| IVOD_ID |
163170 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/163170 |
| 日期 |
2025-07-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-26-20 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
20 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-07-16T12:49:15+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-07-16T13:00:48+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:33 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/7c9429a73bae53e03e663bbb2d53b6b81b1d72feb9295bd2c884a04f466868897c5064231c774fdb5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
楊曜 |
| 委員發言時間 |
12:49:15 - 13:00:48 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-07-16T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第20次全體委員會議（事由：邀請環境部部長、經濟部部長、海洋委員會、農業部、內政部、國防部、金融監督管理委員會針對「光電設施對環境影響情形」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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謝謝主席主席我請一下經濟部能源署代理署長李署長委員好 署長好 署長我先問一個問題就是你在能源署 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
32.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
56.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
大概多久了30年了我想要先請問一下就是就你的在推動能源的過程因為能源轉型推動綠能這個是全球的一個趨勢幾乎共識就是一致性的方向為什麼在台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
58.519 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
71.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
惹了這麼多的爭議出來你能不能就你在公職上持平一點講沒有關係因為這個政策方向一定是對的 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
74.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
98.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
假如是有問題的不只台灣是全球都一致在推動嘛你講一下不用太有壓力我覺得這個是全球的趨勢而且包括國內反對說有什麼不好的人他也從來不會說他是反對綠能那通常他是認為就是說這個綠能的位置不對不適當 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
100.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
119.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
那我想這跟台灣的人口稠密是有關係的在國外它常常可以在一些比較空曠的地方附近的居民比較少所以它這樣的問題會比較少那台灣因為人口稠密所以我們在審核的時候像太陽光電我們推動的時候我們就要求就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
119.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
147.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
他一定要以農業為主然後光電為輔我們用共生的方式來不影響原來土地的利用那所以我們會特別朝這一方面那另外一方面在台灣的話我們特別推動屋頂屋頂型的在台灣特別多那因為屋頂型的對環境生態影響相對是小的那在國外比較少屋頂型大部分都是大片的土地做地面型但相對我們在台灣地面型是 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
149 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
172.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
目前發展的是比屋頂型的要慢地面型的規模經濟比較符合經濟效用對 但如果它的暗場大會有經濟規模剛剛講到人口稠密我覺得可能影響比較大的不是太陽光板可能是反而是風力發電 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
174.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
187.532 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
是目前我們的風力發電主要的是做離岸的那陸域的我們已經就剛才講人口層面慢慢漸居於飽和了那我們沒有特別再去獎勵或是推動反對的聲音也大啦這個就還蠻可惜的啦所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
195.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
223.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
署長的意見就是覺得是因為人口稠密所以造成我們在推動上先天上就比較有一定的困難就是說跟居民的溝通就很重要所以我們現在修改過去是要施工前才要開這個說明會我們現在是說你在核准之前那麼就要先開公開說明會讓附近的居民能夠了解那核准以後你要再 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
225.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
242.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
開公開說明會讓附近的民眾知道你核准的狀況這個程序當然是一定要啦我是覺得比較可惜啦就是一個能源轉型可以減少空汙減少很多環境的迫害的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
244.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
256.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
方向在台灣好像一直有爭議出來所以你也剛好在這邊服務30年所以就請教你一下我問幾個問題署長審計部在112年度審計報告中指出政府為了要落實經濟循環利用 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
268.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
281.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
向太陽光電的業者收取模組的回收費用但是報告指出經濟部能源署就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
282.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
303.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
有估計說我這個數據是在112年審計報告裡面的110年到112年大概還有沒有繳納的金額有接近4億你們主要的原因審計報告也有指出是行政疏失那你們現在這4億元 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
307.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
331.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
吹腳的情況怎麼樣我們已經持續跟他吹腳那如果他沒有腳的話那我們現在修正法令我們就會停止他的售電就不讓他賣電了那另外一方面我們對一個機制也做了一個檢討因為剛才事實上前幾位委員也一直問到就是說我們目前就是要分10年來繳交 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
332.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
351.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
那我們現在也已經在預告修改這個制度了他必須要在商轉的第一年就要把所有的錢都繳齊我知道我是說之前的嘛那署長你剛才說假如說他沒有繳納你們就要停止售店那我覺得這個行政手段 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
353.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
373.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
有一點問題就是你們沒有辦法對公司去做追款嗎因為我們最主要設置就是要讓他綠能發電要讓他受電你應該是讓他受電然後才從受電的所得拿到錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
374.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
389.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
你們現在講說手段是停止售電我覺得是有問題的報告兩個部分一個就是說剛才問到就是說我們現在收取的金錢剛才講112年的金錢那我們大概催收了之後目前大概90%已經繳交了 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
391.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
408.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
還有百分之八的金額沒有繳交那我會繼續跟他催收那另外他如果還沒有催收的話那我們給他的期限是到今年的八月十二他如果還沒有繳我們就會移送行政執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
409.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
427.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
那另外就是說剛才的這種制度的調整那我們現在正在預告我剛剛在講的是說你們的行政手段裡面行政措施裡面假如是以停止售電那我覺得是多方不利你懂我的意思嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
428.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
446.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
我了解那個其實我們原來最早的想法因為他售電台電要付他電費就直接從台電付他的電費裡面扣掉了那但是後來法律我們看到法律說我們不能這樣子做除非有法律的規定要不然那是他要收的錢政府不能扣 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
447.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
473.65 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
那所以我們現在的方法另外就是說停止台電跟他購電這樣我們就不用追繳可是這個就比較荒謬啦因為他是回收機組的錢嘛你去停止他受電我們本來就是設置太陽能光板就是要發電嘛那他停止受電他就沒有發電嘛我覺得應該是看能不能跟還沒有繳的業者去做 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
476.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
490.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
協調或是做一個三方的和解契約懂我意思嗎我覺得這個在法律上是可以做處理的 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
492.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
517.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
停止受騙本席覺得是比較不好的因為我們當時是覺得停止受騙對他來講是很重大的有壓力啦 對他來講有壓力啦可是就是怪啦所以你們回去跟法治人員看看有沒有辦法讓他受騙然後三方 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
517.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
528.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
打成一個和解企業由台電來支付給國庫懂我意思嗎我覺得我們在發展綠能的過程已經那麼多爭議了那麼多困難了它設置了反而要去禁止它售電這個我覺得不行好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
554.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
567.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
台南有一個招廢紙容許使用的農電共生的暗場我直接問 假如說暗場 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
572.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
587.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
暗場廢止了以後太陽能光板沒有移除暗場的部分是由經濟部來負責太陽能光板的處理是環境部對不對暗場的復原你們現在有沒有建立一定的規範 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
590.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
608.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
暗場的復原就要看他原來的土地的使用分區能不能做如果他是因為他當時的使用分區是特別容許太陽光電現在沒有做太陽光電他就要恢復原狀了他就要恢復原狀 是那他只要沒有恢復原狀你們有沒有一定的 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
612.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
632.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
就是他就會違反土地分區使用的管制的規定那就會由土地分區使用管制規定的土地法來處罰他就是用土地分區管制相關法律來處理來處罰所以暗場的復原你們是不用另外建立 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
635.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
647.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
我們就是依照現在法律的規定它的土地食用分區可以使用的狀況來做處理好我最後還是講一下就是全球是在推動能不能轉型 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
649.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
667.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
綠能絕對是首要的選擇希望好的政策我們可以透過溝通不管是跟民眾跟在野黨能夠透過溝通讓好的能源政策可以落實 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
668.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
689.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
不要好像現在講到台灣很可惜就是有一部分是事實有一部分是宣傳炒作抹黑造成好像大家對綠能都怕怕的這個還蠻可惜的好 謝謝署長 謝謝主席好 謝謝顏委員 謝謝副署長 |