| IVOD_ID |
165214 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/165214 |
| 日期 |
2025-11-11 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
院會-11-4-8 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期第8次會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
8 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
院會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期第8次會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-11-11T09:31:43+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-11-11T09:47:28+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:15:45 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/2170dced164337aacd47ef9d6a8b471385e1af54c489cd6258594ca32616fb4d8d5162d7c243163e5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
顏寬恒 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:31:43 - 09:47:28 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-11-11T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
第11屆第4會期第8次會議（事由：一、同意權之行使事項：本院交通、教育及文化兩委員會報告審查行政院函送國家通訊傳播委員會委員提名名單，蔣榮先為委員並為主任委員，程明修為委員並為副主任委員，黃葳威及羅慧雯均為委員，請同意案。（11月7日上午報告事項後）二、對行政院院長施政報告繼續質詢。（11月7日下午及11日）三、11月7日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。） |
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主席各位本院同仁及列席官員大家早主席有請行政院左院長請左院長備詢 |
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燕國元好 院長早 |
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院長台中火力發電廠在我的選區5支煙囪10部燃煤機組那10部燃煤機組的總裝置容量是550萬千瓦依照經濟部的規劃直到2034年會再多出6部燃氣機組那現在的這個燃氣機組的部分每部裝置容量為130萬千瓦所以6部總共是780萬千瓦 |
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那中火目前這10部燃煤機組是全國最大也是全世界第4名的這個燃煤電廠那依照環境部公布的數據中火是台中市這個排放大戶PM2.5排放佔台中市固定污染源的13.5%硫氧化物佔台中市的66.1%氮氧化物排放佔65.6%說了這麼多我們就是要看到說 |
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中火的這個燃煤機組的拆除計畫有沒有全面的拆除計畫不要零星的不要這個片面的 |
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請部長能夠詳細說明我知道他是一個燃氣機組會幾乎等於兩部的燃煤機組一個燃氣機組蓋好之後他會拆掉兩個燃煤機組我們現在看到的是時間確實在網路上面公告的時間是說2025年要開始拆2025跟2026要拆掉兩部機對 但是問題是2025已經快結束了 |
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143.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
2026所以這樣子的我們要看到的是期程不是只有時間拆除計劃其實我跟這個台電這邊所知已經一個禮拜了如果有拆除計劃應該早就在手上不會拖了那麼久還沒有表示沒有這個計劃是不是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
145.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
164.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
85年我們就是在規劃在一起的兩部的新的燃氣機組因為新的燃氣上來以後我知道嘛就是說燃氣上來我們的燃煤才會除液第一步第二步就把它拆掉是沒有說你現在說的就好像是乾就是沒有計畫沒有計畫所以現在其實從一開始 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
166.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
187.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
在地方在跟民眾說明台電拍胸部保證說一氣換一美而且保證拆除當時民眾我們的鄉親為了要讓減少空污讓這個政策可以趕快落實所以也都相信了但是我們近期看到的是高雄大林電廠已經除役的5號機 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
189.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
216.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
偷偷的重啟啊被抓包啊對不對那另外新達電廠他已經除役了咧那另外新達電廠三四號機也是在半年前就重啟啊所以你現在跟人家講說除役除役備用但是還是重啟啊所以你沒有拆除的話你現在跟民眾承諾了民眾不相信那備用的話只有在緊急時候上次大理短短時間而已我跟你講就是因為這些事件 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
217.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
233.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
還發生了公安意外所以民眾已經不相信政府的承諾就是說你跟他講說除役除役之後可是緊急備用又偷偷的重啟所以這樣子的情況民眾要看到的時候拆除所以我們看到你們提供的這個期審時間表 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
234.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
237.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
所以我在這邊我是希望院長要請院長跟台電要求我們這個一個完整的採取計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
253.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
266.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
細部的 計畫怎麼做 請台電提供好不好台電有很清楚的時程的規劃我還要求說不能到2034不要往前拉你現在裡面有25 26 31 32 3334到2034年 還那麼多年中間有空了好幾年空檔 我希望他往前拉 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
280.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
306.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
你說的2025第一步機箱沒動啊2034年會達成完全無美嘛齁那但是之前的那個行程就是他的程序我們會做一些規劃我跟你講啦齁就是說你們這些騎乘齁這樣子但是沒有辦法說服民眾啦因為沒有看到作為嘛沒有看到作為所以我們現在說的2025就還沒動啊2025已經快時間要過了了所以當初啊台電民眾的質疑齁就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
307.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
322.532 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
用騙的去讓他們去承諾去答應以燃氣換燃煤其實我們要的是真正落實拆除而不只是廚藝所以我想在這邊跟委員報告新的燃氣機組正在加緊的 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
324.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
338.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
裝置當中那只要升新的燃氣機組好了那麼1、2號燃煤機組就會拆除那你完整的計劃要出來啊這沒有欺騙我所要不到資料嘛如果你有計劃 計劃應該早就做好啦就是先把新的燃氣機組 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
339.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
364.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
這個目前施工的進度到什麼程度頂台電給出拆除計畫讓台中市民才能夠安心不然不要口號不要讓人家覺得說偷偷重啟也是你說要拆除的也是你那個不是偷偷啦 沒有啦那個是允許的 法律上允許的啦在緊急狀況的時候它稍微運轉而已啦那現在沒有緊急的狀況平常它是不會運轉的 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
367.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
385.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
那我再跟你問一下接下來我要問的就是說台中火力發電廠未來還要除了這些燃氣的機組之外還要增設天然氣儲氣槽那目前中火是不是有計畫要增加這個部分有沒有有沒有計畫跟進度 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
386.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
410.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
目前有的是現有的六座加上在建的兩座還有通過的四座所以台中港區已經有12座的儲氣槽現在正在環評在環評就是台電的部分在環評台中港部分接收站的部分整個就是在環評當中環評有通過嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
412.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
435.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
還沒有還沒有通過還沒有送出去啦 打算要送現在台中港區包括龍井 沙鹿 烏日這一帶整個海線的民眾都在擔心說到底我家門口會有幾座儲氣槽那到底安不安全那所以說 安全啦 儲氣槽沒有發生意外過不是 我跟你講 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
436.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
449.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
報告如果出來了台電未來申請的要增設的這些儲氣槽的計畫如果出來請給本席辦公室也要提醒我在這邊提醒部長一定要 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
450.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
468.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
跟當地所有的居民做一個良好的溝通不只是溝通啦還要宣導未來的風險可能風險在哪裡怎麼樣預防突發的事件不會在居民的附近會比較遠離居民的地方你有到現場看過嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
470.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
491.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
你沒有去嘛 你怎麼知道遠離居民我們就生活在那個地方我跟你講台中港區下那個勒 那個大型的那個Outlet呢Outlet就在旁邊啊 那每天出入多少人啊對不對 所以我跟你講部長 我們要實地去了解關於這些預防的事情我跟台電要的資料 光從111年 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
494.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
507.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
到現在就有八起的公安事故台電喔 這是有通報的那包含未通報的不知道有多少那台電未來要在這邊興建多座的這個天然氣儲氣槽再加上原有已經設置的 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
509.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
527.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
正在建的再加上通過的已經有12座了那台電未來現在正在環評的要增加多少這些東西都集中在台東港區我每一次總諮詢我都關心台電的狀況因為以氣換煤的話一定要有接收站跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
528.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
555.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
當然嘛 沒有錯嘛所以台灣的部分也不是全部集中在不是 你們要增加這個三接的觀塘也好你們要增加儲存量來設置儲氣槽這個部分然後降低供應中斷的風險但是這個風險不可以讓民眾來承受啊讓整個海線來承受所以我說你事前的防範事前的一個宣導這個是最重要的 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
556.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
580.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
署警準備不可少啦但是一旦我們都不希望發生任何事故但是如果一旦發生了那絕對不是小事情民眾承受不起沒有人可以承受政府也承受不起那所以這些東西不可由海線的居民來承擔相關的配套一定要到位不管是怎麼樣安全的評估是第一的民眾的安全是第一的當然永遠比發電更重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
583.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
600.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
再來我再請教我們今年7月份在台中烏日海線這個豪大雨發生了幾次豪大雨不知道院長有沒有注意但是對於當地的居民這個2008年卡梅基颱風對於整個中台灣的重創 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
601.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
629.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
尤其在大渡烏日地區那個水患非常嚴重也全國造成了20人的死亡那這個損失無法估計那也造成很多家庭的破碎所以對當地人民來說可以說歷歷在目那種悲慘的教訓信眾非常害怕我跟台中市水利局討論過相關的案件透過資料我們知道說所有的這些抽水站運作都是正常的 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
630.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
642.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
大理溪、烏溪部分包括漱王碑抽水站、五峒嶺抽水站、中興抽水站、芋園抽水站、宮廷抽水站等等抽水量都正常但是我們發現問題了就是說這些 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
648.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
672.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
排水出去的河川他的水位比淹水地區還高已經高過淹水區所以等於說抽水抽出來水要排出去排不出去那排不出去之後呢包括大渡區的山陽大排也出現這樣的狀況之前南部的颱風南部的風災水災也是這樣子的狀況所以我在這邊要請院長是不是請我們經濟部跟部長要求水利署 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
673.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
682.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
做一個通盤的檢討針對全國全國這個國內多處抽水後排水的河川地勢高於淹水地區的 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
683.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
700.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
這整個河川流域我們都要做全體的一個規劃可不可以院長 部長因為這一次的728豪雨的確是比平常大很多我們治水的平均標準都超過這的確是這樣這個當然是氣候變遷的影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
704.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
716.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
的確也因為這樣子院長給我們的四年一千億來就是地方政府協助地方政府所有整治的治水的部分縣市管河川還包括這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
718.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
743.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
集水區的淨流分擔或者是滯洪池的部分我們會全部盤點起來現在有關於台中的部分在2025年11月10號我們經過審查以後會利用如果公有地的部分我們先來施作因為施有地還是要徵收但是公有的部分如果可以做淨流分擔的部分我們就先做 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
743.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
769.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
河川流域大多數都是公有地都是河川地對不對所以你怎麼會說這種情況我們台風又到了颱風又到鳳凰颱風現在對台灣又產生新的一個威脅所以這個事情不是我們現在講你們現在回應是應該事前就要準備預防所以現在我剛剛提到的烏日大都地區的光是這兩處就有好多處是這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
772.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
789.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
抽水排放的河川水位高於這個淹水區所以這部分不是只有台中會發生各地都在發生都呈現出來經濟部水利署一直有準備所以剛剛部長所說的就是未來四年我們用縣市管河川改善的計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
791.766 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
812.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
繼續將這個地方比方說滯洪池增加實際上過去為什麼有做到預算規模前瞻建設裡面也有做到這個抽水式的移動式的抽水站移動式的抽水站是沒有說是可以調度的可以調度但是大型的抽水站本身就有那個需求所以他才會那個設計才會有整個河川的流量那個排水量他們才會去設計這個抽水站對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
814.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
838.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
那這個移動式的當然也要再增加由現場發生的時候在發生當下由指揮中心來做一個調度這個都合理的這個本來就有在做所以為什麼現在我講的是說他的水位已經高過淹水區啦那水位高過淹水區他怎麼抽你再多的抽水機也抽不出去啊所以為什麼要淨流分攤就是這樣沒有辦法完全集中在某一個地方的集水區 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
840.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
858.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
我想我們請院長部長一定要關心要放在這裡因為現在我們不敢再發聲因為極端氣候來臨我們的力道要加強跟地方的合作要更多不只颱風光是我們現在的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
860.101 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
888.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
這樣子的一個極端氣候強降雨就會造成我們這個人口新興地區還有這些一些部分的一個行政區都會造成淹水為什麼因為雨水下水道不足過去幾十年前的這個都市計畫排水計畫已經無法來滿足我們現在的一個城市發展那有一些包括我們台中市過去台中縣海縣山城屯區它不是在一個完整的都市計畫內 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
889.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
915.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
所以我們很多地方已經人口聚集非常多但是他還是沒有這種雨水下水道所以這個部分我知道這個水利署這邊還有我們營建署這一邊他們都有在有在有在加強有在跟進但是我希望院長院長跟部長我們可以制定一個專案一個計劃針對我們這個國內我們現在尤其六都包含這些縣市人口新興的地區 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
915.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
928.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
人口新新的地區新的發展區那對於雨水下水道的部分來做一個更全面的規劃然後補這個協助地方政府來更多的一個預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
945.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
945.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
好 謝謝 |