| IVOD_ID |
159104 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/159104 |
| 日期 |
2025-03-13 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-19-2 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第2次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
2 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第2次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-03-13T10:54:17+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-03-13T11:03:19+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:09:02 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3b972b8f6f00770f014694617fb736bb6de99780e8e59786ff1cdb1affc83ff4b8c40d3938d270f35ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
謝衣鳯 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:54:17 - 11:03:19 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-03-13T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第2次全體委員會議（事由：邀請公平交易委員會代理主任委員列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。
【本次會議若因當日加開院會而停開，不再另行通知】） |
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謝謝主席我想請我們陳代理主委請陳代理主委 |
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你看一下這是2013年到2023年台灣數位廣告跟電視廣告整體市場金額的比較你看到從過去以來就是說電視廣告比較高到數位廣告比較低到2023年數位廣告已經超過了電視廣告那這個數字 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
46.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
60.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
給主委了解 我相信你也非常清楚喔那對於數位平台上面有商家指定平台支付或者是物流的服務那這些部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
61.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
81.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
因為平台業者他有拒絕提供用戶數據給晉升者或第三方或者是利用演算法的或者是未揭露的順序排序這樣子的規則對於特定的商家降權或限制流量 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
84.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
104.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
這請問例如像是新興的就是跟演算法有規定或者是數位平台上面他們有特定次序的這個部分的時候那請問公平會你要怎麼樣子介入以及監管我想委員提到的這些數位平台上面濫用數據演算法來排除競爭這個在 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
106.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
129.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
我們的公平法架構底下我們事實上都是可以去監管的只是說在監管的時候我們有一些前提要這樣符合譬如說數位平台要有市場力量另外一個更重要的是說它本身是不是真的有這樣的行為如果它真的有自我偏好的行為而且這個自我偏好的行為是那對於演算法那個演算法也是一樣現在陪同你上來備詢的這位是服務競爭處的處長服務競爭處的處長對他是負責數位平台 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
134.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
153.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
那它對於數位平台的演算法它是不是比較清楚我先簡單跟委員報告數位平台演算法主要在國際間關切的問題就是利用演算法來達成聯合定價業者同樣都用一套演算法所以我也知道你的價格你也知道我價格你調價我也調價所以是主要關切那這個我們持續都有在關注啦對處長要不要 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
154.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
180.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
有沒有相關的補充因為對於演算法這個部分其實一般的就是說購買的業者或者是消費者他並不了解說演算法的這樣子的推波的這個他的次序或者是規則是如何的但是如果在於就是平台他怎麼樣子推波給這些消費者的 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
180.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
192.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
那會不會導致於引導消費者的偏好等等的那這樣子怎麼樣子我們公平會怎麼樣子介入委員是不是請處長跟委員稍微做一下報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
194.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
223.064 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
委員目前的演算法做一些推波主要是在目前看起來是比較是為了要增加消費者比較良好的一個體驗譬如說我們有時候有搜尋引擎譬如說我搜尋了運動用品列曾經有搜尋過那他可能會感受到說我對於運動用品比較有興趣那就推出一些相關的廣告那以前過往的媒體的廣告呢是一種平面媒體或是一般的廣告他是不知道特定的人 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
223.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
251.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
所以它是一個比較沒有辦法針對性那它現在這可以做分眾這是一種比較數位時代進步上的一個進步那至於說目前說有沒有競爭法的問題的話我們是有在關注但目前在利害分析上我們認為說這部分可能是比較有益於消費者的部分但如果有限制競爭的問題的話當然我們也會注意以上那你們怎麼監管 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
253.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
253.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
我的問題是你們怎麼監管 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
255.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
280.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
我們當然除了自己主動會去了解譬如說這典型例子就是說業界或是市場上有傳出或者說國外之間有一些具體的案例我們就會去注意說國內是不是本身有這樣的問題那請問你們要跟什麼機關一同會同去如果涉及到比較數位技術的部分當然就跟產業主管機關我們會有密切的合作那是什麼數位部還是經濟部都可能數發部數發部經濟部都有經濟部對我是說這樣涉及到會不會是跨部會的 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
285.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
310.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
很多案子我们必须要尤其是在技术面的部分我们其实很需要速发部的一些专业上的见解就是在技术上面你们需要的是速发部但是在整个产业方面是不是应该要汇同经济部有时候产业上的一些数据一些事业的分布状况我们也是需要有一些主管机关来提供一些相关的数据做我们判断的基础好那现在就是根据 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
312.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
340.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
我們媒體報導的台積電他可能就是要入股了英特爾的這樣子的情況那還結合了輝達、超微還有博通等那未來他們如果入股了而且經營英特爾的這個晶片製造的合資企業我想根據我們之前台灣金聯的董事長施俊傑他說 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
341.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
360.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
他說無論是合作方式是投資入股或者是技術入股或者是由英特爾承接台積電在美國的先進封裝訂單都符合公平交易法的事業結合 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
364.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
390.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
這也會超過台積電與英特爾的年度銷售額接超過了公平會所規定的400億新台幣的門檻那代表了他們就必須要跟公平會申報那未來這一起在美國的這個結合案那你 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
392.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
402.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
還有我們的公平會會不會能夠勇敢的進行審查並且獨立的做出相關的判決 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
404.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
424.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
這個案子我們持續都密切在觀察發展那跟委員報告一下就是說我們審查的前提是他們合作的模式屬於我們結合的定義在公民法裡面第四條它有定義什麼叫結合那假設符合了那門檻也達到了不管是營業額很高我想這個營業額都很高所以符合當然就屬於我們可以審查他們就必須要來申報審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
425.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
448.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那審查的過程當中我們就會依照他們合作的模式到底是競爭者還是上下有業者的模式我們會依照公平法既有的審查的一些架構來進行實體的審查那因為我們是獨立機關我們絕對是獨立依法對那對於相關的資料那我們有沒有管到跟美國就是說能夠有相關的資料的這樣子的 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
450.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
476.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
像上一次我們在台灣審查Uber Eats的時候你們就因為資料的拖延其實就已經就是說在收集的方面都沒有辦法及時的就是按照時程內跟委員會報告以及給所有的大眾了解但現在如果這一起案件那的資料相關都在美國 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
476.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
489.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
那我們有沒有辦法能夠及時的取得及時的做出相關合理的這樣子的判決以及給予所有民眾一個公開的資訊呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
490.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
508.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
資料取得特別是涉及到跨國公司這個當然一直都是一個問題不過依法我們是可以要求提供資料的所以我們也會積極的要求業者必須要盡快配合我們的市場來提供相關的資料那同樣的邏輯跟規定我們也會適用在台積電的身上我們也會盡量的 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
509.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
538.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
要求他來符合我們審查的事項所以他必須要跟你申報是吧對 只要是審查我們要求他補件原則上他們都要配合所以他要跟你申報而且他要就是說要提供相關的這個資料給你是不是那你也會獨立的做出判決是不是那希望你們可以在就是說法定的期間內獨立的做出判決給予民眾了解好嗎所以我們依法來審查這個案子如果這案子進來的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
539.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
539.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
好好謝謝 |