| IVOD_ID |
170825 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170825 |
| 日期 |
2026-08-05 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-26-22 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第22次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
22 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第22次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-08-05T10:34:07+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-08-05T11:02:13+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:28:06 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/d053bb9b075f6aeae3bce8928dd31b39cd75ebd3fcd1029c9e152d6567b454d32cf89a319f4586af5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
陳菁徽 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:34:07 - 11:02:13 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-08-05T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第22次全體委員會議（事由：（上午9時起）
邀請衛生福利部部長、行政院食品安全辦公室、教育部、國防部、經濟部、台灣糖業股份有限公司及行政院消費者保護處就「從致癌油事件發展迄今，中央一味『蓋牌、吃案、當門神』有關行政究責之重做完整調查報告(含台糖失職、食安警訊斷鏈責任、團體訴訟求償進度)及未來如何確保安全無虞的國軍團膳、學生營養午餐」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
（下午2時30分起，若上午議程尚未結束，待結束後接續召開）
一、審查行政院函請審議「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
二、繼續審查委員廖偉翔等18人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法第二十四條及第二十五條條文修正草案」案。
三、繼續審查委員蘇清泉等23人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法第二十二條條文修正草案」案。
四、繼續審查委員蘇清泉等20人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法第四條條文修正草案」案。
......（完整內容，詳見議事日程）
二十、審查委員許宇甄等16人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法第二十二條條文修正草案」案。
二十一、審查委員郭國文等18人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法第七條及第四十八條之一條文修正草案」案。
二十二、審查國民黨黨團擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十三、審查委員黃健豪等16人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十四、審查委員廖偉翔等19人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法第七條及第四十七條條文修正草案」案。
二十五、審查委員李彥秀等23人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十六、審查委員羅智強等17人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十七、審查委員盧縣一等16人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十八、審查委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等16人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十九、審查委員許宇甄等20人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
三十、審查委員王育敏等25人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
三十一、審查委員徐巧芯等17人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
三十二、審查委員林月琴等24人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
三十三、審查委員林淑芬等21人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
三十四、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等16人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
三十五、審查委員李坤城等18人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
三十六、審查委員黃秀芳等21人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
三十七、審查委員劉建國等19人擬具「食品安全衛生管理法部分條文修正草案」案。
【逐條討論，不詢答】
【第二十至二十二案，如經復議則不予審查；第一案及第二十三至三十七案，如未經院會交付本會審查或未經各黨團簽署不復議同意） |
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0.852 |
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SPEAKER_04 |
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1461.70971875 |
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1461.72659375 |
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SPEAKER_05 |
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石部長崇良 |
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1461.72659375 |
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1481.52096875 |
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0.852 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1482.06096875 |
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1482.65159375 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[354].start |
1482.93846875 |
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1484.28846875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[355].start |
1485.97596875 |
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1488.01784375 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[356].start |
1488.37221875 |
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1494.41346875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
| transcript.pyannote[357].start |
1494.83534375 |
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1497.09659375 |
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0.927 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
| transcript.pyannote[358].start |
1497.61971875 |
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1499.05409375 |
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0.927 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[359].start |
1500.28596875 |
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1501.29846875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1501.87221875 |
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1502.24346875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1502.58096875 |
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1523.18534375 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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余組長俊明 |
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1522.18971875 |
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1522.51034375 |
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0.749 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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余組長俊明 |
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1522.56096875 |
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1522.57784375 |
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0.749 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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余組長俊明 |
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1522.59471875 |
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1522.61159375 |
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0.749 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1523.47221875 |
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1537.88346875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
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1537.88346875 |
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1539.35159375 |
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0.927 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1540.07721875 |
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1540.11096875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
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1540.11096875 |
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1542.11909375 |
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0.927 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
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1542.97971875 |
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1543.57034375 |
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0.927 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
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1543.68846875 |
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1547.04659375 |
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0.927 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
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1547.26596875 |
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1551.18096875 |
| transcript.pyannote[371].speaker_score |
0.927 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
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1552.05846875 |
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1555.26471875 |
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0.927 |
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SPEAKER_04 |
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1553.39159375 |
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1554.37034375 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1555.26471875 |
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1569.03471875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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蔡副總經理東霖 |
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1555.28159375 |
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1555.29846875 |
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SPEAKER_04 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1569.47346875 |
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1570.51971875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1572.83159375 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1575.04221875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1595.10659375 |
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1608.38721875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1609.82159375 |
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1611.61034375 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1611.99846875 |
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1614.02346875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_05 |
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石部長崇良 |
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1614.96846875 |
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1622.27534375 |
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0.852 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1620.99284375 |
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1625.11034375 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_05 |
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石部長崇良 |
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1622.73096875 |
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1623.03471875 |
| transcript.pyannote[385].speaker_score |
0.852 |
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SPEAKER_05 |
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石部長崇良 |
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1623.59159375 |
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1623.67596875 |
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0.852 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1625.83596875 |
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1626.93284375 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_05 |
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石部長崇良 |
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0.852 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1631.13471875 |
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1631.60721875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1631.96159375 |
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1633.91909375 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_05 |
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石部長崇良 |
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1634.29034375 |
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1637.20971875 |
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0.852 |
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SPEAKER_05 |
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石部長崇良 |
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1637.93534375 |
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1660.44659375 |
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0.852 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[393].start |
1654.15221875 |
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1654.18596875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_04 |
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1654.18596875 |
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1655.24909375 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1655.24909375 |
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1655.33346875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
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1655.62034375 |
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1655.63721875 |
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0.846 |
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SPEAKER_04 |
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1655.63721875 |
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1656.02534375 |
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SPEAKER_03 |
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陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[398].start |
1656.02534375 |
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1657.25721875 |
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0.846 |
| transcript.pyannote[399].speaker |
SPEAKER_03 |
| transcript.pyannote[399].speaker_name |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[399].start |
1657.47659375 |
| transcript.pyannote[399].end |
1657.76346875 |
| transcript.pyannote[399].speaker_score |
0.846 |
| transcript.pyannote[400].speaker |
SPEAKER_03 |
| transcript.pyannote[400].speaker_name |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[400].start |
1658.01659375 |
| transcript.pyannote[400].end |
1659.31596875 |
| transcript.pyannote[400].speaker_score |
0.846 |
| transcript.pyannote[401].speaker |
SPEAKER_03 |
| transcript.pyannote[401].speaker_name |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[401].start |
1660.00784375 |
| transcript.pyannote[401].end |
1673.81159375 |
| transcript.pyannote[401].speaker_score |
0.846 |
| transcript.pyannote[402].speaker |
SPEAKER_03 |
| transcript.pyannote[402].speaker_name |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[402].start |
1674.55409375 |
| transcript.pyannote[402].end |
1674.94221875 |
| transcript.pyannote[402].speaker_score |
0.846 |
| transcript.pyannote[403].speaker |
SPEAKER_05 |
| transcript.pyannote[403].speaker_name |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.pyannote[403].start |
1675.22909375 |
| transcript.pyannote[403].end |
1681.30409375 |
| transcript.pyannote[403].speaker_score |
0.852 |
| transcript.pyannote[404].speaker |
SPEAKER_03 |
| transcript.pyannote[404].speaker_name |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.pyannote[404].start |
1675.66784375 |
| transcript.pyannote[404].end |
1676.39346875 |
| transcript.pyannote[404].speaker_score |
0.846 |
| transcript.pyannote[405].speaker |
SPEAKER_06 |
| transcript.pyannote[405].speaker_name |
謝署長名冠 |
| transcript.pyannote[405].start |
1683.59909375 |
| transcript.pyannote[405].end |
1685.97846875 |
| transcript.pyannote[405].speaker_score |
0.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
0 |
| transcript.whisperx[0].end |
7 |
| transcript.whisperx[0].text |
謝謝主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
7 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
10 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
謝謝各位官員的出席 還有委員的出席 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
10 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
15 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
我想請石部長 江署長 還有徐副主任 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
15 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
19 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
請石部長 江署長 徐署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
19 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
22 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
好 委員好 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
22 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
26 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
好 當然我覺得你們捲入這個風波啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
26 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
28 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
我也感到非常遺憾 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
28 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
31 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
如果有議員已經告發你們瀆職 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
31 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
36 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
有石部長 有江署長 還有昨天加了台唐的董事長 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
36 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
39 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那議員昨天已經保全了證據 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
39 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
43 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
比如說會議的影音檔 或者是監視器 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
43 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
46 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
那之後呢 這些基層的人員 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
46 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
49 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
今天名字有被披露在報紙上 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
49 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
52 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
應該也會被一一叫去詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
52 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
54 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
關於這個會議的內容 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
54 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
57 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
那再來應該也會傳在羈押裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
57 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
60 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
這個總經理 還有廠長去做詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
60 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
64 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
所以今天這個議員也在看這段質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
64 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
66 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
今天的答詢非常重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
66 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
70 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
一定要誠實的面對國人 誠實的報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
70 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
72 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
那我們先請江署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
75 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
76 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
委員好 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
76 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
77 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
江署長 因為您上週不在 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
77 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
80 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
所以石部長幫您回覆了非常多的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
80 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
84 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
可是從我們今天揭露這個的資訊啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
84 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
85 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
報紙上看到的資訊 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
85 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
88 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
我們發現您才是這場會議的主持人 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
88 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
92 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
這場會議是決定了這個20%以上下架 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
92 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
95 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
20%以上可以保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
95 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
99 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
那另外呢 石部長也在上週幫您回答說 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
99 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
103 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
這個業者是有在這場會議中討論復工 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
103 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
105 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
那我想問一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
105 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
109 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
因為石部長上禮拜是回覆這個會議分上下長次 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
109 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
112 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
可是我們今天所有人印象中 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
112 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
115 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
都停留在會議分上下長次 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
115 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
118 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
這個哪邊看得出來分上下長次 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
118 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
122 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
報告委員 這個會議分成兩個議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
122 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
126 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
第一個是檢視整個中聯這次的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
126 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
130 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
所以我們請了專家來在油品的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
130 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
132 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
製程的部分做進一步的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
132 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
136 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
那第二個部分呢 就是針對我們根據106年 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
136 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
140 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
下架回收的產品 並且下架階層 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
140 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
144 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
我們是定在 因為是衛生安全標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
144 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
146 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
所以是屬於第八類 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
146 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
148 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
所以是在下架在一層 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
148 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
153 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
就是製程中聯製程扶壽扶茂太山的油品的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
153 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
157 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
所以在7月 我們確定了第一層的 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
157 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
159 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
第一層我們看到有不同的聲音 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
159 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
162 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
尤其7月3號媒體上面其實在討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
162 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
164 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
我們很清楚的 我們對於 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
164 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
166 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
其實江市長 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
166 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
169 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
所以我們再重新思考第二個議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
169 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
174 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
你只需要問出你會議到底有沒有分上下兩場 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
174 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
176 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
因為石部長上週幫你回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
176 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
178 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
會議分上下兩場 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
178 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
181 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
應該是說 我們會議裡面有兩個重要議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
181 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
183 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
上面第一個議題是 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
183 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
185 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
我們去中聯相關的 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
185 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
187 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
他本身的製程的是不是有議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
187 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
189 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
專家來協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
189 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
191 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
下半場我們針對說 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
191 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
194 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
第一層下架之下 是不是要往下走 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
194 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
195 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
所以這邊特別提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
195 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
197 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
廠商幾點離開 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
197 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
198 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
廠商幾點離開 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
198 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
201 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
這個會議從3點開到5點 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
201 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
203 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
廠商幾點離開 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
203 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
205 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
廠商應該是有在我們現場 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
205 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
206 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
可是在我們第二層的 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
206 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
208 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
廠商全程都在現場 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
208 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
209 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
209 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
212 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
廠商是在我們的會議討論的過程當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
212 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
214 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
他進入我們的會議的議場 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
214 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
216 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
做完說明之後呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
216 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
218 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
我們繼續在討論後續的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
218 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
220 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
沒有讓廠商做任何的發言 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
220 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
223 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
我們是在做第二層的一些思考 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
223 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
225 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
該如何去做大的討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
225 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
226 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
你只要告訴我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
226 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
229 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
因為你剛剛時事長也講得很輕鬆 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
229 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
232 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
他今天就會公佈全部的會議記錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
232 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
234 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
王毓民委員要求他 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
234 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
235 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
在今天委員會結束以前 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
235 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
237 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
印出給所有的委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
237 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
239 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
所有的國人 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
239 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
241 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
所以你沒有什麼好隱瞞的了 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
241 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
242 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
你只要告訴我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
242 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
246 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
廠商幾點到幾點在現場 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
246 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
248 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
我們現在很明顯看到紀錄上 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
248 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
250 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
有委員會你們的同仁 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
250 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
252 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
還有食藥署的副署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
252 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
255 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
還有食品組的十幾位同仁 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
255 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
258 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
相信這些人很快就可以回憶起來 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
258 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
260 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
廠商幾點到幾點在現場 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
260 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
263 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
廠商有沒有聽到你們在討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
263 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
267 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
20%上架下架的原則 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
267 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
268 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
跟委員做報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
268 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
270 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
因為這整個記錄是透明的 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
270 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
272 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
我們待會今天部長也承諾 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
272 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
273 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
其實你現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
273 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
275 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
所以我等於是說他 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
275 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
279 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
我等一下尋答結束前 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
279 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
281 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
你告訴我就可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
281 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
283 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
就可以因為上禮拜時部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
283 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
285 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
他應該是在這個會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
285 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
287 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
整個會議的過程中 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
287 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
288 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
我們結束的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
288 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
289 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
他其實有在現場的 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
289 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
292 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
他但是沒有進入任何的討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
292 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
293 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
有關於我們第二階層 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
293 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
294 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
好啦很明顯了 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
294 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
297 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
所以廠商跟著你們到會議結束 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
297 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
299 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
徐副也是這樣看到的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
299 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
301 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
徐副主任 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
301 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
303 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
廠商從頭到尾都跟你們在一起 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
303 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
305 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
你們在決策的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
305 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
306 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
他們也都聽到了 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
306 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
307 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
只是他們不能發言 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
307 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
309 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
是這樣嗎徐副主任 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
309 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
310 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
廠商都在 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
310 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
311 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
全程都在 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
311 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
314 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
他進來之後全都在 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
314 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
316 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
那他沒有發言 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
316 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
318 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
但是我們那個會議是建議 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
318 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
320 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
並不是決策 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
321 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
323 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
所以時部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
323 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
324 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
你害到你同事了 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
324 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
328 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
你上禮拜說廠商中間請他離開 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
328 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
330 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
現在旁邊兩個一個主持會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
330 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
331 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
一個參加會議的人說 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
331 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
334 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
廠商全程都在 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
334 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
337 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
那我們再問江署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
337 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
339 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
好我跟委員說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
339 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
341 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
我要問江署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
341 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
344 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
江署長你幾月幾日知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
344 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
348 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
台糖的這個事件14.8PPB |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
348 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
350 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
你幾月幾日知道的 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
351 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
354 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
我的印象是在7月 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
354 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
356 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
應該是7月十幾號 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
356 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
358 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
加進15號以後 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
358 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
359 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
約這個時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
359 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
361 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
是因為我們的同仁們 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
361 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
363 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
再次去進入台糖 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
363 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
366 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
進入中聯去看他所有的油 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
366 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
368 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
去看所有油的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
368 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
369 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
我們調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
369 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
373 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
7月初其實就已經下架了之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
373 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
374 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
我們去做調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
374 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
376 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
所以參加調查之前 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
376 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
377 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
我們也做了調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
377 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
379 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
所以你們7月十幾號 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
379 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
380 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
就已經知道台糖 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
380 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
383 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
有這一批超標7倍的油 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
383 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
384 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
這個這樣子說 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
384 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
386 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
這個油剛才提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
386 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
387 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
我剛才後面認識的 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
387 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
389 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
很像有那個初交原油 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
389 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
390 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
那兩個是長得不太一樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
390 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
391 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
沒關係啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
391 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
392 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
所以我的意思是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
392 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
395 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
7月中你就知道有這個油 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
395 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
397 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
你8月1號還要叫大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
397 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
398 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
去問高雄市政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
398 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
399 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
是什麼意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
400 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
401 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
我說的意思是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
401 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
403 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
因為這個油 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
403 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
405 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
並不是我們在管制的油 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
405 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
407 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
所以我不曉得這個油 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
407 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
408 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
後來它的去向在 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
408 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
410 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
我們後來確定它是在 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
410 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
411 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
原來的油槽裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
411 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
412 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
還有1000多噸 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
412 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
414 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
都在裡面沒有移動 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
414 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
416 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
這是我們後面才了解才知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
416 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
419 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
我們了解的是油是成為成品 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
419 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
421 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
油品裡面的30P的油 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
421 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
423 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
4到6月的我們很清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
423 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
426 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
所以第一上面的油是不太一樣的 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
426 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
427 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
其實這個邏輯很清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
427 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
429 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
您8月1號的時候認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
429 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
431 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
要問高雄市政府嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
431 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
433 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
表示您認為高雄市政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
433 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
436 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
應該是這個您後來不知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
436 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
438 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
去向的油的主管機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
438 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
439 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
不然您不會第一時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
439 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
442 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
食藥署的回覆給媒體是 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
442 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
444 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
請媒體去問高雄市政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
444 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
445 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
我跟委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
445 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
447 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
這個不能就這樣子說 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
447 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
448 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
因為這件事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
448 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
451 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
台糖也並沒有跟我們講 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
451 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
452 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
我們也不清楚這個油 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
452 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
453 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
到底在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
453 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
455 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
所以它也不屬於這個範圍 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
455 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
457 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
我們的管理的範圍內 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
457 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
458 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
所以跟委員們特別澄清 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
458 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
460 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
剛剛徐府主任有提到說 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
460 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
464 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
這場會議所有的中聯關係人全部在場 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
464 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
465 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
專家說真的討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
465 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
468 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
但是討論出來他說是一個建議 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
468 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
469 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
並不是決策 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
469 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
471 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
剛剛徐府主任講的非常清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
471 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
474 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
最後做出20%以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
474 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
478 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
要下架的決策是誰做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
478 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
479 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
江署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
479 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
480 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
誰做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
480 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
482 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
因為您是主持這個會議的人 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
482 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
485 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
我想專家會議裡面我們邀請來 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
485 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
489 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
根據我們知道的整個的各國的 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
489 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
491 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
其實跟我們一樣嚴格的韓國跟歐盟 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
491 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
495 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
面對油品在這一類是同樣的做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
495 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
497 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
你只要告訴我誰決策的 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
497 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
500 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
所以我們在第二層是特殊的情形下 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
500 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
502 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
是誰決策 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
502 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
504 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
這些都已經大家很熟了 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
504 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
505 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
誰決策 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
505 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
508 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
整個專家給予建議完之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
508 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
510 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
我對於會議的結論的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
510 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
511 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
我有做猜測 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
511 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
514 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
原來專家整體的會議是這樣子的結論 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
514 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
516 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
所以結論是 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
516 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
519 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
參考專家學者意見是您決策的 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
519 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
522 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
專家學者做出的這個會議的結論是這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
522 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
524 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
所以進一步這個會議結論是 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
524 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
525 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
達到這樣子的共識 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
525 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
527 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
好 了解 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
527 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
529 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
那就請徐主任先回座 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
529 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
530 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
徐主任回座 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
531 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
532 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
市務長 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
532 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
534 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
上禮拜我在這邊說 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
534 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
536 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
我想要會計錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
536 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
539 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
也想要中聯在裡面練習的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
539 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
540 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
跟你們報告了什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
540 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
543 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
中聯可以知道這些學者名單 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
543 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
545 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
可是你這個報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
545 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
547 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
我7月30所資 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
547 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
550 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
當場你跟我說會後馬上會給我 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
550 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
551 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
我7月30跟您要 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
551 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
554 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
中聯到底在你們的20%會議裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
554 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
556 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
呈現了哪些資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
556 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
558 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
因為它也有可能影響到 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
558 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
560 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
你後續專家學者的建議 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
560 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
561 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
不是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
561 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
562 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
人民也想知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
562 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
564 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
我們國會議員也想知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
564 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
565 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
你為什麼到現在還不能給我 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
565 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
567 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
你什麼時候要給我 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
567 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
570 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
各位說明我那天就已經提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
570 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
573 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
這個全部的資料都送給檢調 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
573 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
575 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
因為這包含了 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
575 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
578 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
當時候發生這個會議的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
578 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
581 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
並沒有檢調還沒有把 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
581 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
585 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
這個相關的人等列為他的嫌疑人 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
585 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
587 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
所以當時候是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
587 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
590 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
後面既然已經列入了是嫌疑人 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
590 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
592 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
當然我們就把這所有的資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
592 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
595 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
都移送給檢調一併查明 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
595 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
597 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
所以當時我的處理是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
597 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
599 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
你上週跟王毓民委員說 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
599 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
600 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
你送檢調 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
600 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
602 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
幾月幾號送檢調 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
602 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
604 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
非常早就送檢調 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
604 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
608 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
送檢調跟給我們看給全國人民看 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
608 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
610 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
不衝突啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
610 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
612 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
中聯在你們會議報告了什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
612 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
614 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
我們不能知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
614 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
615 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
不衝突啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
615 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
616 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
不衝突啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
616 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
619 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
我們現在在調查的是行政責任 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
619 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
623 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
檢調在調查的是刑事責任 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
623 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
625 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
跟委員說明沒有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
625 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
627 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
今天就會發布 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
627 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
631 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
今天把中聯在你們的會議上的資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
631 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
633 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
給全部的委員還有會議紀錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
633 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
635 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
給全部的委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
635 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
638 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
我看你們的吹哨子也到越來越多了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
638 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
639 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
639 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
641 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
因為我們之前都已經陸續提供 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
641 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
643 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
給一些所知的委員了 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
643 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
645 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
所以我們這一次就乾脆把它發布 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
645 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
646 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
以正視聽 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
646 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
648 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
我們也要中聯報告的那份資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
648 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
650 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
在這邊一定要講清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
650 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
652 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
因為我已經要了一個禮拜了 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
652 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
653 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
中聯報告的 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
653 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
655 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
就是在會上提供的 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
655 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
657 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
就是7月3號在台中市 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
657 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
659 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
專家學者 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
659 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
661 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
還有你們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
661 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
662 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
就給我們嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
662 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
664 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
你壓了一個禮拜幹嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
664 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
666 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
他那一天就已經都有檔案了 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
666 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
667 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
就是在7月3號 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
667 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
669 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
在台中市所提供的那一份資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
669 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
671 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
這邊因為台中 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
671 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
673 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
他裁罰了中聯跟福茂 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
673 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
675 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
各罰300萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
675 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
677 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
因為沒有通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
677 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
679 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
超標7倍的這些致癌油 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
679 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
681 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
那你認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
681 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
685 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
台中市政府用食安法第七條第五項 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
685 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
688 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
去做這兩家廠商的裁罰嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
688 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
690 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
中聯福茂 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
690 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
694 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
福茂拿的是產品 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
694 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
698 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
中聯出來的那個已經是實用油脂了 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
698 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
700 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
它不是脫膠原油 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
700 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
703 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
它交給福茂的是實用油脂 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
703 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
705 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
實用油脂是產品 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
705 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
709 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
所以是符合我們的食安法第七條 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
709 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
710 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
應該通報的對象 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
710 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
713 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
所以處分福茂是這個道理 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
713 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
714 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
中聯也是一樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
714 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
718 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
它的成品被南僑驗出超標 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
718 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
721 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
而且通報給福壽 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
721 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
722 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
福壽在告辭中聯 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
722 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
724 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
我在講的是8月3號晚上 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
724 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
725 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
哪一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
725 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
727 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
8月3號晚上 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
727 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
730 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
我在講的是8月3號晚上 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
730 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
732 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
一案歸一案 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
732 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
735 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
這個是台中的新案 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
735 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
739 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
這是台中市政府的處分 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
739 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
741 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
這個是他們的處分 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
741 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
743 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
那看他們自己的理由是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
743 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
746 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
他要查清楚之後才去開罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
746 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
749 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
你剛剛不是把中聯講的很糟糕嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
749 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
751 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
你現在不認同他們的裁罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
751 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
752 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
中聯很糟糕 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
752 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
753 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
福茂也很糟糕 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
753 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
755 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
你不認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
755 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
757 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
我沒有說我不認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
757 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
758 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
我需要去理解 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
758 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
762 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
台中市政府的開罰是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
762 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
764 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
他是針對哪一家去開罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
764 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
765 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
我寫在旁邊給你了 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
765 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
766 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
5月未通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
766 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
769 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
台糖採購原料異常 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
769 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
772 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
台中市府再各罰300萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
772 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
774 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
採購原料異常 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
774 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
776 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
那他是指他採購黃豆異常 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
776 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
778 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
還是採購什麼異常 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
778 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
780 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
中聯是採購的原料 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
780 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
783 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
中聯的原料是黃豆 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
785 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
788 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
那他是罰他黃豆的採購異常 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
788 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
792 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
他們是在罰他台糖5月的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
792 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
794 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
往回報 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
794 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
796 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
你所謂的這批 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
796 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
799 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
你現在口中不肯承認是原料的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
799 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
802 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
回報福茂還有中聯 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
802 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
805 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
但是他們兩個沒有通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
805 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
808 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
我剛剛在報告裡面講的很清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
808 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
811 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
如果就這個食用油脂的製造 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
811 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
813 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
黃豆是原料 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
813 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
814 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
脫膠原油脂 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
814 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
815 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
你只要告訴我 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
815 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
818 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
我就問你 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
818 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
820 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
因為你是主管機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
820 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
823 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
最中央最高的主管機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
823 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
827 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
現在中聯福茂知道台糖拿到了一批 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
827 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
830 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
現在你口中不承認是原料的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
830 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
833 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
沒有告訴中央主管機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
833 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
836 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
沒有告訴地方政府被罰了 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
836 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
838 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
你認不認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
840 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
841 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
你認不認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
841 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
843 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
所有的主管機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
843 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
845 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
不論是中央跟地方 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
845 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
847 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
都要依法行政 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
847 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
851 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
所有的處分都要具名的 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
851 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
853 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
他的法源依據 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
853 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
856 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
跟裁罰的原因跟理由 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
856 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
857 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
你講的很清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
857 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
858 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
你認不認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
858 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
861 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
還是你要說你不認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
861 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
864 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
我會聘請台中市政府來跟我報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
864 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
867 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
委員關心你們的裁罰依據 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
867 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
869 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
請來這個衛福部報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
869 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
871 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
裁罰依據已經寫在上面給你看了 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
871 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
873 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
沒有我們需要看到裁處書 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
873 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
876 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
裁處書才是裁罰依據 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
877 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
879 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
所以你現在還沒有辦法 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
879 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
882 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
下判斷你認同會不認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
882 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
885 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
這個對委員的詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
885 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
887 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
我非常的重視 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
887 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
889 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
所以我必須把所有的事情搞清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
889 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
891 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
我會請台中市政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
891 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
892 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
因為委員的關心 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
892 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
894 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
我請他來跟我報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
894 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
895 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
下一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
895 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
896 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
我們請台糖 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
896 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
898 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
今天是總經理來嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
898 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
899 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
今天是 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
899 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
900 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
副總 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
904 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
906 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
剛剛食物長不想回答的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
906 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
908 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
其實蠻簡單的 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
908 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
910 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
如果他有通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
910 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
913 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
我們後面這些過去幾個月 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
913 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
916 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
過去一個月吃下的 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
916 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
919 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
接近三萬噸的毒油 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
919 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
921 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
也許不會出現 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
921 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
923 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
這麼簡單的道理 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
924 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
926 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
926 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
928 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
你的梗圖都在做葉片 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
928 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
929 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
你拿油上來幹嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
929 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
931 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
你就拿葉片上來就好 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
931 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
934 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
這邊問你一個簡單的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
936 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
939 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
葉片跟致癌油可以類比嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
939 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
941 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
葉片是用眼睛看的 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
941 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
945 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
致癌油是你們用外面的檢驗機器 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
945 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
948 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
公正的驗出來的單位 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
948 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
950 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
14PPB |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
950 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
952 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
你們到底在寫什麼東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
952 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
956 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
葉片是用眼睛看的 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
956 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
959 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
致癌油是致癌油 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
959 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
961 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
再來 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
961 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
962 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
餐廳 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
962 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
964 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
經濟部也上來 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
969 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
971 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
次長好 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
973 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
975 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
經濟部 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
975 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
977 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
還有我們台糖的長官 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
977 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
979 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
你們想要告訴人民什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
979 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
982 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
葉片跟致癌油一樣嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
982 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
985 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
你們想說的是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
985 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
989 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
台糖依規依法 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
989 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
991 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
來進行辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
991 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
993 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
那我們可以看到這位黃豆的初一 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
993 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
994 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].start |
994 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].end |
995 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].text |
我再問葉片 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].start |
995 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].end |
996 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].text |
我們沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].start |
996 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].end |
997 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].start |
997 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].end |
998 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].text |
他沒有回答我的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].start |
998 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].end |
1000 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].text |
而且我也不想看到油在桌上 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].start |
1000 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].end |
1002 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].text |
可以把油拿下去了 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].start |
1002 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].end |
1005 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].text |
油等你等一下自己專題報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].start |
1005 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].end |
1007 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].text |
再拿上來就好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].start |
1008 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].end |
1010 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].text |
我只是在問你們兩個 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].start |
1010 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].end |
1013 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].text |
經濟部跟台糖的社會溝通 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].start |
1013 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].end |
1015 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].text |
到底做到哪裡去了 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].start |
1015 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].end |
1016 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].text |
葉片 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].start |
1016 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].end |
1018 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].text |
眼睛看的 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].start |
1018 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].end |
1021 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].text |
P本篇筆 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].start |
1021 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].end |
1023 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].text |
機器驗出來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].start |
1023 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].end |
1025 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].text |
超標7倍就是超標7倍 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].start |
1025 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].end |
1028 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].text |
葉片跟油的關係在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].start |
1028 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].end |
1029 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].text |
你現在第一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].start |
1029 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].end |
1031 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].text |
你告訴我你的社會溝通是什麼意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].start |
1031 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].end |
1032 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].text |
看不懂 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].start |
1032 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].end |
1033 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].text |
第二個 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].start |
1033 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].end |
1035 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].text |
我這個餐廳 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].start |
1035 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].end |
1037 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].text |
我會知道是哪一攤 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].start |
1037 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].end |
1041 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].text |
你現在就明確知道是哪一家的油 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].start |
1041 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].end |
1043 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].text |
出來是14ppb |
| transcript.whisperx[451].start |
1043 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].end |
1045 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].text |
這兩個可以類比嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].start |
1045 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].end |
1046 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].text |
你講 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].start |
1046 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].end |
1048 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].text |
好次長可以回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].start |
1048 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].end |
1049 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].text |
跟委員說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].start |
1049 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].end |
1051 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].text |
剛剛部長已經說了 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].start |
1051 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].end |
1052 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].text |
台糖的這個作為 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].start |
1052 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].end |
1054 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].text |
依照食安法的規定來辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].start |
1054 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].end |
1056 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].text |
那台糖對於原料的採購 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].start |
1056 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].end |
1059 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].text |
也依照它採購的一個契約 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].start |
1059 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].end |
1060 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].text |
飲收的標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].start |
1060 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].end |
1062 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].text |
來進行處理相關的處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].start |
1062 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].end |
1063 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].text |
這是第一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].start |
1063 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].end |
1065 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].text |
那第二點的一個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].start |
1065 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].end |
1068 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].text |
經濟部始終非常重視 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].start |
1068 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].end |
1070 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].text |
我們不管是我們的消費者 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].start |
1070 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].end |
1072 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].text |
或是我們的通路廠商 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].start |
1072 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].end |
1074 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].text |
還有各項的一個權益 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].start |
1074 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].end |
1076 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].text |
所以台糖公司在這個角色上面 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].start |
1076 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].end |
1079 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].text |
它必須要依法依規來辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].start |
1080 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].end |
1081 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].text |
沒有聽到葉片 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].start |
1081 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].end |
1083 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].text |
葉片跟油一樣嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].start |
1083 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].end |
1085 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].text |
葉片跟油一樣嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].start |
1085 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].end |
1086 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].text |
不是 台糖在法規裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].start |
1086 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].end |
1088 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].text |
它辦理了一個角色 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].start |
1088 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].end |
1091 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].text |
它畢竟它是一個採 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].start |
1091 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].end |
1094 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].text |
透過契約然後去採購這個原料 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].start |
1094 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].end |
1098 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].text |
而且台中地方法院的學員稿 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].start |
1098 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].end |
1099 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].text |
也有提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].start |
1099 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].end |
1100 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].text |
來來來 台糖 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].start |
1100 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].end |
1102 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].text |
台糖的官網 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].start |
1102 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].end |
1104 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].text |
大家現在可以馬上上網看 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].start |
1104 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].end |
1106 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].text |
台糖的使命為何 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].start |
1106 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].end |
1108 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].text |
台糖公司在台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].start |
1108 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].end |
1110 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].text |
是一家老字號的國營企業 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].start |
1110 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].end |
1112 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].text |
最家喻戶曉的品牌 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].start |
1112 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].end |
1115 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].text |
所以他們肩負了配合國家政策 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].start |
1115 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].end |
1117 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].text |
照顧民生需求 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].start |
1117 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].end |
1118 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].text |
基本企業責任 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].start |
1118 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].end |
1120 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].text |
還要跟社會產生連結 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].start |
1120 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].end |
1123 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].text |
我現在都不知道你們連結到哪裡去了 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].start |
1123 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].end |
1125 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].text |
好 配合國家政策 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].start |
1125 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].end |
1129 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].text |
不就包括每年跟我們要這麼多預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].start |
1129 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].end |
1130 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].text |
過去十年 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].start |
1130 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].end |
1134 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].text |
700多億的食安五環 食品雲 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].start |
1134 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].end |
1137 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].text |
還有邊境學房 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].start |
1137 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].end |
1140 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].text |
每一種毒的東西連邊境都進不來 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].start |
1140 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].end |
1142 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].text |
食藥署這個要幫我們把關 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].start |
1142 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].end |
1145 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].text |
從原料到餐桌 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].start |
1145 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].end |
1147 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].text |
每一樣東西都很安心 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].start |
1147 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].end |
1152 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].text |
而台糖也是配合國家政策的一份子 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].start |
1152 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].end |
1154 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].text |
你自己看看你們的使命 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].start |
1154 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].end |
1158 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].text |
跟你現在做出來的事情吻合嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].start |
1158 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].end |
1159 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].text |
不用回答了 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].start |
1159 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].end |
1164 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].text |
下一張我們請食部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].start |
1164 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].end |
1165 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].text |
食部長如果你要說 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].start |
1165 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].end |
1167 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].text |
這個只算蘇丹紅的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].start |
1167 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].end |
1168 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].text |
你就簡單說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].start |
1168 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].end |
1170 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].text |
你們自己113年 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].start |
1170 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].end |
1173 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].text |
因為蘇丹紅這種工業的原料 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].start |
1173 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].end |
1175 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].text |
混進了食品中 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].start |
1175 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].end |
1176 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].text |
混進了化妝品 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].start |
1176 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].end |
1178 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].text |
你們跟業者做了好多的說明會 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].start |
1178 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].end |
1179 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].text |
告訴他們說 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].start |
1179 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].end |
1182 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].text |
食品業者發現原料或是產品 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].start |
1182 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].end |
1184 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].text |
有危害衛生之餘 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].start |
1184 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].end |
1187 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].text |
就要主動的通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].start |
1187 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].end |
1189 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].text |
那個指的是非法添加 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].start |
1189 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].end |
1190 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].text |
這個不一樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].start |
1190 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].end |
1193 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].text |
這個不是中間的產品 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].start |
1193 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].end |
1195 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].text |
這個是違法添加 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].start |
1195 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].end |
1200 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].text |
部長你知道你現在在大開一個邪惡之門 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].start |
1200 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].end |
1202 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].text |
你剛舉了好多歪理 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].start |
1202 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].end |
1205 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].text |
你今天在這邊講的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].start |
1205 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].end |
1206 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].text |
從現在開始 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].start |
1206 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].end |
1208 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].text |
從這一分鐘開始 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].start |
1208 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].end |
1211 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].text |
迪麵粉的還沒進工廠 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].start |
1211 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].end |
1212 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].text |
還沒進門口 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].start |
1212 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].end |
1214 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].text |
結果迪麵粉的被抓到 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].start |
1214 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].end |
1217 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].text |
他說我等一下要做醬糊 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].start |
1217 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].end |
1219 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].text |
這不是給人吃的 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].start |
1219 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].end |
1221 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].text |
迪糖被抓到 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].start |
1221 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].end |
1223 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].text |
他就說我這個等一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].start |
1223 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].end |
1224 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].text |
是要做工業酒精的 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].start |
1224 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].end |
1226 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].text |
你們可以做工業酒精嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].start |
1226 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].end |
1228 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].text |
糖也可以做工業酒精 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].start |
1228 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].end |
1232 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].text |
你這個大開邪惡之門 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].start |
1232 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].end |
1234 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].text |
他只要說他這個東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].start |
1234 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].end |
1237 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].text |
後面有可能不是人吃的 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].start |
1237 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].end |
1240 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].text |
後面有可能不是人吃的 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].start |
1240 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].end |
1241 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].text |
就脫罪了 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].start |
1241 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].end |
1243 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].text |
你引用的法條不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].start |
1243 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].end |
1246 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].text |
如果他是違法添加進去的 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].start |
1246 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].end |
1250 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].text |
是違反了食安法第15條第一項的規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].start |
1250 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].end |
1253 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].text |
是會到第6萬到2億的罰款 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].start |
1253 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].end |
1255 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].text |
那是不一樣的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].start |
1255 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].end |
1257 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].text |
我講的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].start |
1257 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].end |
1260 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].text |
也可能是本篇筆超標的麵粉 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].start |
1260 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].end |
1263 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].text |
也可能是本篇筆超標的糖 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].start |
1263 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].end |
1265 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].text |
不是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].start |
1265 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].end |
1267 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].text |
他就不適用了 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].start |
1267 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].end |
1269 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].text |
他們也可以做成很多 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].start |
1269 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].end |
1271 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].text |
不是人在吃的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].start |
1271 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].end |
1273 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].text |
糖沒有本篇筆 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].start |
1273 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].end |
1275 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].text |
不管如何 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].start |
1275 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].end |
1279 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].text |
他們還是會有你們超標的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].start |
1279 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].end |
1281 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].text |
在裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].start |
1281 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].end |
1283 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].text |
不是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].start |
1283 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].end |
1286 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].text |
我們沒有在訂原料的標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].start |
1286 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].end |
1288 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].text |
我們要看你訂的是哪一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].start |
1288 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].end |
1290 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].text |
我們剛剛提到的 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].start |
1290 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].end |
1293 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].text |
本篇筆是訂在實用油脂的標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].start |
1293 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].end |
1295 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].text |
你就跟我講清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].start |
1295 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].end |
1297 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].text |
你這個東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].start |
1297 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].end |
1301 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].text |
你這個東西113年你發佈的新聞稿 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].start |
1301 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].end |
1303 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].text |
你就告訴大家好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].start |
1303 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].end |
1305 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].text |
你現在就告訴全國國人 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].start |
1305 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].end |
1307 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].text |
你就只針對蘇丹紅 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].start |
1307 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].end |
1309 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].text |
不是蘇丹紅 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].start |
1309 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].end |
1311 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].text |
不能夠添加的 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].start |
1311 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].end |
1313 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].text |
蘇丹紅是舉例 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].start |
1313 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].end |
1315 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].text |
因為他是不得添加 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].start |
1315 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].end |
1317 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].text |
你自己的簡報 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].start |
1317 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].end |
1319 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].text |
你自己的簡報寫得很清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].start |
1319 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].end |
1323 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].text |
危害衛生安全之虞 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].start |
1323 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].end |
1326 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].text |
你是違法添加 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].start |
1326 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].end |
1328 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].text |
就已經違法添加 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].start |
1328 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].end |
1332 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].text |
違法添加就違反了第15條的規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].start |
1332 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].end |
1335 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].text |
你上面幫人家做教育訓練是 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].start |
1335 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].end |
1337 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].text |
危害衛生安全之虞 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].start |
1337 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].end |
1340 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].text |
現在又要硬撈成違法添加 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].start |
1340 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].end |
1343 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].text |
你這個是斷章取義 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].start |
1343 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].end |
1345 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].text |
我跟你講我沒有斷章取義 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].start |
1345 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].end |
1348 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].text |
我們看監察院的調查報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].start |
1348 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].end |
1350 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].text |
你會覺得濃濃的即視感 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].start |
1350 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].end |
1353 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].text |
113年監察院的調查報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].start |
1353 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].end |
1354 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].text |
就寫得很清楚了 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].start |
1354 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].end |
1356 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].text |
那個時候發生蘇丹紅事件 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].start |
1356 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].end |
1358 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].text |
他們說食品業者訂定的 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].start |
1358 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].end |
1360 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].text |
食品安全監測計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].start |
1360 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].end |
1363 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].text |
未有承報主管機關之規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].start |
1363 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].end |
1365 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].text |
故針對原料半成品成品檢驗項目 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].start |
1365 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].end |
1367 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].text |
任由業者自行評估 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].start |
1367 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].end |
1370 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].text |
具本案未將蘇丹紅納為風險檢驗項目 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].start |
1370 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].end |
1373 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].text |
難以真實反應潛藏食安風險 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].start |
1373 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].end |
1375 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].text |
主管機關無從事先察覺 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].start |
1375 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].end |
1380 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].text |
又本案存在居多以虛偽樣本盛檢 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].start |
1380 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].end |
1382 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].text |
檢驗結果不合格 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].start |
1382 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].end |
1384 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].text |
遭下游公司拓貨後 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].start |
1384 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].end |
1387 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].text |
仍持續出貨給不知情的公司 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].start |
1387 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].end |
1389 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].text |
甚至變造檢驗報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].start |
1389 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].end |
1393 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].text |
以取信下游廠商盛檢不合格後 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].start |
1393 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].end |
1396 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].text |
業者為主動通報主管機關等違規 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].start |
1396 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].end |
1398 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].text |
113年監察院告訴你的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].start |
1398 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].end |
1401 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].text |
現在就活生生的 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].start |
1401 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].end |
1403 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].text |
又出現在我們面前了 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].start |
1404 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].end |
1408 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].text |
你看監察院的右邊寫什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].start |
1408 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].end |
1410 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].text |
依法不得添加的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].start |
1410 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].end |
1412 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].text |
你聽我說清楚了 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].start |
1412 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].end |
1414 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].text |
不得添加的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].start |
1414 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].end |
1417 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].text |
不論在原料或者是產品 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].start |
1417 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].end |
1419 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].text |
都是不得添加 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].start |
1419 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].end |
1421 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].text |
如果是安全衛生標準的 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].start |
1421 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].end |
1425 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].text |
他就會訂出他的適用產品 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].start |
1425 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].end |
1429 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].text |
是什麼產品的什麼物質的標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].start |
1429 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].end |
1430 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].text |
這是兩回事 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].start |
1430 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].end |
1432 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].text |
不能回一談 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].start |
1432 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].end |
1436 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].text |
部長請你看監察院調查報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].start |
1436 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].end |
1440 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].text |
他最後是用食安法第七條第五項 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].start |
1440 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].end |
1441 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].text |
所以他說 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].start |
1441 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].end |
1444 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].text |
業者知產品原材料 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].start |
1444 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].end |
1447 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].text |
半成品成品盛驗後檢驗結果不合格 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].start |
1447 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].end |
1450 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].text |
需因食安法第七條第五項規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].start |
1450 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].end |
1451 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].text |
主動停止製造 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].start |
1451 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].end |
1454 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].text |
並通報地方主管機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].start |
1454 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].end |
1455 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].text |
現在我們要相信監察院 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].start |
1455 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].end |
1457 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].text |
還是相信你的法條解釋 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].start |
1459 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].end |
1463 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].text |
監察院在這邊寫了第七條第五項 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].start |
1463 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].end |
1465 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].text |
不得添加的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].start |
1465 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].end |
1468 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].text |
不論是在原料還是在產品 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].start |
1468 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].end |
1470 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].text |
都是不得添加 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].start |
1470 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].end |
1472 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].text |
但是如果是安全衛生標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].start |
1472 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].end |
1474 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].text |
按照第十條訂出的 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].start |
1474 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].end |
1477 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].text |
就要看他的適用品項 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].start |
1477 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].end |
1479 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].text |
跟他的標準是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].start |
1479 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].end |
1482 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].text |
這是兩回事不能混為一談 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].start |
1482 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].end |
1483 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].text |
下一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].start |
1483 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].end |
1486 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].text |
我們請台探回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].start |
1486 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].end |
1488 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].text |
如果你們平常有一些問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].start |
1488 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].end |
1490 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].text |
你們是通報給誰 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].start |
1490 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].end |
1493 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].text |
如果你們的SOP實用有出問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].start |
1493 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].end |
1494 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].text |
你們通報哪一個單位 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].start |
1494 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].end |
1496 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].text |
是 我們一定會通報我們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].start |
1496 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].end |
1499 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].text |
那個實用有的主管機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].start |
1499 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].end |
1502 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].text |
誰啊誰 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].start |
1502 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].end |
1503 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].text |
高雄市政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].start |
1503 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].end |
1504 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].text |
高雄市政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].start |
1504 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].end |
1506 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].text |
OK 因為他們現在兩邊 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].start |
1506 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].end |
1507 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].text |
一直在踢皮球 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].start |
1507 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].end |
1509 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].text |
高雄市政府說要 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].start |
1509 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].end |
1510 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].text |
收集很多資料給台南 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].start |
1510 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].end |
1513 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].text |
台南又說沒有是歸高雄管 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].start |
1513 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].end |
1515 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].text |
好 我們現在聽到你說 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].start |
1515 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].end |
1517 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].text |
是高雄市政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].start |
1517 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].end |
1518 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].text |
好 那我們知道了 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].start |
1518 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].end |
1520 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].text |
不過剛剛我有念出 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].start |
1520 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].end |
1522 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].text |
你們的中指嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].start |
1522 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].end |
1523 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].text |
成立中指 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].start |
1523 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].end |
1525 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].text |
最終人民還是希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].start |
1525 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].end |
1526 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].text |
國營企業 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].start |
1526 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].end |
1528 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].text |
負起國營企業該有的責任 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].start |
1528 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].end |
1531 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].text |
你們只要當時有通報把關 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].start |
1531 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].end |
1534 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].text |
後面這幾萬噸吃下去的毒油 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].start |
1534 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].end |
1536 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].text |
就不會在我們國人的肚子裡了 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].start |
1536 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].end |
1538 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].text |
請回座 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].start |
1538 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].end |
1539 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].text |
是 跟委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].start |
1539 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].end |
1542 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].text |
就台南公司的認知 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].start |
1542 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].end |
1546 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].text |
出油就是脫膠的這個出油 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].start |
1546 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].end |
1548 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].text |
它是不能吃的 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].start |
1548 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].end |
1549 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].text |
它不是可以吃的 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].start |
1549 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].end |
1551 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].text |
所以它不是食品 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].start |
1551 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].end |
1552 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].text |
它不是食品 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].start |
1552 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].end |
1554 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].text |
所以我們的認知是它 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].start |
1554 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].end |
1557 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].text |
我跟你說你只要通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].start |
1557 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].end |
1560 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].text |
他們當時告訴去查中聯 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].start |
1560 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].end |
1563 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].text |
他們會查出更多更多更多 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].start |
1563 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].end |
1566 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].text |
最後會讓人家吃下去的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].start |
1566 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].end |
1568 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].text |
我們可以請四位先回座 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].start |
1568 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].end |
1570 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].text |
我們留著時務長 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].start |
1570 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].end |
1573 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].text |
四位都有 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].start |
1573 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].end |
1574 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].text |
上禮拜你就說 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].start |
1574 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].end |
1575 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].text |
你也不是食安專家 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].start |
1575 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].end |
1577 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].text |
我也不是食安專家 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].start |
1577 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].end |
1578 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].text |
所以我們都不應該 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].start |
1578 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].end |
1580 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].text |
表達自己的意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].start |
1580 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].end |
1581 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].text |
今天我們有食安專家了 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].start |
1581 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].end |
1582 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].text |
江志剛 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].start |
1582 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].end |
1585 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].text |
然後這邊還有法律專家 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].start |
1585 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].end |
1587 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].text |
高檢署主任陳宏達 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].start |
1587 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].end |
1588 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].text |
這邊還有一位公衛專家 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].start |
1588 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].end |
1589 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].text |
詹長權 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].start |
1589 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].end |
1590 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].text |
他們的發言 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].start |
1590 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].end |
1593 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].text |
我不知道你要不要採納 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].start |
1593 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].end |
1595 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].text |
一個說通報是法定義務 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].start |
1595 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].end |
1598 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].text |
並非行政機關給人民的恩惠 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].start |
1598 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].end |
1600 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].text |
另外一位公衛教授說 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].start |
1600 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].end |
1602 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].text |
另外一位公衛教授說 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].start |
1602 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].end |
1604 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].text |
這不只是食安的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].start |
1604 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].end |
1606 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].text |
更是公共治理 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].start |
1606 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].end |
1609 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].text |
跟政府誠信的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].start |
1609 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].end |
1611 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].text |
還是你覺得你還是最懂 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].start |
1611 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].end |
1614 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].text |
公衛跟解釋法條的人 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].start |
1614 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].end |
1616 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].text |
通報是法定義務 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].start |
1616 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].end |
1619 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].text |
在食安法明定的通報義務 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].start |
1619 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].end |
1620 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].text |
很清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].start |
1620 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].end |
1622 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].text |
這一句話絕對是對的 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].start |
1622 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].end |
1623 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].text |
你覺得你懂法律 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].start |
1623 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].end |
1625 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].text |
比高檢署主任還懂 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].start |
1625 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].end |
1627 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].text |
那詹長權呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].start |
1627 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].end |
1629 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].text |
詹長權我不知道他說的是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].start |
1629 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].end |
1631 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].text |
不知道他說的是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].start |
1631 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].end |
1632 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].text |
可是他做的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].start |
1632 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].end |
1634 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].text |
我已經寫在上面了 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].start |
1634 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].end |
1638 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].text |
本篇筆的標準是定在產品 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].start |
1638 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].end |
1640 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].text |
也就是食用油脂 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].start |
1640 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].end |
1642 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].text |
本篇筆的標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].start |
1642 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].end |
1644 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].text |
不是定在脫膠原油 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].start |
1644 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].end |
1646 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].text |
我還是要再強調 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].start |
1646 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].end |
1649 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].text |
脫膠原油後面會經過脫酸 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].start |
1649 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].end |
1651 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].text |
脫色 脫臭 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].start |
1651 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].end |
1653 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].text |
那麼它最高可以降低 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].start |
1653 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].end |
1654 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].text |
百分之百 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].start |
1654 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].end |
1655 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].text |
其實大家都聽懂了 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].start |
1655 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].end |
1657 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].text |
以後我們都知道了 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].start |
1657 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].end |
1660 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].text |
本篇筆是定在食用油脂 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].start |
1660 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].end |
1661 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].text |
其實我就下一個結論 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].start |
1661 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].end |
1664 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].text |
這七百多億食安五環 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].start |
1664 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].end |
1666 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].text |
環環不斷練 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].start |
1666 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].end |
1667 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].text |
從源頭開始管理 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].start |
1667 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].end |
1668 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].text |
自主通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].start |
1668 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].end |
1670 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].text |
還有這些預警機制 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].start |
1670 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].end |
1672 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].text |
去掉了脫膠原油 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].start |
1672 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].end |
1674 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].text |
就是這個結論 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].start |
1675 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].end |
1676 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].text |
食用油脂廠 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].start |
1676 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].end |
1678 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].text |
它必須要去 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].start |
1678 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].end |
1679 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].text |
結束了 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].start |
1679 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].end |
1681 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].text |
它必須去改善它的製程 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].start |
1683 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].end |
1686 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].text |
好 謝謝陳金火委員的質詢 |
| transcript.gazette[0].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[0].start |
2026-08-05T10:34:07+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[0].end |
2026-08-05T10:34:16.812500+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].text |
謝謝主席，謝謝各位官員的列席還有委員的出席。 |
| transcript.gazette[0].quality |
0.95 |
| transcript.gazette[1].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[1].start |
2026-08-05T10:34:17+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[1].end |
2026-08-05T10:34:21.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].text |
我想請石部長、姜署長還有許主任。 |
| transcript.gazette[1].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[2].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[2].start |
2026-08-05T10:34:22+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[2].end |
2026-08-05T10:34:24.400000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].text |
請石部長、姜署長還有許主任。 |
| transcript.gazette[2].quality |
0.5 |
| transcript.gazette[3].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[3].start |
2026-08-05T10:34:26.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[3].end |
2026-08-05T10:34:28.250000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].text |
委員好。 |
| transcript.gazette[3].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[4].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[4].start |
2026-08-05T10:34:29+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[4].end |
2026-08-05T10:34:42.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].text |
好，當然你們捲入這個風波，我也感到非常遺憾，不過有議員已經告發你們瀆職，包括石部長、姜署長，昨天則是再加上台糖董事長。 |
| transcript.gazette[4].quality |
0.788 |
| transcript.gazette[5].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[5].start |
2026-08-05T10:34:43.250000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[5].end |
2026-08-05T10:35:00.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].text |
議員昨天已經保全了證據，比如說會議的影音檔或者是監視器，今天則是這些基層人員的名字被披露在報紙上，應該也會一一被叫去詢問關於這個會議的內容。 |
| transcript.gazette[5].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[6].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[6].start |
2026-08-05T10:35:01.230769+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[6].end |
2026-08-05T10:35:16.733333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].text |
再來，應該也會傳喚被羈押的總經理還有廠長，所以今天這個議員也在看這段質詢，今天的答詢非常重要，一定要誠實的面對國人、要誠實的報告。 |
| transcript.gazette[6].quality |
0.932 |
| transcript.gazette[7].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[7].start |
2026-08-05T10:35:17.250000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[7].end |
2026-08-05T10:35:18.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].text |
我們先請姜署長。 |
| transcript.gazette[7].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[8].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[8].start |
2026-08-05T10:35:22+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[8].end |
2026-08-05T10:35:22.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].text |
委員好。 |
| transcript.gazette[8].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[9].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[9].start |
2026-08-05T10:35:23.100000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[9].end |
2026-08-05T10:35:41.571429+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].text |
姜署長，因為您上週不在，所以石部長幫您回復了非常多的問題，可是從我們今天所揭露的資訊、報紙上所看到的資訊，我們發現您才是這場會議的主持人，這場會議決定了20％以上下架，20％以下可以保留。 |
| transcript.gazette[9].quality |
0.915 |
| transcript.gazette[10].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[10].start |
2026-08-05T10:35:42.250000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[10].end |
2026-08-05T10:35:49.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].text |
另外，石部長也在上週幫您回答說，業者是有在這場會議中討論復工。 |
| transcript.gazette[10].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[11].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[11].start |
2026-08-05T10:35:50.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[11].end |
2026-08-05T10:36:04.769231+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].text |
我想問一下，因為石部長上禮拜是回復這個會議分上、下場次，可是我們今天所有人印象中都停留在會議分上、下場次，從哪邊可以看得出來分上、下場次？ |
| transcript.gazette[11].quality |
0.887 |
| transcript.gazette[12].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[12].start |
2026-08-05T10:36:05+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[12].end |
2026-08-05T10:36:18.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].text |
報告委員，這個會議分成兩個議題，第一個是檢視整個中聯這次的問題，所以我們請了專家在油品製程的部分做進一步的說明。 |
| transcript.gazette[12].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[13].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[13].start |
2026-08-05T10:36:19.250000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[13].end |
2026-08-05T10:36:55.785714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].text |
第二個部分，我們根據106年下架回收的產品裡面的下架階層，我們是訂在……因為是衛生安全標準，所以是屬於第八類，是在下架那一層，就是中聯製程福壽、福懋、泰山油品的部分，所以在7月我們確定是第一層的時候，關於第一層，我們有聽到不同的聲音，尤其7月3日媒體上一直在討論，我們很清楚的，我們對於第一層的下架是有的，所以我們再重新思考第二個議題…… |
| transcript.gazette[13].quality |
0.807 |
| transcript.gazette[14].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[14].start |
2026-08-05T10:36:56.263158+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[14].end |
2026-08-05T10:37:04.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].text |
姜署長，我們只需要問出這個會議到底有沒有分上、下兩場，因為石部長上週幫你回答會議分上、下兩場。 |
| transcript.gazette[14].quality |
0.833 |
| transcript.gazette[15].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[15].start |
2026-08-05T10:37:05+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[15].end |
2026-08-05T10:37:21.875000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].text |
應該是說，我們會議裡面有兩個重要議題，上面第一個議題是中聯相關的，他本身的製程是不是有問題，我們請專家來協助；下半場我們是針對第一層下架之後是不是要往下走，所以這邊特別提到是第二個議程的部分。 |
| transcript.gazette[15].quality |
0.831 |
| transcript.gazette[16].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[16].start |
2026-08-05T10:37:21.875000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[16].end |
2026-08-05T10:37:24+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].text |
這個都知道了。 |
| transcript.gazette[16].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[17].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[17].start |
2026-08-05T10:37:24+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[17].end |
2026-08-05T10:37:24.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].text |
廠商幾點離開？ |
| transcript.gazette[17].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[18].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[18].start |
2026-08-05T10:37:25+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[18].end |
2026-08-05T10:37:29.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].text |
這個會議從3點開到5點，廠商幾點離開？ |
| transcript.gazette[18].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[19].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[19].start |
2026-08-05T10:37:30+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[19].end |
2026-08-05T10:37:32.888889+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].text |
廠商應該是有在現場，可是在我們第二層討論的過程…… |
| transcript.gazette[19].quality |
0.818 |
| transcript.gazette[20].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[20].start |
2026-08-05T10:37:33+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[20].end |
2026-08-05T10:37:34.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].text |
廠商全程都在現場？ |
| transcript.gazette[20].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[21].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[21].start |
2026-08-05T10:37:35+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[21].end |
2026-08-05T10:37:51.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].text |
沒有，廠商是在我們會議討論的過程當中，進入我們會議的議場，做完說明之後，我們繼續再討論後續的時候，沒有讓廠商做任何的發言，我們是在做第二層的一些思考，該如何去擴大的討論可能要下架的範圍…… |
| transcript.gazette[21].quality |
0.882 |
| transcript.gazette[22].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[22].start |
2026-08-05T10:37:52+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[22].end |
2026-08-05T10:38:12.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].text |
你只要告訴我們……因為剛剛石部長也講得很輕鬆，他今天就會公布全部的會議紀錄，王育敏委員要求他在今天委員會結束以前印出給所有的委員，讓所有的國人知道，所以你沒有什麼好隱瞞的，你只要告訴我們，廠商幾點到幾點在現場？ |
| transcript.gazette[22].quality |
0.906 |
| transcript.gazette[23].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[23].start |
2026-08-05T10:38:13+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[23].end |
2026-08-05T10:38:33.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].text |
我們現在很明顯看到紀錄上有5位你們的同仁，還有食藥署副署長，還有食品組的十幾位同仁，相信這些人很快就可以回憶起來廠商是幾點到幾點在現場，廠商有沒有聽到你們在討論20％上架、下架的原則？ |
| transcript.gazette[23].quality |
0.964 |
| transcript.gazette[24].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[24].start |
2026-08-05T10:38:34+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[24].end |
2026-08-05T10:38:38.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].text |
跟委員做報告，因為這整個紀錄是透明的，今天部長也承諾說…… |
| transcript.gazette[24].quality |
0.92 |
| transcript.gazette[25].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[25].start |
2026-08-05T10:38:39+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[25].end |
2026-08-05T10:38:39.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].text |
其實你現在…… |
| transcript.gazette[25].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[26].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[26].start |
2026-08-05T10:38:40+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[26].end |
2026-08-05T10:38:41.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].text |
所以我的意思是說…… |
| transcript.gazette[26].quality |
0.625 |
| transcript.gazette[27].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[27].start |
2026-08-05T10:38:41.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[27].end |
2026-08-05T10:38:42.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].text |
沒有啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[27].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[28].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[28].start |
2026-08-05T10:38:42+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[28].end |
2026-08-05T10:38:50.888889+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].text |
我等一下詢答結束前，你告訴我就可以了，因為上禮拜石部長也是在我詢答結束前…… |
| transcript.gazette[28].quality |
0.706 |
| transcript.gazette[29].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[29].start |
2026-08-05T10:38:52+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[29].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:00.166667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].text |
整個會議的過程中，我們結束的時候，他其實是有在現場的，只是他沒有進入任何有關於我們第二階層的討論。好啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[29].quality |
0.872 |
| transcript.gazette[30].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[30].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:00.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[30].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:05.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].text |
很明顯了，所以廠商跟著你們到會議結束，許輔主任也是這樣看到的嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[30].quality |
0.862 |
| transcript.gazette[31].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[31].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:08+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[31].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:14.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].text |
廠商從頭到尾都跟你們在一起，你們在決策的時候，他們也都聽到了，只是他們不能發言，許輔主任，是這樣嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[31].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[32].speaker |
許主任輔 |
| transcript.gazette[32].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:16+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[32].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:16.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].text |
廠商都在。 |
| transcript.gazette[32].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[33].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[33].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:17+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[33].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:17.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].text |
全程都在？ |
| transcript.gazette[33].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[34].speaker |
許主任輔 |
| transcript.gazette[34].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:18+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[34].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:26.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].text |
他進來之後，全都在，他沒有辦……但是我們那個會議是建議，並不是決策。 |
| transcript.gazette[34].quality |
0.964 |
| transcript.gazette[35].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[35].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:28+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[35].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:40.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].text |
所以石部長，你害到你同事了，你上禮拜說中間有請廠商離開，現在旁邊兩個一個主持會議、一個參加會議的人說，廠商全程都在。 |
| transcript.gazette[35].quality |
0.904 |
| transcript.gazette[36].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[36].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:41.375000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[36].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:43.625000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].text |
我們再問姜署長…… |
| transcript.gazette[36].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[37].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[37].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:44.285714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[37].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:45.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].text |
我跟委員說明…… |
| transcript.gazette[37].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[38].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[38].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:46+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[38].end |
2026-08-05T10:39:56.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].text |
我要問姜署長，姜署長，你幾月幾日知道台糖14.8 ppb這個事件，你幾月幾日知道的？ |
| transcript.gazette[38].quality |
0.794 |
| transcript.gazette[39].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[39].start |
2026-08-05T10:39:58+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[39].end |
2026-08-05T10:40:15.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].text |
我的印象應該是七月十幾號，將近十五號以後，約略那個時間，是因為我們的同仁們再次進入中聯去看他所有的油的時候，我們調查報告…… |
| transcript.gazette[39].quality |
0.839 |
| transcript.gazette[40].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[40].start |
2026-08-05T10:40:15.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[40].end |
2026-08-05T10:40:16.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].text |
發現有這個批號？ |
| transcript.gazette[40].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[41].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[41].start |
2026-08-05T10:40:16+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[41].end |
2026-08-05T10:40:23.857143+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].text |
7月初其實就已經下架了，之後我們去做調查，所以專家調查之前，我們也做了調查。 |
| transcript.gazette[41].quality |
0.939 |
| transcript.gazette[42].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[42].start |
2026-08-05T10:40:24+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[42].end |
2026-08-05T10:40:29.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].text |
所以你們七月十幾號就已經知道台糖有這一批超標7倍的油？ |
| transcript.gazette[42].quality |
0.92 |
| transcript.gazette[43].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[43].start |
2026-08-05T10:40:30+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[43].end |
2026-08-05T10:40:38.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].text |
這個不是這樣子說，這個油……像後面我認識的好像有脫膠原油，那兩個是長得不太一樣的，所以我的意思是，他的油不是在…… |
| transcript.gazette[43].quality |
0.714 |
| transcript.gazette[44].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[44].start |
2026-08-05T10:40:38.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[44].end |
2026-08-05T10:40:39.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].text |
沒關係啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[44].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[45].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[45].start |
2026-08-05T10:40:39+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[45].end |
2026-08-05T10:40:45.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].text |
我的意思是，7月中你就知道有這個油，你8月1日還要叫大家去問高雄市政府，這是什麼意思？ |
| transcript.gazette[45].quality |
0.806 |
| transcript.gazette[46].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[46].start |
2026-08-05T10:40:47+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[46].end |
2026-08-05T10:41:02.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].text |
我說的意思是，因為這個油並不是我們管制的油，所以我不曉得這個油後來的去向，我們後來確定在原來的油槽裡面還有一千多噸，都在裡面沒有移動，這是我們後面才了解、才知道的。 |
| transcript.gazette[46].quality |
0.96 |
| transcript.gazette[47].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[47].start |
2026-08-05T10:41:03+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[47].end |
2026-08-05T10:41:12.785714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].text |
我們了解的是，油成為成品，油品裡面的30批的油，4到6月的，我們很清楚，所以這和定義上面的油是不太一樣的。 |
| transcript.gazette[47].quality |
0.884 |
| transcript.gazette[48].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[48].start |
2026-08-05T10:41:13+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[48].end |
2026-08-05T10:41:30.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].text |
其實這個邏輯很清楚，您8月1日的時候認為要問高雄市政府，表示您認為高雄市政府應該是這個您後來不知道去向的油的主管機關，不然食藥署不會在第一時間回復媒體說，請媒體去問高雄市政府。 |
| transcript.gazette[48].quality |
0.914 |
| transcript.gazette[49].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[49].start |
2026-08-05T10:41:31+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[49].end |
2026-08-05T10:41:44.900000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].text |
我跟委員報告，不能夠這樣說，因為這件事情台糖並沒有跟我們講，我們也不清楚這個油到底在哪裡，且它也不屬於我們管理的範圍內，所以跟委員們特別澄清。 |
| transcript.gazette[49].quality |
0.954 |
| transcript.gazette[50].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[50].start |
2026-08-05T10:41:45+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[50].end |
2026-08-05T10:41:57.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].text |
剛剛許輔主任有提到，這場會議所有的中聯關係人全部在場，專家學者正在討論，但是說討論出來的是一個建議，並不是決策，剛剛許輔主任講得非常清楚。 |
| transcript.gazette[50].quality |
0.825 |
| transcript.gazette[51].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[51].start |
2026-08-05T10:41:58+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[51].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:03.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].text |
最後做出20％以上要下架這個決策的是誰？ |
| transcript.gazette[51].quality |
0.765 |
| transcript.gazette[52].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[52].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:05.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[52].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:06.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].text |
姜署長，誰做的？ |
| transcript.gazette[52].quality |
0.833 |
| transcript.gazette[53].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[53].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:07+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[53].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:08.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].text |
因為您是主持這個會議的人。 |
| transcript.gazette[53].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[54].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[54].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:09+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[54].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:21.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].text |
我想我們邀請來專家會議裡面的，根據我們知道的，各國的，其實跟我們一樣嚴格的韓國跟歐盟，面對只要油品在這一類，其實都是採同樣的做法…… |
| transcript.gazette[54].quality |
0.797 |
| transcript.gazette[55].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[55].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:22+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[55].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:23.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].text |
我只是問你誰決策的，你只要告訴我是誰決策的就好。 |
| transcript.gazette[55].quality |
0.455 |
| transcript.gazette[56].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[56].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:24+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[56].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:26.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].text |
都是在第一層下架，所以我們在第二層的是特殊的情形下…… |
| transcript.gazette[56].quality |
0.625 |
| transcript.gazette[57].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[57].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:27+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[57].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:28.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].text |
是誰決策的？ |
| transcript.gazette[57].quality |
0.8 |
| transcript.gazette[58].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[58].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:29+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[58].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:31.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].text |
這些大家都已經很熟了，誰決策的？ |
| transcript.gazette[58].quality |
0.786 |
| transcript.gazette[59].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[59].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:32+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[59].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:40.812500+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].text |
整個專家給予建議完之後，對於會議的結論我有做裁示，原來專家整體的會議是這樣子的結論…… |
| transcript.gazette[59].quality |
0.949 |
| transcript.gazette[60].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[60].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:40.812500+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[60].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:41.906250+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].text |
對，所以最後是你決定的？ |
| transcript.gazette[60].quality |
0.2 |
| transcript.gazette[61].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[61].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:41.906250+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[61].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:43+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].text |
所以最後決策的結論是這樣子做下來…… |
| transcript.gazette[61].quality |
0.188 |
| transcript.gazette[62].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[62].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:43+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[62].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:45.769231+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].text |
參考專家的意見，所以是您決策的？ |
| transcript.gazette[62].quality |
0.786 |
| transcript.gazette[63].speaker |
姜署長至剛 |
| transcript.gazette[63].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:46.705882+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[63].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:51.875000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].text |
對，決策所做出來這個會議的結論是這個，所以進一步這個會議結論是達到這樣的共識。 |
| transcript.gazette[63].quality |
0.861 |
| transcript.gazette[64].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[64].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:52+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[64].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:53.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].text |
好，了解，謝謝。 |
| transcript.gazette[64].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[65].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[65].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:54.444444+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[65].end |
2026-08-05T10:42:55.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].text |
請許主任先回座。 |
| transcript.gazette[65].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[66].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[66].start |
2026-08-05T10:42:58.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[66].end |
2026-08-05T10:43:27.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].text |
石部長，上禮拜我在這邊說，我想要會議紀錄，也想要中聯在裡面列席的時候跟你們報告了什麼，中聯可以知道這些學者名單，可是你這個報告我7月30日索資了，當場你跟我說會後馬上會給我，我7月30日跟您要中聯到底在你們的20％會議裡面呈現了哪些資料，因為他也有可能影響到你後續專家學者的建議，不是嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[66].quality |
0.905 |
| transcript.gazette[67].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[67].start |
2026-08-05T10:43:28+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[67].end |
2026-08-05T10:43:31.916667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].text |
人民也想知道，我們國會議員也想知道，你為什麼到現在還不能給我？ |
| transcript.gazette[67].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[68].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[68].start |
2026-08-05T10:43:32+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[68].end |
2026-08-05T10:43:33.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].text |
你什麼時候要給我？ |
| transcript.gazette[68].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[69].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[69].start |
2026-08-05T10:43:34.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[69].end |
2026-08-05T10:43:53.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].text |
跟委員說明，我那一天就已經提到，全部的資料都送給檢調，因為這包含了當時召集會議的時候，檢調還沒有把相關人等列為嫌疑人，所以當時候是這樣。 |
| transcript.gazette[69].quality |
0.903 |
| transcript.gazette[70].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[70].start |
2026-08-05T10:43:54+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[70].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:03.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].text |
後面既然已經列為嫌疑人，當然我們就把所有的資料都移送給檢調一併查明，所以當時候我的處理是這樣。 |
| transcript.gazette[70].quality |
0.955 |
| transcript.gazette[71].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[71].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:03.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[71].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:04.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].text |
幾月幾號送檢調？ |
| transcript.gazette[71].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[72].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[72].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:04+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[72].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:08.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].text |
你上週跟王育敏委員說你送檢調，幾月幾號送檢調？ |
| transcript.gazette[72].quality |
0.905 |
| transcript.gazette[73].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[73].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:09+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[73].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:10.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].text |
非常早就送檢調了，把資料就送給檢調了。 |
| transcript.gazette[73].quality |
0.412 |
| transcript.gazette[74].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[74].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:11+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[74].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:16.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].text |
送檢調跟給我們看、給全國人民看不衝突啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[74].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[75].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[75].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:17+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[75].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:20.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].text |
中聯在你們會議中報告了什麼，我們不能知道？ |
| transcript.gazette[75].quality |
0.947 |
| transcript.gazette[76].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[76].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:22+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[76].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:22.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].text |
不衝突啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[76].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[77].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[77].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:23+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[77].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:29.636364+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].text |
我們現在在調查的是行政責任，檢調在調查的是刑事責任。 |
| transcript.gazette[77].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[78].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[78].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:30+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[78].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:31.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].text |
跟委員說明，沒有問題…… |
| transcript.gazette[78].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[79].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[79].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:31.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[79].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:32.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].text |
你可以給我們嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[79].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[80].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[80].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:32+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[80].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:33.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].text |
我們今天就會發布。 |
| transcript.gazette[80].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[81].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[81].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:34+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[81].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:45.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].text |
今天把中聯在你們會議上的資料及會議紀錄給全部的委員，我看你們的吹哨者也報越來越多了嘛！可以。 |
| transcript.gazette[81].quality |
0.907 |
| transcript.gazette[82].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[82].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:45.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[82].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:46.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].text |
好，那就這樣子。 |
| transcript.gazette[82].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[83].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[83].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:46+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[83].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[83].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:52.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[83].text |
因為我們之前都已經陸續提供給一些索資的委員了，所以我們這次就乾脆把它發布，以正視聽。 |
| transcript.gazette[83].quality |
0.949 |
| transcript.gazette[84].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[84].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:53+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[84].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[84].end |
2026-08-05T10:44:58.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[84].text |
我們也要中聯報告的那份資料，在這邊一定要講清楚，因為我已經要了一個禮拜了。 |
| transcript.gazette[84].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[85].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[85].start |
2026-08-05T10:44:59+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[85].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[85].end |
2026-08-05T10:45:03.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[85].text |
中聯報告的就是在會上提供的，就是7月3號在臺中市的那一份。 |
| transcript.gazette[85].quality |
0.84 |
| transcript.gazette[86].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[86].start |
2026-08-05T10:45:04+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[86].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[86].end |
2026-08-05T10:45:08.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[86].text |
對，會上提供給專家學者，還有你們的……你就給我們嘛！ |
| transcript.gazette[86].quality |
0.667 |
| transcript.gazette[87].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[87].start |
2026-08-05T10:45:09+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[87].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[87].end |
2026-08-05T10:45:10.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[87].text |
你壓了一個禮拜，幹嘛？ |
| transcript.gazette[87].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[88].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[88].start |
2026-08-05T10:45:11.166667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[88].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[88].end |
2026-08-05T10:45:12.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[88].text |
那一天就已經都有檔案了。 |
| transcript.gazette[88].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[89].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[89].start |
2026-08-05T10:45:13+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[89].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[89].end |
2026-08-05T10:45:15.846154+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[89].text |
就是7月3號在臺中市所提供的那一份資料。 |
| transcript.gazette[89].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[90].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[90].start |
2026-08-05T10:45:17.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[90].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[90].end |
2026-08-05T10:45:25.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[90].text |
臺中裁罰了中聯跟福懋各300萬，是因為沒有通報超標七倍的這些致癌油。 |
| transcript.gazette[90].quality |
0.897 |
| transcript.gazette[91].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[91].start |
2026-08-05T10:45:27+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[91].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[91].end |
2026-08-05T10:45:34.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[91].text |
您認同臺中市政府用食安法第七條第五項裁罰這兩家廠商嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[91].quality |
0.885 |
| transcript.gazette[92].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[92].start |
2026-08-05T10:45:36+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[92].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[92].end |
2026-08-05T10:45:59.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[92].text |
福懋拿的是產品，中聯出來的已經是食用油脂了，不是脫膠原油，它交給福懋的是食用油脂，食用油脂是產品，符合食安法第七條應該通報的對象，所以處分福懋是這個道理。 |
| transcript.gazette[92].quality |
0.914 |
| transcript.gazette[93].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[93].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:00+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[93].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[93].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:08.857143+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[93].text |
中聯也是一樣，它的成品被南僑驗出超標，而且通報給福壽，福壽再告知中聯…… |
| transcript.gazette[93].quality |
0.935 |
| transcript.gazette[94].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[94].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:09+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[94].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[94].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:10.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[94].text |
我在講的是8月3號晚上。 |
| transcript.gazette[94].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[95].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[95].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:11+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[95].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[95].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:11.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[95].text |
哪一個？ |
| transcript.gazette[95].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[96].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[96].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:12+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[96].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[96].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:18.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[96].text |
8月3號晚上，我在講的是8月3號晚上，一案歸一案！ |
| transcript.gazette[96].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[97].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[97].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:19+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[97].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[97].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:21.625000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[97].text |
這個是台糖的新案。 |
| transcript.gazette[97].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[98].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[98].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:22+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[98].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[98].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:25.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[98].text |
這是臺中市政府的處分。 |
| transcript.gazette[98].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[99].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[99].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:26+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[99].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[99].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:32.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[99].text |
這是他們的處分，看他們自己的理由是什麼，他們要查清楚之後才去開罰。 |
| transcript.gazette[99].quality |
0.967 |
| transcript.gazette[100].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[100].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:33+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[100].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[100].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:35.785714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[100].text |
你剛剛不是把中聯講得很糟糕嗎？對。 |
| transcript.gazette[100].quality |
0.867 |
| transcript.gazette[101].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[101].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:36+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[101].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[101].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:37.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[101].text |
你現在不認同他們的裁罰？ |
| transcript.gazette[101].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[102].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[102].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:38+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[102].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[102].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:39.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[102].text |
中聯很糟糕，福懋也很糟糕。 |
| transcript.gazette[102].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[103].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[103].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:40+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[103].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[103].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:41.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[103].text |
你不認同？ |
| transcript.gazette[103].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[104].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[104].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:42+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[104].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[104].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:44.833333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[104].text |
我沒有說我不認同，我需要去理解…… |
| transcript.gazette[104].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[105].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[105].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:45+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[105].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[105].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:46.454545+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[105].text |
臺中市政府裁罰他們各罰300萬。 |
| transcript.gazette[105].quality |
0.417 |
| transcript.gazette[106].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[106].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:46.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[106].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[106].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:50.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[106].text |
我需要去理解臺中市政府的開罰是什麼，是針對哪一項開罰。 |
| transcript.gazette[106].quality |
0.52 |
| transcript.gazette[107].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[107].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:51+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[107].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[107].end |
2026-08-05T10:46:58.625000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[107].text |
我寫在旁邊給你了，5月未通報台糖採購原料異常，臺中市府再各罰300萬。 |
| transcript.gazette[107].quality |
0.964 |
| transcript.gazette[108].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[108].start |
2026-08-05T10:46:59+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[108].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[108].end |
2026-08-05T10:47:04.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[108].text |
採購原料異常是指採購黃豆異常，還是採購什麼異常？ |
| transcript.gazette[108].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[109].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[109].start |
2026-08-05T10:47:05+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[109].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[109].end |
2026-08-05T10:47:14.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[109].text |
中聯是採購的原料，中聯的原料是黃豆，是罰它黃豆的採購異常，還是罰什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[109].quality |
0.806 |
| transcript.gazette[110].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[110].start |
2026-08-05T10:47:15+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[110].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[110].end |
2026-08-05T10:47:31.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[110].text |
不是，他們是在罰它，台糖5月往回報的這一批，即你現在口中不肯承認是原料的東西，回報福懋還有中聯，但是它們兩個沒有通報。 |
| transcript.gazette[110].quality |
0.846 |
| transcript.gazette[111].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[111].start |
2026-08-05T10:47:32+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[111].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[111].end |
2026-08-05T10:47:40.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[111].text |
我剛剛在報告裡面講得很清楚，如果就食用油脂的製造，黃豆是原料，脫膠原油是中間產品、半成品。 |
| transcript.gazette[111].quality |
0.775 |
| transcript.gazette[112].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[112].start |
2026-08-05T10:47:42+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[112].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[112].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:07.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[112].text |
我就問你，因為你是主管機關，是中央最高的主管機關，中聯、福懋知道台糖拿到了一批現在你口中不承認是原料的東西，沒有告訴中央主管機關，也沒有告訴地方政府，所以被罰了，你認不認同？ |
| transcript.gazette[112].quality |
0.923 |
| transcript.gazette[113].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[113].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:08+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[113].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[113].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:22.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[113].text |
所有的主管機關無論是中央跟地方，都要依法行政，所有的處分都要具明法源依據跟裁罰的原因、理由，就是這樣。 |
| transcript.gazette[113].quality |
0.87 |
| transcript.gazette[114].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[114].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:23+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[114].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[114].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:27.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[114].text |
OK，你講得很清楚，你認不認同，還是你要說你不認同？ |
| transcript.gazette[114].quality |
0.864 |
| transcript.gazette[115].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[115].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:27.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[115].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[115].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:28.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[115].text |
你是在講…… |
| transcript.gazette[115].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[116].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[116].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:28+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[116].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[116].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:35.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[116].text |
如果你一定要問我這個問題，我會請臺中市政府跟我報告，說委員關心他們的裁罰依據，請來衛福部報告。 |
| transcript.gazette[116].quality |
0.674 |
| transcript.gazette[117].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[117].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:36+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[117].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[117].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:38.181818+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[117].text |
裁罰依據已經寫在上面給你看了。沒有！ |
| transcript.gazette[117].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[118].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[118].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:38.363636+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[118].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[118].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:39.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[118].text |
我們需要看到裁處書。 |
| transcript.gazette[118].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[119].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[119].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:39.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[119].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[119].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:40.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[119].text |
我剛剛講得那麼清楚。 |
| transcript.gazette[119].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[120].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[120].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:40+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[120].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[120].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:42.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[120].text |
裁處書才是裁罰依據。 |
| transcript.gazette[120].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[121].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[121].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:44+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[121].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[121].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:48.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[121].text |
所以你現在還沒有辦法下判斷，回答你認同或不認同？ |
| transcript.gazette[121].quality |
0.864 |
| transcript.gazette[122].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[122].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:49.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[122].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[122].end |
2026-08-05T10:48:55.857143+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[122].text |
對委員的詢問，我非常重視，所以我必須把所有的事情搞清楚。 |
| transcript.gazette[122].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[123].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[123].start |
2026-08-05T10:48:56+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[123].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[123].end |
2026-08-05T10:49:00.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[123].text |
因為委員關心，我會請臺中市政府來跟我報告。 |
| transcript.gazette[123].quality |
0.684 |
| transcript.gazette[124].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[124].start |
2026-08-05T10:49:01+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[124].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[124].end |
2026-08-05T10:49:06.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[124].text |
下一個請台糖副總。 |
| transcript.gazette[124].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[125].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[125].start |
2026-08-05T10:49:11+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[125].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[125].end |
2026-08-05T10:49:29.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[125].text |
剛剛石部長不想回答問題，其實蠻簡單的，如果它有通報，過去一個月吃下接近3萬噸的毒油也許不會出現，這麼簡單的道理…… |
| transcript.gazette[125].quality |
0.94 |
| transcript.gazette[126].speaker |
蔡副總經理東霖 |
| transcript.gazette[126].start |
2026-08-05T10:49:29.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[126].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[126].end |
2026-08-05T10:49:33+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[126].text |
委員好。 |
| transcript.gazette[126].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[127].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[127].start |
2026-08-05T10:49:33+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[127].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[127].end |
2026-08-05T10:49:35.857143+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[127].text |
你的梗圖都在做葉片了，你拿油上來幹嘛？ |
| transcript.gazette[127].quality |
0.941 |
| transcript.gazette[128].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[128].start |
2026-08-05T10:49:36+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[128].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[128].end |
2026-08-05T10:49:37.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[128].text |
你拿葉片上來就好啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[128].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[129].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[129].start |
2026-08-05T10:49:38+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[129].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[129].end |
2026-08-05T10:49:45.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[129].text |
這邊問你一個簡單的問題，葉片跟致癌油可以類比嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[129].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[130].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[130].start |
2026-08-05T10:49:46+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[130].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[130].end |
2026-08-05T10:49:58.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[130].text |
葉片是用眼睛看的，致癌油是你們用外面檢驗單位的機器公正驗出14 ppb，你們到底在寫什麼東西？ |
| transcript.gazette[130].quality |
0.854 |
| transcript.gazette[131].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[131].start |
2026-08-05T10:49:59+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[131].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[131].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:05.142857+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[131].text |
葉片是用眼睛看的，致癌物是致癌物。 |
| transcript.gazette[131].quality |
0.867 |
| transcript.gazette[132].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[132].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:06+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[132].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[132].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:10.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[132].text |
再來是餐廳，經濟部也上來。 |
| transcript.gazette[132].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[133].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[133].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:16+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[133].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[133].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:17.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[133].text |
次長好。 |
| transcript.gazette[133].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[134].speaker |
賴次長建信 |
| transcript.gazette[134].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:17.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[134].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[134].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:20+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[134].text |
委員好。 |
| transcript.gazette[134].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[135].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[135].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:20+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[135].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[135].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:25.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[135].text |
經濟部還有台糖的長官，你們想要告訴人民什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[135].quality |
0.95 |
| transcript.gazette[136].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[136].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:26+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[136].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[136].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:28.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[136].text |
葉片跟致癌油一樣嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[136].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[137].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[137].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:29+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[137].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[137].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:31.625000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[137].text |
你們想說的是什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[137].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[138].speaker |
賴次長建信 |
| transcript.gazette[138].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:32.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[138].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[138].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:39.571429+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[138].text |
台糖依規依法來辦理，我們可以看到黃豆的粗油……大豆沙拉油…… |
| transcript.gazette[138].quality |
0.68 |
| transcript.gazette[139].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[139].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:40+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[139].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[139].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:48.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[139].text |
沒有，我沒有在問葉片，我們沒有要……主席，他沒有回答我的問題，而且我也不想要看到油放在桌上，可以把油拿下去了。 |
| transcript.gazette[139].quality |
0.872 |
| transcript.gazette[140].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[140].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:49+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[140].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[140].end |
2026-08-05T10:50:53.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[140].text |
油等你等一下自己專題報告，再拿上來就好了。 |
| transcript.gazette[140].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[141].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[141].start |
2026-08-05T10:50:55+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[141].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[141].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:01.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[141].text |
我只是在問你們兩個，經濟部跟台糖的社會溝通到底做到哪裡去了？ |
| transcript.gazette[141].quality |
0.964 |
| transcript.gazette[142].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[142].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:02+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[142].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[142].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:14.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[142].text |
葉片，眼睛看的；苯駢芘，機器驗出來的，超標七倍就是超標七倍，葉片跟油的關係在哪裡？ |
| transcript.gazette[142].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[143].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[143].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:15.166667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[143].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[143].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:17.866667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[143].text |
現在第一個，你告訴我，你的社會溝通是什麼意思？ |
| transcript.gazette[143].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[144].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[144].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:18+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[144].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[144].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:18.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[144].text |
看不懂！ |
| transcript.gazette[144].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[145].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[145].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:19+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[145].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[145].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:23.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[145].text |
第二個，我會知道是那一家餐廳、哪一攤嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[145].quality |
0.647 |
| transcript.gazette[146].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[146].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:24+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[146].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[146].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:31.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[146].text |
你現在就明確知道哪一家的油出來是14 ppb，這兩個可以類比嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[146].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[147].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[147].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:32+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[147].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[147].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:32.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[147].text |
你講啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[147].quality |
0.667 |
| transcript.gazette[148].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[148].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:33.285714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[148].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[148].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:34.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[148].text |
次長，可以回答了。 |
| transcript.gazette[148].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[149].speaker |
賴次長建信 |
| transcript.gazette[149].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:36+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[149].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[149].end |
2026-08-05T10:51:49.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[149].text |
剛剛部長已經說了，台糖的作為是依照食安法的規定來辦理，台糖對原料的採購也依照採購契約允收的標準進行相關處理，這是第一點。 |
| transcript.gazette[149].quality |
0.929 |
| transcript.gazette[150].speaker |
賴次長建信 |
| transcript.gazette[150].start |
2026-08-05T10:51:50.222222+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[150].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[150].end |
2026-08-05T10:52:05.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[150].text |
第二點，經濟部始終非常重視不管是消費者或通路廠商的各項權益，所以台糖公司在這個角色上面，必須要依法依規來辦理。 |
| transcript.gazette[150].quality |
0.961 |
| transcript.gazette[151].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[151].start |
2026-08-05T10:52:07+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[151].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[151].end |
2026-08-05T10:52:09.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[151].text |
沒有聽到葉片，葉片跟油一樣嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[151].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[152].speaker |
賴次長建信 |
| transcript.gazette[152].start |
2026-08-05T10:52:12+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[152].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[152].end |
2026-08-05T10:52:27.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[152].text |
不是，台糖在法規裡面扮演了一個角色，畢竟它是透過契約去採購原料，而且臺中地方法院的新聞稿也有提到，應該通報的責任是中聯…… |
| transcript.gazette[152].quality |
0.745 |
| transcript.gazette[153].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[153].start |
2026-08-05T10:52:29+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[153].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[153].end |
2026-08-05T10:52:32.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[153].text |
大家現在可以馬上上台糖的官網，看台糖的使命為何？ |
| transcript.gazette[153].quality |
0.773 |
| transcript.gazette[154].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[154].start |
2026-08-05T10:52:33.285714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[154].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[154].end |
2026-08-05T10:52:49.812500+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[154].text |
台糖公司在臺灣是一家老字號的國營企業，最家喻戶曉的品牌，所以他們肩負了配合國家政策、照顧民生需求、基本企業責任，還要跟社會產生連結，我現在都不知道你們連結到哪裡去了？ |
| transcript.gazette[154].quality |
0.987 |
| transcript.gazette[155].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[155].start |
2026-08-05T10:52:50.285714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[155].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[155].end |
2026-08-05T10:53:18.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[155].text |
配合國家政策不就包括每年跟我們要這麼多預算，過去十年七百多億的食安五環、食品雲，還有邊境協防，每一種有毒的東西連邊境都進不來，食藥署要幫我們把關，從原料到餐桌，每一樣東西都很安心，而台糖也是配合國家政策的一分子。 |
| transcript.gazette[155].quality |
0.928 |
| transcript.gazette[156].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[156].start |
2026-08-05T10:53:19+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[156].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[156].end |
2026-08-05T10:53:24.692308+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[156].text |
你自己看看你們的使命跟現在做出來的事情吻合嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[156].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[157].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[157].start |
2026-08-05T10:53:25+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[157].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[157].end |
2026-08-05T10:53:25.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[157].text |
不用回答了。 |
| transcript.gazette[157].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[158].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[158].start |
2026-08-05T10:53:28.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[158].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[158].end |
2026-08-05T10:53:53.571429+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[158].text |
再請石部長，如果你要說這個只算蘇丹紅的話，你就簡短說明，你們自己113年因為蘇丹紅這種工業顏料混進了食品、化妝品，你們做了好多的說明會告訴業者，發現原料或是產品有危害衛生之虞就要主動通報。 |
| transcript.gazette[158].quality |
0.94 |
| transcript.gazette[159].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[159].start |
2026-08-05T10:53:53.571429+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[159].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[159].end |
2026-08-05T10:53:54.571429+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[159].text |
你們是…… |
| transcript.gazette[159].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[160].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[160].start |
2026-08-05T10:53:54+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[160].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[160].end |
2026-08-05T10:53:56.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[160].text |
那個指的是非法添加，這個不一樣。 |
| transcript.gazette[160].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[161].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[161].start |
2026-08-05T10:53:57.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[161].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[161].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:01.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[161].text |
蘇丹紅不是中間的產品，是違法添加。 |
| transcript.gazette[161].quality |
0.8 |
| transcript.gazette[162].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[162].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:02+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[162].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[162].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:06.705882+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[162].text |
部長，你知道你現在在大開一個邪惡之門嗎？不是。 |
| transcript.gazette[162].quality |
0.85 |
| transcript.gazette[163].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[163].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:07+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[163].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[163].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:08.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[163].text |
你剛剛舉了好多歪理。 |
| transcript.gazette[163].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[164].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[164].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:08.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[164].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[164].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:09.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[164].text |
不一樣。 |
| transcript.gazette[164].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[165].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[165].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:09+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[165].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[165].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:30.875000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[165].text |
你今天在這邊講的話，從現在開始、從這一分鐘開始，毒麵粉還沒進工廠、還沒進門被抓到，他就說他等一下要做糨糊，這不是給人吃的；毒糖被抓到，他就說這個等一下是要做工業酒精的，對吧？ |
| transcript.gazette[165].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[166].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[166].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:31.400000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[166].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[166].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:32.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[166].text |
可以做工業酒精，對不對？ |
| transcript.gazette[166].quality |
0.7 |
| transcript.gazette[167].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[167].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:33+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[167].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[167].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:34.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[167].text |
糖也可以做工業酒精？ |
| transcript.gazette[167].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[168].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[168].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:35.444444+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[168].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[168].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:38.555556+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[168].text |
這個是大開邪惡之門！沒有。 |
| transcript.gazette[168].quality |
0.727 |
| transcript.gazette[169].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[169].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:39+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[169].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[169].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:43.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[169].text |
他只要說這個東西後面有可能是人吃的…… |
| transcript.gazette[169].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[170].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[170].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:43.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[170].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[170].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:44.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[170].text |
我必須跟委員說明，你引用的法條不對！ |
| transcript.gazette[170].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[171].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[171].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:44+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[171].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[171].end |
2026-08-05T10:54:47.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[171].text |
後面有可能不是人吃的，就脫罪了。 |
| transcript.gazette[171].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[172].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[172].start |
2026-08-05T10:54:48+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[172].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[172].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:01.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[172].text |
你引用的法條不對，如果是違法添加進去的，是違反了食安法第十五條第一項規定，會處六萬到兩億的罰鍰，那是不一樣的東西。 |
| transcript.gazette[172].quality |
0.885 |
| transcript.gazette[173].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[173].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:02+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[173].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[173].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:11.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[173].text |
我講的東西可能是苯駢芘超標的麵粉，也可能是苯駢芘超標的糖，不是嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[173].quality |
0.8 |
| transcript.gazette[174].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[174].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:12.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[174].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[174].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:13.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[174].text |
它就不適用了？糖…… |
| transcript.gazette[174].quality |
0.714 |
| transcript.gazette[175].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[175].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:14.222222+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[175].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[175].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:17.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[175].text |
它們也可以做成很多不是人在吃的東西。 |
| transcript.gazette[175].quality |
0.941 |
| transcript.gazette[176].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[176].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:18+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[176].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[176].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:18.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[176].text |
糖沒有苯駢芘啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[176].quality |
0.429 |
| transcript.gazette[177].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[177].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:18.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[177].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[177].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:20+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[177].text |
麵粉也沒有苯駢芘啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[177].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[178].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[178].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:20+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[178].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[178].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:29.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[178].text |
不管如何，它們還是會有超標的東西在裡面，不是嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[178].quality |
0.952 |
| transcript.gazette[179].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[179].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:30+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[179].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[179].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:36.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[179].text |
我們沒有在訂原料的標準，我們要看訂的是哪一個，我們剛剛提到的…… |
| transcript.gazette[179].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[180].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[180].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:36.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[180].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[180].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:37.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[180].text |
等一下，部長…… |
| transcript.gazette[180].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[181].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[181].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:37.692308+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[181].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[181].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:39.769231+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[181].text |
苯駢芘是訂在食用油脂的標準。 |
| transcript.gazette[181].quality |
0.692 |
| transcript.gazette[182].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[182].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:40+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[182].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[182].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:43.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[182].text |
部長，你就跟我講清楚，這個東西…… |
| transcript.gazette[182].quality |
0.846 |
| transcript.gazette[183].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[183].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:43.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[183].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[183].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:45.538462+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[183].text |
非法添加，不能添加的就是不能添加。 |
| transcript.gazette[183].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[184].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[184].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:45.538462+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[184].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[184].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:53.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[184].text |
113年你發布的新聞稿，你就告訴大家好了，你現在就告訴全國國人，你就只針對蘇丹紅！ |
| transcript.gazette[184].quality |
0.971 |
| transcript.gazette[185].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[185].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:54+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[185].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[185].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:55.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[185].text |
不是蘇丹紅。 |
| transcript.gazette[185].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[186].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[186].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:55.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[186].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[186].end |
2026-08-05T10:55:56.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[186].text |
不是蘇丹紅？ |
| transcript.gazette[186].quality |
0.2 |
| transcript.gazette[187].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[187].start |
2026-08-05T10:55:56.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[187].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[187].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:01.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[187].text |
不能夠添加的……蘇丹紅是舉例，因為它是不得添加，不得添加。 |
| transcript.gazette[187].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[188].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[188].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:04+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[188].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[188].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:05.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[188].text |
你自己的簡報寫得很清楚啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[188].quality |
0.917 |
| transcript.gazette[189].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[189].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:06+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[189].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[189].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:09.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[189].text |
危害衛生安全之虞！ |
| transcript.gazette[189].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[190].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[190].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:10.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[190].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[190].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:13.857143+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[190].text |
是違法添加就已經違反了…… |
| transcript.gazette[190].quality |
0.818 |
| transcript.gazette[191].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[191].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:13.857143+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[191].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[191].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:15+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[191].text |
你的違法添加有寫在上面嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[191].quality |
0.25 |
| transcript.gazette[192].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[192].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:15+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[192].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[192].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:18.692308+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[192].text |
違法添加就違反了第十五條的規定。 |
| transcript.gazette[192].quality |
0.867 |
| transcript.gazette[193].speaker |
陳委員菁徽：你上面幫人家做教育訓練是 |
| transcript.gazette[193].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:22+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[193].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[193].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:23.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[193].text |
危害衛生安全之虞！ |
| transcript.gazette[193].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[194].speaker |
陳委員菁徽：你上面幫人家做教育訓練是 |
| transcript.gazette[194].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:24+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[194].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[194].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:26.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[194].text |
現在又要硬拗成違法添加？ |
| transcript.gazette[194].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[195].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[195].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:27+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[195].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[195].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:29.625000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[195].text |
你這個是斷章取義，它上面寫得很清楚啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[195].quality |
0.471 |
| transcript.gazette[196].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[196].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:30+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[196].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[196].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:31.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[196].text |
我跟你講，我沒有斷章取義！ |
| transcript.gazette[196].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[197].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[197].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:31.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[197].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[197].end |
2026-08-05T10:56:32.818182+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[197].text |
這是斷章取義啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[197].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[198].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[198].start |
2026-08-05T10:56:32+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[198].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[198].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:01.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[198].text |
我們看監察院的調查報告，你會覺得有濃濃的既視感，113年監察院的調查報告都寫得很清楚，那個時候發生蘇丹紅事件，他們說：惟食品業者訂定之食品安全監測計畫，未有陳報主管機關之規定，故針對原料、半成品及成品之檢驗項目，任由業者自行評估擇定，致本案案關業者未將蘇丹色素納為辣椒（粉）之風險檢驗項目，難以真實反映潛藏食安風險，主管機關無從事先覺察。 |
| transcript.gazette[198].quality |
0.848 |
| transcript.gazette[199].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[199].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:02+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[199].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[199].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:22.785714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[199].text |
又，本案存在諸多以虛偽樣本送檢、檢驗結果不合格，遭下游公司退貨後仍持續出貨予其他不知情公司，甚至變造檢驗報告以取信下游廠商，送檢不合格後業者未主動通報主管機關等違規情形。 |
| transcript.gazette[199].quality |
0.873 |
| transcript.gazette[200].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[200].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:23+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[200].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[200].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:29.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[200].text |
113年監察院告訴你的事情，現在就活生生的又出現在我們的面前了！ |
| transcript.gazette[200].quality |
0.963 |
| transcript.gazette[201].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[201].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:29.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[201].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[201].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:30.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[201].text |
你看監察院…… |
| transcript.gazette[201].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[202].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[202].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:30.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[202].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[202].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:31.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[202].text |
不得添加的…… |
| transcript.gazette[202].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[203].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[203].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:31+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[203].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[203].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:34.636364+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[203].text |
你看監察院的右邊寫什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[203].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[204].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[204].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:35+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[204].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[204].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:36.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[204].text |
依法不得添加的東西…… |
| transcript.gazette[204].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[205].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[205].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:36.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[205].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[205].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:37.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[205].text |
監察院的右邊寫…… |
| transcript.gazette[205].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[206].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[206].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:37+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[206].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[206].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:38.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[206].text |
委員，請你聽我說清楚了…… |
| transcript.gazette[206].quality |
0.7 |
| transcript.gazette[207].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[207].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:38.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[207].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[207].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:39.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[207].text |
這個整篇在寫蘇丹紅！ |
| transcript.gazette[207].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[208].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[208].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:39+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[208].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[208].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:58.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[208].text |
不得添加的東西，不論在原料或者是產品，都是不得添加，如果是訂安全衛生標準的，它就會訂出它的適用產品，是什麼產品的什麼物質的標準，這是兩回事，不能混為一談！ |
| transcript.gazette[208].quality |
0.928 |
| transcript.gazette[209].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[209].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:58.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[209].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[209].end |
2026-08-05T10:57:59.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[209].text |
你把它混為一談了！ |
| transcript.gazette[209].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[210].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[210].start |
2026-08-05T10:57:59+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[210].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[210].end |
2026-08-05T10:58:20.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[210].text |
部長，請你看監察院的調查報告，它最後是用食安法第七條第五項，所以它說業者之產品原材料、半成品、成品送驗後，檢驗結果為不合格，須依食安法第七條第五項規定，主動停止製造……並通報地方主管機關！ |
| transcript.gazette[210].quality |
0.904 |
| transcript.gazette[211].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[211].start |
2026-08-05T10:58:21+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[211].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[211].end |
2026-08-05T10:58:23.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[211].text |
現在我們要相信監察院，還是相信你的法條解釋？ |
| transcript.gazette[211].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[212].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[212].start |
2026-08-05T10:58:26+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[212].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[212].end |
2026-08-05T10:58:29.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[212].text |
監察院在這邊寫了，第七條第五項…… |
| transcript.gazette[212].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[213].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[213].start |
2026-08-05T10:58:30+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[213].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[213].end |
2026-08-05T10:58:36.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[213].text |
我剛剛講了，不得添加的東西，無論是在原料還是在產品，都是不得添加！ |
| transcript.gazette[213].quality |
0.793 |
| transcript.gazette[214].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[214].start |
2026-08-05T10:58:37+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[214].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[214].end |
2026-08-05T10:58:48.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[214].text |
但是如果是安全衛生標準，按照第十五條訂出的，就要看它的適用品項跟它的標準是什麼，這是兩回事，不能混為一談！ |
| transcript.gazette[214].quality |
0.938 |
| transcript.gazette[215].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[215].start |
2026-08-05T10:58:50+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[215].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[215].end |
2026-08-05T10:58:56.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[215].text |
我們請台糖回答，如果你們平常有一些問題，你們是通報給誰？ |
| transcript.gazette[215].quality |
0.92 |
| transcript.gazette[216].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[216].start |
2026-08-05T10:58:57.428571+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[216].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[216].end |
2026-08-05T10:59:00.888889+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[216].text |
根據你們的SOP，食用油出問題，你們通報哪一個單位？ |
| transcript.gazette[216].quality |
0.826 |
| transcript.gazette[217].speaker |
蔡副總經理東霖 |
| transcript.gazette[217].start |
2026-08-05T10:59:01.181818+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[217].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[217].end |
2026-08-05T10:59:06+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[217].text |
我們一定會通報食用油的主管機關。誰？ |
| transcript.gazette[217].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[218].speaker |
蔡副總經理東霖 |
| transcript.gazette[218].start |
2026-08-05T10:59:10+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[218].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[218].end |
2026-08-05T10:59:11.200000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[218].text |
高雄市政府。OK！ |
| transcript.gazette[218].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[219].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[219].start |
2026-08-05T10:59:11.400000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[219].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[219].end |
2026-08-05T10:59:19.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[219].text |
因為現在他們兩邊一直在踢皮球，高雄市政府說蒐集很多資料給臺南，臺南又說沒有，是歸高雄管！ |
| transcript.gazette[219].quality |
0.925 |
| transcript.gazette[220].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[220].start |
2026-08-05T10:59:20+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[220].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[220].end |
2026-08-05T10:59:24.857143+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[220].text |
好，我們現在聽到你說是高雄市政府，那我們知道了。 |
| transcript.gazette[220].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[221].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[221].start |
2026-08-05T10:59:25+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[221].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[221].end |
2026-08-05T10:59:42.846154+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[221].text |
不過剛剛也有念出你們成立的宗旨，最終人民還是希望國營企業負起國營企業該有的責任，你們只要當時有通報把關，後面這幾萬噸吃下去的毒油就不會在我們國人的肚子裡了！ |
| transcript.gazette[221].quality |
0.946 |
| transcript.gazette[222].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[222].start |
2026-08-05T10:59:43+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[222].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[222].end |
2026-08-05T10:59:44.333333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[222].text |
請回座。 |
| transcript.gazette[222].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[223].speaker |
蔡副總經理東霖 |
| transcript.gazette[223].start |
2026-08-05T10:59:45+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[223].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[223].end |
2026-08-05T11:00:00.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[223].text |
是，跟委員報告，就台糖公司的認知，脫膠的粗油是不能吃的，它不是可以吃的，所以它不是食品，我們的認知是它本身不是…… |
| transcript.gazette[223].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[224].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[224].start |
2026-08-05T11:00:01+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[224].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[224].end |
2026-08-05T11:00:12.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[224].text |
我跟你說，你只要通報，他們當時去查中聯，他們會查出更多、更多、更多最後會讓人家吃下去的東西。 |
| transcript.gazette[224].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[225].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[225].start |
2026-08-05T11:00:13.400000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[225].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[225].end |
2026-08-05T11:00:17.500000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[225].text |
可以請四位先回座，我們留石部長，謝謝四位。 |
| transcript.gazette[225].quality |
0.778 |
| transcript.gazette[226].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[226].start |
2026-08-05T11:00:20+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[226].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[226].end |
2026-08-05T11:00:26.714286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[226].text |
石部長，上禮拜你就說你不是食安專家，而我也不是食安專家，所以我們都不應該表達自己的意見。 |
| transcript.gazette[226].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[227].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[227].start |
2026-08-05T11:00:27+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[227].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[227].end |
2026-08-05T11:00:35.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[227].text |
今天我們有食安專家了──姜至剛；還有法律專家──高檢署主任檢察官陳宏達；還有一位公衛專家──詹長權。 |
| transcript.gazette[227].quality |
0.766 |
| transcript.gazette[228].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[228].start |
2026-08-05T11:00:36+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[228].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[228].end |
2026-08-05T11:00:39.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[228].text |
他們的發言，我不知道你要不要採納啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[228].quality |
0.938 |
| transcript.gazette[229].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[229].start |
2026-08-05T11:00:40+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[229].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[229].end |
2026-08-05T11:00:55.625000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[229].text |
一個說通報是法定義務，並非行政機關給人民的恩惠，另外一位公衛教授說，這不只是食安的問題，更是公共治理跟政府誠信的問題。 |
| transcript.gazette[229].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[230].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[230].start |
2026-08-05T11:00:56+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[230].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[230].end |
2026-08-05T11:01:00.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[230].text |
還是你覺得，你還是最懂公衛跟檢視法條的人？ |
| transcript.gazette[230].quality |
0.895 |
| transcript.gazette[231].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[231].start |
2026-08-05T11:01:01+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[231].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[231].end |
2026-08-05T11:01:08.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[231].text |
通報是法定義務，在食安法明定的通報義務很清楚，這一句話絕對是對的。 |
| transcript.gazette[231].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[232].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[232].start |
2026-08-05T11:01:09+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[232].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[232].end |
2026-08-05T11:01:13.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[232].text |
好，沒關係，你覺得你懂法律，比高檢署主任檢察官還懂，那詹長權呢？ |
| transcript.gazette[232].quality |
0.741 |
| transcript.gazette[233].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[233].start |
2026-08-05T11:01:14.461538+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[233].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[233].end |
2026-08-05T11:01:15.846154+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[233].text |
我不知道詹長權說的是什麼。 |
| transcript.gazette[233].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[234].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[234].start |
2026-08-05T11:01:16.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[234].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[234].end |
2026-08-05T11:01:20.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[234].text |
他說的東西，我已經寫在上面了。 |
| transcript.gazette[234].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[235].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[235].start |
2026-08-05T11:01:22.090909+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[235].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[235].end |
2026-08-05T11:01:39.777778+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[235].text |
苯駢芘的標準是定在產品，也就是食用油脂，苯駢芘的標準不是定在脫膠原油，我還是要再強調，脫膠原油後續會經過脫酸、脫色、脫臭，最高可以降低80％到88％的苯駢芘…… |
| transcript.gazette[235].quality |
0.791 |
| transcript.gazette[236].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[236].start |
2026-08-05T11:01:41+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[236].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[236].end |
2026-08-05T11:01:43.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[236].text |
其實大家都聽懂了，以後我們都知道了，這七百多億的…… |
| transcript.gazette[236].quality |
0.727 |
| transcript.gazette[237].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[237].start |
2026-08-05T11:01:44.900000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[237].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[237].end |
2026-08-05T11:01:46.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[237].text |
所以苯駢芘是訂在食用油脂。 |
| transcript.gazette[237].quality |
0.5 |
| transcript.gazette[238].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[238].start |
2026-08-05T11:01:47+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[238].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[238].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:00.750000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[238].text |
其實我就下一個結論，這七百多億的食安五環，環環不斷鏈、從源頭開始管理、自主通報，還有這些預警機制，去掉了脫膠原油，就是這個結論，謝謝。 |
| transcript.gazette[238].quality |
0.966 |
| transcript.gazette[239].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[239].start |
2026-08-05T11:02:02+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[239].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[239].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:02.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[239].text |
食用油脂廠…… |
| transcript.gazette[239].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[240].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[240].start |
2026-08-05T11:02:02.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[240].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[240].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:03.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[240].text |
結束了。 |
| transcript.gazette[240].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[241].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[241].start |
2026-08-05T11:02:03.400000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[241].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[241].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:04.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[241].text |
他必須要去…… |
| transcript.gazette[241].quality |
0.8 |
| transcript.gazette[242].speaker |
陳委員菁徽 |
| transcript.gazette[242].start |
2026-08-05T11:02:05+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[242].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[242].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:05.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[242].text |
結束了。 |
| transcript.gazette[242].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[243].speaker |
王委員育敏 |
| transcript.gazette[243].start |
2026-08-05T11:02:05.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[243].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[243].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:06.666667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[243].text |
結束了，我會繼續問你。 |
| transcript.gazette[243].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[244].speaker |
石部長崇良 |
| transcript.gazette[244].start |
2026-08-05T11:02:06.200000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[244].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[244].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:07.800000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[244].text |
他必須去改善他的製程啦！ |
| transcript.gazette[244].quality |
0.727 |
| transcript.gazette[245].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[245].start |
2026-08-05T11:02:10+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[245].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[245].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:12.727273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[245].text |
好，謝謝陳菁徽委員的質詢。 |
| transcript.gazette[245].quality |
0.818 |
| transcript.gazette[246].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[246].start |
2026-08-05T11:02:13.227273+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[246].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[246].end |
2026-08-05T11:02:16.370130+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[246].text |
接下來請王育敏委員質詢。 |
| transcript.gazette[246].quality |
0 |