| IVOD_ID |
169508 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/169508 |
| 日期 |
2026-05-20 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
院會-11-5-10 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期第10次會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
10 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
院會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期第10次會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-05-20T17:55:37+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-05-20T18:11:35+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:15:58 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/e8e93c7ebde79baeda887c46c75a290e7568857f6f1e6f3b10feea80fe6987ffd23dda6d107b523c5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
王鴻薇 |
| 委員發言時間 |
17:55:37 - 18:11:35 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-05-20T14:30:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
第11屆第5會期第10次會議（事由：一、討論事項：本院台灣民眾黨黨團，建請院會作成決議：「本（第5）會期延長會期至115年7月31日止。」是否有當？請公決案。二、對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢。三、總統彈劾案事項。（5月19日上午）四、「保衛國家安全及強化不對稱戰力計畫第一批發價書採購特別預算案籌編相關事項」專案報告。（5月19日下午）五、行政院院長、主計長、財政部部長、國防部部長及相關部會首長列席報告保衛國家安全及強化不對稱戰力計畫第一批發價書採購特別預算案編製經過並備質詢。【如經本院同意行政院籌編特別預算案則於5月20日(三)下午加開】六、5月15日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。） |
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何局長淑萍 |
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何局長淑萍 |
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4.039 |
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4.179 |
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黃委員好 |
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24.398 |
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45.607 |
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院長部長辛苦了院長我想在軍購特別預算之前我先問一個民生的議題因為今天台電董事長曾董事長提到就是因為現在美伊戰爭還沒有結束那現在台電因為大家都知道中油跟台電都在虧損中 |
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46.787 |
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49.07 |
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所以說10月份有調漲電價的壓力我想請問10月份會有調漲電價的可能嗎 |
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62.791 |
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80.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
跟委員報告台電因為吸收了很多LNG的這個漲價的這個負擔所以他財務狀況確實是我們值得檢討我們知道中油的狀況其實也吸收了很多的台電是也吸收了台電發電這部分是台電吸收的那中油是民生用品這個這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
83.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
98.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
行政院的立場是在這個時候戰爭還在情勢未明當中我們以穩定民生為優先但是電價漲不漲如何調整是省議委員會那我認為省議委員會也會觀測到整個社會的需求跟民生的穩定 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
98.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
118.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
具體的建議第一因為現在本疫戰爭還沒有結束所以為什麼我們現在包含油價也在動漲之中那我覺得在沒有結束之前不宜去談到說未來可能調漲電價第二尤其也發生了台電最近在改他的Logo的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
119.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
130.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
也引起很多社會大眾的疑慮認為台電在虧損的狀況之下還有錢去換LOGO在這樣的疑慮之下我也認為不宜來談到調漲電價以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
138.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
156.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
院長部長在這次的川習會有關於對台軍售成為熱門的話題那當然剛才院長也好部長也好都強調這美國對台政策沒有改變但是我想請問一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
157.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
182.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
美台之間的關係最重要的就是台灣關係法以及在雷根總統時代對台灣的六項保證這個過去大家將近半世紀都沒有被打破的可是在這一次的川習會裡面談到了對台軍售我想請問院長這個部分有沒有違反 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
183.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
197.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
原來台美之間六項保證裡面的其中一項也就是我們有關於美國對台的軍售是不會向中華人民共和國來談論或徵詢意見的 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
200.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
217.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
這是保證六項當中很重要的一項保證但我們從川普總統這一次的講話當中也沒有直接的看到對這個保證的一個改變反倒是在美國國會立場裡面他的各黨團他的一個課內議員都提到要 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
218.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
219.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
美國政府遵守1992年的這個六項保證 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
248.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
262.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
我們也必須非常清楚的讓美方知道也就是說今天對台軍售不宜超越這個六項保證裡面長期將近半世紀以來的一個約定 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
264.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
287.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
我們是不是也可以對美方來做這樣的強調我們會經由各方努力但我們剛剛我說的是經由美國國會的一些領袖對1982年的這個六項保證是有正面希望美方政府還是要繼續遵守所以我們到現在沒有聽到因為如果這個保證不能夠遵守的話那就會出現破口啊所以我們現在沒有聽到要 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
292.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
311.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
我請問一下院長跟部長因為剛才王定宇委員也問其實很多委員都有問也就是第二階段的美國對台軍售當然因為現在川普沒有講時間那麼未來三個月內有沒有可能 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
312.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
319.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
能夠川普核定第二階段的對台軍售三個月內有沒有可能 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
321.234 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
347.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
我們的評估跟委員報告我想首先第一個川普在這個空軍一號上面的發言裡面你又可以看得到第一個他說是中國主動提起那他才跟他進行討論然後第二個他說是由他做成決定而不是要跟中方然後爭取中方的同意對 他有強調是他來決定但是他們確實談到這個議題甚至提到說他要跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
348.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
368.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
台灣這邊做這個商議所以我想跟美台之間的軍購本來就是在美台之間來進行商議這個我想還是被維持住那我們認為對台政策的沒有改變這句話有兩個重要的意向第一個就是台海的和平穩定的這個現狀是美國的核心利益 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
369.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
397.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
美國不希望看到任何的戰事在這裡發生那這其中第二個依照台灣關係法的規範美國長期以提供自我防衛的能力來作為建構台海和平穩定的我在這邊就沒有講到說有關於他有違反台灣關係法的這個的這個所以我們認為還是但是有關於這一次其實我知道我們現在我們的政府是全力希望能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
398.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
412.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
我講的好聽一點是來安定民心講的難聽一點是粉飾太平因為院長部長如果你們去看外媒的報導根本不是我們所想的這麼一回事 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
414.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
440.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
紐約時報甚至直接說這次的川習會是川普送給習近平的一個大禮你可以看到很多外媒在整個的評估這次川習會其實他們的疑慮是很深的那至於我剛才講三個月內有沒有可能部長你們的評估我們會透過各方面的努力然後我們也持續跟美國的相關我為什麼講三個月因為呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
442.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
466.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
九月份習近平又要回訪美國那同樣的狀況會再來一次如果三個月內我們沒有辦法取得第二階段的這個軍售的話那很可能又受到九月份再一次的川習會的影響好 那我想接下來我是要比較關心的就是我們這一段時間裡面一直在談有關於這個軍購的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
470.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
492.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
那麼這兩天我們部長有講F16V是我們國人非常關心的你說九月份第一架會來台灣這是你昨天的說法嘛對不對我事實上之前在外交官委員會也已經說過了好那請問一下九月份只來一架嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
493.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
516.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
不是就是說我們希望就陸續從九月份開始陸續交機因為我剛剛講說第一架我想說這什麼意思它是展示品嗎不是只有一架就是說是陸續來交機這個其實大家非常關切因為到目前為止本來應該今年66架都應該全數交機的 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
519.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
545.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
那另外再請教一下MK48重型魚雷這個部分因為也有嚴重的延宕本來也是今年應該完全交運那請問一下如果是今年的話大概可以來幾枚呢我們現在因為這個合約商重啟產線的進度落後交運的期程會調整到這個117年 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
547.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
557.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
所以今年不會來?今年沒有了?我們教育的期程在跟美黃商議,但是我想應該是會在117年才能夠開始教育 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
558.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
584.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
好所以這個他的延宕的情形更更嚴重也就是說他原來規劃是到今年底就要全數完成交運的然後呢delaydelay到117年好再做全數的交運好那現在再delay變成117年才可以開始交貨是不是意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
584.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
596.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
原規劃是115年全數獲得現在是要改成從117年開始交易117年才可以開始交貨所以我們今年看不到 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
597.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
625.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
是不是好再來好這個又是一個這個這個非常嚴當情形非常嚴重再來海空號他不在對美方的採購裡面但是請問一下海空號你們預計是六七月會交件可是現在已經五月了現在就已經五月所以部長你掌握的時程海空號到底什麼時候可以交件他已經delay |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
626.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
647.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
將近半年 我想我們從來沒有一個預定的一個說哪一月份要交件我們要的就是一個在安全跟合乎需求的一個品質下 當然安全最重要所以相關的驗測那我們也看到了就是說這個潛水潛航已經進行了多次那超雷的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
648.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
667.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
試測也已經完成了那我們接下來還會再陸續依照相關的這個驗測的程序書的要求來進行完成驗測海關號時間仍然不確定交建期間交建的時程仍然不確定我想台船跟海軍都有希望能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
668.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
696.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
能夠盡快的完成這些但是我從國安部的立場我們從安全跟品質的要求之下我們要認為才能夠完成才能夠進行交件我剛才提到的幾項都是你們自己承認言當而且事實上現在外界非常關心的也就是說在我們整個的軍購的進度裡面我們希望就是該買的要買該付的錢要付但是該交的貨也要交貨另外一個議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
697.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
718.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
就最近他討論無人機我覺得不要把這種隨便的大帽子又扣在在野黨好像在野黨不要無人機杯葛無人機事實上我自己在內政委員會到目前為止內政部也採購很多的無人機那我們都是全數的支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
719.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
745.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
因為它不管是海巡的部分也好或者是它是警用的救災用的或者是消防使用可是問題是在無人機的採購裡面或者是在無人機反制系統採購裡面最近又發生大家的質疑最近網路熱議的一個就是它的規模 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
746.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
746.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
這合約規範啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
763.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
783.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
都按照合約規範按照合約規範他去年底就應該完成交機了交這個反制系統按照合約規定他應該去年就已經完成了你到今年六月再給他考一次就有合約規範的那個法案那相關的這些驗測的幾次這個都也是合約規範所律定的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
784.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
799.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
這個部長你不用太激動因為有關於創未來事實上不管是媒體報導也好或者業界的討論也好甚至有人直指說因為創未來可以直通顧部長的辦公室 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
801.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
826.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
那我就想請問從未來在113年的3月他被檢察院糾正國防部院長可能不知道檢察院糾正國防部是什麼呢因為當時這個是有很多的反制系統一共四家在做然後因為沒有辦法整合 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
827.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
853.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
結果國防部這是監察院的糾正文國防部明知廠商技術能力不足堅持辦理研究案而且直接指定創未來去整合其他家的系統可是問題是另外三家都沒有授權書給創未來所以這個事情告到監察院監察院在113年3月22號提出糾正 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
857.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
878.734 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
結果114年1月國防部就以9.8億的無人機反制系統讓創未來得標讓創未來得標而這個得標第一次是流標的第一次流標因為不足三家為什麼呢因為其他家不會來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
880.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
896.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
因為他們看得太清楚了因為整個的有四家在做系統的開發結果讓創未來一家去做整合而其他三家是不願意把授權輸給創未來但是國防部仍然指定創未來繼續來做 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
897.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
916.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
被監察院糾正之後繼續的標案還是給創未來9.8億所以我要講的是我們過去有這麼多的國防的標案不管是茶葉的茶葉商也好 賣馬桶的 賣鞋子的 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
917.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
945.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
更何況這些不管是無人機也好或者無人機的反制系統也好我同意剛才部長講的反制系統重不重要?非常非常的重要可是如果的程序超凡的是連媒體都大幅的報道非常多次而你們國防部完全不理不睬這當然理念大家都會覺得有毛病所以不許我們父民支持無人機才夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
947.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
957.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
正常的無人機採購 應該的無人機採購我們都全力支持但是我們不支持像這樣一臉一點重重的表愛 好不好 |
| transcript.gazette[0].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[0].start |
2026-05-20T17:55:37+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[0].end |
2026-05-20T17:55:38.346333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].text |
好，謝謝主席。 |
| transcript.gazette[0].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[1].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[1].start |
2026-05-20T17:55:38.346333+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[1].end |
2026-05-20T17:55:39.692667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].text |
請卓院長，還有國防部顧部長。 |
| transcript.gazette[1].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[2].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[2].start |
2026-05-20T17:55:39.692667+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[2].end |
2026-05-20T17:55:41.039000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].text |
麻煩再請卓院長、國防部長備詢。 |
| transcript.gazette[2].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[3].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[3].start |
2026-05-20T17:55:41.039000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[3].end |
2026-05-20T17:55:41.159000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].text |
王委員好。 |
| transcript.gazette[3].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[4].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[4].start |
2026-05-20T17:56:01.398000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[4].end |
2026-05-20T17:56:02.699000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].text |
院長、部長辛苦了。 |
| transcript.gazette[4].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[5].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[5].start |
2026-05-20T17:56:04.739000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[5].end |
2026-05-20T17:56:24.408000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].text |
院長，在軍購特別預算之前，我先問一個民生議題，今天台電曾董事長提到，因為現在美伊戰爭還沒有結束，大家都知道中油跟台電都在虧損中，所以10月份有調漲電價的壓力。 |
| transcript.gazette[5].quality |
0.971 |
| transcript.gazette[6].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[6].start |
2026-05-20T17:56:24.989000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[6].end |
2026-05-20T17:56:26.070000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].text |
對不起，龔部長也請上台，請問10月份會有調漲電價的可能嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[6].quality |
0.583 |
| transcript.gazette[7].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[7].start |
2026-05-20T17:56:39.791000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[7].end |
2026-05-20T17:56:47.678000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].text |
跟委員報告，台電因為吸收了很多LNG漲價的負擔，所以財務狀況確實值得我們檢討…… |
| transcript.gazette[7].quality |
0.917 |
| transcript.gazette[8].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[8].start |
2026-05-20T17:56:47.678000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[8].end |
2026-05-20T17:56:50.840000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].text |
我們知道中油的狀況，其實也吸收了很多。 |
| transcript.gazette[8].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[9].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[9].start |
2026-05-20T17:56:52.542000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[9].end |
2026-05-20T17:56:57.366000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].text |
中油吸收了，台電也吸收了，發電的部分是台電吸收的，中油是吸收民生用品部分。 |
| transcript.gazette[9].quality |
0.636 |
| transcript.gazette[10].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[10].start |
2026-05-20T17:57:00.008000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[10].end |
2026-05-20T17:57:15.053000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].text |
行政院的立場，是戰爭情勢還未明當中，我們以穩定民生為優先，但是電價漲不漲、如何調整，是審議委員會的權責，我認為審議委員會也會觀測到整個社會的需求面跟民生的穩定。 |
| transcript.gazette[10].quality |
0.904 |
| transcript.gazette[11].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[11].start |
2026-05-20T17:57:15.533000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[11].end |
2026-05-20T17:57:30.122000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].text |
好，我具體建議，第一，因為現在美伊戰爭還沒有結束，所以包含油價也在凍漲之中，我覺得在戰爭沒有結束之前，不宜談到未來可能調漲電價。 |
| transcript.gazette[11].quality |
0.877 |
| transcript.gazette[12].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[12].start |
2026-05-20T17:57:30.122000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[12].end |
2026-05-20T17:57:47.311000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].text |
第二，尤其最近也發生了台電要改logo的事情，引起社會大眾很多疑慮，認為台電在虧損的狀況之下，還有錢去換logo，在這樣的疑慮之下，我也認為不宜談到調漲電價，以上。 |
| transcript.gazette[12].quality |
0.838 |
| transcript.gazette[13].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[13].start |
2026-05-20T17:57:47.311000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[13].end |
2026-05-20T17:57:51.523000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].text |
我了解。 |
| transcript.gazette[13].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[14].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[14].start |
2026-05-20T17:57:51.523000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[14].end |
2026-05-20T17:57:55.735000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].text |
好，龔部長可以先回座，謝謝。 |
| transcript.gazette[14].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[15].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[15].start |
2026-05-20T17:57:55.735000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[15].end |
2026-05-20T17:58:54.772000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].text |
院長、部長，在這次的川習會中，有關於對臺軍售成為熱門話題，當然剛才院長也好，部長也好，都強調美國對臺政策沒有改變，但是我想請問，美臺之間的關係最重要的就是臺灣關係法，以及在雷根總統時代對臺灣的六項保證，這個在過去大概將近半世紀都沒有被打破，可是在這一次的川習會談到了對臺軍售，我想請問院長，這個部分有沒有違反原來臺美之間六項保證裡的其中一項，也就是有關於美國對臺軍售，是不會向中華人民共和國來談論或徵詢意見的？ |
| transcript.gazette[15].quality |
0.984 |
| transcript.gazette[16].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[16].start |
2026-05-20T17:58:57.113000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[16].end |
2026-05-20T17:59:16.775000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].text |
是，這是六項保證當中很重要的一項保證，我們從川普總統這一次的講話當中，也沒有直接看到對這個保證的改變，反倒是美國國會的立場，他的各黨團以及Khanna議員都提到，要美國政府遵守1992年的這個六項保證，倒是有這樣的聲音，正面的是這樣子。 |
| transcript.gazette[16].quality |
0.743 |
| transcript.gazette[17].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[17].start |
2026-05-20T17:59:16.775000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[17].end |
2026-05-20T17:59:31.044500+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].text |
為什麼呢？ |
| transcript.gazette[17].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[18].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[18].start |
2026-05-20T17:59:31.044500+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[18].end |
2026-05-20T17:59:45.314000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].text |
為什麼美國國會要特別提及？ |
| transcript.gazette[18].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[19].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[19].start |
2026-05-20T17:59:45.314000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[19].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:04.485000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].text |
因為包含很多外媒，或者關心臺美關係的專家、學者、智庫，都提出了這個疑慮，也就是在川習會提及有關對臺軍售，事實上是違反對臺的六項保證，我覺得在這一點上，我們也必須非常清楚地讓美方知道，今天對臺軍售不宜超越這六項保證裡面長期將近半世紀以來的約定，我們是不是也可以對美方來做這樣的強調？ |
| transcript.gazette[19].quality |
0.473 |
| transcript.gazette[20].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[20].start |
2026-05-20T18:00:04.485000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[20].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:05.726000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].text |
我們會經由各方來努力。 |
| transcript.gazette[20].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[21].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[21].start |
2026-05-20T18:00:06.046000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[21].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:15.514000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].text |
但剛剛我說的是，經由美國國會的一些領袖對1982年的六項保證是有正面希望美方政府還是要繼續遵守。當然。 |
| transcript.gazette[21].quality |
0.955 |
| transcript.gazette[22].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[22].start |
2026-05-20T18:00:16.495000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[22].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:17.456000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].text |
所以我們到現在沒有聽到要破壞這個…… |
| transcript.gazette[22].quality |
0.688 |
| transcript.gazette[23].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[23].start |
2026-05-20T18:00:17.676000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[23].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:22.880000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].text |
因為如果這個保證不能夠遵守的話，那就會出現破口啊！ |
| transcript.gazette[23].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[24].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[24].start |
2026-05-20T18:00:22.880000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[24].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:29.051000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].text |
所以我們現在沒有聽到不繼續這六項保證的任何直接的聲音，是沒有，反倒正面的是希望美方繼續遵守。 |
| transcript.gazette[24].quality |
0.233 |
| transcript.gazette[25].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[25].start |
2026-05-20T18:00:29.051000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[25].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:54.540000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].text |
我請問一下院長、部長，因為剛才王定宇委員也問，其實很多委員都有問，也就是第二階段的美國對臺軍售，當然因為現在川普沒有講時間，那麼未來3個月內有沒有可能川普能夠核定第二階段的對臺軍售？ |
| transcript.gazette[25].quality |
0.976 |
| transcript.gazette[26].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[26].start |
2026-05-20T18:00:55.222000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[26].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:55.985000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].text |
3個月內有沒有可能？ |
| transcript.gazette[26].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[27].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[27].start |
2026-05-20T18:00:58.234000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[27].end |
2026-05-20T18:00:58.774000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].text |
我們的評估？部長…… |
| transcript.gazette[27].quality |
0.714 |
| transcript.gazette[28].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[28].start |
2026-05-20T18:01:00.155000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[28].end |
2026-05-20T18:01:13.220000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].text |
跟委員報告，首先第一個，川普在空軍一號上面的發言裡面，你可以看得到：第一個，他說是中國主動提起，他才跟他進行討論。 |
| transcript.gazette[28].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[29].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[29].start |
2026-05-20T18:01:13.740000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[29].end |
2026-05-20T18:01:19.602000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].text |
第二個，他說是由他做成決定，而不是要跟中方，然後徵詢中方的同意。 |
| transcript.gazette[29].quality |
0.929 |
| transcript.gazette[30].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[30].start |
2026-05-20T18:01:19.662000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[30].end |
2026-05-20T18:01:22.803000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].text |
對，他有強調是他來決定，但是他們確實談到這個議題。 |
| transcript.gazette[30].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[31].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[31].start |
2026-05-20T18:01:22.803000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[31].end |
2026-05-20T18:01:28.286000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].text |
第三個，他甚至提到他要跟臺灣商議。 |
| transcript.gazette[31].quality |
0.733 |
| transcript.gazette[32].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[32].start |
2026-05-20T18:01:28.286000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[32].end |
2026-05-20T18:01:34.851000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].text |
所以我想美臺之間的軍購本來就是在美臺之間來進行商議，這個我想還是被維持住。 |
| transcript.gazette[32].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[33].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[33].start |
2026-05-20T18:01:35.812000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[33].end |
2026-05-20T18:01:48.380000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].text |
我們認為對臺政策沒有改變這句話有兩個重要的意涵，第一個，臺海和平穩定的現狀是美國的核心利益，美國不希望看到任何戰事在這裡發生。 |
| transcript.gazette[33].quality |
0.983 |
| transcript.gazette[34].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[34].start |
2026-05-20T18:01:49.661000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[34].end |
2026-05-20T18:01:59.446000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].text |
第二個，依照臺灣關係法的規範，美國長期以提供自我防衛的能力來作為建構臺海和平穩定的基石。 |
| transcript.gazette[34].quality |
0.951 |
| transcript.gazette[35].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[35].start |
2026-05-20T18:01:59.586000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[35].end |
2026-05-20T18:02:03.449000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].text |
我在這邊就沒有講到有關他有違反臺灣關係法裡面的約定。 |
| transcript.gazette[35].quality |
0.84 |
| transcript.gazette[36].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[36].start |
2026-05-20T18:02:05.210000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[36].end |
2026-05-20T18:02:06.490000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].text |
所以我們認為還是…… |
| transcript.gazette[36].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[37].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[37].start |
2026-05-20T18:02:06.971000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[37].end |
2026-05-20T18:02:45.203000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].text |
但是有關於這一次其實我知道現在我們的政府是全力希望能夠……我講得好聽一點是安定民心，講得難聽一點是粉飾太平，院長、部長，如果你們去看外媒的報導，根本不是我們所想的這麼一回事，紐約時報甚至直接說，這次川習會是川普送給習近平的一個大禮，你可以看到很多外媒在評估這次川習會，其實他們的疑慮是很深的。 |
| transcript.gazette[37].quality |
0.985 |
| transcript.gazette[38].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[38].start |
2026-05-20T18:02:46.044000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[38].end |
2026-05-20T18:02:47.924000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].text |
至於我剛才講3個月內有沒有可能？ |
| transcript.gazette[38].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[39].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[39].start |
2026-05-20T18:02:48.404000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[39].end |
2026-05-20T18:02:49.825000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].text |
部長，你們的評估？ |
| transcript.gazette[39].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[40].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[40].start |
2026-05-20T18:02:51.185000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[40].end |
2026-05-20T18:02:55.947000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].text |
我們會透過各方面的努力，我們也持續跟美國相關的…… |
| transcript.gazette[40].quality |
0.955 |
| transcript.gazette[41].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[41].start |
2026-05-20T18:02:55.947000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[41].end |
2026-05-20T18:02:57.008000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].text |
好，我為什麼講3個月？ |
| transcript.gazette[41].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[42].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[42].start |
2026-05-20T18:02:57.408000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[42].end |
2026-05-20T18:03:17.764000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].text |
因為9月份習近平又要回訪美國，同樣的狀況會再來一次，如果3個月內我們沒有辦法取得第二階段軍售的話，很可能又受到9月份再一次川習會的影響。 |
| transcript.gazette[42].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[43].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[43].start |
2026-05-20T18:03:17.764000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[43].end |
2026-05-20T18:03:43.318000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].text |
好，接下來我比較關心的就是我們這一段時間裡面一直在談有關於軍購的問題，這兩天部長有講，F-16V是我們國人非常關心的，你說9月份第一架會來臺灣，這是你昨天的說法，對不對？ |
| transcript.gazette[43].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[44].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[44].start |
2026-05-20T18:03:43.318000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[44].end |
2026-05-20T18:03:46.300000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].text |
我事實上之前在外交及國防委員會也已經說過了。 |
| transcript.gazette[44].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[45].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[45].start |
2026-05-20T18:03:47.281000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[45].end |
2026-05-20T18:03:49.342000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].text |
請問一下9月份只來一架嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[45].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[46].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[46].start |
2026-05-20T18:03:50.448000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[46].end |
2026-05-20T18:03:56.830000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].text |
不是，我們希望陸續，陸續從9月份開始。 |
| transcript.gazette[46].quality |
0.867 |
| transcript.gazette[47].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[47].start |
2026-05-20T18:03:56.830000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[47].end |
2026-05-20T18:03:57.830000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].text |
9月份開始交機？ |
| transcript.gazette[47].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[48].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[48].start |
2026-05-20T18:03:57.070000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[48].end |
2026-05-20T18:03:59.150000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].text |
陸續交機。 |
| transcript.gazette[48].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[49].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[49].start |
2026-05-20T18:03:59.150000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[49].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:02.531000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].text |
開始交機，因為你說第一架，我想這什麼意思？ |
| transcript.gazette[49].quality |
0.722 |
| transcript.gazette[50].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[50].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:02.851000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[50].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:04.971000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].text |
它是展示品嗎？ |
| transcript.gazette[50].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[51].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[51].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:04.971000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[51].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:05.971000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].text |
只來一架？ |
| transcript.gazette[51].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[52].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[52].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:05.971000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[52].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:06.971000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].text |
會陸續來。 |
| transcript.gazette[52].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[53].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[53].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:04.971000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[53].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:09.052000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].text |
不是只有一架，也就是陸續來交機。 |
| transcript.gazette[53].quality |
0.929 |
| transcript.gazette[54].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[54].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:09.052000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[54].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:13.873000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].text |
這個其實大家非常關切，因為到目前為止，本來今年66架都應該全數交機。 |
| transcript.gazette[54].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[55].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[55].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:16.714000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[55].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:33.441000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].text |
另外再請教一下MK-48重型魚雷，這個部分因為也有嚴重的延宕，本來也是今年應該完全交運，請問一下如果是今年的話，大概可以來幾枚呢？ |
| transcript.gazette[55].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[56].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[56].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:34.782000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[56].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:42.505000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].text |
我們現在因為合約商重啟產線的進度落後，交運期程會調整到117年。 |
| transcript.gazette[56].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[57].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[57].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:44.719000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[57].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:47.461000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].text |
所以今年不會來？ |
| transcript.gazette[57].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[58].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[58].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:47.461000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[58].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:48.042000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].text |
今年沒有了？ |
| transcript.gazette[58].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[59].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[59].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:48.662000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[59].end |
2026-05-20T18:04:54.427000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].text |
我們交運的期程在跟美方商議，但是我想應該是會在117年才能夠開始交運。 |
| transcript.gazette[59].quality |
0.833 |
| transcript.gazette[60].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[60].start |
2026-05-20T18:04:55.629000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[60].end |
2026-05-20T18:05:21.122000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].text |
好，所以它延宕的情形更嚴重，也就是說它原來規劃是到今年底就要全數完成交運，但後來delay到117年做全數的交運，現在再delay變成117年才可以開始交貨，是不是這個意思？ |
| transcript.gazette[60].quality |
0.92 |
| transcript.gazette[61].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[61].start |
2026-05-20T18:05:21.765000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[61].end |
2026-05-20T18:05:24.287000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].text |
原規劃是115年全數獲得。對。 |
| transcript.gazette[61].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[62].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[62].start |
2026-05-20T18:05:25.688000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[62].end |
2026-05-20T18:05:28.511000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].text |
現在是要改成從117年開始交運。 |
| transcript.gazette[62].quality |
0.917 |
| transcript.gazette[63].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[63].start |
2026-05-20T18:05:30.132000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[63].end |
2026-05-20T18:05:34.603000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].text |
117年才可以開始交貨，所以我們今年看不到，是不是？對。 |
| transcript.gazette[63].quality |
0.952 |
| transcript.gazette[64].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[64].start |
2026-05-20T18:05:36.004000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[64].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:00.600000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].text |
再來，這又是一個延宕情形非常嚴重的，海鯤號不在對美方的採購裡面，但是請問一下，海鯤號你們預計是6、7月會交艦，可是現在已經5月了，所以部長，你掌握的時程，海鯤號到底什麼時候可以交艦？ |
| transcript.gazette[64].quality |
0.897 |
| transcript.gazette[65].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[65].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:02.080000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[65].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:04.335000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].text |
它已經delay將近半年之久。 |
| transcript.gazette[65].quality |
0.786 |
| transcript.gazette[66].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[66].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:04.555000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[66].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:14.501000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].text |
我想我們從來沒有預定說哪個月份要交艦，我們要的就是在安全跟合乎作戰需求的品質之下…… |
| transcript.gazette[66].quality |
0.872 |
| transcript.gazette[67].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[67].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:14.901000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[67].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:15.882000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].text |
當然啊，當然安全最重要。 |
| transcript.gazette[67].quality |
0.7 |
| transcript.gazette[68].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[68].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:16.482000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[68].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:33.652000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].text |
來進行相關的驗測，我們也看到了潛水潛航已經進行了多次，操雷的試射也已經完成了，我們接下來還會再陸續依照相關的驗測程序書的要求…… |
| transcript.gazette[68].quality |
0.915 |
| transcript.gazette[69].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[69].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:35.172000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[69].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:35.813000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].text |
所以時間仍然不確定…… |
| transcript.gazette[69].quality |
0.778 |
| transcript.gazette[70].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[70].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:35.813000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[70].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:36.813000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].text |
來完成驗測。 |
| transcript.gazette[70].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[71].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[71].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:36.473000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[71].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:39.675000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].text |
所以海鯤號的交艦時程仍然不確定？ |
| transcript.gazette[71].quality |
0.533 |
| transcript.gazette[72].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[72].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:39.995000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[72].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:52.501000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].text |
我想台船跟海軍都希望能夠儘快完成這些，但是我從國防部的立場，我們在安全跟品質的要求之下，我們要…… |
| transcript.gazette[72].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[73].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[73].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:52.501000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[73].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:55.022000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].text |
好，所以我剛才提到的幾項…… |
| transcript.gazette[73].quality |
0.091 |
| transcript.gazette[74].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[74].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:55.022000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[74].end |
2026-05-20T18:06:55.523000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].text |
才能夠進行交艦。 |
| transcript.gazette[74].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[75].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[75].start |
2026-05-20T18:06:56.343000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[75].end |
2026-05-20T18:07:12.935000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].text |
我剛才提到的幾項都是你們自己承認延宕，而且是現在外界非常關心的，也就是說，在我們整個軍購的進度上，我們希望該買的要買、該付的錢要付，但是該交的貨也要交貨。 |
| transcript.gazette[75].quality |
0.943 |
| transcript.gazette[76].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[76].start |
2026-05-20T18:07:12.935000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[76].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:02.136000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].text |
另外一個議題，最近大家在討論無人機，我覺得不要隨便把這種大帽子又扣在在野黨頭上，好像在野黨不要無人機、杯葛無人機，事實上，我自己在內政委員會，到目前為止，內政部也採購很多的無人機，我們都是全數支持，不管是海巡的部分也好，或者是警用的、救災用的或者是消防使用，但問題是在無人機的採購裡面，或者是在無人機反制系統採購裡面，最近大家的質疑、網路熱議的就是，標案規模高達9.8億的無人機反制系統，結果兩次的測試都是0分，你們國防部還繼續給它補考的機會，讓它6月份還可以補考。 |
| transcript.gazette[76].quality |
0.731 |
| transcript.gazette[77].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[77].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:03.056000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[77].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:21.679000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].text |
這是合約規範，都按照合約規範。 |
| transcript.gazette[77].quality |
0.923 |
| transcript.gazette[78].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[78].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:21.679000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[78].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:33.322000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].text |
按照合約規範，他去年底就應該完成交付反制系統，按照合約規定，他應該去年就已經完成了，你到今年6月再給他考一次試…… |
| transcript.gazette[78].quality |
0.96 |
| transcript.gazette[79].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[79].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:33.402000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[79].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:34.422000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].text |
他沒有辦法完成交機的合約規範，就有合約規範的罰款…… |
| transcript.gazette[79].quality |
0.304 |
| transcript.gazette[80].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[80].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:35.163000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[80].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:35.363000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].text |
這個案子…… |
| transcript.gazette[80].quality |
0.5 |
| transcript.gazette[81].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[81].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:36.843000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[81].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:40.764000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].text |
有關驗測幾次的部分，也都是合約規範所律定的。 |
| transcript.gazette[81].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[82].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[82].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:41.444000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[82].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:44.869000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].text |
部長你不用太激動…… |
| transcript.gazette[82].quality |
0.75 |
| transcript.gazette[83].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[83].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:45.290000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[83].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[83].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:46.151000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[83].text |
我沒有激動。 |
| transcript.gazette[83].quality |
0.4 |
| transcript.gazette[84].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[84].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:46.151000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[84].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[84].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:56.606000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[84].text |
因為有關於創未來科技，事實上，不管是媒體報導也好或者業界的討論也好，甚至有人直指創未來可以直通顧部長的辦公室…… |
| transcript.gazette[84].quality |
0.961 |
| transcript.gazette[85].speaker |
顧部長立雄 |
| transcript.gazette[85].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:56.606000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[85].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[85].end |
2026-05-20T18:08:58.548000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[85].text |
我從來沒有跟他們…… |
| transcript.gazette[85].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[86].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[86].start |
2026-05-20T18:08:58.548000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[86].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[86].end |
2026-05-20T18:09:13.858000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[86].text |
我就想請問，有關創未來，在113年的3月，監察院糾正國防部，院長可能不知道，監察院糾正國防部什麼呢？ |
| transcript.gazette[86].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[87].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[87].start |
2026-05-20T18:09:14.598000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[87].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[87].end |
2026-05-20T18:09:46.049000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[87].text |
因為當時有很多反制系統，一共四家在做，因為沒有辦法整合，這是監察院的糾正文，國防部明知廠商技術能力不足，堅持辦理研究案，而且直接指定創未來整合其他家的系統，可是問題是另外三家都沒有授權書給創未來。 |
| transcript.gazette[87].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[88].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[88].start |
2026-05-20T18:09:46.529000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[88].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[88].end |
2026-05-20T18:10:14.173000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[88].text |
這件事情告到監察院，監察院在113年3月22號提出糾正，結果114年1月國防部就以9.8億的無人機反制系統讓創未來得標，而這個得標的第一次是流標的，因為不足三家，為什麼呢？ |
| transcript.gazette[88].quality |
0.971 |
| transcript.gazette[89].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[89].start |
2026-05-20T18:10:14.874000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[89].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[89].end |
2026-05-20T18:10:40.152000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[89].text |
因為其他家不會來，他們看得太清楚了，整個有四家在做系統開發，結果讓創未來一家去做整合，而其他三家是不願意把授權書給創未來，但是國防部仍然指定創未來繼續做，被監察院糾正之後，繼續的標案還是給創未來，9.8億。 |
| transcript.gazette[89].quality |
0.989 |
| transcript.gazette[90].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[90].start |
2026-05-20T18:10:42.334000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[90].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[90].end |
2026-05-20T18:11:00.643000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[90].text |
我要講的是，我們過去有這麼多的國防標案，不管是茶葉商也好，還有賣馬桶的、賣鞋子的，更何況無論是無人機也好，或者無人機的反制系統也好，我同意剛才部長講的，反制系統重不重要？ |
| transcript.gazette[90].quality |
0.947 |
| transcript.gazette[91].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[91].start |
2026-05-20T18:11:00.663000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[91].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[91].end |
2026-05-20T18:11:04.265000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[91].text |
非常、非常的重要，因為這個主要是要用到離島的，可是如果你們的程序充滿了質疑，連媒體都大幅報導非常多次，而你們國防部完全不理不睬，當然這裡面大家就會覺得有貓膩。 |
| transcript.gazette[91].quality |
0.625 |
| transcript.gazette[92].speaker |
王委員鴻薇 |
| transcript.gazette[92].start |
2026-05-20T18:11:04.485000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[92].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[92].end |
2026-05-20T18:11:34.807000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[92].text |
不是我們不支持無人機採購，正常的無人機採購、應該的無人機採購我們都全力支持，但是我們不支持像這樣裡面疑點重重的標案，好不好？ |
| transcript.gazette[92].quality |
0.842 |
| transcript.gazette[93].speaker |
卓院長榮泰 |
| transcript.gazette[93].start |
2026-05-20T18:11:35.307000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[93].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[93].end |
2026-05-20T18:11:36.735571+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[93].text |
好，謝謝委員。 |
| transcript.gazette[93].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[94].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[94].start |
2026-05-20T18:11:37.035571+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[94].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[94].end |
2026-05-20T18:11:43.892714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[94].text |
謝謝王鴻薇委員的質詢，謝謝卓院長、國防部部長備詢，謝謝。 |
| transcript.gazette[94].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[95].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[95].start |
2026-05-20T18:11:44.192714+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[95].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[95].end |
2026-05-20T18:11:49.621286+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[95].text |
接下來請今天登記最後一位的范雲委員質詢。 |
| transcript.gazette[95].quality |
0 |