| IVOD_ID |
169745 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/169745 |
| 日期 |
2026-06-03 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-19-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第16次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
16 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第16次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-06-03T09:27:38+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-06-03T09:39:05+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:27 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5329b193fad0412554416f5ee5d043691daf08b7e9b1ad740ec4bac65b2ac6bff3b9796bc518a7b75ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
鍾佳濱 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:27:38 - 09:39:05 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-06-03T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第16次全體委員會議（事由：一、 繼續審查：
(一) 本院委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等17人擬具「土石採取法第三條條文修正草案」案。
(二) 本院委員黃仁等36人擬具「土石採取法第三條及第十四條條文修正草案」案。
(三) 本院委員邱議瑩等21人擬具「土石採取法部分條文修正草案」案。
(四) 本院委員賴瑞隆等19人擬具「土石採取法部分條文修正草案」案。
(五) 本院委員許智傑等31人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。
(六) 本院委員柯志恩等19人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。
(七) 本院委員邱鎮軍等24人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條、第三十八條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。
(八) 本院委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。
(九) 本院委員丁學忠等16人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。
(十) 本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「土石採取法第三十六條、第三十八條及第四十一條條文修正草案」案。
二、 審查：
(十一) 行政院函請審議「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。
(十二) 本院委員林倩綺等17人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條、第三十八條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。
(十三) 本院委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等16人擬具「土石採取法第三條及第十四條條文修正草案」案。
(十四) 本院委員徐巧芯等16人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。
(十五) 本院委員王鴻薇等19人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。
(十六) 本院委員廖偉翔等21人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。
(第十五及第十六案如未接獲院會交付審查之議事處來文，則不予審查) (詢答及處理)
【6月3日及6月4日二天一次會】） |
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登記第一位的中嘉賓委員發言 |
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16.696 |
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主席在場的委員先進列席的政府機關省長官員會長共同夥伴媒體記者女士先生先謝謝主席再次因應著行政院版還有委員的信任版本人讓我們有機會再次的詢答那我們對這個議題會充分的來加以討論當然因為這個議題前面有些問題也已經討論過了所以今天也會延續到一些新的議題所以我們就有請經濟部的賴次長地調 |
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41.633 |
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52.412 |
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中興的許主任以及內政部國土署的偵檢論視察那麼請園區管理局的楊局長請準備委員好 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
56.922 |
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84.659 |
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市長好 其實這個問題您再熟悉不過過去您就是主管經濟部土質採取法當中最重要的水利署好 那麼我們上次就看到行政院版這裡講出了精準打擊阻斷不法我們看到行政院版跟其他在野黨的版本的最大差別在於你們的上限裁罰的罰還是上限是一千萬但是你們加了一個意圖盈利的話可以處以刑罰有期徒刑五年以下 |
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85.299 |
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但是呢在其他災難版本呢樓地板從100提高為1000或2000萬那麼上限呢從5000萬到1億不等請次長說明您認為對於嚴重盈利者我們處以行則這是必要的嗎這個當然是必要的我們要維護環境的這個 |
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106.84 |
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130.156 |
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那既然這樣的話行政裁罰的部分100萬到1000萬跟在內版本有這麼大的差異您說明一下樓地板的部分跟天畫板的部分為什麼採取100到1000跟委員說明我們這次為了再修法我們也請教法務部包括相關的檢察官我們認為這個部分不符合比例的原則那如果樓地板1000萬或2000萬呢 |
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143.046 |
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樓地板一千萬兩千萬起跳呢因為只要有兩立方公尺我剛有報告過了他就有可能差好那我們就兩立方公尺本席在20年前擔任屏東縣副縣長在25年前擔任屏東縣長的局長秘書當時屏東縣政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
149.21 |
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150.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
所以有一些的農民因為這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
175.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
193.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
觀念比較不足啊所以造成有一些可能所以如果只是單純的兩立方以下就要面對到一百萬的裁罰這似乎過當吧我們原本的法規第三條的規定針對於自用的部分就免於處罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
194.8 |
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所以我們針對於那意圖營利的或是擴大的這個採取的這個行為我們希望來藉由這次的修法可以提高所以當年那個悲劇老農民因為受裁罰一百萬要去致敬那當時的兩立方民如果是致用就沒有問題了是好 謝謝我們支持行政院版的裁罰謝謝 往下看 |
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214.736 |
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238.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
再來我們埋填廢棄物這個土石棄土的最大問題在於盜亂採之後的砂石坑那個空間是更值錢的他可以請到這些廢棄物非法的廢物算是有毒的廢棄物那過去我們發現這些拋棄廢棄物的行為應該由行為人跟地主共同來承擔那現在我們看到在場版本說可以轉嫁給政府您覺得這合理嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
239.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
266.981 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
這完全不合理因為行為人可能藉此來規避他自己總負的責任事實上我知道過去的例子凡是意圖盜亂採土石的人他購買了農地他都用人頭去購買結果行為人沒有抓到地主要負責但是地主也無力去處理這些被盜亂採的有毒廢棄物所以造成地方這種很大的困擾你扣押也沒辦法那代執行也求償不回來所以應該嚴格的課以誰責任課以行為人嘛對不對好我們講往下看 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
269.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
294.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
那麼至於說我們過去的經驗未經許可採取土石擦採取土石呢過去我們有發現採取土石大概有兩個作案工具第一個是輪車運輸第二個是挖掘工具輪車通常抓不到通常我們過去只要發現有意圖不法我們去抓跑掉了但是機具都棄置在現場地方政府當時因為限於我們的保管空間不足也沒有能力去加以所以我們做的方式就是它 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
294.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
302.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
挖土機的面板拆下來就地就保管請問未來未經許可採取的土是殺死的我們的執行方式有哪些做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
303.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
329.551 |
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第一個是沒入 第二個是說是意圖你沒入要保管喔對阿 沒入你要保管阿這個當然就要看說地方政府的所謂的執行那你們對於地方政府執行能力有辦法協議支持嗎過去我們針對河川沙石的疏進很多河川的管理機關他自己有這些的戰事場但是每一個地方政府他的所有的管理的能力不一一組所以我們希望未來經濟部要密切去注意 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
330.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
356.702 |
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我們查扣之後你要沒錄或沒收這個保管的問題有沒有能力去負擔 這要想辦法 那往下看再下來我們現在就要土方的問題了 為什麼要找地調所呢現在我們說啊 國土署說什麼咧說我們這個土資企方已經去平緩了有不合理的漲價 我們都監控所以你們認為呢 目前啊企方只要付大概一千多塊錢 土資漲就可以這個可是事實上市面上的行情 如果我要雇人把 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
357.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
366.426 |
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挖方帶走要付的價格是3,500到4,000跟土資場拿到的1,000出頭是差距很大請問一下到底國土署你們所知道的價格是怎麼樣土方支援之前大概是1,600到2,000比土資場收的還多因為這包括開挖費、運費跟戰資費現在已經漲到4,000了你們有監控到嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
380.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
396.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
跟我們報告因為這個業務是屬於另外一個組的部分不好意思我一直在OK今天我們不是採取土石採取嗎好請先回來那個次長這樣一樣都是您的範圍雖然那是內政部的範圍往下看其實目前現在營造業這內政部的問題你不要跟他講 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
398.232 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
427.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
現在連續被施作土質廠他已經容量裝不下了站氣場也不收如果他有場所他用太空包立竿沒有場所他就停工這是沒有辦法去化的施土怎麼處理這個你要跟內政部去講一下往下看另外還有什麼問題他專探報告會去根據地質專探報告來處理剩餘土質方面的處理計畫但是一旦開挖可能這個土質它鬆軟之後它的鬆方比超過預估或它組成了 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
427.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
455.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
內容不符合專案報告這時候他沒辦法取得土石的出土許可要停工經濟部知道嗎這個部分個別的工地都有一些相對的困難所以我們這次的修法裡面特別針對於整戶的部分除了強調不要使用廢棄土之外我們會會同相關的機關來訂定合理地道中心那剛剛講到的這個如果說土層不符專案報告怎麼辦出土沒辦法許可怎麼辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
457.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
469.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
我們還是會按照規定請他還是要繼續市長聽到了沒有還是要按照規定所以想辦法去解決這個部分我們必須幫實況去做反應請經濟部密切注意最後呢我必須要結束了來那個楊局長 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
472.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
493.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
這個上三月的時候問過了何次長關於產創條例當中我本席的修法第一我提升10%到15%這個我們可以討論那最重要的是在46條之一我把最後第三款拿掉還有即出售員工新建住宅致用請問你們的態度是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
494.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
523.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
是 我們支持委員這樣的一個態度我們後續也會來安排相關法條的調整好 那麼賴市長雖然這是何市長的業務 請你督導下去我希望趕快管理局把過去不只是你們所屬園區過去根據產創條例39條跟4條之一它只要園區內的原來的土地後來有受供員工新建住宅之使用以及出售供新建住宅之使用的現況調查給本席可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
524.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
526.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
市長你承諾大概多久可以給本席 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
533.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
556.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
兩個禮拜兩個禮拜沒有問題我給你一個月的時間好往下看最後呢因為主席站起來了最近我們看到昨天的經濟日報的社論他說台灣要打造戰略科技產業鏈這是我們召委主席很關心的那麼目前外界提出的是修改產業創新條例將國防科技AI半導體低軌衛星還有無人機以及資安和居民兩用的科技納入投資租稅獎勵的範圍請問目前經濟部有沒有構想 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
560.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
587.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
就這個方向上來研擬對於產創條例進行必要的修正只要符合這個部分他只要轉型現有的研發的這個都有好那最後呢因為主席站起來我先講要求第一個就剛剛已經提了一個原來你們就剛剛所要求的提出一個書面包的本席第二個本席往前看那一頁本席在上週就提出了一個無人載具產業創建特別條例的草案 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
588.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
603.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
這個創建特別條例呢 不是產創條例因為是一個暫行的條例它只有期限的 本期是一定五年就可以 所以要特別條例它是創建一次性的 不是產業創新要持續性的但是也有認為啊 既然要去開創這個無人載具的產業應該從長期納入產業創新條例市長你的看法怎麼樣 你是認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
611.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
636.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
為了要開創一個無人載具的產業我們是用一次性的特別法去創建它還是納入到持續性的作用法讓廠創條例把它納入範圍目前的法規主要是可以適用的話因為產業的發展非常快我們盡量來輔導廠商那如果是有需要特別的這個法制的來協助的部分我們經濟部在做研究我跟你說一個差別啦如果放在廠創條例的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
637.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
660.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
涉及到其他部位的作用法你們要排除呢你們要透過行政院內部很長的時間去協商如果是給你們經濟部主管這個特別條例你們就可以用一個這樣有期限的特別條例在該期限內排除其他對於無人機無人載具產業所受到限制的空域海域的傳播法還有民用航空法可以做必要的暫時的解除這樣的束縛 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
661.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
684.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
但是等到特別條例屆滿之後再回歸到各目的世界主管機關的做法去管理這是一個參考的方向但是為了尊重經濟部所以我希望說下一頁您可以承諾將我們目前無人載具相關的產業納入產業創新條例在一個月內提出一個書名報告給本席嗎當然我希望你們參考本席的特別條例的草案遵照辦理好謝謝好 超時 |