| IVOD_ID |
168779 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168779 |
| 日期 |
2026-04-23 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-20-10 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期財政委員會第10次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
10 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期財政委員會第10次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-04-23T09:47:13+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-04-23T09:58:55+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:42 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/a0a6b12795be5442f1c1cc5d0fdaab9c6726ceb1fc879916d3cfaf5c3773194d7fc8a76f1bb69cd85ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
吳秉叡 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:47:13 - 09:58:55 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-04-23T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期財政委員會第10次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請財政部莊部長翠雲、農業部陳部長駿季、衛生福利部石部長崇良、行政院主計總處陳主計長淑姿就「馬鈴薯輸入之邊境管制、檢疫、查驗等機制如何保障國人食品安全，及後市場抽驗預算執行情形」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
二、審查中華民國115年度中央政府總預算案有關主計總處暨審計部、審計部臺北市審計處、審計部新北市審計處、審計部桃園市審計處、審計部臺中市審計處、審計部臺南市審計處、審計部高雄市審計處部分。（僅詢答）
三、審查中華民國115年度中央政府總預算案有關第27款直轄市及縣市政府第3項一般性補助款-財政部主管第1目財政部、第2目國庫署；第13項一般性補助款-其他第1至8目。災害準備金。第二預備金。（僅詢答）
【預算提案截止時間：4月23日（四）下午5時】） |
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主席 麻煩請審計部陳主席 審計長請主席講 審計長 呃 審計長委員好 聲揚早齁我們外交部有捐助一個民主基金會阿 那個捐助的章程的內容你了解嗎 了解 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
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他是為了要主要的目的是因為中共在全世界打壓我們我們有邦交的國家不夠那所以為了要推廣這個外交的工作所以放在國會可以辦一些國會外交所以董事長是本院的院長對不對那他原來捐助成立的目的是為了要推廣民主跟自由嘛那這一次啊台灣中國國民黨的這個黨主席去中國訪問 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
64.833 |
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他申請基金會補助申請基金會補助補助要給補助計畫他申請說明書上面說他是去中國推廣台灣民主自由的理念我看全程的新聞媒體從頭到尾沒有講到台灣沒有講到民主沒有講到自由 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
91.53 |
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106.372 |
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那這樣我想要請教說省進部的立場我們這個補助提一個書面文章所作所為都跟這個書面的表示不相干或是甚至做相反的工作這樣可以申請補助嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
109.204 |
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這個基金會它有一些規定,如果你要申請補助或者足行,都要依照基金會的相關規定來處理。這一個部分,外交部是它的主管機關,外交部在財團法人法裡面,外交部要負責查核。 |
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131.647 |
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156.759 |
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如果有問題外交部要給他一些相當的...是外交部查核不是台灣的這個民主基金會這個組織在查核因為他申請基金他申請480萬是向台灣民主基金會申請喔我現在要問你的就是說他申請的申請書的內容說要去中國推廣台灣的民主自由這個制度給中國了解 |
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157.939 |
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但是我看到整個媒體報導新聞 完全都沒有這些內容我的意思是說 我就是要問你這個問題我的申請 如果有一個人的申請書跟他所作所為完全不相關 甚至背道而馳 |
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176.178 |
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那這個事情基金會應該要怎麼處理呢基金會要根據它整個族型的狀況來先第一段它要審核它要審核完以後才來進行第二階段 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
191.828 |
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197.75 |
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如果他同意或者是他不同意外交部是主管機關也要把關第三段如果這個問題確有那個的時候我們也會督促外交部你要好好的來處理那這個案子報導或者去了解他還沒有辦理核銷作業 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
215.857 |
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229.668 |
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我請教你假設他真的這樣核銷因為現在準的單位現在是本院的院長要當這個基金會的董事長啊那他裡面的董監事如果就給他過了 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
231.4 |
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246.558 |
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假設啦我現在是假設性問題那你審計部最後能有什麼作為我們這一個案子如果他過了那外交部他再次主管機關依照財產法人法所以你意思是說外交部可以跟立法院的 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
247.8 |
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261.378 |
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當院長所主持的民主基金會跟他講說你這個使用的項目跟你的作為跟你事實上你的申請完全不符所以外交部可以跟他講說不可以發嗎這是他是主管機關所以外交部要用公文告訴立法院 |
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262.642 |
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288.192 |
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院長所主導的民主基金會不可以補助是這樣的意思嗎這個是要看他的事實依照他的事實來認定他的事實經過外交部認定有一些瑕疵或者是有一些剛剛講的一些假設的問題那外交部要主管機關要基於他主管機關的監督立場 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
290.113 |
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那外交部 我再問一個繼續假設性的問題外交部如果已經正式發文給民主基金會說這不符合目的結果民主基金會還是硬要補助 那會怎麼樣那你們總計部能有什麼作為我們會依據外交部的一些發文或查核的結果來處理這些相關的賬戶問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
312.961 |
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334.31 |
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相關賬戶問題什麼問題他就是給他假設退一萬部講說真的給他的480萬然後外交部也根據你現在講的原則跟他審核說因為不符合這個目的那也不符合你的作為所以不應該給予補助可是民主基金會仍然要給他補助的時候你們審計部最後能做什麼處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
336.332 |
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355.232 |
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我們會進行要外交部再督促外交部來做處理如果外交部會做適當的處理我們會給外交部相關的那外交部能做什麼樣適當的處理就是他主管機關主管機關問題是那個民主基金會他就覺得他比你大 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
356.776 |
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375.295 |
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我們在立法院 多少人講說我就是比你大我要給你要怎麼樣做壞事人不得到制裁你要去制裁外交部我是因為是假設外交部已經正式跟你回答說這不符合規定你不可以補助那台灣民主基金會仍然要補助 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
376.436 |
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402.793 |
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國家有國家的體制要依照國家的體制那我現在就是要問你國家的體制嘛你們審計部是不是要送監察院還是要移送這個檢調單位處理我是要問你這個啊我要是督促外交部外交部就自然的指責跟他講說這不合法了當然他外交部有不合法但是這個案子堅持在那裡我們審計部當然會去了解啊了解完了以後如果事實就如假設一樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
403.593 |
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430.27 |
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那當然是說有的事我們就會送監察院啊我們就會因為這個如果有不法的我們送檢調啊這個是當然是我們省局部的職責啊中華民國的立法院現在加起來的多數黨立法院的多數黨簡直就是太上皇了你送監察院也沒用了他監察院預算都不給你過監察院的代理院長跟我講說他們很可憐連電梯都沒辦法開因為電費都被刪光了 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
434.515 |
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460.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
親口跟我講的所以現在就是無法無天啦我現在跟你講我們大家講清楚外交部有他的職權他應該去查核那外交部如果已經據實以告跟他講說查核的規矩查核的結果不符合規定不應給予補助這時候有兩種結果有一種就是民主基金會從善逐流嘛那我就不補助另外一種就是民主基金會說不我仍然在補助 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
462.532 |
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472.192 |
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因為我的董監事 我人多啊所以我的董監事仍然要補助那補助了之後你給他送監察院 沒關係啊 監察院等於是被他廢掉了 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
474.404 |
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494.348 |
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所以我來講 我們很厲害啦台灣的國會現在就是 我就是比你大啦就是有人說 我就是比你大國家的體制什麼東西都不重要好 我是要讓你了解說你有可能會面對將來有可能會面對這樣的困境請你回座啦我不是對你回敬我只是說我問的問題該怎麼處理 你要想清楚請回座來 我們請這個 關務署 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
515.516 |
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532.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
現在這個發芽馬鈴薯這個查核標準有沒有變動報告委員是指檢疫的部分檢疫的部分是農委會房間署不是啊你們不是要配合嗎那不然就請農委會跟這樣的衛福部都一起上來大家一起回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
534.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
535.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
制度的改變 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
551.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
578.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
因為馬鈴薯進口有三種一種是種薯進來做種那第二個就是鮮食用的第三個就是用加工用的那過去啊這個鮮食跟加工只要驗到有花芽超過0.5公分或者是有其他這個龍奎鹼超過200ppm在衛福部這邊查到這個的話一律退那目前鮮食的部分還是維持本來的做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
579.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
606.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
那加工的部分如果我們發現在邊境外部發現200ppm以上這個馬上就必須要退那如果他的這個有帶土有8種病蟲害那另外就是他的花芽超過了0.5公分以上的話我們會要求這個推運或者是銷毀不能帶土也不能有病蟲害 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
606.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
629.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
那這一次的改變就是以前整個都退運這一次是不是還要進一步檢驗加工的部分加工的部分對那這個加工的部分標準是不是跟日本的標準相同比日本還嚴因為日本只有驗兩種病蟲害不是啦我是在講那個發芽的部分發芽的部分日本沒有管他不管發芽的部分日本發芽的進口發芽的他也加工對 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
631.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
654.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
因為他們只要美國提出好 那請惠福布回答剛剛講到那個龍奎鹼在發芽的部分產生了這些的有可能產生的這些的有毒物質要怎麼處理這個部分就是其實那個馬來西亞有沒有發芽跟龍奎鹼的濃度也不一定相關所以我們現在就是說我們其實整個檢驗的標準整個實驗的標準全世界一直都沒有標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
654.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
681.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
一直都沒有改變那這個龍奎減200ppm是從107年就訂到現在全世界有沒有一致的標準目前大概加拿大這邊也有採用這樣的標準只有加拿大嗎還有對加拿大日本有沒有日本不驗因為日本生產很多馬鈴薯所以是日本本身也在處理馬鈴薯這個東西國人關心就是有人會利用這個東西Tenny |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
681.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
699.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
要求再要求然後再製造台灣跟美國的緊張然後之後再拿這個東西打說政府無能沒有辦法保護人民的食品安全他們的目的是要講這個這是要做政治操作所以請你們要小心回答請你們一定要把這件事情向國人清楚地澄清好不好好 謝謝 |