| IVOD_ID |
164785 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/164785 |
| 日期 |
2025-10-29 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-36-5 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期司法及法制委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
5 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
36 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
司法及法制委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期司法及法制委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-10-29T11:11:20+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-10-29T11:26:58+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:15:38 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3d43f2f62388da51280f680358516d6dd0e1721cc507f77ac51656f8b51a994ad286ba3e6171f3d45ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
莊瑞雄 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:11:20 - 11:26:58 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-10-29T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期司法及法制委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請行政院人事行政總處人事長列席報告業務概況及立法計畫，並備質詢。
【10月29日及30日兩天一次會】） |
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好 謝謝召委有請我們人事長召委早人事長我看你今天都臭鼻鼻的我上來以後你看那個智慧那個儀板已經降到1000所以大家我來質詢大家身體都很健康但是還是要針對問題來你那個人事總署本來我們是我記得我們上個會議原住民族碎石記憶架 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
31.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
55.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
这个修法已经从假期从一天延长为三天这个意义重大但是以现在来看的话就是说这个社会跟族人对权力的认知其实也不太够没有办法去落实那上一次我觉得质询的时候我说我们的行事历里面应该清楚去标示岁时计一假不要只付一个王子 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
56.872 |
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71.562 |
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目標當然就是說你政策要去做一個落實讓請假的人可以安心你告訴我沒問題 任市長你又跳票我委員報告啦因為原民會他這部分還沒有公告 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
72.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
97.701 |
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我們有去找幾天 他就還要公告的嘛所以日期是哪幾天就沒辦法寫所以我們現在用替代的方案就是直接用網路Hyperlink過讓他確定了以後直接就到這個網址去查上次我委員大贏的 召委大贏的就是碎石祭那三天 稍後清澈嘛我有在大贏的嘛但是到不前一陣子 延民會那個主流還不給我 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
98.652 |
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128.055 |
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所以這個就機關的問題啦對啊這個就機關的問題因為我答應我一定最辦法做得到好不好 這個政策要去落實要讓請假的人因為這個整個修法我相信這個其實是對一個族群的一個尊重啦那立法院這個地方修法通過那我相信行政部門機關跟機關之間你們本來就是要去溝通好你現在本來你現在已經要在位了嘛你本來也要贏了不然你已經贏出來了嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
129.156 |
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145.57 |
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是啊,你印好了,你印好了,你賣你的,所以你就空白在那裡啊。我們只好用錯過網站的話,是用替代的方式來執行。當然啦,機關之間其實有時候啊,你說園民會該什麼時候,那你就應該先跟他講。你在印的時候,你告訴他要怎麼做?問題說在什麼地方?還有罰函。 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
157.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
171.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
原民會就要打屁股了其實這個攸關整個族人裡面他們在請假的時候讓他自己上班的一個單位一個客戶就誰知道嘛說這時候就碎石記憶架這都已經兩年通過了這變國家的一個制度 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
174.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
197.017 |
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讓他可以很安心好不好這個部分應該是機關之間應該是大家進一步去做一個溝通第二個我想上次我在質詢的時候有去提到這個國際的一個警示就是說韓國的資料中心發生那一場大火這個公務機資料全失服務也都停擺 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
199.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
209.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
連韓國總統都出來講說這罐早就預期到有可能發生的事情竟然讓它去發生了那我想要就教的就是說像我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
211.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
236.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
人事總署你掌管著高基民的一個資料那我們是不是有備援或者異地這樣的一個備份就是說我們建立一個完整資料備份跟異地的一個備援這部分人事總署家謝謝委員我做好事嗎事實上這個裡面分兩個部分一個是系統的備援對於就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
238.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
255.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
辦公室的基盤被撤去另外一座基盤就開了那是第一種第二就是資料備份就是這次韓國的主要就是資料備份你資料備份我以前財政部資料備份一定有三分我現在就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
259.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
275.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
電腦的部分 主機的部分 系統的部分我們有另外一組備份還有另外一組資料備份在中央新村所以你的部分就是說完整的資料備份還有異地的備份都有具備 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
276.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
292.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
所以不用煩惱啦 不用像韓國那樣賣啦 不會發生我也覺得韓國這個我覺得很奇怪很韓國所以這個都是一個借鏡另外大家都知道說是這個AI大爆發那我們很多 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
293.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
311.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
的公務機關公務人員大家也都要去使用尤其是一些生成式的一個AI系統裡面大家會寫寫公文或者說去發文的時候甚至於問他很聰明但是我們最擔心的就是說你這個AI可以幫助這個行政 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
312.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
333.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
但是如果涉及到安全跟倫理的部分很有可能造成資料的一個外洩跟信任的一個危機我不知道我們人種這個地方針對於我們這麼多的一個公務人員尤其是我們政府部門也開了很多的一個課程這樣像這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
336.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
351.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
公務員員長很機密的東西把他丟到那個全部GPD好了丟上去了要做公務員要快一點要問問題要快一點那造成你整個機密我如果全部GPD我有後台 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
353.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
374.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
會有整個資料外洩有信任的一個風險我不曉得那個任市長你的看法我跟昭偉報告大概分兩個部分第一個是國科會他有第一個使用的指引就是所有的機關那我們人種基本上也是based on這樣的一個指引 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
375.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
398.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
等於就是一般開放型的open data的東西本來就是在雲端你可以去透過生成式AI無論是GPT還是其他的去問你輸贏的事情但是到我們開發到我們公務機關有限的我們是採落地型的直接在我們這裡現在第一個階段是這樣第二個階段 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
399.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
427.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
現在塑化部他也是在去建構一個Try AI的機制讓各個政府機關以並駐一個大內網的概念讓所有政府機關就要用不用讓大家機關各自去設立因為大家機關各自設立的成本會被他管管理的成本會比較好你那個答非所問我的意思就是說公務人員在使用這個AI的時候尤其啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
428.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
447.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
我就跟他講 你的A卡手的 我就給他機密文件 給我寫一張之後 給我等一段時間 叫他給我生成這個都會涉及到你整個機密文件 這個整個資料會有外洩的一個風險啦 我在講是在講這個啊那是內控的事情啊 什麼內控而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
448.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
452.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
這不是只有內空就算是內空這個顯然就跟韓國那個一樣這個是顯然是可以遇見的那你的準備是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
461.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
478.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
基本上第一個我們可以做的就是把這些資料去做simulation的比對如果有的話就直接攔下來第二個是從他的消息記錄裡面去查他如果再放在你這個生成系統裡面你們他在使用的時候你們攔得下來嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
479.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
501.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
他也知名 我要做一個公文而已他也要登出 我們會有一個cross check的機制沒有問題喔我們一定要做那個啊不然出事 我們發生事情我們也要有一些紀錄去查詢啊這個非常重要啦 這個非常重要啦沒有 我要先跟你示警就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
506.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
533.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
這個顯然也可以一定可以預見的要做好準備啦一定會發現的啊公務機關常常也在洩密太沒想說洩密公務機關啊外人怎麼去給你洩你的密又沒有人知道不是這樣子嗎所以現在都有洩密的風險更何況你用AI你用GPT你用生成式的AI哪有可能他沒有那個風險不會去增加不是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
535.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
563.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
風險一定會增加但是我了解大部分的機關都有買一個偵測軟體叫DLP就是把所有可能有疑慮的這一些東西它第一層會攔截第二層是從記錄裡面去trace它有做什麼事情我認為有高風險我們會把它調出來做分析所以我要跟你講就是說你們要本來就是要有制定指引嘛你這指引你一定要有嘛你使用的一個規範嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
564.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
576.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
這本來你就要去建制的嘛你現在是去大量的訓練讓公務人員去使用讓他更方便思考大家也變聰明了但是我要提醒的就這一些風險啦好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
577.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
602.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
你一定要去做 最後一個問題我來請教就是說 看一下我們中央機關中央機構員工一般健康補助的一個我看你們這個標準 你就看那個標準很有意思第一類 政務人員中央三級機關以上的政府首長 司長相當等級以上的主管人員中央二級機關的 你每年一次健康檢查是一萬六 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
605.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
624.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
第二類40歲以上的公教人員還有連續服務滿一年的兩年就一次你給我看第三類第三類我就含有意見未滿40歲且從事有危險安全及衛生顧慮工作的公教人員每三年 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
626.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
644.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
當然服務滿一年這合理啦你這個就變三千五這個就比較奇怪一點就是說那既然認為它是有危害安全跟衛生顧慮的這頂多算三年一概念你不覺得這樣的一個規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
647.728 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
669.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
我不曉得任市長你的看法是怎麼樣這要公平 這個制度 健全這個制度這樣要公平我們任總這個地方是公務人力政策的一個整體的一個協調者你要負責去整合整個福利的一個資源規劃制度讓它更公平才對 不是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
672.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
683.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
這點我跟委員報告啦 我們還要跟保証會合調啦因為健檢要點是一定的啦剛才我跟委員說的是四十月以來四十月以下 但是他要考慮的風險 黑管的那個是不是那個東西你不可以說一定的啦公教人員 公務人員 人力資源 這樣本來就扔啦福利政策裡面 你制度本來就要把它弄得更公平不是這樣子嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
705.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
727.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
第三類 反而三千五你要提高而且他是有危險安全跟衛生顧慮的人你算三年一次第一類人一年是一萬六你這種有危害安全工作跟衛生疑慮的你反而三年才一次而且你錢還更少 三千五你這個邏輯在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
729.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
756.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
其實我要跟委員報告 因為這個費用的基礎中央的部分應該是OK 但是地方我一定要跟地方去合作因為地方很明顯的人有可能會合作 所以要去算他的補償第三類不是只有地方啦中央地方都有啊 是嘛所以你就不要先給地方 中央也有啊我來解讀這個叫大小眼 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
758.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
779.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
越危險的,你頂到三年那一屆,而且頂到金額,還是更少其實你想想看,我們還規定到四十歲,很多公務人員進去二十幾歲,還不到三十歲就進去了那年輕公務人員,我在那看,大家都有,今天他們沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
781.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
802.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
你會當到政務人員的年紀都比較大了年紀越大其實健康檢查裡面是不是用這樣的一個方式而且那個差距太大一年一次的一萬六三年一次的三千五這個邏輯我想不通其實最重要的就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
804.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
805.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
我會講啦 警消啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
822.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
849.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
夜班的人啦機場的外勤人員啦那種工作強度高風險大的三年一次你真的覺得夠你真的覺得哪個第一類有的政務人員不要再騙我了你知道嗎很多很高階的文官不是說他不應該保障他他的工作未必會比在第一線尤其涉及到危害安全或者警消夜班的人員 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
851.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
872.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
你去比較的時候 我怎麼比你跟我說的 我都聽不懂的我委員報告啦 你說的那個高風險的 我們現在已經在簽約當中了啦你跟考試院家 跟考試院這邊你們自己本身你們應該去建議去調整啦或者透過院計之間的一個政策協調機制來進行制度上的一個檢討啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
873.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
898.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
有啦 最近就是老委員在講的那個喔 三天一天的 我們這次最近已經要簽名的 那就是改造整理一天了我們常常在講 賴總統在講健康台灣的 對不對這個其實也都是其中的一個一環 尤其你們看到新年制度有 你們也知道不夠所以你們推出健康99的方案 那你今年結束以後 黃孟里你明年會不會繼續辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
902.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
918.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
會喔 很好喔那我剛提那個問題我認為啦用你這個反而是更危險的然後有那個健康跟安全之餘的你那個三年一次而且金額是最低應該好好去做一個制度上的一個討論很嚴肅的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
920.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
934.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
不然高官越高的人他就身體檢查一年就一次就一萬六更危險的警消這個部分三年才一次夜班的人而且是三千五不合理 制度上應該去做檢討好不好好 謝謝 |