| IVOD_ID |
164859 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/164859 |
| 日期 |
2025-10-30 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-20-5 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期財政委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
5 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期財政委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-10-30T10:08:52+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-10-30T10:19:46+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:54 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/480bc0daa4347f00db6f07f71ddcad178220506846d94b49935765bd47f546513a5392e6bceeeece5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
吳秉叡 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:08:52 - 10:19:46 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-10-30T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆、中央銀行、法務部、內政部警政署就「虛擬資產服務法草案及其相關子法修訂暨建立完善監理架構之進程」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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我們請彭主委委員早早請問美國的這個穩定幣現在進行到的程度是怎麼樣現在美國穩定幣剛剛就是剛剛講那個天才法案天才法案應該據我所知還在做最後一個確認不過他們已經開始已經就是美元的穩定幣現在在市場上已經是主流了他們現在納管的部分好像他一個立法程序最後要完成了 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
29.861 |
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所以已經先走了然後法律還沒有完備不是 他們確實是過去USDT或USDC這兩個早就已經存在的東西其實我個人認為過去貨幣的發行是國家的主權行為那如果你這個穩定幣跟美元是掛鉤1比1然後讓渡給私人去發行這是把國家的主權行為下放 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
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那這裡產生一個問題啊這個貨幣的總供給量就M2啊會不會因為這樣子而增加這個可能要請央行來回答比較精準這個部分因為央行有做過我知道他們的答案就是說我不把這個算入貨幣嘛但是我是覺得在整體在市面上流動的貨幣就是會增加那個副總裁 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
85.384 |
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其實這個問題我們最近在演藝中還流程還蠻複雜的要看譬如說花型之後那個花型商賣出去他收到的那個款項他怎麼用如果他把它當作存款那這個存款的項目是在貨幣供給的項目裡面可是現在穩定幣 |
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111.098 |
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花型的又可以當交易的媒介那如果從這個部分他有一個影響在這邊對啊他的M2然後還有一個另外一個流向他並不存回銀行體系作為存款他可能買去我們說他可以有高品質的金融資產所以他可能去買債券等等那債券他錢就沒有流回銀行體系所以會有影響假設他去買債券問題是這個 |
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139.979 |
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穩定幣的取得者他要如何使用這個穩定幣不是你能夠控制的啊不是穩定幣他發行就在穩定幣的這個幣圈流通那這一邊當然他就有交易的功能那你同時有交易的功能問題是你本來國家的 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
158.558 |
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貨幣的總供給量M2本來是有受控的但是你再加上這個東西之後這個東西的數量你有辦法總計在裡面嗎我現在這樣講我先講後面流通再來您講的總計如果它在幣圈流通這就是一個交易的媒介那這邊就牽涉到我們要不要把穩定幣它有交易功能要納入貨幣供給這一個項目如果你不納入跟納入這邊 |
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188.365 |
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對啊 你到底納入還不納入因為在計算貨幣供給有M1 M2那你要看要不要列到因為你從M1這邊拿了貨幣去買所以你如果要納入它可能就跑到M2那這邊就有一增一減 |
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206.824 |
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220.223 |
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對啊那這個增加會產生怎麼樣的後果呢還有一個這是第一層第二層是說幣商拿到錢我剛才講我的意思是說剛剛你回答了我是說幣商拿到錢他要怎麼使用不是你可以控制的嗎不是會影響到貨幣供給對啊所以這個 |
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223.087 |
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226.769 |
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影響增減我們說這樣看起來目前沒辦法說是增還是減要去看他們怎麼用那個有一個流程所以這是我們目前的一個邏輯所以我剛剛講說我為什麼會擔憂這個東西我個人認為如果M2的整體是增加的那你國家的主權行為本來你的貨幣供給是有一定在央行的控制之下如果你這個供給增加太多會造成通貨膨脹啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
250.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
263.684 |
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那不只是通貨膨脹會影響到我們講的就是說貨幣政策效果中另外一個利率水準好 那另外一個問題美國的穩定幣你同不同意它在台灣使用當作美金的支付工具 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
265.288 |
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290.354 |
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這是國家跟國家之間的主權行為啊這個你們有討論過嗎我想是這樣那個如果美國發行的穩定幣要進入台灣的市場我們儘管會有些規定應該是看他們的規定有一些他規定不到有一些就在網路上直接支付掉了那那個網路上直接支付掉了也不是你們能夠控制的啊那怎麼辦我覺得現在好像即使沒規定也是有這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
292.594 |
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321.192 |
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就是跟委員說明一下我們在那個穩定幣裡面呢分兩個一個是台灣發行就是對本國募集嘛這個當然沒問題那再來第一個就是國外已經募集已經存在的話他如果要在我們的所謂的未來的虛擬資產服務業裡面進行交易要經過我們的同意等於說他要經過我們的同意還包括追蹤他所做的事情主委我剛剛有個問題他如果進來經過你的同意這個還比較好控制他現在因為網路無國界你根本就控制不到他他直接就在網路上支付了對確實是 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
323.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
347.768 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
台灣的政府就中華民國政府要不要承認是一回事事實上它已經發生了就像我在總質詢的時候經濟部長跟我講說我們台灣不接受中國的電商經營問題是所有的拼多多淘寶的貨品其實大量進來了你不承認它是存在的啊不是說我不承認它就不存在啊那我現在一個問題美國的穩定幣看起來台灣非接受不可 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
348.513 |
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359.778 |
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因為除非你要跟美國對幹但是我覺得不太可能我們中華民國政府不太可能好那如果他在台灣做支付這一些就會變成我剛剛講的廣義的國家貨幣總體供給 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
363.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
379.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
有可能會不受控他的金額會增加很多那當然這個金額增加很多M2增加很多的時候另外一個考慮的問題是說會不會造成整個通貨膨脹的問題因為等於就是廣義的貨幣流通在台灣就增加了很多 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
380.255 |
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406.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
對 這跟委員提到就是說我們從這個比如說穩定幣從過去這一段子在國際上使用確實有一個狀況就是有些國家的民眾對自己本國的貨幣反而信心不夠他會希望持有穩定幣反而成為民間支付一個很重要的這個工具它是自然形成的就是說在確實剛才委員提到就是說在網路世界裡面當我某些國人他自有能力然後透過這個方式去 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
408.368 |
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424.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
購買或是去轉換這個時候確實我們在整個在我們這個法規管理上面是未來要再努力的地方因為我們現在是希望針對說我們現在納管這些業者然後再來就是對於一般民眾我們加大他的保護的範圍是啦我知道你這個立法的目的但是我剛剛講的這些疑慮是要先想的是 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
432.52 |
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446.951 |
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我個人認為未來美國的穩定幣一定會透過各種途徑進到台灣來台灣的人也不會去拒絕全世界沒有人會拒絕美金因為美金的流通性跟它的可信度都是現在世界所有貨幣裡面最強的 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
447.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
467.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
你坦白講 你問我說你是要持有新台幣還是要持有美金如果我有選擇方便的話如果方便的話我當然希望持有美金那我還沒有匯率的我還不會規避匯率的問題啊我們的保險業也不用買那麼多的那麼多的這個在外國投資的時候要買那麼多的這個平衡保險啊不用避那麼多險 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
469.653 |
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483.289 |
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那這些問題馬上就會來所以我是認為說定這個東西非定不可確實因為時代來了你不改變不行但是很多問題要先想清楚你M2的供給 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
484.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
506.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
如果美國這邊一比一他是鎖美國公債跟美金而且要鎖住那麼多才能發行等量的穩定幣那美國公債就是因為美國政府要讓他賣他的公債他認為他的美國公債的這個價值跟他的美金現鈔是一樣的這我們能理解台灣的穩定幣發行如果不要鎖百分之百的你說資產資產怎麼估資產有貶值的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
511.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
538.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
那將來我的這個這個穩定幣的發行結果我的資產事實上我發行的時候百分之百那漲跌的時候要怎麼調整再來如果我跌的時候我的穩定幣還是發行在那邊那我的貨幣的總體供給就增加出來了喔另外在流通的時候我不用信貸幣交易我用穩定幣交易整體的貨如果你把它當作支付的工具當作貨幣的一個形式的話那整體的貨幣供給也是增加的 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
538.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
565.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
委員剛才講的這些都是非常非常深入的問題就是開放這樣一個新的業種以後會產生什麼樣的影響這其實就是我們在日常開會還有找專家學者在仔細研商因為未來我們要定那個那個穩定幣的管理辦法包括剛才這些全部都要考慮這些問題而且我看到當然不是你的問題法務部的那個草案說到那個三年以上十年以下然後罰兩千萬到 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
568.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
572.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
幾千萬到兩億這個如果給你出一個包動輒金額是幾百億幾千億的你罰那麼一點點這樣夠嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
577.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
598.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
這個罰則的部分當然我們有提出來當然就是也要社會有共識看要做什麼而且這個如果出包那個包子大要小心所以它背後的一些封控像剛剛包括一些準備資產像剛剛委員提到那個準備資產的穩定程度還有對外的揭露還有一些平常的調控監控這都是 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
600.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
627.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
這個索性是國外已經有一段時間的經驗了那我們這部分我們剛好在後面再進來的人比較多可以參考啦我是覺得我個人如果我的理解是多參考一下啦當然有一併要這麼急嘛這是一個考慮我們其實沒有急我剛剛跟委員講說我們但是不要落後我覺得再提醒你一次一個問題喔前一陣子光是這個比特幣被震盪的那一下因為槓桿的關係很多人被清倉強制平倉就Clean |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
628.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
646.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
這也是剛剛有委員提到說要不要開放這些演商的商品我們就非常謹慎是我要提醒你我再次提醒你台灣人的特性賺錢沒有人會感謝政府集體賠的錢就要找你算帳找你負責你一定要記得這個特性謝謝謝謝委員的提醒謝謝好 謝謝吳委員接下來我們請鍾嘉賓委員 |