| IVOD_ID |
158907 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/158907 |
| 日期 |
2025-01-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-35-27 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第27次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
27 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
35 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
外交及國防委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第27次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-01-16T10:25:49+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-01-16T10:35:52+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:03 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/e6909b4ca57c0612608e110a4eb8ee6b29ae781c7e1649b4e1c9837952b46cc31aa97a5015985c895ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
鍾佳濱 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:25:49 - 10:35:52 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-01-16T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第27次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國家安全局局長、國防部部長、大陸委員會、國家通訊傳播委員會、交通部、經濟部、數位發展部、海洋委員會海巡署報告「針對海底電纜係國家對外重要通訊手段，為避免中共利用各種灰色地帶手段測試我國網路及電網韌性情事發生，如何建立有效備援系統以支援軍事作戰並支撐基礎建設防護韌性」，並備質詢。） |
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接下來要請的人多一點那麼有請國安局蔡局長以及速發部的薛次長和海巡署的謝副署長那同時呢請我們NCC的陳處長交通部的陳司長以及中華電信的林總經理請準備那還是要請一下顧部長上來一下顧部長因為我只問一句話就好很簡單 |
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今天我的質詢,我先請大家看一個東西,關於海嵐我過去的質詢的記錄,我質詢過十次 |
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交通委員會五次 國防兩次 院會甚至問過一次但是今天呢 我想先就教於部長的 是另外一個課題您覺得 部長 顧部長 您覺得灰色地帶作戰最大的特色跟優勢是什麼灰色地帶作戰是不是成本相對低 讓你防不身防簡單講啦 如果要抓走私 你會派軍艦 還是派緝毒犬 派米格魯 |
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當然不可能派軍艦好 請回就沒國防部的事了嘛請回 謝謝來 蔡局長我們繼續來看下一張今天我們談了很多的事情 |
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我要談的就是我們的策略要符合經濟手段中國貨船全球斷海纜這個大家都知道了往下看切斷海纜的工具呢他早就申請專利真的很可惡再往下看尤其是呢他們的貨輪呢還訊號會造假那要我們去辨識MMSI還有不同身份這些呢都是一種很頭痛的一個事情我請問一下局長你覺得抓賊 |
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防竊跟反詐欺哪一個比較容易還是哪一個比較困難都不太容易啦都不太容易各種的手法不斷的在翻新當中是的那都要做好那我們來看一下 |
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下一個現在我們台灣的特色剛講14條國外10條國內最重要的你有沒有注意到新增加的TPU的海嵐系統它是Meta來跟投資然後它是走什麼走東岸的Down我們在東岸的上岸點只有投誠其他的三個都在西岸為什麼 局長為什麼我們投誠是接跨太平洋的嘛那TPU呢 從哪裡來 |
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從北部進來海南部是要不要請抒發部來說明會比較詳細你關於很重要來 抒發部來 他既然點了 次長你趕快講您覺得為什麼這個TP又要走那裡 |
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跟委員報告,TPU是日本、韓國、台灣、美國它的路徑從哪裡來?它的路徑是一個環狀的環狀的,對,所以它是從南邊上來的好,謝謝接下來我們要請教局長我們剛剛知道了中國的船舶,我們下一張偵測不法或航機詭異船舶的方法有第一個訊號,當然訊號會造假 |
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第二個雷達雷達可能要透過軍方但是漁船過多軍方的重點是防止這些軍事武裝力量進入侵另外一個用眼睛去看那眼睛去看你派船謝副組長在後面船的成本很大你會怎麼判 |
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198.769 |
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226.464 |
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我們有哪些方式局長你問有什麼方式哪些方式最有效益如何搭配資源夠不夠有沒有其他的方式譬如說低軌道衛星的合成孔徑雷達它看的面比較廣它可以穿透雲層它又不是岸上雷達有沒有考慮過這個方法都有啦事實上委員提到這些方法都存在我們在判定各種船位位置都要針對這些綜合的情質來做比較詳細的研判低軌的合成孔徑雷達的技術本局也有在使用 |
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226.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
248.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
但是這些所有的方法呢 都是要怎麼樣 要抓賊在哪裡 對不對好 接下來呢 在場的人可以聽我一下有沒有聽過一句台語的俗諺 下一章意思說三更半夜 做賊只要一個小時就得手啦但是你要防止小偷 你要整個晚上都不睡覺 是不是這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
250.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
261.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
大概知道意思吧所以我要問的情況 今天大家通篇都在問什麼要去登領啊 要登檢啊 要有法律依據啊要去識別啦 他還會用訊號假照啦怎麼辦 有沒有一個方法他做賊 他割你的海膽很快啊他在那邊尋釋 在那邊東張西望 你也不能對他怎麼樣等你不注意他就下手了 怎麼辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
274.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
296.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
這部分可能還是會針對他的可能侵擾的樣態去找出比較高風險的船舶的名單我來告訴你一個方法我們很簡單我們的警察人員就早就會這一套了你就看機場的企圖犬米格魯他在那邊秀秀秀一條米格魯沒多少成本但是整個機場旅客都在看他不要問到我偷藏那個肉包 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
297.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
323.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
行蹟可疑是不是就曝光了很簡單除了watch之外除了從上面監控之外就是follow覺得有點可疑的你們可疑模式有沒有建立有了嘛但是又不能登陵啊派一個無人船後面屁股跟啊後面有人跟監他敢下手嗎局長你知道我意思沒有我們防賊啊要找到對的基本成本最低的往下看來我現在請教一下我們的那個先問 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
327.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
355.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
請問副組長你認為戈蘭的幽靈船成本多少?培養一個戈蘭的幽靈船幾艘貨船要多少錢?目前的話他們有生意專利大概多少錢?要不要20億?沒有我現在還沒有最方便的資料我問那個次長通訊中斷的成本國家成本要多少?修復海嵐至少要兩千萬要兩千萬美金?台幣通訊中斷的損失呢? |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
356.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
380.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
很難估計很難估計對不對好我接下來請教一下因為今天有中華電信在無人機無人船貴不貴局長有沒有做過評估或者副處長無人船貴不貴無人機的滯空時間短我們用無人船比較簡單無人船呢無人船我們也在跟廠商在協調中那目前都在研發階段所以我真的說局長你要阻擇這個策略的運籌帷幄我要跟您說一件事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
381.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
401.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
就是說 如果這四種事情來比較 我覺得通訊中斷的損失最嚴重海嵐修復次之 養一隻幽靈船來割染 相對便宜你要用更便宜的方式 搞個一百艘無人船 先一輪後面都跟監你後面再跟 他就不敢動手了 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
402.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
430.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
無人船的治海時間很長啊所以我請您思考一下最後呢我簡單的要問一下那個薛次長來我們往下看來我們國家智慧國家2.0新綱領是不是有沒有開個會我們要佈建這些海欄台灣的光纜通道5G雲端聯網通路您知道嘛對不對知道知道好那是誰在主責數位國家整個方案是包括了速發部對包括了交通部還有包括了什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
432.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
455.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
國發會,好,來我給你講一個,下一個本席啊,在上一次在哪年前,我不只是在兩年前就問海南被割斷的事情我甚至在2020年我就提出一個主張,什麼就是東部的光纜通道還要加一個西岸的光纜通道還要加一個東岸的光纜站位通道未來我們海南有上路的地點是大武但是大武到頭城,目前有沒有光纖主幹,路上的 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
457.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
469.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
目前還沒有建還沒有我那時候要求交通部配置為什麼因為交通部啊他的台鐵的路廊很適合布建從大虎道頭層的光纖路廊為什麼我要提這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
470.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
499.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
你海欄會被割 陸欄會不會被破壞蔡局長會不會會不會被破壞所以不要只是顧眼前的事情眼前的海欄我兩年前就要再提醒了真的被割了現在我再提早兩年告訴你接下來就是陸欄的防備但是你佈建一個陸欄大概要五年的時間我上次質詢過林佳龍部長如果要在東岸的光線的戰備通道要佈到光線的陸欄大概要五年計畫去施作次長你覺得可不可行 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
500.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
520.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
我想在陸上布置比海上更便宜多了也好防護對不對但是你能保證他不攻擊你西岸的光藍路廊嗎沒有辦法保證沒有辦法保證嘛所以我今天最重要一點我要跟你們講一個抓賊防竊反詐欺要找對方法 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
521.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
546.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
對抗這種灰色地的作戰不要用飛機大砲用小成本的方式拍個米格魯跟在他屁股後面他就不敢下手無人船無人機第二預防海嵐的割染事件再度在其他地方發生趕快籌備我們第二條路上的東部幹線的光纖 光纜可以提個報告嗎第二個提案可不可以請速發部來研議一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
548.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
567.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
好 那麼蔡局長第一個方式 我已經跟你提了很多方式了不管是訊號假照 詭異航跡那個都要很發功夫的不管你用低軌道的衛星的合成光線雷達去Watch還是你用岸上雷達去掃描還是你派我們的海巡船上去要登陵都很貴買幾條米格魯 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
569.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
590.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
投資一些五人船嫌疑犯可能的嫌犯全一輪後面屁股跟肩船身漆得紅紅的讓他看得到我跟你講啦 想要拔竊的人看到有制服警察他就不做了啦最簡單的方式就是見警慮啦那警察呢不要派真人的派五人機的 可以考慮嗎好 這我們來研議也提供給海上司法單位參考謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
594.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
599.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
謝謝鍾嘉賓委員那請依委員的要求並一個月內提出書面報告接下來我們 |