| IVOD_ID |
163552 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/163552 |
| 日期 |
2025-08-19 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
院會-11-3-25 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期第25次會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
25 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
院會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期第25次會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-08-19T14:30:21+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-08-19T14:46:09+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:15:48 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/906c3280ae286f11938d26562e2196a218ad07c9952a2a53c376a4f2be5d241cda6e6bdae5930a855ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
鍾佳濱 |
| 委員發言時間 |
14:30:21 - 14:46:09 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-08-19T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
第11屆第3會期第25次會議（事由：一、行政院院長提出「新世代打擊詐欺策略行動綱領2.0執行成效」專案報告並備質詢（8月15日）。二、行政院院長提出「全額撥付114年度對地方政府之一般性補助款及原住民族地區基本設施維持費等相關事宜」專案報告並備質詢（8月19日）。） |
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主席 在場的委員先進列席的總經事長 官員 會長 工作夥伴 媒體 記者 影視先生有請卓院長及主席長以及莊部長麻煩請卓院長 主席長來任務備詢 |
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總委員好院長好主席長好莊部長好今天我要請教的題目是中央財稅分配應考慮城鄉發展所得統計以呈現稅負公平目標請問卓院長最近為了災後重建美國關稅衝擊我看到了勞動部發布了一些對勞工的獎勵或補助或支撐措施您知道嗎相當多元知道 很多元 |
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我昨天看到勞動部發布了一個消息說明年的基本工資將渴望調高可能高達3%甚至勞團建議4%你覺得是什麼原因需不需要調整 |
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這個調整都有一定討論的時程跟過程那最後除了聽取大家意見之外我們衡量國家的財政面臨的各種國內外情勢抱歉勞工的基本薪資跟政府的財政沒有關聯他跟我們的經濟成長跟我們的物價指數還有跟勞工的薪資所得要不要提升有關而且是由 |
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学者专家另外政府以外的一个团体结合工商雇主跟劳工代表共同来讨论对不对我们还是会考虑到他调整所以说如果基本薪资调高是不是反映着我们的劳工朋友会乐于见到这样的过程过去的几年我们都连续的调高是的这是一个政府努力带动经济成长利润分配劳工的一个做法所以劳动部这样的一个消息揭露是很振奋人心但是我又看到另外的新闻 |
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人事總書表示說明年軍工調薪啊只有兩個版本一個是不調一個是3%看起來不調的可能性大請教一下如果說今天經濟成長我們可以帶動基本薪資的提高那為什麼公教沒有政府沒有錢幫公教加薪呢主席這不是很衝突嗎為什麼沒有辦法幫宗教加薪這個部分也是要看我們整個一個裁員的結構 |
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現在財源 明年沒有足夠的財源可以幫公教加薪對 麥克風大聲一點你要很清楚的告訴國人尤其是告訴全國的公教朋友今天我們政府可以帶動經濟成長可以讓勞工朋友明年的基本工資渴望調高 |
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將近3%甚至4%但是我們政府中央的財政困難沒有能力幫全國的公教加薪是不是這樣子其實一方面也是因為我們沒有要發展就是因為財化法把中央的收入撥給了地方對不對 |
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昨天早上也是這樣表達嗎我們中央的財源被地方拿走了嗎是不是所以民間經濟成長老闆可以幫勞工加薪基本薪資可以提高但是作為雇主的中央政府沒有辦法沒有餘裕幫全國公教調薪是不是這樣 |
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像今年 今年的調薪中央政府單獨負擔是122億可是我們會補給地方90億地方另外還有50億自行負擔那未來這樣的結構必須要做改變這個改變之前要讓地方知道所以說你要大聲的告訴他那如果因為中央沒有錢幫全國公教調薪地方政府有錢可不可以單獨幫地方的公務員調薪可不可以但是我們考慮到公務員的薪資還是要有全國的一致性 |
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今天台南市議會都通過啊 認為台南市政府有餘裕啊要普發 加碼普發現金 你有沒有看到這個新聞其實任何的社會福利跟這種政策啊 都應該他有那你知道黃市長怎麼說嗎他說如果要發不是發一千 要發就要發一萬啊 |
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289.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
如果地方政府有財慾 要做好人 大家都會做今天中央的財政 因為財政收支發放法這樣調整之後中央比地方窮 中央沒有辦法幫公交加薪地方比較有錢 地方來幫公交人員調薪 可以嗎這樣可能有失全國公務員公平的這個機制又要馬兒好 又要馬兒不吃草不給中央草 又要地方的馬兒肥這是不可能的嘛 所以我們來往下看這個就是統計數字 來 我看到昨天一個很大的新聞 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
290.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
318.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
青年所得再創新高31歲以下年平均收入將近56萬元56萬元什麼意思我跟院長說一下56萬元除以12一個月要拿4萬6多的薪水月薪那如果你全國不要拿年輕人全國平均所得是73萬平均月薪大概是6萬以上院長你認識的年輕朋友3歲以下的有多少比例是拿到4萬6以上的月薪 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
318.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
343.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
所以這只是長年來一樣的統計數據跟計算的方式我覺得要呈現出來的應該更貼近真實呈顯的跟人民的感受是不是有距離我們經常跟主席總書說你公佈平均數真正大家感受的是中位數我再給你拿一個數字如果你拿114年每個月的薪資所得經常信薪資所得未滿30歲的平均數是3萬4啊中位數是3萬啊跟你們發布的數據 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
346.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
370.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
年輕人的感受差很多啊中位數三萬接近我們的基本工資兩萬八千六平均數多了四千塊是不是所以是哪一個數字才能貼近人民的感受主席是平均數還是中位數這個部分平均數是四萬六但是中位數是三萬八因為這是我們暗示我了解我說哪一個比較貼近人民的感受你認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
372.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
397.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
當然是中位數 這就是問題我再告訴你下一個數字這是我們未滿30歲每個月經常薪資你拿中位數跟平均數來看從109年到114年中位數比平均數差了2700到現在差到了3400有沒有看到什麼叫做中位數跟平均的差距就是所得分配惡化 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
398.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
426.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
中位數比較低 平均數比較高表示高於中位數的人的薪資高很多很多這樣了解嗎 什麼影響再看一看這個所得分配二劃是什麼這是全年齡的114年1月到6月全國的受僱員工中位數是38000平均數47600差了9500啊院長我要告訴你年輕的時候30歲以下我跟那個高所得的 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
427.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
449.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
差本來是他多少本來差三千五經過了職業發展之後拉到了9000這是什麼意思政府要正式從職場一入場的時候所得分配二話我們看看中衛書跟評估的差別我再講一個聽下一頁這是一個高中籃球隊一個班級籃球的身高有10個人 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
451.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
455.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
從169 170 171 172 還有一個160的然後有一個178 183 190 2200的中位數在哪裡 在172.5結果173以下的6個178以上的200 190 180的這樣了解中位數跟平均數的意思沒有多數的人不到172可是平均數是176 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
476.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
502.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
這就是少數身高特別高的人拉高了我們的身高平均我用這麼淺白的方式告訴你我們的統計數字應該要符合貼近人民真實的感受我們再往下看委員我曾經要求過統計數公佈的時候要同時公佈沒有改嘛沒有改嘛我再告訴你我現在進入去查如果所得分配二的話我們的資產分配有沒有改善 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
502.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
515.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
我查不到這個數字我要查全國23個縣市我們的家戶資產負債 我們有看到說家庭部門平均每戶的資產負債高達1477萬你去跟我們平等的鄉親講你們每戶的資產是將近1500萬沒人聽下去啦這種數字就是主計總數公布的 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
525.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
552.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
我們主計總數的數字是客觀的但是怎麼有意義的呈現讓人民知道你知道我要問什麼嗎我要了解一下到底現在全國人民的資產各縣市的分布有沒有一個惡化的均值我找到一個很接近的數字往下看就是土地資產土地資產的價格高低很多人說取決於什麼不是取決於炒作取決於政府投入公共建設的多寡我們來看一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
553.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
574.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
土地價值最高的一定是六都不對除了台北市新北市之外從中間第二名第三名到第四名第五名是竹科的概念區竹科的概念區新竹縣市跟苗栗地價很高然後呢台中桃園高雄跟台南啊然後呢底下通通都是非都 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
576.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
598.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
六都的土地資產價格高於非都除了新竹科學園區概念之外什麼原因就是因為我們政府預算規模的限制我給你看台中跟彰化兩個人在一起彰化的人口呢是台中的人口是彰化的將近三倍預算規模呢兩倍多 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
599.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
625.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
反過來預算規模將近三倍人口規模兩倍多他的人均分配的預算可用額度就差了將近兩成什麼意思六度的財政他的人口規模相對有利每個人可以分配到的政府預算相對多房地產的價格自然提高相對的非都彰化跟台中就在隔壁彰化的縣民我還不拿屏東來比 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
626.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
651.164 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
就拿彰化來跟台中比彰化是非都的人口最多的縣市結果呢他能分票預算最少院長我要說的是說今天我要教區啊您早上在說的我們中央對地方的補助的目的是什麼不是補助地方政府給他零用錢啊是要平衡協助地方的發展不均嘛對不對這不是一次同仁按照人口規模給多少嗎主計長你們怎麼分配的 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
656.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
684.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
你們人口怎麼分配的我們用財力分級來分配我要告訴你地方補助款是為了改善城鄉差距的分配不是按照人口規模一次同仁給他一樣多我要告訴你資產價格是分布不均是因為基礎建設分配不均基礎建設分配不均要靠我們地方補助款來調節幫助地方財政發展我們才能改善城鄉的差距城鄉的差距不改善我們來看幾個數字你來看屏東這次稍微有增加增加的幅度最少 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
684.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
705.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
我們再往下看現在什麼少子化習台預估全國將有40所大學要關門院長你猜猜看要先關哪幾所我告訴你最先關的兩所都在屏東屏東的鄉親已經夠可憐了我們現在連大學都從非都開始關門我們再往下看 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
706.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
730.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
偏鄉哪裡有偏鄉屏東線三分之二的國中小屬於偏鄉的學校我們偏鄉的學校不是經費少而已喔連老師都留不住院長你為什麼認為我們偏鄉為什麼老師留不住你覺得呢什麼原因 薪水比較低嗎一個是地方的生活的條件以及他整個財政狀況可以資助的教育資源等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
731.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
754.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
生活機能不變生活機能不變取決於公共建設我們來看醫療資源我們的醫缺也是最大的破口今天沒有衛福部在我要告訴你目前台北市他的醫院的分佈跟我屏東天差地遠差距絕對不是台北市人口跟屏東人口的三倍四倍來取決什麼原因我們再告訴你 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
755.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
781.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
今天報紙上寫 蔣萬安市長宣布台北市的兒童 學童可以喝學童奶之前學童奶不是全國補助嗎 院長後來中央停掉了嘛 為什麼要全國補助我屏東付不起啊 要靠中央補助啊中央不補助 我就沒辦法喝了那為什麼台北可以喝你認為是不是台北比較有錢台北的財政狀況確實比較好 不是台北也不是因為他有錢台北是因為什麼 他發兌換券 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
783.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
807.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
學童可以拿著兌換券去7-11便利超商換我們之所以中央把學童奶停下來不是中央不願付這筆錢是因為我屏東沒有辦法冷面去支持每個學校的老師發給學生每天一瓶奶台北為什麼可以做到台北有7-11啊我滿洲鄉只有一個便利超商你叫我滿洲鄉的小孩你中央支持我學童奶的經費我也喝不到啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
809.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
837.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
所以當時農業部提過各地的不同狀況因地制宜有需要這方補助的農業部還是會設法那我覺得這個事情由地方來主辦會更貼近地方真正的情況你還是沒有了解我的問題今天台北市能發學童奶不是台北的財政特別好這只是原因之一台北有全國最便利的便利超商的分布命度最高台北市這種不用投資冷鏈他只要花錢給勸學童就會換到牛奶 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
837.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
852.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
我屏東縣就算你中央支持我錢我沒有辦法買冷鏈我的學童沒辦法在滿洲鄉唯一的便利超商換學童奶了解了沒有這就是城鄉發產差距對人民造成的不公平我們來看一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
853.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
875.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
我們在偏鄉地區如果財政得不到中央政府用一般性補助款來幫我們調節我們的教育人員沒有人要去我們的醫師沒有人要去我們的人民得不到教育跟醫療的一個普及化的服務就算你家籍再高因為生活技能差沒有便利超商他們不願意去怎麼辦必須從我們基礎的財政著手 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
876.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
893.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
所以非獨地區交通的子女安全問題無法改善財政收支劃分是不是要呼籲包括朝野各政黨不要自私站在台灣均衡發展的前提之下要不要給中央足夠的財力來解決城鄉發展不均各地方政府所覺得差異來補強是不是要這樣做 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
894.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
916.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
我們就是願意從這個角度來討論檢討這個財政收支發放法但新的財政收支發放法顯然無法達到委員剛剛所希望的那樣的一個調整所以院長你們要跟全國的人民講我們也會講但是我們任憑這個方式惡化下去之後台灣只會變成天堂更低的兩極化包括我們看一下這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
917.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
937.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
這個問題呢 請回去請財政部要求公股銀行要特別注意不要讓親親安貸款讓首購族被限貸令造成斷頭最後呢 我的結論 兩個請院長答應中央政府對地方的財政分媒補助應該改善呈現下去是不是要支持 院長 是不是是 要支持那是不是我們統計資訊請主席長改變我們的統計資訊發布貼近人民的需求 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
947.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
948.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
好 謝謝鍾嘉賓委員 |