| 影片長度 |
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| 委員名稱 |
蘇清泉 |
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部長謝謝謝謝主席你好我今天問你兩個問題第一個就就業安定基金第二個是東港的漁船的漁工第一個就業安定基金在第8屆地委的那個時代開始嘛那那個時候的規模差不多5億6億到現在已經400億今年可能1000億了有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
32.941 |
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臺灣現在外資看護23萬這是每個月繳多少錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
47.715 |
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68.825 |
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兩千那如果是製造業因為我接到很多僱主的抱怨製造業五千、六千及一萬一個外籍老公來台灣僱主還要提高一萬塊怕死人一年十二萬的沒有 太貴了你這麼錢這麼多 大家都這樣白手金褲褲 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
72.967 |
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94.444 |
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我跟委員報告啦齁您講的那個比較超過2000跟2000是以上的那個都是額外的extra的那個機制啦啊那個當然就是為了希望你不要引進太多移工而設計的所以確實我也知道我們的廠商確實企業也你現在製造業根本找不到人嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
95.425 |
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116.028 |
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誒 不會餒委員 其實製造業這部分因為我們一直都有在開放 然後對他其實應該相對還算現在外籍勞工在臺灣已經快要變成我們人口的一部分了變成是我們同胞的一部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
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所以可是委員就是我們救援基金對也因為這樣所以所以能夠來平衡國人就業我們今年預算293億就進帳291啦那你的支出是花在什麼地方就國人就業喔就是失業的來頂失業救基金不是不是就業訓練要給他魚乾 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
144.904 |
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150.789 |
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不是職業養育,要給他養育剛剛可以釣魚我們剛剛拿工非職業性的離職每個月領的補助是用這筆錢來付的嗎?那是就業保險 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
162.403 |
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我就業保險是另外一筆錢就業保就保基金就保基金餘額更多那每個月在花給這些失業的勞工一個六個月啦九個月一年的年齡的關係那這個是勞保局在發的錢嗎通過勞保局去給付 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
187.998 |
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198.491 |
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好那你這個接案定基金洗29個委員在掌控嘛那以前有發生過很多弊端現在還會有嗎 |
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202.127 |
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220.12 |
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應該應該委員你覺得最近還有這幾年有在聽到嗎我們這位署長上來之後他還我覺得應該還蠻透明很公正的是那你們這個委員是多久拼一次兩年一任嗎還是兩年一任無幾職出馬費初期車馬費對 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
224.045 |
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252.131 |
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因為去年還有人在報裡面的弊端那你這樣一年有291的進賬那你的支出差不多多少我們今年預算支出也是編291欸收支要270我們今年的支出也是編270那是整個支出教育訓練是一部分啦不過是占三分之二以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
254.174 |
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273.067 |
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那錢那麼多所以呢各個縣市長都要跟你磕頭跟你掉頭寸有沒有這回事啊我們確實在補助地方政府方面也蠻多的對可是這不是磕頭啦那個大家都是夥伴關係對我們跟縣市的合作都非常好那有沒有拿去投資其他的 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
273.988 |
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276.57 |
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今年的預算也就是要拜託委員省 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
298.069 |
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那來第二個問題就是：當天很多外籍：這次在船上有外籍的漁工那常常被你們罰：被你們開罰單就是說這次的船員開到買艇、艇頭你要整理漁獲那你們想說那個叫鯊魚我告訴你齁我們這個海邊的魚 抓魚的齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
324.035 |
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324.055 |
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委員會議員會議員會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
350.844 |
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357.526 |
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委員我知道您在關心的這樣的形態他下船以後去幫忙鯊魚那沒有問題整理魚貨那不叫鯊魚火魚才叫鯊魚整理魚貨沒問題可是他如果去市場賣魚 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
376.952 |
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380.815 |
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海上叫做走私那兩岸叫做海上小貿易 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
382.508 |
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410.556 |
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關鍵不太一樣餒兩岸四地沒有什麼走私是海上小貿易所以這個想法講法不一樣所以你現在整理一戶家當然你們要跟漁業署來溝通那現在勞動部這邊是解釋然後現在你們是要怎麼處理你不能再一直開端那不然人家動會掉啦對不對你不知道這件事喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
411.336 |
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427.972 |
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我知道其實我在東港那邊有很多這樣的需求對他們也希望你的意思就是希望移工也能夠幫忙到市場上處理他處理他整理出來叫他到市場我們也不容許 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
429.233 |
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444.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
到岸邊喔?對岸邊,他現在起床了我們來研究看看好嗎?因為就是如果他是他工作的延伸那就可以啦對工作的延伸對我們來研究看看所以這個你要跟漁業署好好的來溝通不然的話這些傳統給你看到 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
449.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
461.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
今天剛好坐完坐完我們出去了,要給你餵了,所以今天跟愉悅鼠好好啊,好啊,溝通一下,好不好,那你現在你的部分,該稅有多寬,愉悅鼠那現在是還留很晚了嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
466.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
488.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
委員報告因為這個議題其實漁民有反應我們跟漁業署其實都有在持續溝通那現在就是把那個範圍界定工作延伸基本上那個部分只要沒有涉及到一些未來一些漁獲的販賣或什麼大概這個部分我們跟漁業署會來溝通 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
490.181 |
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490.502 |
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蘇清泉委員 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-10-16T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:16:58 - 10:25:31 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。
【10月16日及17日二天一次會】） |
| gazette.lineno |
593 |
| gazette.blocks[0][0] |
蘇委員清泉：（10時17分）部長，謝謝，謝謝主席。 |
| gazette.blocks[1][0] |
何部長佩珊：委員好。 |
| gazette.blocks[2][0] |
蘇委員清泉：我今天問你兩個問題，第一個是就業安定基金，第二個是東港的漁船的漁工。第一個，就業安定基金在第8屆立委的那個時代開始嘛。 |
| gazette.blocks[3][0] |
何部長佩珊：是。 |
| gazette.blocks[4][0] |
蘇委員清泉：那個時候的規模差不多五億、六億，到現在已經400億，今年可能1,000億了，有沒有？ |
| gazette.blocks[5][0] |
何部長佩珊：沒有。 |
| gazette.blocks[6][0] |
蘇委員清泉：那我現在要問你的是，我們臺灣現在外籍看護差不多有23萬人。 |
| gazette.blocks[7][0] |
何部長佩珊：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[8][0] |
蘇委員清泉：這個是每個月繳多少錢？ |
| gazette.blocks[9][0] |
何部長佩珊：2,000。 |
| gazette.blocks[10][0] |
蘇委員清泉：如果是製造業，因為我接到很多雇主在complain，製造業是5,000、6,000到1萬，一個外籍勞工來臺灣，雇主一個月要替他繳1萬塊，嚇死人！一年12萬欸，部長，會不會太貴？你們這個錢這麼多，大家眼睛都睜很大。 |
| gazette.blocks[11][0] |
何部長佩珊：我跟委員報告，你講的那個比較超過2,000跟2,400以上的，那個都是額外的、extra的那個機制啦，那個當然就是為了希望你不要引進太多移工而設計的，所以確實我也知道我們的廠商……確實企業也…… |
| gazette.blocks[12][0] |
蘇委員清泉：現在製造業根本找不到人嘛。 |
| gazette.blocks[13][0] |
何部長佩珊：不會欸，委員。 |
| gazette.blocks[14][0] |
蘇委員清泉：不會喔？ |
| gazette.blocks[15][0] |
何部長佩珊：是，其實製造業這部分，因為我們一直都有在開放，它其實應該相對還算…… |
| gazette.blocks[16][0] |
蘇委員清泉：現在外籍勞工在臺灣已經快要變成我們人口的一部分了，變成是我們同胞的一部分。 |
| gazette.blocks[17][0] |
何部長佩珊：可是委員，我們就安基金也因為這樣，所以能夠來平衡國人…… |
| gazette.blocks[18][0] |
蘇委員清泉：你這樣一年的收入差不多多少錢？ |
| gazette.blocks[19][0] |
何部長佩珊：我們今年預算293億。 |
| gazette.blocks[20][0] |
蘇委員清泉：就進帳290億啦，那你的支出是花在什麼地方？ |
| gazette.blocks[21][0] |
何部長佩珊：就是國人就業。 |
| gazette.blocks[22][0] |
蘇委員清泉：就是失業的人來領失業救濟金，對不對？ |
| gazette.blocks[23][0] |
何部長佩珊：不是、不是，是就業訓練，要給他釣竿可以釣魚。 |
| gazette.blocks[24][0] |
蘇委員清泉：我們的勞工如果是非自願性的離職，每個月領的補助就是用這筆錢來付的？ |
| gazette.blocks[25][0] |
何部長佩珊：不是，那是就業保險，就業保險是另外一筆錢，就保基金。 |
| gazette.blocks[26][0] |
蘇委員清泉：那你們的錢很多欸，你們基金一大堆、小金庫一大堆。 |
| gazette.blocks[27][0] |
何部長佩珊：就保基金餘額更多。 |
| gazette.blocks[28][0] |
蘇委員清泉：每個月發給這些失業的勞工，最長6個月、9個月、1年的失業給付，因年齡的關係有別。這是勞保局在發的錢嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[29][0] |
何部長佩珊：透過勞保局去給付。 |
| gazette.blocks[30][0] |
蘇委員清泉：就業安定基金是29個委員在掌控，以前發生過很多弊端，現在還有嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[31][0] |
何部長佩珊：委員這幾年有再聽到嗎？我們這位署長上任之後，我覺得應該還蠻透明、公正的。 |
| gazette.blocks[32][0] |
蘇委員清泉：委員是多久聘一次？兩年一任嗎？還是？ |
| gazette.blocks[33][0] |
何部長佩珊：兩年一任。 |
| gazette.blocks[34][0] |
蘇委員清泉：無給職？出席領車馬費而已？ |
| gazette.blocks[35][0] |
何部長佩珊：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[36][0] |
蘇委員清泉：去年還有人在爆裡面的弊端。一年有290億的進帳，支出差不多多少？ |
| gazette.blocks[37][0] |
何部長佩珊：我們今年預算支出也是編270億。 |
| gazette.blocks[38][0] |
蘇委員清泉：教育訓練就花270億，嚇死人！你是在說…… |
| gazette.blocks[39][0] |
何部長佩珊：那是整個支出，教育訓練是一部分，不過占三分之二以上。 |
| gazette.blocks[40][0] |
蘇委員清泉：錢那麼多，所以各個縣市長都要跟你磕頭、調頭寸，有沒有這回事？ |
| gazette.blocks[41][0] |
何部長佩珊：沒有。我們確實在補助地方政府方面也蠻多的，可是這不是磕頭，大家都是夥伴關係，我們跟縣市的合作都非常好。 |
| gazette.blocks[42][0] |
蘇委員清泉：你有沒有拿去投資其他的，比如股票等等？ |
| gazette.blocks[43][0] |
何部長佩珊：沒有，就是最保守的方式。 |
| gazette.blocks[44][0] |
蘇委員清泉：就是孳息，存款利息這樣而已？ |
| gazette.blocks[45][0] |
何部長佩珊：對，因為這是辛苦錢。 |
| gazette.blocks[46][0] |
蘇委員清泉：因為這個基金不用給立法院監控，也不用來報告，什麼都不用，就讓29個人在那邊搞。 |
| gazette.blocks[47][0] |
何部長佩珊：有，這個基金要來立院審的，要給您審的。今年的預算也要拜託委員審。 |
| gazette.blocks[48][0] |
蘇委員清泉：第二個問題就是東港很多漁船上面有外籍漁工，常常被你們處罰、開罰單。這些船員在碼頭上整理魚貨，你們說那個叫殺魚。我跟你們說，我們住海邊在捕魚、從事養殖的孩子，殺活的魚叫做殺魚，魚若死了就變魚貨，魚貨就是整理而已。魚貨在碼頭整理，他們當然要幫忙整理，不然船長要怎麼處理？你們卻拼命開單，開到讓大家群起連署，要租遊覽車來勞動部抗議，你們現在處理得怎樣？ |
| gazette.blocks[49][0] |
何部長佩珊：委員，我知道您在關心這樣的型態…… |
| gazette.blocks[50][0] |
蘇委員清泉：我很關心，我每天聽他們在吵。 |
| gazette.blocks[51][0] |
何部長佩珊：他下船以後去幫忙殺魚，沒有問題，可是他如果把魚搬去市場賣…… |
| gazette.blocks[52][0] |
蘇委員清泉：那是整理魚貨，不叫殺魚，活魚才叫殺魚。都是冰起來的死魚，都從海裡抓回來，都是死的、都冰凍的，哪叫殺魚？整理魚貨，講好！ |
| gazette.blocks[53][0] |
何部長佩珊：對，整理魚貨沒問題。可是他如果去市場賣魚就會…… |
| gazette.blocks[54][0] |
蘇委員清泉：海上叫做走私，兩岸叫做海上小額貿易，觀念不太一樣。兩岸四地沒有什麼走私，是海上小額貿易，所以這個想法、講法不一樣。 |
| gazette.blocks[55][0] |
何部長佩珊：主要是去市場上賣…… |
| gazette.blocks[56][0] |
蘇委員清泉：針對整理魚貨，你們要跟漁業署來溝通，現在勞動部有解釋，然後你們要怎麼處理？你不能再一直開單，這樣沒人受得了！部長，你不知道這件事情嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[57][0] |
何部長佩珊：我知道。我知道東港那邊有很多這樣的需求。 |
| gazette.blocks[58][0] |
蘇委員清泉：非常多。 |
| gazette.blocks[59][0] |
何部長佩珊：你的意思是希望漁工也能夠幫忙到市場上，處理、整理魚貨。 |
| gazette.blocks[60][0] |
蘇委員清泉：岸邊而已，叫他到市場而已，我們也不容許。 |
| gazette.blocks[61][0] |
何部長佩珊：可是這部分……到岸邊？ |
| gazette.blocks[62][0] |
蘇委員清泉：對，岸邊。魚貨上岸，他就在那邊整理、幫忙清洗等等。 |
| gazette.blocks[63][0] |
何部長佩珊：我們來研究看看，好嗎？如果是工作的延伸，那就可以。 |
| gazette.blocks[64][0] |
蘇委員清泉：對，工作的延伸，部長講到重點了。 |
| gazette.blocks[65][0] |
何部長佩珊：我們來研究看看。 |
| gazette.blocks[66][0] |
蘇委員清泉：你要跟漁業署好好來溝通。 |
| gazette.blocks[67][0] |
何部長佩珊：對，我們要跟漁業署一起會商。 |
| gazette.blocks[68][0] |
蘇委員清泉：不然這些船東被你開罰到……過兩天我就要帶他們坐遊覽車北上來包圍你們。 |
| gazette.blocks[69][0] |
何部長佩珊：了解。 |
| gazette.blocks[70][0] |
蘇委員清泉：所以趕快跟漁業署好好溝通，好不好？ |
| gazette.blocks[71][0] |
何部長佩珊：好。 |
| gazette.blocks[72][0] |
蘇委員清泉：現在你們的部分是解釋有放寬，漁業署那邊還抓得很緊嗎？你們有在溝通嗎？這個是漁民生計，現在抓魚很艱苦。 |
| gazette.blocks[73][0] |
何部長佩珊：我請署長來說明。 |
| gazette.blocks[74][0] |
蔡署長孟良：因為這個議題漁民有反映，我們跟漁業署都有在持續溝通，現在就是把範圍界定為工作延伸。基本上，那個部分只要未來沒有涉及魚貨的販賣等等，這個部分我們會跟漁業署來溝通。 |
| gazette.blocks[75][0] |
蘇委員清泉：就是很單純的，把魚抓上來、釣上來，在碼頭、岸邊幫忙整理這些魚貨，這樣不要把他當做……如果要到菜市場幫忙賣，這樣當然不行！如果只有在那邊工作就放寬一下，不要急著抓，這是沒意義的事情，好不好？ |
| gazette.blocks[76][0] |
何部長佩珊：好。 |
| gazette.blocks[77][0] |
蘇委員清泉：好，謝謝。 |
| gazette.blocks[78][0] |
何部長佩珊：謝謝委員。 |
| gazette.blocks[79][0] |
主席：好，謝謝。 |
| gazette.blocks[79][1] |
下一位請涂權吉委員，在涂權吉委員發言完畢後，休息10分鐘。 |
| gazette.agenda.page_end |
362 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_id |
委員會-11-2-26-4 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[0] |
黃秀芳 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[1] |
陳昭姿 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[2] |
林月琴 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[3] |
陳菁徽 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[4] |
王育敏 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[5] |
邱鎮軍 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[6] |
廖偉翔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[7] |
蘇清泉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[8] |
涂權吉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[9] |
王正旭 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[10] |
林淑芬 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[11] |
王鴻薇 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[12] |
羅廷瑋 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[13] |
陳瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[14] |
楊瓊瓔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[15] |
洪孟楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[16] |
吳宗憲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[17] |
林國成 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[18] |
羅智強 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[19] |
吳春城 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[20] |
邱若華 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[21] |
牛煦庭 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[22] |
蔡易餘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[23] |
葉元之 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[24] |
楊曜 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[25] |
劉建國 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[26] |
麥玉珍 |
| gazette.agenda.page_start |
265 |
| gazette.agenda.meetingDate[0] |
2024-10-16 |
| gazette.agenda.gazette_id |
1138601 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_lcidc_ids[0] |
1138601_00006 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_name |
立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄 |
| gazette.agenda.content |
邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_id |
1138601_00005 |
| IVOD_ID |
155518 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/155518 |
| 日期 |
2024-10-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-26-4 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
4 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-10-16T10:16:58+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-10-16T10:25:31+08:00 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |