| IVOD_ID |
155529 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/155529 |
| 日期 |
2024-10-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-19-5 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
5 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-10-16T10:27:35+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-10-16T10:38:28+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:53 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| 委員名稱 |
陳亭妃 |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/9cb36b9643c5df69d4e991289839cbe48abd6de18eea4dbe4b5ae818276114a0f0c54870947c465d5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
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現在請陳亭妃委員質詢。陳亭妃委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
25.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
29.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
委員長部長早還有署長基本上我待會 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
30.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
31.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
57.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
57.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
陳亭妃 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
73.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
96.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
我們看到一期 這也是陳亭妃一直在追的一期的回饋金簽的地方 21.6億當時候在我們的環評裡面 所寫的是要售電收入的回饋結果 申罷自己把它改變成盈餘你知道這當中20年差了多少 21.6億 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
99.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
115.129 |
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結果現在不跟地方談沒有談啊騙你的啦在談什麼在談成為別的特定人士的小金庫在地居然辦活動沒有辦法爭取到預算的一個補助 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
119.522 |
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147.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
其他完全不在這個區塊的還可以爭取到補助我將這個新聞報得非常清楚我們也是收到了一大堆澄清案回饋金不跟地方談欠地方的不談21.6億不談成為特定人士的小金庫再來二期沿用一期的管線現在都在試營運地方炸鍋 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
149.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
167.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
問題是安全在哪裡沒有人沒有人說也沒有人給我們資料也沒有人給我們評估在環評要用二期來沿用一期的管線居然在環評裡面沒有任何的一些監測標準現在是我們質詢之後現在才開始做一些監測 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
176.189 |
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197.795 |
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你是不是把地方人民的生命財產安全當成什麼當成什麼這是誰在護航誰在護航再來 署長久違久違安定 要在安定設廠天然清拒絕現在素穀廠商也拒絕那現在要何去何從嘿 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
204.431 |
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229.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
好現在好奇怪九位是拿到台電他的核准天然氣設置的核准好奇怪現在安定設廠拒絕因為當時候也是我帶頭的因為他沒有辦法給地方安全的證明所以當時候安定安南 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
230.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
257.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
所有的民眾反彈請你們趕快去做說明趕快去做一些溝通你們都置之不理大家都置之不理好拒絕了大家都拒絕了現在聽說在議會有決議要去溯谷園區現在連廠商也拒絕那大家都拒絕了居然還有一個電廠突然之間寶春 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
260.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
283.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
目前好奇怪喔在第一時間我想這個資料署長也清楚他已經違反行政程序沒有讓地方同意結果就跟台糖申請結果台糖是拒絕台糖是拒絕你們能源署也沒有收到任何的資料然後他們現在在做什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
288.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
316.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
目前喔 都沒有提出任何申請 地點也沒確認寶村居然在各地辦理各區的說明會在各地喔 善化 關鐵 麻豆 到處辦 到處辦他在辦什麼 然後善化的民眾問他說請問你要設置哪裡 阿伯國庭啦請問你阿伯國庭 那你今天在召開什麼樣的說明會 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
318.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
344.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
你地點都沒確認你還召開什麼說明會我跟台堂問請問他有跟你們申請嗎沒有我跟能源署問沒有那請問他可以在各區辦說明會造成人心惶惶我收了一堆陳情書反對的陳情書那請問他在製造這個假象是什麼是認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
348.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
360.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
現在九位不能做了因為我們都反對九位不能做了所以他有機會有人在撐腰可以去拿到這張執照 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
361.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
385.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
是這樣嗎 否則你跟我說寶春現在也沒拿到臺電的天然氣的相關資料然後又沒有提出申請他到處在辦說明會是在辦什麼搞得大家現在一頭霧水 署長我剛提出來這整個他電廠可以橫著走嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
386.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
410.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
跟我們報告所有的電廠設立當然要依照相關的法令那這中間在台南完全沒有阿在台南完全沒有依照相關的SOP在走阿到底是誰到底是誰嘛誰在護航嘛否則為什麼我們台南這麼奇怪電廠都可以不照著我們應有的規定辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
414.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
424.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
都可以做直升機做噴射機搞的地方那麼大的反彈搞的地方都要出來抗爭為什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
427.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
427.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
署長今天該辦的不辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
454.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
472.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
今天申辦應該去辦地方說明會去跟地方說他的管線要怎麼跑然後他的安全性在哪裡去適宜的是申辦他不辦他不辦結果保村連八字都沒一撇 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
474.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
486.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
也沒有拿到台電的准許也沒有跟台糖去申請到相關的土地也沒有跟我們能源署申請他到處在辦他在辦什麼他在辦什麼這不是奇怪嗎該辦的不辦然後不該辦的造成地方的恐慌去到麻豆大家要說是要在我們麻豆設電廠 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
503.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
518.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
阿去上化然後去關田大家一頭霧水現在是要來我們這邊設了嗎所以 署長台南到底怎麼了台南到底怎麼了 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
522.911 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
541.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
有關於這個電力開發計畫我還是說都要依照相關的法令來執行那委員所關切的包括第一個生霸那生霸這部分剛剛委員所關心的回饋金的部分分成一期跟二期那剛剛委員談到的那個一期的部分是在我們的電協已經發布之前 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
541.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
551.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
所以這個部分看他有沒有跟地方的相關的協議那委員提到的有關在環評說明書裡面所提到的這些相關論述那個已經寫得很清楚了啦從去年開始到今年你們有什麼樣的進度完全沒有沒有進度一期沒有進度然後二期甚至可以無限上綱變成讓電廠自己可以去 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
567.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
587.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
處理他那40%的部分這我完全不能接受沒有安全性然後又可以變成是小金庫變成是電廠的小金庫來修理地方反對他的人我沒辦法接受我告訴你署長我再次強調喔沒有安全我告訴你生怕不可能讓他運轉 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
589.398 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
607.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
第二今天回饋金沒有處理地方沒有辦法接受因為欠地方的21.6億就要歸還這很簡單然後保村他基本上完全八字沒一撇他到底在做什麼樣的處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
609.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
636.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
這是不是有人在乎啦 我不知道啦喔 署長你森巴如果在這樣子橫著走寶村在這樣橫著走因為酒會大概也已經大家地方都反對也沒機會了啦如果電廠要橫著走沒有人願意陪著你們這樣子毫無關注地方的聲音我們永遠跟人民站在一起 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
637.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
648.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
我們永遠跟人民站在一起如果真的我們會跟人民站在第一線抗議要嘛就從我們的身上踩過去 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-10-16T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:27:35 - 10:38:28 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請經濟部部長率台灣電力股份有限公司董事長就「我國電力能源配比執行現況與未來規劃」進行報告，並備質詢。） |
| gazette.lineno |
439 |
| gazette.blocks[0][0] |
陳委員亭妃：（10時27分）謝謝主席，我請部長還有能源署署長。 |
| gazette.blocks[1][0] |
主席：請郭部長還有游署長。 |
| gazette.blocks[2][0] |
郭部長智輝：委員早。 |
| gazette.blocks[3][0] |
陳委員亭妃：部長早，還有署長。基本上我待會兒討論的部分，我想署長會比較清楚，可以由署長直接回答，因為這個是延續性的，我也希望部長知道到底臺南發生什麼事，尤其這跟我們未來的用電有直接關係。每個人都說因為要用電，但是要用電，電廠就可以橫著走嗎？就可以漠視人民的安全還有權利嗎？應該不是吧！ |
| gazette.blocks[3][1] |
我們有幾個問題，我想署長都很清楚，我們從森霸開始來談，這也是陳亭妃一直在追的，一期的回饋金，回饋金欠了地方21.6億，當時在環評裡面所寫的是要售電收入的回饋喔！結果森霸自己把它改變成盈餘！這當中二十年差了多少？21.6億。結果現在不跟地方談，沒有談哪！它騙你的，在談什麼？在談成為別的特定人士的小金庫。在地居然辦活動，沒有辦法爭取到預算補助，其他完全不在這個區塊的還可以爭取到補助，這個新聞報得非常清楚，我們也是收到了一大堆陳情案。回饋金不跟地方談，欠地方的不談，21.6億不談，成為特定人士的小金庫。 |
| gazette.blocks[3][2] |
再來，二期沿用一期的管線，現在都在試營運，地方炸鍋耶！問題是安全在哪裡？沒有人說、沒有人給我們資料，也沒有人給我們評估。二期要沿用一期的管線，居然在環評裡面沒有任何的一些監測標準，是我們質詢之後，現在才開始做一些監測，你把地方人民的生命財產安全當成什麼？當成什麼？這是誰在護航、誰在護航？ |
| gazette.blocks[3][3] |
再來，署長，九崴要在安定設廠、天然氣，被拒絕，樹谷廠商也拒絕，現在何去何從？現在好奇怪，九崴是拿到台電的核准，天然氣設置的核准，好奇怪！安定設廠，被拒絕，當時也是我帶頭的，因為它沒有辦法給地方安全的證明，所以當時安定、安南所有的民眾反彈，請你們趕快去做說明、趕快去做一些溝通，你們都置之不理，大家都置之不理。好，都拒絕了，現在聽說議會有決議要去樹谷園區，現在連廠商也拒絕，大家都拒絕了。 |
| gazette.blocks[3][4] |
居然還有一個電廠，突然之間，寶椿目前……好奇怪喔！在第一時間，我想這個資料署長也清楚，它已經違反行政程序，沒有經地方同意就跟台糖申請，結果台糖拒絕，台糖是拒絕耶！能源署也沒有收到任何資料耶！然後他們現在在做什麼？目前喔！都沒有提出任何申請，地點也沒確認，寶椿居然在各地辦理各區說明會，在各地喔！在善化、官田、麻豆到處辦。到處辦，它在辦什麼？善化的民眾問它：請問你要設在哪裡。還沒決定啦！還沒決定，那請問今天在召開什麼樣的說明會？地點都沒確認，要召開什麼說明會？我問台糖：請問它有跟你們申請嗎？沒有。我問能源署，沒有！那請問它可以在各區辦說明會嗎？造成人心惶惶。我收了一堆陳情書、反對的陳情書，請問它在製造的假象是什麼？是認為現在九崴不能做了，因為我們都反對，九崴不能做了，所以它有機會、有人在撐腰，可以拿到這一張執照，是這樣嗎？否則，你跟我說，寶椿現在也沒拿到台電的天然氣的相關資料，又沒有提出申請，它到處在辦說明會是在辦什麼？搞得大家現在一頭霧水。署長，以上我剛剛提出來的，電廠可以橫著走嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[4][0] |
游署長振偉：跟委員報告，所有的電廠設立當然要依照相關法令，這中間…… |
| gazette.blocks[5][0] |
陳委員亭妃：在臺南完全沒有啊！在臺南完全沒有依照相關的SOP在走。 |
| gazette.blocks[6][0] |
游署長振偉：一定是要…… |
| gazette.blocks[7][0] |
陳委員亭妃：到底是誰？到底是誰嘛？誰在護航嘛？否則為什麼臺南這麼奇怪，電廠都可以不照著我們應有的規定辦理，都可以坐直升機、坐噴射機，搞得地方那麼大的反彈、搞得地方都要出來抗爭，為什麼？ |
| gazette.blocks[8][0] |
游署長振偉：跟委員報告，相關的程序一定要遵守，有關電廠設立，包括該有的這些行政程序、審查前的說明會，包括在環評法裡面也都有規定；在電業法裡面，我們也有相關的規範，說明會是必要的程序。寶椿這個案子，它現在是在蒐集民意的階段。 |
| gazette.blocks[9][0] |
陳委員亭妃：署長，今天該辦的不辦，今天森霸應該去辦地方說明會、跟地方說它的管線要怎麼跑、安全性在哪裡，去釋疑的是森霸，它不辦！它不辦，結果寶椿連八字都沒一撇，沒有拿到台電的准許、沒有跟台糖申請到相關的土地，也沒有跟能源署申請，它到處在辦，它在辦什麼？它在辦什麼，這不是奇怪嗎？該辦的不辦，然後不該辦的造成地方恐慌，去到麻豆，大家說：是要在我們麻豆設電廠？去善化，然後去官田，大家一頭霧水：現在是要來我們這邊設了嗎？所以署長，臺南到底怎麼了？臺南到底怎麼了？ |
| gazette.blocks[10][0] |
游署長振偉：跟委員報告，有關於這個電力開發計畫，我還是說都要依照相關的法令執行，委員所關切的，包括第一個，森霸這部分，剛剛委員所關心的回饋金部分，分成一期和二期，委員談到的一期是在我們的電協金發布之前，所以這部分看它有沒有跟地方的相關協議。委員提到，有關環評說明書裡面所提到的這些相關論述…… |
| gazette.blocks[11][0] |
陳委員亭妃：那個已經寫得很清楚了，從去年開始到今年，你們有什麼樣的進度？完全沒有。沒有進度，一期沒有進度，二期甚至無限上綱，變成讓電廠自己可以去處理它那40%的部分，這我完全不能接受，沒有安全性，又可以變成小金庫，變成是電廠的小金庫來修理地方上反對它的人，我沒辦法接受！ |
| gazette.blocks[12][0] |
游署長振偉：跟委員報告，二期…… |
| gazette.blocks[13][0] |
陳委員亭妃：署長，我再一次強調，沒有安全，我告訴你，森霸的話，不可能讓它運轉。第二，今天回饋金沒有處理，地方沒有辦法接受，因為欠地方的21.6億就是要歸還，這很簡單。然後寶椿基本上完全就是八字沒一撇，它到底在做什麼樣的處理？這是不是有人在護，我不知道啦！署長，森霸如果再這樣子橫著走、寶椿再這樣橫著走，九崴因為地方大家都反對，也沒機會了啦！如果電廠要橫著走，沒有人願意陪著你們這樣子毫不關注地方的聲音，我們永遠跟人民站在一起！我們永遠跟人民站在一起！如果真的，我們會跟人民站在第一線抗議，要嗎？就從我們的身上踩過去！ |
| gazette.blocks[14][0] |
主席：請賴瑞隆委員質詢。 |
| gazette.agenda.page_end |
304 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_id |
委員會-11-2-19-5 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[0] |
呂玉玲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[1] |
林岱樺 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[2] |
邱議瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[3] |
張嘉郡 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[4] |
羅智強 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[5] |
楊瓊瓔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[6] |
鄭正鈐 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[7] |
陳亭妃 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[8] |
賴瑞隆 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[9] |
張啓楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[10] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[11] |
邱志偉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[12] |
謝衣鳯 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[13] |
陳超明 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[14] |
郭國文 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[15] |
賴士葆 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[16] |
萬美玲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[17] |
蔡易餘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[18] |
洪孟楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[19] |
黃國昌 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[20] |
王育敏 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[21] |
陳昭姿 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[22] |
高金素梅 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[23] |
廖偉翔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[24] |
黃健豪 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[25] |
葉元之 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[26] |
翁曉玲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[27] |
牛煦庭 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[28] |
涂權吉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[29] |
何欣純 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[30] |
徐富癸 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[31] |
徐欣瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[32] |
林思銘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[33] |
陳冠廷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[34] |
王鴻薇 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[35] |
傅崐萁 |
| gazette.agenda.page_start |
209 |
| gazette.agenda.meetingDate[0] |
2024-10-16 |
| gazette.agenda.gazette_id |
1138401 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_lcidc_ids[0] |
1138401_00009 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_name |
立法院第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議紀錄 |
| gazette.agenda.content |
邀請經濟部部長率台灣電力股份有限公司董事長就「我國電力能源配比執行現況與未來規劃」進
行報告，並備質詢 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_id |
1138401_00017 |