| IVOD_ID |
164407 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/164407 |
| 日期 |
2025-10-20 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-35-6 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第6次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
6 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
35 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
外交及國防委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第6次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-10-20T11:01:27+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-10-20T11:12:28+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:01 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/03f010abd9bb8d1b7616265d87adc9699336e3c0e2d3d52383c966d97180d5d22d0461bc9268856f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
賴士葆 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:01:27 - 11:12:28 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-10-20T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第6次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國防部部長顧立雄報告「潛艦國造原型艦海測執行現況及因應作為」，併請台灣國際造船股份有限公司董事長列席，並備質詢。） |
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謝謝主席以及各位先進有請副參謀總長副總長還有楊常務次長還有陸軍司令部的陳這個參謀長陸軍參謀長首先我想先請教陸軍 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
23.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
41.141 |
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幾位長官好先請教陸軍參謀長因為有人提到說今天三棟二砲營的軍官在砲撤中心跳樓已經走了有沒有這個意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
41.681 |
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報告委員是的有這件遺憾的事情這件事情到底是為什麼跳樓我們去了解這個從一早我們就循著戰情系統就直接的掌握時間什麼時候在凌晨五點五十分的時候跳下來這樣是墜樓 |
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60.078 |
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他的軍階是什麼樣中衛副連長中衛副連長沒有去了解為什麼原因他目前是 他是302旅但是他是在砲車中心接受這個基地訓練是 要力太大還是什麼樣不知道 細節目前因為我們已經在第一時間我們也封鎖了現場那也通知了雲林憲兵隊那目前也因為是營區內的重大傷損案件那目前是有檢調來介入調查確定是自殺 |
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90.284 |
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這個我不能因為報告委員這個我剛已經報告說這個是有檢調要來介入調查和釐清 |
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98.407 |
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119.464 |
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你大概什麼時候會對外說明一下還是我剛才說的這個因為已經介入到檢調來處理好你請回喔這個你遺憾啦這是遺憾啦到底是怎麼樣啊是不是訓練壓力太大還是怎麼樣啦那個副參謀總長我先請問你啊這個部長今天早上來了一下講啦說這個一般 |
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潛艦都要七年以上 我們現在五年多言下之意 就是我們的進度delay是理所當然的會這樣子嗎 就是我們的潛艦到底第一艘什麼時候可以出來 |
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鮑威實際上我們國家是第一次自立建造潛艦當然會面對非常多的挑戰我們當然是希望做最詳盡的計畫能夠在我們希望的時間之內獲得但是 |
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151.053 |
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170.971 |
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各單位都非常的努力那我們也有很多地方也獲得了突破但是我相信也可以理解在這個過程中一定會遭到非常多的困難跟挑戰所以部長這樣講我就請教因為時間有限是不是最少要七年現在五年多我們要再等一年多才可能看到 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
171.271 |
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171.932 |
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最順利 最少7年如果按計劃的話我們計劃是5年那當然是看到現在各項的情況我們來根據實際的狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
186.853 |
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191.475 |
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在安全跟符合我們的需求的計畫現在你不要變成一個現在什麼都沒有整合系統就是沒辦法整合我們很擔心給你這麼多錢700億加起來才500億會不會變成爛尾劍 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
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221.613 |
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那根據海軍的說明那是一些這個額外的因素發生之後我們也做了調整那他們也做了整合實際上這個相關的困難都在排除中這個也很在也也很在這個繼續的推動這個進展應該是可以不會造成這個所謂您所謂的這種 不會 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
224.155 |
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227.316 |
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我們很擔心這個因為你現在三階段第一階段輻射是不是輻航輻航都沒有完成還要潛水的潛航還深水的潛航第一階段都沒有了安全的原則下這個要一步一步達成我們的供性能所以說當然是做詳細的測試都在繼續在進行中我請教另外一個問題大家很關心的 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
250.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
264.234 |
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就是我們現在交了像美國買武器交了錢還沒有到的外面外面是說大概200億美金這個數字到底有沒有錯好 那我就想省紀部特別針對F16特別預算F16特別預算是2500億左右喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
269.677 |
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290.324 |
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這個他講的在這審計部講的114年6月匯出去47.2億美金佔了總金額59億美金的六成我們我們已經付了六成結果第一架原來說112年要出廠delay到今年的 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
291.124 |
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305.12 |
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Q1現在還在美國根本都沒有交貨那現在美國說115年的Q3開始交115年的Q4完成交貨你會這麼樂觀看嗎這部分我請空軍參謀長做講解空軍參謀長來 |
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309.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
325.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
委員好 我是工進消防長跟委員報告這個交貨的部分我們付款的部分在112年以前因為都還沒有交機所以我們是按他的發價書來付款113年以後因為他的交機delay所以說我們並沒有實際的付款給他 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
326.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
351.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
那在 這個省經部的報告省經部的報告是75我們已經付了75但是事實上 75%我們到今年底我們只付了61那沒有交機的部分我們都按照跟美方的這個討論之後好 現在我就問一個很重要的問題啦因為這個特別預算是115年底就明年底要執行完畢如果那時候都還沒有交完貨怎麼辦 你告訴我怎麼辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
353.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
365.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
我們會按程序做預算的保留因為現在看起來是風險是非常的高所以就是你講說明年底交不了60價就對了啦我們評估風險很高就交不了啦簡單來講就是交不了這樣就對了那這個東西你保留預算我覺得另外有個方式嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
377 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
389.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
你這個可以特別預算來修改一下不就好了把那個後面時間往後延一下不就好了這個我們會按程序來走程序你是說保留還是保留保留很久預算保留跟執行年度我們都會一併檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
390.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
409.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
好另外一個另外一個最後一個問題我要講一下現在你們正在發展一個東西叫做軍民兩用無人機就是無人機平時轉轉平站的轉換就平時轉為暫時所以就是軍商用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
411.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
425.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
軍商規 共用軍商共用的規格第一個小問題來問一下那個副總長你知道現在的操控手或者是空軍司令的那個參謀長那個我說要訓練一千個人結果只訓練三百個人 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
428.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
444.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
然後現在規定 按照我們國防部的規定針對於大陸港澳產品是不可以用大陸產品那你現在軍跟商用的無人機是共用那商的部分很多是大陸的晶片 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
445.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
463.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
這一來的話這裡面風險其實蠻高的按照你們的規定來講這個如何的避免這個事情你們正在發生這個喔比如說這個有叫軍民共規策略軍民通用無人機能量籌建這兩個大計畫都在做這個事情來 長官要不要回答一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
465.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
484.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
哪一位長官可以回答我請採購室主任跟您做個詳細回答簡單來講就是居民方面裡面無論幾很多是大陸的晶片結果你現在要轉換為暫時那都是有 因為就有這個大家所擔心的治安的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
485.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
506.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
委員好 國防財務室主任跟您報告不管是軍用還是商用我們對於這個廠商的要求我們規定是不能夠有錄製品也就是說像無人機它是屬於軍用商用很多錄製品的 怎麼沒有呢商用也是我們包含買商用的無人機或軍用無人機一律是禁止這個錄製品我們都有這個履約 履約督導還有這個驗收的這個規定這個不是我講的喔 是審計部講的喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
515.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
543.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
你們的國防部的採購契約買無人機方面沒有與國防部的這個履約驗收作業指導的相關規定審計部 這個話審計部講不是我講的啊審計部講的啊審計資料我們辦的 我們訂的這個作業指導是在去年8月30號訂的也就是這個指導之後我們是確實落實按照這個作業指導來執行這個履約督導和驗收 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
544.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
550.791 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
我不知道你怎麼去管到民間的民間買無人機你怎麼去管得到民間買的商用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
551.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
565.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
民間買對啊 軍民兩用啊 軍民兩用啊你沒有聽懂我意思我們有軍用商規的五輪機我們也會去買商規的 商用的五輪機可是就在這個採購的規定裡頭有這個非常明確的綠定它不可以裡頭有這個大陸的你沒聽懂我意思我現在講是你們在發展一個叫軍民 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
575.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
598.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
居民共規策略就是軍用的無人機跟民間用的無人機民間用的無人機你沒辦法阻止他他的無人機裡面有大陸的晶片可是我們在採購的時候我們就會檢查他如果我們要買的是軍用商規的無人機也就是這種這個一般外面商業生產的這個無人機的時候他裡頭必須 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
600.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
607.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
不能有大陸的所以等於說民間你們現在有兩個計畫一個是你們 一個是經濟部經濟部是軍民通用無人機能量籌建有兩個 都是說我這個按照好好的方法想就是擴大我們無人機的規模啦size啦這不是壞事但是就是在民間他會用到的無人機裡面的晶片是大陸做的晶片 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
628.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
636.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
可是他只要進入軍方的採購我們就會限制他不得使用大陸方面的零件我講一句話就結束了審計部打你們的臉說你們的採購契約無人機的採購契約沒有與國防部的相關的作為指導你回去檢討好不好審計部給你們的一個糾正這是糾正喔他裡面有讀了一下糾正你們就是代表你剛剛講的話你沒有落實 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
656.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
660.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
我們現在的確已經在開始落實這個相關的概念現在在開始落實是謝謝好 謝謝委員 |