| IVOD_ID |
17513 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/17513 |
| 日期 |
2026-06-10 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2026-06-10T08:35:31+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-06-10T11:50:00+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
03:14:29 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/eeffa975d6a1e3ea345d10eba18100397db068076667a51b6dbd1a1f1ae50216498a5fb1dabeb2a35ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-06-10T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
3.黃被提名人謀信-立法院第11屆第5會期內政、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：審查行政院函送中央選舉委員會委員提名名單，沈淑妃為委員並為副主任委員，蔡維哲及黃謀信均為委員，請同意案。【依序分別審查沈被提名人淑妃、蔡被提名人維哲、黃被提名人謀信】【6月10日、11日二天一次會】） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:35:31 - 11:50:00 |
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105.043 |
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谢谢观看 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
413.131 |
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415.299 |
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谢谢大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
641.749 |
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643.504 |
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謝謝收看 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
808.695 |
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809.037 |
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谢谢观看 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
1116.442 |
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1118.172 |
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谢谢大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
1203.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
1206.266 |
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谢谢观看 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
1241.305 |
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1244.204 |
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谢谢观看 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
1336.425 |
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1338.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
谢谢观看 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
1476.903 |
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1497.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
響鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
1552.689 |
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1578.118 |
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請主任秘書報告出席人數報告聯席會出席委員13人以主法定人數現在開會進行討論事項請宣讀審查行政院韓宋中央選舉委員會委員提名名單沈淑飛為委員並為副主任委員蔡惟哲及黃某姓君為委員請同意案宣讀完畢 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
1585.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
1611.29 |
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好,首先介紹在場委員及列席機關人員先介紹許中信委員王美惠委員行政院張敦涵秘書長中央選舉委員會副主任委員提名人、被提名人沈淑飛 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
1613.911 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
1621.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
委員被提名人蔡維哲委員被提名人黃毛信還有主任秘書謝美玲 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
1629.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
1644.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
好立法院院會第十一屆第五會期第九次會議報告交付內政司法法制兩委員會審查行政院含送中央選舉委員會委員提名單審除非委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
1646.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
1669.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
並為副主任委員蔡維哲及黃茂信軍委委員請同意案兩委員會已於6月8號舉辦公聽會日前並已完成本院各黨團對被提名人的資格及適任性所提書面問題函請行政院轉至各提名人經行政院函附各 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
1670.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
1697.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
被提名人提出相關資料並以檢訟與各黨團在案本案依審查順序安排今天10號及11號兩天一次會分開審查本次會議開始進行詢答前原例做以下事項一 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
1699.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
1717.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
宣告一我們今天進行中選會委員被提名人的審查,這是由兩個委員會聯席因為名單是由行政院提名,所以待會我們會請行政院張秘書長報告然後進行中選會委員會 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
1722.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
1746.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
副主任委員被提名人沈淑菲女士的說明及詢答在沈淑菲女士詢答後休息五分鐘再進行中選會蔡惟哲先生的說明跟詢答在蔡惟哲先生詢答結束後休息五分鐘最後再進行中選會委員被提名人黃某信先生 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
1747.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
1774.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
的說明跟詢答每位委員詢答時間本聯席會委員5分鐘必要時得延長2分鐘非本聯席會委員5分鐘上午10點30分截止發言登記為被提名人如已詢答結束並離席者即不再受登記詢問該被提名人本次會議不處理臨時提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
1778.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
1780.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
那我們現在請行政院張秘書長報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
1790.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
1809.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
主席在場的各位委員先進所有辛苦的媒體記者朋友有看直播的國人同胞大家早安最近這一兩個禮拜台灣受到美語封面的影響我希望大家都能夠出入平安那今天 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
1811.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
1832.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
內政委員會跟司法法治委員會舉行這一個會期第一次的聯席會議審查行政院所提出審處菲永世、蔡惟哲先生、黃謀信先生等三人分別為中央選舉委員會副主任委員及委員的人事同意權本人應邀列席報告 深感榮幸 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
1833.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
1848.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
選舉罷免跟公投都是憲法保障人民參與公共事務的基本權利也是我國國民參政權的具體展現台灣也透過一次次的定期的投票或者是公投持續深化 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
1850.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
1873.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
民主憲政國家的精神為了貫徹憲法保障民主法治及人民參政的意旨中選會必須恪守中立超然獨立統籌辦理公職人員選舉罷免及公投的相關事務來持續鞏固公平公正公開的公共事務環境因此以下僅就本次中選會提名作業報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
1875.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
1903.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
首先依據中選會組織法第三條所規定中選會自委員九人至十一人其中一人為主任委員一人為副主任委員那除了主任委員跟副主任委員之外其他都為兼職無幾職第二中選會的前任委員六位任期已經在去年的十一月三日屆滿那另外其中蒙志成委員在去年六月二十七號請辭 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
1906.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
1927.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
在前些日子,行政院依據中選會組織法規定,提名七位委員,包括了主任委員游盈隆、副主任委員胡柏諺以及委員黃文林、李李仲、蘇嘉鴻、蘇紫橋、陳忠義等交由大院來經過人事統一權的審議 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
1929.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
1948.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
立法院在今年的3月13號已經完成了人事同意權的行使通過了游銀龍、李立仲、蘇嘉鴻、蘇紫橋等四人出任中選會的委員胡柏諺、黃文林及陳忠義三人則未獲同意通過 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
1951.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
1976.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
前面提的四位新任的主任委員或者是委員已經在今年的4月27號就任雖然使得中選會的人數達到8人但距離剛剛所報告的中選會組織法則規定9人的下限仍有所不足因此為了讓中選會運作更真的周全行政院這次提名副主任委員沈淑飛 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
1977.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2003.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
蔡惟哲委員兩名來接任任期到2029年的11月3日為止那另外黃某信委員則接任蒙志成委員的遺缺任期到明年的11月3日為止那第三依照中選會組織法的規定這次行政院也依照過去的慣例來進行以三個原則來進行提名第一 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2005.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2023.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
三位被提名人都具有豐富的專業學士跟實務的經驗也符合中選會組織法第三條相關的規範都具有法證、相關學士及經驗的公證人士第二同一黨籍的委員不超過三分之一這一次三位被提名人均為五黨籍 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2024.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2051.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
如果獲得立法院這個通過那未來的11位委員也僅有蘇嘉鴻委員具備中國國民黨黨籍那委員的黨籍比例也符合中選會組織法的相關規定那第三這個三位委員被提名人也符合國籍的相關規範都沒有中國戶籍或身分證件也沒有外國永久居留權或者是雙重國籍的相關問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2053.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2077.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
第四,我就三位被提名人來做簡單的介紹第一位是副主任委員的被提名人,沈淑菲女士沈淑菲女士是資深的公務員民國72年考取公職之後都在公部門服務,台大法律系畢業從孫運璇院長一路做到卓榮泰院長 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2078.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2106.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
在今年年初從行政院法規會主委的工作下卸任、退休40年以上的公務經驗他也曾經擔任過內政部的主任秘書因此相信他對法治跟選務的工作是著有經驗第二位是蔡惟哲委員他現職是律師具備台大法律系以及台大經濟學碩士的雙專業背景 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2108.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2134.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
在律師職業的期間對於弱勢的照顧對於債務的清理以及對於希拉雅族群的權益的保障著力甚深因此也期待如果蔡惠哲律師能夠獲得立法院同意通過之後能夠在弱勢的保障跟人權的行使上更能有所關注第三位是黃某縣委員他是現任的法務部的政務次長 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2137.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2160.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
曾經擔任過澎湖、屏東、台中地檢署檢察長,也擔任過法務部檢察司司長、常務司長,曾獲頒法務部92年模範公務員、100年公務員傑出貢獻獎。在過去地方的經驗,對於司法的歷練以及查會的實務,都有所專精跟實務的經驗。 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2164.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2190.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
省除非蔡維哲黃謀信三位被提名人都具有法證專長實務經驗以及沒有黨籍的共通性專業中立足以升任中選會委員相信也能在未來對中選會的法制工作人權保障以及查會失誤的面向都能夠讓中選會更為健全的運作 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2194.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2216.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
最後我要引述美國前總統甘迺迪的一句名言在漫長的世界歷史中只有少數世代有幸擔負起在最危急關頭時捍衛自由的使命台灣的民主也是在兩千三百萬台灣人民 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2218.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2242.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
一次又一次行使公民權利當中使得民主更為確信更加成熟也因此敬請立法院能夠給予三位被提名人支持、同意讓中選會的選務工作能夠更完善讓台灣民主更深化以上報告,謝謝謝謝,謝謝張東海秘書長的說明現在開始進行中選會委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2250.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2258.398 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
並為副主任委員被提名人沈淑菲女士的說明與行答請被提名人沈淑菲女士先做說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2269.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2280.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
好主席各位委員還有張秘書長還有在座的各位女士先生大家早很榮幸獲得行政院提名能夠參加大院今天召開的審查會 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2281.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2300.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
那陳如剛張秘書長介紹我過去公職長期都是在行政院的法治單位服務辦理書院還有相關各項法規的法治工作期間也曾經到內政部服務擔任主任秘書的工作之後又回到行政院服務一直到 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2301.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2327.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
今年的1月16號退休那在這麼漫長公職這個生涯當中我很深刻的體會各項政策的業務推動都必須要有完善的法規作為基礎那我也期許我自己如果有機會獲得大院的審查能夠到中選會擔任議員兼副主委的職務除了相助主委推動 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2329.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2343.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
這個會晤之外我也期許自己能夠對於中選會的各項選務還有公投的法制能夠配合社會的脈動還有社會的需求更為的精進同時也希望能夠做好跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2344.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2364.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
兩選罷法選政主管機關內政部之間的溝通協調工作那當然如果當然對於中選會委員的各項職務我當然是要本與行政獨立來行使各項職權希望能夠對於國家的民主法制做出貢獻以上謝謝好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2374.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
2374.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
主席、各位同仁 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
2399.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
2418.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
省前主委您請留步不用這麼怕我因為我是要誇獎你我們今天提名的三位人選真的比上次的人選優質太多所以本院嚴格審查真的是有它的作用 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
2419.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
2445.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
三位都是我們法學界的精英而且都非常好的聲譽包括我們黃某信次長蔡律師都在他們的領域受到相當大的肯定那麼您長期擔任法規會主委就像我上次在誇獎我們張秘書長你們兩位的工作其實是國家最重要的工作 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
2446.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
2473.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
那些大官呢立委坦白講對我而言不重要而是你們兩個這個角色最重要所以曾經有一位我最好的朋友但是39歲就往生天際英才他叫做林明洲法官是你台大學弟很高大他身體非常好打橄欖球但是不幸鯉魚肺腺癌所以我對空氣非常關注就是這個原因 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
2475.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
2499.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
他生前有一個學弟,也是你的老同事叫陳明仁陳明仁考上行政院法規會的時候林立中法官跟他講說,你這個職務是最重要的你好好的做,這對國家最重要的就是行政院法規會整個國家的法治,這裡最重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
2499.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
2528.164 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
所以您長期做您跟陳明仁都是法學界非常讚賞所以我很高興總統能夠提名您來當我們的中選會的候選人那麼我們台灣其實就像您剛才講的我們有獨立的選舉機關而我們的選舉現在已經開始落實剛才您報告以後我一直就想到一個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
2530.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
2552.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
南韓最近選舉出了問題對不對南韓他的問題出在哪裡 您知道嗎選票印資不足南韓的印票機怎麼會這麼的不足啊他到底除了這個問題以外還有沒有其他的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
2559.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
2582.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
選舉投票制度也有一些關係啦因為可能還有開放海外投票那這個選票的估計可能沒有那麼精確所以導致選務機關在判斷的時候就認為說在現場投票人數可能沒有那麼多所以在印製選票的時候就自行決定印的 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
2583.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
2610.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
比估計少一點所以衍生這個問題所以最主要是海外投票的問題所以如果我們不要擴及海外這個問題應該就比較不會發生是沒錯嘛您覺得我去報載我們媒體有報載說南韓的民眾在肯定台灣的選舉我不知道這是真假因為現在媒體都會網傳也在報 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
2612.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
2641.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
所以我對媒體的報導我會不知道是不是真的有南韓民眾這麼講但是如果假設他是真的您覺得我們的選舉制度為什麼可以讓南韓人民來跟我們肯定因為照目前我們公子選罷法的相關規定我們的投票制度是過程非常公開透明而且也獲得民眾的信任所以過去這 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
2642.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
2669.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
幾十年來這個選舉過程之中也民眾也非常的肯定所以我覺得現行的選舉制度有它的優點所以表示我們台灣現在的選舉制度它的本質的設計以及我們的人員我們的經驗其實是受到南韓肯定所以表示我們在進行選舉的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
2671.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
2683.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
即使有所變革應該不會產生南韓這種海外投票所產生的一些缺點還有選舉不公平的情形我們當 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
2685.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
2709.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
中選會委員你必須要前車之鑒南韓的經驗我們必須要加以深入的觀察然後避免產生這個問題今天很謝謝我們省前主委給我這個答案非常謝謝許中信委員接下來我們請張志倫委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
2717.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
2723.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
好 謝謝主席 各位委員 各位觀點早好 謝謝我們沈淑飛副主委 被提名人 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
2725.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
2753.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
你好 首先還要先感謝你對我們國家40年的行政之力的付出跟奉獻那您剛有提到您今年1月份選擇退休那今天很榮幸在這邊認識你可以有機會跟你請教請問一下為什麼您今年1月退休以後您還願意接受行政院來提名擔任中選會的副主委提名人您的心路歷程是怎麼可以分享一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
2755.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
2777.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
我今年1月是借領退休其實我自己從事公職那麼久但是我對工作其實是充滿了熱情尤其如果能夠在這個法制方面對於各機關有所協助的話我是非常樂意所以當行政院有徵詢我的時候我很樂意就接受了謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
2779.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
2805.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
好 謝謝那因為這個我相信副主委是一個相當重要的工作那由於容主委上次擔任主委以後有跟我聊到他說中選會的工作非常的辛苦他說從早忙到晚他覺得壓力非常大所以這邊還是祝福說未來如果有正式提名你為副主委的時候就是為了我們台灣的選舉這個付出心力也要保重身體 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
2806.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
2831.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
那第二個當然也很多人會質疑那我還是要跟你請教你擔任公職40年而且長期在行政院法規會主委這麼長的行政經驗會不會受到政治壓力的時候針對中選會應有的憲政獨立性你如何來比如說未來如果有一些行政高層給你的壓力的時候你如何來拒絕 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
2834.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
2837.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
我想行政院也會尊重獨立機關的獨立性也應該不至於會來干涉我們獨立機關的運作這是我 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
2858.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
2876.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
所以你有信心可以抗議我有這個信心有這個信心好謝謝副主席提名人那我再來接下來請教因為今年11月28號馬上就面臨了這個地方的大選那我相信這個地方大選是非常的重要因為地方的民意非常重要那其實很多 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
2877.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
2896.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
民間大家也在擔心因為今年可能年底我們的地方大選跟公投會結合在一起因為現在法令通過公投綁大選是大家現在民意的主流那大家會擔心之前有那種投票人數排很長的這個問題所以我有兩個問題要請教您針對年底 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
2900.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
2913.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
的大選是不是你們會有沒有方式來去避免這個2018年2018年當時就是投票人數累積的很長的這個問題你們有沒有去想說我們不管是這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
2915.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
2931.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
地方的這個圈票處到底要設多少個你們有沒有這樣的一個想法或是討論如果地方圈票數是不是要更多那選務人員是不是要更多你們有沒有規劃一個大致的一個方向讓我們來知道一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
2933.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
2962.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
在這個看到這個我們選務處處長在立法院詢答的時候他已經有說明因為公投綁大選既然法律已經通過就應該做好相關的規劃有沒有一個大概的比例就是說我今年我的圈票的數量要大幅增加有沒有增加的一個比例有沒有稍微不好意思處長可以協助沒有問題可能就是還是要看今年公投提出來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
2962.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
2991.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
情況啦 他的案件數那有沒有說 比如說公投提幾案我的圈票數就要增加多少來去消化這個投票的人數的這個問題委員不好意思 是不是這個因為我 是不是可以請好 可以可以 請處長稍微回答一下因為這我相信人民都非常關切是 委員好那我們從109年開始推動選務改革那這裡面就包括我們增加圈票數的遮屏 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
2992.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3015.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
那我們是從以往的2個遮屏增加到6個遮屏就有公投的時候你至少會增加到6個遮屏現在的選舉就會6個那如果增加公投呢未來會是公投的數量一定會從6個往上增加就對了那如果以就是會從6個往上增加就對了好 OK好 謝謝那再請教副主委提名人 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3015.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3035.787 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
那很多民眾在投票的時候也在想一件事情就是說我們的這個投票的這個投票箱的問題也很多人質疑那我想要請教您現在就你的了解您對於投票箱它是不是現在我們全國有一個統一的規定中央地方的選舉有無一致那您的看法是什麼現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3041.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3053.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
現在有一致的規定嘛那現在地方上投票的地點是不是已經全部全台灣的投票箱都一致了大概一致的規定您清楚嗎那個麥克風有開嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3059.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3079.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
所以您的意思是說今年年底我們的地方選舉全台灣的投票箱都一模一樣那是什麼樣的投票箱你可以簡單說明一下目前都是紙箱目前都是紙箱的投票箱不管以後未來中央地方選舉都一模一樣了解喔 OK 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3080.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3104.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
好那接下來我還要再請教就是年底的公投我們認為非常重要那當時我也問游泳組委就說因為現在獨駕橫行所以我們針對幾個現在民眾生物痛覺的一些制度年底應該會有公投的這個投票包含有關性侵、虐童或是高額詐欺甚至獨駕 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3105.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3115.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
我們未來可能在立法院會提出來做這個編刑的入法公投那請問您對這樣的公投的看法是如何 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3119.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3141.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
針對鞭刑公投我想外界目前也有提出有違人道的一些看法我們徐委員當然也有提出這幾個看法你對他施以鞭刑後續你還要送他做治療 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3143.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3169.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
可能還要付出相關的健保還要相關經費的支出那我自己對於邊形這個除了有人道疑慮之外我是認為說這個邊形啊在我們刑法裡面它到底是主刑之一還是說它是附加的那哪些罪名應該要施以邊形這可能還是要有這個要考慮罪行相當還有平等原則的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3170.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
3200.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
那這個我目前是認為這可能有這幾個問題好那我再請教因為您擔任未來可能是副主委提名人嘛那上次游宇榮主委說因為在去年的時候立法院有提了一個公投案被中選會否決那我上次也請教過游宇榮主委說會不會立法院的公投的案子被中選會否決那當時游宇榮主委說的是原則是同意很例外的情形才會反對請問您的看法也是一樣嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3203.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3217.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
我的看法也是如此但是因為基於公民投票法和這個中選會委員會組織法規定這個公投案縱使是立法院提出來的全國性公投案中選會還是依法有審查的權責 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3218.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3242.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
至於審查的原則因為我們的公投它的效力是法律未接所以它不能夠去抵觸憲法還有相當憲法未接的司法院解釋或者憲法法庭的裁判所以我認為立法院所提的全國性公投案如果有明顯違反憲法或司法院解釋或憲法法庭裁判的情形中選會本於這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3245.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3271.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
依法行政還有獨立的職權我認為這個部分可能不應該與同意那至於其他的部分如果不是很明顯違憲的話應該可以尊重立法院的決定主席我最後一個問題抱歉那最後一個問題就是不再一起投票大家談了很久那本席的建議是說因為現在我也跟主委講現在選務工作人員其實他現在是可以不再一起投票的因為選務工作人員很辛苦他不能離開那個選舉場域 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3273.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3298.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
那我現在一直在幫我們所有的警察消防軍人他們也是因為工作的關係可能沒辦法離開他的選區去投票那工作人員都可以不在一起投票我是不是有機會這些第一線的公務人員也可以開始不在一起投票這一點也拜託副主委提名人未來有機會來去思考我也有幫忙爭取就是我們現在的選務人員因為非常難招聘 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3299.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3319.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
所以他們現在的薪水非常的低不管他們的薪資的提升跟榮譽價的問題主委都有繼續在研商當中也希望說副主委提名人如果有順利提名了以後這一點也協助主委繼續來追蹤把這個進度推出來希望在年底的大選可以來試用好嗎是 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3322.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3328.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
好謝謝張志倫委員抱歉因為今天聯席會所以時間我會抓得緊一點我們接下來請王美惠委員有請 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3339.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3351.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
在這本席要跟我們提名人討論一些問題第一點本席剛才聽你的報告跟前輩我們的董事說你從孫選到卓榮泰院長都會做公交機關的事情尤其你剛才回答這句讓我覺得很感動的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3369.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3387.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
他說,問說你已經在今年一月十八你是怎樣才會接受院長來邀請你擔任這個節目你說,因為我是這個人一月十八所以聽出來你說的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
3388.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
3407.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
你很要為國家服務的事情所以若沒有解零的時候的限制我相信你不去申請退休會繼續做所以現在的工程可以做到40天 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
3410.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
3430.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
我會讓人很感動的所以在這個過程當中今天要跟你討論的是我希望大家看出你的日程你為國家要做的事情可以投入統一票本時要跟你談到的就是我們最近韓國的投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
3436.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
3451.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
大家都會覺得說,韓國的投票的運票,運到不夠他們做過什麼事啊?到底是環境的變化,那麼多人要為了他自己投他想要的好選人,還是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
3459.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
3465.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
他現在生育的有23%多所以在現場要交的應票有50%嘛在50%當中,從頭到尾,我覺得,哇!國檢沒救了沒救,因為選舉是要公平公正 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
3487.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
3498.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
像這個事情,被提名人,像這樣的時候,你要怎麼處理?如果發生在你的心中,你怎麼處理?還是跟韓國這樣道歉,就過了 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
3506.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
3517.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
謝謝委員 因為中 三回進行已經新聞局有說明我們選票印製是按照選舉全人百分之百來印製所以我們台灣不會去發生這個問題嗎應該是不會發生這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
3523.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
3549.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
在這兩邊本身自己探討會是怎樣會很要緊的因為我們有覺得說發財党的管理的党票我們就是運發財啦在運發財當中因為我們民隊就是九合一九合一的規定當中北京民運你敢知道總統在中選會的 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
3552.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
3566.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
選票種類有達到八千多種這說實在我告訴你鄉郎南庭就說全台灣選舉要有八千多種的時候這連一種都不可以出差錯自己認為這個要怎麼去 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
3581.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
3596.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
用可以被審在被審規定裡面,我們有公報嘛,選舉公報嘛,在選舉公報裡面,所適中的、所被審的、所看的,才被判 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
3598.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
3607.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
如果你身為副主委的時候你要有什麼想法來改變北省對這個選舉公報很多人看或是有什麼改變我可以說我從小到大 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
3619.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
3628.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
運送我們的選舉公報就是這樣我們的選舉童年端跟我們的選舉公報跟我們的主委或是信箱跟公寓就是幾百個都落下去有時候選舉之後那些東西跟我們不同的東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
3649.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
3655.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
統一權力後,你一副主義,你可以改變什麼嗎?可以做什麼嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
3659.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
3687.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
委員報告這可能就是涉及我們現在想要推這個不在籍投票因為不在籍投票裡面的方式有很多那目前比較獲得信任的是移轉投票的方式但是因為我們的九合一的選舉第一個選舉全人人數非常眾多然後選舉票的總類達到八千多種所以目前中央各地方的選務機關認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
3689.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
3708.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
如果這個要採移轉投票的方式針對九合一來實施在選務上面是非常具有相當的複雜性跟困難性所以目前是希望能夠由選票單一的全國性公投先來做 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
3708.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
3717.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
然後吸取相關的經驗之後再來思考有沒有辦法推行到其他的選舉我們覺得你的回答是覺得我們先實施公投因為一波一波來 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
3726.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
3733.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
不可以亂走的,就想要用走的,這樣有時候會出錯的尤其這個選舉的事情,不能開玩笑的啦所以說在不在籍投票,要依轉投票,這你們非常 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
3744.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
3767.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
去用心去演繹,因為這個國家要進步,當然你的選舉一定要有改變,要不然改變當中,就是你要準備好、處理好,才可以去實施啦,不然亂跑跑的時候,他就很慘了啦,他再來本身要跟我們提名人說的說,有的是吃 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
3772.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
3775.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
其實我認為我們中選會的力度不夠,因為其實我認為對一個認真發明,會有的民意代表,對他來說是真沒公平。 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
3789.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
3804.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
在這個過程當中,我問問,如果送你這個支付的時間,這個寫信息,如何去處理,如何去做的時候,我們說實在的,有時候單人炒料後,這個後來的好選人一定落選了, |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
3810.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
3823.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
要說有判決的時候,我不會說,有時要一、兩天都去按,跟這個還寥寥啊所以我們這個吃訊息,說實在我們中選委,我知道吃訊息這是要很多單位去處理的,可是在我們中選委這邊的角度 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
3838.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
3855.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
一定要配合、一定要相處,我們要如何保護好的人、認真的人的好選人這樣才是最重要的,以上好,謝謝王美惠委員,謝謝接下來我們請王宏威委員進行質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
3866.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
3894.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
好謝謝主席請被提名人沈淑菲委員好好還是被提名人好你是已經退休之後現在接受提名那我看到你的相關的經歷背景我覺得我們這次提名的人選其實有很大的不同那你算是一個可以講說是一個技術官僚 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
3896.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
3917.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
我們第二位提名人最年輕 但是我看到他的想法很多 理想性 可是我覺得有些很難落實第三位候選人可能就是爭議性比較大的 因為現在擔任我們的法務部次長我想請問 先請問被提名人 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
3917.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
3943.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
就是在去年去年整個大罷免的狀況裡面其實有很多的亂象其中有關於政治獻金的部分其實被討論的非常非常多那我們經歷過很多的選舉其實在政治獻金的部分歷經過去幾十年的這樣的選舉基本上它已經制度化但是在罷免的過程裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
3944.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
3969.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
就出現了因為就沒有《政治獻金法》的一個規範所以在這裡其實我們所了解我自己本身有提出修法那內政部也提出修法因為大家都看到這樣的亂象因為被提名人你曾經在行政院擔任法規會主委但這個案子送到行政院之後沒有下文 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
3971.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
3990.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
我們不能說不會有再有下一次的罷免或者可能沒有這樣的一個大規模的罷免無差別的罷免但是零星的罷免還是有可能存在所以對於罷免應該同樣要建立政治獻金的制度請問一下貝提名媛妳的看法是什麼我贊成 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
3995.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
4011.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
不論是罷免方或被罷免方都有宣導自己理念的一個需求所以我認為把他們納到政治獻金法去規範一方面他有相關的制度可以依循一方面也可以讓他的資訊透明 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
4012.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
4025.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
對 這樣也才公平嘛我們選舉最重要一個就是公平還有透明嘛所以你個人認為說因為現在我剛剛講其實內政部也送到行政院所以你也認為應該要加速來修法 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4026.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4042.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
同不同意同意好同意另外我想前面幾位委員都提到最近這個韓國的這個選舉出現非常大的爭議但是這個爭議後來延燒到台灣不只網路還有包含台灣的媒體 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4043.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4055.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
那麼其實事後都證明韓國這一場選舉的爭議來自於他的選票不足這當然是非常致命性而且也是低級的錯誤那在韓國其實後來我們了解 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4060.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4082.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
就是在網路上 比如說 比如是極右派或者是在野黨的支持者就把它引申為這場的選舉爭議來自於所謂的中國借選這裡面的謠言甚至包括他們執法的警察都說是中國人假扮的但是事後都證明這全部都是謠言 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4084.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4112.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
那在韓國這些網路的部分的謠言傳到台灣的這個社群平台也開始大肆的在操作那甚至呢去把它做一個完全造謠的衍生說現在立法院裡面在野黨針對不在籍投票的修法就是要來幫助中共借選所以從 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4114.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4139.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
韓國的選舉的錯誤到選舉的謠言跑到台灣來也出現了選舉的謠言然後甚至也有新聞報導那甚至直接去指涉在立法院修法不在即投票變成引申為事中國借選所以我想請問一下被提名人 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4140.146 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4161.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
你所了解的現在在立法院裡面的不在籍投票的修法是不是要讓中國竊選我想以為了了解這個立法院在野黨的提案不在籍投票已經有把海外投票的部分拿掉了幾乎全部都把它拿掉了所以不會有這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4166.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4187.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
至於有沒有中國的借選這可能還要我現在問的是有沒有中國借選有沒有海外勢力的借選在過去這個台灣的這個選舉裡面包含那次韓國瑜參與總統大選有沒有境外勢力的借選我直接說有境外勢力的借選 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
4188.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
4202.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
就是來自於那個一個所謂的共諜王立強當時包含澳洲的媒體澳洲的所謂的情治單位都來說這個這個韓國瑜這個共諜有幫助韓國瑜來選舉事後這個人就不見了 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4209.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4237.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
事後證明就是假消息事後證明就是境外健訊所以我要講的是不在即投票現在我想尤其你被提名一定會了解一下立法院目前所針對的不在即投票其實所有不在即投票的提案已經把海外的部分已經把它先暫時沒有把它涵蓋在內那主要是集中在台澎金馬的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4238.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4250.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
所以在立法院裡面的修法不在即投票並沒有你也認為沒有說是要讓中國借選的問題嗎好另外一個選舉 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4254.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4274.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
每一年選舉都有一些錯假新聞奧博太多了這個之前在中選會業務報告裡面我也特別提及最近比如說吳宗憲我們的立委吳宗憲他去選耶蘭縣長那吳宗憲不曉得他也變成蔡奇阿明這主要是我們有這個我們的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4277.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4302.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
演藝人員 演藝天王有之前的前國安局這個所謂這個私營的這個吳宗憲還有在桃園的前議員的吳宗憲結果呢 在這段時間裡面所有有關於吳宗憲的錯假消息一堆啊 一坨拉骨啊什麼包含說吳宗憲什麼涉貪 已經被起訴了 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4303.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4307.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
像這種訊息老師說他如果是在選前24小時這樣隨便的發布會不會影響選舉 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4312.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4335.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
會吧 一定會或者是把人家的主席都造謠了說他的主席是什麼廣東的他把另外一個吳宗憲的主席去按到這個吳宗憲 在參選的吳宗憲像在選前 現在大概還有半年的時間這些訊息確實是可以去做澄清的但是我舉例來講 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4336.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
4358.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
拿另外一個吳宗憲 比如說他之前有個私驗案 或者有涉灘然後被起訴的然後去安塞 就是直接講吳宗憲 涉灘 被起訴了像這樣的訊息 或者大家很關心的現在AI的這種身為的影像 其實未來都層出不窮 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
4360.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
4386.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
所以請問一下被提名人你認為要如何防範這種層出不窮的這種所謂的選舉之前的這種錯假訊息我是認為就是說針對AI生成的假訊息的部分它本身就是不實和不法的所以我覺得現行的選罷法是由 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
4387.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
4407.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
你參選人自己去申請檢查機關鑑識然後再去自己去向媒體或平台要求下架我認為可以再做得積極一點賦予這個媒體或相關的平台或主管機關要主動積極一些我剛才講像這種如果在24小時之前跳到黃河洗不清 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
4409.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
4415.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
好不好好謝謝謝謝王文威委員抱歉今天聯席會把握一下時間接下來我們請張宏祿委員進行詢答好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
4433.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
4462.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
我想請問我們的省副主委這個大家都很擔心年底這個九合一選務基層選務人員招募不順的問題如果你當了副主委你有沒有什麼辦法可以積極的解決因為你有行政的經驗我想請教一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
4464.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
4488.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
過去選罷法其實針對公務人員的比例選務人員比例其實修法已經有調降了那我想可能在招募上面還是要積極去做招募啦除了這個辦法可能也沒有或者提升更好的待遇或者給他們更好的保障看看有沒有人願意進來擔任這個選務人員協助我們國家辦理這個選舉 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
4495.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
4520.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
我們回顧歷史啦其實你如果回到30年前很多的我們的就是我們的公務人員其實是很積極很爭取而且大家都很想去當省務人員是不是是沒錯沒錯嘛那時候可能啊比如說這個公所 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
4521.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
4538.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
可能有一百個名額可能多出來的大家還要輪流那個年代是不是這樣對啊對啊為什麼今天呢大家避之唯恐不及我覺得啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
4540.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
4556.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
壓力或者是呢人家認為這個可能壓力大然後我去做這個呢我得到的比我付出的少很多那我覺得啦要把 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
4558.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
4577.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
選舉辦得好 辦得公平公正我認為還是必須要有公務人員在這個選舉的其中所以我覺得應該是想個辦法藉助你有這個行政經驗應該有跨部會的協調如何來解決這個問題以前為什麼這樣 現在為什麼這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
4581.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
4590.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
一定出了問題啊一定有原因啊我在這邊就不必講原因了應該你也知道原因大概在哪裡了吧是不是啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
4591.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
4613.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
可能之前有發生一些選務上面的一些紛爭啦所以可能也會讓選務人員會比較卻步不過我想中選會已經就整個選務的標準作業程序也都做好相關的規劃也做好相關的講習和演習我想這個部分應該可以避免 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
4615.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
4640.895 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
我認為選務出眾會並不是讓人家不去的原因我覺得這個絕對不是原因是整個制度整個這個誘因喪失了我覺得這個是這樣那我們中選會我們做的是選政的工作嘛這些就把它做好嘛基層的選務工作才能做得好我剛剛其實有講得很清楚了 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
4641.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
4665.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
你應該可以去協調去做這些事情用你的專長去協調去做這些事情因為有很多事情是要跨部會的那你要協調之後行政院才可以去做處理才可以怎麼樣嘛對不對選政跟選務其實要分得很清楚中選會我們要把這個選政的工作做好啊這個做好呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
4666.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
4684.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
包括如何讓選務人員我願意來我願意來做對不對不然我壓力這麼大然後我去做這個大家現在避之唯恐不及嘛對不對而且以前 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
4685.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
4710.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
是沒有週休二日啊對不對那現在都週休二日了啊那我如果去的話我到底可以比如說我可以補假多少這個其實大家都知道啦對不對那還有一點是我要在這邊最近很多人網路上什麼大家都在說韓國選舉什麼選票不夠什麼的啦台灣會發生這個問題嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
4716.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
4730.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
台灣不會絕對不會吧對絕對不會台灣是你有多少人口數多少公民數不能講人口數要精確一點多少公民數你就印多少上選票吧是 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
4731.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
4750.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
對不對?我們的選票還有已發出幾張,然後還剩幾張吧?是不是?是,都會點的非常清楚不只點喔?對應該是早上主任管理員拿到選票之後,就要先點一遍喔?對不對?然後呢? |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
4751.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
4775.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
投開票完之後還要再清點一遍喔清點一遍之後然後呢主任管理員還要蓋章才能送對不對現在還有透過電腦連線然後呢先把這個票數先統計先傳回去但最後的結果還是要以這個真正的選票送回去 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
4776.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
4787.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
不用說送到縣選委員會,縣選委員會做最後的統計才能算數吧是是,委員說的對,委員說的很對對嘛,所以我們台灣絕對不會出現這個問題吧但我覺得這一點,人家一直講中選會其實要大聲的說,台灣不會有這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
4800.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
4825.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
這個如果你第一個時間講這個事情就不用討論了就不用再做了所以我覺得啦我們州選會雖然是委員制但如果是主任委員跟副主任委員其實你還是有這個行政的一個權利跟義務我覺得像這種的未來你有機會你會不會第一時間跟主委講或什麼我們要馬上做出這樣的 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
4827.532 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
4845.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
這也不算澄清本來就不干我們的事選舉制度完全不一樣講兩句話選舉制度完全不一樣我們的制度不是這樣這樣是不是就可以解決了應該要馬上因為民眾可能有疑慮應該馬上做出說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
4846.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
4873.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
對外作出說明對嘛我覺得這個就很簡單公信力就是這樣嘛然後議員會回到我剛剛的問題你們都不講我們到時候有去當主任管理員、主任監察員什麼事情要我們扛要讓他們知道背後還有人背後還有政府在幫他們大家都去做的意願就高了對不對是謝謝委員的指導好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
4876.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
4880.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
謝謝張宏祿委員接下來我們請黃婕委員進行詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
4888.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
4918.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
好謝謝主席我們請沈女士首先當然要先請教這個大家都有看到上週韓國發生的事情他們發生了一個非常激烈的這個選務的可以說是災難啦那這個選票不夠我覺得在台灣是無法想像說是一個多麼低級的錯誤那我也所以說我希望說我如果未來上任之後擔任這個副主委是絕對可以保證說台灣不會出現選票不夠這樣的事情對吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
4918.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
4933.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
這一定不能有這種事情發生沒錯絕對不能發生選票不足的事情那當然這次這個韓國的選舉大家也有很多的討論甚至他們的人民也說可以學台灣啊因為台灣在這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
4935.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
4957.155 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
國際上可以是公認的說這個信任度很高然後也很有公正性的一種選舉制度因為我們的選舉制度非常的單純然後也非常的大家也知道說這是非常嚴謹的所以大家也認為說這樣子的制度在民主國家當中或許是可以參考的一種模式那我覺得這個我們應該要引以為傲 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
4957.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
4971.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
因為我們的選舉制度也是在一次又一次的血淚當中在過去從中立事件各式各樣的這一種事件當中從威權走向民主好不容易建立起來的一個選舉制度我認為我們應該要共同維護 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
4974.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
5002.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
那所以呢第一個要請教的是因為現在其實從去年年底民眾黨跟國民黨他們聯合提了一個不在籍投票的版本那去年底就已經進負二讀囉那所以現在其實是要通過是非常容易甚至是我們民眾黨的委員也在這裡這個是他們這個會期的優先法案所以以他們的目標來說不在籍投票是很可能很快就要上路 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
5002.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
5027.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
的一個接下來很可能就要發生的事情那甚至在他們的版本裡面不只是可以投公投可以投總統大選中央的公職人員選舉還有地方的公職人員選舉全部都涵蓋在他們不在籍投票的版本裡面那我要問的是那請問您支持嗎那如果支持的話有沒有做好準備了呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
5029.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
5055.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
我想這個投票便利性可能也很重要但是投票過程的公開透明還有選舉結果的正確性還有民眾的信任是相當重要的那過去針對中央和地方所有的這個選舉委員會也都有表達目前如果要採不在籍投票那對我們的選務的衝擊是相當的大負荷恐怕也有問題所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
5058.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
5071.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
如果要採這個不再舉投票是希望能夠移轉投票而且是針對選票單一的全國性公投先來做吸取經驗之後再來看看有沒有辦法推展到其他的選舉上面 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
5073.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
5096.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
好那所以我剛剛也說啦因為當然這個我覺得這個不在即投票要上路大家真的要很謹慎小心啦因為任何一個環節其實都是很有可能只要你一個環節出錯了那或許大家對於這個選制的信任度就會開始崩解那選制我認為信任度遠大於其他所有的便利性 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
5097.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
5120.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
公正才是最重要的那所以在這樣的基礎之上我認為所有的制度要進行選務的改革都應該要所有的環節都應該要就是審慎的先去思考剛剛甚至我說的這個一開下去以這個藍白的版本是從總統到中央公職地方公職公投全部都要一次開喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
5122.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
5139.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
那所以我不知道說這邊你們如果真的像你剛剛說的選務衝擊非常大但是你們有辦法做好準備嗎這個其實我上次也問過在這個主委投票之前我問過游主委他是說他也認為這很可能會造成一個很大的災難 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5140.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5169.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
那最大的問題就是說因為其實這個很多選票是跨縣市的尤其是不再集投票很可能集中在六都也就是說六都裡面所有的選務人員你要的選務人員的量還有這些選票的量可能遠大於其他縣市那我不知道說這個我們六都的有沒有先事前訓練過了那是不是六都的這些選務人員都已經有先告知大家說很有可能有這樣的事情發生那我們接下來如何因應 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5172.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5199.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
對 這有很多的問題要處理啦除了這個移轉投票因為有跨縣市移動的問題這些名冊怎麼樣來處理要怎麼運送移轉還有投票所的設置那你是不是因應我們都會區的人口比較多那它這個移轉投票需求會比較大那有那麼多的投票所還有它的面積地點的選擇等等都是要 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5200.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5210.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
很積極有很大的困難要克服是的所以剛剛我提出的您提出的也都是可能會遇到的問題這些問題您想過我也想過六都的選務人員應該都想過那問題是怎麼解決這個是你們現在要開始先行做準備的 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5217.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5236.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
甚至是我看到的是以因為我們院版裡面公投的版本也是有說如果你要進行不在籍投票你要先線上登記那請問這個網站我們是有準備好了嗎那這個網站的資安等級是夠的嗎它是不是有可能會中間有任何出差錯的空間啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5237.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5266.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
因為一旦說你是一個線上登記很可能萬一沒有登記好AD跟BD之間你有可能變成兩邊都有選票欸那到時候總選舉的這個票數如果跟所有的可選舉人口不一致那這個作票的空間就出現啦大家的信任就開始崩解了我記得這個院裡院板的不再取投票這個草案裡面他的施行日期是授權由行政院來定 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5267.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5289.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
也就是希望說這個法通過之後能夠讓中選會做好相關的準備工作包括系統等等這些有人剛所提到的這些作業能夠都準備充足之後我們再來上路穩穩的跨出第一步是的所以我必須要說這個票這種東西是一票不能差的因為你一票可能就會在勝敗之間了 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5290.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5308.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
那所以你這邊登記了另外AD登記BD要註銷這件事情哪邊有資格這個是一票不能差的事情喔所以這個真的要拜託如果接下來年底可能就要遇到這樣子的衝擊一定一定要做好萬全的準備 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5309.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5337.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
好那最后还有一点时间跟您请教因为其实礼拜一的公听会也有问到说如果真的年底这个公投就要上路了那我们中选会可不可以进行公投案的实质审查您的看法我认为现在有两种版本嘛就是一个认为说只能行事审查另外一种认为这可以进行某种程度的实质审查就例如说不能违宪不能侵害人权不能违反两公约等等的 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5337.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5363.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
我認為中選會依法有審查的權責那但是是在明顯違憲的情形之下中選會來如果認為有明顯違憲應該是不能通過因為公投的效力只有法律效力他不能夠抵觸憲法或司法院的解釋或憲法法庭的裁判所以如果有明顯違憲的時候中選會本於權責就要先自行做判斷 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5364.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
5382.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
當然這個判斷後續要接受司法的審查和檢驗那我覺得我的看法是這樣好 謝謝你的說明 謝謝謝謝黃婕委員 謝謝接下來我們請陳昭芝委員陳昭芝委員陳昭芝委員不在接下來我們請洪孟凱委員詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
5391.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
5410.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
好 被提名人已經站在這個備軍台上了來 被提名人我想被國家提名都是一種榮耀也是一種光榮當然人事的部分立法院一定會務實的來去審視您的答詢來做最後的一個投票來決定我們對於有能力的人絕對不會 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
5412.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
5438.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
不讓他擔任我們國家的職務但是如果說不適任的人我們也沒有辦法放水我想這對事不對人先跟被提名人來說說明不過被提名人剛剛我覺得因為你是行政官員也因此我必須要很務實也直接針對你剛剛的答詢裡面點出來我們不要說被媒體或者說現在這個執政黨的官員好像把違憲違憲掛在嘴巴上 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
5438.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
5461.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
然後就變成是說違憲就是直接行政機關認定我想先請教一下違憲以法治國家來講違不違憲誰來認定當然最終還是要憲法法庭來做認定憲法法庭認定嘛也因此在憲法法庭還沒有認定之前中選會可以先講是說這個東西可能有違憲這個東西可能沒違憲然後就去做判斷嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
5462.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
5484.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
跟委員報告因為所有行政機關在受理申請案或做相關案件的審查本來就應該本於依法行政還有對自己對法律的就是依法行政啊所以說本行現在想強調的地方在於是說不管是我們中選會組織法或是相關法令有沒有給予我們中選會權責職責能夠判定違憲與否 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
5489.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
5511.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
因為依照公民投票法規定中華民國法治我們法治國家嘛誰來判定違憲是大法官嘛最終是沒有錯不管講不講最終其實也就只有一個機關能夠審查啦就是憲法法庭就是大法官啦不是中選會不是任何的所以任何案件都要提起大法官做釋憲嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
5512.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
5523.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
但是機關在審查的時候還是要先做出判斷所以誰給機關這樣的判斷認為是說這段違憲然後他就可以不再進行其實這就是我們剛剛強調的就是說公投有 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
5528.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
5548.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
三個目的其中一個很重大的目的是重大政策的創製嘛對不對就是說我們提出任何一個公投案提出來之後它並不是法律條文公投案通過與否是人民對於說法律的方向希望是說能夠有重大政策的創製譬如說去年我們有河山業役公投 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
5549.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
5577.159 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
並不是說通過之後馬上核三就可以研議而是人民認為是說如果在安全無虞的情況下符合法規的情況下能夠運轉持續運轉這是人民表達意見人民表達意見與否如果說公投真的確定之後再由相關部門不管是行政部門或立法部門來針對相關法律來做修法嘛是不是這樣子是好那一樣的道理是我就直接講因為本席有提出邊行打擊詐騙公投啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
5577.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
5601.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
但請教一下被提名人有沒有看過本席所提出來的公投題目的版本有大約了解有大約了解你能不能描述一下本席的這個題目有沒有涉及任何的法令條文當然所提出來的是一個本席的這個公投主文是一個重大政策的一個方向還是一個法律條文 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
5603.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
5616.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
應該是個重大政策的方向重大政策的方向嘛那能不能讓人民用重大政策創製來實行公投這個可能要再看這個公投的內容而定啦你這樣是自我矛盾耶 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
5622.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
5648.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
來本席再一次提醒很多人也講就是說為什麼我們不直接修法因為本席要補足程序正義第一台灣中華民國我們目前是沒有身體刑很多人有表達不同的立場我都尊重那但是如果說人民真的認為是說中華民國真的現在犯罪猖獗那真的有增加身體刑的必要性 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
5649.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
5663.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
那透過重大政策的創制完畢之後立法院行政院還是要負起相關責任去修相關的法令避免過於腐爛或是避免造成 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
5664.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
5679.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
後續的一個措置處罰所以這個是行政部門跟立法部門的責任絕對不是交給人民但是人民有什麼決定人民的權利在於是說如果他認為台灣有需要重大政策創置的時候應該能夠來做一個公投的表達 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
5680.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
5709.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
我想這是直接民意的展示貝婷媛應該不否認吧不否認所以我們其實有蠻大的共識我甚至有聽過法律學者法律專家跟我講說他支持本席的版本能夠做重大政策的創製覆決也因此創製的部分他支持法學界的大佬他支持本席提出邊行打詐公投能夠來公投交由全民來直接民意決定但是他個人 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
5710.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
5735.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
他可能會投反對票為什麼因為站在他過去的法學素養來講他覺得這跟他的過去的這個理解他是相對違背可是他支持應該要讓人民來決定直接民意來表達所以其實某種程度上公投題目真的出來之後應該是受全民的檢驗應該受直接民意的檢驗而中選會在這個過程裡面扮演一個很重要的角色什麼角色 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
5736.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
5752.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
並不是否決公投而是讓公投能夠順利的進行選務能夠順利的進行台灣兩千三百五十萬人能夠勇於表達自己的主張立場讓這個公投題目真真正正代表直接民意的展現愛庭年應該不反對吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
5754.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
5780.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
不反對好謝謝貝提敏人所以我希望未來如果你真的有機會當為國家服務為人民服務的時候今天的答詢也變成是未來你在執行職務的時候的一個唯一立場因為以法論法不要因人設事因案設事我想這才是我們對於中選會任何委員的期待以上謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
5785.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
5809.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
謝謝黃孟愷委員,接下來我們請鄭天才委員詢答委員好提名人主任委員好最後的職務副主任委員是吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
5814.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
5836.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
這個你是從科研一路上事務官出身到這樣的一個職務希望你能夠通過副主委但是很重要很重要的我們先看這個回憶一下以台灣為名申請參加2020東京奧運的公投案 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
5842.605 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
5866.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
當然公投結果是沒有通過這個公投案當然你因為當時你的職務的話我不知道是不是你有在內政部的時候的時間還是在行政院的時候的時間這時候應該在行政院所以你就沒有參與這個公投案 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
5870.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
5898.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
是嚴重違反中華民國的法例公民投票法我要提的就是說中選會依法行政不管尤其是選舉包括公民投票也是一樣依法行政絕對是一個要守住的部分我們看公民投票法第二條第二項 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
5899.895 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
5926.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
全國性公民投票依憲法規定外憲法就是國民嘛 領土嘛 這個不涉及法律之復簡 立法原則之創制重大政策之創制或復簡奧運公投有屬於這三個之一嗎沒有真的沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
5928.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
5951.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
但是就被通過了 我當初就質詢當時的副主委他也是寫法的我不知道他怎麼 反正就是為了證明嘛對不對 何必呢我們看公民投票法 對不對 這寫得都很清楚了再說了 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
5954.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
5982.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
國民體育法27條中華奧林匹克委員會簡稱中華奧會為法人他是法人經國際奧林匹克委員會承認之我國奧會的代表要符合奧林匹克的憲章對不對中華的名稱台灣的名稱要用什麼名稱 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
5984.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
6011.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
那是要中華奧林匹克委員會然後他要提報到國際奧林匹克委員會才能夠更改啊那豈是公民投票法第二條第二項的規定都根本就不是啊就算通過了又怎麼樣呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
6014.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
6042.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
對不對就算通過了也不能做什麼啊國際奧會也不會同意啊連中華奧會可能都不會接受啊所以這個部分啊很多類似這樣的公民投票那次為什麼那麼多案就是很多全部都同意啊對不對所以這個都是怎麼樣依法行政要去守住 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
6045.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
6072.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
所以這個部分很重要另外就是說這個不再舉投票台灣選舉幾十年了不再舉投票 當然沒有辦法實施就是國內的移轉投票也都沒有辦法實施如果真的有擔心受怕 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
6073.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
6101.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
我之前提過從原住民的立法委員開始為什麼呢原住民的立法委員選舉是怎麼樣被提名了你知道嗎我們的選區台澎金馬我們台澎金馬都有投票所尤其是我們的選民我們的鄉親花東人口最多 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
6103.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
6130.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
花東因為就學就業到都會去啊要回到台東縣的蘭嶼要回到台東縣的山地鄉都很遠啊到東海岸的都很遠啊對不對那可以實施移轉投票啊到現在不敢實施我提了很多次的法 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
6135.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
6159.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
總協會怕什麼怕請問一下被提名的人你知道印尼在台灣印尼呢在台灣很多外勞對不對是他們在台灣可以投票不是投給我們啦海外投票啦以轉投票對 以轉投票他們都可以投票我們號稱這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
6161.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
6186.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
自由民主法治國家連這個都做不到可以分階段啦不要全部都不行就先從中華民國的總統跟立委一次同時選了嘛對不對好好的推動也請這個被提名人的委員那個好好的推動支持以上謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
6189.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
6203.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
好,謝謝,謝謝鄭天才委員所有登記質詢沈淑菲女士的委員,經已詢答完畢謝謝,請坐 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
6208.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
6234.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
中選會委員並為副主任委員被提名人沈淑菲女士的說明及詢答結束委員蘇巧慧、莊瑞雄、沈發慧、蔡其昌所提書面詢問列入紀錄刊登公報中選會委員並為副主任委員被提名人沈淑菲女士可以先行離席我們現在休息五分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
6240.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
6240.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
謝謝下課啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
6388.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
6413.524 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
響鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
6488.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
6489.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
谢谢观看 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
6544.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
6546.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
谢谢大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
6595.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
6598.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
谢谢观看 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
6633.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
6645.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
繼續進行中選會被提名人蔡惟哲先生的說明及詢答請中選會委員被提名人蔡惟哲先生先說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
6653.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
6671.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
主席 各位委員 還有張秘書長 各位先進 大家好我是蔡惟哲 我是職業律師 我本身無黨籍我的專業有兩個軸線 一個是法律我長期承辦憲法 行政法 民法 還有刑事的訴訟 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
6672.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
6688.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
那我另外一個軸線是經濟學我畢業於台大經濟所那我有完整的統計與實證研究的訓練我相信中選會需要的不只是法律人還需要循證治理意思是說用數據說話用證據決策讓每一項的選務改革都經過其檢驗 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
6693.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
6711.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
職業以來我最看重的是替弱勢者辯護包括卡債的更生、職災勞工、身心障礙者、刑事被告還有原住民這些經驗讓我深信法律制度是弱勢者的最後一道防線而公正的選舉也是民主的最後一道防線 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
6712.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
6740.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
如果我有幸能夠獲得統一擔任委員我有三個承諾第一是獨立那會停止一切的其實本來也沒有在參與但是我也可以再次承諾說會停止一切的政黨活動那在憲法跟法律的專業以外沒有任何事情會排在前面那第二是傾聽中選會是一個合一機制那我會先當傾聽者再下判斷第三是穩健 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
6742.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
6763.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
選舉規則牽動所有的人所以改革要漸進要有共識要有配套而貫穿這三個承諾的是我認為中選會應該要做的三個事情第一個是程序要公正第二個是競爭要公平那第三個是人民的選舉權要保障特別是弱勢者的選舉權要被實質的保障中選會的目標很簡單讓贏的人贏得清白讓輸的人輸得福氣謝謝大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
6770.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
6772.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
主席 各位同仁 蔡律師好 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
6790.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
6805.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
好委員好您非常的年輕能夠被提名為中選會委員這是一個榮譽也是責任這個國家是你的所以很多事情是必須你要來做我本來 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
6806.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
6834.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
登記三位公平我都第一個要發問但是我受困於我現在必須要同時兼任我成大教授的職務所以黃某信委員的問題我已經沒有時間可以問所以您就必須要替他回答我就把他的問題提過來問請教你您對希拉雅族的正名讓我們台南人非常的感動希拉雅族 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
6835.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
6864.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
你非常了解蕭榮社就是現在家裡麻豆社就是現在的麻豆但是它以前的麻是有草字頭木家六安社現在的善化安定然後大木匠社也是大木匠在新化我們新市叫新港社這五社只有新港社是用漢字做它的族名你知道這個原因嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
6867.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
6889.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
我清楚再請委員知道以後再跟你談這個問題不過您已經非常了解希拉雅族證明以後我們要從事選舉工作我們立委有原住民、山地、平地原住民議員也有嘛所以我們希拉雅族證明以後 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
6890.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
6908.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
是否可以還回他們的選舉權讓他們也可以從事這方面的不分區以及原住民議員的選舉分兩個層次一個是立委一個是議員立委的部分受限於憲法的規定規定很實就是三地三席 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
6909.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
6938.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
平地三洗所以這部分可能比較困難那我自己之前有寫過一篇投書我認為說可以在不分區類似性別比例的條文說譬如說每五名這個政黨提名每五名就有一名或每十名就有一名所以不分區可能用這種方式來突破在沒有修憲之前就可以來做這個這個平普族群的立委那當然長期目標還是修憲那至於議員的部分就是要去修這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
6940.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
6966.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
應該是地方制度法的規定或者是相關選罷法的規定那所以您的意思就是要讓他能夠根據原住民做相同的平等待遇是這樣證明才有意義對是這非常好本席這個答案非常同意那麼西拉雅族因為他們在麻豆在新港他們的居地被漢人取代所以西拉雅族現在很多進入山區甚至更遠到台東 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
6968.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
6995.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
所以他們很多人已經離開他們的家鄉那他們現在很多也到都市來所以黃某信次長曾經提到不再去投票可以用原住民先行嘛那麼希拉雅族是原住民嘛 對不對所以根據黃次長的看法您覺得不再去投票如果我們原住民來先行是否可行 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
6998.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
7021.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
我認為完全可行那這個我認為應該按階段第一階段當然是總統這種全國一致的那第二階段可能就是像這種有全國選區的原住民或者是我另外有想到一個就是特別針對受刑人跟受羈押的這個在看守所的人也應該可以用類似的方法來做這個移轉投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
7023.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
7047.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
很好啊 我覺得您的態度很積極啊剛才原副主委他提到我們台灣的選舉的體質是比南韓好所以我們有能夠去挑戰比較進步的一個制度所以你剛才這個答案非常好的確跟黃次長所講的從原住民可以一步一步來做 西拉雅族 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
7048.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
7076.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
如果真的可以來跟其他的原住民可以一樣的有選舉權的相等的待遇的話本席非常的這個贊同你的這個言論非常好那第三個問題本來是要來請教黃次長的但是因為我時間來不及所以那個第一名已經現在浪費掉所以您來代答你們是有委員制嘛那委員制黃某姓委員如果 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
7078.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
7102.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
通過本院的審查你也通過你們就是委員同事同事之間有督促的義務因為這個是一個委員決策以黃某信次長他以前查會的經驗他以前在屏東我們南部那種會選真的是里長林長拿著名冊到家家戶戶來來會選那個時候是這種情形 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
7107.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
7126.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
請問不在籍投票里長林長還有辦法這樣來會選嗎也就是說不在籍投票是真的像人家所講的五二百二五以上不在籍投票對會選的減少是可以減少 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
7128.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
7155.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
我相信如果是從這個角度來出發應該是會有幫助的有幫助所以並不是百惡無一善所以我們為什麼要把不再去投票把它汙名化它有很好的功用我們台南南部地區山區很多這種會選的情況不再去投票就會可以改善台灣就可以進步了不是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
7157.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
7184.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
跟委員講我是完全贊成不再急投票但是我要強調就是要怎麼階段性的一步一步來因為這個九合一大選有八千多張選票這真的是太困難了這真的沒有前面的前期的這種測試失敗的機會非常可這個國家是你的你剛三十幾歲很多制度就是你們將來自己要用的所以要替自己的制度建立的很好非常好所以現在最後一個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
7185.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
7195.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
也就是說當房次長當為中選會委員的時候他可以透過他政務次長的身份 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
7196.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
7216.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
跟檢察總長全國對會選對於打擊競爭對手的網路上的毀謗不實的文宣如果黃次長沒有辦法去盡到他的職責你敢不敢去督促他這個應該是完全沒問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
7217.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
7244.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
要承諾喔也就是說今天要承諾將來黃次長如果怠慢你必須要監視義務來監視黃次長去用他的中選會委員去督促選查議題查會公平那個沒問題我可以承諾那另外中選會委員本身應該也可以直接這個跟這個檢查機關進行合作那所以直接對檢查機關來做督促還有透過王委員都可以承諾很好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
7247.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
7252.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
謝謝中信委員接下來我們請王鴻威委員詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
7262.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
7286.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
好謝謝主席還有提名人我剛才有講這今天的三位提名人其實整個的學經歷的背景其實有很大的不同那我們這個蔡惟哲律師你是最年輕那我看起來你也是我在看你的這個相關的字數裡面我覺得你也是理想性最高 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
7287.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
7312.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
不過你提出來很多的這個想要改革的方向的事情我會覺得誠意度過高並不符合現在的一些政治情勢我們要有時間再來討論但是有幾個問題我個人比較重視的第一個就是我之前也問前一位的這個被提名人就是我們在去年整個大罷免的過程裡面因為它是一個無差別大罷免 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
7314.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
7332.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
當時出現了很多的亂象其中一個就是政治獻金因為我們選舉政治獻金相關的規定比較嚴格而且都比較有制度但是對於罷免特別像對罷團它是完全沒有任何政治獻金的法律的規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
7333.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
7355.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
所以當時我們提出來包含從內政部中選會監察院通通一推四五六所以我們都認為說在未來還是會面臨到一些罷免也許沒有全面性的罷免但是這種零星的罷免還是會有所以我們認為應該建立制度那在立法院我個人有提出修法也有其他委員提出修法 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
7356.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
7374.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
那內政部也同意有提出修法那但是呢因為現在卡在行政院那我現在看到我們秘書長也在現場或許秘書長也可以帶回去這個是一個大家經過去年大罷免之後認為應該做一個制度的修正所以我想請問被提名人你支不支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
7375.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
7387.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
在罷免的正反雙方都應該有政治獻金的相關的制度的規定也就是要公開跟透明支持另外 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
7390.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
7409.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
今天大家也提到很多的這兩天韓國選舉的問題造成非常大的爭議這個事件有傳到台灣台灣有一些包含在網路上甚至在一些我們的主流媒體裡面也有報導 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
7410.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
7437.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
那這裡面呢就把韓國這次選舉的這樣的一個嚴重的瑕疵後來在台灣的社群媒體把它引申為說這是因為有中共借選然後再引申去打擊這個立法院的這個不在籍投票的修法直接把它引述或者把它直接的把它定義為說 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
7439.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
7459.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
在野黨提不在即投票就是要方便中共借選所以就是說以韓國選舉為禁但事實上韓國選舉跟這個境外設立的借選是無關的它主要是來自於它的這個選票不足那我想請問被提名人 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
7460.094 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
7484.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
我想你也應該看過我們現在在立法院的不在籍投票的提案請問一下你認為這是當中共借選來找途徑嗎我想就我的了解就是目前的提案應該是完全的排除境外的投票也就是說不能在台澎金馬以外的地方進行投票所以只是在國內進行這個投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
7485.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
7510.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
這部分應該是與這個境外的勢力應該是無關的這個我也這樣認為因為在用韓國的這個事件拿來造謠帶風向甚至用這個來反對不在即投票不在即投票的實施我覺得其實是有很多討論的面向比如說大家提到九合一選舉因為它裡面還包含里長的選舉 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
7512.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
7531.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
那他適不適合做這個不在籍投票一開始我覺得這個確實可以去做討論但是把它變成說直接說是中共借權我覺得這個就是極為惡意的是來阻擋但是拿這樣的一個這樣的政治的操作我個人是認為非常不以為然那 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
7533.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
7555.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
那個其實剛才有特別提到因為我時間有限我想跟這個被提名人就教啦因為你這邊有提到一些我個人其實是支持但是我覺得一下子可能很難達到的譬如說有關保證金的這個改革那確實我們現在其實選舉我自己經歷過很多次選舉台灣的選舉很花錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
7558.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
7586.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
美國選舉更花錢那簡直嚇死人所以最後都會變成後面的金主現在美國政府甚至都是後面金主來當部長這是非常不合理的那其實花錢不是只有保證金這個保證金的制度我覺得也許可以討論但是你裡面比較提出來的是說初選制度公辦初選制度我覺得這個是有點誠意過高啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
7587.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
7608.981 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
因為各政黨即便美國民主黨共和黨他們的初選他們也是跟大選一樣但是也是由各政黨來辦初選所以以現階段說如果說這個各政黨的初選變成是由政府來辦公辦我覺得這個誠意太高了一些 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
7610.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
7623.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
這個是一個可以想像的目標逐步來達成但如果我的理解沒錯的話美國應該出選人似乎是有公辦的但這可能我再確認一下就是他並不是單純是由各政黨內部來辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
7625.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
7636.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
沒有我所了解是他們自己在辦這個也許可以去查一下但是我覺得在台灣你要把它變到公辦初選比如說各大政黨縣市長你去為民進黨這個什麼台南高雄來我們來公辦那他們可能因為現在執政 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
7643.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
7646.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
然後我們現在讓我們各政黨的初選比如說我們現在藍白的這個大家初選拿給政府來辦你想想看現在國家機器沒有整理我們就已經謝天謝地了還要給他來辦我就覺得這誠意過高了一些再來講一下就是一點點時間就是造謠的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
7664.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
7688.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
其實每一次選舉都有不同的造謠層出不窮道高一尺 謀高一丈我特別提出這個例子就是最近發生的我們的宜蘭縣的候選人吳宗憲那剛剛好這個吳宗憲名字太多人我們演藝人員有還有過去涉案的有或者最近也有這個地方名帶他涉及貪污就是這個有關於 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
7690.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
7716.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
詐領助理費被起訴等等直接就想說吳宗憲完了吳宗憲這個社攤被起訴了我要講就是說我看到這樣的報導其實我是觸目驚心我在想如果他今天不是現在出現這樣的一個媒體報導或者網路流傳而是在選前24小時或者在選前 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
7717.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
7721.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
一天十點以後都已經結束選舉出現這樣子的一個報導我想這一定會影響選舉所以我要講就是說你可以說這個報導他沒有錯就是這個吳宗憲但他不管他就說吳宗憲完蛋了所以我在這邊要特別提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
7736.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
7756.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
那個律師到律師會不會通過我不曉得但是我覺得未來如果有機會進入中選會對於這些錯假而且是有意的製造要影響選舉的其實他的態樣非常非常多我也看到你這邊有特別提到要怎麼樣快速的打假 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
7757.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
7772.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
打錯假所以這可能是未來選舉我覺得不管是任何一個政黨的參選人都會希望的因為沒有人會希望說這些惡意的錯假新聞最後去影響選舉好不好好 謝謝委員謝謝王煌哥委員接下來我們請蔡春籌委員詢答 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
7793.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
7794.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
主席好那個請蔡律師委員好中選會這個紙質法第五條明定中選會應該要超出黨派以外然後要依法獨立行使職權 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
7818.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
7822.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
那蔡律師你最具備的法律還有經濟學是雙背景並長期也投入司法改革這個是我個人在協理跟實務結合上對你抱有很高的一個期望的一個原因謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
7838.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
7856.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
但我要提醒的是中選會是掌握國家選務公信力的一個最高機關主管機關那也要請你能夠理解人事同意權是國會對獨立機關最重要的一個民主監督的一個機制之一 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
7857.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
7882.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
而中選會作為國家選務的一個最高主管機關其核心價值是在於要體現獨立公正跟專業那中選會所執掌的一個選制是民族政治的一個根基那制度如果失其公信那就會增添社會很多的一個紛爭所以在這裡要請問蔡被提名人 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
7886.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
7887.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
你認為中選會最大的一個公信力應該要建立在什麼地方 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
7893.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
7917.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
我認為中選會最大的公信力應該建立在它是依法行政上面就是所有的決定都要依照這個法律的決定依照法律或者是依照過去中選會依照相同的先前的判決定的先例那用一個穩定的方式來做這個法律的判斷用這種方式來建立公信力就是依法行政 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
7919.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
7920.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
那你又如何讓我們及社會大眾信任你們有這樣的一個公信力 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
7931.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
7949.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
那我想可以從我過去的一些職業的經驗來做說明就是剛剛也有提到的譬如說西拉雅案我對西拉雅案有提出很多的批評那有幫他們打訴訟嘛那這個訴訟過程其實是橫跨國民黨跟民進黨時期 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
7958.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
7971.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
我自己是反對民進黨提出的平埔原住民草案我認為它是一個有損害原住民自治的草案我這個有非常多的投訴當然最後還是修法通過了 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
7975.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
7999.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
那所以我想雖然我是這個卓院長所提名的但是我過去的經驗上都是對事不對人那也跟政黨完全沒有什麼完全沒有把政黨放在口中內就是一件事情我的看法是什麼我就把它投書寫出來所以我相信我在接下來我是可以公正中立的來行使這個職權 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
8001.187 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
8021.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
就是說你有這樣的一個決心,一定可以做到很獨立的一個判決當社會覺得說這個顯物不公正或是辦理上有問題,你又要如何來面對這樣的一個瑕疵來提出你的改善之道 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
8021.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
8044.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
如果當然這個顯物工作出來之後呢讓社會大眾很 譬如說像上一次這種大罷免這樣的一個選舉那如果產生 就是大家對這樣的一個制度呢有一些疑慮的時候 你如何提出你的改善制度 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
8046.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
8066.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
我想重要的應該是廣泛的聽取這個社會各界的意見那同時呢也很積極的來跟社會做溝通包括公聽會或者是主動的發新聞稿或者是開記者會用這種像甚至是拍影片用各式各樣方式來跟這個社會做溝通 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
8067.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
8090.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
那如果中選會有做了不好的地方要改進的地方那就下定決心的改善那如果有需要譬如說立法院幫忙特別是涉及人事跟預算的時候就是再請立法院來協助那透過行政部門自己的檢討那下定決心來做還有立法院的在預算上的支持我相信中選會一定會越來越好 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
8090.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
8095.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
好 謝謝最後呢因為呢剛剛有很多委員都有提到不再擠投票嘛那大家也都表示很多當然我在看你的那個問卷裡面呢在回答民眾黨的一個問卷裡面有提到就是有關於那個監所的一個收容人的一個投票這個地方呢我希望我蠻贊同的希望你能夠拿出你的魄力 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
8117.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
8142.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
能讓這樣的一個你一樣的一個制度能夠趕快上路這樣子最後呢 我在想說唯有中選會能夠堅守公正獨立還有依法行政法的一個原則才能讓每一張的選票都能夠被公平對待也才能夠守護民主政治一個最重要的一個防線好 以上跟您交流謝謝謝謝蔡順籌委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
8149.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
8164.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
針對蔡律師你剛剛那個對黃宏威委員的回應美國的初選制度是公辦還是政黨主辦其實都有你們兩個都答對了初選通常由州政府主辦這沒有錯 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
8165.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
8180.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
但是有一些州那因為這個歷史的淵源像愛荷華州他就是由黨團會議由政黨主導那所以說剛剛兩位的回應都是正確的謝謝我們先休息兩分鐘我上個廁所謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
8199.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
8208.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
來一點點 過癮了可以回體驗 最好直接加在喔 可以喔對 好的直接 直接講說這個沒寫到 沒寫到對 也沒寫到 沒寫到這個沒寫到沒寫到 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
8233.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
8236.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
你家的牛奶丟個半口給你,然後...不會... |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
8262.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
8262.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
OK,謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
8286.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
8308.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
8324.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
8335.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
謝謝收看,下次見 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
8351.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
8353.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
好繼續開會接下來審發會委員、審發會委員、審發會委員用書面質詢我們請張雅琳委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
8369.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
8393.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
那我想請教一下蔡惟哲提名人您是律師出身也有法律與經濟的專業那您過去呢針對民進黨立法院黨團書面的答覆是說你相當重視我們的制度設計以及風險管理也提到說未來呢在中選會希望可以建立客觀的指標還有例如還有投票排隊的時間投票率選務錯誤率等等來評估我們的選務的品質是否有改善 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
8394.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
8416.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
那您也有主張就是不在籍投票應該要採取穩健以及漸進的方式來推動可以先從國內的移轉投票開始讓選民事前申請在工作地就學地跟執勤所在地來投票但是對於境外的通訊投票呢就會才比較保留的態度所以接下來我就想要針對我們最近大家應該都非常關注的這個韓國的投票事件來跟您做討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
8418.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
8436.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
就是說在這一次呢韓國的投票裡面呢我們可以看到韓國全國大概有14300個投票所裡面有50個投票所出現了選票用盡22個投票所甚至一度出現了暫停投票那部分選民因此排隊等候數小時甚至有人無法完成投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
8437.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
8457.712 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
韓國的選務機關也有說這個事件是歸因於事前投票的人數高於預期選票配置不足等等的行政問題但事件發生之後就馬上產生了很多的政治抗議從選訴求甚至部分人士連結到選舉舞弊的一個指控 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
8458.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
8479.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
所以我想要問一下因為其實這是一個關注到選舉的一個性任務的危機而且還有我們對於民主制度的一個維持的一個非常大的挑戰所以其實這一次可能不一定是來自舞弊本身因為過去其實韓國的選舉也有多次說是這個選舉不公但是憲法法庭都有判決不成立 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
8480.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
8501.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
所以我想問的就是說當我們的選管機當韓國的選管機關這一次最爭議的就是他們依據預估投票率來印製部分選票後來卻因為事前投票率與實際投票情形超出預期造成部分投票所的選票不足那您有提到就是漸進式開放所以我想要請教就是說如果在未來 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
8502.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
8531.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
我們要來提出像這個韓國國內移轉投票的時候那中選會要如何來做這個實際投票人數的預估呢因為在韓國的輿論最近也有看到說他們覺得台灣的速度其實是比較好想請教您的看法我的看法是假設如果有這種提前制度或者是不再急投票制度他最應該先做的就是事先的登記就是他並不是想投就能投而是要譬如說提前一個月先登記說我要改到哪個地方投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
8532.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
8550.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
那在改到特定的地方投票之後那中選會他就可以依照各個登記的結果然後來去準備這個選票那選票的準備上是要做百分之百的準備而不能做一個像韓國這樣子因為預估就準備50%就是要百分之百的準備而且甚至 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
8551.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
8563.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
可以再多準備也沒什麼關係只要最後的數字中選會在每次選舉的時候都會做事前的核對跟事後的核對這個多準備其實也沒關係就是最後的票比較少就好了透過這樣的方式應該就可以解決這種很誇張的低級的錯誤 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
8571.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
8591.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
好那我想請教一下您說的這個事前投票那如果說民眾沒有做事前投票那他還是來到了這個投票那他就是不能夠做投票對嗎他就是要回到他原本的戶籍地來去做投票那您說的事前投票要印到百分之百就是說事前登記有多少人我們就應該要多印這個多少人以上的選票對嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
8593.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
8617.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
對 跟委員澄清一下就是我剛講是事前登記因為那個韓國他另外有一個制度叫事前投票兩個不一樣 事前登記當然是在當天投票我知道我知道所以我理解你的意思那我想問一下因為說你們現在因為剛剛講的講我覺得就是非常清楚啦那因為你還有提到一個中選會應該要建立選務的客觀指標我覺得這件事情其實也是非常重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
8618.524 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
8640.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
那我希望的是說是不是不要只有留在中選會內部檢討而是可以讓民眾一起來知道因為我想過去不管是我們常常講公投綁大學有人就會講說這個其實是會有選舉信任危機的問題然後但是有人又會講說這個其實比較划算所以就會有很多很多大家的感受性上面的 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
8641.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
8661.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
一個討論而不是在實務上事實上的討論所以我想問一下是說我們是不是如果是您未來進入中選會的話是不是可以一起來推動就是說在每一次的全國性選舉或公投之後來把這些客觀的指標都公布給全民呢我完全的贊成那也非常的希望和歡迎大家一起來討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
8662.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
8676.282 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
好那最後我想要再請教一下我關於18歲公民權這件事情因為我一直都是主張我們的年輕人因為我們都是應該要從年輕的時候從小開始學習那在18歲以後他應該要能夠來去 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
8678.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
8694.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
投票來表達他的立場因為很多的時候我們的政治都會影響到他們的權益好那您自己在過去的自傳裡面其實都有提到你也非常關注學生自治以及青年公共參與你也認為就是學生自治本身就是民主教育非常重要的一環 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
8695.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
8723.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
所以我想要請教一下就是說現在的針點就是說憲法第130條規定了年滿20歲者有依法選舉之權那我們應該如何理解它是最低保障還是絕對限制如果是最低保障就是憲法至少保障20歲以上嘛對不對但是不應該禁止法律讓18歲19歲的新年提前行事那如果是絕對限制才必須透過憲法處理那現在民間有非常多的想法那不曉得您的想法又是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
8725.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
8748.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
我的想法是最低保障也就是說至少到20歲的時候你就至少一定要給他這個投票權但是在這個因為之前有經過公投嘛那在公投的這個結果之後我認為這個合理的解釋應該就變成他是一個限制而不是一個保障如果在沒有這個公投的情況下我完全認為說直接可以修法就可以了 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
8749.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
8765.734 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
其實在當時的公投統一票其實是多過於不同一票只是當時的門檻讓他沒有辦法通過所以這個民意上面的展現其實應該是比較支持的我個人也是完全支持這個主要是想要了解一下你的想法 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
8766.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
8786.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
那另外就是說你也有提到就是說你非常在乎選舉資訊的品質也提到就是說中選會應該要強調跟這個教育部還有學界公民團體一起來做選舉資訊的判讀跟媒體素養特別是年輕世代的一個數位資訊的環境的素養那但是我想就是說我們現在大多數的時候我們都可以看到中選會做這些事情大概就是圖卡 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
8786.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
8796.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
好 那其實是完全 您自己是個年輕人嘛你也知道現在年輕人不是用圖卡來接受這些資訊那您接下來會如何來做到您所謂的提升年輕世代的媒體素養呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
8799.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
8816.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
我認為說譬如說以選舉公報來說我們可以在選舉公報上放QR code那這個選民就可以去看QR code裡面對應的影片那或者是說可以委由專家假設是公投的話可以由專家出具他們的各自的意見那或者是由這種 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
8817.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
8836.282 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
有設計思考的專業的人來特別針對每個提案進行這個設計讓他能夠被這個一般的人民更好地吸收我想方法應該有很多種好 那我提出一個想法希望未來有機會的話可以來在中選會來推動就是說因為我想現在年輕人大部分都使用Threads對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
8837.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
8853.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
使用shorts 使用這些短音音所以我想這個部分是我們必須要來強化讓我們的資訊可以被年輕的世代給接收那同樣的我也希望未來是可以把學生會跟學生議會 系學會等學生組織一起來視為推動公民教育的合作對象 謝謝謝謝張雅玲委員 謝謝接下來請范雲委員詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
8869.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
8881.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
蔡律師您好我想我有看到您是這次候選人中裡面年紀最輕的算是我們年輕世代的但是經驗非常豐富的 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
8882.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
8896.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
那我特別看到您很關心就是弱勢族群包含這個原住民的一些法律的訴訟那您參與很多那在弱勢族群的過去的權益的法律爭取上 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
8899.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
8913.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
那我也特別注意到在您這次的那個書面資料中也有談到就是無障礙的相關的部分所以我想先問您一個很簡單的部分你覺得我們目前的投票制度平等嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
8916.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
8942.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
因為我們的憲法裡面有這個普通平等直接無記名投票的方式那中選會就是掌管選務還有選舉相關的法規那您認為我們現在的投票制度是否平等我想在法律上是平等的但在事實上其實還是有很多可以改善的空間那您可能會覺得哪方面就是如果是您當選的話會怎麼樣改善可以簡單講個方向嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
8945.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
8966.768 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
以這個投票能不能去投票這件事情有的人可能會受限於他的工作所以他沒有辦法在假日的時候去投票那或者是學生他可能剛好遇到期末考像我大學的時候就很常這樣子遇到期末考所以他沒辦法去投票所以在投票的時間的選擇上可以避開這個大學期末考的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
8967.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
8990.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
那有關因為工作而不能投票的人或者是因為時間距離比較遠而不能投票的人我們可以給他比如說前一天放假或者是每個人就直接撥一筆這個通勤的費用可能台鐵的費用高鐵的費用這個詳細可以再討論而有國家直接來幫這個每個公民來出這筆錢來讓他們更容易的投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
8992.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
9009.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
這樣的理想非常的好但是我想要針對您過去關心的或這次書面資料有提到的無障礙的部分特別來跟您討論那你覺得在無障礙的部分我們能夠做改善的就是有哪些呢這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
9012.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
9026.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
這個身心障礙有很多種類型那每種不同的類型他可能會遇到不同的挑戰那我先講一個比較大的方向就是我認為這個身心障礙者權利公約也有明確的提到說 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
9028.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
9051.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
這個身心障礙者他有一個合理調整機制的權利也就是說他需要什麼樣的幫忙他可以先跟行政機關講假設一個身體障礙的人他可能在前往這個投票所有困難他就可以事先來跟這個選委會申請說我需要什麼樣的協助或者是一個視障者他可能就需要 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
9053.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
9075.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
動線的導引那他也可以事先的來跟學員會來申請那現在是沒有這樣的制度那除了這種身體障礙身體障礙之外還有一些是精神障礙或智能障礙以智能障礙來說就是如何讓他更容易的能夠了解這些很複雜很困難的資訊那以精神障礙來說就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
9076.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
9104.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
有沒有可能透過其他人的協助譬如說法律上有他的監護人或輔助人能夠來協助他來投票這可能是一個可以改進的方向謝謝這個蔡律師我想就是你講的其實已經超過我的期待那我比較希望說中選會我想選舉公正公平然後有效率不出錯是最重要的那我們可以看到民進黨的 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
9105.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
9121.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
過去的深藏候選陳俊翰當他去投票投給自己的時候他說投票的體驗不算太好那也提出說動線仍然不良那我想至少從我的角度來看我知道這個改革並不容易而且中選會 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
9123.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
9142.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
從韓國的經驗所有的改革都必須要非常謹慎但是在還可以做到的部分包含就是我們國家人權委員會的CRPD的獨立報告也提到說還是有選務人員沒有依據身心障礙投票權人投票協助的措施協助身心障礙者投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
9143.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
9158.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
所以在選務人員的訓練上是可以改變的還有就是國家人權委員會也提到就是我們的選舉公報到目前為止都沒有提供易讀的版本至少我知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
9158.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
9183.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
在有些別的國家其實就有做到那當然就是我想這個部分CRPD的公約您可能比我們知道的更多就是身上者要有平等參與政治生活的一個權利那選舉就是最基本的所以您是否支持如果您當選建立符合一個CRPD精神的投票環境逐步謹慎的往這個方向邁進呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
9184.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
9214.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
我完全的贊成那特別要強調就是剛剛有提到一個那個合理的調整機制那我認為這個合理的調整機制應該要入法也就是說身心在案案者有一個合理調整權來可以跟這個各地的選委會來做申請說他需要什麼樣的協助那當然也不是說事情都可以馬上做到但是有這個權利來入法之後他們就可以申請這個選委會來協助他們那我想入法之後這個行政機關就一定會配合 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
9214.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
9232.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
好那我有看到你的書面答覆中有關於就是這個一讀版的部分那當然就是希望如果您有幸當選成為我們中選委員的話那能夠就是執行這樣的一個逐步謹慎改革的理想以上謝謝謝謝好謝謝謝謝范營委員謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
9243.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
9272.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
好謝謝那我們中選會委員被提名人蔡惟哲先生的說明跟詢答結束中選會委員被提名人蔡惟哲先生可以先行離席謝謝主席我們繼續開會繼續進行中選會委員被提名人黃謀信先生的說明及詢答請中選會委員被提名人黃謀信先生說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
9278.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
9306.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
主席 各位委員 在座的各位媒體正朋友 大家好很高興的能夠接受到接受中選會委員的提名那也非常感謝大院的進行審查那本人的學歷方面是政大的法律碩士 政大的法律博士那近30年的檢察官生涯近幾年從檢察行政的工作轉任檢察行政跟法務行政的工作那這幾年來擔任檢察司司長 副司長 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
9307.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
9331.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
常務次長在今年轉任這個政務次長那對於中選委員的核心的這個這個要求不只是期許而是自我的要求就是做到獨立性客觀性中立性跟平等原則理論上我擔任將近30年檢察官工作理論上應該不要被質疑我的客觀性跟中立性 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
9332.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
9351.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
那因為這是我這一輩子自我的要求跟自我的期許但如果外界有這方面的疑慮就是我做的不過我要自我的檢討我意思要說這個對這個單位眾選委員的這個客觀性中立性跟相關的這個獨立性這是不容易不容質疑也不容這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
9353.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
9369.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
外界有一點點的質疑那最重要的我覺得要做到的就是依法行政這個剛剛幾位委員都提到了我覺得我們做了一輩子的法律工作法律它是開始也是法律它也是它的最終點那 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
9372.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
9395.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
最後一點就是說我之所以有這個機會來擔任中選會委員我最主要的目的其實就是想在我自己在法學上的一些意見跟經驗能夠提供給中選會做一些參考那在我擔任法務工作的這段期間我們常常看到中選會關於這一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
9400.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
9424.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
選罷法28條有關於候選人消極資格的部分它常常會有一些疑慮希望檢察機關或者法務機關能夠提供一些意見我在擔任檢察官的過程當中我也發現我們現行的選罷法裡面常常會有一些裁罰的它有一些違反選罷法它是一些行政裁罰有些是刑罰的規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
9425.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
9454.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
甚至有一些是一些灰色的要先經過一個行政上的處理然後在刑法的規定在這個交錯的適用方面常常中選會跟檢查機關也許會有法律意見不一致的地方所以我希望透過這個我能夠擔任中選委員無論在法務行政或在檢查行政方面可以提供中選會一些在法治面方面的意見以及經驗作為我們精進我們相關選務方面的一些意見跟方向以上報告 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
9458.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
9475.415 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
謝謝黃謀信先生的說明接下來我們請登記第一位許中信委員許中信委員許中信委員不在王洪威委員王洪威委員不在我們請洪育翔委員詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
9487.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
9493.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
我想今天的審查的話大概對這個委員暫停一下沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
9525.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
9534.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
中選會應該就不是一個單純辦理選務的一個計數值因為基本上來講我們在封控或者是一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
9545.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
9568.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
選務爭議的一個發生問題的一個責任歸屬那最主要還是獨立機關的一個主動性那我看完你的這樣子的一個書面的一個回答我們這個黨團的一些問題那事實上來講我們我個人比較大的一個困惑跟這個疑慮就是因為你擔任這個次長 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
9569.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
9596.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
那在這種一般行政機關當然就是執行國家的政策服從這個行政的體系嘛 依法行政等等但是在中選會它是一個比較獨立超越黨派的一個政治的一個中立性的一個要求所以它可能對這種公正超越黨派的要求性會比我們在當年行政機關比較高所以我覺得這個地方的疑慮是在於說 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
9598.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
9627.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
倒還不是說什麼之前的財產利益衝突啊或者是一些關係的衝突我覺得比較對黃候選人的話他的一個問題我個人是認為就是說現在現任政務官的身份跟你中選會委員這個獨立形象之間我們是存在著一個巨大的矛盾那就是說還是要給你一個機會就是說如果你會任命怎麼樣去具體做好這樣子的一個切割 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
9628.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
9648.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
好 各位報告 我現在擔任法務部政務次長的工作法務部的工作跟中選委員他重疊的部分就是法務部他是負責這個查查會選的工作我相信查查會選無論是在哪個機關或中選委也好或其他任何一個機關 它是一個普世的價值 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
9649.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
9678.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
無論我今天在法務部他要查查賄選我今天到中選會也是要查查賄選甚至我到任何一個機關都是要查查賄選我意思是說我在法務部當任查查賄選這個行政的角色並不會因為我到中選會就產生一個獨立性會產生直面並不會這是制度方面那就我個人特質來講我剛報告已經講過了這個人獨不獨立其實是以除了制度面另外是以這個個人他獨不獨立我剛才也講過我擔任30年的檢察官工作檢察官工作最核心價值是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
9679.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
9698.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
最大的自我要求是什麼就是獨立性所以我覺得這個獨立性的形塑無論我在法國或是我在中學會我是覺得這樣子啦以我自己的例子我當不分區立委只有兩年但是我是毅然遲然就遲掉製作會的所有的工作 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
9699.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
9728.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
我兩年後說失業就是說有沒有可能破釜沉舟就是說如果你擔任了或是候選為中選會的委員有沒有可能辭去這個政務官跟我們報告因為中選委組織法它就規定它的委員就是兼任這是個制度使然它只有主委副主委是專任其他委員它無幾值得兼任所以它一定會在組織設計上它一定會有委員所提到兼任的問題它就沒有辦法辭它就是一個兼任這是法令明文規定的 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
9730.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
9751.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
所以就是用堅韌對 法律它就是要堅韌如果有氣魄一點這就是我的想法供你參考不代表要遵守這個就是一個決心的表現而已這就是讓我覺得歐洲比較放心一點再來第二個問題就是說我們在去年 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
9752.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
9774.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
因為我覺得公投這件事情是人民決定的權利所以我中選會的話我是認為不應該成為公投題目的一個守門員因為過去的話在這個立法院這邊我們提出那個反廢死我記得是國民黨去年的5月多但是中選會把它否決掉我現在想要問的問題就是中選會對於立法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
9775.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
9799.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
我們通過的這些創製覆決 符合這樣的東西的公投案我們中選會可不可以審查 它是不是核限各位報告 我從這個法律的法律面來講 純粹法律面來講從這個中選會的組織法也好 那公投法也好其實我認為中選會它有一個事先的一個低密度的一個審查權 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
9800.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
9828.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
但是對實質內容他沒有辦法不應該進行審查所以我認為說我們應該遵守如果你當選委的話應該說中選會就是做刑事跟法定的事項審查嘛對不對但是這個違憲的審查不應該是中選會因為他是憲法法庭的一個職者對 第一面就是審查但是對實質內容他不應該審查這實質上審查包括因為我們的這個共同法有規定他憲法 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
9829.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
9845.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
如果是憲法保留的這形式上的他就不應該列入這個公投法庭這個我聽到你的答案我還覺得不錯就是維持這個中選還有這個公投法的這個精神那另外的話就是說因為你在回答上面有一個再讓我一點時間就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
9846.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
9865.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
就是你會認為說這個公投的事因為公投黨大選所以你可能這樣回答說一對公投案數進行限制這個理由會是什麼這涉及到就是現實事務上的問題就是說我們過去一個不好的一個經驗公投 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
9866.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
9891.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
數太多的話導致於我們107年非常選務混亂所以說如果這個公投數能夠少的話單純化對選民對公投內容的理解選務的運作我的想法是這樣的就是說中選會不要去判斷因為根據之前這樣的方式就是如果公投要是合乎你的刑事跟法定的審查要件就應該要符合 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
9891.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
9918.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
所以我們不應該用行政負擔去說這個要限制 我覺得這個不好我不是限制 我的意思是說他一次 他可以分兩天或者不要一次 一天一次就過多的公投數不是說去限制他的投 不是OK就是技術上 行政上 選務行政上不應該再一直因為講說查我們人民的書都沒有行政負擔這個公投還是行政負擔 讓我回答很奇怪不會啦 OK 好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
9922.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
9925.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
謝謝洪玉祥委員接下來我們請劉書斌委員詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
9941.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
9951.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
好 謝謝主席 那有請黃倍提名人我也好好看一下欸 我們的資料好像還沒放上去好了 沒關係 直接就問 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
9956.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
9973.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
就是您在過去的這個政策表態上面沒有對中選會例如說在利用在數位科技還有在數位投票甚至在不在籍投票上面的看法那請問您的背景當中或者我直接就問您您對於不在籍投票的看法是如何 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
9973.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
9986.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
那基本上參政權它是憲法實際要保障的基本人權嘛那不在即投票它當然也是參政權的一個制度上的一個這個表徵所以基本上對於這一個這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
9989.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
10004.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
不在即投票 制度上我是贊成的只是說在現實上實務上如何去不要逐步的去落實而不是一步的到位那請問你的逐步落實你有沒有想法對 像譬如說現在大家比較倡議的移轉投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
10005.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
10022.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
移轉投票事實上我們現在現行的選務人員現在選務人員當天實質上他也是進行一個移轉投票我意思是說從移轉投票開始逐步的放大到全國性的公投甚至未來 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
10023.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
10044.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
執行久了之後是不是以原住民或者特殊的執行人員可以進行相關的類似的這種移轉投票而不是全面性的海外投票或全面性的來實施它是要逐步的落實逐步你現在是先從公投開始再到其他的現在移轉投票到公投然後再往往向進行 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
10046.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
10051.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
好 那我們現在看到一個很大的問題就是說因為您的背景其實看起來比較適合檢查中長那這個部分就在於說您在中選會應該是說要獨立行使職權然後又是必須要提供的在您用你的背景上去提供在對中選會怎麼樣的讓選舉的運作是正常尤其你現在還是法務部的一個政務次長對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
10072.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
10092.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
那現在一個問題啊如果說行政院他的意見對於像很多的包括公投的一個這個選這公投的題目的選擇上面中選委員會有提的這個審議權包括的是還有其他的在這個可能在像剛剛有說的中選就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
10094.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
10104.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
就是在不在意投票這部分上面他如果有特定意見的話那如果您現在剛剛講說是往這個方向去進行嘛就是說不在意投票是您是原則上是支持的齁等等但是如果 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
10106.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
10135.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
我們行政院跟你講說不是往這方向支持尤其是你是行政院提名的那您的後作法會如何呢各位報告我剛剛也說明我一輩子都在擔任檢察官的工作他的獨立性客觀性質不容易質疑如果剛剛向委員提的行政院有什麼特殊目的他不應該提一個檢察官背景的來擔任中選委員尤其不應該提我這點把握我是非常有把握的我意思是說檢察官30年來的訓練跟養成自我要求 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
10136.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
10153.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
客觀性獨立性依法行政是他最基礎最基本的要求所以外界我剛才報告也說明了理論上我們要做到外界都不會提這個問題因為你獨立性沒問題但外界有這個理論的時候我就要檢討我以前做得不夠好嗎事實上我自己有非常絕大多數的 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
10153.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
10170.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
把絕絕對的保證的這個信心我覺得行政院也好任何一個人也好不敢來對我一個個案尤其未來如果當中委員裁法也好法規的修正也好來表示任何的一個一個所謂的關稅或所謂的不當的這個意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
10172.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
10192.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
好那另外一個問題就是說公投的案件當中其實現在因為包括去年的這個廢死的公投當中就反廢死的公投當中國民黨通過立法院提出來那這個因為是後來是被中選會擋下來了但是他有一些考量但是他最重要的理由是說因為呢他是不是重大政策的創製或覆決 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
10194.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
10215.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
好 那就這樣的議題上面但是立法院它本身有對重大的一個有出立法的時候還是重大的政策部分其實也可以看到出來是說有些意見包括我們上次用公投的在於核三的公投部分那您對於像重大政策跟法律的這個創制的原則當中您覺得這個分際差異在哪裡 是不是可以做一下分析 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
10216.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
10238.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
各位報告 我覺得從中選會委員的角色來講中選會組織法也好 像公投法也好中選會它的確只有公投案它可以進行一個初步的一個審查但是我比較強調這個審查只是一個低密度的審查甚至也可以講它只是一個刑事要件的審查至於公投的內容涉及到實質內容 實體內容的其實要 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
10239.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
10262.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
尤其是立法院所提出的為什麼立法院要特別的規定他可以交付中協會來進行公投代表從間接民意到直接民意的話有他的必要性這個時候中協會他只能做一個低密度的審查而不是做實質內容審查這是我一個最基本最基本對我的未來工作自我取取你不可以過度介入到實質公投的內容 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
10263.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
10277.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
好 我聽到你這樣的一個意見方式很好啦就是一個低密度的審查就是這樣一個公投的裡面的直接民意甚至在間接民意當中的世界事實上直接民意應該是更優先的在儲缺好 謝謝 貝迪議員 謝謝好 謝謝 劉淑冰委員接下來我們請吳啟明委員詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
10290.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
10313.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
主席我們一位同仁請我們法務部次長委員好次長好因為今天我看了很多委員的執行因為中選會屬於獨立單位那你又擔任了那個法務部的次長那你在檢察官的任期真的是非常盡責來推動一些法務的工作 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
10313.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
10320.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
那其實本市比較關心的你現在來,我們尤其在今年的11月28日進入大選 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
10322.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
10348.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
那大選我們過去很多的不管是在黑韓的影射啦還有我們現在就是比較科技的就是AI那未來是不是在這個選務的工作上我們擔任中選會委員的話你未來因為這是也是你的專長啦我們未來要怎樣去核實我們未來的選舉因為你一個長孫子 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
10350.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
10375.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
會造成很多我們社會的紛爭嘛包括說他的不實的指控啦很多是會嫌的查查罷還有那個就是黑函嘛這時候是未來都是要落到我們法務部我們這邊包括我們情治單位的調查是不是說在這個部份也能接到你的專長你怎麼來處理還有有機呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
10379.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
10381.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
未來我們還會面臨的不再擠投票這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
10383.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
10412.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
可以說在過去我們的九合一的選舉這個亂象應該我們這幾天我們那個韓國韓國的媒體韓國的選舉大家都知道嘛就是選票的問題選票不足但是我們台灣的自從有辦理我們的選舉全世界都認定台灣的選舉是最公正又是最透明說不說 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
10414.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
10430.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
今天你可以說來擔任我們選舉委員來兼任是不是可以發揮你的專長還是要秉持的過去其中亂象該改革的我們來改革該推動的因為過去我們選舉建立這個制度非常好我是不是請我們次長來做誰率領 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
10435.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
10456.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
好 謝謝委員那事實上我們選罷法就這個假訊息或者是申違其實在我們選罷法它已經有做一些特別規範加重比一般刑法還要重的這個規定甚至我們選罷法有一些預防的措施有一些當事人可以申請鑒定是不是假訊息申違甚至有一些請求下架的規範 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
10457.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
10483.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
那我覺得最重要的還是民眾對視假的能力啦這是最根本的民眾要有些認知網路上流傳這些不見得可信民眾本身要有視假的能力另外就是說我覺得就是說剛剛委員提到就是說執法人員嚴格的偵辦假訊息然後嚴格的把它述之以法這是最好的反假最好的破假 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
10485.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
10503.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
嚴格的這個這個讓他受到法律應有的治法讓他不敢再做這個假訊息的這個傳播這是一個打擊假訊息很重要的措施另外就一個中選會的角度來講其實他要有一個主動澄清的這一個積極的一個行政作用行政的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
10504.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
10520.16 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
指導產生就是說當一個假訊息產生了中選會他應該要有一個積極的澄清的一個功能另外中選會他擔任一個行政機關當然他發現了一個假訊息的時候可能涉及犯罪他要主動 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
10521.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
10538.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
來向執法機關來告發因為你執行公務發現的犯罪他就要告發所以我覺得中絕會也應該賦予他積極告發的義務從這多方面的面向來抑制這個選舉的假信息對 處長本身我們可以說 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
10539.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
10565.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
在我們中選會 它這個職位是非常繁雜因為未來的選舉是一個非常複雜不管說在會選 查集會選也好還是吃信息也好尤其現在就是AI的時代這是未來我們的重重之重我們主要是說未來你不再提投票會不會再重蹈過去2018年那個九合一選舉邊開票 邊投票 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
10567.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
10575.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
這個解隊一定要赫責我們能力不過就是要增加能力解隊都不能再從過去重複的錯誤這就是我們未來要做改進的部分這完全贊同好 謝謝謝謝謝謝吳祈明委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
10595.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
10624.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
好 謝謝好 接著我們李柏毅召委謝謝謝謝黃次長這不是恭喜這是責任被提名為中選會的委員那其實當然剛剛次長這樣子回應其實大家對你的過去的簡歷也都有做一些相關的這些研究 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
10626.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
10648.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
我其實不太能同意在野黨會認為法務部的次長檢察官出身的法務部次長他會行政不中立檢察官怎麼行政不中立你過去30年的檢察官的資歷有沒有收過有任何辦案的壓力怎麼處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
10650.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
10670.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
各位報告這是一個公開的媒體公開的轉播我三十年檢察官生涯我自認為沒有接受到任何一個政治上的壓力該怎麼辦或不該怎麼辦案我自己本身有沒有對我的下屬因為我擔任過檢察長主任檢察官也不曾對我的下屬就一個個案上政治上的該如何去觀說該怎麼辦或怎麼辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
10671.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
10693.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
雖然是政務官但是你是檢察官出身的政務官我現在雖然是政務官但我長期擔任一個常任的事務官那我現在也沒有我只是有檢察官身份但我目前沒有檢察官的職務我已經五年沒有檢察官的職務了我現在是負責一個法務行政的工作但是嚴格遵守你過去的這些檢察官的養成訓練來執行這個中選會委員的這個職務其實對你是有期待的因為所有 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
10701.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
10724.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
可能即將參選的所有的候選人他即將都面對的就是包含不當訊息的這個借選那這些錯假訊息、不當訊息、生成訊息的這些借選如果經過一般的程序當事人、候選人在當地報案之後那可能選委會可以做什麼事情或 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
10725.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
10750.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
以檢察官擔任或者是法務部次長擔任選委會委員你會認為可以多做什麼事情這個就是說從檢察官的角色跟從這個行政機關的角色啦如果檢察官角色他如果發現錯假訊息的話他我們現在有所謂的他有司法上的扣押司法上的下架那是檢察官可以做的這部分我不能夠干涉那就是檢察官個案獨立的判斷 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
10751.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
10774.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
那從周璇和委員的角色來講其實如果機關發現了一些錯假訊息其實機關他有一些行政上的協助一些行政上強制我們行政執行法上有行政上強制他可以跟TWNIC或相關的這個視訊平台透過一個聯繫的機制讓他可以那我們要不要預先來跟他們做這些演練比如我舉例啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
10775.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
10792.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
過去的黑函可能需要經過印刷廠可能候選人去報案半夜去查報然後可能把他扣押現在的黑函沒辦法就一張圖卡你說經過這個社群平台有沒有先做這樣的演練之外 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
10792.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
10809.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
那如果經過這些群組的亂發我們有沒有相關的機制可以處理這還是要有這個檢察官經驗的人來擔任選委會的主委可以多想一些遇到這種事情的時候對選舉的公正性的保障 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
10810.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
10831.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
各位報告 其實他如果我剛剛講 他其實是一個雙軌可以並行的檢查部分的司法上的扣押 司法上的下架 其實我剛才提過我絕對不能夠干涉 這講到個案的判斷在行政上能做的 我相信中選會 因為我還沒有進入中選會我相信中選會一定有跟現在各社群平台 各大社群媒體或TWM建立一定的機制 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
10832.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
10855.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
我不知道有沒有他有 我知道所有行政機關都會跟TWNIC有做一些連結他可以做一些封網的一些動作現在其實我們的行政執行法上他就有一些即時強制的一些規範可以讓我們行政機關去對TWNIC做一些先透過速發布說一些封網或下架的一個規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
10857.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
10876.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
如果有機會可以通過這個任命案,可以在中選會擔任委員的話,我也希望這個次長可以在選委會裡面發揮這個角色那更積極的跟所有相關單位,包含速發部,包含各地方選委會甚至地檢署先做一個這樣的演練跟討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
10878.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
10888.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
地檢署個案的時候我再次重申這也是我自我的要求個案的部分任何人都不能夠干涉也不能夠協助行政上是絕對沒有問題不要聽錯意思針對這類型的遇到這種狀況的話要不要先演練到時候又地檢署一團亂 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
10898.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
10922.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
對,了不了解嗎?完全理解,謝謝好,謝謝那針對於這個剛剛的另外兩位委員被提名人其實我剛剛坐在主席台針對另外兩位被提名人包含沈淑飛副主委被提名人他擁有非常豐富的行政的這個資歷那剛剛的詢答也非常的平穩 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
10923.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
10939.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
那蔡惟哲被提名人律師他雖然年輕但是對於一些進步的這些選務工作的想法非常的務實而且而且非常的進步我覺得都可以達成那對於這個次長我對於你的公正性那我也相當的認為沒有問題所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
10941.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
10969.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
行政院這一次包含秘書長今天特別來到這裡再提出的人選不代表上一次的不好上一次是被政黨用意識形態的這樣故意不通過的不通過所以造成其實到目前為止選委會總人數只有委員只有八人他低於九人以下的這些可以運作的方式所以今天補提名三個人選我都認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
10970.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
10993.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
非常適當而且可以支持那也希望為了選務的公正性也希望朝野共同來支持這個中選會委員的這個同意權謝謝好謝謝我們李博義召委好那下一位請習新穎委員好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
11004.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
11030.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
主席在座各位同仁以及我們三位被提名人大家好首先本席想請教黃被提名人我們看了您的檢查與法務行政資歷非常完整這是您的專業那也是今天審查很重要的一個基礎那但是本席要先說明清楚就是說中選會不是法務部 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
11031.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
11051.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
中選會委員絕對不是法務部派駐在中選會的政務代表我想這個部分您認同吧完全贊成所以法務部處理的是刑事偵查檢查行政以及法務政策我相信您非常清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
11052.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
11072.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
但中選會守的是人民的選票還有選舉的公平競爭政黨的公平競爭還有民主的程序這個非常非常重要所以您現在是法務部政務次長那也是行政權力的核心高層 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
11073.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
11103.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
所以我本席今天首先要問的不是您懂不懂法律而是您可不可以真正的切斷行政權的連結守住中選會的獨立公正與專業這個部分本席要先請您來做一個表述簡單的重要的來表述跟委員報告這也許是我這個這是第三次我正宗的這個跟委員報告我擔任檢察官近30年的工作檢察官的 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
11104.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
11127.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
做公正性獨立性依法行政這是我一生的職質跟我個人的素養個人的要求不會因為我這個DNA不會因為我今天到了中選會我今天到了法務部就不一樣當任中選會的委員我非常清楚的知道無論法律規定也好或者是民眾期待也好都是要求他的客觀性中立性 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
11128.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
11143.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
所以我非常有把握自己未來如果擔任中學委員我相信獨立性中學科案絕對沒有問題我也相信以我過去三十年講完經驗沒有任何人敢來挑戰我的獨立性跟科專性未來再 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
11144.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
11169.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
中選會也如此非常好本席很開心聽到您這樣的回應所以接下來我們有三個題目想請教您首先第一個有關反廢死的公投我們有看到您的答覆您說中選會有審查權但審查密度應該是較低密度之要見識的審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
11172.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
11188.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
也强调应该考量立法院是最高民意机关所以本席想请教的是您说的低密度要见审查实质上是不是等于就是立法院通过交付中选会就应办理 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
11189.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
11214.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
跟我們報告我的意思是說因為我們中選會的組織法也好公投法也好中選會它就有審查的義務但是這個審查它只是個低密度的審查只是刑事要件的審查尤其是立法院有交付公投立法院交付公投之後還是要經過要有主文要有理由這種刑事要件中選會一定要審查不可能這種刑事要件中選會不予以審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
11215.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
11239.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
但是最核心的內容這核心的內容成立與否除非它是憲法保留的規定之外我覺得中選會不應該介入審查這就是一個低密度的審查這就是低密度那所以因為在您的報告中沒有明確的表態支持或反對原來中選會否決反廢死公投的立場 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
11240.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
11266.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
所以本席今天想問的是如果未來同樣的案子再度交付那您會支持辦理還是支持否決各位報告齁那這因為涉及到未來這個委員的直接形式啦我的標準其實我已經講有答案已經講了啦其實已經講了只是說這個答案只要沒有跟憲法裡面有保留或是有抵觸的應該就是要 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
11268.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
11289.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
低密度審查再來本席也想請教您我們現在有很多AI假訊息進入AI時代AI的身偽和不實訊息傳播得非常快您在報告中也有說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
11291.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
11304.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
我們在這邊就要請教您您是否支持這個三層的機制第一個就有發現很大的爭議這個AI身為的情況的時候我們中選會應該基於這種 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
11307.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
11321.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
為主持這種公正公平正義能夠快速地見識然後由據公信力的第三方判斷是否是深為然後能夠快速地來標示昭告社會大眾 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
11323.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
11350.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
這是這第二個第三個就是能夠快速救濟被處理者可以及時的深附避免政府或平台錯殺合法的言論這三層的機制您是否支持各位報告那個關於假訊息當然就是說源頭的阻斷或下架第一時間是非常重要的事實上我們現在我們的選罷法裡面其實它就有一些阻斷 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
11352.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
11368.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
主断归主断但它可能已经被传播出来了那民众在这个通常这种审委它可能会在最关键的时候比如选前三天甚至选前一天那这时候有一个 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
11369.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
11385.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
等於中選會或是我們這種中立而且超然的機構很快的變勢而且糟糕這一塊做不做得到跟我們報告澄清機制對假訊息的抗制是非常重要的但中選會它身為一個審問機關它因為選舉它畢竟涉及到雙方 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
11388.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
11399.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
所以他要非常非常小心在這個他主動性要非常小心那有可能涉及到雙方的一個競爭甚至一個言論自由的問題所以如果說中學報告狀況最好的狀況他是馬上的 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
11402.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
11429.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
告發相關的司法機關有權機關馬上處理我覺得最好的究責就是最好的反應沒錯這些究責這些程序本席都認同但是以選戰來說最關鍵是在那個當下給社會大眾知道真偽就是說他是假的有一個公正的機關他就是要糟糕甚至就是要標示 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
11430.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
11450.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
這塊應該做得到我剛才提過就是澄清澄清也是這個破甲一個非常重要的機制即時的澄清如果中選會他能夠一個很明顯的判斷他就是一個假訊息說非常明顯的判斷像一些很明顯的狀況下他應該要進行澄清這是我們政府部門要求各級官都應該要做到的這個應該要做到 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
11452.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
11476.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
而且還有一個很重要就是說在澄清的時候一定要公正不能偏藍或偏綠這個等於是有案件上來就事論事然後立即的給予澄清這一塊應該做得到我們公開的講其實也是就是讓大家看出您的立場是能夠公正超然的這個當然以上兩個謝謝許信英委員謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
11483.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
11493.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
中選會委員被提名人黃謀信先生的說明及詢答結束中選會委員被提名人黃謀信先生可以先行離席 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
11523.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
11528.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
11538.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
11560.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
好謝謝來被提名人已離席本次會議登記詢問三位被提名人的本院委員除不在場者外其餘經理詢答完畢詢答結束委員蘇巧慧、蔡其昌、莊瑞雄、沈發慧、陳昭芝、傅坤祺、高金素梅、徐欣盈所提書面詢問列入紀錄刊登公報 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
11561.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
11590.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
委員於詢問中要求提供相關資料及未及答覆部分請行政院及相關機關盡速以書面答覆報告聯席會對於院會交付行政院含送中央選舉委員會委員提名名單沈淑飛為委員並為副主任委員蔡維信及黃謀信均為委員請同意案 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
11592.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
11606.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
蔡維哲及黃謀信軍委委員請同意案審查完略做以下決議1.本案審查完略1.立法院職權行使法第29條第3項規定於6月22日拟據審查報告提請院會公決請問各位委員有無異議 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
11620.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
11648.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
沒有異議吼好那通過本案於院會討論時由李昭吉委員博弈補充說明請問各位委員有沒有異議好那通過3本院各黨團對被提名人的資格及適任性所提出面問題及行政院含附就被提名人提出相關資料均列入紀錄刊登公報 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
11650.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
11654.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
今日審查會到此結束,本次議程處理完畢 |