| IVOD_ID |
165015 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/165015 |
| 日期 |
2025-11-05 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-26-8 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第8次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
8 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第8次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-11-05T09:35:22+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-11-05T09:52:23+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:17:01 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/0bb7d6ea348ff1d22b2778a0a55bc15a5a7dc8d9023f59e5e98bf0b6cf7b51043dda3dec39bdc3285ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
劉建國 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:35:22 - 09:52:23 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-11-05T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第8次全體委員會議（事由：（上午9時起）
邀請環境部部長、經濟部、內政部、農業部、交通部、行政院公共工程委員會就「非法棄置到城市採礦：檢討環境部環境管理署執法痛點與城市採礦推動策略」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
（下午2時起。若上午議程尚未結束，待結束後接續召開）
一、繼續審查
(一)委員賴瑞隆等16人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(二)委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(三)委員張智倫等17人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(四)委員王育敏等24人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(五)台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(六)委員黃健豪等19人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(七)委員牛煦庭等25人擬具「噪音管制法第二條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案。
(八)委員羅明才等20人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(九)委員羅廷瑋等17人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
二、審查
(一)委員林倩綺等16人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(二)委員洪孟楷等16人擬具「噪音管制法第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(三)委員廖偉翔等16人擬具「噪音管制法第二條、第二十六條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
【二、(二)及(三)案，如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書不予審查】【逐條討論】） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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謝謝主席我想本市上週在本委會 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
11.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
35.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
就特別強調台中這個非洲豬瘟的事件中央各單位要強烈的介入不要再讓地方這種叫胡搞瞎搞吧這個狀況一直發生因為醫院哪有清消兩次然後還會驗出陽性嘛再來就最終還拜託了國軍再度這個化學兵進入清消 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
36.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
50.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
那台中市怎麼又馬上派人又再去傾銷一次這很奇怪啦齁我想是說從整個這個事件的一個過程裡面傾銷應變來自己處理整個畫面呈現在國連的面前會覺得是很亂毫無彰化的在應變這樣的事情那我覺得這樣齁 坦白講這一種 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
66.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
86.838 |
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這種處理方式真的會害死這些養豬場這些養豬戶然後甚至會影響到國人吃這個溫體豬肉然後以系列的所有的攤商都會受到很嚴重的這樣的一個傷害跟挑戰所以我坦白講我是真的要在這邊做強力的一個譴責部長你請起來 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
91.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
115.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
你在11月1號有到雲林出席雲林就是全國養豬最大最大最大宗的縣市那你在參加這個環保這個群林志工會的時候你有特別接受媒體的採訪你是希望說朝你中長期方案把廢棄物的觀念轉化為資源但是我要在這邊提醒部長這眼下的廚餘流向已經出了很大的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
116.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
136.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
已經來不及等你以後還要轉會為能了真的會趕不上來啦從應變中心調查報告中初步可以了解疫情僅在台中的武器廠然後病毒恐來自為弱食增足的廚餘 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
137.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
155.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
我現在每一個細節我都講得很清楚了請部長就希望我的這樣的一個質詢可以提醒一些事情但這個處理到底是從哪邊來目前沒有比較明確的方向照這個表 部長可以看一下無期清潔隊的處理是陰性 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
156.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
170.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
無期清潔隊的處理是陰性所以初步可以排除來自清潔隊但載運處理的車輛上有驗到非洲豬瘟陽性反應依照台中市政府的說法處理飆收後是由業者自行派遮載運 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
172.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
199.5 |
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也就是說這台車到底接觸到到哪有非洲豬瘟的病毒應該是這次查明這事件的重中之重對不對不過到現在好像要查起來應該是很費工了很費工不過還是要查還是要查第一個是清潔隊無期清潔隊的處理是陰性的但是載運的這台車輛是驗到有非洲豬瘟呈陽性那到底是不是處理出問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
203.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
217.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那到底是不是廚餘出問題這是一件事情嘛那第二件事情在整個調查報告中竟然還多出一個西養豬場然後浙江無竊養豬場就是這個暗場竟然還可以違規分讓多餘的廚餘給西養豬場使用 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
223.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
233.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
這是什麼樣的狀況啦他還要用到中間給西廠去用最重要的喔 西養豬場沒有標授無期清潔隊的廚餘卻能從無期清潔隊再去載廚餘回來養豬這個表格很清楚嘛 對不對這問題真的實在是 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
249.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
274.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
不要說養豬戶啦現在連消費者都看的都會物理看的話也都非常驚訝說怎麼有這樣的一個一個方向軸板的那不叫管理啊那等於是沒有在管理嘛應該是這麼說嘛那現在這台車這台車到底它的整個路徑有沒有辦法去追查出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
276.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
301.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
這台有驗到陽性反應的這台車有沒有辦法去了解它的路徑怎麼樣有沒有從這個地方去追查下去部長就你的掌握跟了解我所知道是這個載送的目前是沒有GPS啦所以等於是透過包含了各種的車級資料還有照相機等等我們可以提供的包含了這個處理的去向各種的資料我們都已經給檢調單位去處理了 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
303.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
330.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
所以這個至於說這個東西因為我沒有參與在這個疫調的這個過程所以我不清楚但是其實可能是的確是很困難的但是我們這邊是負責這個真主那的確那家是沒有落實真主的然後也跟委員報告委員剛才說的西洋豬場這個的確是違規的從這個我們的廚餘一家就是簽約就是那家不能再去分送給別人這個也是完全是違規可以會受罰的他會受法我知道了齁但是 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
331.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
359.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
但是他會受啊 但是為什麼這一個他沒有去標這個武器清潔隊的廚餘這個西洋豬場還可以跑到這個武器清潔隊去載送這個廚餘那這兩照可以接受到什麼處罰一個是工部門的清潔隊 一個是西洋豬場對 這個會依照我們的廢清法不知道第幾條有一條 他們昨天 我們昨天有匯報這個事情是完全會開罰的 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
361.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
380.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
請上來說明一下好不好針對公部門還有針對這個西洋豬場怎麼採訪 怎麼處理他這個因為是屬於飼料的轉移大概是用飼料管理法跟這個動物疾病防治條例來做處分 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
381.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
400.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
對 怎麼處分嘛一照這兩個條例對公部門清潔隊怎麼處理對這個西洋署長怎麼處理請署長是不是可以說明清楚一點我們想了解一下因為這個不說明清楚我想現在是禁運然後禁止廚餘 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
413.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
428.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
包委員 這個會用洞床條例去拆滑然後就是目前的狀況是會議給農業部用洞床條例跟飼料管理法對 怎麼處罰嘛 依照這兩個條例要怎麼處罰嘛是滑緩對 滑緩 對 清潔隊 公部門怎麼處理對 西洋組長怎麼處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
435.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
451.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
兩邊應該都可以拆滑怎麼拆滑啦 我問第三次了啊你們怎麼到現在沒辦法答覆我這麼簡單 明確法律有明確性嘛清潔隊 清潔隊怎麼可以讓沒有來飆售這個廚餘的西營養豬場來載運這個廚餘公部門怎麼可以公然犯罪違規違法那我們怎麼處理吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
464.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
489.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那西洋豬場怎麼可以去沒有標誌的時候可以直接到工部門的清潔隊去載送 載運這一個廚餘他又應該說到什麼廚華廚華嘛你們怎麼沒有辦法第一時間答覆我 答覆委員會好 包委員 這個我們是不是農業部這邊來回答 回應這個農業部市市長是不是黃市 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
495.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
496.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
有關於廚餘的部分的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
514.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
538.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
這個廚餘工部門沒有標授給西洋豬場西洋豬場怎麼可以去清潔隊載送 載運這個廚餘那清潔隊要負起什麼樣責任那這個去載送西洋豬場要接受到什麼樣的才華主席你要多給我時間我已經問了三分鐘到五分鐘他們都沒有辦法答覆我這樣的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
541.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
568.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
抱歉啦 好不好這太煩了你們這個太離譜了你們不管地方 不管中央 我覺得這叫做應變這個叫應變我就問這個題目 到現在沒辦法答覆所以 他們才敢肆無淡計的持續的違法到這種程度嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
570.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
585.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
所以等於就是沒有管理嘛就是沒有管理嘛就不只你想要中長期的轉匯維能基本上如果照這樣的情況下去不可能啦可以答覆我了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
588.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
612.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
各位委員報告好那如果這個部分的話我們是認為應該是由這個動船條例裡面的這個因為它造成的這個疫情的這樣的一個部分但是因為動船條例裡面它的這個規定的這個項目比較多所以要引用哪一個條例的罰則的部分我們還需要再來研議市長它造成疫情 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
613.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
641.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
是一件事情 他沒有造成疫情平常遇到這種事情 你們就怎麼管理 你們就怎麼處理嘛如果平常遇到這樣的事情的話應該是依照這個廢新法還有這個飼料法的這個部分來處理因為他不是在這個合約廠商裡面飼料法不是你們管的嗎我們的罰則是3到300萬的這個3到300萬是罰台中武器清潔隊還是罰西洋豬場 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
643.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
664.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
行為人 行為人 兩個都是行為人啊沒有合約怎麼清潔隊敢把廚藝讓他們來載運就公務人員的部分應該是有公務人員的這個職權的這個部分來做裁處怎麼裁處嘛 怎麼裁處嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
667.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
696.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
我現在是指疫情尚未爆發之前持續的有這種事情發生公部門必須負起什麼責任西洋豬場必須接受什麼樣的才華發生疫情之後這兩兆要受到懲罰程度絕對有層次上的不一樣我們現在講前面 再來講後面你們連前面都講不清楚你要怎麼去督導地方啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
697.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
726.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
你要怎麼去管理啊我後面還有很多題目要問咧我把這題你到現在不知道答不完你在應變什麼啊應變中心不是跨部會所有重要的單位都必須集結然後用最快速的方法去做因應然後該怎麼樣處理 該怎麼處罰第一個時間因為已經碰到疫情發生了 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
731.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
757.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
難道進宅進運進廚餘的過程裡面你中文字母跟地文字母在公秀阿其實我們昨天有在討論這個事情啦是不是說明一下因為我們昨天有特別 因為我副組長他過去就在處理廚餘 他比較清楚那跟委員報告齁這一個是因為他跟原來的申請的事項不同而 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
758.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
778.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
現在檢察官也在偵辦可能朝向這個檢察官處理是檢察官在處理在行政的處罰上我們什麼樣的作為嘛就這樣而已啊我問的問題不簡單嗎然後你可以分疫情前跟疫情後我都可以接受你就明確的表達說明清楚嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
779.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
790.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
跟委員報告那非法載運儲餘的罰則會因為這個不同的樣態然後觸犯的這個條例可能有廢清法還有洞傳法還有飼料管理法那包括了如果是一般的違規的話那會 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
795 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
816.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
夾帶廚餘的這樣的垃圾的樣態會罰到一千二到六千元的罰則但是像這個樣態的話是非法載運廚餘給禁止的這個就是他不是經合格的這個養豬場的話那我們依據這個動產條例那處新台幣五萬以上一百萬以下的罰款那累犯的話會加計罰則的這個部分那另外 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
817.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
843.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
因為他未經許可那處理廢棄物包括廚餘那可以依照廢棄法來處以新台幣六萬以上三百萬以下的罰款那其他的這個部分那如果有違反了這個飼料管理法的這個部分那我們會依照飼料管理法的部分處以三萬到三百萬以下的罰款大概是目前我們能夠去查照他的這個相關的行為規則所必須要負的責任是這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
844.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
870.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
市長還有部長我希望你們把明確我剛剛提出來這個點疫情前疫情後針對武器清潔隊針對西洋豬場該怎麼處罰該怎麼樣的處理方式用書面資料給我們委員會所有委員做參考這第一件事情也公告全國啦好不好但是我要提醒我為什麼要講這一點來講我後面的事情今天趙委排的這個事情非常重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
871.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
896.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
有利可圖啦 大家都有同盟機會啦連這個廚餘都可以做到這樣的程度你看那些匯圖他會怎麼處理海洋污染防治法 你只要把廚餘請到到海洋怎麼划 你知道嗎 不能說他們可以從新台幣30萬以上 3000萬以下 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
900.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
929.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
好 廚餘到屏東 疫藥廠復納廠不曉得依照廢清法你要怎麼處理地方環保局立即有通報東港警分局來做處理嘛 對不對當場的查扣 然後也移送這個環外公務然後用這個廢法處理及不實申報廢棄物等罪嫌移送屏東地檢署偵辦 最高可以怎麼樣依法廢清法六千到三百萬六千到三百萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
930.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
954.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
除以倒在海洋依照海洋污染防治法最高可以划到三千萬我們到現在還在六千到三百萬依照廢清法第四十六條不行嗎如果依照廢清法第四十六條可以的話最高到多少你還在六千到三百萬最高到一千五百萬對除以 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
957.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
976.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
丟在海洋 最高可以花三千萬丟在你陸地 如果照部長講的 最高是三百萬如果照署長講的 一飛行環四十六條一千五百萬 怎麼差這麼多怎麼差這麼多所以這次招委要排這個修滑你對滑款的部分 要不要重新審視 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
979.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
991.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
不能用這樣的差異吧 差太大了吧如果以300跟3000差十倍如果1500到3000是差兩倍不對吧 所以很多人唯利可圖就會跟你拼啦 就會逃亡氣會嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
993.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
1017.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
拜託 我今天的主題是要回到這個地方來那我也希望 非洲事務的事情我剛剛有特別提到如果這個點不是在儲雨是在這一台載運車到現在還沒有辦法很詳細的把這台車的路徑去調查出來我覺得 不管中央跟地方到時候都會監察院見好 謝謝 謝謝主席好 謝謝委員 謝謝謝謝劉建國委員的發言 |