| IVOD_ID |
158657 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/158657 |
| 日期 |
2025-01-02 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-26-17 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
17 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-01-02T13:18:44+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-01-02T13:31:47+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:13:03 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/186d177ad48e30e5636b3321c5825468c921d2cbf1168e40c298e4a85a6a9cd579b5a1982509e2505ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
黃國昌 |
| 委員發言時間 |
13:18:44 - 13:31:47 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-01-02T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議（事由：請勞動部、衛生福利部、教育部就「推動友善職場、校園性騷擾與霸凌防治及長照悲歌並檢討現行長照制度缺失與長照3.0規劃」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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蔡主席謝謝主席,麻煩有請勞動部部長跟衛福部部長委員好 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
22.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
40.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
那個先請教林副部長,審計部給我的報告,初步第一階段的報告差五年的完整的報告還要再給他一段時間,初步的報告給我的是說就業安定基金遭到不當挪用的大概五千多萬,目前追討的計畫跟進度出來沒有? |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
41.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
64.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
跟黃委員報告我們在12月底的時候有收到審計部的報告它是給我們一個月的時間恢復所以是跟審計部在回覆跟釐清之後會跟同仁說了如果在釐清之後確實查有不法或確認名目不符的話當然該啟動法定的作業程序什麼是法定的作業程序跟大家說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
65.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
89.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
因為其實到時候會是審計部來判斷到底是要那審計部初步的判斷不是出來了嗎不是 這還沒有他現在給你回覆的機會嗎他現在是把他覺得需要說明的項目所以給你們一個月的時間說明嘛那如果一個月以後的說明你們的說明沒有辦法說服審計部的話錢是審計部負責追討還是你們自己要去要回來 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
90.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
101.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
應該是有勞動部那勞動部到時候等到你們回覆審計部之後審計部再判定出來的結果以後就我們的立場很清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
102.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
125.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
所有備不到農用的錢每一分每一毫全部都要追回來那現在在你們回覆審計部的程序當中我們尊重那請部長做好準備下個會期因為這個會期顯然是來不及下個會期開議的第一件事情我們就要看到被認定 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
127.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
149.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
不放挪用的錢追討的計畫跟進度可以嗎跟黃委員說明齁就是就像我剛剛前面說的會有一個跟審議部確認的過程剛講過的話不要再重複浪費我的時間該要啟動法定要追回的程序的我們就會去做這件事情沒有關係啊因為齁我們立法部門在監督的時候部長有當過委員嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
151.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
164.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
我們沒有辦法因為行政官員空洞的承諾就相信嘛所以我要有具體的東西嘛請你準備好 開議的時候這不是空洞的承諾開議的時候就會跟你要這個東西好 現在換衛福部部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
165.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
193.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
來 部長上一次你們衛福部做那個霸凌報告說要帶來給我看我看了以後我直接跟部長報告四個字叫做慘不忍睹慘不忍睹你口中所講的最高規格的調查從報告的內容報告的格式報告的結論我再跟部長報告四個字慘不忍睹什麼最高規格的調查報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
195.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
219.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
附件的部分可能會涉及到當事人的程序我先不論啦我看完整份報告了以後我心裡只有一個狐疑啊這個是要去特定誰誰都沒辦法特定啊這個會洩什麼密什麼密也都不會洩漏啊我一會洩漏的秘密是什麼我跟部長報告我一會洩漏的秘密就是衛福部的調查報告竟然做的如此之爛 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
220.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
241.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
這是我的結論這是我的結論部長你可能不同意我的結論所有的外服部做出來的報告啊超高規格非常詳細句細米疑論證清楚利潤證據充足但我看完了以後就不是這個樣子啦所以我只有簡單一個問題電話報告要不要公開 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
246.036 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
271.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
諸件不用調查報告要不要公開 給我yes or no的答案就可以了報告委員 那個委員非常感謝您的我想您也在CORNEA那邊嘛 對不對量化質化這邊 大家相關都已經做過相關研究我們這個調查報告就是BAS在這個方法上面 是有量化也有質化的 BAS的方法非常的粗糙 內容非常的爛請你針對問題回答 調查報告要不要公告主席 是不是可以請你制止他 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
273.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
283.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
我在問問題的時候可不可以不要插嘴是不是可以請主席清楚的告訴列席的行政官員在未來委員會尋答的規矩是什麼他講話的時候時間不算部長調查報告要不要公開yes or no 給我一個答案 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
296.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
306.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
我想非常感謝黃委員的指教,那我們今天其實也經過了再度的早上討論,也透過了互代的結議針對我們現在的一個大家覺得有指教的地方,我們會去做檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
317.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
335.064 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
所以又給你們兩個月做檢討喔沒有關係啦 衛華委員會這邊所做的決議我尊重衛華委員會委員的決議啊那我清楚的跟部長講行政調查報告不公開一定會反映在台灣民眾黨黨團預算提案上 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
337.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
361.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
我這樣講很清楚了啦調查報告不公開一定會反映在台灣民眾黨黨團預算審查預算審查的內容之上我很清楚的跟部長表達了這樣子清楚的訴求那一天你們的署長拿報告來給我看我老實講我看了快吐血我看了快吐血我直接問他一個最直接的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
363.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
388.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
駐建方的部分有沒有深蹲執行官那天我在這邊問你你說你不是很清楚調查報告要看調查報告結果我看了調查報告一個字都沒提你們拿到那來給我看的同仁我請教他有沒有深蹲執行官這件事情他當場跟我回答是有那我的問題來了那如果有為什麼調查報告半個字都沒有提 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
390.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
411.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
為什麼調查報告半個字都沒有提他跟我說啊這個齁是因為什麼後來才發現那不就符合您所講的如果有新事實新證據要重啟調查部長我有沒有講錯這個部分我們可以在在下一次的報告裡面再來澄清再來冒 再來釐清 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
412.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
429.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
就這個部分吼就這個部分第一個啦我還是跟部長勸告報告我看完了啦復健的部分不用公開沒有關係啊你那個報告給全民公平啊看我今天黃國昌在這邊質詢台上面講說那個報告爛的不得了 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
430.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
447.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
這樣的評價到底是公平還是不公平你如果覺得我講的不公平 你就公開嘛然後我們一般的公民看了以後說 衛福部的報告寫得這麼好這麼詳細 句細米疑還符合你們剛剛什麼量 量化 質化 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
449.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
477.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
講一堆黃國昌的質詢一點道理都沒有人家衛福部做得這麼棒你竟然說人家調查報告根本不能看受傷的會是我啦不會是衛福部啦所以我還是給部長啊你回去慎重考慮啊看調查報告要不要公開我跟你保證啊你念完了以後不會有什麼個資被洩漏不會有什麼秘密被洩漏唯一會被洩漏的秘密啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
478.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
498.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
就是為什麼衛福部做的這個調查報告品質如此粗糙第二個事情有專業團體來跟我陳情他們陳情是什麼來來來部長這兩個英文名詞是什麼意思你知不知道我沒有要考你英文啦但是你應該很清楚你做過醫生 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
503.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
520.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
謝謝委員 剛剛我補充一下 不算是沒關係我們已經按照兩個禮拜前的未完的決議 已經是所有的未完的委員我們都有過去跟他報告 我說我們都有經過這樣的過程 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
534.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
551.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
這個比較一個是在technician的部分那一個可能會比較有一些多一點那個工作的內容那可能有一點點超越optician的那種工作內容這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
555.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
570.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
我老實跟你講你應該很熟所以我才一開始說我就沒有要考你英文啦這個是煙光師啦他們來的陳情啦他們說國際社會上基本上都是用什麼都是用automatrists用這個詞那但是什麼啊但是 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
576.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
599.982 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
把其他國家都翻譯出來了但是你們衛福部我覺得是不是因為眼科醫師有壓力所以你們一直在英文的名稱上就只願意用optician不願意用optometrist他們要的是前面這個那為什麼他們要前面這個我後來仔細的看人家的訴求也合理其他國家全部都是用這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
601.155 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
625.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
那結果只有我們的什麼驗光能源法在驗光能源法裡面的驗光師用Optician但是我進一步的去看說你們自己衛福部的統計年報也不是用Optician啊還是用Optimetrist的這個詞我們的總統副總統給人家的賀電也是用Optimetrist |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
626.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
639.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
那我就覺得很奇怪人家現在因為這個英文訴求的事情跟整個國際上面的交流都產生了障礙這個事情應該他們都有跟衛福部澄清嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
640.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
665.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
那你是有眼科醫師的壓力是嗎沒有我們完全沒有因為我當維護部以後才注意到這個現在這個事情有結論了嗎還是要再研議完全在專業他們1月3號我好多人跟他們1月3號眼科醫學會跟燕光師大家坐下來談嗎坐下來談在中興醫院坐下來因為2019年在過那個燕光師法的時候那是我第一次在立法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
666.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
679.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
眼科醫師有眼科醫師的看法然後驗光師有他們的看法那個時候我還記得青島東路的時候來了一大堆非常年輕的那個驗光師還有相關科系的學生來陳情 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
681.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
700.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
那個時候我們大家都有去去聲援他們的訴求那眼科醫師的考慮我們了解如果牽涉到醫療專業那當然是眼科醫師的專業範圍嘛那但是有關於眼光師他們所提出來的訴求看其他國家所用的英文專業名詞看起來也沒有不當 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
702.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
728.439 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
我們自己的總統、副總統都這樣發賀電給人家了你總不要說要搞到好像蔡英文跟賴清德發賀電給人家說一套自己背地裡面又幹另外一套這樣子不好啦這樣不好啦 我希望123號的時候我們希望兩兆能夠真的取得一個比較好的專業我希望啦不曉得發揮你調和、deny調和、deny |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
731.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
757.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
好該怎麼講全力以赴全力以赴調和在那裡的功力啦讓兩邊的專業團體不要這樣子出現了一些我覺得啦是沒有太必要的爭執眼科醫師當然是眼科醫師嘛驗光師就是驗光師嘛也不會有把人把這兩件事情牽涉到業務是啦但是業務的分配其實是在中文的法規去做分配嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
758.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
775.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
不會有人用那個英文單字來決定業務要怎麼分配啦我們在相關的法規裡面 醫事法規裡面什麼事情燕光是可以幹什麼事情只有眼科醫師可以幹中文法規很清楚不要為了一個英文的單字不要為了英文的單字搞成這個樣子好 謝謝好 謝謝黃委員 謝謝部長 |
| transcript.gazette[0].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[0].start |
2025-01-02T13:18:51.276000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[0].end |
2025-01-02T13:18:53.218000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].text |
謝謝主席，麻煩有請勞動部部長跟衛福部部長。 |
| transcript.gazette[0].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[1].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[1].start |
2025-01-02T13:18:53.218000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[1].end |
2025-01-02T13:18:53.258000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].text |
委員好。 |
| transcript.gazette[1].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[2].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[2].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:06.334000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[2].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:16.684000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].text |
先請教勞動部部長，審計部給我的報告是初步第一階段的報告，查五年的完整報告還要再給他一段時間。 |
| transcript.gazette[2].quality |
0.884 |
| transcript.gazette[3].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[3].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:17.725000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[3].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:24.752000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].text |
給我的初步報告是說，就業安定基金遭到不當挪用大概五千多萬，目前追討計畫跟進度出來沒有？ |
| transcript.gazette[3].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[4].speaker |
洪部長申翰 |
| transcript.gazette[4].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:25.954000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[4].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:45.967000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].text |
跟黃委員報告，我們在12月底的時候收到審計部的報告，他是給我們一個月的時間回復，所以跟審計部回復與釐清之後……我也跟同仁說了，如果在釐清之後，確實查有不法或確認名目不符的話，當然該啟動法定的作業程序…… |
| transcript.gazette[4].quality |
0.933 |
| transcript.gazette[5].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[5].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:46.347000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[5].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:47.468000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].text |
什麼是法定的作業程序？ |
| transcript.gazette[5].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[6].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[6].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:47.608000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[6].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:48.268000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].text |
跟大家說明一下。 |
| transcript.gazette[6].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[7].speaker |
洪部長申翰 |
| transcript.gazette[7].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:49.589000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[7].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:54.152000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].text |
因為到時候是審計部來判斷，到底是要…… |
| transcript.gazette[7].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[8].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[8].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:54.633000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[8].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:56.134000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].text |
審計部初步的判斷不是出來了嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[8].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[9].speaker |
洪部長申翰 |
| transcript.gazette[9].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:56.134000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[9].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:57.135000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].text |
不是，這還沒有。 |
| transcript.gazette[9].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[10].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[10].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:57.415000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[10].end |
2025-01-02T13:19:59.336000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].text |
他現在給你回復的機會嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[10].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[11].speaker |
洪部長申翰 |
| transcript.gazette[11].start |
2025-01-02T13:19:59.336000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[11].end |
2025-01-02T13:20:02.519000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].text |
他現在是把他覺得需要說明的項目列出來。 |
| transcript.gazette[11].quality |
0.833 |
| transcript.gazette[12].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[12].start |
2025-01-02T13:20:02.899000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[12].end |
2025-01-02T13:20:04.220000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].text |
所以給你們一個月的時間說明嗎？對。 |
| transcript.gazette[12].quality |
0.867 |
| transcript.gazette[13].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[13].start |
2025-01-02T13:20:05.161000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[13].end |
2025-01-02T13:20:13.147000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].text |
如果一個月以後，你們的說明沒有辦法說服審計部，錢是審計部負責追討，還是你們自己要去要回來？ |
| transcript.gazette[13].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[14].speaker |
洪部長申翰 |
| transcript.gazette[14].start |
2025-01-02T13:20:14.307000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[14].end |
2025-01-02T13:20:15.788000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].text |
應該是由勞動部。 |
| transcript.gazette[14].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[15].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[15].start |
2025-01-02T13:20:15.928000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[15].end |
2025-01-02T13:20:33.621000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].text |
到時候等到你們回復審計部，審計部在判定的結果出來以後，我們的立場很清楚，所有被不當挪用的錢，每一分每一毫全部都要追回來，全部都要追回來。 |
| transcript.gazette[15].quality |
0.774 |
| transcript.gazette[16].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[16].start |
2025-01-02T13:20:34.221000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[16].end |
2025-01-02T13:20:57.279000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].text |
現在在你們回復審計部的程序當中，我們尊重，請部長做好準備，因為這個會期顯然是來不及，下個會期開議的第一件事情，我們就要看到針對被認定不當挪用的錢追討的計畫跟進度，可以嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[16].quality |
0.949 |
| transcript.gazette[17].speaker |
洪部長申翰 |
| transcript.gazette[17].start |
2025-01-02T13:20:57.279000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[17].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:02.241000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].text |
跟黃委員說明，像我剛才前面說的，會有一個跟審計部確認的過程…… |
| transcript.gazette[17].quality |
0.926 |
| transcript.gazette[18].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[18].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:03.001000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[18].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:05.722000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].text |
剛講過的話不要再重複，浪費我的時間。 |
| transcript.gazette[18].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[19].speaker |
洪部長申翰 |
| transcript.gazette[19].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:05.722000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[19].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:09.543000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].text |
該啟動要追回的法定程序的，我們就會去做這件事情。 |
| transcript.gazette[19].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[20].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[20].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:09.823000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[20].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:22.909000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].text |
沒有關係，因為我們立法部門在監督的時候……部長也當過委員，我們沒有辦法因為行政官員空洞的承諾就相信，所以我要有具體的東西，請你準備好，開議的時候…… |
| transcript.gazette[20].quality |
0.985 |
| transcript.gazette[21].speaker |
洪部長申翰 |
| transcript.gazette[21].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:23.389000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[21].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:24.870000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].text |
黃委員，這不是空洞的承諾。 |
| transcript.gazette[21].quality |
0.727 |
| transcript.gazette[22].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[22].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:24.870000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[22].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:26.531000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].text |
開議的時候就會跟你要這個東西。 |
| transcript.gazette[22].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[23].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[23].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:27.331000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[23].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:28.032000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].text |
現在換衛福部部長。 |
| transcript.gazette[23].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[24].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[24].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:29.703000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[24].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:42.611000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].text |
部長，上一次你們衛福部做那個霸凌報告，說要帶來給我看，我看了以後直接跟部長報告，四個字啊，叫做「慘不忍睹」，慘不忍睹啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[24].quality |
0.961 |
| transcript.gazette[25].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[25].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:42.611000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[25].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:56.298000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].text |
你口中所講的最高規格的調查，從報告的內容、報告的格式、報告的結論，我再跟部長報告四個字啊，慘不忍睹啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[25].quality |
0.956 |
| transcript.gazette[26].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[26].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:56.298000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[26].end |
2025-01-02T13:21:57.879000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].text |
什麼最高規格的調查報告？ |
| transcript.gazette[26].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[27].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[27].start |
2025-01-02T13:21:59.120000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[27].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:03.022000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].text |
附件的部分可能會涉及當事人的程序，我先不論。 |
| transcript.gazette[27].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[28].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[28].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:03.882000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[28].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:10.245000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].text |
我看完整份報告以後，心裡只有一個狐疑，這個是要去特定誰？ |
| transcript.gazette[28].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[29].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[29].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:10.245000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[29].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:11.146000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].text |
誰都沒辦法特定啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[29].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[30].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[30].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:12.706000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[30].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:12.927000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].text |
這個會洩什麼密？ |
| transcript.gazette[30].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[31].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[31].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:13.627000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[31].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:15.068000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].text |
什麼密也都不會洩漏啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[31].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[32].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[32].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:15.908000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[32].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:17.469000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].text |
唯一會洩漏的秘密是什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[32].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[33].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[33].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:17.469000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[33].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:26.252000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].text |
我跟部長報告，唯一會洩漏的秘密就是，衛福部的調查報告竟然做得如此之爛，這是我的結論。 |
| transcript.gazette[33].quality |
0.947 |
| transcript.gazette[34].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[34].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:27.493000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[34].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:44.056000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].text |
部長可能不同意我的結論，說衛福部做出來的報告超高規格、非常詳細、鉅細靡遺、論證清楚、證據充足，但我看完了以後，就不是這個樣子啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[34].quality |
0.893 |
| transcript.gazette[35].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[35].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:44.616000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[35].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:45.396000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].text |
所以我只有簡單一個問題，調查報告要不要公開？ |
| transcript.gazette[35].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[36].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[36].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:50.036000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[36].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:52.538000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].text |
附件不用，調查報告要不要公開？ |
| transcript.gazette[36].quality |
0.923 |
| transcript.gazette[37].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[37].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:52.538000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[37].end |
2025-01-02T13:22:54.499000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].text |
給我Yes or No的答案就可以了。 |
| transcript.gazette[37].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[38].speaker |
呂次長建德 |
| transcript.gazette[38].start |
2025-01-02T13:22:54.779000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[38].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:04.145000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].text |
報告委員，非常感謝您，我想您也在Cornell那邊，量化、質化部分都已經做過相關研究，我們這個調查報告就是base在這個方法上面。 |
| transcript.gazette[38].quality |
0.797 |
| transcript.gazette[39].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[39].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:04.145000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[39].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:05.145000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].text |
是，base的方法非常粗糙，內容非常爛…… |
| transcript.gazette[39].quality |
0.059 |
| transcript.gazette[40].speaker |
呂次長建德 |
| transcript.gazette[40].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:04.805000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[40].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:05.666000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].text |
有量化也有質化，他會…… |
| transcript.gazette[40].quality |
0.778 |
| transcript.gazette[41].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[41].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:09.568000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[41].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:10.669000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].text |
請你針對問題回答…… |
| transcript.gazette[41].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[42].speaker |
呂次長建德 |
| transcript.gazette[42].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:10.669000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[42].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:11.669000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].text |
質化的部分有96…… |
| transcript.gazette[42].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[43].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[43].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:11.629000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[43].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:12.690000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].text |
調查報告要不要公告？ |
| transcript.gazette[43].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[44].speaker |
呂次長建德 |
| transcript.gazette[44].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:12.690000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[44].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:13.690000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].text |
我們這個都經過公正…… |
| transcript.gazette[44].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[45].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[45].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:13.410000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[45].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:15.872000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].text |
主席，請你制止他。 |
| transcript.gazette[45].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[46].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[46].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:17.598000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[46].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:19.318000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].text |
我在問問題的時候可不可以不要插嘴？ |
| transcript.gazette[46].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[47].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[47].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:20.699000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[47].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:26.060000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].text |
是不是可以請主席清楚的告訴列席的行政官員，在衛環委員會詢答的規矩是什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[47].quality |
0.912 |
| transcript.gazette[48].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[48].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:26.060000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[48].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:26.320000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].text |
他講話的時候時間不算。 |
| transcript.gazette[48].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[49].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[49].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:26.340000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[49].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:26.780000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].text |
部長，調查報告要不要公開？ |
| transcript.gazette[49].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[50].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[50].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:26.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[50].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:27.240000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].text |
Yes or No，給我一個答案。 |
| transcript.gazette[50].quality |
0.846 |
| transcript.gazette[51].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[51].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:41.154000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[51].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:47.859000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].text |
非常感謝黃委員的指教，我們今天早上再度討論，也通過了附帶決議…… |
| transcript.gazette[51].quality |
0.679 |
| transcript.gazette[52].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[52].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:47.859000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[52].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:48.859000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].text |
所以你要不要公開？ |
| transcript.gazette[52].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[53].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[53].start |
2025-01-02T13:23:48.079000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[53].end |
2025-01-02T13:23:50.921000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].text |
透過附帶決議，針對現在大家有指教的地方，我們會去檢討，在兩個月之內會把…… |
| transcript.gazette[53].quality |
0.656 |
| transcript.gazette[54].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[54].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:01.252000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[54].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:02.533000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].text |
所以又給你們兩個月檢討？ |
| transcript.gazette[54].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[55].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[55].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:02.533000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[55].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:06.476000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].text |
把大家覺得疑惑或者不足的地方…… |
| transcript.gazette[55].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[56].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[56].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:06.476000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[56].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:07.457000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].text |
沒有關係啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[56].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[57].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[57].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:10.519000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[57].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:12.860000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].text |
我尊重衛環委員會委員的決議。 |
| transcript.gazette[57].quality |
0.923 |
| transcript.gazette[58].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[58].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:13.501000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[58].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:19.044000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].text |
我清楚的跟部長講，行政調查報告不公開，一定會反映在台灣民眾黨黨團的預算提案上。 |
| transcript.gazette[58].quality |
0.944 |
| transcript.gazette[59].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[59].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:21.557000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[59].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:22.658000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].text |
我這樣講得很清楚了啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[59].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[60].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[60].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:23.378000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[60].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:35.603000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].text |
調查報告不公開，一定會反映在台灣民眾黨黨團預算審查的內容之上，我很清楚的跟部長表達這樣子清楚的訴求。 |
| transcript.gazette[60].quality |
0.979 |
| transcript.gazette[61].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[61].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:36.263000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[61].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:49.651000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].text |
那一天你們的處長拿報告來給我看，老實講我看了快吐血，我直接問他一個最直接的問題，祝健芳的部分有沒有深蹲值星官？ |
| transcript.gazette[61].quality |
0.882 |
| transcript.gazette[62].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[62].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:50.752000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[62].end |
2025-01-02T13:24:59.035000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].text |
那天我在這邊問你，你說你不是很清楚，要看調查報告，結果我看了調查報告，一個字都沒提。 |
| transcript.gazette[62].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[63].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[63].start |
2025-01-02T13:24:59.916000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[63].end |
2025-01-02T13:25:07.179000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].text |
你們拿報告來給我看的同仁，我請教他，有沒有深蹲值星官這件事情，他當場跟我回復有。 |
| transcript.gazette[63].quality |
0.861 |
| transcript.gazette[64].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[64].start |
2025-01-02T13:25:08.520000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[64].end |
2025-01-02T13:25:12.942000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].text |
那我的問題來了，如果有，為什麼調查報告半個字都沒有提？ |
| transcript.gazette[64].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[65].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[65].start |
2025-01-02T13:25:14.129000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[65].end |
2025-01-02T13:25:15.911000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].text |
為什麼調查報告半個字都沒有提？ |
| transcript.gazette[65].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[66].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[66].start |
2025-01-02T13:25:16.411000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[66].end |
2025-01-02T13:25:22.397000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].text |
他跟我說，這個是因為後來才發現。 |
| transcript.gazette[66].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[67].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[67].start |
2025-01-02T13:25:22.397000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[67].end |
2025-01-02T13:25:27.102000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].text |
那不就符合您所講的，如果有新事實、新證據要重啟調查。 |
| transcript.gazette[67].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[68].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[68].start |
2025-01-02T13:25:27.542000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[68].end |
2025-01-02T13:25:28.904000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].text |
部長，我有沒有講錯？ |
| transcript.gazette[68].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[69].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[69].start |
2025-01-02T13:25:28.904000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[69].end |
2025-01-02T13:25:35.270000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].text |
這個部分我們可以在下一次的報告裡面再來澄清，再來釐清。 |
| transcript.gazette[69].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[70].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[70].start |
2025-01-02T13:25:37.976000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[70].end |
2025-01-02T13:25:56.954000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].text |
就這個部分，第一個我還是跟部長勸告，報告我看完了，附件的部分不用公開沒有關係，你這個報告給全民公評，看今天黃國昌在這邊的質詢台上面講，說那個報告爛的不得了，這樣的評價到底是公平還是不公平。 |
| transcript.gazette[70].quality |
0.93 |
| transcript.gazette[71].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[71].start |
2025-01-02T13:25:57.614000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[71].end |
2025-01-02T13:26:00.035000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].text |
你如果覺得我講的不公平，你就公開嘛！ |
| transcript.gazette[71].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[72].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[72].start |
2025-01-02T13:26:00.995000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[72].end |
2025-01-02T13:26:13.699000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].text |
然後我們一般的公民看了以後，說衛福部的報告寫得這麼好、這麼詳細、鉅細靡遺，還符合你們剛剛什麼量化、質化講一堆。 |
| transcript.gazette[72].quality |
0.939 |
| transcript.gazette[73].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[73].start |
2025-01-02T13:26:14.900000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[73].end |
2025-01-02T13:26:22.564000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].text |
黃國昌的質詢一點道理都沒有，人家衛福部做得這麼棒，你竟然說人家的調查報告根本不能看。 |
| transcript.gazette[73].quality |
0.974 |
| transcript.gazette[74].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[74].start |
2025-01-02T13:26:23.144000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[74].end |
2025-01-02T13:26:25.646000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].text |
屆時受傷的會是我，不會是衛福部啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[74].quality |
0.867 |
| transcript.gazette[75].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[75].start |
2025-01-02T13:26:26.546000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[75].end |
2025-01-02T13:26:32.029000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].text |
所以我還是請部長回去慎重考慮，看調查報告要不要公開。 |
| transcript.gazette[75].quality |
0.958 |
| transcript.gazette[76].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[76].start |
2025-01-02T13:26:32.029000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[76].end |
2025-01-02T13:26:46.037000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].text |
我跟你保證，你唸完了以後不會有什麼個資被洩漏，不會有什麼秘密被洩漏，唯一會被洩漏的秘密，就是為什麼衛福部做的這個調查報告品質如此粗糙？ |
| transcript.gazette[76].quality |
0.984 |
| transcript.gazette[77].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[77].start |
2025-01-02T13:26:46.758000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[77].end |
2025-01-02T13:26:54.626000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].text |
第二個事情，有專業團體來跟我陳情，他們陳情的是什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[77].quality |
0.957 |
| transcript.gazette[78].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[78].start |
2025-01-02T13:26:54.626000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[78].end |
2025-01-02T13:26:57.889000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].text |
部長，這兩個英文名詞是什麼意思你知不知道？ |
| transcript.gazette[78].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[79].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[79].start |
2025-01-02T13:26:59.031000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[79].end |
2025-01-02T13:27:01.233000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].text |
我沒有要考你英文，但你當過醫生，你應該很清楚。 |
| transcript.gazette[79].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[80].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[80].start |
2025-01-02T13:27:07.409000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[80].end |
2025-01-02T13:27:24.361000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].text |
謝謝委員，我補充回答一下，我們已經按照兩個禮拜前衛環的決議，所有衛環的委員我們都有過去跟他報告，我們都有經過這樣的過程，也跟他們說明…… |
| transcript.gazette[80].quality |
0.803 |
| transcript.gazette[81].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[81].start |
2025-01-02T13:27:24.361000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[81].end |
2025-01-02T13:27:38.349000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].text |
現在回歸正題，這兩個英文名詞有什麼不同？ |
| transcript.gazette[81].quality |
0.111 |
| transcript.gazette[82].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[82].start |
2025-01-02T13:27:38.349000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[82].end |
2025-01-02T13:27:55.356000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].text |
Optician、Optometrist，一個是在Technician的部分，一個可能會有比較多一點工作的內容，那可能有一點點超越Optician的那種工作內容。 |
| transcript.gazette[82].quality |
0.711 |
| transcript.gazette[83].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[83].start |
2025-01-02T13:27:59.558000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[83].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[83].end |
2025-01-02T13:28:04.801000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[83].text |
我老實跟你講，這個詞意你應該很熟，所以我一開始才說我沒有要考你英文。 |
| transcript.gazette[83].quality |
0.839 |
| transcript.gazette[84].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[84].start |
2025-01-02T13:28:06.422000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[84].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[84].end |
2025-01-02T13:28:07.162000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[84].text |
這個是驗光師啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[84].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[85].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[85].start |
2025-01-02T13:28:07.683000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[85].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[85].end |
2025-01-02T13:28:14.086000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[85].text |
他們來陳情，他們說國際社會上，基本上都是用Optometrist這個詞。 |
| transcript.gazette[85].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[86].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[86].start |
2025-01-02T13:28:20.109000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[86].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[86].end |
2025-01-02T13:28:35.397000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[86].text |
他們把其他國家都翻譯出來了，但是你們衛福部，我覺得是不是因為眼科醫師有壓力，所以你們一直在英文的名稱上就只願意用Optician，不願意用Optometrist。 |
| transcript.gazette[86].quality |
0.947 |
| transcript.gazette[87].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[87].start |
2025-01-02T13:28:36.037000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[87].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[87].end |
2025-01-02T13:28:39.759000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[87].text |
他們要的是前面這個Optometrist，為什麼他們要前面這個？ |
| transcript.gazette[87].quality |
0.633 |
| transcript.gazette[88].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[88].start |
2025-01-02T13:28:39.759000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[88].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[88].end |
2025-01-02T13:28:43.982000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[88].text |
我後來仔細的看，人家的訴求也合理，其他國家全部都是用這個。 |
| transcript.gazette[88].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[89].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[89].start |
2025-01-02T13:28:46.156000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[89].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[89].end |
2025-01-02T13:28:52.379000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[89].text |
結果只有我們的驗光人員法，在驗光人員法裡面的驗光師用Optician。 |
| transcript.gazette[89].quality |
0.879 |
| transcript.gazette[90].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[90].start |
2025-01-02T13:28:52.979000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[90].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[90].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:05.846000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[90].text |
但是我進一步去看，你們自己衛福部的統計年報也不是用Optician，還是用Optometrist這個詞。 |
| transcript.gazette[90].quality |
0.98 |
| transcript.gazette[91].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[91].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:05.846000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[91].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[91].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:09.688000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[91].text |
我們的總統、副總統給人家的賀電，也是用Optometrist。 |
| transcript.gazette[91].quality |
0.964 |
| transcript.gazette[92].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[92].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:10.408000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[92].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[92].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:21.205000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[92].text |
那我就覺得很奇怪，人家現在因為這個英文，訴求的事情，跟整個國際上面的交流都產生了障礙。 |
| transcript.gazette[92].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[93].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[93].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:21.205000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[93].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[93].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:26.639000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[93].text |
這個事情應該他們都有跟衛福部陳情，你們是有眼科醫師的壓力嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[93].quality |
0.893 |
| transcript.gazette[94].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[94].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:26.639000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[94].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[94].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:32.060000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[94].text |
沒有，我們完全沒有，我到衛福部以後才注意到這個問題。 |
| transcript.gazette[94].quality |
0.783 |
| transcript.gazette[95].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[95].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:32.060000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[95].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[95].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:33.741000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[95].text |
現在這個事情有結論了嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[95].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[96].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[96].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:33.741000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[96].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[96].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:34.561000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[96].text |
還是要再研議？ |
| transcript.gazette[96].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[97].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[97].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:34.561000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[97].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[97].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:41.163000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[97].text |
這個完全在專業，我好不容易溝通他們1月3號，眼科醫學會跟驗光師…… |
| transcript.gazette[97].quality |
0.704 |
| transcript.gazette[98].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[98].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:41.163000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[98].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[98].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:42.163000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[98].text |
大家坐下來談嘛！ |
| transcript.gazette[98].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[99].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[99].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:42.723000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[99].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[99].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:44.904000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[99].text |
在中興醫院坐下來談。 |
| transcript.gazette[99].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[100].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[100].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:45.744000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[100].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[100].end |
2025-01-02T13:29:54.332000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[100].text |
好，2019年在過驗光師法的時候，那是我第一次在立法院，眼科醫師有眼科醫師的看法，驗光師有他們的看法。 |
| transcript.gazette[100].quality |
0.952 |
| transcript.gazette[101].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[101].start |
2025-01-02T13:29:54.512000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[101].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[101].end |
2025-01-02T13:30:08.550000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[101].text |
我還記得那個時候青島東路來了很多非常年輕的驗光師，還有相關科系的學生來陳情，那個時候我們大家都有去聲援他們的訴求。 |
| transcript.gazette[101].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[102].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[102].start |
2025-01-02T13:30:09.411000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[102].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[102].end |
2025-01-02T13:30:24.961000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[102].text |
眼科醫師的考慮我們了解，如果牽涉到醫療專業，那當然是眼科醫師的專業範圍，但是有關於驗光師所提出來的訴求，看其他國家所用的英文專業名詞，看起來也沒有不當。 |
| transcript.gazette[102].quality |
0.986 |
| transcript.gazette[103].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[103].start |
2025-01-02T13:30:26.021000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[103].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[103].end |
2025-01-02T13:30:38.810000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[103].text |
我們自己的總統、副總統都這樣發賀電給人家了，你總不要搞到好像蔡英文跟賴清德發賀電給人家說一套，自己背地裡面又幹另外一套，這樣子不好啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[103].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[104].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[104].start |
2025-01-02T13:30:40.231000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[104].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[104].end |
2025-01-02T13:30:42.272000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[104].text |
我希望1月3號的時候…… |
| transcript.gazette[104].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[105].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[105].start |
2025-01-02T13:30:42.552000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[105].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[105].end |
2025-01-02T13:30:48.036000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[105].text |
我們希望1月3號兩造能夠真的取得比較好的專業，對人民是…… |
| transcript.gazette[105].quality |
0.708 |
| transcript.gazette[106].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[106].start |
2025-01-02T13:30:48.036000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[106].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[106].end |
2025-01-02T13:30:49.997000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[106].text |
我希望部長發揮調和鼎鼐的功力。 |
| transcript.gazette[106].quality |
0.5 |
| transcript.gazette[107].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[107].start |
2025-01-02T13:30:57.244000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[107].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[107].end |
2025-01-02T13:30:57.604000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[107].text |
我們會全力以赴。 |
| transcript.gazette[107].quality |
0.571 |
| transcript.gazette[108].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[108].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:02.025000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[108].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[108].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:07.847000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[108].text |
讓兩邊的專業團體不要出現一些我覺得沒有太必要的爭執。 |
| transcript.gazette[108].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[109].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[109].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:07.847000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[109].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[109].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:09.327000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[109].text |
眼科醫師當然是眼科醫師嘛！ |
| transcript.gazette[109].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[110].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[110].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:10.307000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[110].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[110].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:11.448000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[110].text |
驗光師就是驗光師嘛！ |
| transcript.gazette[110].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[111].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[111].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:12.488000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[111].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[111].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:14.509000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[111].text |
也不會有人把這兩件事情…… |
| transcript.gazette[111].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[112].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[112].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:14.669000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[112].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[112].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:16.569000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[112].text |
因為這牽涉到業務…… |
| transcript.gazette[112].quality |
0.625 |
| transcript.gazette[113].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[113].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:16.569000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[113].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[113].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:25.613000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[113].text |
是，但是業務的分配其實是在中文的法規去分配，不會有人用那個英文單字來決定業務要怎麼分配。 |
| transcript.gazette[113].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[114].speaker |
黃委員國昌 |
| transcript.gazette[114].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:26.334000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[114].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[114].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:38.882000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[114].text |
我們在相關的法規裡面，醫事法規裡面什麼事情驗光師可以幹，什麼事情只有眼科醫師可以幹，中文法規很清楚，不要為了一個英文單字搞成這個樣子。 |
| transcript.gazette[114].quality |
0.968 |
| transcript.gazette[115].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[115].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:39.282000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[115].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[115].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:39.382000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[115].text |
好，一定努力。謝謝。 |
| transcript.gazette[115].quality |
0.429 |
| transcript.gazette[116].speaker |
邱部長泰源 |
| transcript.gazette[116].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:39.382000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[116].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[116].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:40.382000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[116].text |
我們一定會繼續努力，謝謝，謝謝主席。 |
| transcript.gazette[116].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[117].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[117].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:39.382000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[117].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[117].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:39.502000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[117].text |
好，謝謝黃委員，謝謝部長。 |
| transcript.gazette[117].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[118].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[118].start |
2025-01-02T13:31:40.002000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[118].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[118].end |
2025-01-02T13:31:42.859143+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[118].text |
接續請陳冠廷委員質詢。 |
| transcript.gazette[118].quality |
0 |