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王鴻薇 @ 第11屆第5會期內政委員會第23次全體委員會議
| Start Time | End Time | Text |
|---|---|---|
| 00:00:00,000 | 00:00:02,000 | 好 下位請王宏威委員發言諮詢 |
| 00:00:10,000 | 00:00:15,000 | 好 謝謝主席 我請劉部長還有花敬群董事長 |
| 00:00:22,000 | 00:00:28,000 | 好 董事長 這次趙姬及寄居穴的一個風波 |
| 00:00:28,000 | 00:00:33,000 | 那影響範圍極大 製造了很多的租屋孤兒 |
| 00:00:33,000 | 00:00:38,000 | 那在寄居穴的部分 這兩天你對外說明的比較多 |
| 00:00:38,000 | 00:00:44,000 | 就是再去做協調 由其他的單位來接手 |
| 00:00:44,000 | 00:00:48,000 | 不過我也覺得非常奇怪啦 因為你一直都強調 |
| 00:00:48,000 | 00:00:54,000 | 所有的這個 所有的包租代管 |
| 00:00:54,000 | 00:00:59,000 | 通通都是公開招標 但是你現在的一個 |
| 00:00:59,000 | 00:01:05,000 | 等於說階段性這樣的一個處置 也沒有經過公開性的招標 |
| 00:01:05,000 | 00:01:09,000 | 那我另外請教 另外趙姬公司 |
| 00:01:09,000 | 00:01:16,000 | 趙姬公司她的這個包租代管的業務 會不會出問題 |
| 00:01:16,000 | 00:01:19,000 | 好 謝謝委員的詢詢 我想第一個 |
| 00:01:19,000 | 00:01:22,000 | 目前並沒有包租代管孤兒的狀況 |
| 00:01:22,000 | 00:01:25,000 | 現在所有的服務案件都還在持續進行中 |
| 00:01:25,000 | 00:01:30,000 | 那寄居穴的案子 其實寄居穴公司的服務現在也還是存在 |
| 00:01:30,000 | 00:01:33,000 | 我先問你 趙姬公司會不會有問題 |
| 00:01:33,000 | 00:01:36,000 | 這個部分我沒有辦法代替趙姬公司回答 |
| 00:01:36,000 | 00:01:40,000 | 因為他們現在內部正在重組 他們的主管團隊 |
| 00:01:40,000 | 00:01:45,000 | 那請問一下 她包租代管的房東房客會不會權益有問題 |
| 00:01:45,000 | 00:01:48,000 | 目前都還在服務的狀態當中 |
| 00:01:48,000 | 00:01:54,000 | 好 請問一下 昨天趙姬公司她公開承認 |
| 00:01:54,000 | 00:01:58,000 | 她列為警事戶 因為有人去檢舉 |
| 00:01:58,000 | 00:02:02,000 | 她列為警事戶 警事戶解除了嗎 |
| 00:02:02,000 | 00:02:05,000 | 這個案子昨天當晚已經解除警事了 |
| 00:02:05,000 | 00:02:06,000 | 解除警事 是 |
| 00:02:06,000 | 00:02:10,000 | 那請問一下 還會不會有一些投資人 |
| 00:02:10,000 | 00:02:13,000 | 因為現在投資人都組成自救協會了 |
| 00:02:13,000 | 00:02:16,000 | 自救會也有跟我來做投訴 |
| 00:02:16,000 | 00:02:19,000 | 那請問一下 還會不會有其他投資人 |
| 00:02:19,000 | 00:02:22,000 | 繼續的去控告趙姬公司 |
| 00:02:22,000 | 00:02:27,000 | 那使得她的銀行帳戶進入警事戶的一個階段 |
| 00:02:27,000 | 00:02:30,000 | 這個東西我沒有辦法判斷 |
| 00:02:30,000 | 00:02:33,000 | 但是當然經過了昨天那一次的歷程 |
| 00:02:33,000 | 00:02:36,000 | 我相信銀行 銀行團隊應該可以理解 |
| 00:02:36,000 | 00:02:38,000 | 你不能講得雲淡風輕 |
| 00:02:38,000 | 00:02:44,000 | 因為所有包租代管 這個房客的錢進入趙姬公司的帳戶 |
| 00:02:44,000 | 00:02:48,000 | 趙姬公司再從她的帳戶要把錢給房東 |
| 00:02:48,000 | 00:02:54,000 | 所以一旦她的帳戶出現任何的被凍結 |
| 00:02:54,000 | 00:02:56,000 | 或者進入警事戶 |
| 00:02:56,000 | 00:03:00,000 | 那第一個當然就是房東跟房客權益同時受損 |
| 00:03:00,000 | 00:03:01,000 | 是 |
| 00:03:01,000 | 00:03:03,000 | 還有另外我請問一下 |
| 00:03:03,000 | 00:03:06,000 | 因為你剛才我看到前面的質詢 |
| 00:03:06,000 | 00:03:08,000 | 你認為趙姬公司沒有問題嗎 |
| 00:03:08,000 | 00:03:10,000 | 我沒有說趙姬公司沒有問題 |
| 00:03:10,000 | 00:03:16,000 | 我想現在他們公司內部的團隊正在進行重整重組的過程 |
| 00:03:16,000 | 00:03:20,000 | 那我也都會持續的去瞭解他們的狀況 |
| 00:03:20,000 | 00:03:22,000 | 甚至我們也已經我們在昨天已經約詢一次 |
| 00:03:22,000 | 00:03:25,000 | 我們要求她禮拜五把公司除了採報 |
| 00:03:25,000 | 00:03:27,000 | 然後注入到警察的檢查 |
| 00:03:27,000 | 00:03:29,000 | 我想請問一下你也應該知道 |
| 00:03:29,000 | 00:03:31,000 | 她在立刻公司改組 |
| 00:03:31,000 | 00:03:33,000 | 她另外的一個股東 |
| 00:03:33,000 | 00:03:35,000 | 宏基接任董事長之後 |
| 00:03:35,000 | 00:03:39,000 | 兩天就立刻就立刻辭掉了 |
| 00:03:39,000 | 00:03:41,000 | 而且直接說這家公司 |
| 00:03:41,000 | 00:03:44,000 | 她的管理有問題 |
| 00:03:44,000 | 00:03:49,000 | 擔心她的投資的這些問題會擴大 |
| 00:03:49,000 | 00:03:53,000 | 所以她自己裡面去接任董事長 |
| 00:03:53,000 | 00:03:56,000 | 兩天就不敢再繼續接任了 |
| 00:03:56,000 | 00:04:00,000 | 那這代表這家公司大有問題啊 |
| 00:04:00,000 | 00:04:04,000 | 我覺得這個因為選擇區的總結 |
| 00:04:04,000 | 00:04:06,000 | 如果這次從集軍線到趙姬 |
| 00:04:06,000 | 00:04:09,000 | 趙姬他們整個的包租代管 |
| 00:04:09,000 | 00:04:11,000 | 高達兩萬戶以上 |
| 00:04:11,000 | 00:04:13,000 | 有時候到兩萬八千戶 |
| 00:04:13,000 | 00:04:15,000 | 一個集軍線說我不幹了 |
| 00:04:15,000 | 00:04:18,000 | 一個趙姬現在可能列入警事戶 |
| 00:04:18,000 | 00:04:21,000 | 還有這些投資人組成自救會 |
| 00:04:21,000 | 00:04:22,000 | 要跟她求償 |
| 00:04:22,000 | 00:04:24,000 | 可能有漫長的一個司法 |
| 00:04:24,000 | 00:04:27,000 | 那麼這麼龐大的房租 |
| 00:04:27,000 | 00:04:30,000 | 房東跟房客的權益 |
| 00:04:30,000 | 00:04:32,000 | 要怎麼樣保障呢 |
| 00:04:33,000 | 00:04:35,000 | 這真的是一個非常大的風暴 |
| 00:04:35,000 | 00:04:36,000 | CG協的案子 |
| 00:04:36,000 | 00:04:38,000 | 當然我們接下來這個月陸續轉嫌 |
| 00:04:38,000 | 00:04:41,000 | 出去之後其實就不會有房東房客 |
| 00:04:41,000 | 00:04:43,000 | 潛在的這個糾紛的問題嘛 |
| 00:04:43,000 | 00:04:44,000 | 那趙姬的部分 |
| 00:04:44,000 | 00:04:46,000 | 當然我們現階段還是要尊重 |
| 00:04:46,000 | 00:04:48,000 | 他們的經營團隊 |
| 00:04:48,000 | 00:04:50,000 | 以及現在的股東 |
| 00:04:50,000 | 00:04:53,000 | 在他們預計8月27號要開臨時股東會 |
| 00:04:53,000 | 00:04:57,000 | 會選出新任的董監事等等 |
| 00:04:57,000 | 00:04:59,000 | 那這部分我們當然要尊重 |
| 00:04:59,000 | 00:05:02,000 | 他們這些權力人對自己公司 |
| 00:05:02,000 | 00:05:03,000 | 的一個處置過程 |
| 00:05:03,000 | 00:05:05,000 | 好 董事長 因為時間有限 |
| 00:05:05,000 | 00:05:07,000 | 你們在尊重之餘 |
| 00:05:07,000 | 00:05:11,000 | 要怎麼樣保障這些房東跟房客的權益 |
| 00:05:11,000 | 00:05:14,000 | 就變得非常非常重要 |
| 00:05:14,000 | 00:05:17,000 | 所以來請一下來請部長回答一下 |
| 00:05:18,000 | 00:05:20,000 | 如果這次風暴擴大 |
| 00:05:20,000 | 00:05:23,000 | 而並不像我們花敬群董事長 |
| 00:05:23,000 | 00:05:25,000 | 講的這樣雲淡風氣 |
| 00:05:25,000 | 00:05:27,000 | 那要不要有人 |
| 00:05:27,000 | 00:05:30,000 | 這個要負起一個行政責任或政治責任 |
| 00:05:30,000 | 00:05:31,000 | 包括委員 |
| 00:05:31,000 | 00:05:34,000 | 我們在多次的這個對外的說法裡面 |
| 00:05:34,000 | 00:05:37,000 | 就是目前我們跟各縣市地方政府 |
| 00:05:37,000 | 00:05:41,000 | 處理包租代管業者的這些市府團隊 |
| 00:05:41,000 | 00:05:43,000 | 都保持密切的溝通 |
| 00:05:43,000 | 00:05:46,000 | 那有關房東房客權益受損的部分的話 |
| 00:05:46,000 | 00:05:49,000 | 我們會用這個公共設施的 |
| 00:05:49,000 | 00:05:52,000 | 公共利益的這個服務不打折的方式 |
| 00:05:52,000 | 00:05:54,000 | 來處理房東房客的權益 |
| 00:05:54,000 | 00:05:55,000 | 這是第一個 |
| 00:05:55,000 | 00:05:56,000 | 第二個呢 |
| 00:05:56,000 | 00:05:58,000 | 如果造基或者是寄居縣 |
| 00:05:58,000 | 00:06:01,000 | 有任何在處理包租代管業務上面 |
| 00:06:01,000 | 00:06:03,000 | 出現狀況沒有辦法回復 |
| 00:06:03,000 | 00:06:04,000 | 我們所提的問題的時候 |
| 00:06:04,000 | 00:06:07,000 | 我們會暫停第四期的撥付計畫 |
| 00:06:07,000 | 00:06:08,000 | 那再來就是說 |
| 00:06:08,000 | 00:06:10,000 | 裡面有沒有人謀不章的問題的話 |
| 00:06:10,000 | 00:06:13,000 | 我已經先啟動內部的行政的查查的程序 |
| 00:06:13,000 | 00:06:16,000 | 好所以要有行政調查的程序 |
| 00:06:16,000 | 00:06:20,000 | 才能夠去回應現在社會的一些質疑 |
| 00:06:20,000 | 00:06:22,000 | 另外來部長 |
| 00:06:22,000 | 00:06:25,000 | 先暫停一下部長還有署長好嗎 |
| 00:06:25,000 | 00:06:27,000 | 我們國土署署長 |
| 00:06:31,000 | 00:06:32,000 | 好部長署長 |
| 00:06:32,000 | 00:06:34,000 | 剛才因為很多委員關心 |
| 00:06:34,000 | 00:06:38,000 | 就是民團在直接指出的 |
| 00:06:38,000 | 00:06:41,000 | 也就是我們的社宅的興建 |
| 00:06:41,000 | 00:06:46,000 | 原來從外總統的13萬戶的他的政見跳票 |
| 00:06:46,000 | 00:06:48,000 | 變成只有3萬戶 |
| 00:06:48,000 | 00:06:51,000 | 那剛才我有注意到 |
| 00:06:51,000 | 00:06:55,000 | 這個部長跟署長都在澄清沒有這件事 |
| 00:06:55,000 | 00:06:59,000 | 可是你看我算是很認真的 |
| 00:06:59,000 | 00:07:02,000 | 我來幫你們都mark起來 |
| 00:07:02,000 | 00:07:05,000 | 我就看不到在你報告裡面 |
| 00:07:05,000 | 00:07:08,000 | 針對外界最近沸沸揚揚 |
| 00:07:08,000 | 00:07:12,000 | 在質疑的政見跳票裡面 |
| 00:07:12,000 | 00:07:15,000 | 你沒有白紙黑字就沒有寫說 |
| 00:07:15,000 | 00:07:18,000 | 你這13萬戶絕不跳票 |
| 00:07:18,000 | 00:07:21,000 | 所以你現在是口頭上講而已 |
| 00:07:21,000 | 00:07:24,000 | 另外我必須要講 |
| 00:07:24,000 | 00:07:27,000 | 我們這一次整個包租代管的業務 |
| 00:07:27,000 | 00:07:30,000 | 其實會有這麼大的出包 |
| 00:07:30,000 | 00:07:32,000 | 其實要有很多地方要檢討 |
| 00:07:32,000 | 00:07:35,000 | 也就是說我們用了很多包租代管 |
| 00:07:35,000 | 00:07:37,000 | 還有包含房屋補貼 |
| 00:07:37,000 | 00:07:42,000 | 去彌補那個所謂的百萬社宅的一個大餅 |
| 00:07:42,000 | 00:07:45,000 | 但是現在包租代管出現了問題 |
| 00:07:45,000 | 00:07:48,000 | 因為這些公司他的財務 |
| 00:07:48,000 | 00:07:51,000 | 甚至這次可能涉及到投資詐騙 |
| 00:07:51,000 | 00:07:54,000 | 我先跟你講一下我聽到的消息是 |
| 00:07:54,000 | 00:07:57,000 | 因為他們掌控很多房東的資訊 |
| 00:07:57,000 | 00:08:00,000 | 房東很多有包租公包租婆 |
| 00:08:00,000 | 00:08:03,000 | 包租公包租婆有什麼特色 |
| 00:08:03,000 | 00:08:05,000 | 有錢 |
| 00:08:05,000 | 00:08:08,000 | 所以他們就成為他們去 |
| 00:08:08,000 | 00:08:11,000 | 要求他們來投資去買他公司在的這些對象 |
| 00:08:11,000 | 00:08:14,000 | 所以你一方包租代管給他們 |
| 00:08:14,000 | 00:08:19,000 | 另外一方面又提供給他們一個投資的客源 |
| 00:08:19,000 | 00:08:21,000 | 所以這一點我剛才為什麼 |
| 00:08:21,000 | 00:08:23,000 | 因為時間的關係 |
| 00:08:23,000 | 00:08:27,000 | 我要講就是說這次的包租代管所爆發出來的問題 |
| 00:08:27,000 | 00:08:29,000 | 他的面向是很多重的 |
| 00:08:29,000 | 00:08:34,000 | 那另外你們現在社宅的興辦少十萬戶 |
| 00:08:34,000 | 00:08:37,000 | 你說沒有但是我沒有看到你白紙黑紙 |
| 00:08:37,000 | 00:08:40,000 | 很明確的告訴我們說這個政見絕不跳票 |
| 00:08:40,000 | 00:08:43,000 | 我們直接興建一定還是有十三萬戶 |
| 00:08:43,000 | 00:08:45,000 | 好另外我要提出質疑 |
| 00:08:45,000 | 00:08:47,000 | 剛才你們一直在講 |
| 00:08:47,000 | 00:08:50,000 | 就是說因為地方跟地方了解之後 |
| 00:08:50,000 | 00:08:53,000 | 說這個地有限等等之類 |
| 00:08:53,000 | 00:08:55,000 | 好那我要請問一下 |
| 00:08:55,000 | 00:08:58,000 | 對於地方社宅的補助 |
| 00:08:58,000 | 00:09:02,000 | 是不是到2028年就全面取消補助 |
| 00:09:02,000 | 00:09:04,000 | 這一點是不是確定的 |
| 00:09:05,000 | 00:09:07,000 | 報告委員您所提的三個問題 |
| 00:09:07,000 | 00:09:09,000 | 第一個我先簡單跟委員報告 |
| 00:09:09,000 | 00:09:12,000 | 感謝委員關心賴總統的政見 |
| 00:09:12,000 | 00:09:14,000 | 你現在所看到的這樣子的一個 |
| 00:09:14,000 | 00:09:16,000 | 所謂十三萬變成三萬的部分 |
| 00:09:16,000 | 00:09:17,000 | 是一個草案 |
| 00:09:17,000 | 00:09:20,000 | 這個草案是縣市地方政府 |
| 00:09:20,000 | 00:09:23,000 | 跟我們中央政府在討論的部分 |
| 00:09:23,000 | 00:09:26,000 | 所以第一階段興建的量是三萬戶 |
| 00:09:26,000 | 00:09:28,000 | 那未來的八年的興建的量 |
| 00:09:28,000 | 00:09:30,000 | 我們是朝著三萬戶的問題 |
| 00:09:30,000 | 00:09:31,000 | 那我請問一下 |
| 00:09:31,000 | 00:09:32,000 | 目前賴總統上任之後 |
| 00:09:32,000 | 00:09:33,000 | 這是你們的資料 |
| 00:09:33,000 | 00:09:36,000 | 已經達到2.4萬戶 |
| 00:09:36,000 | 00:09:37,000 | 對不對 |
| 00:09:37,000 | 00:09:40,000 | 你達到2.4萬戶沒有錯吧 |
| 00:09:41,000 | 00:09:42,000 | 中央加地方對 |
| 00:09:42,000 | 00:09:45,000 | 好中央加地方達到2.4萬戶 |
| 00:09:45,000 | 00:09:48,000 | 如果按照你們草案三萬戶 |
| 00:09:48,000 | 00:09:50,000 | 就是未來你們只要蓋六千戶 |
| 00:09:50,000 | 00:09:51,000 | 是這個意思嗎 |
| 00:09:51,000 | 00:09:52,000 | 報告委員 |
| 00:09:52,000 | 00:09:53,000 | 我們有提到的 |
| 00:09:53,000 | 00:09:55,000 | 您現在所提的就是樹地 |
| 00:09:55,000 | 00:09:57,000 | 就是直接是空地裡面長出來的 |
| 00:09:57,000 | 00:10:00,000 | 但是我們有提到多元興辦 |
| 00:10:00,000 | 00:10:02,000 | 這個多元興辦包括榮獎 |
| 00:10:02,000 | 00:10:04,000 | 包括都更危老等等這些 |
| 00:10:04,000 | 00:10:05,000 | 都是朝著 |
| 00:10:05,000 | 00:10:07,000 | 尤其是朝著這個總統所指示的 |
| 00:10:07,000 | 00:10:09,000 | 這些都是要以婚育宅為先 |
| 00:10:09,000 | 00:10:11,000 | 來推動的社會住宅 |
| 00:10:11,000 | 00:10:12,000 | 你們這些都更 |
| 00:10:12,000 | 00:10:14,000 | 我是說你們直接興辦 |
| 00:10:14,000 | 00:10:17,000 | 當時直接興辦就是13萬戶 |
| 00:10:17,000 | 00:10:18,000 | 然後其他的 |
| 00:10:18,000 | 00:10:21,000 | 加起來才是百萬戶 |
| 00:10:21,000 | 00:10:23,000 | 然後你們現在 |
| 00:10:23,000 | 00:10:25,000 | 所以到三萬戶這個數字 |
| 00:10:25,000 | 00:10:27,000 | 並不是空穴來風 |
| 00:10:27,000 | 00:10:29,000 | 因為你剛講是你們的草案 |
| 00:10:29,000 | 00:10:30,000 | 我要確定一下 |
| 00:10:30,000 | 00:10:32,000 | 因為大家全國都在聽 |
| 00:10:32,000 | 00:10:33,000 | 很多人在關心 |
| 00:10:33,000 | 00:10:36,000 | 到底是13萬戶還是3萬戶 |
| 00:10:36,000 | 00:10:38,000 | 所以我才多次跟大家講說 |
| 00:10:38,000 | 00:10:40,000 | 我們的目標值並沒有改變 |
| 00:10:40,000 | 00:10:42,000 | 而且要有時間來證明 |
| 00:10:42,000 | 00:10:44,000 | 所以13萬戶是目標 |
| 00:10:44,000 | 00:10:47,000 | 但是你目前的草案是3萬戶 |
| 00:10:47,000 | 00:10:48,000 | 不是 |
| 00:10:48,000 | 00:10:50,000 | 因為剛才講說草案3萬戶 |
| 00:10:50,000 | 00:10:53,000 | 13萬戶這個是確定 |
| 00:10:53,000 | 00:10:55,000 | 以後要達成的目標 |
| 00:10:55,000 | 00:10:56,000 | 什麼時候達成 |
| 00:10:56,000 | 00:10:58,000 | 121年 |
| 00:10:58,000 | 00:11:00,000 | 然後現在做的是因為 |
| 00:11:00,000 | 00:11:01,000 | 跟地方政府盤點完以後 |
| 00:11:01,000 | 00:11:03,000 | 用地沒有問題可以蓋的 |
| 00:11:03,000 | 00:11:05,000 | 這個部分第一階段已經 |
| 00:11:05,000 | 00:11:07,000 | 另外我想一個很重要的 |
| 00:11:07,000 | 00:11:09,000 | 你們在講地方 |
| 00:11:09,000 | 00:11:11,000 | 對地方的補助 |
| 00:11:11,000 | 00:11:13,000 | 會不會2028就取消了 |
| 00:11:13,000 | 00:11:15,000 | 跟委員報告不會 |
| 00:11:15,000 | 00:11:17,000 | 因為我們之前核定的一些相關的 |
| 00:11:17,000 | 00:11:18,000 | 社宅補助案 |
| 00:11:18,000 | 00:11:19,000 | 這個部分就要20年 |
| 00:11:19,000 | 00:11:20,000 | 所以現在這一次 |
| 00:11:20,000 | 00:11:22,000 | 大家關心的除了你的這個 |
| 00:11:22,000 | 00:11:25,000 | 就是要興建的戶數大幅縮減之外 |
| 00:11:25,000 | 00:11:27,000 | 另外一個部分 |
| 00:11:27,000 | 00:11:29,000 | 就是對地方補助的取消 |
| 00:11:29,000 | 00:11:31,000 | 所以你在這邊告訴我們 |
| 00:11:31,000 | 00:11:33,000 | 對地方補助他們興建社宅 |
| 00:11:33,000 | 00:11:35,000 | 不會取消是嗎 |
| 00:11:35,000 | 00:11:36,000 | 有沒有 |
| 00:11:36,000 | 00:11:38,000 | 我們今年我們有統籌分配稅款 |
| 00:11:38,000 | 00:11:39,000 | 今年有改變 |
| 00:11:39,000 | 00:11:41,000 | 那之前已經確定的 |
| 00:11:41,000 | 00:11:42,000 | 這個都不會變 |
| 00:11:42,000 | 00:11:44,000 | 那這個部分後面只是說 |
| 00:11:44,000 | 00:11:46,000 | 他必須要做一些地方配合款 |
| 00:11:46,000 | 00:11:47,000 | 才外法修正以後 |
| 00:11:47,000 | 00:11:49,000 | 一直都有啊 |
| 00:11:49,000 | 00:11:51,000 | 他們一直都有自籌款 |
| 00:11:51,000 | 00:11:53,000 | 之前的部分我們核定的 |
| 00:11:53,000 | 00:11:55,000 | 這個部分是全額 |
| 00:11:55,000 | 00:11:58,000 | 所以就是會縮水的意思 |
| 00:11:58,000 | 00:11:59,000 | 這不是縮水 |
| 00:11:59,000 | 00:12:00,000 | 因為這個地方的 |
| 00:12:00,000 | 00:12:02,000 | 我在這邊我不耽誤其他委員 |
| 00:12:02,000 | 00:12:04,000 | 我相信很多委員都關心 |
| 00:12:04,000 | 00:12:05,000 | 我要特別講 |
| 00:12:05,000 | 00:12:07,000 | 其實對於地方來說 |
| 00:12:07,000 | 00:12:08,000 | 你可以看到 |
| 00:12:08,000 | 00:12:09,000 | 這個是你們資料 |
| 00:12:09,000 | 00:12:11,000 | 今天是你報告的資料 |
| 00:12:11,000 | 00:12:12,000 | 你們全部 |
| 00:12:12,000 | 00:12:15,000 | 比如說在北北 |
| 00:12:15,000 | 00:12:17,000 | 就是新北跟台北市 |
| 00:12:17,000 | 00:12:18,000 | 跟桃園市 |
| 00:12:18,000 | 00:12:20,000 | 這三個主要地方 |
| 00:12:20,000 | 00:12:23,000 | 事實上三個主要的縣市政府 |
| 00:12:23,000 | 00:12:25,000 | 他們所興建的戶數 |
| 00:12:25,000 | 00:12:27,000 | 其實都非常高 |
| 00:12:27,000 | 00:12:30,000 | 也就是說地方很努力的 |
| 00:12:30,000 | 00:12:32,000 | 也在興建社會住宅 |
| 00:12:32,000 | 00:12:33,000 | 所以我要講的是說 |
| 00:12:33,000 | 00:12:36,000 | 他們算是社宅的模範生 |
| 00:12:36,000 | 00:12:38,000 | 可是你們給他的補助款 |
| 00:12:38,000 | 00:12:40,000 | 不應該因此縮水 |
| 00:12:40,000 | 00:12:42,000 | 我有計算一下 |
| 00:12:42,000 | 00:12:45,000 | 就是以台北市全部興建的社宅 |
| 00:12:45,000 | 00:12:47,000 | 而由地方興辦的 |
| 00:12:47,000 | 00:12:49,000 | 是42.2% |
| 00:12:49,000 | 00:12:51,000 | 新北市 |
| 00:12:51,000 | 00:12:54,000 | 中央加地方全部興辦 |
| 00:12:54,000 | 00:12:57,000 | 而是地方興辦的比例 |
| 00:12:57,000 | 00:12:58,000 | 是55.7% |
| 00:12:58,000 | 00:13:01,000 | 超過五成是地方興辦的 |
| 00:13:01,000 | 00:13:02,000 | 然後桃園市 |
| 00:13:02,000 | 00:13:05,000 | 大概49.2%是地方興辦 |
| 00:13:05,000 | 00:13:07,000 | 所以我要講的就是說 |
| 00:13:07,000 | 00:13:09,000 | 其實這幾個縣市 |
| 00:13:09,000 | 00:13:12,000 | 都是興建地方社宅的 |
| 00:13:12,000 | 00:13:14,000 | 一個模範生 |
| 00:13:14,000 | 00:13:16,000 | 所以我也希望說 |
| 00:13:16,000 | 00:13:18,000 | 在他們願意配合 |
| 00:13:18,000 | 00:13:21,000 | 即便這三個縣市 |
| 00:13:21,000 | 00:13:22,000 | 應該基本上 |
| 00:13:22,000 | 00:13:24,000 | 都是寸土寸金的地方 |
| 00:13:24,000 | 00:13:26,000 | 但是他們願意配合政策 |
| 00:13:26,000 | 00:13:28,000 | 積極的興建 |
| 00:13:28,000 | 00:13:30,000 | 這個都是賴總統上任之後 |
| 00:13:30,000 | 00:13:31,000 | 興辦的統計表 |
| 00:13:31,000 | 00:13:33,000 | 這是你們的書面報告 |
| 00:13:33,000 | 00:13:34,000 | 是不是 |
| 00:13:34,000 | 00:13:37,000 | 所以我希望是對於 |
| 00:13:37,000 | 00:13:40,000 | 有在積極興建社會 |
| 00:13:40,000 | 00:13:42,000 | 住宅的地方政府 |
| 00:13:42,000 | 00:13:45,000 | 你們的補助不要縮水 |
| 00:13:45,000 | 00:13:46,000 | 不要忘記喔 |
| 00:13:46,000 | 00:13:50,000 | 你明年是3.6兆的預算 |
| 00:13:50,000 | 00:13:51,000 | 明年3.6兆預算 |
| 00:13:51,000 | 00:13:53,000 | 你現在跟外界講 |
| 00:13:53,000 | 00:13:55,000 | 所以你們的這個 |
| 00:13:55,000 | 00:13:57,000 | 社宅的興建的預算 |
| 00:13:57,000 | 00:13:58,000 | 從2046億 |
| 00:13:58,000 | 00:14:00,000 | 要減成820.9億 |
| 00:14:00,000 | 00:14:02,000 | 說不過去喔 |
| 00:14:02,000 | 00:14:06,000 | 明年3兆6千億的預算 |
| 00:14:06,000 | 00:14:09,000 | 然後你們的社宅興建 |
| 00:14:09,000 | 00:14:13,000 | 要從2046億減成820.9億 |
| 00:14:13,000 | 00:14:14,000 | 這個是大家 |
| 00:14:14,000 | 00:14:16,000 | 絕對很難接受的 |
| 00:14:16,000 | 00:14:19,000 | 所以我希望內政部長 |
| 00:14:19,000 | 00:14:21,000 | 我們劉部長請找國土署 |
| 00:14:21,000 | 00:14:23,000 | 再重新檢討 |
| 00:14:23,000 | 00:14:25,000 | 我們整個社宅興建 |
| 00:14:25,000 | 00:14:27,000 | 剛講說砍到3萬 |
| 00:14:27,000 | 00:14:28,000 | 太少了 |
| 00:14:28,000 | 00:14:31,000 | 你們現在興建已經2萬4千戶 |
| 00:14:31,000 | 00:14:33,000 | 如果按照你現在變3萬的話 |
| 00:14:33,000 | 00:14:35,000 | 你只增加6千戶 |
| 00:14:35,000 | 00:14:36,000 | 我告訴你 |
| 00:14:36,000 | 00:14:37,000 | 那總統怎麼 |
| 00:14:37,000 | 00:14:39,000 | 他怎麼還要再連任 |
| 00:14:39,000 | 00:14:41,000 | 我當然不是這個答案 |
| 00:14:41,000 | 00:14:42,000 | 所以請你 |
| 00:14:42,000 | 00:14:44,000 | 你的計算標準是有問題的 |
| 00:14:44,000 | 00:14:45,000 | 這個是你的數字 |
| 00:14:45,000 | 00:14:46,000 | 沒有沒有沒有 |
| 00:14:46,000 | 00:14:47,000 | 我剛已經提過了 |
| 00:14:47,000 | 00:14:49,000 | 我們直接興建社會住宅 |
| 00:14:49,000 | 00:14:51,000 | 確實是需要比較多的 |
| 00:14:51,000 | 00:14:52,000 | 公務預算的投入 |
| 00:14:52,000 | 00:14:55,000 | 但是未來我們如果有榮獎 |
| 00:14:55,000 | 00:14:57,000 | 或者是都更等等這些的話 |
| 00:14:57,000 | 00:14:58,000 | 就比較不需要 |
| 00:14:58,000 | 00:15:00,000 | 有時候還支持這些 |
| 00:15:00,000 | 00:15:02,000 | 我們也同意北北基 |
| 00:15:02,000 | 00:15:05,000 | 朝中是本來社宅的熱區 |
| 00:15:05,000 | 00:15:06,000 | 好我希望 |
| 00:15:06,000 | 00:15:08,000 | 但是財政水準化專報 |
| 00:15:08,000 | 00:15:09,000 | 也是大院通過的 |
| 00:15:09,000 | 00:15:12,000 | 部長今天我們專報 |
| 00:15:12,000 | 00:15:14,000 | 這個我們的周瑋 |
| 00:15:14,000 | 00:15:16,000 | 這個專報其實是讓你們 |
| 00:15:16,000 | 00:15:18,000 | 今天去澄清 |
| 00:15:18,000 | 00:15:20,000 | 民團他們質疑 |
| 00:15:20,000 | 00:15:21,000 | 這些包含砍戶數 |
| 00:15:21,000 | 00:15:22,000 | 砍預算的 |
| 00:15:22,000 | 00:15:24,000 | 一個非常好的時機 |
| 00:15:24,000 | 00:15:28,000 | 但是這個圖已經廣傳在網路上 |
| 00:15:28,000 | 00:15:31,000 | 我這邊左邊圖廣傳在網路上 |
| 00:15:31,000 | 00:15:33,000 | 這個圖要把所有的公文 |
| 00:15:33,000 | 00:15:34,000 | 能力拿出來 |
| 00:15:34,000 | 00:15:35,000 | 沒有任何事宜 |
| 00:15:35,000 | 00:15:37,000 | 一個公文長達兩公分 |
| 00:15:37,000 | 00:15:38,000 | 那麼厚的時候 |
| 00:15:38,000 | 00:15:39,000 | 只有一張圖表 |
| 00:15:39,000 | 00:15:40,000 | 不能夠掐頭掐尾 |
| 00:15:40,000 | 00:15:41,000 | 來作戰的解釋 |
| 00:15:41,000 | 00:15:42,000 | 那你都沒有辦法解釋 |
| 00:15:42,000 | 00:15:43,000 | 給你機會解釋 |
| 00:15:43,000 | 00:15:44,000 | 給你安排專報 |
| 00:15:44,000 | 00:15:45,000 | 你都沒有辦法解釋 |
| 00:15:45,000 | 00:15:47,000 | 我們已經講得非常清楚 |
| 00:15:47,000 | 00:15:50,000 | 我看不出這個圖 |
| 00:15:50,000 | 00:15:52,000 | 沒有錯的地方 |
| 00:15:52,000 | 00:15:53,000 | 所以我們再來 |
| 00:15:53,000 | 00:15:54,000 | 跟那個委員做報告 |
| 00:15:54,000 | 00:15:55,000 | 都沒有關係 |
| 00:15:55,000 | 00:15:57,000 | 我是只有跟我們做報告 |
| 00:15:57,000 | 00:15:58,000 | 你要跟社會做報告 |
| 00:15:58,000 | 00:15:59,000 | 好不好 |
| 00:15:59,000 | 00:16:01,000 | 既然都今天排了這個專報 |
| 00:16:01,000 | 00:16:02,000 | 但是我覺得沒有解釋 |
| 00:16:02,000 | 00:16:04,000 | 外界的懷疑之處 |
| 00:16:04,000 | 00:16:05,000 | 我們知道很多 |
| 00:16:05,000 | 00:16:06,000 | 外界不同的聲音 |
| 00:16:06,000 | 00:16:07,000 | 那我們會再做一個 |
| 00:16:07,000 | 00:16:08,000 | 比較簡單的 |
| 00:16:08,000 | 00:16:10,000 | 跟大家做一個事宜 |
| 00:16:10,000 | 00:16:11,000 | 也謝謝委員的關心 |