| IVOD_ID |
169964 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/169964 |
| 日期 |
2026-06-11 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-22-15 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第15次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
15 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
22 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
教育及文化委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第15次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-06-11T11:14:24+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-06-11T11:30:09+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:15:45 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5a3f69ccecb4f85e92d54733cc82ed16fb40f357bf30cd037edf230e2e918ce09b6e307be05129615ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
羅智強 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:14:24 - 11:30:09 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-06-11T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第15次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查
(一) 委員柯志恩等18人擬具「高級中等教育法第二十條條文修正草案」案。
(二) 委員柯志恩等19人擬具「高級中等教育法第二十條條文修正草案」案。
(三) 委員吳沛憶等18人擬具「高級中等教育法第二十條條文修正草案」案。
(四) 委員羅廷瑋等17人擬具「高級中等教育法第二十條條文修正草案」案。
二、審查
(一) 委員王鴻薇等24人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(二) 委員許宇甄等19人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(三) 國民黨黨團擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(四) 委員翁曉玲等17人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(五) 委員羅明才等18人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(六) 委員葛如鈞等17人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(七) 委員羅廷瑋等17人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(八) 委員羅智強等17人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(九) 委員賴士葆等19人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(十) 委員林倩綺等23人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(十一) 委員葉元之等19人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(十二) 委員郭昱晴等16人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(十三) 委員伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe等21人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(十四) 委員吳沛憶等21人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(十五) 委員張雅琳等18人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(十六) 委員陳培瑜等16人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
(十七) 委員吳思瑤等16人擬具「高級中等教育法第五十八條條文修正草案」案。
三、繼續審查
(一) 委員柯志恩等16人擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案。
(二) 委員徐欣瑩等19人擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案。
(三) 委員羅廷瑋等16人擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案
四、審查
(一) 委員王鴻薇等25人擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案。
(二) 台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案。
(三) 委員葉元之等18人擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案。
(四) 委員邱鎮軍等17人擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案。
(五) 委員許宇甄等19人擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案。
(六) 委員陳菁徽等16人擬具「大學法第三十五條條文修正草案」案。
……(因系統字數上限，詳參議事日程)） |
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528.72471875 |
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529.90596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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530.54721875 |
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531.54284375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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533.33159375 |
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羅委員智強 |
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534.09096875 |
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536.47034375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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544.35096875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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545.49846875 |
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548.56971875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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549.51471875 |
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551.91096875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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朱司長俊彰 |
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553.19346875 |
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553.69971875 |
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1 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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朱司長俊彰 |
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554.13846875 |
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554.81346875 |
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1 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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朱司長俊彰 |
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554.88096875 |
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563.26784375 |
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1 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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562.33971875 |
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562.52534375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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563.97659375 |
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566.72721875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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567.25034375 |
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568.44846875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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569.22471875 |
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569.76471875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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570.42284375 |
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575.35034375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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575.73846875 |
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581.47596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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582.23534375 |
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590.72346875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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590.75721875 |
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592.02284375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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朱司長俊彰 |
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593.96346875 |
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603.85221875 |
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1 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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朱司長俊彰 |
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604.34159375 |
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609.11721875 |
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1 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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609.11721875 |
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609.84284375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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朱司長俊彰 |
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609.84284375 |
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609.97784375 |
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1 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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609.97784375 |
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610.28159375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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611.20971875 |
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612.44159375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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613.50471875 |
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615.98534375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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616.71096875 |
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618.46596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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618.85409375 |
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621.50346875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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622.51596875 |
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628.52346875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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629.40096875 |
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633.88971875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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634.88534375 |
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640.06596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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640.52159375 |
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643.15409375 |
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0.978 |
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羅委員智強 |
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644.31846875 |
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647.60909375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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648.63846875 |
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650.57909375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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651.72659375 |
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655.38846875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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656.24909375 |
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658.00409375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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658.69596875 |
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659.94471875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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660.95721875 |
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662.93159375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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664.12971875 |
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669.32721875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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669.83346875 |
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672.70221875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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673.95096875 |
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674.62596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_00 |
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朱司長俊彰 |
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675.04784375 |
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678.96284375 |
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1 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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678.96284375 |
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681.64596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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682.05096875 |
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684.07596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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684.81846875 |
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692.00721875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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693.13784375 |
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694.65659375 |
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0.978 |
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羅委員智強 |
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696.44534375 |
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702.70596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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703.39784375 |
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708.62909375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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709.23659375 |
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712.83096875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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713.33721875 |
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714.43409375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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715.17659375 |
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717.60659375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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718.16346875 |
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719.19284375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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719.80034375 |
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722.88846875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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725.03159375 |
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727.34346875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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728.10284375 |
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731.15721875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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731.88284375 |
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739.00409375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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739.61159375 |
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742.00784375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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742.42971875 |
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745.70346875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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745.88909375 |
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747.74534375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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748.31909375 |
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754.52909375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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755.03534375 |
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762.20721875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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762.84846875 |
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772.55159375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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773.00721875 |
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775.33596875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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775.70721875 |
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780.06096875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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780.71909375 |
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782.32221875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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783.79034375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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784.56659375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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785.07284375 |
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785.96721875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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787.53659375 |
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798.06659375 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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798.60659375 |
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808.44471875 |
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0.978 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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羅委員智強 |
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808.47846875 |
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813.37221875 |
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0.978 |
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有請彭署長跟朱次長謝謝次長委員好好謝謝我想先請教署長在這邊我覺得我必須幫我們的昭偉羅廷偉幫他還一個公道我先講幾件事情我想請問我們次長你知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
40.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
68.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
立法院各委員會齁其實在會期當中考察是很平常的事情吧對不對是沒錯嘛有分過出國考察國內考察都有嘛對不對那不管是哪一個政黨擔任召委考察都是有的國內的也有這個出國的也有那作為立法政策形成你第一個你先要做實地的了解包括國內的很多考察 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
68.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
93.108 |
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你也包括要做其他國家的經驗的所謂的一個探求所以就有國際的部分那我今天真的非常非常遺憾真的非常遺憾羅廷偉召委安排到日本的營養午餐的考察我們的非常感謝我們的署長也有一起參與這個考察收獲勝風待會我會一一來講收獲勝風 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
99.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
124.871 |
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但是卻在我們民進黨委員的攻擊之下變成薪水小偷第一件事我就要說請問那個我想請問次長或署長這個日本的考察有拿到教育部的經費嗎用教育部的公費來出國嗎有沒有沒有嘛對不對立法院的也沒有羅廷偉 昭偉在 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
126.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
152.539 |
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公布今天調查立委的到日本考察的這個調查表第一張發出去上面就寫所有的經費請委員治理請委員自行負擔的經費包括機票住宿甚至我相信署長您知道我們到日本去吃跟小朋友併桌吃的營養午餐 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
154.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
180.265 |
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請問我們吃的營養午餐誰出的錢也是立委自己出的錢啊羅廷偉召委還堅持要付費勒堅持要付費說抱歉這個是我們到人家學校吃的就按照他們的收費標準我們所有委員就要出錢就要付費做到這個程度民進黨開記者會說這用公費考察薪水小偷 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
181.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
208.464 |
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我想請教民進黨要不要道歉啊我先不講出國考察民進黨也有啦拿公費的都有啦民進黨不要跟我講說你沒有拿公費出國考察過你國內考察國外考察都有拿公費的也都有結果羅廷輝委員從出發第一刻跟你講這一場是自費自費去考察結果民進黨竟然可以開記者會雙標到這種程度 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
211.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
237.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
我這邊必須還給羅廷偉招為一個公道那接下來我就要講 我想請署長我必須說啦 這次去真的對署長我真的是非常的感謝也表示崇高的敬意因為整個過程我們看在眼裡你非常認真在向日本來取經日本的營養午餐是專法吧 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
239.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
268.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
他們實施了非常久嘛對二三十年以上了對不對有沒有參考的價值1954、1968所以他們是最早來做營養午餐專法的那第二個我們在實際考察過程當中我有幾樣東西我印象很深刻啦就剛剛羅廷惠委員也講到了我們有去跟日本的小學生一起吃營養午餐吃營養午餐 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
269.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
294.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
我想問一件事,有一件事我印象很深刻署長印象很深刻請問我們台灣的營養午餐通常是幾菜幾湯幾主食原則上三菜一湯,有時候有一水果邊向地區還有可能的點心點心嘛,然後牛奶要看情況嘛,對不對那我想請問你去日本他幾菜幾湯,我們這次去幾菜幾湯 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
296.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
319.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
一菜一湯然後有一個牛奶對一湯一湯一湯然後那天剛好有水果他說一年大概兩次水果嘛對不對然後剛好那一年比較少那我要特別講就是說這就是我們有在現場問為什麼他們的所謂的那個菜的種相品相這麼少他怎麼回答我們你還記得嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
321.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
345.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
這一點大概個別學校回答的比較不一樣當然他們從營養營養的均衡跟適當的食量等等那以我個人看其實他那一瓶牛奶也是佔的餐費啦是沒錯事實上我的印象很深刻是什麼他們在做所謂的那個營養午餐的滿意度的調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
347.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
368.45 |
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在州立區的調查幾乎是92、93%的學生都是滿意的我現在署長你也看到我們去那我至少我做的那一班我們是分開的那一班我有特別觀察小朋友是吃得乾乾淨淨的所有的飯跟菜全部吃光光啊那我也直接問他們好不好吃他們就當場跟我講很好吃 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
369.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
380.036 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
所以我看到我們從日本的還有剛剛有講秋刀魚的影片他們在每個飲食他們會做一些影片教小朋友幹嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
380.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
402.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
教小朋友什麼?用影片教小朋友幹嘛?什麼撥刺啦讓他在整個食的過程享受到魚肉的鮮美但是不會擔心到那個受到刺的這個影響做了以後效果是什麼?這個滿意度也蠻高的小朋友也是真的可以因為影片而真的享受到魚肉的這個食用的過程 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
402.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
428.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
還有一個重點他們的廚餘就變少了相對的就會變少因為小朋友知道怎麼吃魚怎麼把魚翅挑出來所以就不會留下太多的魚肉在廚餘裡面為什麼從這些細節開始講我就要講今天我去日本考察營養午餐我特別感受到一個很強烈的東西是日本的營養午餐它不是單純把它當成所謂的社會福利或是照顧 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
429.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
443.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
他把它當成幾個重點第一個飲食教育對不對第二個健康教育特別倡導說糖尿病要從小學的營養午餐開始就教起就是要從飲食當中來去防治各種慢性病 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
445.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
464.519 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
這次的考察我們幾乎是從早然後到晚就在不斷的再去跟日本的各個單位來交流也包括數學教育啦也包括說今天營養午餐資訊教育都有這是一個非常有意義的一個國外的考察 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
465.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
493.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
那我就覺得說今天自己受益甚豐所以我必須在這邊也要透過這個質詢來告訴大家我們台灣既然要討論營養午餐的專法那當然要跟今天營養午餐法已經行之有年的日本來去參考他們立法的經驗這絕對是今天有一個有品質立法應該做的事情這我必須給羅廷偉委員一個還他一個公道那下一個我想請教一下我們的次長 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
495.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
521.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
如果大人害怕小孩這世界就完蛋了請問這句話出處你知道是哪裡嗎鐵拳教育打對鐵拳教育我剛剛看質詢說你沒有看鐵拳教育嘛因為有10個小時不好意思我會抽空來看沒有你要不要看我覺得這點是尊重次長的判斷但我要跟你講就是說基本上我們現在老師有很多恐懼你知道吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
523.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
551.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
有很多恐懼啊恐懼所謂的濫訴恐懼所謂的濫用檢舉恐懼網報恐懼校內的一些霸凌恐懼一些所謂的少年犯運用所謂的少年保護來去欺壓學生當老師恐懼教育環境的時候市長你覺得受害者是老師而已嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
553.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
581.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
是嗎不管是老師或學生如果校園讓親師生都感到恐懼這是我們必須要很嚴肅面對的問題沒錯 我告訴你多大老師都恐懼教育現場環境這個世界就完了為什麼受害的不只是老師受害的包括學生的受教權受害的是今天老師如果沒有辦法好好教育的話國家也不會有未來 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
582.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
609.519 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
為什麼今天雖然次長沒有看過鐵拳教育裡面當然有很多戲劇化的手法那是另外的問題但是它為什麼引起這麼大的共鳴次長你知道嗎 為什麼我是有看到一些相關的評論主要是這某種程度是來自於教育現場一些觀察跟反應就是這個部分可能切合現在他們的經驗是的 我跟次長說 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
611.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
633.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
裡面幾乎啊完完全全大家沒有任何陌生全部發生在教育現場不只南韓獨有台灣也是啊其中一集講國會議員的兒子仗著父親的勢力霸凌學校同學那也有少年犯仗著法律的保護在校園橫行霸道 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
634.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
662.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
公然挑釁 還傷害 惡毒傷害被害者家屬很多人看到這就想到2023年新北校園的戈井案啊毒品現在侵入校園的嚴重性與日俱增大家看到裡面所有的一些隱具的情節跟教育現場幾乎是一模一樣這才會產生強大的共鳴我再講一集我覺得更是幾乎百分之百命中 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
664.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
691.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
他有一集講恐龍家長如何濫用檢舉制度長期壓迫老師市長你知道這在台灣也發生過一模一樣的事吧您知道吧有看到有類似的評論跟建議不是類似的評論跟建議啊市長您是教育部的官員啊你是學生的後盾 也是老師的後盾是教育現場必須走出這種所謂惡質霸凌之風 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
693.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
722.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
的一個最強大的後盾媒體有報導有一位教學20年在台南市國中任教的謝信老師2024年4月因為關心學生的學習狀況在聯絡簿上寫下數學是不是練習較少寫下這句話引發家長強烈反彈家長指控老師的一句話會摧毀孩子的生命 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
725.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
749.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
然後呢投訴到教育局接著擴大成40多項投訴連他午休時提醒學生不要關燈寫練習卷要保護眼睛也變成說是侵害學生的權益甚至三四年前的臉書貼文都被翻出來檢舉2024年8月校士會議調查結果認定40多項投訴均無違規 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
755.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
781.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
家長還是持續啊持續繼續爛訴啊然後要求逐項說明投訴為什麼不成立在調查過程有無瑕疵在沒有新市政的情況之下同年12月原本調查沒有任何違規的報告改成四項成立老師難以接受問為什麼結果不同就調查委員跟他講啊你被投訴這麼多項如果一項都沒有成立家長會覺得我們只是 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
783.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
785.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
在幹嘛暴斃老師啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
787.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
816.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
因此還被學校寄申戒一次 考積打一等 考積獎金減半然後被列為追蹤名單 撰寫五千字報告 參加四小時研習最後訴願成功 經歷八個月的投訴調查四個月的考核會審查 到十個月的訴訟兩年漫長程序 折磨到身心俱疲最後他已經不知該如何重返校園了 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
819.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
846.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
這位老師他撐過了這場磨爛但是不像劇中的老師他今天幾乎撐不下去為什麼幾乎一模一樣如果你去看那一集你會發現一模一樣完全一樣他為什麼形成強大的共鳴就是現在大家擔憂的是我們教育現場對老師而言已經是惡化到今天執教非常困難了 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
848.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
860.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
在這種情況之下我們教育部非常有責任要去解決這個問題那為什麼要舉這個例子我要告訴現在校事會議就是有爛輸的情況沒錯吧就是有些爛輸的情況吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
866.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
894.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
所以說我們在今年1月也針對校事會議也針對匿名檢舉針對分流針對於相關的資訊輔助人的部分我們都有做了調整也期待說在這半年我們收整現場一些狀況之後在今年7月中能夠再進行整個檢討分析看是不是要能夠再進一步精進是不是還有什麼不足的部分可以用來讓整個一個校事會議制度能夠更完整我要跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
896.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
921.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
次長說啊 校事會議 今天純廢是一件事改革是非常必要的我們就很多老師在教育現場不堪霸凌 不堪濫訴就選擇走上我們最不樂見的路這樣的去對老師的這種欺壓我說過傷害的不是老師而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
923.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
942.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
傷害是整個教育現場跟環境傷害是學生的受教訓傷害是國家的未來所以為什麼今天要嚴肅來討論這件事情希望教育部今天真的要肩膀扛起來把我們老師扛起來不要讓老師獨自承受這樣一個黑暗的霸凌以上 謝謝是 謝謝委員長 |
| transcript.gazette[0].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[0].start |
2026-06-11T11:14:35.718000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[0].end |
2026-06-11T11:14:42.963000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].text |
有請彭署長跟朱次長。 |
| transcript.gazette[0].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[1].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[1].start |
2026-06-11T11:14:42.963000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[1].end |
2026-06-11T11:14:45.565000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].text |
謝謝次長。 |
| transcript.gazette[1].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[2].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[2].start |
2026-06-11T11:14:45.565000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[2].end |
2026-06-11T11:14:45.745000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].text |
委員好。 |
| transcript.gazette[2].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[3].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[3].start |
2026-06-11T11:14:51.309000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[3].end |
2026-06-11T11:15:11.113000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].text |
在這邊我必須先還我們的召委羅廷瑋一個公道，我先講幾件事情，我想請問次長，你知道立法院各委員會在會期當中考察其實是很平常的事情，對不對？是。 |
| transcript.gazette[3].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[4].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[4].start |
2026-06-11T11:15:12.254000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[4].end |
2026-06-11T11:15:17.236000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].text |
沒錯嘛，包括出國考察、國內考察都有，對不對？ |
| transcript.gazette[4].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[5].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[5].start |
2026-06-11T11:15:17.356000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[5].end |
2026-06-11T11:15:23.859000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].text |
不管哪一個政黨擔任召委，考察都是有的，國內的也有、出國的也有。 |
| transcript.gazette[5].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[6].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[6].start |
2026-06-11T11:15:25.300000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[6].end |
2026-06-11T11:15:39.976000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].text |
為了立法政策形成，第一個你先要做實地的了解，包括國內的很多考察，另外也包括要做其他國家經驗的探求，所以就有國際的部分。 |
| transcript.gazette[6].quality |
0.944 |
| transcript.gazette[7].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[7].start |
2026-06-11T11:15:41.437000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[7].end |
2026-06-11T11:16:10.320000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].text |
我今天真的非常非常遺憾，羅廷瑋召委安排到日本的營養午餐考察，我們非常感謝署長也有一起參與，這個考察收穫甚豐，待會我會一一來講，但是卻在民進黨委員的攻擊之下變成薪水小偷。 |
| transcript.gazette[7].quality |
0.949 |
| transcript.gazette[8].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[8].start |
2026-06-11T11:16:11+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[8].end |
2026-06-11T11:16:20.566000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].text |
第一件事我想請問次長或署長，這個日本的考察有拿到教育部的經費嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[8].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[9].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[9].start |
2026-06-11T11:16:20.566000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[9].end |
2026-06-11T11:16:22.527000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].text |
有用教育部的公費出國嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[9].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[10].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[10].start |
2026-06-11T11:16:22.527000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[10].end |
2026-06-11T11:16:23.328000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].text |
有沒有？沒有。 |
| transcript.gazette[10].quality |
0.6 |
| transcript.gazette[11].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[11].start |
2026-06-11T11:16:23.748000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[11].end |
2026-06-11T11:16:25.149000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].text |
沒有嘛，對不對？ |
| transcript.gazette[11].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[12].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[12].start |
2026-06-11T11:16:25.149000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[12].end |
2026-06-11T11:16:26.109000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].text |
立法院的也沒有啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[12].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[13].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[13].start |
2026-06-11T11:16:28.091000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[13].end |
2026-06-11T11:17:02.549000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].text |
羅廷瑋召委公布了立委到日本考察的調查表，第一張發出去上面就寫所有的經費請委員自理，請委員自行負擔的經費包括機票、住宿，甚至我相信署長您知道我們到日本跟小朋友併桌吃營養午餐，請問我們吃的營養午餐是誰出的錢？ |
| transcript.gazette[13].quality |
0.938 |
| transcript.gazette[14].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[14].start |
2026-06-11T11:17:02.549000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[14].end |
2026-06-11T11:17:03.870000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].text |
也是立委自己出的錢啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[14].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[15].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[15].start |
2026-06-11T11:17:04.911000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[15].end |
2026-06-11T11:17:13.297000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].text |
羅廷瑋召委還堅持要付費，他說：抱歉，這是我們到人家學校吃的，就按照他們的收費標準。 |
| transcript.gazette[15].quality |
0.944 |
| transcript.gazette[16].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[16].start |
2026-06-11T11:17:14.057000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[16].end |
2026-06-11T11:17:27.472000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].text |
我們所有委員就要出錢、就要付費，做到這個程度，民進黨還開記者會說這是用公費考察、薪水小偷，我想請教民進黨要不要道歉？ |
| transcript.gazette[16].quality |
0.962 |
| transcript.gazette[17].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[17].start |
2026-06-11T11:17:28.912000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[17].end |
2026-06-11T11:17:38.897000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].text |
我先不講出國考察民進黨也有，拿公費的都有，民進黨不要跟我說你沒有拿公費出國考察過！ |
| transcript.gazette[17].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[18].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[18].start |
2026-06-11T11:17:38.897000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[18].end |
2026-06-11T11:17:52.444000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].text |
你們國內考察、國外考察都有，拿公費的也都有，羅廷瑋委員從出發第一刻跟你講這一場是自費去考察，結果民進黨竟然可以開記者會，雙標到這種程度！ |
| transcript.gazette[18].quality |
0.968 |
| transcript.gazette[19].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[19].start |
2026-06-11T11:17:55.616000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[19].end |
2026-06-11T11:17:58.438000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].text |
我在這邊必須還給羅廷瑋召委一個公道。 |
| transcript.gazette[19].quality |
0.765 |
| transcript.gazette[20].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[20].start |
2026-06-11T11:17:59.899000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[20].end |
2026-06-11T11:18:21.535000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].text |
接下來我想請教署長，我必須說這次去我真的對署長非常的感謝，在此要表示崇高的敬意，因為整個過程我們看在眼裡，你非常認真在向日本取經，日本的營養午餐是專法對不對？是。 |
| transcript.gazette[20].quality |
0.919 |
| transcript.gazette[21].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[21].start |
2026-06-11T11:18:23.022000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[21].end |
2026-06-11T11:18:29.504000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].text |
他們實施了非常久，二、三十年以上了，有沒有參考的價值？ |
| transcript.gazette[21].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[22].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[22].start |
2026-06-11T11:18:29.504000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[22].end |
2026-06-11T11:18:33.265000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].text |
不只，在1954、1968年。 |
| transcript.gazette[22].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[23].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[23].start |
2026-06-11T11:18:33.265000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[23].end |
2026-06-11T11:18:37.127000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].text |
所以他們等於是最早做營養午餐專法的。 |
| transcript.gazette[23].quality |
0.882 |
| transcript.gazette[24].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[24].start |
2026-06-11T11:18:38.207000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[24].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:01.771000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].text |
第二個，我們在實際的考察過程當中，有幾樣東西我印象很深刻，剛剛羅廷瑋委員也講到了，我們有去跟日本的小學生一起吃營養午餐，有一件事我印象很深刻，署長印象應該也很深刻，請問我們臺灣的營養午餐通常是幾菜幾湯幾主食？ |
| transcript.gazette[24].quality |
0.948 |
| transcript.gazette[25].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[25].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:02.692000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[25].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:10.617000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].text |
原則上三菜一湯，有時候有一水果，偏鄉地區還可能有點心。 |
| transcript.gazette[25].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[26].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[26].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:11.558000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[26].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:15.700000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].text |
然後牛奶要看情況，對不對？是。 |
| transcript.gazette[26].quality |
0.917 |
| transcript.gazette[27].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[27].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:15.841000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[27].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:17.942000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].text |
我想請問日本他們是幾菜幾湯？ |
| transcript.gazette[27].quality |
0.846 |
| transcript.gazette[28].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[28].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:17.942000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[28].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:18.722000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].text |
我們這次去考察的是幾菜幾湯？ |
| transcript.gazette[28].quality |
0.692 |
| transcript.gazette[29].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[29].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:20.069000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[29].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:23.112000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].text |
一菜一湯，然後有一個牛奶。 |
| transcript.gazette[29].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[30].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[30].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:23.713000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[30].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:24.233000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].text |
對，一菜一湯。 |
| transcript.gazette[30].quality |
0.8 |
| transcript.gazette[31].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[31].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:24.233000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[31].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:25.795000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].text |
然後那天剛好有水果。 |
| transcript.gazette[31].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[32].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[32].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:26.215000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[32].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:28.778000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].text |
他說一年大概兩次水果，對不對？ |
| transcript.gazette[32].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[33].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[33].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:28.778000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[33].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:31.680000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].text |
對，次數比較少，剛好我們那天踫到。 |
| transcript.gazette[33].quality |
0.286 |
| transcript.gazette[34].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[34].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:31.680000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[34].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:41.370000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].text |
我要特別講的是，我們有在現場問為什麼他們菜的品項這麼少？ |
| transcript.gazette[34].quality |
0.923 |
| transcript.gazette[35].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[35].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:42.250000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[35].end |
2026-06-11T11:19:43.031000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].text |
他怎麼回答我們你還記得嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[35].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[36].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[36].start |
2026-06-11T11:19:45.572000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[36].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:01.104000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].text |
這一點個別學校回答的比較不一樣，當然他們是從營養的均衡跟適當的食量等等，以我個人來看，其實那一瓶牛奶也是占了餐費。 |
| transcript.gazette[36].quality |
0.925 |
| transcript.gazette[37].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[37].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:01.745000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[37].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:03.066000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].text |
是，沒錯。 |
| transcript.gazette[37].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[38].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[38].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:03.066000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[38].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:05.988000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].text |
事實上，令我印象很深刻的是什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[38].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[39].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[39].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:05.988000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[39].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:09.811000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].text |
就是他們在做所謂的營養午餐滿意度的調查…… |
| transcript.gazette[39].quality |
0.895 |
| transcript.gazette[40].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[40].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:11.321000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[40].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:13.222000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].text |
對，在足立區的調查。 |
| transcript.gazette[40].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[41].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[41].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:13.682000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[41].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:32.430000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].text |
幾乎有92%、93%的學生都是滿意的，我相信署長也有看到，我們是分開到不同的班，我有特別觀察我去的那一班，小朋友是吃得乾乾淨淨的，把所有的飯跟菜全部吃光光，我也直接問他們好不好吃，他們當場跟我講很好吃。 |
| transcript.gazette[41].quality |
0.83 |
| transcript.gazette[42].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[42].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:37.347000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[42].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:48.164000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].text |
還有，剛剛有講到秋刀魚的影片，他們對每個飲食會做一些影片，用影片教小朋友什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[42].quality |
0.943 |
| transcript.gazette[43].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[43].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:48.164000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[43].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:57.549000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].text |
就是如何挑魚刺，讓他們在整個食的過程享受到魚肉的鮮美，但是不會擔心受到魚刺的影響。 |
| transcript.gazette[43].quality |
0.789 |
| transcript.gazette[44].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[44].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:57.549000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[44].end |
2026-06-11T11:20:59.450000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].text |
對，這樣做了以後的效果是什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[44].quality |
0.692 |
| transcript.gazette[45].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[45].start |
2026-06-11T11:20:59.450000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[45].end |
2026-06-11T11:21:06.394000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].text |
這個滿意度也滿高的，小朋友也真的因為影片而真的享受到食用魚肉的過程。 |
| transcript.gazette[45].quality |
0.906 |
| transcript.gazette[46].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[46].start |
2026-06-11T11:21:06.794000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[46].end |
2026-06-11T11:21:09.115000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].text |
還有一個重點是他們的廚餘就變少了。 |
| transcript.gazette[46].quality |
0.938 |
| transcript.gazette[47].speaker |
彭署長富源 |
| transcript.gazette[47].start |
2026-06-11T11:21:09.335000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[47].end |
2026-06-11T11:21:10.115000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].text |
相對的就會變少。 |
| transcript.gazette[47].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[48].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[48].start |
2026-06-11T11:21:10.255000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[48].end |
2026-06-11T11:21:17.178000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].text |
對，因為小朋友知道怎麼吃魚、怎麼把魚刺挑出來，所以就不會留下太多的魚肉在廚餘裡面。 |
| transcript.gazette[48].quality |
0.946 |
| transcript.gazette[49].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[49].start |
2026-06-11T11:21:18.038000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[49].end |
2026-06-11T11:21:20.539000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].text |
我為什麼從這些細節開始講？ |
| transcript.gazette[49].quality |
0.917 |
| transcript.gazette[50].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[50].start |
2026-06-11T11:21:20.539000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[50].end |
2026-06-11T11:21:46.999000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].text |
我要講的就是，在我去日本考察營養午餐以後有特別感受到一個很強烈的東西，就是日本並不是單純的把營養午餐當成所謂的社會福利或是照顧，他們認為營養午餐有幾個重點：第一個是飲食教育；第二個是健康教育，他們也倡導預防糖尿病要從小學的營養午餐開始教起，就是要從飲食當中來防治各種慢性病。 |
| transcript.gazette[50].quality |
0.775 |
| transcript.gazette[51].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[51].start |
2026-06-11T11:21:49.313000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[51].end |
2026-06-11T11:22:34.501000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].text |
在這次的考察，我們幾乎是從早到晚不斷的跟日本各個單位進行交流，包括數學教育、營養午餐、資訊教育，這是一個非常有意義的國外考察，我覺得自己受益甚豐，所以我必須在這邊透過這個質詢來告訴大家，我們臺灣既然要討論營養午餐的專法，而日本的營養午餐法已經行之有年，我們當然要去參考他們立法的經驗，這絕對是今天要達成高品質立法所應該做的事情，所以我必須要還羅廷瑋委員一個公道。 |
| transcript.gazette[51].quality |
0.869 |
| transcript.gazette[52].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[52].start |
2026-06-11T11:22:35.601000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[52].end |
2026-06-11T11:22:43.445000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].text |
接下來我想要請教一下次長，你知道「如果大人害怕小孩，這世界就完蛋了！ |
| transcript.gazette[52].quality |
0.8 |
| transcript.gazette[53].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[53].start |
2026-06-11T11:22:44.546000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[53].end |
2026-06-11T11:22:47.328000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].text |
」這句話的出處是哪裡嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[53].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[54].speaker |
朱司長俊彰 |
| transcript.gazette[54].start |
2026-06-11T11:22:47.328000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[54].end |
2026-06-11T11:22:47.788000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].text |
「鐵拳教育」。 |
| transcript.gazette[54].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[55].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[55].start |
2026-06-11T11:22:49.029000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[55].end |
2026-06-11T11:22:49.029000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].text |
答對了！ |
| transcript.gazette[55].quality |
0.333 |
| transcript.gazette[56].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[56].start |
2026-06-11T11:22:49.029000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[56].end |
2026-06-11T11:22:51.912000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].text |
就是「鐵拳教育」，我剛剛看了質詢的過程，你說你沒有看「鐵拳教育」，對不對？ |
| transcript.gazette[56].quality |
0.655 |
| transcript.gazette[57].speaker |
朱司長俊彰 |
| transcript.gazette[57].start |
2026-06-11T11:22:52.212000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[57].end |
2026-06-11T11:22:54.834000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].text |
因為有10個小時，不好意思，我會抽空來看。 |
| transcript.gazette[57].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[58].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[58].start |
2026-06-11T11:22:55.715000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[58].end |
2026-06-11T11:23:05.383000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].text |
沒有，關於你要不要看，我覺得這一點是尊重次長的判斷，但是我要跟你講的就是，基本上，現在老師有很多的恐懼，你知道吧？ |
| transcript.gazette[58].quality |
0.88 |
| transcript.gazette[59].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[59].start |
2026-06-11T11:23:07.035000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[59].end |
2026-06-11T11:23:07.735000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].text |
他們有很多的恐懼。是。 |
| transcript.gazette[59].quality |
0.556 |
| transcript.gazette[60].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[60].start |
2026-06-11T11:23:09.136000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[60].end |
2026-06-11T11:23:28.020000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].text |
他們恐懼所謂的濫訴、恐懼所謂的濫用檢舉、恐懼網暴、恐懼校內的霸凌，還恐懼有一些少年犯利用所謂的少年保護去欺壓學生。 |
| transcript.gazette[60].quality |
0.808 |
| transcript.gazette[61].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[61].start |
2026-06-11T11:23:29.740000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[61].end |
2026-06-11T11:23:39.115000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].text |
當老師恐懼教育環境的時候，次長覺得受害者只有老師而已嗎？是嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[61].quality |
0.893 |
| transcript.gazette[62].speaker |
朱司長俊彰 |
| transcript.gazette[62].start |
2026-06-11T11:23:39.115000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[62].end |
2026-06-11T11:23:46.458000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].text |
不管是老師或學生，如果校園讓親師生都感到恐懼，這是我們必須要很嚴肅面對的問題。 |
| transcript.gazette[62].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[63].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[63].start |
2026-06-11T11:23:46.458000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[63].end |
2026-06-11T11:23:52.140000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].text |
沒錯，我告訴你，如果讓老師都恐懼教育現場的環境，這個世界就完了！ |
| transcript.gazette[63].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[64].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[64].start |
2026-06-11T11:23:53.401000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[64].end |
2026-06-11T11:23:54.581000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].text |
為什麼？ |
| transcript.gazette[64].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[65].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[65].start |
2026-06-11T11:23:54.581000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[65].end |
2026-06-11T11:24:05.046000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].text |
因為受害的不只是老師，受害的包括學生的受教權，而且今天老師如果沒有辦法好好教育的話，國家不會有未來，所以也因此受害。 |
| transcript.gazette[65].quality |
0.792 |
| transcript.gazette[66].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[66].start |
2026-06-11T11:24:07.722000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[66].end |
2026-06-11T11:24:14.987000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].text |
雖然次長沒有看過「鐵拳教育」，在裡面當然有很多戲劇化的手法，那是另外的問題，但是它為什麼引起這麼大的共鳴？ |
| transcript.gazette[66].quality |
0.979 |
| transcript.gazette[67].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[67].start |
2026-06-11T11:24:14.987000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[67].end |
2026-06-11T11:24:18.629000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].text |
次長，你知道為什麼嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[67].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[68].speaker |
朱司長俊彰 |
| transcript.gazette[68].start |
2026-06-11T11:24:18.629000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[68].end |
2026-06-11T11:24:32.439000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].text |
我是有看到一些相關的評論，某種程度是來自於教育現場的一些觀察跟反映，就是這個部分可能契合現在他們的經驗。 |
| transcript.gazette[68].quality |
0.939 |
| transcript.gazette[69].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[69].start |
2026-06-11T11:24:32.439000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[69].end |
2026-06-11T11:24:45.304000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].text |
是的，我跟次長說，大家對裡面演的幾乎完完全全沒有任何陌生的感覺，全部發生在教育現場，這不是南韓獨有，在臺灣也是啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[69].quality |
0.784 |
| transcript.gazette[70].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[70].start |
2026-06-11T11:24:46.584000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[70].end |
2026-06-11T11:25:11.292000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].text |
其中有一集講國會議員的兒子仗著父親的勢力霸凌學校同學；也有少年犯仗著法律的保護，在校園橫行霸道、公然挑釁，還二度傷害被害者的家屬，讓很多人看了就想到2023年新北校園的割頸案；還有現在毒品侵入校園的嚴重性與日俱增。 |
| transcript.gazette[70].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[71].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[71].start |
2026-06-11T11:25:12.713000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[71].end |
2026-06-11T11:25:22.778000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].text |
就是因為大家看到這部劇裡面的一些情節跟教育現場幾乎一模一樣，所以才會產生強大的共鳴。 |
| transcript.gazette[71].quality |
0.775 |
| transcript.gazette[72].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[72].start |
2026-06-11T11:25:22.778000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[72].end |
2026-06-11T11:25:36.294000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].text |
我再講一集的內容，我覺得更是幾乎百分之百命中，有一集是講恐龍家長如何濫用檢舉制度，長期壓迫老師，次長，你知道在臺灣也發生過一模一樣的事嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[72].quality |
0.905 |
| transcript.gazette[73].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[73].start |
2026-06-11T11:25:38.134000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[73].end |
2026-06-11T11:25:38.434000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].text |
你知道吧？ |
| transcript.gazette[73].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[74].speaker |
朱司長俊彰 |
| transcript.gazette[74].start |
2026-06-11T11:25:39.935000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[74].end |
2026-06-11T11:25:43.455000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].text |
有看到類似的評論跟建議。 |
| transcript.gazette[74].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[75].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[75].start |
2026-06-11T11:25:43.455000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[75].end |
2026-06-11T11:25:45.396000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].text |
不是類似的評論跟建議啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[75].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[76].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[76].start |
2026-06-11T11:25:46.556000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[76].end |
2026-06-11T11:25:58.406000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].text |
次長，你是教育部的官員，你是學生的後盾，也是老師的後盾，更是教育現場必須走出這種所謂惡質霸凌之風的一個最強大的後盾。 |
| transcript.gazette[76].quality |
0.943 |
| transcript.gazette[77].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[77].start |
2026-06-11T11:26:00.487000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[77].end |
2026-06-11T11:26:16.529000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].text |
媒體有報導，有一位在臺南市國中任教20年的謝姓老師，在2024年4月因為關心學生的學習狀況，在聯絡簿上寫下「數學是不是練習較少？ |
| transcript.gazette[77].quality |
0.942 |
| transcript.gazette[78].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[78].start |
2026-06-11T11:26:17.929000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[78].end |
2026-06-11T11:26:50.808000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].text |
」這句話，引發家長強烈反彈，家長指控老師的一句話會摧毀孩子的生命，然後向教育局投訴，接著擴大成四十多項投訴，連他在午休時提醒學生不要關燈寫練習卷、要保護眼睛，也變成是侵害學生的權益，甚至連他三、四年前在臉書的貼文也都被翻出來檢舉。 |
| transcript.gazette[78].quality |
0.894 |
| transcript.gazette[79].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[79].start |
2026-06-11T11:26:50.808000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[79].end |
2026-06-11T11:27:08.694000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].text |
2024年8月校事會議調查結果是認定四十多項投訴均無違規，家長還是繼續濫訴，然後要求逐項說明投訴為什麼不成立、調查過程有無瑕疵。 |
| transcript.gazette[79].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[80].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[80].start |
2026-06-11T11:27:09.534000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[80].end |
2026-06-11T11:27:29.812000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].text |
在沒有新事證的情況之下，在同年12月原本調查並沒有任何違規的報告改成有4項成立，老師難以接受，所以問為什麼結果不同，調查委員跟他講：你被投訴這麼多項，如果連一項都沒有成立，家長會覺得我們在包庇老師啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[80].quality |
0.888 |
| transcript.gazette[81].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[81].start |
2026-06-11T11:27:31.588000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[81].end |
2026-06-11T11:27:42.717000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].text |
因此他被學校記申誡一次，考績打乙等，考績獎金減半，然後被列為追蹤名單，要撰寫5,000字的報告並參加4小時的研習。 |
| transcript.gazette[81].quality |
0.766 |
| transcript.gazette[82].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[82].start |
2026-06-11T11:27:42.717000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[82].end |
2026-06-11T11:28:00.352000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].text |
最後他訴願成功，經歷8個月的投訴調查、4個月的考核會審查到10個月的訴訟，被長達兩年的漫長程序折磨到身心俱疲，最後他已經不知該如何重返校園了！ |
| transcript.gazette[82].quality |
0.919 |
| transcript.gazette[83].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[83].start |
2026-06-11T11:28:03.930000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[83].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[83].end |
2026-06-11T11:28:21.338000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[83].text |
這位老師撐過了這場磨難，不像劇中的老師幾乎撐不下去，如果你去看那一集，你會發現一模一樣、完全一樣，這部戲劇為什麼會引發強大的共鳴？ |
| transcript.gazette[83].quality |
0.864 |
| transcript.gazette[84].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[84].start |
2026-06-11T11:28:21.338000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[84].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[84].end |
2026-06-11T11:28:30.203000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[84].text |
就是現在大家擔憂教育現場對老師而言已經惡化到執教非常困難。 |
| transcript.gazette[84].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[85].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[85].start |
2026-06-11T11:28:32.513000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[85].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[85].end |
2026-06-11T11:28:41.038000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[85].text |
在這種情況之下，教育部非常有責任要去解決這個問題，我為什麼要舉這個例子？ |
| transcript.gazette[85].quality |
0.97 |
| transcript.gazette[86].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[86].start |
2026-06-11T11:28:41.158000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[86].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[86].end |
2026-06-11T11:28:43.039000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[86].text |
我要說的就是現在校事會議就是有濫訴的情況，沒錯吧？ |
| transcript.gazette[86].quality |
0.739 |
| transcript.gazette[87].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[87].start |
2026-06-11T11:28:43.439000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[87].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[87].end |
2026-06-11T11:28:44.520000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[87].text |
就是有一些濫訴的情況嘛！ |
| transcript.gazette[87].quality |
0.636 |
| transcript.gazette[88].speaker |
朱司長俊彰 |
| transcript.gazette[88].start |
2026-06-11T11:28:50.329000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[88].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[88].end |
2026-06-11T11:29:18.058000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[88].text |
是，所以我們在今年1一月針對校事會議、針對匿名檢舉、針對分流、針對相關的資訊和輔佐人的部分都有做了調整，也期待在這半年我們蒐整現場一些狀況之後，在今年7月中能夠再進行整個檢討分析，看是不是能夠再進一步精進事實上有不足的部分，藉此讓整個校事會議制度更完善。 |
| transcript.gazette[88].quality |
0.905 |
| transcript.gazette[89].speaker |
羅委員智強 |
| transcript.gazette[89].start |
2026-06-11T11:29:18.659000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[89].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[89].end |
2026-06-11T11:30:06.244000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[89].text |
我要跟次長說，今天校事會議的存廢是一件事，改革是非常必要的，我們已經有很多老師在教育現場不堪霸凌、不堪濫訴，最後選擇走上我們最不樂見的路，這樣對老師做這種欺壓，我說過傷害的不是老師而已，傷害的是整個教育現場跟環境，傷害的是學生的受教權，傷害的是國家的未來，所以為什麼今天要嚴肅來討論這件事情，也希望教育部真的要有肩膀扛起來，把我們的老師扛起來，不要讓老師獨自承受這樣黑暗的霸凌，以上，謝謝。 |
| transcript.gazette[89].quality |
0.904 |
| transcript.gazette[90].speaker |
朱次長俊彰 |
| transcript.gazette[90].start |
2026-06-11T11:30:06.384000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[90].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[90].end |
2026-06-11T11:30:06.404000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[90].text |
謝謝委員指導。 |
| transcript.gazette[90].quality |
0.667 |
| transcript.gazette[91].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[91].start |
2026-06-11T11:30:06.904000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[91].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[91].end |
2026-06-11T11:30:11.189714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[91].text |
謝謝羅智強委員、謝謝次長、謝謝署長。 |
| transcript.gazette[91].quality |
0.067 |
| transcript.gazette[92].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[92].start |
2026-06-11T11:30:11.489714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[92].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[92].end |
2026-06-11T11:30:14.346857+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[92].text |
接下來有請蔡春綢委員。 |
| transcript.gazette[92].quality |
0 |