iVOD / 170892
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李坤城 @
| Start Time | End Time | Text |
|---|---|---|
| 00:00:00,000 | 00:00:02,000 | 來詢問 |
| 00:00:17,200 | 00:00:19,000 | 好 謝謝主席 |
| 00:00:19,000 | 00:00:23,000 | 那我們先請今天裁判院院長 被提名人陳永新院長 |
| 00:00:23,000 | 00:00:25,000 | 請陳被提名人 |
| 00:00:25,000 | 00:00:31,000 | 好 院長好 |
| 00:00:31,000 | 00:00:32,000 | 你好 |
| 00:00:32,000 | 00:00:35,000 | 院長算是這個民主政治的前輩 |
| 00:00:35,000 | 00:00:37,000 | 不過今天基於職權的關係 |
| 00:00:37,000 | 00:00:39,000 | 我必須有一些問題要請教您 |
| 00:00:39,000 | 00:00:41,000 | 請教一下 |
| 00:00:41,000 | 00:00:43,000 | 去年其實在立法院 |
| 00:00:43,000 | 00:00:47,000 | 他就已經大幅的刪除跟凍結監察院的預算 |
| 00:00:47,000 | 00:00:49,000 | 今年度也是一樣 |
| 00:00:49,000 | 00:00:51,000 | 那今天對預算 |
| 00:00:51,000 | 00:00:54,000 | 我看也是被刪除了 |
| 00:00:54,000 | 00:00:56,000 | 大概是除了這個人事費用之外 |
| 00:00:56,000 | 00:00:59,000 | 其他的業務費用全部都刪除掉了 |
| 00:00:59,000 | 00:01:01,000 | 那我想請問一下陳院長 |
| 00:01:01,000 | 00:01:04,000 | 如果有這個機會擔任這個監察院的院長 |
| 00:01:04,000 | 00:01:06,000 | 那你發現說你上任之後 |
| 00:01:06,000 | 00:01:08,000 | 你只剩下人事費 |
| 00:01:08,000 | 00:01:09,000 | 其他所有的費用都沒有了 |
| 00:01:09,000 | 00:01:10,000 | 都被刪除了 |
| 00:01:10,000 | 00:01:13,000 | 那整個監察院要怎麼運作 |
| 00:01:13,000 | 00:01:15,000 | 你不能要馬兒跑 |
| 00:01:15,000 | 00:01:17,000 | 又要馬兒不吃草 |
| 00:01:17,000 | 00:01:20,000 | 我會爭取合理的預算 |
| 00:01:20,000 | 00:01:26,000 | 我覺得在監察院沒有被修憲廢除以前 |
| 00:01:26,000 | 00:01:28,000 | 不應該用把預算刪除 |
| 00:01:28,000 | 00:01:32,000 | 或者是把監察委員的人選全部否決 |
| 00:01:32,000 | 00:01:36,000 | 讓他變成一個空窗空轉的機構 |
| 00:01:36,000 | 00:01:37,000 | 然後讓他癱瘓 |
| 00:01:37,000 | 00:01:40,000 | 這樣的做法不但不合理 |
| 00:01:40,000 | 00:01:41,000 | 其實是違憲的 |
| 00:01:41,000 | 00:01:44,000 | 所以我如果做監察院長 |
| 00:01:44,000 | 00:01:46,000 | 我一定跟立法院充分的溝通 |
| 00:01:46,000 | 00:01:48,000 | 爭取合理的預算 |
| 00:01:48,000 | 00:01:51,000 | 但是有可能在你這個有機會擔任院長的時候 |
| 00:01:51,000 | 00:01:53,000 | 預算已經被刪除掉了 |
| 00:01:53,000 | 00:01:55,000 | 所以我今天希望我這裡的發言 |
| 00:01:55,000 | 00:01:59,000 | 讓這個禮拜你們最後協商的時候 |
| 00:01:59,000 | 00:02:02,000 | 主張要刪預算的立法委員 |
| 00:02:02,000 | 00:02:04,000 | 可以再慎重的思考一下 |
| 00:02:04,000 | 00:02:07,000 | 那如果在您就任之前 |
| 00:02:07,000 | 00:02:09,000 | 有機會就任之前預算被刪除了 |
| 00:02:09,000 | 00:02:12,000 | 那你會採取什麼樣的一個法律的一個就介的行為 |
| 00:02:12,000 | 00:02:14,000 | 我很遺憾 |
| 00:02:14,000 | 00:02:18,000 | 但是我會研究是不是可以再請監察院附議 |
| 00:02:18,000 | 00:02:21,000 | 或者是行政院幫我們提這個附議 |
| 00:02:21,000 | 00:02:23,000 | 因為去年是這個 |
| 00:02:23,000 | 00:02:26,000 | 因為有監委是監察院是提出釋憲 |
| 00:02:26,000 | 00:02:29,000 | 那所以釋憲是不是也是 |
| 00:02:29,000 | 00:02:31,000 | 如果有機會的話會採取了一個動作 |
| 00:02:31,000 | 00:02:34,000 | 其實我覺得立法院如果是講道理的地方 |
| 00:02:34,000 | 00:02:37,000 | 這個其實還不需要動到釋憲嘛 |
| 00:02:37,000 | 00:02:38,000 | 如果是講道理的地方 |
| 00:02:38,000 | 00:02:40,000 | 預算就不會被刪掉了 |
| 00:02:40,000 | 00:02:42,000 | 這個機構沒有廢除你不給他預算 |
| 00:02:42,000 | 00:02:44,000 | 然後你又要求他做事情 |
| 00:02:44,000 | 00:02:45,000 | 要就有功能 |
| 00:02:45,000 | 00:02:47,000 | 這個是矛盾嘛 |
| 00:02:47,000 | 00:02:49,000 | 我剛剛已經舉例了嘛 |
| 00:02:49,000 | 00:02:52,000 | 你治安不好你不能把警政署廢掉啊 |
| 00:02:52,000 | 00:02:55,000 | 你應該監察的人力設備配備嘛 |
| 00:02:55,000 | 00:02:57,000 | 一樣的道理我們醫院也是這樣 |
| 00:02:57,000 | 00:03:00,000 | 我發現一個醫院沒有好經營不好 |
| 00:03:00,000 | 00:03:04,000 | 我就是派更好的醫生去給他充分的設備 |
| 00:03:04,000 | 00:03:08,000 | 讓他提升服務病人的這個績效嘛 |
| 00:03:08,000 | 00:03:10,000 | 博憲院長你遇到的這個情況 |
| 00:03:10,000 | 00:03:12,000 | 跟之前的又不太一樣 |
| 00:03:12,000 | 00:03:14,000 | 第六屆至少還有監察委員 |
| 00:03:14,000 | 00:03:16,000 | 所以他們預算被刪除了 |
| 00:03:16,000 | 00:03:20,000 | 那他們有一些事情還是可以低度的運作 |
| 00:03:20,000 | 00:03:22,000 | 那現在你可能面臨到的情況是 |
| 00:03:22,000 | 00:03:28,000 | 有可能監察委員的提名人都被藍白都被反對了 |
| 00:03:28,000 | 00:03:34,000 | 所以接下來有可能會呈現一個沒有監察委員的監察院 |
| 00:03:34,000 | 00:03:38,000 | 那這個我想對台灣社會的不幸啦 |
| 00:03:38,000 | 00:03:44,000 | 我覺得不要什麼事情都要讓這個政府癱瘓空傳 |
| 00:03:44,000 | 00:03:47,000 | 大家應該為了整個人民著想 |
| 00:03:47,000 | 00:03:51,000 | 這個機構讓它發揮功能才是正途 |
| 00:03:51,000 | 00:03:53,000 | 那所以其實蠻矛盾的 |
| 00:03:53,000 | 00:03:56,000 | 我剛才也聽了幾位國民黨委員他們的說法 |
| 00:03:56,000 | 00:04:00,000 | 他們提到說這個監察院要發揮這個調查權監察權 |
| 00:04:00,000 | 00:04:02,000 | 要彈劾要糾舉糾正等等之類的 |
| 00:04:02,000 | 00:04:05,000 | 但是實際上他沒有想要讓你過 |
| 00:04:05,000 | 00:04:09,000 | 沒有想讓你過也希望說監察院要發揮這些的功能 |
| 00:04:09,000 | 00:04:10,000 | 這其實是矛盾的啦 |
| 00:04:10,000 | 00:04:12,000 | 那我再請一下陳院長 |
| 00:04:12,000 | 00:04:15,000 | 那過去您跟這個民眾黨的關係 |
| 00:04:15,000 | 00:04:20,000 | 跟這個柯文哲跟黃國昌兩位主席的關係算是不錯 |
| 00:04:20,000 | 00:04:22,000 | 那這次有特別去拜會他們嗎 |
| 00:04:22,000 | 00:04:23,000 | 沒有 |
| 00:04:23,000 | 00:04:24,000 | 沒有 |
| 00:04:24,000 | 00:04:30,000 | 我過去當然從台聯時代力量一直到民眾黨 |
| 00:04:30,000 | 00:04:33,000 | 我都是比較關心弱勢啦 |
| 00:04:33,000 | 00:04:36,000 | 所以我也覺得他們是台灣社會比較弱小的政黨 |
| 00:04:36,000 | 00:04:39,000 | 我都曾經給予很大的幫忙 |
| 00:04:39,000 | 00:04:44,000 | 但是我覺得監察院長是一個要得罪人的 |
| 00:04:44,000 | 00:04:47,000 | 監察院是得罪人的地方啦 |
| 00:04:47,000 | 00:04:52,000 | 所以我不會去拜託任何的一個委員 |
| 00:04:52,000 | 00:04:56,000 | 李登輝總統曾經提名我做監察委員 |
| 00:04:56,000 | 00:05:00,000 | 那時候我才39歲是最年輕的監委 |
| 00:05:00,000 | 00:05:02,000 | 那時候的院長是陳宇安 |
| 00:05:02,000 | 00:05:06,000 | 那李登輝總統要陳宇安帶我們29個監委 |
| 00:05:06,000 | 00:05:08,000 | 去拜託當時的國民大會代表 |
| 00:05:08,000 | 00:05:10,000 | 只有我一個沒有去 |
| 00:05:10,000 | 00:05:14,000 | 因為我覺得我不能欠這些國大人情 |
| 00:05:14,000 | 00:05:16,000 | 我將來要彈劾人家 |
| 00:05:16,000 | 00:05:19,000 | 他們說你當初請我投你一票 |
| 00:05:19,000 | 00:05:22,000 | 那這個案子是不是可以這個觀說一下 |
| 00:05:22,000 | 00:05:24,000 | 那我怎麼做 |
| 00:05:24,000 | 00:05:28,000 | 所以我是不會去跟他們有任何接觸 |
| 00:05:28,000 | 00:05:32,000 | 好 那因為除了民進黨支持之外 |
| 00:05:32,000 | 00:05:34,000 | 可能還需要在野黨的支持 |
| 00:05:34,000 | 00:05:37,000 | 那你有信心通過這次的人事通過 |
| 00:05:37,000 | 00:05:38,000 | 我知道很困難 |
| 00:05:38,000 | 00:05:41,000 | 第一次來總統希望我當任監察院長 |
| 00:05:41,000 | 00:05:44,000 | 我說大概不會通過吧 |
| 00:05:44,000 | 00:05:46,000 | 我說讓我思考一個禮拜 |
| 00:05:46,000 | 00:05:48,000 | 後來我祈禱 |
| 00:05:48,000 | 00:05:52,000 | 我覺得監察院是一個行公義的地方 |
| 00:05:52,000 | 00:05:54,000 | 是要追求社會公平正義 |
| 00:05:54,000 | 00:05:58,000 | 那這個是聖經所教誨 |
| 00:05:58,000 | 00:06:00,000 | 也是我畢生努力的目標 |
| 00:06:00,000 | 00:06:02,000 | 後來我跟賴總統說 |
| 00:06:02,000 | 00:06:04,000 | 好啦我答應 |
| 00:06:04,000 | 00:06:07,000 | 即使不過也是上帝的旨意 |
| 00:06:07,000 | 00:06:10,000 | 那我願意承擔這個單子 |
| 00:06:10,000 | 00:06:12,000 | 但是呢 |
| 00:06:12,000 | 00:06:15,000 | 事實上我覺得目前朝野對立的這種氣氛 |
| 00:06:15,000 | 00:06:18,000 | 真的我們要把監察院好好改革 |
| 00:06:18,000 | 00:06:20,000 | 是有相當的困難 |
| 00:06:20,000 | 00:06:21,000 | 可是要廢掉 |
| 00:06:21,000 | 00:06:23,000 | 現實是做不到 |
| 00:06:23,000 | 00:06:26,000 | 最少好幾年的時間 |
| 00:06:26,000 | 00:06:30,000 | 要去討論這個新鮮的真正的版本 |
| 00:06:30,000 | 00:06:34,000 | 所以我覺得應該是朝野的立委 |
| 00:06:34,000 | 00:06:36,000 | 特別是在野的立委 |
| 00:06:36,000 | 00:06:40,000 | 其實應該用朝野黨派的思考 |
| 00:06:40,000 | 00:06:43,000 | 來看這個人事案 |
| 00:06:43,000 | 00:06:47,000 | 我覺得不是所有提名的都不適任 |
| 00:06:47,000 | 00:06:49,000 | 如果說要全部封殺 |
| 00:06:49,000 | 00:06:51,000 | 根本就不需要審查 |
| 00:06:51,000 | 00:06:53,000 | 就直接退回了 |
| 00:06:53,000 | 00:06:55,000 | 既然要審查 |
| 00:06:55,000 | 00:06:58,000 | 就應該好好看每一個被提名人 |
| 00:06:58,000 | 00:07:00,000 | 他的操守 |
| 00:07:00,000 | 00:07:02,000 | 他的性格 |
| 00:07:02,000 | 00:07:04,000 | 或者他過去的表現 |
| 00:07:04,000 | 00:07:06,000 | 他的專業 |
| 00:07:06,000 | 00:07:08,000 | 在社會上是不是一個受敬重的 |
| 00:07:08,000 | 00:07:10,000 | 一個好的監委的人選 |
| 00:07:10,000 | 00:07:14,000 | 那我覺得這樣才能夠幫助台灣社會 |
| 00:07:14,000 | 00:07:16,000 | 讓監察院發揮功能 |
| 00:07:17,000 | 00:07:19,000 | 陳院長講的是一個理想的狀態 |
| 00:07:19,000 | 00:07:21,000 | 如果立法院是講道理的地方 |
| 00:07:21,000 | 00:07:24,000 | 審查也不應該全部都封殺 |
| 00:07:24,000 | 00:07:26,000 | 那目前看起來 |
| 00:07:26,000 | 00:07:29,000 | 有可能還是會被在野黨封殺 |
| 00:07:29,000 | 00:07:32,000 | 我也是問心無愧 |
| 00:07:32,000 | 00:07:34,000 | 我覺得平常心 |
| 00:07:34,000 | 00:07:36,000 | 被通過了 |
| 00:07:36,000 | 00:07:40,000 | 我一定讓監察院變成一個民眾可以信賴 |
| 00:07:40,000 | 00:07:43,000 | 然後行使公義的地方 |
| 00:07:43,000 | 00:07:45,000 | 但是不通過 |
| 00:07:45,000 | 00:07:47,000 | 其實是讓我比較自由 |
| 00:07:47,000 | 00:07:49,000 | 我這個年紀 |
| 00:07:49,000 | 00:07:51,000 | 我也可以比較輕鬆的過日子 |
| 00:07:51,000 | 00:07:53,000 | 那再請教一下陳院長 |
| 00:07:53,000 | 00:07:55,000 | 因為剛剛有委員提到說 |
| 00:07:55,000 | 00:07:59,000 | 我們談判總代表楊貞寧 |
| 00:07:59,000 | 00:08:01,000 | 他是在7月29號 |
| 00:08:01,000 | 00:08:05,000 | 被第六屆的監察委員通過彈劾 |
| 00:08:05,000 | 00:08:07,000 | 那通過彈劾接下來 |
| 00:08:07,000 | 00:08:09,000 | 是要送這個懲戒法院來做審理 |
| 00:08:09,000 | 00:08:12,000 | 那接下來有可能會上台 |
| 00:08:12,000 | 00:08:14,000 | 接下來有可能會產生一些問題 |
| 00:08:14,000 | 00:08:16,000 | 就是當懲戒法院 |
| 00:08:16,000 | 00:08:18,000 | 不是在監察院這個體系 |
| 00:08:18,000 | 00:08:20,000 | 但是如果懲戒法院 |
| 00:08:20,000 | 00:08:22,000 | 他審理的案件 |
| 00:08:22,000 | 00:08:24,000 | 一審判決出來 |
| 00:08:24,000 | 00:08:26,000 | 監察院覺得說 |
| 00:08:26,000 | 00:08:28,000 | 對於一審判決的結果 |
| 00:08:28,000 | 00:08:30,000 | 絕對不符 |
| 00:08:30,000 | 00:08:32,000 | 這個必須要當初調查的監委 |
| 00:08:32,000 | 00:08:34,000 | 或是新任的監委 |
| 00:08:34,000 | 00:08:36,000 | 在20天內決定是否上訴 |
| 00:08:36,000 | 00:08:38,000 | 如果到時候沒有監察委員 |
| 00:08:38,000 | 00:08:40,000 | 那怎麼辦 |
| 00:08:40,000 | 00:08:42,000 | 其實不是全民之福 |
| 00:08:42,000 | 00:08:44,000 | 所以我們還是希望 |
| 00:08:44,000 | 00:08:47,000 | 9月29號大家投票的時候 |
| 00:08:47,000 | 00:08:52,000 | 可以真的憑著專業的判斷 |
| 00:08:52,000 | 00:08:54,000 | 然後全民的福祉 |
| 00:08:54,000 | 00:08:56,000 | 去考慮這個人事權的問題 |
| 00:08:56,000 | 00:08:58,000 | 我剛才特別是舉這個楊貞寧這個案子 |
| 00:08:58,000 | 00:09:00,000 | 因為大家重視 |
| 00:09:00,000 | 00:09:02,000 | 變成一個無解 |
| 00:09:02,000 | 00:09:04,000 | 就是沒有辦法處理的問題 |
| 00:09:04,000 | 00:09:06,000 | 沒有監察委員可以決定說 |
| 00:09:06,000 | 00:09:08,000 | 是否要提上訴 |
| 00:09:08,000 | 00:09:10,000 | 接下來人民陳情案 |
| 00:09:10,000 | 00:09:12,000 | 怎麼做處理 |
| 00:09:12,000 | 00:09:14,000 | 如果沒有監察院 |
| 00:09:14,000 | 00:09:16,000 | 就沒辦法處理 |
| 00:09:16,000 | 00:09:18,000 | 可以收件但是沒辦法處理 |
| 00:09:18,000 | 00:09:20,000 | 沒有人能夠調查 |
| 00:09:20,000 | 00:09:22,000 | 沒有人能夠指揮辦案 |
| 00:09:22,000 | 00:09:24,000 | 但是 |
| 00:09:24,000 | 00:09:26,000 | 除了收件之外 |
| 00:09:26,000 | 00:09:28,000 | 案子就躺在那邊 |
| 00:09:28,000 | 00:09:30,000 | 也沒辦法做任何的審理 |
| 00:09:30,000 | 00:09:32,000 | 所以我覺得 |
| 00:09:32,000 | 00:09:34,000 | 人民的 |
| 00:09:34,000 | 00:09:36,000 | 深淵無處可深 |
| 00:09:36,000 | 00:09:38,000 | 這個是社會的損失 |
| 00:09:38,000 | 00:09:40,000 | 對阿 |
| 00:09:40,000 | 00:09:42,000 | 所以我們所講的 |
| 00:09:42,000 | 00:09:44,000 | 監察院一般賦予的期待 |
| 00:09:44,000 | 00:09:46,000 | 彈劾、糾舉、糾正 |
| 00:09:46,000 | 00:09:48,000 | 完全都停擺了 |
| 00:09:48,000 | 00:09:50,000 | 因為沒有監察委員 |
| 00:09:50,000 | 00:09:52,000 | 就停擺了 |
| 00:09:52,000 | 00:09:54,000 | 現在年底要選縣市長選舉了 |
| 00:09:54,000 | 00:09:56,000 | 那現在我看很多候選人 |
| 00:09:56,000 | 00:09:58,000 | 都已經申請了政治獻金了 |
| 00:09:58,000 | 00:10:00,000 | 那政治獻金現在要申請是可以 |
| 00:10:00,000 | 00:10:02,000 | 但是如果政治獻金 |
| 00:10:02,000 | 00:10:04,000 | 未來相關有發現一些問題 |
| 00:10:04,000 | 00:10:06,000 | 相關的裁罰 |
| 00:10:06,000 | 00:10:08,000 | 還是要有監察委員 |
| 00:10:08,000 | 00:10:10,000 | 陽光法案就也停擺了 |
| 00:10:10,000 | 00:10:12,000 | 我是覺得 |
| 00:10:12,000 | 00:10:14,000 | 不應該讓監察院停擺 |
| 00:10:14,000 | 00:10:16,000 | 所以我講的 |
| 00:10:16,000 | 00:10:18,000 | 就是說大家期待 |
| 00:10:18,000 | 00:10:20,000 | 監察院要有作為 |
| 00:10:20,000 | 00:10:22,000 | 但是監察委員他不讓你通過 |
| 00:10:22,000 | 00:10:24,000 | 那我們所講的陽光司法也都停擺了 |
| 00:10:24,000 | 00:10:26,000 | 然後監察院要做的這個 |
| 00:10:26,000 | 00:10:28,000 | 彈劾、糾正、糾舉 |
| 00:10:28,000 | 00:10:30,000 | 也完全沒辦法做了 |
| 00:10:30,000 | 00:10:32,000 | 那更不用說這個國下任前委員會 |
| 00:10:32,000 | 00:10:34,000 | 我說監察院需要改 |