| IVOD_ID |
17540 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/17540 |
| 日期 |
2026-06-24 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
聯席會議-11-5-19,20-3 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期經濟、財政兩委員會第3次聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
3 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[1] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[1] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期經濟、財政兩委員會第3次聯席會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2026-06-24T08:37:01+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-06-24T10:22:00+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
01:44:59 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/16eb79f0bb3b77db0f3d5f6e9ef4dbd4684e7a1615a05c3fed7231b3d2e2f92a410adc883542d2055ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-06-24T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期經濟、財政兩委員會第3次聯席會議（事由：一、繼續審查：
（一） 本院委員邱志偉等17人擬具「產業創新條例第十條、第二十三條之一及第二十三條之二條文修正草案」案。
（二） 本院委員鍾佳濱等20人擬具「產業創新條例第三十九條、第四十六條及第四十六條之一條文修正草案」案。
（三） 本院委員賴瑞隆等21人擬具「產業創新條例部分條文修正草案」案。
（四） 本院委員陳亭妃等19人擬具「產業創新條例部分條文修正草案」案。
（五） 本院委員邱鎮軍等17人擬具「產業創新條例第十條之一及第七十二條條文修正草案」案。
（六） 本院委員王鴻薇等23人擬具「產業創新條例第十條之一條文修正草案」案。
（七） 本院委員廖偉翔等19人擬具「產業創新條例第十條之一及第二十三條之一條文修正草案」案。
（八） 本院委員丁學忠等16人擬具「產業創新條例第六十七條之一及第七十條條文修正草案」案。
（九） 本院委員林倩綺等20人擬具「產業創新條例第十條之一及第七十二條條文修正草案」案。
（十） 本院委員蔡易餘等17人擬具「產業創新條例部分條文修正草案」案。
（十一） 本院委員邱志偉等18人擬具「產業創新條例第二條及第二十三條之三條文修正草案」案。
（十二） 本院委員楊瓊瓔等25人擬具「產業創新條例第十條、第二十三條之一及第二十三條之二條文修正草案」案。
（十三） 本院委員邱志偉等19人擬具「產業創新條例第十九條之一條文修正草案」案。
二、審查：
（十四） 本院委員林思銘等18人擬具「產業創新條例第十條條文修正草案」案。(處理)
【6月24日及6月25日二天一次會】） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:37:01 - 10:22:00 |
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剝皮 |
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MING PAO CANADA MANGA |
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915.087 |
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915.842 |
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谢谢观看,下次见! |
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1033.985 |
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1035.009 |
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MING PAO CANADA MANGA |
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1116.192 |
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1116.395 |
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谢谢观看,下次见! |
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1159.315 |
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1159.477 |
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谢谢观看,下次见! |
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1291.834 |
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1307.048 |
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字幕志愿者 杨洁 |
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1645.615 |
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1647.105 |
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谢谢观看,下次见! |
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1695.58 |
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1695.661 |
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谢谢观看 |
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1745.667 |
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1746.883 |
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谢谢观看,下次见! |
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1777.568 |
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1807.255 |
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字幕志愿者 杨洁 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
2124.319 |
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2124.42 |
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谢谢观看 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
2164.718 |
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2165.358 |
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谢谢观看 |
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2286.647 |
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2297.519 |
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谢谢观看 |
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2400.401 |
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2401.169 |
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MING PAO CANADA MANGA |
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2472.91 |
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2473.422 |
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MING PAO CANADA MANGA |
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2517.227 |
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2532.36 |
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由 Amara.org 社群提供的字幕 |
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2558.09 |
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2567.21 |
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MING PAO CANADA MING PAO TORONTO |
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2593.882 |
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2595.009 |
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MING PAO CANADA MANGA |
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2663.957 |
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2680.57 |
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好大家早安我們現在開會先請組密報告出席人數報告聯席會出席委員10人一組法定人數好我們現在開會我們首先進行報告事項請議事人員宣讀上次會議事錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
2682.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
2703.126 |
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立法院第11屆第5會期經濟財政兩委員會第二次聯席會議事錄時間115年4月30日星期四9時至10時1分地點花樓101會議室初期委員陳婷菲等27人請教委員1人練習委員洪孟凱等2人練習人員經濟部政務次長何進昌國家發展委員會主任委員葉俊賢等主席召集委員邱志偉8事項宣讀上次會議事錄決定確定 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
2704.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
2718.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
討論事項一繼續審查本院委員邱志偉等十幾人理據產業創新條例第十條第二十三條之一及第二十三條之二條件修正草案二本院委員鍾嘉斌等二十人理據產業創新條例第三十九條第四十六條及第四十六條之一條件修正草案 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
2720.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
2745.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
3.本院台湾民政党党团拟据产业创新条例第3条条案修正草案4.本院委员大院长等21人委员陈廷辉等19人委员蔡玉等17人台湾民政党党团分别拟据产业创新条例部分条案修正草案等4案本院委员邱振军等17人委员林建吉等20人分别拟据产业创新条例第10条之1及第72条条案修正草案等2案6.本院委员王洪威等23人拟据产业创新条例第10条之1条案修正草案及本院委员 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
2746.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
2757.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
廖偉強等19人禮據採用創新條例第10條之一及第23條之一條文修正草案8.本院委員兼學中等16人禮據採用創新條例第67條之一及第70條條文修正草案2.審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
2759.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
2765.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
9.本院委員邱志偉等18人擬拒產業創新條例第二條及第二三條之三條行修正常案10. |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
2765.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
2771.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
本院委員楊瓊英等25人擬拒產業創新條例第十條第二三條之一及第二三條之二條行修正常案11. |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
2771.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
2780.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
本院委員邱志偉等19人擬拒產業創新條例第十九條之一條行修正常案決議 談事項所列條文經已宣讀完畢 令定期進行審查 散會宣讀完畢好 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
2784.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2792.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
我們來確定上次會議事錄請問各位同仁對上次會議事錄有無錯誤沒有那我們就議事錄確定好我們繼續進行討論事項請一併宣讀討論事項 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2800.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2809.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
1.繼續審查本院委員邱志偉等17人 委員楊橋斌等25人分別擬據產業創新條例第10條第23條之一及第23條之二條人修正草案等二案2. |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2809.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2816.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
本院委員莊家斌等20人擬據產業創新條例第39條第46條及第46條之一條人修正草案3. |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2816.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2817.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
本院委員蠟燈王等21人 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2818.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2838.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
委員陳庭菲等19人委員蔡依儀等17人分別擬據產業創新條例部分條件修正草案等3案本院委員邱振均等17人委員林健吉等20人分別擬據產業創新條例第10條之1及第72條條件修正草案等2案另外本院委員王寬威等2人3人擬據產業創新條例第10條之1條件修正草案 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2839.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2868.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
6.本院委員廖偉祥等19人擬拒,採用創新條例第10條之1及第23條之1條人修正長案7.本院委員丁學莊等16人擬拒,採用創新條例第67條之1及第70條條人修正長案8.本院委員邱智維等18人擬拒,採用創新條例第2條及第23條之3條人修正長案9.本院委員邱智維等19人擬拒,採用創新條例第19條之1條人修正長案2.審查本院委員林思明等18人擬拒,採用創新條例第10條條人修正長案,宣傳筆 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2869.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2869.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
好來 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2872.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2892.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
今天我們處理這個產業創新條例的修正案那今天列起的我們各部會的代表我很快的跟大家做一個報告跟說明經濟部有龔明堅部長代表 謝謝 龔部長還有投診師蘇市長 蘇啟燕蘇市長 謝謝經濟法治師羅翠玲市長 謝謝產發署是邱秀慧邱署長 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2901.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2915.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
財運運動管理局是曾促芬副局長 謝謝官位代表是由詹芳冠 詹副組委 謝謝採訪處陳瓊華 陳副組長 謝謝財政部部份是由陳永勝 陳次長謝謝次長 謝謝副稅署是由倪麗欣 倪副組長 謝謝衛福部是144的劉玉金 副市長 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2930.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2936.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
法務部還沒來法務部是廖江縣廖參事 好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2940.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2963.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
本日議程是要審查產業創新條例部分條文修正草案這個部分已經在本會議3月19日我們詢答完畢4月30日宣讀本日議程所列第一案到第13案有關提案的條文已經都宣讀完畢之後院附又交付委員林世敏等18人理據產業創新條例第10條的條文修正草案案 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2964.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2993.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
我們先請140元把這個條文宣讀之後今天我們一起並來審查請宣讀委員林思明等人產業創新條例第10條條文修正草案第一項劇中增訂或投資訂購經國家發展委員會核定之高風險創新科技新創事業等文字外餘同委員邱志偉等人提案宣讀完畢 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2993.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
3007.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
好 謝謝我們現在進行調溫的處理在處理之前必須跟委員會 聯繫委員會做個說明這個產業的經營環境瞬息萬變 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
3009.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
3025.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
特別是在AIA這個時代那行政院也很積極在努力要制定這個中小微企業轉型升級發展條例一定在8月會制定完成下個月 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
3027.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
3049.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
8月底下個會期會送到立法院來審議我們期待在經濟委員會針對行政院所提的微中小企業轉型升級條例能用最快的速度能夠通過讓微中小企業能夠在AI時代能夠很順利轉型升級甚至發展 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
3050.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
3064.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
來補充現有的中小企業發展條例之不足同樣的產業創新條例在去年也是由本席擔任召委主持去年的產業創新條例的修法 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
3065.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
3086.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
那當然已經經過一年多產業環境在一年多可謂是變化不小各界的期待特別是新創產業希望得到政府更多從法律政策資源的支持跟協助所以我們蒐集了很多的資料也聽了很多各界的聲音對產業創新條例還有必要 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
3090.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
3105.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
做適度的調整調整的方向是確保相關的這個新創事業能夠透過修法能夠得到更多政府的支持從政策面從法律面從預算面讓新創事業 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
3109.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
3131.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
能夠有更好的環境 有更多的土壤 能夠生根茁壯發展特別是新創事業 很多都是年輕朋友募資不易 經營不易如果政府政府用更多的力量來支持的話台灣的新創有很多人才 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
3133.322 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
3159.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
沒有辦法讓這些人才能夠表現他們的專業促進產業的發展我們也認為這個是非常可惜所以政府該做的就是在法律面能夠有更多的支持跟協助所以我跟幾位委員包括各黨派委員都針對今天的產業傳統條例有不同版本的提案這個提案的內容我們今天 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
3160.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
3181.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
這兩天 我排了兩天議程能夠充分討論制定出一個符合產業需求 符合社會共識符合各界期待的一個修法的內容所以以上針對今天這個修法的這個主旨跟聯席委員會做一個說明好 那我們現在進行逐條審查好 我們先處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
3185.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
3190.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
第二條的部分第二條的部分只有本席所提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
3191.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
3220.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
這個部分是我先做一個說明是針對一個醫療事業所謂是醫療事業指的是醫療法設立的醫療社團法人這個部分跟後面23條之三是有一定的互動性跟連帶性所以我們是不是等到23條之三確定之後我們再回過頭來再看看第二條有無針對之必要好第二條我們就先暫時保留待會再處理那針對 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
3221.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
3238.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
接下來處理第10條第10條的部分有包括本席還有楊全英委員還有林世民委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
3240.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
3254.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
等等都有提出相關的修法那修法內容我想相關單位包括經濟部包括財政部都已經有針對條例內容有做一些的討論跟研析我想聽聽這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
3256.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
3269.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
經濟部跟財政部關於第十條研發投資抵減經濟部的立場跟這個財政部的立場等兩個部會表達基本立場之後我們再請委員來針對還是委員你們要先詢問呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
3274.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
3286.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
那我們先發言一下 好不好好那我們就先把事情做去調整先請我們今天所有書記委員針對第10條的部分先做一個這個條文的詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
3288.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
3314.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
請單位委員好 謝謝 謝謝主席我想朝這個針對第10條朝野委員那提案把大企業這個併購新創納入最高50%的一個投資抵減他其實最重要的是要活絡台灣的新創市場這個大方向本席是支持的但是本席也要嚴正的提醒行政部門實務上我們常看到了 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
3315.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
3327.982 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
大企業為了搶奪專利錢 還是消滅潛在的一個對手 那花了大錢買下了新創公司 結果第一件事情竟然是買技術 裁員工把辛苦打拚的一個年輕的團隊 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
3330.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
3358.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
那一腳就把它踢開了所以本席要求經濟部跟國發會企業的一個併購法跟勞基法應該清清楚楚的寫在把它寫清楚那我們也希望你們嚴格的把關在未來財團拿著併購案來申請最高的50%的計額計額的這個免稅的紅包的時候我們主管機關必須要睜大眼睛只要發現有惡質的一個財源違反勞基法不當的解雇那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
3359.594 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
3372.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
基層的員工的這些事情的時候我們就應該踩在這個產創那個創新的一個紅線一毛錢我覺得都不應該抵所以我們支持給誘因但是國家那個減稅 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
3375.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
3398.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
這一個紅包絕對不能變成就是財團惡意的財源的一個補貼那我們請經濟部跟國花會務必要嚴格的執行把年輕人的工作錢顧好 這以上是本席的一個建議好非常謝謝單位委員 還沒有委員針對第4條要發言我想說請行政單位先說明這個部分是監視到這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
3400.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
3420.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
抵檢率的部分跟抵檢稅的上限的調整所以這部分我是不是先請經濟部做說明是部長還是由署長來做說明邱署長你先做說明好了好那謝謝昭偉還有各位委員這個提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
3421.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
3442.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
那这个提案我先讲一下提案然后再针对戴委员的建议事项做回应第一个的话就是有关于在第十条里面增加对并购国发会核定的高风险创新科技新创事业可以适用投资抵减我想当然这个提案对于 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
3443.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
3462.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
增加更多的這些新創他們出場出場的這個誘因不只是一定就是要上市上櫃這個是會有他的這個幫助的這個出場的一個效果但是因為我們原來第十條的這個定位是在於說鼓勵企業內部進行研究發展 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
3464.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
3485.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
所以我們經濟部是認為說他這個屬性上根據鼓勵外部的這個併購的這樣子的一個原來立法的意旨是有所不一樣的這樣一個情況所以我們是不建議說在第10條裡面是有增訂一個併購也納入原來的這個內部研發投資底檢的一個範圍 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
3487.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
3510.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
至於說委員這邊有建議說在抵減率方面也有提升那這個部分的話我想因為有牽涉到稅收方面的這樣的一種影響這部分的話也許就等一下請財政部進一步做說明以上就是抵減率跟抵減稅的部分這是屬於財政部的主管好我們請陳市長來做說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
3523.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
3551.146 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
謝謝張偉 謝謝各位還有各位謝靜我想這個第10條的一個提案的一個修正的內容它涉及到兩個部分一個是擴大它整個投資的適用範圍把賓購的部分這些投資的部分也把它放進來第二個涉及到抵減率的從15%提升到30%的部分那本部的立場是建議不予修正主要的原因是因為目前來講我們這一個條文鼓勵的是自主研發 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
3552.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
3576.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
所以自主研發是從產業自己去提升自己的研發的實力這個第一個部分第二個部分當然回過來低減率的部分因為確實目前全世界有在實施GMT的一個情況也就是說我們的一個低減率越高那它涉及到的所有的一個我們徵客的稅收就相對的低那其他國家其他一個徵客的一個稅收如果提高的話我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
3577.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
3595.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
碎刻的部分就會跑到其他國家去所以這個部分的條文我們是建議不以修訂而且目前這個院裡面也在所謂的一個對於中小微企業的一個提升我想這個法案剛等一下二三條之二的部分我想那個部分會在進一步說明 以上謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
3598.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
3624.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
好 謝謝陳市長說明我想這個第四條部分是我的提案還有楊瓊議員提案跟我的那種是一樣但是楊委員好像跟院長出國那這部分有關於兩個部分經濟部主管的就是說你這個併購新創的部分經濟部可以同意嗎併購新創的部分部長說明部長要經濟說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
3628.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3648.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
因為它這個立法的意思是有一點不太一樣所以我們還是也尊重財政部的意見就是說不要把它併進來如果真的對於併購要適用這個投資可以抵減的話可能要另外起一條因為它的性質不太一樣這一條是鼓勵我們內部的這個RD |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3650.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3668.187 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
那併購是外來的技術,把它放在一起說老實話,因為遞減率都一樣,是有點怪因為併購行為跟自己研發它的功能屬性也不太一樣那如果把它放在一起的話,遞減率都一樣,那是有點奇怪 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3669.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3694.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
這是我們的想法所以經濟部也不傾向要把賓購新創納進來對 因為我們後面會有一個企業如果投資新創的話是可以抵減的那那個也是鼓勵這個大型企業那是哪一個法也是廠商條例嗎還是企業購賓法23條之1所以那裡面23條之1已經有了那個是23條之2主要會是投資 對 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3696.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3713.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
那財政部的立場對於當年度低減的比例三年內低減的比例跟上限財政部的立場我聽起來好像就不傾向於做調整是這樣不傾向於做調整還是維持現行條文嗎第四條部分因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3721.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3748.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
其他委員只有我在 楊瓊英委員也不在 林思英也不在那第四條是不是就先保留就先保留保留之後再看看 因為等他們回來再針對第四條再做一些這個協商好 各位如果沒意見的話第四條我們就先做保留邱委員有沒有意見邱委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3751.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3776.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
謝謝主席 這個您要問我其實比較贊同部會的看法併購是併購研發是研發所以我覺得這一條的基本立場是在鼓勵研發不是在支持併購新創所以新創的部分是不是在另外的條文去協助做處理我個人是比較不贊同在這裡把併購新創把它放進去 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3778.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3796.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
好 這個我的立場跟大家一樣我尊重尊重委員會大家的這個想法跟發言那因為我也要顧及今天因公出國的其他提案委員他們的看法所以是不是先把第四條部分先保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3798.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3818.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
那之後我們再召開這個協商再來請其他今天沒有出席的委員來做討論好我們就處理第10條之一第10條之一的話我看起來是所有委員提案包括邱正軍、蔡毅宇、王宏威、陳庭菲、賴月榮 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3819.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
3840.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
這個提案的內容我們在去年我主持的產生條例修法已經納入已經修正完了沒有錯嘛對而且已經刪除通過這個是我主持的會議我很清楚所以中文也公佈了就是說現在在提這些也沒有意義因為已經公佈了嘛所以部長你要不要說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3843.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3867.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
時間差的關係因為當初委員提案的時候那就是還沒有審完嘛那後來提了以後我們也按照大致上內容都按照委員那個方面已經修正那也通過了三讀也通過了所以基本上委員的想法已經在既有目前新的版本裡面在現行條文都已經有包含在裡面好那第一條之一我們不予修正維持現行條文 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3869.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3888.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
好所以第19條之一的部分就是員工獎酬股票款客的部分這個部分我想也跟財政部也做過溝通那這部分主要還是財政部他有他的想法我必須要尊重財政部跟經濟部的共同想法首先先請經濟部對這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3893.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3899.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
上限能不能提高 目前是500萬 那有沒有可能提高的可能性這個經濟部的立場 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3901.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3923.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
我們這個部分當然跟財政部有做過討論那我們希望是可以適度的提高因為現在的股票市場跟過去是落差非常大所以就是說實際的狀況已經改變了我們認為可以適度的提高適度提高有沒有具體的建議的額度呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3923.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3946.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
我們是建議一千萬一千萬我們建議一千萬那其他的條件我們大概就尊重財政部的看法就不要改變就是說員工的這個緩客適用條件等等這個應該是由財政部來做評估好 那個財政部主席這個事業評價財政部的意見好不好財政部說一下那個財務城市長 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3951.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3976.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
這針對那個屬地價格的這個環科資用條件好 謝謝張偉 謝謝各位的一個指教我想這個部分是19條之一的設計就是要留財染財就是要鼓勵自己的員工買自己的股票或者把獎酬留給員工讓他留住他的一個對於公司的實際的一個股份的一個掌握 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3977.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3987.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
那這個條文目前看起來修正的內容增加了一個給予日那我們原來設計的條文就是已經符合所謂的 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3988.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
4016.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
您員工拿到股票真正可以處分的那個時間點到實際處分的時間點兩個讓他去選擇哪一個價值是低的可以選擇那個價值的低的部分去課稅現行的機制已經是這樣子了那如果增加一個給予日會變成因為給予日重點在於員工能不能夠處分這是一個重點也就是給予日的時候那個時間點 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
4017.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
4036.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
員工是要沒辦法處分他的股票所以他的所得還沒實現所以要確定說給予日這個三個字的一個定義如果員工還沒有實際可以去進行處分的時候這一個點拿進來會變成跟原來現在的這一個時間點來講孰低來講會變成有點衝突以上 謝謝市長那剛剛廣部長講的那個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
4043.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
4068.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
五百萬的部分五百萬的部分目前是這樣子應該講說我們這一個確實19條之一訂定的時間點跟目前股票整個一個市值來看這個部分我們尊重經濟部如果經濟部覺得說要往上提升我們是尊重經濟部畢竟這個的一個面值現在的一個市值往上提升有沒有必要做修正我想尊重經濟部的意見以上 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
4069.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
4097.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
可是那個召委的提案也沒有提到具體的金額這個具體金額就是要等財政部跟經濟部他們共同貨商這個論據大概一千到兩千我們之前會前討論結果他們大概還沒有做確定 需要兩個部會再一次的做討論協商財政部也對於給予給予日的這個部分好像也沒有確切的那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
4097.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
4109.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
就是我們要怎麼樣訂呢是 謝謝委員的一個指教 謝謝趙偉我想這個隔離日我剛剛講了就是因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
4110.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
4134.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
員工還沒有實際拿到他可以去進行轉讓所以那一個時間點的給餘日他的所得還沒有實現如果這個把他納進來會對於我們整個稅制概念還沒有拿到整個的一個可以儲分的股票所以他那個所得就還沒實現他們所得計算也會有問題嘛 對不對是他們現在所得計算也會有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
4136.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
4152.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
以上 謝謝這個部分對於說這個上限要調整到多少總額內要調整到多少這個還待進一步確認所以我們這一條19條之一還是先保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
4155.33 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
4180.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
22條的部分 我看了一下條文的內容好像跟我去年三讀通過的條文是一樣的所以是不是進行委員會 聯席委員會我們這個在去年三讀通過 總統修正公佈了所以有關第22條陳金飛跟蔡依的版本我們就建議不以修正 建議維持現行條文 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
4182.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
4210.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
好 22條維持協議條文不予修正好來23條之一的部分是有限合夥創投這個透視個體概念的這個科稅的部分有本席跟楊瓊英還有陳田飛賴慧榮差與廖偉強的版本這個部分是不是先請經濟部先對所有委員的提案內容先做一個立場的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
4212.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
4229.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
好 謝謝召委那有關這次邱召委跟楊委員的這個提案的部分我經濟部這邊大概說明如下第一個有關提案將新創的這個年限放寬從5年到8年的這件事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
4230.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
4257.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
那當然我們這個114年114年才剛三讀通過的這個修法是剛改到這個五年的這個時間但是呢因為考慮到在經濟部的一些相關的規定裡面還有國科會裡面相關的這個規定裡面對於新創它的這個年限的這個定義都是八年所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
4258.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
4279.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
那再加上這個五年到八年的這段時間對新創來講也是比較屬於在擴張期的這個階段對於這個資金也是相當的有需要我們有一些相關的一些政策的一些支持他在做進一步的這個發展基於這樣子的一種這樣的一個需求的話我們是認為說我們經濟部可以同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
4282.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
4295.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
把這個5年變成8年的這樣的一個修改我們是可以做認同的那至於第二個部分的話就是說有關適用這個穿透式課稅的門檻的部分 現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
4297.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
4309.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
委員這邊是也有做一些提案的條文包括說在第四年開始這個投資新創的這個投資的比例就下修從現行的這個50%下修到30%的這個部分那我們是認為說這個部分也是一個比較容易 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
4320.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
4331.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
達成的這樣子的一種的一個情況因為我們原來在整個投資期一般是五年原來現行的條文從第三年開始就要有規定50%的這樣的一種 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
4335.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
4362.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
比例要投資在新創方面那我想這個對於他們在整個投資的時間會有比較不足的情形也可能會加速的他的投資的評估導致投資不夠嚴謹的這個情況所以有關我們這個從第三年然後延緩到第四年下修這個投資的這個比例的這個部分的話我想這個也是一個合理的要求不過 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
4362.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
4389.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
這可能是不是有影響到相關的這個稅收的影響的部分的話也許也可以等一下就教財政部的意見那至於第三個部分的話是海外公司間接控制的子公司或分公司的部分那這塊的話我們會前也有跟財政部這邊有做一個討論就是說只要是實質的這樣的一個經營活動是在台灣那有時候新創有做一些國際佈局 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
4391.139 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
4406.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
所需要的做一些海外的投資控股公司的設立等等 這個我們也可以納入我們在新創投資的範圍的這個定義之內那第四個部分的話是有關於這個個人合夥人的鼓勵 是不是可以分開計稅的部分那因為這部分還牽涉到整體這個稅收設計的這部分的話 我們是尊重財政部的意見 以上說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
4414.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
4443.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
這些邱署長的說明大概二三兩之一幾個重點邱署長都有說明由調整到八年對行政事業定義調整八年經濟不是支持嗎第二項部分就是說投資新創的門檻現行規定可以把它適度的調降調降到比例是多少你沒有說你剛剛沒有提 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
4445.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
4458.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
可以輸出條約這樣但是你沒有把這比例說明那這個多城市的海外控股這個架構經濟部是可以支持那另外有關於個人合夥人鼓勵所的分開課稅的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
4459.841 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
4481.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
當然我本行認為是可以提高一些投資誘因但是這個也要必須考驗到整體稅制跟國家稅收的這個租稅政策會不會造成一定的影響這基本上也尊重財政部的立場好就請這個財政部陳市長針對23條之一的部分財政部的立場 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
4484.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
4500.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
好 謝謝趙薇 謝謝各位委員23條之一的部分我想有涉及到財政部的部分有三個部分就像誠如剛剛趙薇講的其實我們跟經濟部整個政府對於這些新創產業的一個福祉我們也都是站在一個正面的角度去看 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
4500.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
4520.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
至於5到8年從5年提升到8年因為像剛剛經濟部也講了去年修正那這段期間我們也是修正的方向要不要到8年這個部分我們尊重經濟部也就是概念來講就請說5年到8年它是不是還是真正所要扶持的一個對象我想這個經濟部剛剛已經說明了這是第一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
4521.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
4540.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
第二個部分是有關於所謂的一個外國事業的部分如果在國內有直接或進階的一個營運活動這個部分我們也尊重經濟部第三個部分就涉及到整個從三年、四年、五年它的一個底檢的一個就是它實際的一個出資額度的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
4541.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
4568.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
這個部分我們是有跟經濟部這邊提醒主要還是在於說因為我們整個的一個我們是要鼓勵新創事業我們是要把這些投資到新創事業的創投的這些事業投資越多的一個資金在新創事業是好事所以這個部分至於要定多少的比例我覺得要從整個是不是它真正的新創事業的部分能夠多多拿到 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
4568.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
4593.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
外界對他的投資的金額這才是一個這個比率所管控的所以這個部分我想經濟部會做審慎的一個評估以上因為剛好經濟部跟那個財政部都在這裡那是不是能夠說明一下就是新創事業的範圍以及就是說適用的項目因為對於一些就是說國內的企業來講或者是就是有志於從船廠變成新創的 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
4595.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
4620.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
他們對於這個就是說財政部跟經濟部的認定恐怕也不是非常清楚喔那你們是不是也藉這個機會也說明一下這個走向條例的適用範圍我們對他們都公平認定我知道所以是不是也說明一下這次的修法也提案有沒有這方面的調整好像沒有對 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
4625.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
4652.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
今天還不會完全達成共識如果實質的做法上這個執法事實上兩部會都有共同的在認定認定完以後呢我們事實上我們check完以後也會送到財政部去財政部會再confirm如果我認為要增加的部分也可以提案提案之後兩部會也去做評估是不是要納入應該沒有錯嘛這在執法裡面嘛對不對在執法裡面就有嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
4655.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
4672.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
我想請問一下財政部陳次長這個第三年的比例第四年的比例第五年的比例財政部有沒有一個藍圖或者一個可能的方向也許你訂比例也可以但是不要訂總額有沒有可能往這方向去處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4673.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4690.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
是謝謝趙偉我想這個趙偉講的沒錯就是說我們其實他的一個這個條文的管控他除了比例之外還有一個貨跟且金額的一個上限的一個訂定我們要的一個概念就是說基本上 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4693.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4721.895 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
這些創投投資到新創的產業因為他這個規定是穿透式的是整個創投他公司只要有投資多少他整個年度是不用課稅的所以我們的精神只要鼓勵這些投資在新創的產業的資金能夠多一點我們的概念只有這樣子以上謝謝所以你的概念是可以在比例上面去做調整但是不要設定金額的上限 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4723.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4752.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
是跟召喚報告是我想經濟部這邊也評估了是定多少的一個比率剛剛經濟部講他們還在審慎思考就是定那個比率我們是要朝的方向是讓於這些真正資金跑到新創事業的資金是多一點這是好事以上這個有個委員提案那我跟楊瓊欣的提案是說第三年是管制師出資本第四年不管是出資的上限 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4753.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4755.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
我們調整30%下降30%歸紋到3億第5年 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4760.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4786.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
變成這個30% 達3億那這個部分我尊重財政部在對這部分需要更多的評估所以我今天委員會是不是正在二三聊之一當然有些有共識那有些關於說到底比例是多少 要調降到多少這個還需要進一步的兩個部分的協商趙委 這個我今天是不是能在下次的時候把這個具體的給我們好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4786.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4813.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
就是兩部會溝通過你們 你們認為最妥善的那個比例跟金額給我們好不好這樣大家 下一次我們還會做更多的比較細緻的討論因為今天有些委員因為一般出國對 這個如果都保留我們出委員會還會再召集協商協商的部分就針對今天所保留的部分做更確實更全面更完整的討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4815.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4840.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
好 那謝謝兩位次長 謝謝部長那針對二十三條之一我們是不是先保留好 記者處理二十三條之二有本席版本跟楊瓊英陳情飛蔡宇那種版本這個部分關於天安投資人的租稅優惠所以這部分我想是不是先請主管機關經濟部來做個說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
4844.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
4871.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
好 謝謝昭偉那有關23條之二的修法建議的部分昭偉的版本跟楊委員的版本有提到幾個項目第一個的話就是說在23條之二裡面也有提到一個新創事業年限的規定那我們跟23條之一一樣我們也是競表同意從5年改到8年原因剛才也有提過 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4872.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4875.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
那第二个部分的话就是有关这个 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4876.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4902.33 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
增訂一個盈利事業股東的這個投資抵減在投資新創可以適用投資抵減然後抵減率是20%那他的抵減上限是因納所得稅額的50%那有關這個條文的建議本部的看法是這樣就是說因為這個新創的資金現在大部分都還是來自於創投來自於創投 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4904.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4928.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
那如果說這個條文制定了以後是有助於他這個新創的資金可以來自於一些盈利事業也就是大公司去做投資那這樣子的話對這個新創來講他有更多的資金的來源這個就可以益助新創的發展而且其實這個對大公司也有幫助我們現在看很多這種矽谷的這種大公司他們都經常去投資或甚至去併購 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4929.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4933.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
一些新創可以加速他們內部的一些創新跟人才的一個培養我想這個部分的話增加公司更多的誘因我們是有表示就從經濟發展的立場來講是對於整個產業創新對大公司對小公司都能夠達到雙贏 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4951.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4962.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
但是因為有牽涉到剛剛張偉友提到可能8月的時候中小微的這個轉型升級條例就會提到這個經委會來做審查那因為這是針對新創那中小微的轉型升級條例也是針對新創那到底是要放在這個產動條例也好還是放在中小微條例也好 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4976.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4987.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
這部分的話也可以請各位委員這邊做一個思考那第三個部分的話就是有關於這個個人所得稅的這個減除的這個上限從500萬到1000萬的這個部分因為這部分的話有牽涉到 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4993.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
5019.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
這個租稅上面可能造成的這樣的一個損失啦所以這部分的話我們是尊重等一下尊重財政部他們的這樣的一個評估那至於陳廷飛委員蔡議員跟這個拉攏委員的這個提案的條文在114年的這個修正條文裡面都已經納進去了這部分的話我們就建議照現以前的條文以上說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
5021.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
5023.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
謝謝邱市長說明 接著請財政部陳市長說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
5028.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
5050.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
好 謝謝昭緯 謝謝各位委員 與各位先進我想23條之二的部分它就涉及到所謂的一個天使投資人的部分那原本的部分涉及到我們的財政部現在修正的條文有三個部分剛剛陳儒那個經濟部所講的第一個是我們的一個整個五年是不是要開放到上限的門檻到八年 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
5051.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
5066.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
我想這個回到一樣23條之一 這個是經濟部要審慎的一個評估這第一個部分第二個抵減上限的部分500萬往上提升的部分 這個也回到我們剛剛所提的是不是跟19條之一的精神是一樣的那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
5067.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
5086.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
整個的一個上限是不是要往上提升我想我這個也尊重經濟部再來的部分是有關於目前二三條的之二的設計是個人對於這些新創事業的一個投資的一個租稅的一個減免一個抵減率的部分因為這個部分涉及到目前增加的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
5088.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
5115.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
項目是盈利事業對盈利事業也就是說整個盈利事業對新創事業的一個投資抵減的部分這個部分直接涉及到稅的一個抵減以目前來講行政院在推一個中小為企業的一個發展跟升級條例的一個進行中所以這個部分是要放在產創還是在中小企業我們就要去經濟部要審慎的一個評估到底在放在哪一個部分至於抵減率的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
5115.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
5134.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
因為這一個部分涉及到整個是稅的一個減免所以我們是建立要再從不管投資者或者被投資者他的整個的一個限額他的一個事業的一個要發展的哪一項的重要的事業我想這個進步要做一個審慎的評估以上 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
5137.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
5157.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
謝謝陳市長說明兩位市長說明大概方向是一樣但力道有所不同那經濟部立場大概是樂觀正面開放不管是到8年或者是這個提高個人所得的上限提高但是這個財政部立場好像是審慎開放 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
5159.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
5179.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
這個力道有種不同所以到底說這個能不能從現行500萬再調高到一定額度那至於說這個一定事業股東投資低減這部分要定在中小微企業轉型升級化的條例還是在產生條例事業修正我個人認為是不是就從產生條例來修正來處理這部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
5184.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
5203.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
也有待協商我想這部分是不是有一些共識我們把今天討論共識化為在下次協商的一個討論基礎基本上是可以到8年然後個人的上限可以提高至於說是不是股東同事抵檢的部分能夠要增訂這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
5207.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
5219.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
抵檢率跟抵檢上限這些到底要定在中小微企業轉型申請條例還是定在那個定在本條例我們在協商的時候我們再來討論所以二三條之後我們還是保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
5221.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
5251.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
二十三條之三的部分我想這個未分配與實質投資租稅的優惠部分這接受到財政部也開會好幾次那也希望說能夠由財政部來提出一些關於租稅的相關的這個評估那這個租稅評估好像這個崔副總好像還沒有出來是衛福部要做還是衛福部要做衛福部的部分這個部分完成了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
5252.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
5256.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
大概什麼時候會完成?你來說明一下這個可能沒有記錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
5266.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
5292.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
好跟周委報告有關於23條之3的部分事實上是經過了幾次的會議的協調那目前是希望有目前決定是由衛福部來做這個稅市支出評估那因為這個部分牽涉範圍比較廣所以我們需要找專業的團體來協助那目前案子已經在進行中預定會在年底有評估的結果 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
5295.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
5323.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
因為你這個稅市支出評估是我們修法的一個重要的參考依據那你到年底我的修法的進度我是希望這個會期能夠有一個結論因為我今天如果保留送協商協商大概一個月之內我就會召集協商我希望說在九月可以有公司的部分就讓他修正通過那你這個稅市支出評估能不能快一點點 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
5324.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
5347.112 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
因為之前達成共識是由衛福部主導的話那是兩個月前的事情所以能不能加快進入不到年底我覺得這稅市支出評估應該沒有那麼困難其他相關的產業也有做過相關的稅市支出評估是不是能夠在八月底給它完成 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
5348.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
5365.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
今天我們列席是劉副市長是不是衛務部努力一下好這個部分我們會盡量的按照剛剛莊委所講的期限因為我們這個案子是用採購法來進行所以會再跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
5366.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
5392.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
得標廠商來進行討論我必須很客觀的去尊重行政部門的專業評估這評估出來我才能做我修法的依據所以我不能說譬如一己知見我就說就一定要做調整或修法我想我不會做這樣的事情但我會充分尊重行政部門行政部門包括這次的稅制支出評估 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
5393.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
5412.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
進度可能晚了一點我之前是兩個月前大宣公示 是不是八月底把它完成我們努力以這個期限來完成不要努力 要全力一定要完成 我沒辦法針對這二三條之善來做修法 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
5417.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
5446.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
好 二三條之三因為要等這個務務部針對稅事支出做一些分析跟評估在八月底之前完成之後我們再做本條文的討論所以二三條之三我們先以保留那因為剛開始的第二條部分已經牽涉到這個牽涉到這個定義的部分所以這部分也第二條部分也一併保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
5448.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
5470.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
好 再處理39條財運園區用地規劃這是中加併委的版本那這個部分主要還是經濟部 應該是園管局嗎園管局要不要做說明中加併委不在 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
5474.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
5488.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
专委还有我们各位先进大家好那这个第39条的部分委员他提出的版本是希望能够针对产业用地的规划对于在社区用地占全区土地比例可以从现行10%提高到15%那本部的立场我们是认为 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
5493.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
5512.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
以目前我们产厂所规定设置的产业园区呢我们是以生产制造为主要的目的那也定有产业用地不得低于全区土地面积的60%的规定那以目前我们在编定的产业的实物上产业园区的实物上来看的话整个社区用地呢如果要从10%提高到15%的话 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
5513.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
5537.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
那我们现在在化射源区必要的这个产业用地至少有60%那公共设施呢也因为现在很多在环平会议上都被要求所以整个公共设施的这个面积比例呢至少都会达到30%以上所以如果产业用地的面积如果还要再去做增加确实是有它的困难度那我们是建议呢还是希望能够维持原条文那在这里呢也补充报告 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
5538.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
5554.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
在中嘉賓委員在6月3號質詢的時候有特別要求本部要盤點現有的產業園區當時候在出售供新建住宅使用的這個數量那也要求要一個月內提出書面報告所以目前我們正在準備這樣的一個資料中 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
5556.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
5572.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
那這個部分我們也跟委員也先做過事先的溝通跟說明委員是也可以支持資料呢整理好之後我們再來續商後續相關的怎麼樣來去做更完整的規劃好謝謝原管局曾副局長的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
5575.036 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
5591.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
這個39條因為中委員現在也不在這個部分也同樣是保留因為還有相關資料要提供給他嘛好第39條部分先保留46條部分關於產業園區用地使用收益跟儲分的部分也是中嘉賓委員提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
5592.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
5621.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
这个部分是政务局长也要做个说明好第46条的部分呢中嘉宾委员的版本希望能够删除在整个现有条文里面所谓的出售工员工新建住宅以及出售工新建住宅使用这样的一个规范那本部的立场呢我们是考虑到说社区用地呢它是配售给被架构或者是被征收的土地或房屋所有权人 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
5622.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
5645.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
那便得出售於園區內的企業或員工來興建住宅以解決員工員工住宅的這個需求那如果調整相關的規定的話除了會影響園區這個住宅的供給之外呢也可能會涉及到土地的利用跟處分的方式的調整而且會影響到整個園區開發成本的回收那後續呢一樣我們也跟中委員中加兵委員見拜會過也一樣會針對後續我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
5648.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
5664.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
整理相關目前原有園區整個的社區用地的使用狀況會再針對實際執行情形再跟委員來做請教然後後續看怎麼樣規劃更完整的一個條文所以聽起來經營部立場是希望說自治六好不予修訂 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
5666.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
5680.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
聽起來 但是因為莊委員不在 我們這個46條還是以保留46條之一 也是要加速完成這個建築使用也是宗教兵委員提案 現在還是先請這個曾副局長做說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
5681.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
5706.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
好 是 趙薇好 那針對46號之一呢其實最主要中嘉賓委員他是希望能夠加速完成建築使用那當然針對46號之一最主要他是在規範閒置土地強制拍賣那要不要去民電整個展延的年期跟次數那土地所有權人會因有不可規則的理由而導致所謂的延誤期間因與扣除如果有政黨理由兵給予這個請求延展之 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
5706.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
5732.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
延展期限不能超过两年并以一次为限那本部的立场实际上就目前我们46条之一在做相关规划的闲置土地的这样的一个规划其实我们都是采所谓的进进式的管制方式而且督促厂商要积极地落实投资那针对我们能够来申请所谓展延的闲置土地的厂商他必须要有一些要件也就是他必须取得建筑执照要有开工而且要有 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
5733.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
5756.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
動工的這樣一個證明他才能夠進入到我們的展研的這個審查所以呢以我們目前整個展研個案的這個狀況來看的話其實透過我們專家學者的審查會議目前我們所掌握到的其實大家對於被公告這個閒置土地的部分其實廠商都非常積極在做建廠使用那我們也把針對目前整個我們在針對後續再怎麼樣去加強閒置土地的 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
5759.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
5775.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
提高它的建築使用的部分我們也設定了所謂的查核點那依照工程進度我們會給予嚴格的控管同時我們也會定期來做追蹤而且也會去做督促確保整個土地能夠在我們的土地規範之下能夠落實它的活化的一個效果 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5775.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5792.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
那針對這個部分因為確實每個廠商在針對它的建廠會有很多多變而且複雜的狀況而且每個地區它的整個產業發展情形也不太一樣所以針對這個展延我們既然已經有相關的嚴謹的規劃那確實我們也是希望說後續針對46條之一目前的執行狀況能夠維持目前現有的條文那這個部分我們也事先去拜會過委員中委員有獲得同意的這個意見和以上因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5805.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5827.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
你說他同意 但是我還經過他本人說是關於46條之一 謝謝曾副局長說明因為他本人不在 因為他提案委員 46條之一也保留67條之一 為一線申報轉讓股份資料的罰則這有丁薛忠 陳天飛 蔡玉的版本我看了一下 這跟我們去年修法的條文是一樣的 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5828.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5856.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
那修法也三讀通過了也公佈了所以跟聯席委員會說明所以六四七條之一我們就應維持現行條文不宜修訂來陳上面委員今天通過的不是通過很快保留的很快表示這個產創條例修法的時候我們可以看到一個是資稅的優惠一個就是免稅額的提高 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5857.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5879.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
但是我今天特地趕過來因為這行政院財政部在決定要跟他們協商我覺得這個實在行政院的版本沒有出來表示行政院不重視產創條例這是第一點那第二點我關於中加兵委員提供第39條跟46條 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5881.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5897.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
我這邊他用心良苦但是他沒有考慮到實際的情形我們產創條例一般徵收就是國客會去徵收的大概是這樣國客會有錢可以一般徵收 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5898.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5918.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
那每個縣市要推產大概都依據產創條例來做那產創條例在於實現產業園區的開挖為了減少民眾的抗爭這個是新的做法而且要地方的政府很大膽不怕民眾的抗爭在合理的條件在進行 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5919.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5935.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
所以一般如果縣市政府開花的話他沒有財力去一般徵收他只要採取區段徵收那中委員也不錯啦他提高說產業速度發寬到15%因為你要了解實際的情形 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5939.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5963.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
當你在開挖產業園區的話採取區段徵收那裡面土地有很多的民宅民宅裡面你減少抗生只有一個方法第一個提高它房屋的賠償第二個以地依地給它來蓋蓋到更好更有規劃的地方才有辦法這個區段徵收完成 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5964.685 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5975.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
至於說你15%全部要用在社會自在還有社會福利的建設沒辦法 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5977.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
6005.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
其實臺灣這個社會的自在社會的福利你都要好好考慮那是喊給人家聽的如果蓋島你如果15%的話要增加15%5%拿來這邊用給工廠去蓋他的員工施設另外你要保留10%給地方的政府好運作中央政府沒有辦法區段出售他不了解民情只有地方的政府才有辦法做 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
6006.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
6023.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
所以关于39条跟第46条之一利益良善但是不是确实实际的办法所以我主张这个地方一定要完全的保留下来如果依照这个通过地方政府没有办法做 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
6024.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
6040.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
任何的產業園區的開發也沒有辦法促進當地的工業的發展跟它的繁榮跟它的進步我想好好考慮一下我們交委非常關心這個產算條例有很多新的方法都很不錯很敬佩謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
6042.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
6068.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
謝謝這個陳委員的鼓勵我會繼續努力但是那個鍾嘉斌委員的提案當然剛剛政務局長都做過說明了那也跟鍾委員有做過討論鍾委員也同意說可以不予修訂但是我必須尊重他因為他本來現在不在所以我才把這個再做一些保留那剛剛我提到這個67條之一那都已經在去年三個都通過了67條之二 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
6071.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
6091.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
整體內容參與的版本因為蔡委員也在這部分是去年我們都已經修正通過了內容都已經在去年三讀的條文裡面所以是不是第六條之二相關的法則我們就堅定維持信息條文不宜修訂六十七條之三 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
6093.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
6119.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
也是一樣是罰則部分 這是陳廷飛跟蔡宇的版本這同樣是去年我們三讀也通過 總統公佈所以建議維持現行條文 我們不予修訂好 第七十條部分 不得重複享有租稅優惠的部分有丁薛忠 陳廷飛跟蔡宇的版本同樣 去年三讀通過 總統公佈我們建議維持現行條文 不予修訂第七十二條的部分有邱振軍 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
6120.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
6122.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
另外我們接下來處理有一件的附帶決議請先宣讀 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
6143.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
6172.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
附帶決議針對產業創新條例第二三條之二修正草案為確保天使投資人租稅優惠能有效引導資金益助實質創新避免任何高資產者之避稅管道原要求中央主管機關因與相關授權執法中增訂監制高風險新創事業投資效益追蹤製造庫製規範以落實政策論則委員 賴會員 張嘉斌 邱盈穎 宣傳筆好 這個這個附帶決議提案委員不在我們本案保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
6175.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
6200.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
好 謝謝 我們這個請議事總統一併宣讀協商的結論宣讀協商結論第二條 保留送運會處理第四條 保留送運會處理第十條之一 維持現行條文第十九條之一 保留送運會處理第二十二條 維持現行條文第二三條之一 保留送運會處理第二三條之二 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
6201.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
6225.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
保留雙院會處理第二三條之三保留雙院會處理第三十九條保留雙院會處理第四十六條保留雙院會處理第四十六條之一保留雙院會處理第六七條之一維持現行條文第六七條之二維持現行條文第六七條之三維持現行條文第七十條維持現行條文第七十二條維持現行條文附帶決議保留雙院會處理 宣傳筆謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
6228.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
6249.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
請問各位同仁 我們照剛才宣讀的協商結論通過 請問有異議好 沒有異議我們就通過討論事項 鎖立一案 產業創新條例部分條文修正草案 計14案併案審查完略我們理據審查報告 提報議員會討論 請問需不需交由黨團協商好 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
6255.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
6271.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
需交由黨團協商院會討論時有本席做說明審查通過的條文相關法制用以授權主席及議事人員來整理好本日議程處理完畢大家辛苦了謝謝大家我們現在來散會 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
6298.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
6300.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
慢慢來點 慢慢來點要回去嗎要啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
6326.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
6334.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
我要去高雄找空的座談會跟誰座談會?看一下我們座談會有羅斯、鮑達、龔舅發生要我送你去高鐵站嗎?沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
6357.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
6358.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
所以說明天應該也不用來 |