| IVOD_ID |
169928 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/169928 |
| 日期 |
2026-06-10 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-36-18 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第18次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
18 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
36 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
司法及法制委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第18次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-06-10T11:20:15+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-06-10T11:34:25+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:14:10 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/dee24285c0428ea5671df554894b550c02c75a4b042dc3678c63d91a868a86b1f0631761c12512c65ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
許宇甄 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:20:15 - 11:34:25 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-06-10T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第18次全體委員會議（事由：併案審查
（一）台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「軍公教人員待遇調整條例草案」案。
（二）委員翁曉玲等16人擬具「軍公教人員待遇調整條例草案」案。
【6月10日會議僅進行詢答】
【6月10日及11日兩天一次會】） |
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謝謝主席 我們請張副人事長請副人事長委員好副人事長好我現在要首先來追蹤一件事情就是在今年3月25號的時候我有質詢我們的人事長就是有關因為去年的經濟成長率已經達到8.68% |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
35.859 |
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所以說照理說今年應該是要幫公務人員加薪大家一起共享這個經濟成長的果實那當時這個我們的人事長也有跟我講說他有預備4月要跟這個卓榮泰院長報告爭取另一次加薪的機會就今年度不是指明年 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
56.152 |
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然後之後我也有在這個諮詢過也有請教過婦人市長你當時是跟我講說6、7月會研擬相關的一個方案喔那因為現在已經進入到6月了我想問一下這個進度是怎樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
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跟委員報告我上次當然有跟委員報告說六七月我們會把方案提出來那現在進度是我們這個禮拜一這個禮拜一六月八號我們跟教育部有先跟公教團體的代表 |
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有先做過一個座談會溝通現在也收集他們的意見他們意見收集完以後我們會跟原來收集的相關的財經指標一起做評估那評估之後我們就會提方案提到待遇審議委員會那待遇審議委員會通過以後我們就會把建議的方案提給那這樣的時間預計什麼時候現在都已經六月了今年已經過一半了 |
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對 我們會抓住這個時程時程是什麼時候就是上次有跟委員報告說6、7月7月以前會有定案那請7月送給行政院之後呢那通常都要多久的時間 |
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因為七月就已經要今年度就已經可以結束了因為它會要配合總預算的時程所以一定會在這個時間會做決定所以就是在八月之前因為在總預算提出之前對所以這個部分 |
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希望就是說我們這個人事總處這邊如果我想你們也是身為公務人員的一份子啦就是經濟成長要跟這個我們的公務人員共享這我想是大家的共識那也希望說大家能夠積極處理這個進度加快一點幫我們的公務人員爭取另一個調心的計畫我們來趕我們來趕好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
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然後另外就是在請教您就是說我們今天審議的是軍公教人員待遇調整的這個條例的一個修法那我想我們這個也有提出這個相關的版本那尤其是針對這個部分我想請教一下就是人事總書的報告是說已經有把這個軍公教的這個待遇的那個待遇調整的條例草案已經有送交了行政院了是嗎 |
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199.088 |
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歐元寺什麼時候送膠的我們是113年12月送的113年12月就送了那為什麼現在院會還沒有拍審呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
210.68 |
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因為行政院要處理的案子當然很多啦那這件事情相對不重要就對了也不是 我們也一直在立法院裡面其實草野的委員都很關心這件事情然後我們也一直有跟行政院在討論這件事那我想我們會盡快把這個案子送過來 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
233.048 |
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盡快送過來已經從113年12月到現在囉這已經不是盡快了尤其是現在這種AI時代喔這已經是落後非常久了那表示說所以是行政院認為這不重要所以不把它排入院會這個案子就是很重要可以評估的比較省慎那我們最近也有媒體在反映你們應該是在送草案之前就已經評估非常久了嘛找了非常多的團體一起大家共同來研議嘛 |
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261.915 |
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269.161 |
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收集相關的各國的制度所以都已經送行政院那麼久了我們會很快把這個案子送過來我們盡快行政院現在院會都還沒排進去吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
281.573 |
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298.849 |
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我覺得我們人事總署要積極一點啦既然草野都有這個共識人事總署也都已經提出版本應該要把這個我們的這個軍公教人員待遇能夠法制化我想這是大家共同的想法那所以說人事總署這邊應該是要積極的來去處理好嗎 |
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302.15 |
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321.465 |
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好 那另外就想請教你除了這個要法制化之外呢我們也覺得說我們現在的這個薪資的待遇調整應該是要決策公開透明化所以呢我們認為就是過去因為都是行政院在密室協商就行政院自己決定要加薪或不加薪 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
322.305 |
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那現在呢 我們有提出的版本裡面有強制規定待遇審議委員會必須要納入現職的軍公教的代表那請問一下 目前你們送立法院的版本裡面呢有沒有提到這個部分各位報告 目前我們送行政院代表有公教的代表 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
343.188 |
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有公教代表 那軍人的部分是 軍人的部分其實我早上有做過說明 因為軍人他是基於他工作的特性 國安的考量一般國家也不會把軍人放在待遇協商的範圍 但是我們我們其實是有國防部 請國防部來代表軍人那但是問題是 你現在公教的代表的比例是幾位四位那你的成員是幾位 |
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373.991 |
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成員目前是規劃21位好 21位然後公交代表就4位因為還有地方機關還有學者專家對啊 那等於說真正的基層代表代表公交人員的才4位也就是有五分之一那這樣的話他們的意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
391.693 |
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410.709 |
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跟他們所要表達的要求其實在整個審議委員會裡面可能根本完全起不了什麼作用啊就變成說你們只是安排有公教基層的公教在裡面可是事實上完全沒有辦法影響而這攸關他們最重要的權益他們才是當事人 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
411.61 |
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424.736 |
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那所以這個部分呢我覺得應該是這個比例的部分應該是要調整那因為其實翁小林委員的版本裡面就有特別提到了就是軍公教各三位嘛至少九位那大概比例就是三分之一 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
426.223 |
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452.587 |
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那針對這個部分是不是可能調整到三分之一呢這個院版送過來以後我想這個草野的委員應該會很有智慧的副院長您自己您覺得呢站在你的立場其實我們現在很多的相關的審議委員會幾乎都是把這個基層的代表大概都有三分之一就像之前我們說海保法後來也把我們的漁民代表 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
454.068 |
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474.246 |
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這個大概占了三分之一左右我想這是最基本的委員報告就是早上其實也有其他委員有在詢問這個問題因為這個待遇調整現在就是各國的制度上面因為都是這個當事的團體就是他有建議或者是表達意見的這個機會 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
477.088 |
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499.769 |
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那最後應該是涉及整個國家的資源的分配這個當然我們知道但是就是三分之一我現在也不是說過半就三分之一來去表達他們的意見這應該不為過吧那針對這個部分的話我原意見我們再拿回去參考好然後另外就還有也希望說你們能夠尊重審議的結果因為現在看起來大家都是行政院決定那既然你有一個審議委員會應該要尊重委員會的一個權益是嗎 |
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505.943 |
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523.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
委員報告大家都擔心說是不是這個一人決策啦其實這個案子都不會是一人決策因為整個自助的規劃都會有相關的指標那請問一下如果未來這個審議委員會做成待遇調整的建議啊那行政院是不是會尊重 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
526.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
544.112 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
我們以現行的運作來講按照過去大部分的時間都是會尊重的就是會尊重那如果說行政院假設啦不同意的話有沒有什麼具體的條件還是說有什麼理由會再重新那個召開審議會還是沒有就是照行政院說的算目前現有的制度化機制是沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
549.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
575.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
對啊 那就是我剛剛講的這個問題嘛我們還是希望要尊重審議的結果既然你開了一個審議委員會給行政院那行政院就應該要尊重 否則就不用開這個審議委員會啦因為那代表的是 你剛剛講的嘛21位代表的是各界的不管是專家 學者 基層代表 公務公家機關都已經有這樣子的一個建議了啦所以是不是應該是要尊重審議的結果?報告就是現行運作的狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
576.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
605.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
行政院都是尊重委員會的建議所以會尊重審議的結果然後最後就是我想請教一下就是說我們現在這個有提出的版本就是希望是明定消費者物價指數CPI累積成長達3%的時候或者是每四年要定期調整然後條幅也不得低於通膨率的二分之一那請問你們現在送行政院的版本裡面目前的這個朝向的這個調整的方向是怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
607.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
632.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
我跟委員報告 行政院還沒有送過來的最後定稿但是我們人總署的我剛剛一開始報告的時候其實有講這個部分我們都往那邊去調聞去做考量所以你是說CPI達到3%然後每四年要定期檢討也有對年輕人我們可能還更我們都有規劃 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
632.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
636.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
你們都有規劃那條幅不得低於通膨率的二分之一這個也都有規劃因為我剛剛有報告其實就是這是一個專業的委員會的評估然後也有相關明確的指標在進行那因為總的國家資源的負責分配還是這個主政者還是要去負最後的責任 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
659.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
668.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
所以這個部分我希望說這個盡快的也希望人事總署能夠要求就是請行政院因為立法院現在已經今天我們現在已經這個特別針對這個部分有排審了那也希望說行政院趕快把院板送進來我們在審查的過程中才能把院板納入否則的話我們這樣審一審院板要來不及進來的話我們可能就沒有辦法 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
680.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
683.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
我們也希望病神我們希望願本病神希望能夠盡快最後再請教一個問題就是說針對職場霸凌的部分從109年的12件大幅增加到114年的132件5年成長了10倍這5年間成長了10倍究竟是公務機關霸凌的問題越來越嚴重還是人事總署過去的預防機制根本沒有發揮作用人事總署你們要怎麼解讀這個現象 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
711.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
739.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
委員報告這問題當然大家都很重視那在去年那個保障法修法之前就是我們整個國家法制對不管是職場霸凌的定義都沒有一個作用法的明確的規範然後主管機關到底是誰都還沒有明確所以在那個過渡期其實人總處是有 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
741.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
767.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
這個努力的先做一個指引讓各機關可以執行然後在去年大家努力的去推展這一塊資產霸凌的房子也修了保障法也修了安慰辦法那安慰辦法是去年7月1號就實施然後保障法是今年1月9號監察院有調查就是多起的霸凌案件發現部分的人事單位不但沒有協助被害人甚至出現勸退的情形要求當事人自行檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
769.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
787.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
請問這是怎麼一回事我覺得這個可能有點太簡化了我覺得大多數的人事同仁其實都很兢兢業業在處理如果委員有聽到地方基層的聲音應該也知道我們人事同仁處理這個領域的工作其實也是盡情盡力在做 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
788.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
811.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
越多所以我們還是希望就是就是除了你們這個事後調查懲處之外我們還是希望要建立一個預警的一個機制然後主動的介入制度然後就像你剛講的我們可能有一些預警的然後一些什麼宣導未來我覺得會更好因為這個今年這個已經制度已經完備化了那主管機關也確定是保訓位然後現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
812.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
838.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
處理的方式就是在調查小組其實要有二分之一的外聘委員就是外部介入的力量已經變大了然後安慰委員會也要至少三分之一外聘委員那像調查小組如果他是機關首長他沒有上級的部分其實外聘委員是要達到三分之二然後另外保訓會他也可以做外部的抽查 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
839.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
847.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
希望這個部分要確實的落實讓我們這些公務人員不要再受到這種霸凌之苦這個我們會努力去跟保訓會協作好 謝謝謝謝委員 |