| IVOD_ID |
160882 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/160882 |
| 日期 |
2025-05-01 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-15-15 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期內政委員會第15次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
15 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期內政委員會第15次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-05-01T11:00:48+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-05-01T11:06:38+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:05:50 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/872e8bbe37846fc0a767d3dda80e667e1fb26350580dc1695144d4d67ecd09c104d060652815dfb75ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
吳宗憲 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:00:48 - 11:06:38 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-05-01T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期內政委員會第15次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查委員陳冠廷等21人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。二、審查委員沈伯洋等17人擬具「國家安全法第十三條及第十三條之一條文修正草案」案。三、審查委員陳冠廷等23人擬具「國家安全法第四條及第八條條文修正草案」案。四、審查委員邱志偉等16人擬具「國家安全法第三條條文修正草案」案。五、審查委員沈伯洋等20人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。六、審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。七、審查委員沈伯洋等20人擬具「國家安全法第三條、第八條及第十八條條文修正草案」案。八、審查委員陳冠廷等19人擬具「國家安全法增訂第十九條之一條文草案」案。九、審查委員黃捷等16人擬具「國家安全法第二條、第三條及第七條條文修正草案」案。） |
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好 請法務部跟司法院委員好好 各位早安因為我看了那個民進黨委員的版本那我就那個第二條的部分我想請教一下因為我有看過司法院跟法務部你們對於這個草案的論述 |
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尤其是齁 我覺得最近發生很多共諜案那昨天還前天林永昌不是說國民黨這是那個幽靈聯署這個是犯罪組織 事實上幽靈聯署那個偽造文書並不是五年以上中所以依照我國目前的組織犯罪條例第二條 |
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那個不算是組織犯罪 但是什麼東西算組織犯罪就是最近發生在總統府 國安會 外交部 還有民進黨民主學院還有民進黨立法院 黨團 都常有共諜那這個就完全符合組織犯罪的規定對不對 三年以上 五年以上有期徒刑所以我再說 這個我們必須一定要很注重國安的安全而且國家安全是每個人的責任 |
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那我想請教一下齁我先請問痾正次啦齁痾第一款齁第二條第一款那個發起資助主持操縱指揮發展組織目前的起訴比例定罪比例你有資料嗎痾有資料嗎好請問你稍後這多少我請我們市長來扶一下 |
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| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
跟委員報告那針對那個國家安全法的案件那起訴的案件在103年的時候是有81件定罪率起訴率定罪率目前定罪率是81%好起訴率呢起訴率是這個28點62.3抱歉所以起訴率蠻低的嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
128.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
130.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
130件裡面有81件起訴那起訴率是62.3%你剛剛不是說20幾嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
137.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
164.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
不是 不是 我看錯了好 沒關係 那不然這個到時候我再請教你們一下因為再給我一個比較精確的數據好 我們會再提供數據因為我看了一下法務部跟司法院你們對於第二款的版本草案司法院認為說含義不明確法務部認為範圍不夠具體那所以說對於這一次委員所提出來的這個草案第二條第二款你們是不是不支持啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
165.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
171.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
我們都建請在座建請在座OK那就就是有疑慮司法院呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
172.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
197.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
也正如本院提出的報告確實有一些需要調整之處好 謝謝 那我想說這就是司法的專業啦因為有一些人提出一些國安的法條那我們有疑問或我們我們有疑問在那邊說很多人說那你就是中共同路人我想不能這樣 我們都法律人事實上這個法條的規範它從公務上面變成是涉及國家安全及公益上面這個範圍變得非常的不明確 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
197.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
212.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那如果這個因為這樣然後卡的罪又這麼重我覺得這不是一個立法委員一個禁止的立法委員該做了而且這個會變成到時候執政黨可以拿這個來作為政治攻擊我在這邊先聲明我非常支持國家安全 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
213.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
232.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
我也非常支持來自於任何一個國家或地區對我們的攻擊或滲透我也絕對反對但是我希望相關的法律在研擬的時候必須要明確尤其是最非常的重那我過往我看到了國安法反滲透法等等我都發現有一個問題就是它的 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
233.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
257.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
後來的無罪率很高也就是說一開始他問了非常多的人鄰里非常多人因為去大陸旅遊或吃個飯然後就被起訴是被約談起訴結果後面就大量的被約談的人被大量牽結不起訴那被起訴的又大量的判無罪那我覺得這個都是老民那甚至呢他就是為了選舉在做一些動作那不要讓我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
259.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
272.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
覺得政府怎麼走向是希望讓國家走向寒蟬效應這個是我們不期待的那我想時間的關係我最後我就提一個我想提你們 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
273.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
291.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
提供給我一些資料我希望法務部在一個月內能夠把違反國安法的起訴率有罪定罪率這個資料給我然後還有不起訴跟判無罪的理由提供一些我們立法建議還有這構成要件是有明確這個部分能夠給我 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
293.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
311.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
然後另外就是一週內給我們一份2023年到2024年總統跟立委大選期間違反選罷法、反滲透法這些上次我其實在SAR法治已經有提過請你們把這個資料給我們因為我覺得國家安全事先的防範重於事後的追陳 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
312.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
327.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
結果你們把重點放在事後追審 而且還規定的不明確 這樣是不對的那下週我自己再上法治委員會 我有安排 我希望說國安會 國安局的人能夠一併來說明 我也希望說大家不要動動就請假 或是用一些理由說不要過來 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
329.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
347.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
國家安全全民都注意不能一邊喊很大聲抗中保台國家安全另外一面然後你連來都不來齁這是我希望下週在市長法治委員會開會的時候大家都能夠到我們一起來為國家安全能夠加油不要讓國家安全變成是打擊政治異己的工具謝謝好 謝謝委員 |