| IVOD_ID |
170553 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170553 |
| 日期 |
2026-07-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
聯席會議-11-5-19,35,20-1 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期經濟、外交及國防、財政三委員會第1次聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
1 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[1] |
35 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[2] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[1] |
外交及國防委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[2] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期經濟、外交及國防、財政三委員會第1次聯席會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-07-16T14:57:52+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-07-16T15:08:10+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:18 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/c57864e9296d47753a279fca7d3da8801ac734a26d834dc4c96cfc61d699b925ccd822a3089844525ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
李坤城 |
| 委員發言時間 |
14:57:52 - 15:08:10 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-07-16T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期經濟、外交及國防、財政三委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：併案審查：
一、 行政院函請審議「國防自主無人載具採購特別條例草案」案。
二、 本院委員林楚茵等17人擬具「國防自主無人載具採購特別條例草案」案。
三、 本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「強化國防自主暨無人機產業發展條例草案」案。
四、 本院國民黨黨團擬具「國防自主無人載具科技發展及採購條例草案」案。(僅詢答)(以上各案如未接獲院會交付審查之議事處來文，則不予審查)） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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好 謝謝主席我剛才潛意識的想要跑到三樓三樓的這個國防委員會後來發現說這個是經濟部在阻損的所以又跑到了一樓我們請這一個我想請那個黃市長請黃市長對 我之前好像都是問他比較多好 那個我們經濟部何市長您也stand by 一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
35.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
48.424 |
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好 請教一下市長我們這一次在這個行政院版本主要是要買這三項這個濱海監偵型、濱海攻擊型無人機還有這一個小型自殺無人艇嘛主要這三項嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
49.284 |
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62.753 |
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而這三項就是說六年兩千一百億的這個預算是不是好那這三項先請問一下這三項都是國內的廠商都可以生產是都可以生產包園這個部分我們已經就 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
64.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
79.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
無人機的部分是去年9月跟11月做過兩次招商說明然後也跟國內的廠商大概有200多家參加的這些廠商了解過他們的技術備變水準然後有哪些項目是他們必須要引進的做過深入研討 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
80.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
109.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
事實上無人艇的部分是在今年3月份的時候做了第一次的招商說明那經過檢討之後在5月份的時候他們又跟國內的廠商去做過討論就是目前無人艇的部分也有很多家包含Matek跟Sonic跟這些外國的知名廠商表達有意願跟國內的廠商合作來共同生產無人艇所以主要就是要投資國內的廠商就對了是好 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
110.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
125.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
那國內廠商也有這個能力嗎?是有這個能力但是呢這個有一些比較高階的一些光電的徵收的系統啊抗干擾的系統啊AI的系統啊或是說這個遠端的這個自動的控制軟體等等之類的國內廠商有這個技術嗎?還是要跟美國合作? |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
129.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
146.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
包委員這個部分我們會分階段來走因為剛剛經濟部他們也提到就是目前我們國內包含非控跟通信的某一些晶片跟關鍵零組件是還沒有辦法完全自製的但是這個關係到初期投資的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
148.039 |
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162.807 |
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這些重要的關鍵零組件都必須要有龐大的初期投資才有辦法建立本土的自治能量那所以我們如果沒有給廠商足夠的商機跟誘因要他去做如此龐大的投資可能會有所困難 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
163.878 |
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180.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
那這些技術是國內廠商就算我們給他長訂單大量的訂單那國內廠商有辦法自己去處理那還是要跟美國來合作他們必須要跟初期階段一定要跟國外的廠商合作那所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
181.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
207.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
在去年到今年的多個美國的高階無人系統的技術團體來這邊表達他們的意願的時候這個技術的導入引進跟在地化也是雙方討論的一個主軸那所以我們要買的不是只有這個國內廠商的這些無人機無人體其實我們也是要引進美國這些技術嘛對不對美國還有歐洲美國還有歐洲這些技術進來嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
208.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
227.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
那我覺得這才是一套的啦就是說我們藉由長班大量訂單讓國內的廠商有機會來做這些無人機無人艇但是呢一些比較高階的我們可能還是要仰賴不論是你剛才講美國或是歐洲的一些技術上面的合作但是有這些合作的話那或許幾年之後我們有辦法自己來做生產那再請教一下齁這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
233.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
237.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
這行政版本我知道是要買這三項那在野黨的版本你知道是要買哪幾項嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
239.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
268.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
因為在野黨的兩個版本他主要的重點是產業發展所以他的著墨的地方並不在於要採購哪些項目而是採取什麼樣的這個步驟跟手段來促成產業那至於比如說國民黨版的這個部分他只有講說後續有關於軍用的無人系統的採購的這個部分會由國防部來執行所以並沒有明確的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
268.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
294.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
所以我看兩個黨的版本,在野黨的版本就是說不知道要明確要買哪些東西那對廠商來講你如果不知道確定是要買哪些東西的話那他們也不知道說要怎麼樣去配合去生產哪些東西啊那另外就是說因為我們這個是攸關我們的這個不對稱的作戰的戰力的需求所以有時間上面的急迫性啊那如果按照這個在野黨的版本來看的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
295.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
323.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
發展產業固然重要把台灣變成無人載具的一個重要的生產國家 這很重要但是呢 緩不濟急因為我們要的是不對稱戰力所以我看了這兩版本似乎是想要把它去軍事化去軍事化就是當然產業發展是很重要但是呢 在作戰需求這方面沒有達到我們國防部的要求 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
325.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
343.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
就我們目前看不出來他裡面有針對這段做琢磨好那我請市長因為他們是比較著重這個產業發展那產業發展我們經濟部目前有沒有在做啊當然有在做我們從112年就開始在協助產業發展這個無人機的相關的一些零組件 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
344.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
349.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
還有這個整機的部分到目前為止剛剛提到說有些這個技術缺口的部分我們還是一樣透過法人科專業界科專再來協助我們產業來補足這樣的一個缺口所以這一次的這個國防的這個無人機的這個採購其實很短期之內有一些零組件可能還是需要從外購但是我想應該很快的時間我們就可以把這樣的一個缺口把補齊 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
372.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
400.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
所以看起來這個在野黨的這個版本比較是未來經濟部或是以前已經有在做的未來也要持續在做的事情嘛那我覺得那個目標不太一樣啦就是說你當長期來做是OK啊但是我比較concern就是說目前我們的這個戰力的問題為什麼我們現在要編制2100億的特別預算就是因為我們在1.25兆的特別預算裡面所有有關無人機的預算全部都被砍掉了啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
401.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
421.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
所以我們才有提這一個 再補一個2100億的特別預算過來那結果如果還是把它變成一個產業發展的這個模式來做的話 反不及急啦就是說當中國的戰力一直在提升 我們想要用這個不對稱作戰的一個方式至少大家可以有一個對抗的力量 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
422.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
432.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那看起來如果按照在野黨的版本來看是沒有這個沒有這個方向要去做啊對 而且說真的我們現在已經有一個統籌型統籌型的這個計畫已經在這個協助這個整個產業界他們在不管是從這個技術研發上面 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
440.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
454.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
或是說我們未來在怎麼樣能夠進行一些非測的場域的部分能夠測試無人機的性能這部分其實很多面向的一起來協助整個產業的一個發展所以災黨他們所提出來的這個內容其實我們在統收型計畫裡面都已經涵蓋了 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
463.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
485.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
都已經有涵蓋了我認為他們是比較騙成是你們現在已經有在做的這些計畫那其實在野黨的這個版本是可以跟你們經濟部這邊我覺得可以再去討論但是如果是講到不對稱作戰的話我覺得還是要以我們行政院的版本為主那我再請教一下黃市長 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
488.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
502.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
這個我們對於無人載具的作戰的需求是什麼就是說我們把這一次我們這一次要採購的這些無人機也好無人這個艇也好我們把它是當成一個是戰術的消耗品呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
502.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
518.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
那還是把它當成是一個產業的發展來做一個扶持?它有兩個,我先講一個最關鍵的,那1446架濱海深圳型無人機。我們前面的所有的軍購案,如果沒有這些無人機,它的效用會非常的低。 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
519.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
533.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
因為沒有目獲就沒有辦法打中目標這是一個基本邏輯那至於攻擊型跟自殺無人艇的這個部分當然是來輔助我們既有的這個攻擊手段來讓它的效果能夠更好 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
534.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
560.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
對 那所以說這個所謂攻擊型的無人機跟這個自殺型的無人機它基本上是屬於一個戰士的消耗品那消耗品就是要大量的製造嘛 大量的生產那這個就是希望說我們廠商有這個能力萬一啦 真的要作戰的時候我們廠商有這個能力大量的生產 大量的製造然後呢 發揮這個類似這個地獄景象的這一種作戰的一個模式嘛 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
561.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
564.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
那跟在野黨他們所想要的他們又要提這個什麼產業的發展的綱領啊還要找這個產業界啊來做這個規劃怎麼樣的所以我看是兩種不一樣的一個發展這個趨勢啊就是兩個不一樣的方式兩個不一樣對啊這兩個不一樣我不曉得為什麼可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
578.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
603.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
這個把它擺在同一個籃子裡面來談這會變得有點雞頭鴨腳產業的發展經濟部這邊目前已經有在做的持續也會在做但是我更關心的就是我們不對稱作戰的能力有沒有辦法藉由這一次的這個特別的預算來做提升那如果沒有辦法藉由這一次的這個預算來提升的話那變成說我們國防的需求 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
605.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
617.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
在短時間裡面關於不對稱作戰這方面我們就整個是跟這個中國比起來我們就整個是落後了啊對 這個會受到非常大的影響好 謝謝主席 |