| IVOD_ID |
170223 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170223 |
| 日期 |
2026-07-01 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-19-19 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第19次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
19 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第19次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-07-01T11:06:50+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-07-01T11:16:57+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:07 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/10566d69eaf1b9ac8cf818c533929b04d7789928a886f01810bb06545781b11bbb7f1b8e8d3d49e25ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
呂玉玲 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:06:50 - 11:16:57 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-07-01T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第19次全體委員會議（事由：邀請經濟部部長、國家發展委員會主任委員及法務部首長就「經濟部、國家發展委員會補助案審查機制、投資案審議程序中之利益衝突迴避規範全面性檢討」進行報告，並備質詢。
【7月1日及7月2日二天一次會】） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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謝謝主席請葉主委請過來葉主委因為他腳傷所以讓他坐著我知道請坐 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
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謝謝委員好 謝謝葉主委我們今天要談的國發基金剛剛委員一直強調國發基金就是依據產業創新條例的第29條來設立的最重要我們是要期盼能夠透過我們的投資融資跟信用保證跟我們資金補助的方式多元的方式來協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
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我們國內較具潛力的這個企業的成長也配合著國家整體的這個產業的策略那尤其像我們的台積電在成立之初就是我們國發基金一路的來相挺它造就它今天成為我們世界第一個半導體的這個公司那尤其是我們現在國發會也是最大的股份 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
64.077 |
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所以在這方面的話我們有穩定的這個股利的收入那近幾年來我們看到國發基金這個我們的投資也爆發了投資失利跟監管失能的情形尤其是外界還嘲諷我們說未來的投資就看我們國發基金投資什麼我們就反指標這種方式你聽了做何感想 |
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因為我們那個其實像企業直投方案有很多其實都在獲利當中雖然委員這邊有列出一些虧損但大部分的虧損公司其實我們那個本金都已經收回來了只是說有一些股票還沒有把它賣掉或是說放在那邊股票就被凍結了 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
108.379 |
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那你看到我們國發基金裡面有直接管理的我說直接管理沒有委外的企業直接投資的方案裡面有69家投資進去21家虧損創業天使這個投資方案的話有投資268家33家都虧損這個很難讓人家接受那我們是認為說國發基金在這種情形之下的話讓我們國人沒辦法信任的那你們做這方面有沒有任何的調整方案 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
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我們會持續的在精進就是說頭前的評估頭後的管理這部分我們都會做那委員列的這一些虧損的案件的話其實投資本來就有虧有贏有虧有贏啦有賺啦但是整個平均來講的話其實我們的那個投報還算是蠻不錯的啦你滿意就是了 |
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不錯至少在資產成長的倍數上面來看的話我們大概成長大概有105倍當然裡面有蠻大部分是台積電有Question我們就要檢討因為我們每一項投資裡面我們都有委外 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
180.625 |
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來做一個評估 審慎的評估包括不管是技術跟財務跟稅務法務跟建架等等的領域我們都請專家來跟我們做一個協助評估在有這個協助評估他一定有給你建議難道他這些建議你們都不當一回事嗎我們這個部分會公開透明的揭露給大家看投資評估給你的這些建議你們會採納還是僅供參考 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
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我們會採納 假如說那個建議是很公允的話 我們會你們都會採納 本席這樣子問的話 就是請你們真的要採納可是我們看到很多方式 你們並沒有採納你們會用審議委員會的方式 進行投資的最後表決但是我們看到你們在表決的時候 所有審查的委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
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應該全部出席來做表決但是我們看到很多沒有出席喔也有代理的 也有請假的我知道你們有修改一下有的是二分之一 三分之二 或者四分之三的出席率去投資去表決 但是結果很多未出席的這樣子的公信力 這樣子的決定不是很正確的 是不是要再修正一下這個部分我是不是請那個我們指名跟那個委員好 指名你來做解釋 |
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是跟委員報告在投資我們每一個這個直接投資的方案都會經過三階段的我知道是三階段那剛剛委員講的說要不要全員出席的部分尤其是在投資評估審議會剛剛講的那個委外的專業評估那個評估書是經過淨值調查然後財務法務技術商業模式等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
287.333 |
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提出來給專業的這個委員那委員是用在一個大的這個專業的池子裡面去抽籤的因為擔心說都是澳大利亞固定委員所以這一些評估報告他們都會去參採那至於說個別委員他在做投票的時候他覺得說這個案子對我們國家政策的發展對產業的發展這個企業本身的體質每一個委員是專業的去做這個判斷那在 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
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投評會的時候一定是要 譬如說舉例來講這一個委員抽到他 但是他沒有時間來那就跳過了 就往下一序去所以要強調了為什麼你們知道重要性你們才從二分之一改三分之二最後還改到四分之三就是重視最後的決定要公平公正而且能夠做到把關對不對但是你現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
340.387 |
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367.331 |
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我們要各部會首長來的有部份首長要來的 有是抽籤專家要來的但是你看到 部會首長要請代理人有些人請假 有些人不出席 甚至你剛剛講的 有些委員沒有空為什麼會沒有空 他不來了 他反對就是你不要來好了 不要投票好了都有這些情形發生 所以就沒有辦法做到公正跟把關的最重要要素 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
368.212 |
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所以你們要了解了解之後就要改過未來我希望未來出席最後的決定表決的人員全數都要到好不好不能到的人我們請別人到絕對不能有代理跟請假 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
383.01 |
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是 我們持續來精進不然你們的從二分之一到四分之三這個意義都不大了瞭解不要有人故意有意見的就迴避了好不好這情形不要再發生不會才能夠真正的幫我們把關我們投資才會更好好不好這都是人民的納稅錢絕對不能輕忽的是 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
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那接下來我想請問的就是說我們國發基金為了擺脫一些外界的罵名對我們的不信任等等所以我們經過2024年的6月我們有提出了9項的精進投資的管理措施對我們的投資我們要有效益跟風險的管控等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
421.405 |
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445.753 |
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所以我們也成立了這個投資的整合管理的平台這目前有七項的專案基金都有各部會跨部會來做一個績效的檢討的機制都有來做另外有兩項是直接我們國發基金裡面由內部直接審查的包括企業直接投資的方案跟創業天使投資的方案剛剛都有提到了 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
447.153 |
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472.914 |
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有投資的部分也有虧損的部分但是我們看到在我們國發基金的內部裡面的這個投審機制裡面我們各部會是自行去做投資的評估再送到國發基金做備查所以國發基金你們沒有任何的角色你們是負責出錢虧錢也是你們在虧這樣子合理嗎這樣子你們的權責分工在哪裡呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
473.774 |
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498.47 |
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跟那個委員報告這個也是為什麼我們要成立一個百億基金的投資平台一樣就是說我們每一季會就他們通過的案子然後進行去審查那假如說有一些不太合規的案子的話我們在每一季的那個工作會議我們其實就會建議他就把它剔除掉所以我們會精進後面的頭前評估的這個部分我們會持續的來精進這個部分對 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
499.23 |
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522.464 |
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因為虧損是大家不願意的那投你們要出錢之前你們要審慎賠估譬如我們中小企業的這個投資方案裡面我們投資了333家我們虧損了也有53家所以我認為這個專案這個基金部分的話我們國發會你們要有角色你們也要進去審查你不能他們審查說可以你們就可以了是不是這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
523.539 |
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539.18 |
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你們有沒有負責這個責任未來的話我們那個投資協調平台的話不只會在那個投錢管理甚至連投錢評估甚至連投後管理都會做出很積極的建議甚至也會幫每一個基金去找一些案源 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
540.703 |
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561.851 |
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還有另外的就是運動產業跟大健康產業在這個運動產業這個部分的話本來我們的質詢的請問的時候你們說4月份的時候告訴我們說5月份就會完成現在已經7月份了那現在進度到哪裡了運動產業7月15會公告公告之後就會已經 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
565.403 |
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582.832 |
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對 五月已經公告五月公告兩個月就7月15號那接下來他就會送到那個管理委員會管理委員會就會通過他就會通過了那另外一個大健康產業呢大健康還在規劃進度還在推 到哪裡了但現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
584.997 |
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605.133 |
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還在衛福部啦不過部長有持續的跟我表達就是說他們其實會在今年年底之前會想辦法讓大健康產業這個也會進到那個百億基金裡面既然已經投出計畫的話不要再這些緩解的卡關子啦那對全民才有真的福利好不好好 謝謝好 謝謝委員好 謝謝李玲委員 |