| IVOD_ID |
160774 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/160774 |
| 日期 |
2025-04-30 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-23-9 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期交通委員會第9次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
9 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
23 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
交通委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期交通委員會第9次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-04-30T09:33:32+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-04-30T09:49:32+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:16:00 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/b6da7da99b94236901a3a01dfb2b6d8f385a4fd0f0fffa49c2100e055cb59403eb84b7fcc79dab935ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
洪孟楷 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:33:32 - 09:49:32 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-04-30T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期交通委員會第9次全體委員會議（事由：邀請交通部部長陳世凱、交通部民用航空局局長何淑萍、交通部鐵道局局長楊正君、國營臺灣鐵路股份有限公司代理董事長伍勝園、台灣高速鐵路股份有限公司董事長鄭光遠、中華航空股份有限公司董事長高星潢及國家運輸安全調查委員會率所屬相關單位列席就「近期我國航空、鐵路運營安全事件之檢討與改善及臺鐵票價調整方案」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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好 主席麻煩請陳士凱部長好 那個交通部陳部長民航局局長還有我們運安會主委好 那個民航局何局長 來運安會林主委 來高董事長 |
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我先很快的來就教因為這一次的這個4月13號華航的飛機的一個狀況剛剛高董事長也說明很清楚但是我想還是要請教這次運安會你的報告講是說非屬重大運輸事故範圍所以為立案調查但本席之前有提過其實運安會應該是一個防範於未然我們當然不希望說每一次是重大事故之後我們才來去做相關的調查如果可以我們在 |
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預先預防的一個情況下來去做一個調查跟了解是不是會更加的妥適來 運安會是不是說明一下委員講的沒有錯是如果會預防防範以未然這是最好的那麼這樣子它對航空機實質沒有損害而且沒有那我們有沒有看到真正的low data |
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來 部長或者是我們院安會因為現在是民航局有相關監理機關進行調查那現在華航告訴我們今天給我們的一個簡報是相對比較簡陋只有跟我們講說天氣其他的機場都是不行的那請教不管是我們現在民航局也好或是院安會也好有沒有看到當天的一個確實的一個數據 |
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跟委員報告 基本上民航局這邊已經訪談了相關的駕駛跟公司那有關派遣的相關天氣資料我們已經拿到也有看到相關的數據 當天的數據狀況當天的我們還要再調還要再調對 因為相關Meta資料現在4月30號了 4月13號兩個多禮拜以前的事情那現在今天我們做專案報告結果你跟我們講是說你的資料還要再調 |
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我們的資料就是我們還要因為根據黃航剛剛講的當天因為機場的前一個小時是包含那個是由機場端來報就是新加坡、拉夫、自民等等所以這些資料基本上我們也要經過判讀跟相關的時間然後包含當天的操作跟防航的地點來 部長本席 |
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也過去也是華航的常客我搭最多的就是華航因為我覺得是值得信賴也是我們國家的航空那但是在飛安事件上來講在這次的事故裡面很多人都會懷疑不是以飛安為最優先的考量而是以維修方便所以不是選擇最近的胡志明市的機場或者是馬尼拉機場而是選擇回來到我們台灣的小港機場小港機場不在我們的這個飛行計畫裡面 |
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176.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
是不是是 報告員本來是沒有在飛行計畫裡面那當時我所理解的是當時的駕駛他是有判斷鄰近的那幾個機場的天氣的狀況包含新加坡在內包含馬尼拉那也包含越南那我們有沒有看到確實的當天 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
179.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
196.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
這幾個機場的氣候狀況報告委員 剛剛還是華航給我們的資料我們就照單全收在華航的報告的內容其實已經有講到氣候的狀況是 但我們有沒有主動去了解這個部分我們在調資料當中銀行局正在調資料當中這個我會要求大家其實真的沒有那麼難調來 我們先看一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
197.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
214.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
當天本時也去查了一下當天確實新加坡下午的地方有可能會有雷陣雨對飛航有可能有安全的疑慮來當你也看到胡志明市胡志明市整體的氣象降雨量少以及馬尼拉 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
217.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
237.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
4月13號當天的一個氣象大致穩定但午後可能會有局部雷陣雨我想這個是專業的判斷本席都可以請同仁先去找出相關的資料那更重要的是專業的判斷你這個資料是飛航需求的資料嗎專業判斷對所以本席才提到因為飛航需求的資料需要前一個小時 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
237.702 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
256.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
沒錯 所以部長本席才會提醒你如果說兩個禮拜之後到現在你們都沒有掌握資料你們只是片面的聽信華航提供的資料我覺得這不夠專業也沒有盡到監管機關的責任報告委員氣象資料民航局有掌握不是沒有掌握但是監管機關是誰 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
258.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
267.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
他有掌握啊 他有掌握本席 部長你剛剛沒有辦法回答我的問題其實 我說實在話哪個問題沒辦法回答部長 你在反質詢是不是沒有 我沒有在反質詢哪個問題沒辦法回答部長 你就針對問題 是啊 沒有問題啊好不好 來來來 部長本席現在在 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
278.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
304.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
要求的是交通部站在中央主管機關應該要看到我們各飛航的專業來協助飛航怎麼樣做經濟而華航主要在這一次的事件裡面讓外界質疑的聲音到現在沒有少過即便今天講得如此的好聽但是我說了到現在兩個禮拜之後到目前為止你們的飛航紀錄以及相關的航空資訊到目前為止你們沒有掌握 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
305.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
328.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
既然沒有掌握本席只是要求說是不是應該要去做一個管理以及立案調查去真真正正的了解說當天的狀況是不是符合現場的判斷報告委員民航局說他們有掌握啦只是說資料要分析需要再分析相關的資料他們真的有掌握啦不是沒掌握跟委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
329.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
337.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
如果說要這樣硬凹的話 我覺得這不是一個做實現的做法那我可以請民航局提供資料給你們來 我們再來 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
339.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
365.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
民航局什麼時候會給國人一個清楚明白的交代針對這一次的華航的判斷的一個事件因為外界大家都在質疑其實我今天有很多的議題啊部長我說實在話我很希望能夠心平氣和跟你就專業論專業今天是在做後續的檢討我們今天沒有發生任何的人為意外我覺得這是萬幸但是萬幸完之後我們要去釐清說到底 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
366.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
387.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
華航的決策是不是站在乘客的安全為最高指導標準還是說站在他們的航空的維護的安全方面你可以搖頭那就代表請你用數據以及用你們的報告專業的來說服我們而不是到現在兩個禮拜之後給出了我們這一份只有華航單方面的一個片面資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
389.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
413.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
來再來報告委員民航局的報告是用書面的他不是來台上報告但他有提供書面您可以參考他的書面報告黃航有沒有看到這一個投書有有看到黃航剛剛跟我們講得非常的好聽喔說有包括這個這個回程的作業支持主動跟旅客致意表達建議等等的 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
413.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
440.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那我們來看一下這個是其中一個投書過去一個禮拜非常煎熬始終沒有任何正式的說明或者是更新以乘客安全當時的機上廣播以乘客安全為優先的決定感覺像是以公私利益為出發點這是大多數乘客的感受最後收到的希望能夠索取一個延誤證明但最後收到的是一個簡單的備忘錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
442.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
462.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
沒有忽略台北起飛13.5個小時的過程以及收到的是一個300塊的餐券跟金沙巧克力華航你的資料報告說明的很完整看起來完整 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
464.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
474.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
最大的關懷處理最大的誠意速度全力處理協助平安續行但實際上乘客的感受是這樣子天差地別這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
479.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
501.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
這對姐弟我們有掌握,在新加坡人當時飛機回航的時候,在高雄我們就盡力的供應飲料還有餐食這些東西就是為了準備下一次的起飛後來我們當天下午就又派了一架加班機從台北到高雄,然後再把高雄載到新加坡去 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
502.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
517.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
這個我們真的不是用那個航機維修的那個考量假如真的航機維修我乾脆就飛到台北就好啦我根本不需要到高雄然後再派飛機上這個大費周章所以基本上真的是底下的那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
520.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
546.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
東南亞的這些天氣不是很好所以我們華航的說明我覺得還是要由主管機關這邊來做一個認定因為這就代表是我們要看到一個問題今天真的是不幸中的大幸沒有造成任何的人員傷亡但我每一次在交通委員會我都講如果說要等到人員傷亡要等到後面全都排排站有很多攝影機的時候那代表我們出大事 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
547.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
552.766 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
不要有任何事情最好所以在這件例子上面民航局什麼時候能夠再做釐清來給國人確認 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
555.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
583.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
跟委員報告因為剛剛所提到的相關關心的天氣資料也好飛航的過程組員的判斷等等因為民航局都要根據剛剛委員所提的我們自己調查到的資料而不是單憑華航的提供的資料所以這個部分我們需要花一些時間在做處理那是不是委員這邊可以給我們如果是初步報告因為一般來講我們是完成完整的報告那如果初步的報告我們是不是建議可以一個月 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
584.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
609.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
好 一個月來 部長再來請教我們上上禮拜有討論到美國關稅的問題那您也提到是說對於觀光業以及運輸業 航運業有很大的衝擊那現在行政院提出了4100億本期兩個禮拜前在這邊有跟您就教交通部有沒有針對這個部分特別條例有爭取任何行政院這邊的支持那現在4100億出來啦本來的880億 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
613.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
628.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
沒有交通部那多增加了三四倍到4100億到目前為止沒有看到細項那我想請教4100億裡面交通部不管是觀光的部分不管是航運的部分佔了多少報告委員我們有個別跟這個航運業界空運業界 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
630.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
650.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
還有觀光業界大家都有辦過座談會那目前看起來海運跟航空的影響還沒有很大所以這個部分目前應該就是有一些調整性的東西跟彈性的東西我們有提供給業者給他們協助那另外觀光業界我昨天有跟他們座談我有看到新聞也有出來但我現在問的問題部長深度問題回答問題好4100億 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
655.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
677.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
有支持產業930億有國土安全認証1500億有照顧民生1670億這個是額外因應美國關稅那你兩個禮拜前在這邊也詢答說有特別講到觀光產業有可能會有非常大的衝擊我們那時候也說料底要從寬所以如果說有任何支持資源的力量也應該要來預先掌握 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
678.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
689.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
那4100億裡面有沒有交通的部分目前我們跟這個業者大家座談跟一些協助的方案的討論我們目前用觀光的基金應該都還能夠應付所以4100億裡面是沒有交通觀光 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
693.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
708.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
你們做決策要負責啦來最後我想今天很重要的部分還是在於是安全的部分那有兩個我再佔用一小段時間啦有兩個最近的新聞我覺得這個東西也是見為之助 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
709.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
733.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
部長一個是有行人要過馬路那高舉雙手舉了雙手意思就代表說要過馬路那結果這一個畫面裡面他可能沒有辦法播放影片那這個畫面裡面連續過了十幾台車都沒有停讓那之後才讓這個行人過去這是一個部分另外下一個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
734.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
757.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
因為行人在過馬路而導致於救護車已經有警示燈的救護車他要等行人過馬路而救護車才啟動那再加上早上新聞又推播我們交通部的小編跟剛剛部長一樣也是很強悍 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
759.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
782.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
這個很嗆 就是在交通部的很嗆是講道理 很嗆 不會用嗆的啦很好 部長我們希望就事論事 就專業論專業啦所以一樣 就是說在現在的執法已經我們為了要擺脫行人地獄一年多的時間但難免在社會上有遇到很多的狀況每個人都會以本位主義為考量 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
784.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
787.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
駕駛用路人以及行人等等的部分本席認為應該都是 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
790.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
816.791 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
我們不能說偏廢權益都要互相尊重那在這兩個案例裡面部長看到什麼樣的狀況報告委員大家像委員剛剛所提到的大家對於大家平等的狀況的共識我認為這個社會還不足啦那但是對交通部來說最重要的行人的安全因為這關係到人命這個部分我們會去要求所以剛剛那個影片雖然沒有辦法播放但我有看過那桃園市政府也有針對 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
818.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
843.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
這十幾台車有裁罰這個部分有裁罰那針對行人的部分其實我知道因為這個我們現在開始尊重行人之後有些行人的違規的狀況我們也都看得到那這個部分該罰其實也都有罰那最近這兩年我們在行人違規的開罰的這個數量其實也增加了不少因為現在大家都有行車紀錄器如果有行車紀錄器的檢舉這些該罰其實也都會罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
846.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
866.754 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
開罰是最好的做法嗎其實不是 大家的觀念是最重要的所以我們觀念的提升以及怎麼樣用制度的設計讓更多人能夠清楚明白了解一個過馬路每天大家都要做的事情的一個順暢本席只提一個這一個我覺得真的是可以研究討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
868.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
885.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
粉絲專頁上面也拍到日本有一個畫面他是在很多的價值朋友也抱怨就是說有看到行人在路邊的時候他不確定這行人到底要不要過馬路也因此他不確定說要不要停等那行人如果說他已經有他的習慣譬如說舉手代表是過馬路 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
887.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
907.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
另外一個部分像日本他有一個有趣的設計是說他有多畫一個過馬路時候的停等區如果說行人站在那上面代表他就是要準備過馬路那那個時候駕駛就應該要停下來讓行人過但如果說他不是停在那個地方的話可能他只是在路邊等朋友 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
907.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
917.712 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
他就不一定要停下來我覺得光這樣子的一個部分也許在幾個路口可以做事辦的方式非號之路口是可以這麼做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
918.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
947.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
我們可以來示範我們可以來示範我覺得這是蠻好的方法但我本席提醒一下像這個他是畫在馬路上如果說畫的話應該是要畫在行人畫裡面一點是畫裡面一點不然我覺得我看了也覺得說這個小朋友在馬路上側邊好像也有點危險為了要去那邊停等在日本可能比較安全在台灣可能比較危險好所以部長針對這個部分如果說能夠來示範什麼時候能夠來推行或說至少來做一個研擬跟規劃設計省到找個地方來做好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
948.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
957.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
我們省道很快速的來示範幾個路口我想還是要跟地方政府溝通之後來去做推行新北市跟台北市我們來跟他們溝通 |