| IVOD_ID |
168611 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168611 |
| 日期 |
2026-04-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-19-9 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第9次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
9 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第9次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-04-16T10:33:34+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-04-16T10:41:47+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:08:13 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5c6c6faabdac9c280d1564e81c6ebe1424d82c1ebe87fe24e494fea1324b5f1a071eed9bfd46deff5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
邱志偉 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:33:34 - 10:41:47 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-04-16T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第9次全體委員會議（事由：邀請經濟部部長率台灣電力股份有限公司董事長、國家發展委員會主任委員及農業部部長就「我國再生能源及電網韌性之發展現況、建置進度、容量目標、推動困境、法規障礙及相關改善對策」進行報告，並備質詢。
【4月15日及4月16日二天一次會】） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
2.773 |
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18.343 |
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好 接下來請邱志偉召委質詢好 謝謝主席 是不是先請拱部長然後國會的詹副主委請拱部長 中郵的方董事長方董事長 請 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
22.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
48.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
如果這個荷姆斯海峽持續去封鎖或者每一陣子持續延長的話當然分散游泳很重要比照其他國家的做法韓國他派一個總理大使總統大使去各國去找游他們去沙烏地阿拉伯去哈薩克跟阿曼他們找了2.7億桶的原油全部繞過荷姆斯海峽 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
50.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
78.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
所以避免如果戰爭持續擴大或者持續延長的話我們中油有沒有相關的緊急的購油計畫來分散油源有 我請那個方董來說明一下當然不可諱言那麼中油進口的原油呢原先在戰前呢不是啊 我說我們有沒有這個計畫因為我聲音有限我們有沒有相關的緊急的購油計畫過去韓國是沒有跟沙烏地買喔也沒有跟哈薩克買也沒有跟阿曼買 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
79.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
101.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
為了戰事的關係 他一次買2.1億桶 我們會與仇魔我們的其他的替代油盈就是在非洲 非洲還有澳洲澳洲原先就有 就請他增產而已嘛是是是 類似像這種做法那我們目標 你說從非洲有多少數量的原油可以增加 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
102.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
118.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
我們要買肝原油是一船一船買的我是說你應該是學韓國做法有一個特使去各國去採購去詢問有沒有可能再提供供油比如說像韓國的做法我們就可以借進我是提供給部長做參考 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
120.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
133.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
一定要為武籌謀你們到時候缺油的時候找不到油全世界都在搶油這部分再提醒部長另外2030年你剛剛一直提到說這個一定會達成綠電20%我們一直的總目標是燃氣50%再剩30%燃煤20%這是原先的總體目標2030年做一個時間點 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
148.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
158.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
你現在2025再生能源佔比才13.1剛剛那個委員也提到所以這個你有提過這個目標再生能源佔比30%的目標會不會改變 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
162.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
186.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
我們是盡力啦但是這個所以你就是是不是如果做不到就目標要調整嘛目標要調整才知道我們要循序漸進要穩定的推動嘛你不能畫一個餅在那邊然後永遠沒有辦法達成所以目標該修正就要修正啦30%是一定要達到的但是時程可能會延後您的說法是這樣子沒有錯嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
186.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
210.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
方向上 因為我們最終的規劃啦這個齁 國化會跟經濟部要做一個整合你們報告裡面齁 看所以你今天報告國化會報告第三頁然後這個經濟報告第一頁你針對那個針對那個地熱的部分啦兩個數據完全不一樣國化會是說1.2MW你們是經濟部是200MW |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
215.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
241.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那到底是差距在哪裡 差很多耶差六七倍 差六倍就是我們務實的這個那你說國外不務實因為要達到1.7真的是有事實上的困難設定目標你的科學依據是怎麼來的那你經濟部你比較務實你變成200MW是什麼樣的困境你要把它調整 往下調80%這個副主委 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
243.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
263.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
1.2是你們設定的嘛,你們報告也這樣寫,我到底要聽誰的看誰的沒有沒有,跟委員報告,其實這個也是之前根據台電的資料但是因為經濟部有調整,所以我們會根據經濟部的調整你們報告出來之前也應該要檢視一下,跟經濟部對一下或是會讓人一頭霧水,到底誰說了算 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
267.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
284.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
我們會尊重經濟部啦那我要求國發會跟經濟部是不是一個月之內完成2030年第2跟各項的各類的綠能一個合理跟一個正式務實的一個目標值可以嗎一個月之內齁接下來這個另外這個天然氣的部分齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
292.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
307.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
台灣有非常規的天然氣叫做頁岩氣我們現在所有的天然氣都是外購對不對都是外購有沒有可能發展這個非傳統的天然氣 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
311.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
331.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
目前我們台灣用的天然氣百分之九十九都是進口的那是非頁岩氣是不是也可以當作一個天然氣的一個替代可以但是台灣沒有頁岩氣好那我們有沒有可能去採購其他的頁岩氣目前從美國進口的天然氣就是頁岩氣現階段就已經有了接下來離岸風電 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
338.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
363.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
兩份的問題是說這三之三期你們3月27日突然公布這個選商機制這個會引起整體目前有意願的開發商會措手不及我們當然希望說這個能夠加速這個能源轉型但是你相關政策一定要在務實的基礎所以目前有很多問題存在是說你備標跟併網時程不確實際市場可能會有過度競爭的問題所以我建議 具體建議 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
368.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
389.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
可不可以彈性調整期程然後把雙方ESG的違規責任做個相關的規定這個我拜託是不是經濟部上個月之內提出相關檢討報告好 上個月之內 好嗎另外氫氣的部分我們現在氫能的發展到哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
391.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
406.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
現在如果看使用端的部分有在高雄嘉青站的示範性計畫所以還在研究示範的階段很多國家已經在運用另外就是剛剛提到的如果是那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
408.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
435.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
那個FEAR SALE的那個部分事實上已經有企業在運用了那我們也有一些方案即便這樣子我們覺得我們還在非常起始的階段其他國家已經已經應用在很多的這個實證場域嘛已經在有一個產業鏈或者相關的市場應用都已經有很明確化嘛日本跟這個韓國也是一樣日本他是用政府來主導 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
436.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
450.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
你們現在好像只有中友在做但是我們到底有沒有這個新人的整個戰略規劃一定要政府主導然後配合其他產業來協助然後有階段性的來推動 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
452.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
476.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
對 現在有分成兩個部分 一個是產清怎麼樣產生氫氣的問題 然後運送清的問題然後還有運用端的問題這些日本都有相關的經驗我是請經濟部 是不是三個月之內你面對這個氫能發展一定要整體的戰略性規劃然後我剛剛說的 你這個要怎麼樣形成明確的產業鏈跟應用市場 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
477.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
486.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
然後有跨部會的整個層面都需要經濟部跟國會來協助所以是不是三個月之內提出我國氫氣農園發展的相關檢討報告是好的好 謝謝好 謝謝邱少偉 謝謝部長 謝謝董事長 |
| transcript.gazette[0].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[0].start |
2026-04-16T10:33:46.319000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[0].end |
2026-04-16T10:33:46.440000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[0].text |
謝謝主席。 |
| transcript.gazette[0].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[1].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[1].start |
2026-04-16T10:33:46.940000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[1].end |
2026-04-16T10:33:52.343000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[1].text |
先請龔部長，然後國發會詹副主委、中油方董事長。 |
| transcript.gazette[1].quality |
0.85 |
| transcript.gazette[2].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[2].start |
2026-04-16T10:33:52.343000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[2].end |
2026-04-16T10:33:54.384500+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[2].text |
請龔部長、副主委、方董事長。 |
| transcript.gazette[2].quality |
0.091 |
| transcript.gazette[3].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[3].start |
2026-04-16T10:33:54.384500+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[3].end |
2026-04-16T10:33:56.426000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[3].text |
召委好。 |
| transcript.gazette[3].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[4].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[4].start |
2026-04-16T10:33:56.426000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[4].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:07.632000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[4].text |
如果荷姆茲海峽持續封鎖，或者美伊戰爭持續延長的話，那麼分散油源就很重要，所以比照其他國家的做法。 |
| transcript.gazette[4].quality |
0.727 |
| transcript.gazette[5].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[5].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:08.692000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[5].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:27.033000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[5].text |
韓國派總統特使去各國找油，他們去沙烏地阿拉伯、哈薩克及阿曼，他們找了2.7億桶原油，全部繞過荷姆茲海峽，避免戰事如果持續擴大或者持續延長。 |
| transcript.gazette[5].quality |
0.902 |
| transcript.gazette[6].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[6].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:27.834000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[6].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:32.177000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[6].text |
我們中油有沒有相關的緊急購油計畫來分散油源？ |
| transcript.gazette[6].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[7].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[7].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:33.318000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[7].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:35.640000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[7].text |
有，我請方董事長說明一下。 |
| transcript.gazette[7].quality |
0.818 |
| transcript.gazette[8].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[8].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:35.640000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[8].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:37.702000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[8].text |
來，方董。 |
| transcript.gazette[8].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[9].speaker |
方董事長振仁 |
| transcript.gazette[9].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:37.702000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[9].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:42.005000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[9].text |
當然不可諱言，中油進口的原油原先在戰前是滿大…… |
| transcript.gazette[9].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[10].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[10].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:42.946000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[10].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:44.487000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[10].text |
不是，我是說我們有沒有這個計畫？ |
| transcript.gazette[10].quality |
0.929 |
| transcript.gazette[11].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[11].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:44.487000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[11].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:45.128000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[11].text |
因為我時間有限。 |
| transcript.gazette[11].quality |
0.714 |
| transcript.gazette[12].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[12].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:45.588000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[12].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:49.451000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[12].text |
我們有沒有相關緊急購油計畫？ |
| transcript.gazette[12].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[13].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[13].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:49.451000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[13].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:52.673000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[13].text |
過去韓國是沒有跟沙烏地買，也沒有跟哈薩克買，也沒有跟阿曼買。 |
| transcript.gazette[13].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[14].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[14].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:53.935000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[14].end |
2026-04-16T10:34:58.358000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[14].text |
為了戰事的關係，他一次買2.7億桶，我們要未雨綢繆。 |
| transcript.gazette[14].quality |
0.762 |
| transcript.gazette[15].speaker |
方董事長振仁 |
| transcript.gazette[15].start |
2026-04-16T10:34:59.378000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[15].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:03.961000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[15].text |
我們其他的替代油源就是在非洲還有澳洲，當然…… |
| transcript.gazette[15].quality |
0.85 |
| transcript.gazette[16].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[16].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:04.982000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[16].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:07.323000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[16].text |
澳洲原先就有，就請它增產而已嘛。 |
| transcript.gazette[16].quality |
0.929 |
| transcript.gazette[17].speaker |
方董事長振仁 |
| transcript.gazette[17].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:08.043000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[17].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:09.284000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[17].text |
是，類似像這種做法。 |
| transcript.gazette[17].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[18].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[18].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:09.944000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[18].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:14.947000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[18].text |
我們的目標是要從非洲增加多少原油？ |
| transcript.gazette[18].quality |
0.688 |
| transcript.gazette[19].speaker |
方董事長振仁 |
| transcript.gazette[19].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:16.776000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[19].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:19.058000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[19].text |
我們不要買乾原油，是一船一船買。 |
| transcript.gazette[19].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[20].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[20].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:19.198000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[20].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:32.789000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[20].text |
我是說你應該是學韓國做法，有一個特使去各國採購，去詢問有沒有可能再提供油，韓國的做法，我們就可以借鏡，我是提供給部長做參考。 |
| transcript.gazette[20].quality |
0.982 |
| transcript.gazette[21].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[21].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:34.290000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[21].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:39.412000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[21].text |
一定要未雨綢繆，免得到時候缺油的時候找不到油，全世界都在搶油，好不好？是，好。 |
| transcript.gazette[21].quality |
0.667 |
| transcript.gazette[22].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[22].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:40.933000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[22].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:43.114000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[22].text |
好，這部分再提醒部長。 |
| transcript.gazette[22].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[23].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[23].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:43.114000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[23].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:45.895000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[23].text |
另外，你剛剛一直提到2030年一定會達成綠電20%。 |
| transcript.gazette[23].quality |
0.944 |
| transcript.gazette[24].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[24].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:45.895000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[24].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:46.895000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[24].text |
沒有、沒有。 |
| transcript.gazette[24].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[25].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[25].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:45.895000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[25].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:47.036000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[25].text |
我們一直的總目標就是燃氣50%、再生能源30%、燃煤20%，對不對？ |
| transcript.gazette[25].quality |
0.708 |
| transcript.gazette[26].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[26].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:47.036000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[26].end |
2026-04-16T10:35:47.456000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[26].text |
這是原先的總體目標。 |
| transcript.gazette[26].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[27].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[27].start |
2026-04-16T10:35:47.456000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[27].end |
2026-04-16T10:36:12.915000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[27].text |
以2030年做一個時間點，現在2025年再生能源占比才13.1%，剛剛賴瑞隆委員也有提到，所以你有提過這個目標，再生能源占比30%的目標會不會改變？ |
| transcript.gazette[27].quality |
0.839 |
| transcript.gazette[28].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[28].start |
2026-04-16T10:36:16.759000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[28].end |
2026-04-16T10:36:18.980000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[28].text |
我們是盡力啦，但是這個…… |
| transcript.gazette[28].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[29].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[29].start |
2026-04-16T10:36:18.980000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[29].end |
2026-04-16T10:36:22.962000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[29].text |
所以如果做不到，目標要調整嘛。是。 |
| transcript.gazette[29].quality |
0.929 |
| transcript.gazette[30].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[30].start |
2026-04-16T10:36:23.102000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[30].end |
2026-04-16T10:36:33.547000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[30].text |
目標調整，我們要循序漸進、要穩定推動，你不能畫一個餅在那邊，然後永遠沒有辦法達成，所以目標該修正就要修正。是。 |
| transcript.gazette[30].quality |
0.979 |
| transcript.gazette[31].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[31].start |
2026-04-16T10:36:36.148000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[31].end |
2026-04-16T10:36:40.030000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[31].text |
30%是一定要達到的，但是時程可能會延後，您的說法是這樣子，沒有錯嘛？ |
| transcript.gazette[31].quality |
0.966 |
| transcript.gazette[32].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[32].start |
2026-04-16T10:36:40.950000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[32].end |
2026-04-16T10:36:42.992000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[32].text |
方向上，因為我們最終的規劃是希望再生能源比例還是要提高。 |
| transcript.gazette[32].quality |
0.462 |
| transcript.gazette[33].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[33].start |
2026-04-16T10:36:43.232000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[33].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:02.847000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[33].text |
國發會跟經濟部要做整合，在你們今天的報告裡面，國發會報告第3頁、經濟部報告第1頁，針對地熱的部分，兩個數據完全不一樣。 |
| transcript.gazette[33].quality |
0.863 |
| transcript.gazette[34].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[34].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:02.847000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[34].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:11.309000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[34].text |
國發會說1.2GW，經濟部是200MW，到底差距是在哪裡？ |
| transcript.gazette[34].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[35].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[35].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:11.309000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[35].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:14.370000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[35].text |
差很多，甚至差了六倍。 |
| transcript.gazette[35].quality |
0.667 |
| transcript.gazette[36].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[36].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:15.170000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[36].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:16.250000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[36].text |
就是我們務實地…… |
| transcript.gazette[36].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[37].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[37].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:17.431000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[37].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:19.831000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[37].text |
你這樣是說國發會不務實？ |
| transcript.gazette[37].quality |
0.545 |
| transcript.gazette[38].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[38].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:19.831000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[38].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:24.113000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[38].text |
因為要達到1.2GW，真的有實際上的困難。 |
| transcript.gazette[38].quality |
0.824 |
| transcript.gazette[39].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[39].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:24.113000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[39].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:26.334000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[39].text |
國發會設定目標的科學依據是怎麼來的？ |
| transcript.gazette[39].quality |
0.824 |
| transcript.gazette[40].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[40].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:27.814000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[40].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:31.235000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[40].text |
經濟部比較務實，所以變成200MW。 |
| transcript.gazette[40].quality |
0.846 |
| transcript.gazette[41].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[41].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:32.035000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[41].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:34.876000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[41].text |
是什麼樣的困境，你要往下調80%？ |
| transcript.gazette[41].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[42].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[42].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:34.876000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[42].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:41.698000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[42].text |
副主委，1.2GW是你們設定的，你們報告也這樣寫，我到底要聽誰的、看誰的？ |
| transcript.gazette[42].quality |
0.933 |
| transcript.gazette[43].speaker |
詹副主任委員方冠 |
| transcript.gazette[43].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:42.639000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[43].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:50.621000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[43].text |
跟委員報告，其實這個也是根據之前台電的資料，但是因為經濟部有調整，所以我們會根據經濟部的調整重新再修正。 |
| transcript.gazette[43].quality |
0.833 |
| transcript.gazette[44].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[44].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:50.821000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[44].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:53.902000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[44].text |
你們報告出來之前，也應該要先檢視一下……抱歉。 |
| transcript.gazette[44].quality |
0.842 |
| transcript.gazette[45].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[45].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:54.902000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[45].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:56.063000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[45].text |
跟經濟部對一下。 |
| transcript.gazette[45].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[46].speaker |
詹副主任委員方冠 |
| transcript.gazette[46].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:56.363000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[46].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:56.363000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[46].text |
是，抱歉。 |
| transcript.gazette[46].quality |
0.333 |
| transcript.gazette[47].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[47].start |
2026-04-16T10:37:56.803000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[47].end |
2026-04-16T10:37:57.763000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[47].text |
會讓人一頭霧水，到底誰說了算？ |
| transcript.gazette[47].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[48].speaker |
詹副主任委員方冠 |
| transcript.gazette[48].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:01.307000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[48].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:02.288000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[48].text |
我們會尊重經濟部。 |
| transcript.gazette[48].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[49].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[49].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:03.668000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[49].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:17.416000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[49].text |
我要求國發會跟經濟部是不是一個月之內完成2030年地熱跟各項各類的綠能有一個合理、正式、務實的目標值，可以嗎？是。好。 |
| transcript.gazette[49].quality |
0.898 |
| transcript.gazette[50].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[50].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:17.416000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[50].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:17.776000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[50].text |
一個月之內？ |
| transcript.gazette[50].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[51].speaker |
詹副主任委員方冠 |
| transcript.gazette[51].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:17.776000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[51].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:18.776000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[51].text |
好，謝謝委員。 |
| transcript.gazette[51].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[52].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[52].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:17.776000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[52].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:18.756000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[52].text |
接下來是天然氣的部分。 |
| transcript.gazette[52].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[53].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[53].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:26.503000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[53].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:41.084000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[53].text |
臺灣有非常規的天然氣叫做頁岩氣，但我們現在所有的天然氣都是外購，有沒有可能發展這個非傳統的天然氣？方董？ |
| transcript.gazette[53].quality |
0.938 |
| transcript.gazette[54].speaker |
方董事長振仁 |
| transcript.gazette[54].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:45.516000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[54].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:49.378000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[54].text |
目前我們臺灣用的天然氣99%都是進口的。 |
| transcript.gazette[54].quality |
0.941 |
| transcript.gazette[55].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[55].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:50.579000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[55].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:54.961000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[55].text |
對，但是頁岩氣是不是也可以當作天然氣的替代？ |
| transcript.gazette[55].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[56].speaker |
方董事長振仁 |
| transcript.gazette[56].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:55.761000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[56].end |
2026-04-16T10:38:57.402000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[56].text |
可以，但是臺灣沒有頁岩氣。 |
| transcript.gazette[56].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[57].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[57].start |
2026-04-16T10:38:57.402000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[57].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:02.245000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[57].text |
好，我們有沒有可能去採購其他國的頁岩氣？ |
| transcript.gazette[57].quality |
0.944 |
| transcript.gazette[58].speaker |
方董事長振仁 |
| transcript.gazette[58].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:02.245000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[58].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:04.806000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[58].text |
目前從美國進口的天然氣就是頁岩氣。 |
| transcript.gazette[58].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[59].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[59].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:04.806000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[59].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:05.006000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[59].text |
現階段就已經有了，是不是？是。好。 |
| transcript.gazette[59].quality |
0.615 |
| transcript.gazette[60].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[60].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:05.046000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[60].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:13.506000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[60].text |
接下來是離岸風電的問題。 |
| transcript.gazette[60].quality |
0.909 |
| transcript.gazette[61].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[61].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:16.287000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[61].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:24.991000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[61].text |
你們3月27號突然公布這個3-3期的選商機制，這會讓目前有意願的開發商措手不及。 |
| transcript.gazette[61].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[62].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[62].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:25.811000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[62].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:31.713000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[62].text |
我們當然希望能夠加速能源轉型，但是相關政策一定是要基於務實的基礎。 |
| transcript.gazette[62].quality |
0.903 |
| transcript.gazette[63].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[63].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:31.713000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[63].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:49.705000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[63].text |
所以目前有很多問題存在，就是你備標跟併網的時程不切實際，市場可能會有過度競爭的問題，所以我具體建議可不可以彈性調整七成，然後把雙方ESG的違規責任訂定一個相關規定？ |
| transcript.gazette[63].quality |
0.896 |
| transcript.gazette[64].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[64].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:50.726000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[64].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:56.088000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[64].text |
這個我拜託經濟部三個月之內提出相關檢討報告。好。 |
| transcript.gazette[64].quality |
0.955 |
| transcript.gazette[65].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[65].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:56.469000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[65].end |
2026-04-16T10:39:57.929000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[65].text |
好，三個月之內，好嗎？好。 |
| transcript.gazette[65].quality |
0.667 |
| transcript.gazette[66].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[66].start |
2026-04-16T10:39:57.929000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[66].end |
2026-04-16T10:40:03.352000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[66].text |
另外，氫氣的部分，我們現在氫能的發展到哪裡？ |
| transcript.gazette[66].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[67].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[67].start |
2026-04-16T10:40:05.961000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[67].end |
2026-04-16T10:40:12.851000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[67].text |
現在如果看使用端的部分，有在高雄加氫站的示範性計畫…… |
| transcript.gazette[67].quality |
0.917 |
| transcript.gazette[68].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[68].start |
2026-04-16T10:40:12.851000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[68].end |
2026-04-16T10:40:15.294000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[68].text |
所以還在研究、示範的階段？ |
| transcript.gazette[68].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[69].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[69].start |
2026-04-16T10:40:15.555000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[69].end |
2026-04-16T10:40:17.478000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[69].text |
很多國家已經在運用了。 |
| transcript.gazette[69].quality |
0.9 |
| transcript.gazette[70].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[70].start |
2026-04-16T10:40:18.059000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[70].end |
2026-04-16T10:40:27.357000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[70].text |
另外就是剛剛提到的，如果是fuel cell的部分，事實上已經有企業在應用了，我們也有一些方案來補助他們。 |
| transcript.gazette[70].quality |
0.708 |
| transcript.gazette[71].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[71].start |
2026-04-16T10:40:27.578000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[71].end |
2026-04-16T10:40:57.261000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[71].text |
即便是這樣，我們還在非常起始的階段，其他國家已經應用在很多的實證場域，已經有一個產業鏈或是相關的市場應用，都已經有明確化，比如說日本跟韓國，日本是政府來主導，你們現在好像只有中油在做，但是我們到底有沒有氫能的整體戰略規劃？ |
| transcript.gazette[71].quality |
0.912 |
| transcript.gazette[72].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[72].start |
2026-04-16T10:40:57.261000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[72].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:04.468000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[72].text |
一定要由政府主導，然後配合其他產業來協作，有階段性地來推動。 |
| transcript.gazette[72].quality |
0.889 |
| transcript.gazette[73].speaker |
龔部長明鑫：對，現在有分成兩個部分 |
| transcript.gazette[73].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:08.531000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[73].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:16.492000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[73].text |
一個是產氫，怎麼樣產生氫氣的問題；然後運送氫的問題，還有運用端的問題，我們是舉這幾個面向來看。 |
| transcript.gazette[73].quality |
0.69 |
| transcript.gazette[74].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[74].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:16.492000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[74].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:18.893000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[74].text |
這些部分日本都已經有相關經驗。 |
| transcript.gazette[74].quality |
0.714 |
| transcript.gazette[75].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[75].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:18.893000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[75].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:25.655000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[75].text |
我請經濟部三個月之內，面對氫能發展，一定要有整體的戰略性規劃。是。 |
| transcript.gazette[75].quality |
0.931 |
| transcript.gazette[76].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[76].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:26.235000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[76].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:35.079000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[76].text |
還有我剛剛說的，要怎麼樣形成明確的產業鏈跟應用市場，然後有跨部會的整合策略，都需要經濟部跟國發會來協助。 |
| transcript.gazette[76].quality |
0.875 |
| transcript.gazette[77].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[77].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:36.139000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[77].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:38.841000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[77].text |
所以是不是三個月之內提出我國氫氣能源發展的相關檢討報告？ |
| transcript.gazette[77].quality |
0.926 |
| transcript.gazette[78].speaker |
龔部長明鑫 |
| transcript.gazette[78].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:39.302000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[78].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:39.422000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[78].text |
是，好的。 |
| transcript.gazette[78].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[79].speaker |
邱委員志偉 |
| transcript.gazette[79].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:39.462000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[79].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:39.582000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[79].text |
好，謝謝。 |
| transcript.gazette[79].quality |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[80].speaker |
主席 |
| transcript.gazette[80].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:39.622000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].guessed |
|
| transcript.gazette[80].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:40.122000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[80].text |
謝謝邱召委、謝謝部長、謝謝董事長。 |
| transcript.gazette[80].quality |
0.857 |
| transcript.gazette[81].speaker |
主席（邱委員志偉） |
| transcript.gazette[81].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:40.622000+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[81].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:45.193429+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[81].text |
下一位陳超明，陳超明，陳超明委員不在。 |
| transcript.gazette[81].quality |
0 |
| transcript.gazette[82].speaker |
主席（邱委員志偉） |
| transcript.gazette[82].start |
2026-04-16T10:41:45.493429+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].guessed |
1 |
| transcript.gazette[82].end |
2026-04-16T10:41:48.064857+08:00 |
| transcript.gazette[82].text |
下一位請劉書彬委員。 |
| transcript.gazette[82].quality |
0 |