| IVOD_ID |
151039 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151039 |
| 日期 |
2024-04-11 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-1-19-7 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第7次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
1 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
7 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第7次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-04-11T10:30:19+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-04-11T10:37:59+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:07:40 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/40ef09094e90200bac1f5a1b12030e08e63a84d836101fd2f8ba9b0039caa7a62f3f07a615f4351a5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:30:19 - 10:37:59 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-04-11T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第7次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查：
（一）行政院函請審議「遠洋漁業條例第十四條之一、第三十六條之一及第四十七條條文修正草案」案。
（二）本院委員邱鎮軍等18人擬具「遠洋漁業條例部分條文修正草案」案。
（三）本院委員楊瓊瓔等21人擬具「遠洋漁業條例增訂第十四條之一及第三十八條之一條文草案」案。
（第二案及第三案如經復議，則不予審查。）
二、審查：
（一）行政院函請審議「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案。
（二）本院委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等21人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案。
（三）本院委員賴瑞隆等16人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案。
（四）本院委員黃捷等22人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案。
（五）本院委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等16人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案。
（六）本院委員郭昱晴等16人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案。
（七）本院委員呂玉玲等17人擬具「野生動物保育法第十九條、第二十一條及第二十一條之一條文修正草案」案。
（八）本院委員張雅琳等18人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案。
（第八案如經復議，則不予審查。）
【4月10日及11日二天一次會】） |
| gazette.lineno |
483 |
| gazette.blocks[0][0] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：（10時30分）主席、各位委員。有請代理部長陳部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[1][0] |
主席：請陳部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[2][0] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：部長好。 |
| gazette.blocks[3][0] |
陳代理部長駿季：委員好。 |
| gazette.blocks[4][0] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：今天審查野保法還有遠洋漁業條例。原住民族基本法第十九條是在94年2月5號就公布施行，原住民得依法獵捕野生動物，而且是以傳統文化、祭儀、自用為限，從94年到現在一直沒有辦法落實，我們也曾經在第9屆提出野保法的修正，但是朝野協商沒有完成，沒有辦法三讀，106年2月24號朝野協商，然後在第10屆，就是上一屆，我們再次提出野保法的修正，雖然經濟委員會審完了，但是朝野協商沒有完成。因為野保法第二十一條之一遲遲未通過，導致原住民族一直被起訴，然後打官司要打很久。我們看2017年（106年）本席特別去聲援布農族的獵人王光祿，我特別舉了這個牌子──國家違法！因為原住民族基本法已經規定得很明確了，但是野保法一直不修，很多你們的官員，包括檢察官就起訴，這是我今年3月14號的臉書：國家違法！獵人無罪！恭喜獵人王光祿狩獵案，最高法院判決無罪確定！歷經10年，不是只有他喔！他是很堅持的，所以歷經10年，我們很多鄉親、很多獵人就這樣被起訴，然後被判決。我們看今天的野保法第二十一條之一修正條文，本席所提出來的跟現行條文，其實就是要因應原住民族基本法。因為時間的關係，我就跳到第五十一條之一，第五十一條之一本席的修正條文跟行政院版最大的差距，部長要不要說明一下？ |
| gazette.blocks[5][0] |
陳代理部長駿季：我想跟委員說明，我們行政院版本裡面大概有分為保育類跟一般野生類的部分，因為在整個動物保護來講，一般野生動物跟保育類動物是有不一樣的保護概念，所以我們有不同的處罰條例。 |
| gazette.blocks[6][0] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：我先談剛才農業部一直在說明的，對於到底要使用怎麼樣的狩獵器具，當然有很多不同的意見，跟我們原住民的需求、跟其他立委或是配合相關動保團體意見所提出來的，我們都尊重，但是也要尊重原住民族在臺灣這塊土地上千百年，造成野生動物各方面的減少絕對不是原住民，其實很多根本就是科技造成的，還有天災什麼的，都有關係啦！但是不能因為這些野生動物少了，然後就要影響我們的狩獵文化，所以這個部分也要請農業部該堅持的要堅持。以這一條條文來講，就是希望能夠維持現行條文，然後做適度的修正。部長，還有署長，其實去打獵的時候，你能看得清楚這是保育類還是不是保育類嗎？晚上怎麼看得出來呢？對不對？你說保育類就要怎麼樣加重處罰，狩獵的時候，尤其是晚上，我還可以眼睛這麼厲害嗎？所以還是維持現行條文，或最起碼就按照本席的條文，這個是事實嘛！ |
| gazette.blocks[7][0] |
陳代理部長駿季：我跟委員說明，如果這些獵人在狩獵之前有申請的話就不會發生這種事情。 |
| gazette.blocks[8][0] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：我知道，當然現在我們還不知道通過的條文是什麼。 |
| gazette.blocks[9][0] |
陳代理部長駿季：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[10][0] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：因為原來都說要核准嘛，判決也說還要核准，現在你也說修了嘛，對不對？但是現在是核准、備查兩個啊！ |
| gazette.blocks[11][0] |
陳代理部長駿季：我跟委員說明，後續的部分其實我們還有一系列的配套，包括一般狩獵、包括自主管理狩獵、包括原住民自主管理狩獵。如果到達原住民自主管理狩獵的時候，只要公部門跟原住民部落簽行政契約，他們就可以採用備查的方式。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][0] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：我知道。 |
| gazette.blocks[13][0] |
陳代理部長駿季：所以這個部分後面會有比較大的彈性去處理。 |
| gazette.blocks[14][0] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：你們的報告裡面有提到這已經施行12年了，但是就原住民族而言，這次修正之後才開始啦！你知道嗎？你講12年是從以前到現在，但是就我們而言，這是一直違法的法律啊！沒有配合原住民族基本法去修正。就你們而言是已經實施12年了，所以已經宣導過了，但是就我們而言，這次三讀通過之後才開始啊！所以認知上有很大的差別，好不好？希望不要堅持，希望能夠照我的條文啦！以上，謝謝。 |
| gazette.blocks[15][0] |
主席：謝謝鄭天財委員。接下來我們請張嘉郡委員詢答。 |
| gazette.agenda.page_end |
456 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_id |
委員會-11-1-19-7 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[0] |
邱議瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[1] |
邱鎮軍 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[2] |
楊瓊瓔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[3] |
黃捷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[4] |
伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[5] |
呂玉玲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[6] |
張雅琳 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[7] |
林岱樺 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[8] |
張啓楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[9] |
鄭正鈐 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[10] |
陳亭妃 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[11] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[12] |
張嘉郡 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[13] |
謝衣鳯 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[14] |
陳超明 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[15] |
賴瑞隆 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[16] |
邱志偉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[17] |
黃國昌 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[18] |
高金素梅 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[19] |
郭昱晴 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[20] |
蔡易餘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[21] |
洪申翰 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[22] |
陳冠廷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[23] |
洪孟楷 |
| gazette.agenda.page_start |
359 |
| gazette.agenda.meetingDate[0] |
2024-04-11 |
| gazette.agenda.gazette_id |
1132601 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_lcidc_ids[0] |
1132601_00006 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_name |
立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第7次全體委員會議紀錄 |
| gazette.agenda.content |
一、審查：(一)行政院函請審議「遠洋漁業條例第十四條之一、第三十六條之一及第四十七條條
文修正草案」案、(二)本院委員邱鎮軍等18人擬具「遠洋漁業條例部分條文修正草案」案、(三)
本院委員楊瓊瓔等21人擬具「遠洋漁業條例增訂第十四條之一及第三十八條之一條文草案」案；
二、審查：(一)行政院函請審議「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案、(二)本院委員鄭天財
Sra Kacaw 等21人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案、(三)本院委員賴瑞隆等16人擬
具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案、(四)本院委員黃捷等22人擬具「野生動物保育法部
分條文修正草案」案、(五)本院委員伍麗華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等16人擬具「野生動物保育法
部分條文修正草案」案、(六)本院委員郭昱晴等16人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」
案、(七)本院委員呂玉玲等17人擬具「野生動物保育法第十九條、第二十一條及第二十一條之一
條文修正草案」案、 (八)本院委員張雅琳等 18人擬具「野生動物保育法部分條文修正草案」案 |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
0.08 |
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21.928 |
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條文修正草案案。主席、各位委員、有請陳代理部長。來,請陳部長。來,部長好。委員好。 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
30.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
57.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
今天審查這個《野保法》還有《遠洋漁業條例》的《原住民族基本法》第十九條是在94年2月5號就公布施行原住民得依法獵捕野生動物而且是以傳統文化距離自用為限的94年到現在一直沒有辦法落實 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
58.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
80.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
我們曾經也在第九屆提出《野保法》但是草譯協商沒有完成沒有辦法刪讀。106年2月24號草譯協商然後在第十屆就是上一屆我們再次的提出《野保法》的修正 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
83.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
103.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
同樣,雖然經濟委員會審完了,但是草也協商沒有完成。所以,因為《野保法》21條之一遲遲未通過導致原住民族一直被起訴,然後打官司要打很久。我們看這個2017年、106年, |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
108.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
131.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
這個本席特別去聲援布農族的獵人王光祿我特別提了這個牌子國家違法因為也是原住民族基本法已經規定的很明確了但是野保法一直不修很多的你們的官員包括檢察官就起訴 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
133.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
161.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
就變成這個是我今年的3月14號的臉書國家違法獵人無罪恭喜王光祿這個狩獵案最高法院判決無罪確定歷經十年了不是只有他他是很堅持的所以歷經十年我們很多的鄉親很多的獵人就這樣被起訴 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
162.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
189.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
條之一及第十六條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
192.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
203.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
第51條之一、第51條之一本席的修正條文跟行政院版最大的差距。」 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
209.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
225.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
我想跟委員說明我們行政院版本裡面我們大概有分為保育類跟一般野生類的部分因為在整個動物保護來講一般野生動物跟保育類動物他是有不一樣的概念保護的概念所以我們有不同的這些處罰的一個條例這個條文我先談剛才一直農業部 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
238.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
241.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
條文修正草案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
263.815 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
282.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
所提出來的我們的尊重但是也要尊重原住民族在台灣這塊土地上千百年來造成這個野生動物各方面造成的減少絕對不是原住民 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
285.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
286.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
條文修正草案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
312.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
341.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
條條例部分條文修正草案案。以這條條文來講就是要希望能夠維持維持現行的條文然後做適度的一個修正其實這個部長還有署長去打獵的時候你能看得清楚這是保育類還是不是保育類嗎?晚上怎麼看得出來呢?對不對? |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
342.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
345.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
三）本院委員楊瓊瓔等21人擬具《遠洋漁業條例部分條例部分條文修正草案》案。 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
360.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
361.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
條文修正草案案 案。 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
384.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
412.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
但是你現在是核准備查兩個我跟委員說明後面的部分其實我們還有一系列的配套包括一般手列包括自主管理手列包括原住民自主管理手列那如果到原住民自主管理手列的時候只要我們公部門跟原住民部落簽行政契約的時候他們就可以採用備查的方式所以這個部分後面會有比較大的一個彈性去處理然後 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
414.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
442.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
及第十六條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一及第十八條之一 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
443.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
455.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
條文修正草案案 案件,但據我們而言,這次三讀通過之後才開始,雖然事實上有很大的差別,希望不要堅持,希望能夠照我的條文,以上謝謝。 |