| IVOD_ID |
161532 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/161532 |
| 日期 |
2025-05-19 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-19-13 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第13次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
13 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第13次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-05-19T09:52:32+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-05-19T10:06:59+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:14:27 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/ecb6f54fb5d604f032255df051ef455528de2cce2b28366acb2fe453f4508dd4d354354e2f17e0785ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
張啓楷 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:52:32 - 10:06:59 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-05-19T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：一、處理或審查114年度中央政府總預算有關農業部及所屬主管預算凍結案等30案。
二、處理或審查114年度中央政府總預算有關公平交易委員會主管預算凍結案等8案。） |
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現在陳部長來請部長 |
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31.474 |
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55.766 |
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最近我回到南部我看到我們的漂亮稻田都陸陸續續都在收成我們的農民也是很感謝包括地盤民通過後都走步也提高了他們供糧收購的這個價格至少提高了一公斤大概是我算了一下大概1.83但是差不多一公斤可以多收兩萬塊錢這算是一個對農民不無小補這算是一個好消息 |
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71.039 |
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這個跟我們原來的標準還差了三分之二這也是為什麼今天要談解凍案這次農業部最大的最大的凍結的這個案子有兩個一個是業務費810302萬凍結了30% |
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兩億四千零九十萬另外有一筆這個農政的這個業務費也凍結了大概一億左右啦那現在今天最重要的就是三億左右的這個經費到底要不要解凍我剛剛講有好消息是已經幫了我們農民一公頃大概可以公糧收購可以增加兩萬嘛對不對那接下來還剩下這三分之二 |
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133.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
你上次有答應我 你說逐步要完成對不對你現在要怎麼去我沒有這樣講齁你要怎麼去達成逐步的包括立法院通過的是一公斤五塊錢不是你現在只有調的一公斤1.83還有包括那一天我們在草野協商在行政院的時候院長也說要逐步去完成嘛 對不對你今天要解凍然後講今天就是要解凍這三立多到底要怎麼去怎麼去達到農民可以達到一公斤五塊錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
134.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
159.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
我第一個跟委員報告就是我們現在用的糧食產業升級的方案裡面那你可以看得到我們整個方案裡面不只照顧了水稻的農民因為對農業部來講我不只是處理水稻有要處理其他的雜糧然後第一個就是我受益的民眾增加了從22萬到36萬有增加了那更重要就水稻的種植的農民來講你可以看得到 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
161.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
182.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
就他的計劃輔導跟餘糧 過去農民都沒在交餘糧的如果你單看計劃跟輔導都是超過五塊錢以上所以以整體的效益來講他是對農民的動農是有保障而且是一個持續性的保障如果今天我把每一個都調高了五塊的話我可以保證 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
183.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
208.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
那個價格支撐不了一兩年因為大家會大量的種植水稻那相對的種植水稻後面的這個水稻的數量太多市價崩盤的時候對農民反而是不利的我想這個我跟委員做了非常多的溝通我們這個事情已經溝通過好幾次我也給你看了很多數據包括之前有好幾次的公糧價格的提高後來面積雖然有上去點點後來都下來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
208.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
234.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
這個我們經過好幾次討論了現在最重要的 最重要的我覺得第一個是立法院的通過的協議嘛 對不對一公斤五塊錢第二個我們有經過草野協商跟行政院協商這個你要落實國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 國民黨我提醒你一個很重要的事情民間財喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
237.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
249.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
農民運動是我們台灣解嚴以後第一次最大規模最嚴重的警民的這個衝突他那時候有八大訴求裡面兩個跟你都非常有關係 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
250.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
268.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
第一個他要求把農委會提升為農業部嘛所以你現在才有農委部長可以當這是一個第二個當初因為美國很多農產品要進來農民上街頭抗議了77年民國77年的520很慘烈的農民運動那另外一個他裡面有一個很重要的訴求就是稻民要進來嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
270.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
295.947 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
所以他們要求美國稻米要進來他們要求做兩件事情公糧的收購價格要保證適度的提高第二個 面積要能夠一些保障你看這個訴求從民國77年到現在喔那我們現在跨出了一步了我們給了1公斤1.83我可以肯定這部分對農民也有幫助了可是後續另外這三分之二怎麼去做到部長你今天要給我一個報告啦說實在的 這三億多這個預算其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
300.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
319.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
我那時候本來是要砍的喔 本來是要砍一億的預算嘛 對不對我們經過溝通嘛 我沒有砍喔 一毛錢都沒有砍喔可是我們包括跟楊瓊英 張家俊我們就一月會凍結百分之三十嘛 對不對我現在算下來就是這兩三億那你要給我一個 例如說那時候你有談到說你要下鄉去去做說明嘛 對不對我們市府中聯 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
321.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
337.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
我跟委員報告一個數據就好我們推動糧食產業升級方案的時候繳工糧的面積少了5000公頃那些農民跑到哪邊去了那些農民他去做集團栽培他不繳工糧用集團栽培同樣造用 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
338.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
359.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
用種稻但是他用品牌的方式去提高他的收益這個才是我們想要的我希望我們所有農民種稻是用他的品質用他的市場價格去支撐他的所得而不是靠政府的價格去支撐那也希望委員來支持我想這個部分做了一年兩年那個成效一定會出來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
359.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
378.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
我之前在嘉義參觀那個月桃故事館他們成立一個那個食農的那個教育基地那那個什麼光嘉義那個三光米啊現在說要銷到日本光是一個三光米就20萬噸對不對今年我們輸到日本的過往大概每一年平均大概3900多公斤 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
381.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
392.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
今年可以超高9000到10000噸所以我們用更好的米我們鼓勵農民做更好的米然後去外銷比你繳公糧放在公糧倉庫好很多所以我希望委員給我們一個機會就是讓我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
395.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
424.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
這個制度這個沒有衝突啦我們的米能夠銷到日本銷到比較好的國家更好的這個價格我真的有衝突喔三光米這個嘉義幸福米這個我們就是我們驕傲嘛所以多去推動讓他們可以賣到日本賣更好價格可是相對的普遍的這個農民工糧收購我講過了民國七十七年開始農民我們現農基層的農民那時候就要求了嘛我們現在日本的股你已經過了你現在也做一部分我現在要求說你三萬七千要補償要補償要補償我先跟你講一下你今天要通過這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
426.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
452.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
解凍的這個百分之三十業務費你今天要提出因為等一下會會討論嘛對不對你要加俊啊等一下那個當初我們有共同討論的其他立委都在待會要解凍這個預算你要給我一個很明確的這樣老實講農民也在等農民要高興那個一公頃可以多收兩萬塊的時候他們也在想說你我們答應他的立盤過的還沒有我們要走去補起來你等一下想一下你這個我先質詢可是老實講解凍之前我們要解決這問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
454.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
478.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
我跟委員報告齁 您說的都變成五塊錢的時候那相對的所有的民糧都沒有辦法活下去它就不種民糧了 我們就沒有好的米外銷了民糧就你說有些銷到日本 有些比很好大家就搶著一點當你工糧的價格變高的時候 你的民糧就沒辦法支撐下去就沒有好的米外銷了 也沒有好的米給國人 我們的民眾來吃啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
479.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
486.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
這個就是我們考慮的公糧價格太高的時候民糧沒辦法生存的時候那相對的他沒有辦法做好的米 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
487.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
513.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
這個就是所以我說糧食產業升級拜託你現在變成是太高的問題我們經過好幾次溝通你要逐步把我們什麼去達成嗎所以你是先調了1公斤1公斤增加2萬塊就是反映他的成本那反映他的成本以後我們用集團栽培去拉高他的產品的品質然後透過產品品質提高讓消費者認同來提高他的收入 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
514.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
536.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
這個方法才是持久的你剛才在聽邱議員在說沒有那個成本13年沒調 你看他們連那個災損都要求要提高了工糧收購當然 除了現在調了三分之一 三分之二怎麼去補給沒關係你等一下給我一個案子啦等一下我們 反正解凍之前沒有的話就保留 我們到議員會再繼續來談來另外我問一下 你們看到那個4100億的那個特別條例嘛你本錢是一百八十億對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
543.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
556.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
那我們台灣民眾黨啊認為在強化農業金融還有提升產業的這個競爭跟協助這個多元這個市場我們大幅提高喔我們要求把它提高到300億你贊不贊成 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
558.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
585.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
基本上我們提出來的這個180億那這個180億是針對現在目前關稅10%到32%之間可能的浮動我們設計出來的短期之內協助我們的受影響的業者的金融資金的負擔中長期是增加他的產業的韌性所以180億我們初步看起來是夠的但是如果說關稅 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
586.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
591.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
整體的關稅有你現在不要提高嗎我跟委員報告就是說後續如果不足的話我們會用追加預算的方式來處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
602.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
628.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
幹嘛追加 你就支持民進黨的300億就好啦你現在變180 連民進黨 不要說國民黨跟在野黨我們是要支持我們的農民農業啊沒有 當然我知道說越多的經費給農業部當然越好可是相對的在現在的情況之下我們覺得現在用180億去處理是可以去處理的那後續如果不足的話我們會循程序去做追加預算的方式來處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
630.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
653.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
因為他畢竟 特別預算畢竟是三年嘛 兩年半快三年嘛那如果不夠 因為整個關稅的不確定性太高了 現在關稅如果博定你等一下再想一下啦 其實報告面這段禮拜都沒說這八百一百八十億是太少了不是 現在關稅的不確定性太高了啊 不知道不要用追加的 你至少三百億是要來 我問另外一個問題齁 那個最近那個美債引起很多討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
655.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
683.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
我有去查我們的農業金庫啊5年10億塊錢,我們因為買美債大家知道嗎?我們已經虧損,虧損5年,包括你們農業部自己的資料嘛虧損了50億最近,到目前,那現在呢?有沒有繼續買?現在虧損多少錢?這個我沒辦法現在回答你我可以了解以後再跟你講他農業金庫到底有沒有繼續買美債這個我不清楚,我現在沒辦法回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
685.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
711.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
你現在手上沒有資料對我手上沒有這個事情算很重要這個是我們去跟美國最近要關稅談判應該會談到的餒對因為農業金庫是我們農業因為我們買了很多啊就是因為農業我們現在是幫人民看緊荷包也幫農民看緊荷包啊對不對啊去年你11月底的統計你已經了過了為了美債已經因為利息一直在升嘛所以你已經損失了50億啊啊你現在關稅在談判的時候會提到這個對你來講應該很重要啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
713.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
733.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
沒關係 部長 你那個 你三天內 因為這個本來就應該有了你報告一件談判也要這個資料啦 你三天內給我談判不需要這個資料對農業部來講 談判不需要這個資料不需要這個資料不需要說我有多少美債他們如果要 美國要求我們再繼續買美債你要不要的話 你這個基本資料要有啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
735.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
755.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
我們的納稅錢 農民的錢你一直虧損 你怎麼沒有準備不是我想美債的買賣以農業經過來講他有他的那個董建市的決議嘛那相對的我因為現在沒有辦法手上沒有這個資料他到底買了多少美債那我想我會後 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
757.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
783.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
會請問他們來提供委員這份資料我背後再資料給你主席這裡面有兩個問題啦第一個就是因為虧損累累嘛第二個就是因為你一直在講說你的獨立董事沒有發揮功能這是這兩個問題啦好沒關係 保證我告訴你現在統統這是人民的荷包啦也是農民的這個荷包啦你儘快 三天OK嘛你查一下你到底從11月底已經虧損50億你後來有沒有再買買了多少 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
784.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
798.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
因為買多少 第二個統計一下了解要看錢 好不好 那如果虧損的話就不能繼續買啦不只台灣啊 全世界都沒有在討論說要繼續買美債啊 對不對這是跟所有人 跟川普 跟美國在談判裡面最重要一個問題欸 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
801.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
826.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
第一個已經虧損了所以不能再虧嘛對不對啊如果有啊所以我要清楚說你到底有沒有在買有虧損多少這個資料我後續會提供資料給你我現在沒辦法回答因為我沒辦法這應該是現成的資料嘛對不對這應該可以調得到我不知道可不可以如果可以提供我一定會提供第一個前提就是說他們這個購買你那時候公佈為什麼這個東西不能提供這是公開資料啊我不知道齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
826.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
843.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
這個我不敢確定因為每個公司或是每個這些東西它有相關的一個規範如果能夠提供給委員的我一定提供包括他們買什麼樣的一個債券什麼樣的東西是不是他們的內部資料還是可公開的這個我必須確認如果可以我一定提供給你 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
843.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
862.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
部長第一個你們以前公佈過啦這也是對前面要負責我不清楚啦但是所以我我回去會了解儘快在三天內你儘快在三天內給我我說可以的話我一定提供OK好要看緊人民的荷包幫農民啊鄉長當然你今天那個要解凍那個解凍那個錢供應收報那個提高五塊錢等一下給我方案好謝謝好謝謝張七開委員那下一位請 |