| IVOD_ID |
164581 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/164581 |
| 日期 |
2025-10-22 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-20-3 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期財政委員會第3次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
3 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期財政委員會第3次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-10-22T11:27:49+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-10-22T11:40:43+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:12:54 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/615807a88c5be4da94ece8dddd3e2a77e29853ba2d60c06d83c966d97180d5d2fe35119236caa9935ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
黃珊珊 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:27:49 - 11:40:43 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-10-22T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第3次全體委員會議（事由：邀請行政院主計總處、財政部就「中央對直轄市及縣（市）政府補助辦法修正後，一般性補助款審查與評比基準、財務計畫檢核基礎、撥款方式等規範及作業程序為何？修改財力級次計算公式之合理性及對各縣市補助款影響為何？計畫型補助款範圍與業務定義？對各縣市未來整體財政補助金額之影響」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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謝謝主席 我請主席長還有財政部次長好 請主席長還有阮次長委員好兩位首長好我想大家都非常關心的還是財政部昨天再邀了地方政府討論財化法那昨天開會的狀況怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
33.771 |
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57.123 |
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昨天我覺得是大家有一個非常不錯的一個交換意見最起碼就是就整個分配的架構大家是有共識我看到你們的是說統籌款跟一般性補助款不低於7177就是2015的目標嘛就是我們立法院立法的原意對吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
58.304 |
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69.92 |
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但是統籌性統籌款是統籌款然後一般性補助款還有計畫性補助款這中間的關係尤其是今年你們預算已經編了請問這個新的討論跟你的預算編列會做什麼樣的調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
74.403 |
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87.46 |
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我們基本上我昨天溝通的是針對統籌分配稅統籌款統籌款那部分補助款那部分由總署那邊來負責所以補助款就是主計處的對 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
89.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
110.446 |
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那基本上昨天就是對剛剛講對分配市長啊我還是一樣我剛問的是預算已經編了明年各地方政府也編了預算現在立法院雖然還沒開始審但是你們將來這個法說年底才要送來請問我預算審了你法又來修那到底是預算先過還是法要先過啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
111.748 |
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124.921 |
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是這樣子 你了解我的意思嗎我知道你的法又在修 我的預算又這樣編然後法又修來的時候又不一樣立法院也不見得會通過你們的版本所以到時候一定變成一個又要追加減 是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
126.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
141.324 |
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如果是我們就是說會在這個年底前送修法案的話到年底前只剩下71天116年立法院正要審預算所以我不知道要怎麼審 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
142.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
169.646 |
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對 但是我們這個案子一定是從116年以後才開始用不會影響到115年不影響 所以我們預算可以照審你的法可以照過你的意思是這樣我還是要回到原點一年多了立法院這一屆一上任就要修裁划法這一年多你們說一直在找地方政府開了幾次會 到昨天還在開會我實在不知道你們到現在為止還拿不出自己的版本到底是怎麼回事 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
170.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
189.999 |
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這一年多都是白搭都在睡覺不會跟委員報告其實我們現在積極在做你們積極在做這我已經聽了一年了耳朵都開始長繭了我在說年底一定有版本一定有相關未來所有的可長可久卓院長口中說請鄭麗君副院長來做相關的統籌請問你們開過幾次會跟鄭副院長 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
195.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
200.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
我們基本上我剛才講過就是說我們爭取能夠我問你們開過幾次會我們開過四次會了 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
203.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
225.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
我問跟鄭副院長開過幾次會?跟副院長那邊開,那個算不清楚了開柴化法的會開過幾次?開過很多次會,我已經記不出來多少次什麼時候開始開的?開到現在還在開啊?就一直在溝通,一直在精進相關的法案的內容好,那昨天這個會,主計處有沒有參加? |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
226.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
249.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
有有有有參加主席長沒有參加沒有那都是比較其實技術層面的同仁在在在我的想法很簡單啦就是只有71天你們自己溝通你還有一個東西叫做跟立法院溝通我們現在沒有聽到你們要跟我們溝通的意思而且過程裡面我一直問版本到現在為止只看到上次院長在 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
251.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
262.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
議長說我有版本在手上這個版本到現在沒有見過光次長很簡單我們在這個財政委員會這總要見公婆的啦時間到了 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
263.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
289.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
不管省預算也好還是要財化法的版本也好都必須要在這邊做審查另外國民黨本身的公私爭議的還有補助款的爭議它都有版本而且都進付二讀了11月中就可以表決了所以到時候表決通過的是立法院的版本你們的版本又擺在後面了這才是我覺得行政機關最大的問題這是我所以我跟你不要讓這種事情發生吧再來善後善後再善後 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
290.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
315.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
要嘛就快一點要嘛就跟立法院好好溝通怎麼樣在這個財化法上面能夠找到一個最大的共識而不是只是你們在閉門造局當然當然當然所以謝謝委員的指教這個也是我們未來要處理的事情現在看起來就是你們慢慢慢慢拖拖拖才會拖到今天這樣的僵局到現在還要去跟地方政府開會地方政府來這邊開過幾次會 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
318.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
334.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
重視人家就不會拖到現在重視人家的意見就不會讓地方政府還要到你們那邊來哭窮如果立法院沒有幫他們通過他們永遠在看你們的臉色我覺得今天的問題是行政機關請尊重地方政府什麼叫財政自主 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
334.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
349.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
我覺得應該地方政府不是看中央的臉色不要把它當成你們的下屬機關大家是一種合作關係這是中華民國是大家的這個我完全贊同所以財政地方自主是地方自治非常重要的精神 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
350.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
374.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
那中央是要去怎麼樣協助或平衡但是不是把它當成你們的籌碼去做分配這個很重要接下來次長我還有一個問題我們現在很多政府的政策是鼓勵所謂的終身學習再次進修目前新的世界已經來臨 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
376.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
405.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
尤其是像人工智慧 區塊鏈各種新興的技術那現在全時的工作者都會選擇再回到學校進修不過我們目前為止台灣有非常多的大學開了在職專班還有EMBA但是在我們的稅法裡面對於這些終身學習好像沒有給予特別的優惠或者是說我們現在的所謂的扣除額裡面它有一定的限制所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
406.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
419.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
如果我的小孩在念大學我可以扣但我自己念書不能扣你覺得這樣合理嗎跟委員報告目前的稅法規定對這是不是我們應該要做一些檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
423.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
446.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
所以我简单的让我说明一下目前的规定就是说目前我们对子女的教育补助费每年是2.5万元这个是子女很少啦针对他的抚养心思现在念书怎么可能只有2.5万元所以说刚才委员提到本人那一部分那我们是目前是做法是说从他的薪资目前是用薪资特别扣除 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
446.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
474.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
去扣或者是列舉扣除額比如說你職業專用的服裝進修訓練費或職業上工具的支出這個我都知道但是它有很多的限制嘛第一個要跟工作有關的技能我如果是念法務我要去念法律它才能扣但是我去念法務我去念EMBA可能就不能扣我的意思是說終身學習不應該做這些限制第二個扣減的比例很低因為薪資特別扣除額扣得比較多所以在美國它其實有一個終身學習 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
477.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
500.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
減稅額每一個夫妻合併申報不超過18萬美元的話本人配偶受撫養人的大學研究所跟專業學位都可以申請扣減最高限額抵稅金2000美金也就是6萬元這個我認為我們也會在裁判會來提案因為我覺得終身學習尤其是我自己在讀書不能扣我的小孩讀書可以扣這很奇怪 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
501.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
527.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
那金額也不高但是接下來的世界我剛剛說非常的新連我們現在包括我們這個年紀我們可能都要去學一下AI了這些東西都不會是停下來的所以委員這個概念很好啦但是我是覺得就是說我們會提案那也請你們開始研議這部分的金額跟相關的稅損有可能有減少多少我相信不會太多 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
528.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
553.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
我們到時候會精算但是我覺得目前我們是希望因為現在扣除額實在太多了就造成就是說百分之將近一半的人這就是大家都因為中華民國萬萬歲只能一直找扣除額不然要怎麼辦現在碩士在職專班有5.3萬人也就是說這是國家很重要的人才苦如果大家願意去讀書我們應該是鼓勵的好嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
554.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
558.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
我們當然一定要鼓勵但是是不是一定要用稅的方式好最後一個問題主席長我想問一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
562.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
591.036 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
還有財政部賴總統8年要直接興建13萬戶的社會住宅到現在所謂的直接興辦社會住宅的百萬戶租屋家庭支持計畫聽說還沒有核定沒有核定的原因是各部會審查意見還是希望內政部說要有更多的錢去買地但是主計總署反對請問是主計總署在反對蓋社宅嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
592.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
615.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
我們是沒有反對說蓋社宅可是你們說要尊潔減少國庫財務負擔所以到現在沒有核定的原因是這個嗎不是因為事實上就是說你租屋補貼和建社宅這兩個到底要採哪一個或者是說所以不是主計總署的意見那賴總統的政見要不要執行啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
616.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
639.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
這是要執行的但是就是說我執行的方式要用什麼方式來對它最容易合訂計畫都有這麼難嗎至少先合訂然後大家去找裁員本來就是這樣啊你連合訂計畫都沒有那連合訂都不合訂所以根本不知道要怎麼辦現在有方法了嗎百萬社宅蓋不蓋嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
640.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
654.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
她是社宅她不是她百萬的一個包括租屋補貼嘛租屋補貼嘛租屋制裁計畫辦不辦嘛這個計畫是她的總統政見到現在一年了還在指紋樓梯響 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
656.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
667.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
所以25萬裡面分為就是我都知道細節我只問你們這個計劃要不要辦還是什麼時候會核定還是主席處一開始就說不要是誰在打是誰在停 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
671.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
691.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
我問各部會 各部會說是主計處的意見反對啊那什麼時候要給我答案我們這個會期要審預算啦所以我想知道這個百萬社宅住宅基金的相關的計畫尤其是百萬租屋家庭支持計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
693.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
721.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
今年年底會不會有個計畫有沒有一個完整的計畫還是你主計處告訴給我一個你們的意見完整的給我這個部分就是說內政部他是怎樣我們是再來跟他一個我們希望如果是政府要做主計處不應該是那個阻礙的人我們沒有阻礙我們只是提供更好的分析給他參考財政部也一樣剛剛講沒有錢請問你們要去找錢才有辦法做這件事聽起來是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
722.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
727.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
所以財政部的立場呢我們要不要支持百萬戶租屋家庭支持計畫呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
728.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
757.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
因為這個就是健全這個房市市場的一部分嘛所以基本上它是一個國家的政策一年了這個計畫連影子都沒有這很離譜啊好不好兩位你們身為財主機關我覺得如果我們百萬家庭的租屋計畫沒有裁員那你們就要大聲的去向其他單位說大家要怎麼來想辦法而不是只是提了一個空殼的計畫好嗎沒有核定這件事情很離譜啊好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
760.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
775.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
好 謝謝黃森山委員我想財政部跟主席處這一部分剛剛黃委員的這個質詢的內容這一部分應該跟行政院來好好溝通信訴核定這是賴總統的一個 |