| IVOD_ID |
162212 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/162212 |
| 日期 |
2025-06-04 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-20-15 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期財政委員會第15次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
15 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期財政委員會第15次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-06-04T10:58:39+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-06-04T11:09:01+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:22 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/dfdeed74d30b9828514819ce622157325e54a9d835821946ec695a437ff13aed747f46cb97eb1dba5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
吳秉叡 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:58:39 - 11:09:01 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-06-04T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期財政委員會第15次全體委員會議（事由：一、本院台灣民眾黨黨團，有鑑於行政院主計總處行文各縣市政府，將中央編列給地方政府的一般性補助款自114年度5至12月份分配及撥付數全數改為未分配數，已嚴重違反立法院通案刪減、促進政府資源有效配置之決議精神。中央政府預算編列浮濫，原編列三兆一千億元，立法院通案刪減後仍有二兆九千億餘元之數，為中華民國史上最高之中央政府總預算，本院本於職責審議預算，以督促中央政府增進財務效能、減少不當經濟支出甚至浪費之目的，中央政府不思檢討如何有效節用分配資源，卻意圖慷地方政府之慨，緊縮一般性補助款補助事項，將直轄市、準用直轄市規定之縣及縣（市）基本財政收支差短與定額設算之教育、社會福利及基本設施等改為未分配數，此舉不僅違反原預算刪減提案之意旨，更將嚴重影響地方財政及運作，對地方長期建設造成劇烈衝擊。爰建請院會作成決議：「行政院主計總處應依立法院審議中華民國114年度中央政府總預算案通案刪減之決議意旨，由中央各機關及所屬編列之預算刪減調整，並立即將一般性補助款足額撥付予地方政府。」請公決案。【本案如經院會復議，則不予審查】
二、邀請行政院主計總處陳主計長淑姿、財政部莊部長翠雲、內政部劉部長世芳及法務部就「近十年中央政府依財政收支劃分法、地方制度法等地方政府之補助情形及對均衡地方經濟發展之成效」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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主席麻煩請陳主席長這一次立法院的預算三減總共三多少金額2076億然後這一次這個有指定可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
23.57 |
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指定名目刪除了有多少1439還有一個636億沒有指定要我們自行調整對 已經刪了1400多億然後還有636億要自行調整請問主席 你知不知道雖然名義上是立法院刪的但是主張刪除的表決你有沒有看是不是國民黨跟民眾黨的立委贊成這樣刪除的是不是 |
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是所以預算刪除是藍白兩黨刪除了嘛對不對對方的首長聽清楚啊今天刪這麼多就是藍白的立法委員憑藉立法會的多數收含了眼想要貪汗中央政府所以砍這麼多預算啊沒有這些刪除大家今天不用來坐在這個地方啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
79.198 |
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然後講那個似是而非的說歷年來預算最多哪一個縣市政府不是歷年來預算最多今年哪一個縣市政府不是歷年來預算最多所以用這個邏輯來講是不通的啦因為這是一個話術啊時代進步我們所要做的業務越來越多當然經費要增加然後講的好像我們去少了這個 |
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108.206 |
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對於這一般的這個補助款刪減就是刻意要刪社福刻意要刪教育刻意要刪一些什麼兒童跟老人的福利我跟你說剛剛主席長有報告地方政府過去這幾年財政都有盈餘啊都plus啦當然長年來講負債還沒有還完但是連續幾年都是正數嘛 |
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133.154 |
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那所以今年因為立法院這樣刪減大家共體時間來去做財政的手段做一些舉借如果真的不夠也可以啊也還在舉借的範圍內嘛以我新北市來講少了30億但是總數還是比去年多了60幾億啊今年的總體的補助是不是比去年多了60幾億 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
161.104 |
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然後來這個地方好像是我們刻意要凌虐你刻意要虧空你的沒有人有這樣的心啦今天如果不是藍白的立法委員沙紅的眼這樣亂刪除預算人家行政院原來編好送到立法院的預算喔是足夠的那誰是始作俑者現在 |
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亂三預算之後外界在用大罷免在反彈刻意製造這個場景想要來推卸責任想要來挽回民眾對你們的制裁這一種說法不能接受啦主席長我請問你你的636億為什麼要刪一般性的補助款 |
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是因為我們636億第一個他要叫我們自行調整那這個部分如果自行調整金額龐大是有自愛難行而且造成政策成敗無法歸屬所以我們有複議但是複議的結果又被維持原決議所以我們現在在5月21申請釋憲 |
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233.923 |
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但是我們已窮盡所有的救濟程序然後我們也嘗試去刪減各項譬如說國防、外交還有教育這些大部分都沒有辦法刪減所以我們在不得不的一個情況下才來刪減一般性的一個補助款那目前我們也希望說各界能夠提供給我們一些各方的一個解決的辦法我們聽取各方的一個意見來研擬解決的一個辦法 |
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259.664 |
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剛剛還在這邊有委員講說是給你方便耶636讓你統山叫做給你方便是有困難的自行刪減是有困難的那你覺得如果不自行刪減舉一個例子國民黨跟民主黨他人就多啊我好指3636還有人要說我要刪更多咧那請他們提出要刪減的金額跟確切的項目你覺得這樣建議好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
286.762 |
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至少不要在這邊推卸責任說我是給你方便如果說我們自行刪減責任是真的歸屬困難是這樣子那到底是要刪哪裡就是有困難啊所以預算是誰刪除的誰是始作俑者我要再強調一遍不要亂刪預算後面沒有這些困難啦那刪的預算人民要究責 |
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311.858 |
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330.098 |
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安排這種場景想要推卸責任叫地方來副市長來這邊搞政治說中央就是要克扣你們是這樣嗎你等一下也可以講啊台中市今年總共補助比去年相比多多少 |
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334.912 |
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多多少 他比去年增加46億今年的補助比去年增加46億是 再減三 靠一句市長說的錢更多不會值振那就換人嘛都用你們邏輯講就好了嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
350.694 |
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對不對 他不是講說錢更多不會執政就換人為什麼地方政府的財政每一年往前增加中央政府就說人家是最多因為民進黨會執政啊財政做得比以前好啊 稅收多啊所以我當然變用預算來用啊那你地方政府不是這樣嗎你今天財政做過變好就代表你地方政府的執政也有成效啊 |
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377.605 |
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那為什麼不用相同的標準對待中央跟地方我再跟藍白的立委講636億有本事你來講這邊講你要刪哪裡 要刪哪一個科目 要刪多少錢不要在那邊賴說什麼事 給人家請證據方便已經刪到沒有辦法再刪了 已經出骨頭沒辦法了你還說你要賭 你要賭就是這樣 |
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406.755 |
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433.623 |
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我在立法院也將近二十年了從來沒有預算刪除兩千多億的啦以前了不起就頂多刪一個百分點一點多個百分點照比例來講 刪照一千億以前最多就是刪三百億今年給你刪兩千多億那我中央沒有錢我中央的錢被拿走了那我要怎麼辦 請台灣全體大家共體時間嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
436.247 |
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453.744 |
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因為大家都還有財政手段可以用你地方政府跟議會的關係不像在台立法院都在搞政治立法院都在搞政治啊要癱瘓你啊地方議會沒有這樣的狀況地方議會經過議會的同意地方還可以用財政手段 |
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454.724 |
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474.925 |
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以前Mainas的時候也舉借嘛那何況連續這麼多年都是class真正有愛心就用財政手段去解決這個問題行政院也是不得已講的好像是我們都是壞人我們是天生沒良心都是故意要怎麼樣沒有這樣的人啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
478.82 |
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506.042 |
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喔 大家都是應該要將心比心啦今天不要亂算預算 後面沒有這些問題啦我有嘴說到無辜 說到瘦死啦因為這些人都在扭曲啦就是在扭曲 預算是他們砍的甘不甘死牙砍的預算 然後還要不承擔責任還想要推卸責任你們當初在砍多少預算在比賽的時候 不是很爽嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
509.639 |
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524.34 |
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我跟林大夫回答二十年來我在立法院沒有見過這樣的在野黨了現在只是因為習勢多什麼時候還要打拔配合中華民國憲政中華民國憲法權力分立全部來亂搞一氣 |
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530.114 |
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546.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
那再問一個問題3.114年的一般性補助款有沒有違法他們在強調你違法你有沒有違法是因為依照那個補助辦法裡面他規定就是說中央要橫走自己的一個財力來對地方著以補助那所以這個部分我們在 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
548.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
567.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
2013年8月30在核定各縣市的一個一般性補助款的時候也述明說如果補助這個部分我們有立法院被刪減的部分我們就會做一個相關的一個調整和刪減所以這個部分2014年一般性補助調減636億也沒有違反相關的一個法令規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
568.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
593.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
另外一點就是預算去年編的你剛剛他現在改了這個財政收支法裡面再去規定說以後他們的那個金額一般性補助款不能減那是要向後生效的是 因為我們是115年編列那是要以114年度的一個一般性補助的額度來作為一個拘束所以他要用後面修的法來說你前面違法嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
593.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
614.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
他現在邏輯就是這樣你們已經一講再講台灣現在有些地方不講道理藍郡的媒體多都講他們的話好像他們講的都對一樣你要加強發言的力道多講一些讓社會大眾知道怎麼一回事好不好加油堅持到底大罷免大成功謝謝接下來請我們 |