| video_url |
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| 委員名稱 |
林淑芬 |
| 委員發言時間 |
12:06:35 - 12:19:24 |
| 影片長度 |
769 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-11-21T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第15次全體委員會議（事由：邀請司法院、法務部部長、內政部部長、內政部警政署署長、內政部移民署署長、勞動部、數位發展部、國家通訊傳播委員會、行政院打擊詐欺指揮中心、金融監督管理委員會率所屬相關單位列席就「如何遏止移工及青少年淪為詐騙集團工具，及打詐四法施行後相關子法及配套措施進度與具體成效之檢討」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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主席各位大家午安是不是來請我們行事廳廳長麻煩廳長委員好廳長上一次我在這裡質詢的時候我記得你說我們討論這個依究的這個糾紛鑑定那你說最後說你們派主責的法官跟醫師司跟醫審會的委員要來跟我們做一些說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
36.414 |
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然後從那時候到現在通通都沒有說明遇到我都會說我要去拜訪你我要去說明可不可以給我時間回應一下對我就是要聽你謝謝委員那事實上我們在這三個禮拜我們有跟法務部跟衛福部還有其他人還有幾個議事這樣子我這樣子問好了是 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
57.641 |
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84.026 |
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從我在院會質詢我們要求行政部門要跟司法院跨院會去討論這一件事情因為整個醫療糾紛的訴訟停擺到現在從法律過你們提了修法案208條的修法到現在七個多月了整個訴訟停擺你知道這個被醫院會退回的鑑定案件有多少件嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
85.906 |
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102.263 |
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這部分是在檢察署那邊的是300多件事實上我們自己調查的是沒那麼多啦就是審判中的是沒那麼多啦我知道目前只有兩件還是三件而已那我跟委員報告一下就卡關卡在檢察署當然送不到你們那裡啊你如果說我真笑你當作我是笑的喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
102.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
108.366 |
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那我跟委員報告一下我們事實上安排在11月29號你們開過幾次會協調跨院的這個協調討論11月29號要做跨部會的那個協商那另外呢我們安排11月27號下午我們跟醫師之前開過幾次會之前也有一個跟法務部有這邊聯繫過聯繫過沒有開過會 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
128.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
141.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
我們本來就因為他們我們有跟衛福部約時間他們一直說沒有空所以我們約所以才定在11月29號要跟跨部會包括醫事司跟新建師還有所以正式的會議是29號才要開11月29號那我們私底下的拜會部分在11月27號我們會拜會醫師全年會我們會去跟他們說明一些相關的一些見定心智的一些相關問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
152.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
155.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
也知道他們也想了解他們的顧慮現在不是你們去跟他們宣導現在是你要聽人家講什麼我們是要去了解他們的顧忌跟他們的需求是什麼我們看能不能提高他們我10月1號10月1號我諮詢10月1號你11月29兩個月以後才要開會 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
173.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
183.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
然後這兩個月中間沒有任何進度你們也相互之間正式的溝通也還沒有正式的溝通過然後正式的會議要11月29這已經很慢了耶你有沒有想過訴訟當事人的權益在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
195.954 |
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214.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
事實上我也跟委員報告一下我們也有去在網路上搜尋有沒有其他機關願意做醫療鑑定的的確是有在南部有個協會有在做那也曾經在參與過法院的一些相關醫療你不要跟我講曾經我現在問你的是現在有沒有人有意願要做如果就 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
218.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
228.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那我再問你一個問題你叫人家自然人要具名到底是具名比較敢真實的把這個報告裡面鑑定報告比較敢真實寫出來還是 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
231.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
232.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
具名比較不造假,還是要不具名?理想很豐滿,但是現實很骨感 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
250.177 |
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256.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
理想是很正確的但是做不到現在問題是你們是要保障訴訟當事人的權益讓這個鑑定報告的真實性還有它的公正性要確保可是呢執行起來是沒有了什麼都沒有了沒有鑑定了醫療糾紛連鑑定都沒有了我現在沒有 你說的都有道理啦但我現在只問你一件事啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
279.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
280.627 |
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醫療糾紛沒有鑑定,訴訟審理沒有辦法進行。」 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
294.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
299.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
他所受到的侵害誰要來補償他?我想衛福部也可以幫忙對國家政策的推行你還是機關本會主義衛福部告訴你我當初你修法就是這樣子造成整個法律你講得很有道理但是就沒有人要去跟你感情 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
318.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
341.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
沒有人要幹定整個訴訟審理沒辦法繼續在立委在這裡跟你們講了兩個月以後還是沒有進度也沒有溝通有安排進度也有溝通事實上在上任然後你在進度和溝通的態度你就是我繼續維持我本位主義我們沒有維持我們本位主義現在現在我知道我跟妳說我跟妳說就是我們想說我現在跟妳問妳一件事 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
344.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
365.138 |
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您講的都很有道理,但是沒辦法醫生買,醫生會也沒人買,現在要怎麼做?我問您是如何解決這個問題?所以我們才去拜託去拜訪那個全國醫事聯合會就我所知,醫事部門的人希望重新再修法,你有可能嗎?你接受嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
366.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
373.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
就目前來講我們可能還要審慎的考慮你就是不願意接受你現在就是不願意你現在所指的理由你就是說平平專業人士很多啊白人的專業人士就發動具名是怎麼你們做醫生的沒辦法你們的態度就是這樣啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
385.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
409.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
問責制度問責機能這是一個立法你就是認為理所當然現在我問你是執行面你利益良善而且是正確無誤可是執行面執行面做不出來要怎麼做啊那你不可以說醫生說你就一定要來幫我做的是我們當然不能明顯說我們才說我們要盡力的所以我問你的不是盡力喔你已經盡力你已經拖到過去了已經背後了 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
411.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
424.97 |
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被告的你若訴訟當事人說我的案件八個月全台灣每一個每一個訴訟當事人每一個案件都沒有辦法鑑定每個人都拖在那裡跟你沒關係捏因為案件沒到你這裡來是檢察官沒跟董事請的事情捏 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
431.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
444.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
你現在結果說跟你們無關的火是你們放的現在你們置身度外都跟你們無關的事不關己責任都在檢察官和訴訟當事人身上可是就沒辦法鑑定 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
448.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
452.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
這個是國事會議的結論我們必須去做弱勢你現在國事會議的結論你做廳長的人你沒辦法解決我現在立委跟你接觸你說你叫國事會議執行你就沒找出解決的問題的方法來我們有期望解決的方案你到現在還在堅持說你沒辦法修法 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
469.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
481.947 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
你沒有修法也可以但是你告訴我怎麼解決我沒有要求一定要修法也許醫省會這邊他們有他們的堅持我們尊重所以你認為醫省會的制度運作是錯誤的嗎我再問你聽長你認為醫省會運作的制度是錯誤的嗎你知道醫省會怎麼運作嗎我知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
493.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
503.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
就醫療鑑定的部分先從出鑑醫師出鑑醫師從醫學中心來找出鑑醫師出鑑醫師然後呢對 然後再提到醫審會去做審議醫審會是不是集體共識決是不是可以修改出鑑醫師的意見它是一致決的 一致決的對 要一致共識在監察院曾經在109年也曾經為了一個匿名鑑定的部分提出一個調查報告也針對醫審會這個部分是調查報告還是糾正報告你要講什麼前策 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
522.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
530.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
就沒有修正你現在在說一個調查報告我問你啦大家醫省會所有的委員對初見報告可不可以下指導期可不可以修正可不可以改是可以的阿你這樣子叫初見的醫生去具名公平嗎很抱歉我們有講初見醫師是不用具名的要具名的是誰就是醫省會的所有的委員具名所有的委員更冤枉 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
552.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
570.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
因為我對出鑑的醫生有一點意見然後你叫我出鑑你叫我大家都要具名請問到庭上去結問的要是誰負責去用審理的審判的時候要去上出法這個在我們有跟法官講說 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
571.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
593.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
如果是這種情形 如果他有鑑定不足的部分 儘量用書補充鑑定的方式來實施 如果非必要的話啊 必要的時候是叫誰那就請出見 不是請出見委員來 不是請出見醫師來請問那就有具名的委員了 其中一個具名委員 其中一個到底是誰啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
594.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
606.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
你名字沒有給我們我們怎麼知道通知是誰一次如果有五個六個要找誰那每個人都有每他的專業我們根據這部分的專業也許那他為什麼要花這個時間去為這個鑑定報告去負責呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
612.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
628.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
所以你的意思是醫生會你覺得很簡單的但是他們就沒辦法運作醫生也不愛捏那怎麼辦我也知道他們的顧慮啦事實上我剛才問你的事實上我們有個幾位醫師也有報告過具名瞎出來報告比較不造假是不是啦你跟我說這是基本的問責機制啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
629.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
651.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
就好像我們最高法院以前的秘密分爛的時代保密分爛的時代 如果法官都不具名 或者是...規定意見具名勢必難以避免案件關係人進行關說請託之情事 需求鑑定人能做出對極有力的鑑定如果有不利於己方的鑑定 案件關係人更可能進一步對鑑定人進行騷擾或報復好 現在來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
655.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
672.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
B.B.醫生,好多關係啦,好多關係啦,這樣現在,如果這樣下去,醫生沒人要做如果把這個理由推演下去的話,所有的審查都通通不要具名,包括法院的判決書都不要具名,法官的名字在審理的時候也都不要具名 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
674.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
695.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
因為我們也有朋友啊那這樣子可以用這樣的推演說我們會被受關說現在是這樣你職務上你不可規避啊分案給你你就要審啊那這個醫生呢他是法定的職權耶法定的任務耶你就是醫生人家醫生會是這樣沒有錯可是醫生可以說我不當委員了啊他不是真的法官是以此為業他可以說我不當啦我不當委員啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
703.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
714.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
他不是以此為業 以委員為業我現在都不想問你道歉 因為你說了有道歉 但是醫生就是不愛這要怎麼解決你沒有想出來 你要拖下去 這幾百個訴訟當事人的權益到底還要讓你們拖多久 我就問這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
726.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
738.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
要再拖下去或想辦法你今天在這裡跟我們說想辦法可是你要想多久我們真的有在做事我們包括我們安排了聯繫會議兩個月一次不是兩個月一次立委諮詢以後兩個月才有開會我們請法官到意見會那邊去做說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
744.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
761.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
這部分我們都有在做,我們知道他們的難處是什麼事實上我們開了三次會、諮詢會,會員隊的人也有到我們這邊來做一些現在就是司法院都很大,跟你說也不想聽我們非常尊重委員給我們的指教對啦,我會指教,我們就等著審預算的時候來指教啦 |
| IVOD_ID |
157340 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/157340 |
| 日期 |
2024-11-21 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-36-15 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
15 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
36 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第15次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-11-21T12:06:35+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-11-21T12:19:24+08:00 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |