| IVOD_ID |
17459 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/17459 |
| 日期 |
2026-05-21 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-36-14 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第14次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
14 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
36 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
司法及法制委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第14次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2026-05-21T08:36:36+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-05-21T16:50:00+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
08:13:24 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/8d241381c4f8c7fcd1a6f5ee3635aa4fa87e0970f6860b3e601341028818003dd09b08bdfd180e665ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-05-21T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第14次全體委員會議（事由：審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於總統府主管（不含中央研究院）收支部分。
【預算提案於5月21日上午10時30分截止收件】
【5月18日、20日及21日三天一次會】） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:36:36 - 16:50:00 |
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那我們繼續開會,來介紹到場的委員跟應邀列席的官員先介紹到場的委員,首先介紹審發會委員你不要拍我一下,開玩笑,今天要審美選人還有徐宇珍徐委員接著介紹應邀列席的官員,我們歡迎總統府秘書長潘孟安秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
1488.719 |
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1495.224 |
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國家安全會議秘書長吳釗燮秘書長總統府副秘書長何志偉副秘書長國家安全會議副秘書長趙怡翔副秘書長國史館館長陳怡生館長國史館台灣文獻館館長黃祥宇館長 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
1515.885 |
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1530.002 |
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那其餘列席的機關代表我們就不再逐一介紹啦請參閱名單並列入公報紀錄那本次會議是三天一次會那今天是第三天的會議議程的一個排定討論事項是省財115年度中央政府總預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
1533.306 |
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1539.874 |
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關於總統府主管當然不含中央研究院的收支部分審查預算的相關提案請各位委員在今天10點半10點30分截止收件預時我們就不受理了那也請機關於處理提案前利用時間先跟提案的委員來進行溝通協調 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
1554.43 |
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1560.296 |
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畢立後預算的一個審查那我們現在來進行報告每一位來發言時間三分鐘那我們現在請總統府潘秘書長來做報告 |
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1571.779 |
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1590.455 |
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主席在場許議員、沈委員以及本次一支到期與會的國安會吳秘書長、何副秘書長以及國事館館長以及所有我們列席的同仁各位媒體的先生女士,大家早安、大家好 |
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1591.616 |
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1617.483 |
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今天在法治委員會來召開審查本府115年度的預算案受邀列席深感榮幸首先我就就本府在115年度的工作計畫重點及預算編列的簡料來做說明其餘預算書大概都有送到各位的手上包括在各位的桌上 |
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1618.303 |
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1642.716 |
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那我想就總統府本身的簡要的說明就總統府是憲法依據總統的職權的一個幕僚機關那承認總統行使職權有關的事項在115年度工作重點就是辦理總統公布的法律、預算、任免文武官員及提名幕僚作業 |
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1644.197 |
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1662.766 |
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辦理國政規劃諮詢幕僚工作同時也辦理資通安全管理法規應辦的事項健全資安防護的能力縝密辦理國家重要慶典及外賓貴賓之接待妥善管理維護總統府的古蹟建築 |
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1664.026 |
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1681.276 |
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辦理新聞發布與聯繫審慎處理人民的陳情案件同時也提供卸任總統禮遇事項同時也辦理公報編印及印信勳章的鑄造等等本府也在115年度稅務編列 |
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1686.922 |
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1706.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
58萬8千元相較於114年度增加了4萬2千元主要是增加系列之帶紀念品的權利的一個權利金的一個收入那同時對於在這個各項工作預算上今年的稅出編列了11億6381萬1千元 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
1711.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
1733.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
這其中裡面大部分六成是用在人事的費用四成七億是用在人事的費用四億多萬是大部分用在行政局一般的相關的管轍維修等等相關的費用其中一項在這個增加了八千四百九十八萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
1734.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
1742.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
在這個部分除了是人事的心思的調整以外除了 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
1744.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
1765.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
同時在211營的營舍辦理的整個更新設備包括整個修繕高達4000萬所以在本年度的預算裡面相較去年在這個部分有所增加所以我們在這次的預算也經過整整的評估列了優先順序以這個精準的這個尊爵矜持原則來編列 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
1771.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
1779.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
以維護整個服務的運作及維持及基本的需求以上報告敬請各位委員能夠支持 謝謝好 謝謝潘秘書長那接下來請國安會吳秘書長來做報告主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
1801.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
1823.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
各位委員 各位列席同仁 各位媒體朋友 大家早安 大家好國家安全會議114年度各項工作在貴院各委員的支持和指導之下都能夠如期如質完成在此要特別向各位委員表達謝意今天也非常的高興能夠受邀來報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
1824.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
1846.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
國家安全會議115年度的工作計畫和收支預算書面報告就請各位來參閱以下就114年度預算執行情形115年度的預算編列和工作重點進行口頭報告首先是114年度的預算執行情形 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
1847.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
1876.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
那國家安全會議在114年原來編稅入預算數是兩萬三千元那實際稅入決算是三百六十五萬九百二十四元執行率為百分之一萬五千八百七十四那最主要是儘管南海陸土地因為都市變更權力變換計畫領取的拆遷補助費和拆遷安置費已經依照規定繳交國庫 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
1879.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
1903.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
原編稅出預算數是兩億兩千三百五十八萬九千元那實際稅出決算數是兩億一千八百二十九萬九千六百七十二元執行率為百分之九十七點六三那各項工作計畫都在貴院支持之下依照進度辦理那其次報告一百一十五年度預算編列的概況 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
1904.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
1933.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
首先在稅入部分編列兩萬三千元跟一百一十四年度相同最主要是借用本會議宿舍的員工從薪資扣回宿舍使用費繳酷訴以及出售報費財產的收入至於稅出部分共編列兩億四千六百六十三萬一千元跟一百一十四年度兩億兩千三百五十八萬九千元增加了兩千 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
1936.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
1951.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
304萬2千元各項工作計畫預算編列情形如下在一般行政方面主要是經常性的行政管理工作以及共同性的經費其中人事費編列1億8千18萬9千元 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
1954.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
1980.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
基本行政工作維持費編列3208萬9千元兩者合計2億1227萬8千元跟114年度相較增列978萬3千元那這個是因為配合政府的調薪政策、增列人事費和增列行政輸入以及房屋養護費用所致 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
1981.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
1990.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
那另外資訊研究業務部分是指執行國防外交兩岸和國家重大變故等相關議題的研究和資訊的經費 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
1992.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
2012.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
一共編列3,385萬3千元這個是因為國際縣市軌跡多變導致國家安全相關之研究和諮詢議題增多為了強化理念相近國家和我國的安全合作也就是國安外交並持續擴大國際交流的能量而較114年度增列1,325萬9千元各項經費都依照實際運作所需核實編列 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
2019.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
2038.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
那最後是第一預備金編列50萬元和去年度相同那接下來簡單報告國家安全會議115年度的工作重點包括國防外交兩岸全社會防衛任性等五大部分工作內容如下第一在國防方面首要完成 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
2040.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
2063.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
所要完善國防自主政策強化整體國防戰略以及軍事戰略加速建構不對稱戰力提升全民防衛動員能量維護國家安全和區域和平穩定促進國內產業升級和提振經濟發展第二在外交方面我們要和理念相近夥伴深化合作堅定捍衛民主自由和平等普世價值並且擴大我國的國際參與 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
2065.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
2085.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
持續厚植國際友我力量第三在兩岸關係方面面對中國持續在軍事、外交、灰色地帶等方面不斷加大恫嚇與脅迫的力道我們將積極掌握兩岸和區域的動態持續和全球民主陣營深化合作共同維護台海以及印太區域的和平與穩定與繁榮 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
2087.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2106.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
第四,在全社會防衛韌性方面,我們要強化全社會防衛韌性推動全民防衛體系建構和社會資源整合,提升國家整體因應能力此外,強化危機預警和情勢研判的能力,降低非傳統威脅的安全危害 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2107.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2130.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
積極拓展和友好國家的交流關係確保我國社會防衛體系能夠和國際接軌那這個也是我們的工作重點那第五在資通訊安全方面將以公私協力方式因應治安威脅打造更具韌性安全可信賴的智慧國家並且要強化網路以及數位通訊的韌性以有效降低危機發生時通訊或運作中斷的風險 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2132.532 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2141.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
以上有關於本會議預算執行編列以及工作重點已報告完畢那敬請各位委員先進多餘指教和支持謝謝大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2156.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2172.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
主席 各位委員 各位聯席同仁國事館114年各項工作在大院委員的支持與指導下都能順利完成在此先向各位委員表達感謝以下就本館114年度執行情形115年度工作計劃與預算編列重點則要報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2178.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2187.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
第一 114年度預算執行情形 請看書面報告第二 115年度工作計畫重點 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2189.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2217.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
一加強徵集總統副總統文物及史料與台灣民主化相關史料多方充實管長為了充實管長除了依法定期從總統府移轉總統副總統文物之外也主動聯繫對國家社會有重大貢獻的受包養人物的家屬與相關單位並擴及壽星人物與徵集重要史料第二研究及出版 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2220.65 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2247.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
編輯專書梗序擴充歷任總統資料庫描繪台灣民主化的歷程促進學術研究持續辦理戰後台灣政治案件及重要史事專題檔案史料的研究編轉總統副總統專書例如蔣中正日記蔣經國日記與嚴家幹先生大事長篇歷任外交部長與重要大使口述歷史訪談等編輯出版發行國史館管刊 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2248.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2262.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
擴充歷任總統資料庫內容以及辦理學術交流合作以促進相關的學術研究三 落實開放政府的目標持續上網公開管藏並推廣應用 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2263.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2284.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
第四,妥善管理维护直辖市设定古迹,台湾总督府交通局地信部依据文化资产保存法与古迹修复及再利用办法,办理古迹建筑本体外墙修复工程委托技术服务案,善尽文化资产保存责任。 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2286.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2294.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
3.115年度單位預算稅入稅出的編列情形1.稅入部分本管115年度稅入預算即編列126萬元較上年度法定預算數1225000元增加35000元 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2303.439 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2323.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
二 稅出部分 本管一百一十五年度稅出單位預算即編列兩億五千一百七十三萬三千元較上年度法定預算含追加預算兩億三千六百零七萬四千元增加一千五百六十五萬九千元那內容重列 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2326.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2349.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
4.本管各项计划均经审慎评估,依施政优先顺序,本金时遵节原则编列,并持续以开放政府为目标,其能提升政府始料资源之有效开放利用,以发挥预算最大效能。敬请各位委员先进给予指导与支持,感谢。 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2352.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2358.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
好 謝謝陳館長 來接下來請國使館台灣文獻館黃館長來做報告主席各位委員大家早 國使館台灣文獻館114年度各項工作計畫 承蒙各位委員的支持皆依預定的進度如期如質的舉行 在此先向各位委員表達感謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2378.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2393.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
然後今天大院召開預算審查會議很榮幸奉邀列席報告本館115年度預算編列情形本館依據組織條例整理文物文獻史料的收集整理典藏數位化研究出版及推廣並辦理台灣史詩研究及學術研討會等 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2394.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2412.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
各類事項 據於擬定各項工作計畫並依據預算編制作業相關規定 核實編列115年度預算現僅將114年度預算執行情形及115年度工作計畫重點及預算編列的情形檢要報告如後 敬請各位委員指教與支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2413.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2420.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
一、114年度預算執行信息稅入部分114年度法定預算為1157000元執行率為156.27%以如期如數繳交國庫稅出的部分114年度法定預算數為1億12853000元決算數為1億8846000元執行率為96.45%各項工作皆依照進度確實執行第二 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2440.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
2465.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
第115年工作計畫重點第一個是根據收藏整理文物及文獻史料透過展示推廣研究出版形塑館藏特色以凸顯台灣歷史文化的一個特殊性與多元性第二加速館藏檔案目錄的整理編目保存維護數位化推廣及出版及資料庫的提升以強化檔案管理及開放應用的一個效能第三根據進行族群史專題研究及出版專書舉辦研討會辦理專題演講及研習活動以深化台灣推廣 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
2470.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
2489.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
以深化及推廣台灣史研究第四維持管社的園區的運作辦理安全保護管社修繕消防機電空調資訊及環境清潔增進各項管務推展第三115年度單位預算及稅數預算的編列情形稅入的部分本管115年度稅入 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
2490.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
2509.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
預算編列為一百十五萬七千元同一百十四年法定預算數稅出的部分本管一百十五年度稅出預算編列為一億兩千六百二十二萬兩千元較一百十四年度法定預算數含追加預算一億一千兩百八十五萬三千元增加一千三百三十六萬九千元之將各項工作計劃編列概況 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
2511.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
2529.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
簡要報告如後第一一般行政本計劃系經常性的行政工作以及共同性經費即編列九千三百九十九萬五千元在最初總額的百分之七十四點四七與一百一十四年法定預算數八千六百七十萬五千元相較增加了七百二十九萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
2530.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
2543.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
主要是增加機關、庫房等新建工程第二文獻業務本計畫包括民俗文物管理應用、文獻管理應用、文獻研究編撰等業務推展經費即編列3227000元佔稅數總額的25.52%與上年度法定預算數26128000元相較增加了6079000元主要是增加廣場文物、文物清查等各項重要的業務 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
2555.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
2575.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
再來就是第一預備金依照經常性支出總額的百分之一範圍編列兩萬元佔稅出的百分之零點零一那本館各項計畫皆秉持預算資源有限及尊潔開支的原則依施政的優先順序持續推動加強各收集古文書及鼓勵民間捐贈文物 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
2576.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
2587.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
還有持續辦理原住民、民族史及客家專題研究、口述訪談等業務上級各位委員繼續對本館各項計畫鼎力支持並管務順利推展敬請各位委員指教與支持謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
2590.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
2611.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
好 謝謝黃館長 機關代表報告完畢 相關書面報告內容就請各位來參閱並列入公報記錄那我們先就本日的會議的進行方式來做原則性的說明上午我們會議時間我們先進行到詢答結束以後再來休息 那休息以後下午再繼續開會 那下午的 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
2613.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
2641.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
開會後我們先進行宣讀預算案的預算數及委員的提案那宣讀以後我們就進行審查那下午的開會時間我們就來看今天早上10點半截止收案今天看起來收案的件數也還好收案的情況跟提案等會整以後整理所需要的時間在我們中午休息前我們再做宣告 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
2642.139 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
2662.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
那如果巡打提前結束我們再視情況來做一個調整那我們現在開始來進行巡打那因為巡打之後下午我們要進行預算的提案的處理那所以到時候每一位委員一樣可以針對提案的內容充分的發言所以我們就按照往例今天時間就6加2 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
2665.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
2682.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
本會的委員6加2 那尋答時間6分鐘 必要延長2分鐘非本會委員尋答時間4分鐘 想要再問的 你會再問的 那並不再延長那上午10點半截止發言登記 現在請登記第一位審發會委員來做尋答 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
2693.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
2695.139 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
要刷你要給他代理一下好 主席我們先請總統府潘秘書長請潘秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
2719.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
2743.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
這個我想從這個這個月15號這個川習會結束到今天大概是六天的時間那這個川習會結束在整個川習會的過程看起來我們外界沒有辦法得知在川習會過程裡面所出現的狀況但是在從川普總統離開 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
2746.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
2762.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
15號離開在空軍1號上面他就有發表他那時候就有提到說他將與掌管台灣的人談過之後在不久的將來做出決定這是他第一次提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
2763.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
2776.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
那這個在川普離開北京之後我想這個川習會的這個整個效應對於這個整個台海議題台美關係真的是投下了一個巨大的漣漪那這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
2779.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
2806.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
這個幾次川普總統對外談話都造成國內外不小的震盪那也引起國人高度關注跟焦慮那今天是我們總統府還有我們國安會第一次到我們等於在川習會第一次來我們有機會立法院有機會來了解我們在這整個過程中我們國安單位怎麼樣因應我們國安單位怎麼看待我們國安單位怎麼面對接下來要面的狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
2807.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
2828.33 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
那這個我剛才提到說這個川普總統的15號在飛機上提到說他要跟掌管台灣的人談一談結果昨天那時候我們一開始大家認為說可能川普總統大概是會透過什麼樣的管道來跟我們對話或傳話或者大家怎麼樣進行對話結果昨天昨天這個就在他們這個美國這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
2832.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
2844.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
馬里蘭州的安德魯聯合基地我們的川普總統他也透過白宮的快速回應帳號他直接說記者問他說你會不會跟台灣的賴總統談記者這樣問川普就在昨天他就直接講說I will speak to him |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
2859.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
2875.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
我要跟他談這是他第二次講了時隔五天第二次講說I will speak to him也就是川普總統明確的表達他要跟拜總統對話請問潘兵部長這個部分我們現在做了什麼樣的準備如果這個齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
2877.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
2895.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
如果川普總統真的跟賴總統直接進行對話那是台美關係40年來第一次真正的官方直接的對話這是第一次上一次我們小英總統跟川普通電話的時候他還沒就任 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
2897.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
2908.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
這是如果說川普總統照他所講的這個是第一次台北最高高峰直接對話這請問台北部長這部分我們有什麼樣的準備跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
2909.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
2934.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
好 謝謝沈委員的推詢針對川習會之前到進行當中以及結束登上空軍一號甚至一直到落地到回到美國本土那國安會總統府都高度的關注在這個川習會之前在進行當中每一天到結束那當然川普總統在離開 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
2936.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
2951.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
這個北京之前接受福斯的裡面的一個預錄的專訪到空軍一號在對記者的所講以及大概回來之後然後又開了一些相關的談話那這個部分總統府充分總統 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
2955.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
2982.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
充分掌握了相關的資訊國安會以及總統府包括外交部都有相當的掌握那同時呢在如果目前我們沒有接到任何相關的一個通話如果有通話的話也會來跟大家來做說明這五天就川普講這兩次說要跟賴總統對話這兩中間十個五天有沒有任何的管道 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
2983.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
3000.824 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
或者有任何的這個方式來跟我們做表達說可能要做這樣的準備或者說有什麼樣的意見的傳達有沒有我想我們台美之間的關係暢通暢通無阻而且不管是美國國會不管是眾議院參議院包括這個國務院 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
3004.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3032.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
以及這個在台的機構這個AIP國安會外交部跟總統府都保持的非常大的暢通溝通相當好那而且今天早上國務院的發言人也對外發布了一個公正式的郵件也同時也跟大家來分享這個國務院的發言人同時重申美國對台的承諾持續的依舊如同40年來的堅定的立場 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3033.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3057.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
那他們也表明對台的政策不但不會改變仍然還是以台灣關係法六項保障協定跟中美三個公報來進行這樣的一個這個海海這邊的一個未來的關係的工作的指引那發言人更是說明了他講說我們期待與賴總統及我們的台灣夥伴來持續合作 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3061.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3084.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
以推進雙方共同的利益並維護台海和平穩定我想這一段國務院的發言秘書長你看我的這個簡報就是今天早上7點45國務院給我們的郵件就是提到秘書長剛剛所提的這個是最新美國國務院對台灣最新的回應他們保證我們對台的政策沒有改變然後他們 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3085.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3102.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
依然以台灣關係法 美中三公報以及六項保證為指引這個他講得非常清楚同時他還敦促北京停止對台灣施加軍事外交及經濟壓力這個是很清楚好 那這個我是不是請我們國安會這個上來 這個接下來比較詳細細節的問題細節的問題 國安會可以問來是不是先請回休息 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3111.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3127.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
身為原稿長秘書長齁剛才我這個所詢問這個我們潘秘書長的這些問題齁這個我們現在比較關心的啦齁是就是說這個川習會他只是三天的過程但是從 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3129.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3149.101 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
從川普離開北京開始在控制軍調上面發表意見接下來甚至可能一直到9月現在已經確定9月習近平要回訪華府習近平要到美國訪問中間這段時間我想川習會的三天並不是重點而是從川普離開 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3150.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3168.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
離開北京之後我想台美關係這樣子的相關議題的辯論相關的議題的這些討論我想在華府會變得非常的激烈而且會變成一個非常主要的議題在華府進行討論這個過程我們國安單位有做什麼樣的準備有做什麼樣的因應 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3169.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3185.829 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
非常謝謝委員的催訓,的確這是一個對我們台灣來講非常重要的議題美國對我們來講是一個非常重要的國家,很多人說是最重要的關係也因此我們跟美國之間的關係是要保持全面的友善的關係 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3187.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
3205.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
那不管有什麼樣的這些發言那我們跟美國的這個結構性的關係都是非常友善的那剛剛潘秘書長也講就是我們跟美國的各個層面都保持非常密切的聯絡所以在媒體上面最近我們也有看到很多的這些支持台灣的聲音 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3205.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3233.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
那我必須要跟委員強調的就是台美甚至是全世界都有一個共同的利益就是台海和平穩定那在這一方面我們跟美國的立場是一致的不只立場一致我們的利益一致利益與共啦事實上現在這些波折齁我們只要掌握一件事情就是台灣跟美國事實上在台海和平上面利益是相同的完全是相同的一點都沒有錯那這個所以我剛才會講 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3234.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3245.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
我們川普總統他在離開之後川普總統對於這個他參議會之後他對台灣議題有各種不同角度的發言那這些發言這個這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3247.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3271.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
事實上接下來馬上例如說國會美國眾議院他有就表達了眾議院的立場像這個我們剛剛看到的國務院在今天早上國務院也講得很清楚甚至聯合國秘書長他也講說這次川習會並沒有任何的重大突破但是關鍵都還是在於我講的九月習近平回訪在這過程當中尤其是現在開始 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3273.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3285.981 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
在川普總統離開北京之後在對外發表這些意見之後他勢必在華府會引起對台灣議題的一些討論一些爭辯 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3289.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3307.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
這個都是我們應該要因應的啦但是因為我們也有一個就是我們掌握住台灣跟美國其實在台海的利益上面是完全一致的國家利益是一致的所以這個是基本上可以掌握但是在這個一致的國家利益之下我們如何去在接下來這個討論裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3310.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3322.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
讓華府在美國對於台灣議題的討論的時候能夠更加理解台灣現在所碰到的困境更加理解台灣目前政府所做的努力我想這是最重要的事情對不對沒有錯完全贊成委員的意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3325.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3346.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
那除了我們台灣必須要去面對中國的擴張主義以及軍事威脅之外第一島鏈的所有國家通通都必須要去面對中國的擴張主義那在這一點上面我相信美國政府美國國會都非常的清楚那在一個利基點上面我們也會跟美國保持非常密切友好的關係好這個部分齁在 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3347.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3366.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
在因為時間的關係最後我個人提兩個建議因為我相信我們國安單位我們總統府各幕僚單位大家事實上現在大家都繃緊神經而且都是全力以赴全力以赴的在處理相關的問題但是我個人提兩個建議第一個就是說定義現在的狀況我個人認為現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
3374.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
3402.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
我們的整個這個國安團隊在對美關係上面的團隊、隊形是不是應該要做調整跟檢討在這個過程裡面我們是不是能夠更精確的表達台灣的整個在台灣整個民主化過程中台灣現在目前維持現狀所做的努力以及現在的現狀之下台灣人民主權的立場好這個我認為說我們在從現在開始在整個 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
3403.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
3422.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
對美的這個工作的團隊我認為應該可以做一個檢討跟調整因應未來更加重要的這個時機這是第一點對美團隊的這個調整第二個在這個時候我們除了在這個加強全面強化對美的工作之外 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
3423.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
3438.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
我們這個要更加的強化我們其他跟其他與台灣安全命運與共的盟邦之間的溝通透過跟我們命運與共的盟邦跟我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
3439.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
3462.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
他們對台灣的理解來影響整個來形塑整個台海局勢在未來的整個佈局我們話不能講得很白但是我的建議是這樣我是希望說我們能夠除了對美以外我們同時在這個時候更加強化與我們利益與共利益一致的這些盟邦 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
3464.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
3486.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
而且透過這些盟邦大家共同來傳達對於台海和平我們維持現狀的決心對於中國對破壞現狀的這樣子的做法我們所做的相關的因應要讓國際社會及美國了解好不好謝謝委員的指教剛剛第二點就是我們正在努力的方向那委員的看法跟我們的看法是完全一致好謝謝謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
3489.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
3494.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
好 謝謝沈發慧委員 接下來請范雲委員來做詢問謝謝昭緯 有請秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
3512.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
3526.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
今天沒有要問國安的問題剛剛給沈博洋不是沈發慧講錯了都姓沈這樣秘書長早安首先要肯定總統府在民主人權不管是展覽 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
3527.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
3547.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
記錄片這邊都做了非常的努力我們有聽到就是去看過的人都非常的肯定今天我其實有兩個題一個就是關於性別主流化另一個部分就是關於新竹縣的議員有一個關於我們的圖書館就是我們的文獻館 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
3549.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
3566.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
國史館的台灣文獻館的一個議題因為之前新竹縣的總圖因為各種收藏設備不夠好所以當時把過去的新竹縣的文化局的一批日治時期的新竹洲圖藏書贈予了台灣文獻館可是這兩年新竹縣的興建總圖已經幾乎落成 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
3574.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
3594.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
所以新竹縣的議員希望說這些書能不能夠返鄉納入他們但是我們了解過之後可能有一定的困難度所以想得到秘書長的支持是不是可以用管際交流的方式定期選送週圖書的舊集到新竹縣的總圖展示 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
3596.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
3604.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
這個謝謝委員的推詢對於文化這個文件的這些保護紙您剛剛講是他已經送給 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
3605.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
3626.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
對 送給我們的國史館 台灣文獻館那我想是不是最後這個部分謝謝委員的關心那我想對於這些文物的保存以及互相的借願大概過去有一些管理的辦法那過去如果他們有捐贈是否國史館這邊願意回贈還是用這個策展的一個交流的方式是不是我請這應該比較沒問題那我請國史館 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
3630.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
3653.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
國資管還是台資管都可以 看是黃館長還是陳館長要回應因為我想新竹縣的議員非常重視文史保存覺得他們新建的總圖現在有能力但是我知道歸還可能暫時是有困難但是我們先從管際交流圖書的這個部分交流開始可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
3654.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
3672.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
謝謝委員的指教 有關於這個議題基本上我們當初跟新竹市政府文化局跟新竹縣文化局基本上已經取得我們要相互合作進行數位化的這個協議初步有過這個共識至於說委員你剛提到的萬計合作這是沒有問題的 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
3674.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
3697.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
透過合辦展覽或借展的方式讓這些文物可以就是說彼此交流共享這樣子這個是沒有問題的因為在102年我們已經展現了第一次中央跟地方合作的一個典範那在第二次這次中央跟地方也要合作其實是沒有問題的以上回答好 太好了那我今天有一個主決議就跟著相關那謝謝秘書長支持也謝謝館長支持館長請回那再來就是回到就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
3703.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
3719.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
性別主流化的部分我也要肯定總統府我知道你們過去兩年辦理了好多的性別平等的講座包含解碼數位性別暴力然後日常生活的性別議題那還有對公務員做的一地訓練性騷擾防治及救濟等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
3723.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
3749.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
還有也有依照行政院的CEDAW計畫檢視法令及行政措施那也依照規定有設置補給乳室孕婦優先停車位改善廁所的設備等我覺得這些都值得肯定那這邊要跟秘書長說一下其實在2005年當時陳水扁總統的擔任總統的時候總統府有成立性別主流化諮詢顧問小組 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
3751.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
3778.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
我還曾經成為第一屆的顧問小組的成員不過很遺憾這個小組後來沒有繼續延續所以我今天是想問總統府除了剛剛做的這些事情之外有沒有因為我們現在五院都有做包含性別主流化的聯合國的六大推動工具不知道總統府有沒有進一步的類似的做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
3779.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
3784.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
因為我想就公務員的培訓的部分我看到的資料總統府是進行了不少 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
3786.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
3812.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
那謝謝委員對於性別議題的長期的關注與推動那尤其在推動這個性別主流化長期不但是委員過去在民主運動上包括人權運動上包括性別主流上相關的都是一個著墨在文教包括社會運動甚深的委員令人敬佩那當然在這個性別主流化的議題裡面那過去性別三法通過之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
3813.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
3839.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
各個機關團體包括公司力的所有的都應該率先來做表率那也應該率先來做把硬體的設施不足的來做修展那按照法規來那至於內部的一些委員會的組成的這個部分我們已經在遵照這個性別法的包括一些執行的細節都已經來做那至於未來是否作為一個在成立香港的一個委員會這個我們這個未來會來討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
3843.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
3857.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
那目前我們在這個性別委員會大概分別開了17場包括在每一個局處每一個單位那甚至在工作上有任何的那個都可以有相當的層數的一個部分那這個部分包括因為過去這個總統府是一個歷史建築 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
3860.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
3874.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
有一些改建或是在修繕對於友善空間甚至補給乳室甚至女性廁所等等這些都有很大的改善也已經都改善完畢那這個部分謝謝委員的詮詢那至於未來的性別主流化的部分我們何文明在督導這個A5未來我們會討論是否來遵照委員的要求來成立這樣的一個委員會這個我們會來討論好不好好 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
3888.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
3904.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
那個因為時間的緣故那我想其實後來我有得到一些資料你們其實是有性別平等小組只不過很可惜沒有放在網頁上所以我昨天晚上才看到那因為細節我並不了解那這邊可以跟秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
3906.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
3926.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
報告一下其實我們現在的行政院立法院司法院考試院監察院都有總統府因為沒有放在網站上外界就比較不了解那我想總統府可以把相關的作為等等就比照五院都能夠在網站上讓大家了解那詳細的部分我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
3927.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
3942.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
因為就是各院都有公務員的培訓我們也希望在總統府的公務員都能夠與時俱進因為這畢竟是聯合國的重點那也是我們的歷任總統都非常的重視特別是民進黨籍的總統很重視的議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
3943.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
3970.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
那我想因為時間的緣故那謝謝那個祕書長的支持喔那也希望就是能夠給我們總統府的職員更多的支持增加訓練的資源那從我們國家的政治中樞就讓大家感受到對性別平等價值的肯定好謝謝委員的推行那這個質疑的放在網站上我們會請人的諮問對馬上來做更正那這樣外界就可以有更多的了解是是是這個多了不足好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
3975.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
3979.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
好 謝謝范議員那我們接下來下一位我們請莊瑞雄莊委員上台詞詢謝謝主席有請我們總統府秘書長潘秘書長還有我們國安會吳秘書長請潘秘書長吳秘書長上台備詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4003.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4027.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
來請教兩位秘書長先請教潘秘書長我看這兩天新聞的一個熱搜裡面大家看到美國總統川普跟習近平見面以後在他的空軍預號裡面就直接講說他要跟治理台灣的人來談一談我相信外界的解讀就是要跟賴總統來講 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4031.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4052.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
我不曉得我們總統府國安會對這件事情怎麼解讀我相信這個其實也是一個一再的釋放出對於整個美中或者美台之間一個戰略性的模糊像比如說傳達出來的異議 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4055.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4066.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
站在美國的立場他也可以認為說我可以跟你談美中之間可以跟你談在台灣的議題上可以在談判桌上談但是呢我也可以跟台灣的 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4067.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4093.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
治理的台灣的總統直接來做一個對話那也就是說啊這個其實可以把它解讀成變成說對中國的一種施壓 外交上的一個施壓啦那當然站在台灣民眾的立場他也有一點擔心啦這川普的講話有些小小這個聽起來也很有藝術但是也很擔心啦就被台灣被當成一種政治上的一個籌碼那我們總統府 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4096.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4100.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
還是國安會我們剛好做沙盤的一個推演比如說阿亮 電話響起來 嘿阿真的川普打過來的比如說阿納多 川普真的電話打來之後 阿你怎麼應應 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4110.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4120.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
謝謝委員的關心我想有一部分這個至於總統打過來的電話呢這個都要有國安的部分我等一下請國安會副處長來談但我要特別強調的在台美這個兩國的關係包括川普總統所談的話包括這個國安會長期的努力跟耕耘在美國在台協會也好或是在美國所有的國會政要 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4139.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4160.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
甚至在白宮國務院都有相當的一些溝通管道暢通無阻這一點請國人放心總統也表示尤其台灣的這幾年因為全體國人包括整個國家的大家的努力之下用經濟用和善來維持整個國家的競爭力 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
4161.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
4186.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
讓台灣更是在整個未來世界的這個經濟發展以及安全的樞紐上不可或缺的一個樞紐所以基本上不會有很多可能有心人的疑慮會認為台灣會被談判掉那我想這一點大家大可放心維持這樣因為川習會談判裡面這最終有透露三個訊息第一個對台政策不變 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4187.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4192.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
第二個維持台海兩的現狀第三個軍過只跟台灣談不用跟北京談我想這一點是這樣那至於他的打電話來的設置呢我們在國安單位有一些相關的擇品我請這個秘書長來跟大家做說明電腦派來當然那個吳釗燮秘書長適合來談但有一件事情潘秘書長一定可以談啦我如果來找你 我會說欸 那個秘書長不然你也很久沒見 明天來啦我請你吃一個土雞啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4217.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4220.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
總統去 賴總統去說他如果跟習近平見面喔要請他喝珍珠奶茶就一件事 你總是可以建議嘛你可以給他寫嘛說川普總統你電話打來或是要去台灣有機會見面你要請人吃什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4232.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4255.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
這個一定可以啦 當然啦 國際禮儀 元首之間的對話有它的嚴謹性那該有的禮儀我也會做甚至我也想希望川普總統可不可以開擴音但是因為涉及到這個國家機密 這個細節還是請國安會來做處理啦那至於要喝珍珠奶茶或請他吃臭豆腐我都可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4256.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4258.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
那我接下來要請教吳釗燊秘書長 是潘秘書長就說 欸 川普這個熱線有拍到嗎其實民眾要解讀的倒也未必把他當成一個好像是比較比較輕鬆的話題其實我認為這個是非常嚴肅的尤其是 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4276.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4302.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
川普這樣丟出來突然殺出來這個變化球那其實如果我們國安團隊應付得好的話把他打成打出這個台灣跟重要的民主盟友之間更為緊密的關鍵的一個安打其實我覺得非常重要我不曉得吳秘書長你怎麼樣如何因應川普這樣的一個突然拋出來的變化球委員說得非常好 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4303.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4321.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
那我們跟美國之間的關係對我們來講非常的重要如果說這些溝通對話能夠不斷提高層級而且對於區域和平穩定能夠持續保持對話的話那這個對我們台灣來講很重要對於民主國家對印太TG來講都是非常的重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4322.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
4342.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
我想委員也了解我長期在外交單位工作外交上面就是說還沒有處理好的還沒有完全可以對外公開的這個部分我們必須要保持低調如果說有任何新的進展我們再跟社會來公開如果說我們看一看我們跟美國之間的 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
4344.187 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
4360.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
都共同關切的這個議題就是台海要和平穩定那大家共同的立場就是要維持現狀那這個也是我們的現狀這個也是我們的政策我們不卑不亢維持現狀我們要跟有盟國家維持地區的和平與穩定 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
4361.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
4380.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
潘秘書長請回我要繼續來追問我們吳秘書長的就是說我們這一次國安會裡面增加的預算推動全社會防衛的一個韌性這個我相信在司法法治委員會大家會來做一個支持但是呢其實社會大眾也會期待就是說你們這個研究案研究出來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
4381.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
4404.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
就變成說 我們太多太多的一個報告出來以後有沒有可能啊 你把它 你們的研究報告啊動作一般民眾都看有的啦 純理版的啦 甚至於民眾版的不要說研究 我們花了幾千萬 做出來只是一種研究的一個報告然後變成說 你至少讓地方 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
4405.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
4408.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
民眾看得懂得說這個SOP到底是些什麼譬如說多多的演習演習的部分不是測試民間的力量怎麼樣去把它拉進來譬如說超商 物流 電信 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
4422.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
4437.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
這個關鍵時刻 其實都是台灣的韌性的一部分所以我期待 期待的是說 真正的韌性不是跟我們的簡報 做得漂亮應該是就是說 有事情的孫 剛才有事情的孫全社會 整個社會 有沒有辦法撐得住我請秘書長簡單做回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
4440.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
4462.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
非常謝謝委員的這個垂詢的確全社會防衛任性我們在國安會已經討論了很多那不只是跟各部會之間的那個合作也跟地方政府合作也公司方面都有合作剛剛委員有提到好幾個事情都是我們目前在處理的那其中對於我們的台灣的一般的民眾的這個說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
4463.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
4480.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
最重要的一個機制就是小局書我們的小局書已經發放到全國的各家戶透過這個小局書就可以了解到說在危機來臨的時候大家如何來保護自己如何來協助別人 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
4480.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
4509.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
那另外那個全社會防衛任性方面我們也要確保有水的供應而且在危機的時候可以去哪裡取得水去哪裡取得食物那這一方面就是說我們跟一些那個全國的超商連鎖超商正在合作的一個議題那我們逐漸會透過全社會防衛委員會的這個對外的這個說明讓大家都了解到我們為台灣在未來危機的時候我們如何來保護我們自己的安全 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
4509.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
4524.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
所以這就是我必須跟你說的就是 上次我看到紀連城將軍他去下鄉然後那麼多的民眾來 喔他講得很白話甚至叫我們那種替代役的 我掛後期 唱歌 有沒有那種宣導這個意義我覺得才是重大 不然你說我們國安會開三千萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
4531.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
4546.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
他做一個研究報告出來 讓你們這個國安團隊知道知道之後 你說既然是對於社會的一個防衛任性的話這個重點是要讓民眾知道啊這個才是重點 所以我期待啊 那要繼續啦好不好 主席再發一文件 秘書長請回我請國事館陳醫生館長 抱歉喔這你來啊 這要討預算的 我也要跟你頂領一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
4557.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
4566.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
就是說我要特別來提出來的就是說 我們台灣文獻館那個三寶裡面 我剛才這個邏輯跟國安會一樣我們不要只有你們學者看有的 研究的人看有的就是說我們錢開下去之後 你現在數位化 大家看得見啦但是呢 現在重點不是說有沒有數位化 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
4578.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
4583.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
我們做這個政府開支,老百姓要讓他看有沒有,讓民眾有沒有辦法去更親近,所以我期待啦,就是說我們這個報告也都一樣,他要看我們比較白話沒有,你像譬如說你那個主題的一個策展啦,跟學校教育之間的做一個結合啦,以為你翻出來都日本的啦, |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
4600.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
4610.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
你說日本在台灣的時候那些文獻你都把它做出來 都把它數位化那你把它做出來之後不要說民眾看不到 不一定有趣味連我來看我也看不到 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
4612.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
4633.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
所以我們花了大錢以後所以我這種歷史真正的價值不是把它做出來然後把它變成它有數位化了然後就把它放在那個地方了讓民眾要去接近更親近我覺得這個就很可惜了譬如說過去日本統治台灣你那個專賣的博文這就是對台灣的影響是什麼研究出來 化毛 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
4638.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
4654.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
我覺得就很可惜了所以我們不是只有數位而已所以那個館長這樣喔預算我們也是跟你們支持但是該去做的像讓如何讓民眾更去接近他更方便去接近我覺得這個很重要我問一下館長你會不會簡單給他回應一下 來 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
4657.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
4672.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
謝謝委員的指教國使館除了修轉處之外還有採集處所以說電腦的部分也是接近民眾很重要的方式因為委員發起了關於一樓台灣歷史上的選舉為日本時代講到總統打算所以那是很淺白的 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
4680.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
4703.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
也有一些關於美麗島事件或是中紀事件的展覽的方式我們可以注意如何讓大眾可以接近、看好各個學校特別是大學生他們相關的教學活動來我們館裡的頻率也不太高所以除了數位的途徑國內外的研究者可以方便接近以外這方面我也有注意 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
4708.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
4731.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
是啦 所以我是認為說像這樣子歷史的價值應該去發揮它更大的功能國家的預算砸下去了那不要讓只有研究的人知道不要歷史只是要放在那個地方只有傳承應該讓民眾也可以更親近 更有機會不然你要做什麼 就是要讓人家看到嘛我認為這個部分應該再來加強啦 好不好好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
4747.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
4753.282 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
來 接下來請我們最專業美麗的林倩琦委員來做巡檔好 謝謝莊昭偉主席 福貴同仁大家好我先請我們總統府的秘書長請潘秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
4779.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
4801.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
本席在這邊要先針對一個其實應該也討論很久的一個問題可是本席在這邊還是要做一個提醒也就是總統在人事提名跟憲政運作的一個正常運作上的責任跟能力那麼我想最近檢察中長被提名人沒有獲得立法院的同意結果還是由同一個人來代理檢察中長 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
4801.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
4821.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
那麼會引發各界的一個懷疑那本席在這邊還是講本席對於人不是針對人而是針對這樣一個制度那麼所以呢在這樣一個結果之下呢前司法院長其實那個賴院長也公開指出被國會已經否決的人選然後再被派為代理這樣子的安排 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
4822.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
4847.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
其實對於民主的價值跟制度其實是有很大的衝擊所以依照這個法院組織法第66條的規定那麼最高檢署的這個檢察總長由總統來提名然後要經立法院同意後任命那麼檢察總長出缺或沒有辦法認識的時候總統也應該在三個月來重新提出人選並經立法院來同意任命 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
4848.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
4875.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
那麼這個制度最主要是不希望行政權來單方面做決定那每一個人或每一個制度我們可能都有一些沒有辦法真正抗衡的地方所以要由這個國會權的一個引路來做民主的一個制衡但是呢 如果被立法院來否定的人選最後仍然在以代理的方式來行使職權我想各界都會懷疑啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
4877.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
4901.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
那立法院的同意權在這個過程當中看起來有被架空那代理制度會變成繞過國會的審查這樣子一個結果其實有各界的疑慮所以本席在這邊還是請教秘書長那麼您自己認為呢在總統府指定被立法院否認的人長期來代理檢查總長那這樣的一個精神符合原先制度的一個設計嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
4902.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
4917.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
那第二個部分本席再進一步跟您詢問什麼時候那麼總統會依法院 對不起法院組織法的一個規定在期限內來提出新的檢察總長然後最重要就是說你們應該有這個能力針對這樣一個人選 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
4920.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
4932.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
透過你們的方式或者是透過憲政體制來讓這樣子一個人被各界認同我想這個應該是總統府的一個能力那所以本席在這邊請教您這兩個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
4933.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
4956.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
好 我想這兩個問題裡面分幾個層次我想這個過去的馬前總統的時候有三次的派代這樣的一個都是有群力可群第二個檢查總廠因為他握有非常上述的權力這個業務不能中斷第三個最重要是我們要尊重這個法務部固然是總統 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
4958.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
4969.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
派任經國會同意但必須由這個法務部曾請行政院送到總統府來做派任謝謝秘書長您這邊講的法務部的這個部分我想其他委員應該也有在確認過所以這個的派任究竟總統府的這個比例上比較高或者是法務部我想這個應該你們是清楚的 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
4980.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
4998.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
所以本席在這邊最重要指出兩點是這樣一個制度精神在過去您講的這個例子裡面我們對於制度精神的遵守在每一個階段是不是都符合這樣一個制度精神那我想這一個case總統府應該好好的去思考 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
4998.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
5021.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
制度權力平衡的精神跟人選還有對於各類權力平衡的一個狀態我想這是最主要的那本席針對您剛才講的這個回應其實很多人都問過了那我們也不要焦灼在這裡面所以本席在這邊還是跟您請教那總統府近期有沒有針對制度的這個時間要再提出人選的一個規劃 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
5023.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
5046.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
這個部分跟委員來做報告第一個我們會敦促法務部盡速把一些符合因為最高檢察總長他有條資格的限制他必須符合資格的人盡速送到承報院承報來扶那因為他沒有承報我們不能去交條子這點不太好 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
5047.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
5061.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
好 那意思是說我們要再去督促這個法務部啦對不對 你的意思可能是這樣好 那也希望那個總統府在這個部分也能夠積極做一個處理好不好好 那其實同樣的東西在這個司法院 憲法法庭等等都有這樣一個狀態 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
5063.064 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
5082.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
所以這個檢察組長長期代理那司法院長又長期代理那大法官缺額補不足我覺得這個部分應該執政黨要好好的來檢討那中間是不是出了哪一些實質運作的這個問題我們講最直接的溝通有效與否這個是很重要的一個關鍵 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
5084.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
5109.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
所以本席在這邊提出來這樣一個制度我們遵循制度如果我們認為這個制度是好的或者是制度裡面有哪一些缺口需要我們再去做補足跟處理的那我們也透過這些案例來去做一些修正嘛好不好所以希望總統府能夠積極認識好 那本席要接下來因為時間的這個關係就接下來問下一個問題好 那麼接下來其實是也是你們這個新聞聯繫 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5111.532 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5132.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
跟這個預算增加的這個問題那我想在總統府做這個新聞聯繫或是讓人民知道我們目前國政的一個推動是很重要的但是呢我在115年的預算裡面看到那麼在新聞發布下這個預算有增高那過去的年度在111年這個預算大概是473萬左右那麼112年那邊列了470 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5140.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5157.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
大概都在五百萬左右但是今年突然就暴增了一百多萬大概到了六百六十六萬七千元那這個增幅還蠻明顯的但是依據本席所看到的應該你們這個預算的使用應該是基本上對新聞發布還有媒體聯繫國會溝通 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5160.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5186.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
那這些都有一個重要性還有重大政策 國安議題 國際局勢的一個社會溝通是重要的但是呢為什麼在今年會跟過去幾年比較差異那麼大您這邊是不是先做個簡要的說明好 謝謝委員的關心我想作為總統府作為一定是新聞發布這個要適時也要及時那因為去年的預算被刪減了 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5187.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5214.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
那在整個這個新聞量包括這個就回補啦第一個部分第二個部分因為目前增加了一些在所謂的這種社群用LINE發布那必須有一個合約那包括現在人事的這個費用調整那大概增加的部分是在這個部分所以因為按照這個差旅的部分就增加在這個部分的一個這個支出啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5215.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5241.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
所以這整年度以整年來講除了迴編以外然後再增加的業務量其實也不大啦這個部分要麻煩我這個委員能夠協助能夠來支持好 那所以您有講到這個迴編的這個部分好 那本席這樣講本席認同在這整個新聞發布還有國會的溝通的重要性那例如說最近我想這個中美的局勢對台灣的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5243.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5269.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
衝擊影響應該是非常大的所以在你們這個國會溝通是不是也應該總統府應該要有一個安排來對國會做一個說明這樣子一個衝擊對台灣的影響是如何我想這點在國會跟全民都應該要有知的一個權利所以既然你們增加了某一些預算但是預算基本上也是有某種必要性的話但是做得如何更有效能這點是重要的 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5269.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5284.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
所以本席這樣一個提議啦所以針對目前的這個中美的關係還有這個那個川習會之後那對於台灣的這個影響那總統府應該有這樣一個來國會說明的必要所以本席在這邊也做一個建議跟提醒 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5285.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5309.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
好 謝謝 這個部分我們隨時會發布新聞 而且對外做說明好 那最後一個也是針對你們在諮詢業務的這個部分剛才我們那個召委其實也提到 我想你們也做了一些研究那這些研究如何讓更多的人了解跟認識 這點是重要的所以你們在這今年的年度 在諮詢研究的業務上較上個年度也增加了一千多萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5310.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5339.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
一千三百二十五萬九千元那裡面的那個內容大概是針對這個非傳統安全議題諮詢研究的一些出國費用那國防安全非傳統安全區域情勢跟國際交流這個都有它研究的必要性但是呢在針對超過了一千三百多萬的這樣一個預算只有一句話蓋瓜那沒有很具體的主題的研究還有你們要參加哪一些會議那這樣子是不是有一些相關的資料或是不知道您這邊知不知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5340.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
5354.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
究竟增加這些預算你們要做的一個方向跟阻止呢好謝謝委員的詮釋我想這個我們總統府比較沒有出國這個國安會的需求比較大那國安會人家必須跑全球那這個部分我請國安會秘書長來做說明好嗎好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
5358.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
5374.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
非常謝謝林委員的確我們國安會今年有增列了那個一千多萬的那個出國的這個費用研究然後出國的費用研究出國的費用那如果說看看我們接受到邀約的這個狀況增加了七成 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
5374.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
5396.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
那是因為我們台灣在國際社會上面的這個地位或者是重要性增加了那這些都是很重要的會議那另外就是說看到那個旅費機票費用住宿費用等等都增加兩成三成所以在這一方面如果說依照舊的這種預算的編列的話是不夠的那在去年我們也有幾個會議就是因為我們經費不夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
5397.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
5415.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
所以需要去動用預備金那也有好幾個重要的會議我們沒有辦法參加所以在這邊要拜託委員就是讓我們國安會能夠有充足的這種跟其他國家進行國安交流的機會來確保我們台灣的國家安全受到國際社會的重視 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
5416.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
5445.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
好的那秘書長如果照您這樣講基本上你們應該在去年的經驗上你說有缺的這個部分應該有一些會議或者是應該也有一些結果或者是你們今年的預期應該有比較具體吧那您是不是應該把這個相關的資料提供給本席參考就像本席剛才講的那究竟去年你們是哪一些會議平台或者是相關的事項經費是不夠的那在去年的基礎上我想你們今年的計畫應該也有在過去的基礎上嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
5446.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
5463.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
有一些是繼續連結的或者是今年有一些新的可能性那這個你們應該有一些預期吧你們不會沒有預期或是過去的一個結果到底要不要持續那這個部分應該是有吧那這個相關的資料是不是要讓我們可以了解要不然我們只看到你們這樣一句話也很難去確認來評論你們這樣一個需求的一個必要性 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
5470.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
5492.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
委員說得非常好那第一件事情就是說我們會後會來跟委員做報告那第二個就是說我們國安相關的這種外交的這些項目國安交流國安外交等等的那通常都是在機密的狀況之下所以讓社會大眾來了解並不是對我們國家利益最好的 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
5492.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
5510.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
對 但是對於那個立法院的這個了解應該是必要的吧要不然我們也不能蒙著頭就給預算嘛 對不對對 所以我們私下會來跟委員報告那我這邊也說到就是說那相關資料也請你們也要帶來就是也是要讓我們有比較具體的一個文字資料的了解 好不好好 謝謝謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
5512.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
5520.981 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
最後,很短的一段時間,因為莊委剛才提到,非常感謝國史館,國史館是不是可以先請館長,還有文獻館的館長。當然,專委人叫貢鬼,展示還有一些研究或者是成果,國史館這邊都會依照你們的一個標準來做。 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
5537.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
5557.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
剛才趙偉這邊講到針對我們的憲政或者是民主的會議的制度你們這邊有做一些了解本席之前也有參與過國史館的一些著作的評審所以在剛才趙偉這邊所講的內容當中本席這邊想要做一個提醒 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
5558.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
5577.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
雖然你們是從歷史時期做了一個記錄但是不要忘記我們南島語族其實在過去部落的一個組織上部落的制度上其實也有相對民主跟共同決定的一些機制那或許不像歷史時期的文字記錄一樣但是我想國史館應該也 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
5578.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
5606.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
可以有這樣子的一個規劃來做這方面的一個歷史的搜羅或許我們可以從這裡面南島語族在台灣的整個部落的制度還有部落的這個會議或者是部落的運作的一個形態找到一些新的可能性也說不定所以我這邊提供給這個國史館這樣一個概念那不要把南島語族給忘記了好 謝謝好 謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
5609.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
5624.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
你是叫他 為什麼又變成這樣 你要跟他支持就對了好 謝謝 謝謝林倩琪 林委員接下來請翁曉琳 趙薇來做詢答好 謝謝主席有請潘秘書長 請潘秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
5643.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
5662.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
秘書長早安我想我們這邊因為這幾天的話題跟川習會有關還有跟賴清德總統昨天就職兩週年有關所以我這邊有幾個問題我想要請教秘書長首先我們先來看一段畫面好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
5663.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
5679.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
现在我们和中国做得很好的我们有很好的关系我们真的有很好的友谊他是一个很厉害的领导他在这里很久了非常强壮非常强壮没有任何疑问我们的关系很好 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
5681.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
5698.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
好因為剛剛的這個聲音比較小我不曉得秘書長有沒有聽到那麼簡單來說呢就是其實川普在川習會之前跟之後其實接受媒體詢問的時候都有講到就是他與習近平的關係很好是好朋友那也認為說中美兩國其實他們這個維持一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
5702.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
5723.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
不错的一个友谊的状况那么甚至呢他刚在影片里面还说他还称习近平是一个tremendous leader一个了不起的领导人猛夸习近平啊所以我自己想请教秘书长就是您是否同意川普的话他对于尤其是川普对于习近平的评价 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
5725.911 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
5753.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
謝謝委員的垂詢我想作為G2兩個世界超級大國大概彼此的外交的公為這個必然的一個禮貌那我想是不是他內心裡面怎麼樣想法我不知道但是他講出了這一句話我想是一個外交的公為那因為他既然如果他是那麼偉大但他不給他任何的承諾就是說對台灣的部分他川普也同時後面就講了這一句話 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
5755.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
5774.454 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
好 剛剛講到承諾的問題其實川普其實在後續的影片的訪問裡面他有講到就是說有關於就是台灣軍購的問題台灣軍售的問題那他有特別提出說這個未來美國會不會給台灣軍售就是It depends on China就是說這是要看大陸的這個態度 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
5776.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
5796.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
取決於中國大陸所以外界現在很擔心說那麼台灣是不是可能會淪為大國交易的菜單所以請問民進黨政府因為我們知道在過去這段時間我們看到民進黨政府執政十年高度依賴美國的軍售而且不斷擴大對美軍售的規模 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
5799.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
5825.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
那像這種找敵人的麻吉來當保鏢或是我們講的更簡單就是把台灣的安全交給敵人的朋友圈的這種做法到底合不合適啊我們花那麼多錢向美國買了軍購結果美國說我們的目的是為了怕中國大陸可能來威脅來攻擊我們結果現在美國反而說是這個到底要不要軍購的事情我還要跟我的朋友討論討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
5827.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
5847.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
這個委員 我認為這個邏輯難道要跟中國買嗎這個要跟中國軍購 因為中國一直在威脅我們你不是把他當成敵人嗎我現在意思是講說就是民進黨的國防政策尤其在對於所謂的軍購軍售政策的方面你們都沒有思考 你們都沒有一個更好 與時俱進的判斷嗎中美的關係在改變 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
5853.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
5869.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
然後你可以看到這次川普去了中國大陸之後跟習近平見面他在之前之後的這個訪問基本上就是真的就把台灣當成是他們未來兩國談判的一個籌碼 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
5871.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
5886.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
這是不真的事實其實國內國外的政治評論專項也都是這麼看法但是昨天賴清德總統在他的就職典禮裡面還又在講我們還要再提高國防預算還要再提新的特別條例 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
5887.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
5892.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
現在的問題就是說我們要只要我們要把所有的籌碼都堵在美國嗎這個委員就是因為中國持續的這個騷擾不斷我們才更應該去保自我保衛你總不能說有一個流氓隨時來這邊跟你騷擾我買個監控器我買個反制的東西那我們有錯 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
5913.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
5935.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
這一點是不對的 第二個中美關係未必有改善台美關係我想要重申 我的意思是台灣自我防衛是需要的只是說我現在是認為總統府還有我們的國安會乃至於我們的整個國家國防政策不需要再去進行一個與時俱進的檢討嗎在整個的方向上面有沒有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
5937.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
5953.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
絕對沒問題台灣隨時在檢討也隨時在面對地緣政治國際情勢的改變不管是對歐洲似乎也不了解現在國際局勢的發展你看世界各國的領導人都要去 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
5954.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
5970.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
這個中國大陸參訪去跟習近平見面只有我們台灣動不動就是要跟大陸這個對抗對立然後把和平放在兩邊我想這個議題我們就談到這邊因為我希望民進黨政府可以好好的再去思考你們現在新的國防的策略好 那接下來我要問的就是說賴清德總統呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
5983.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
6008.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
昨天他就職兩周年的時候他其實在他談話一開始就說的就說這個兩年前的今天我在總統府宣誓向全體國人承諾我備定遵守憲法盡忠職務增進人民福利保衛國家不負國民託付兩年來這份誓言沒有一天離開我的心中這份責任也沒有一刻因為挑戰艱難而有所逃避我看到這個賴總統這段話 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
6011.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
6016.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
我真的覺得挺諷刺的邁進德總統講這些話難道不覺得心虛嗎他說他要遵守憲法盡忠職務總統的憲法義務是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
6026.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
6050.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
很清楚他必須要在這個一縣要公佈立法院三讀通過的法律可是我們看看現在有五項立法院三讀通過的法律至今未公佈而這些法律基本上都影響到我們民眾的權益 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
6052.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
6080.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
不管是老舊眷村的這個改進條例財政收視劃分法影響還有廣電業者的權益立法院助理的權利等等 那麼為什麼我們的總統竟然可以違憲不公布法律這個全世界也沒有哪個國家裡的總統是不公布國會所通過的法律啊總統 這個委員妳可能弄錯了是 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
6083.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
6092.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
總統經過立法院要送到總統府的三讀決議文總統依法送到行政院去附屬行政院也是一個憲法機關立法院也是一個憲法機關總統府更是憲法機關絕對是尊守憲法我認為賴清德總統我們總統府不要把這個責任推到卓榮泰的身上 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
6107.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
6113.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
卓榮泰就是總統所任命的行政院院長如果今天賴清德總統他不認同行政院院長卓榮泰的做法麻煩請聽我說完秘書長 麻煩請聽我說完我現在要講的是我都聽你講那麼久了你讓我講一下是我會讓你有講的時間但是請你不要講不要這個搶我的話好不好好 謝謝我現在要說的是 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
6137.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
6159.895 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
卓榮泰院長是賴清德總統任命的行政院院長如果說賴清德總統今天不認同卓榮泰的做法他可以把卓榮泰換掉那麼在現在的狀況之下看起來就是我們賴清德總統他授意支持卓榮泰的做法這不就是個違憲的作為嗎不會 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
6162.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
6180.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
好,這是你說的不會,總統府說的不會,賴記者說的不會,但是我要講的是說,全世界也沒有哪個國家的總統是敢不公佈國會的法律。就算是有這樣的一個狀況,也不會是一個總統在短時間裡面,兩年之內他五部法律都不通過。 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
6181.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
6200.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
這個是非常非常嚴重違憲亂成的情況委員 你們通過的法律多少案子已經被判為違憲了總不能國會任意的自大到把什麼的法案通過之後而且對於一個自愛男性的法案總統要叫公佈總統包括集政院不是橡皮圖章啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
6205.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
6210.895 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
這是由總統去決定 總統不是憲法法庭總統不是大法官 他沒有權力可以去宣告自己做決定說哪一個法律是違憲這是有認為賴清德總統他違反的第一個憲法義務第二個憲法義務就是到現在為止 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
6226.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
6250.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
大法官已經缺額一年半賴清德總統不提名就不提名縱使他之前曾經提過兩次的名單那麼立法院審議不通過但是他還是應該要基於憲法中層憲法義務他必須要再提名大法官但是沒有啊他現在就一直這個好像這個很受益就是讓這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
6253.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
6260.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
謝明陽大法官持續的代理院長是要持續代理到他們這一任這七個大法官全部卸任嗎委員我認為我們的憲法送了兩次的十四位大法官被貴院否決了你說還要再送嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
6274.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
6291.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
兩次的獨內所有法制的菁英14位法制菁英被你們這樣一一的否決了我要講的是依照憲法的規定賴清德總統就應該要持續提名大法官人選我相信我們台灣的法學界絕對不止 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
6294.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
6304.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
台灣的法學精英現在是為什麼賴清德總統在我們的法界找不到適合的人才我認為這是一個很嚴重的問題好那接下來還有第三個問題好第三個問題不好意思可以請昭偉再給我一些時間第三個問題喔賴清德總統昨天在就職發言裡面也說他要向國軍 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
6319.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
6338.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
弟兄姊妹們表達最高的敬意身為三軍統帥他會繼續做國軍最堅定的後盾讓國軍有更好的裝備更好的訓練更好的照顧也讓軍人受到社會應有的尊敬講這句話我也認為其實真的是非常的諷刺 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
6340.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
6358.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
到現在為止給軍人加幾三萬元的這件事情賴清德總統行政院到目前為止都沒有編列我們立法院三讀通過要給退伍軍人所有退伍軍人的子女子女教育補助費到現在為止也沒有編列 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
6360.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
6375.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
今天我要講的就是說賴清德總統愛護國軍不要口惠而食不至該給的就要給更何況這是我們立法院三讀通過的法律全民都支持為什麼要卡在總統府 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
6377.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
6401.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
昨天還有個新聞 我覺得也是希望總統還有我們國安會要警覺的因為我們目前國防部的支通電的軍官出現大批的退伍潮這代表什麼 代表我們的國軍弟兄們已經開始對我們國家沒有信心了以後找不到軍人了 買了再好的武器也沒有辦法 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
6402.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
6423.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
來做國防的防衛所以這個部分是我要提醒總統府的第四個問題 對不起還有一個第四個問題就是有關於外交困境這次總統出訪史瓦帝尼坦白說我基本上是看到這個賴清德總統沒有辦法搭乘自己的總統專機而必須要搭乘 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
6424.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
6430.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
這個石瓦帝尼的國安專機出訪我內心其實是挺不捨的雖然說賴清德總統一些作為我不能認同可是呢在這件事情上面我認為我們的總統府跟我們的國安會是之前都沒有考慮清楚相關的這個影響嗎我現在要問的一個問題是有關於我們的總統沒有辦法搭乘自己的總統專機 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
6447.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
6454.829 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
去搭了別的國家的元首國王的專機那在街上的委安呢總統的委安是怎麼維持 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
6457.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
6466.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
我可以回答囉嗎可以請總共你幾個問題蔡總統總統都加起來沒有我想你就是專注在我們最後一個問題你剛剛講說總統違憲總統對軍人不加薪這根本不是事實啊我足以你有三四個問題我足以來跟你回答啊就是你說軍人不加薪總統跟蔡總統這四年來幫了加了次次薪在賴清德總統我不是指那 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
6482.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
6485.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
然後27次的戰鬥加急翁委員這是你的認知因為你不分軍種不分階等然後全面的儀式性的 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
6499.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
6501.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
這個就是我們國會的立法政策這個就是我們國會的立法政策甚至當時聯名戰委員也都支持所以在釋憲嘛第一個我要講說這個荒唐荒謬的事情連長領的比營長多所以你們這個齊投資的叫假平等 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
6517.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
6521.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
這不是在關心軍人這已經在加 已經送到 部長您聽見這樣的說法我跟你說會更傷我們國軍弟兄的心錯錯錯我絕對同意賴清德總統在我們立法院給的軍人加緊三萬元以上你要再加十萬再加十五萬我都同意你加一百萬我都沒意見是那為什麼你不執行 但不是這樣的做法嘛為什麼你不是執行重要是說我們現在立法院通過這三萬元謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
6542.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
6550.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
你根本是在糊弄 你根本在模糊焦點我要講的是 趙薇請我解釋一下她問了四五個問題 因為我沒有回答好像是她講的是對的 那就請秘書長先回座不用嘛 因為嘉興 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
6557.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
6560.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
總統國安部再研擬一套那至於釋憲結果如何總統府秦政院會遵照釋憲結果不是提頭式的也不是這種等級式的這完全不是在為今年著想第二個總統出訪有一定的嚴謹的規劃這一點謝謝委員的關心推行謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
6577.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
6590.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
好 謝謝潘秘書長也謝謝翁小玲 趙薇因為我們下午還有很多時間可以跟秘書長來做一個對話因為我本來是要問有關於國安會借調的問題可能很快兩分鐘好嗎沒關係 我已經給你一半的時間了 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
6593.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
6612.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
我對我們最美麗大方的昭偉是最尊敬的這個昭偉基本上因為你也知道潘秘書長搶我話佔了我很多時間啦所以呢我本來還有一個重要的問題可以啦你們兩個的對話是今天我們本委員會最精彩的一部分啦好不好謝謝翁小玲昭偉那接下來請鄭正全委員來做詢問鄭正全鄭正全委員不低耶張雅玲委員來做詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
6629.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
6630.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
好 謝謝主席 我們有請秘書長請潘秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
6641.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
6665.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
好 那在開始之前呢 我想我先 我剛剛在樓下我剛剛在下面有聽到一些但我想也給秘書長幾個一些充分解釋的時間啦就是剛剛翁委員有特別提到就是說總統一直都不提大法官嘛但是我們也可以看到其實總統一直很認真的在處理這件事情但是一直到立法院就被否決嘛 對不對所以我想我們認知到的都是這個共同的事實其實應該是這樣那第二個問題是說呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
6667.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
6677.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
郭文貴議員也關心了就是說為什麼我們不幫軍人加薪那剛剛我聽到秘書長其實是想要完整的回答那是不是可以請秘書長簡單的回答這一個問題好謝謝委員也謝謝委員讓我做一個充分的表達避免這個以訛傳耳被斷章取義甚至以挖皆木那我想總統跟國防部長行政院長都一樣都是軍人是自己的弟兄他們很辛苦的所謂在前線 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
6693.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
6721.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
或是後勤單位每一個人職司其職的扮演很重要的工作保家衛國讓我們可以在這邊安居樂業那所以總統上任以來就已經在調整所有各軍種各軍種因為他的戰鬥部隊離島偏鄉都不一樣所以必須是有系統性的去區分來怎麼樣調整戰鬥加急把它加薪那如果說像齊頭市的以目前現在現況 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
6723.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
6742.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
就已經有排長比營長領的還要多那因為這個是制度上如果是這樣齊頭式我們應該是這種所謂的國安部已經在做的已經加了27次的戰鬥加急以外4次加薪以外那這個部分會再調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
6743.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
6760.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
就針對他的特殊的軍種陸海空不一樣那包括他的服務的單位離島外島第一線等等這些人應該是全盤來講而不是齊頭市齊頭市變成這個大現在二等兵一進去就十萬多然後 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
6761.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
6782.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
到時候一加的時候7萬多這個部分不是不跟他加薪是怎麼樣通盤的檢討而不是說扣帽子你不跟他加薪這完全不是這樣所以國安部在全盤檢討而且已經有確實在加薪包括最近的目前從蔡英文總統到現在賴清德總統這10年來整個銀色的改善 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
6785.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
6802.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
不管是他們已經花了一千多億這個都必要的讓他們有一個舒適的環境包括演練設備等等包括國軍的裝備或是武器等等我想這些都要與時俱進那這個部分是整體的國防戰略的考量不是說一次扣帽子對軍人這個不友善我講這一點這個是要嚴正的表達 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
6808.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
6834.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
我想剛剛秘書長講得非常非常的清楚就是說其實我們是一直非常非常照顧我們國軍兄弟的那特別是說在加薪的制度上面除了過去有加薪而且我們還有一個穩定的制度在討論這件事情我覺得這其實對國軍來說是非常非常重要特別是我認為如果藍白真的非常非常在乎我們國軍的安全的話那這些國防預算呢就不應該隨便亂刪啦因為這才是最重要保護我們國軍弟兄生命 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
6834.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
6851.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
這是至關重要的一件事情而且這會影響到他們整個家庭所以我想這件事情剛剛秘書長也講得非常清楚那第二個問題呢剛剛其實翁小林委員也有提到就是說為什麼我們的總統是從搭別人的專機回來我們這個外交混勁剛剛他也有一些提問那剛剛他沒有給秘書長時間所以我也給秘書長一些簡單的時間來回應來以正視聽 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
6856.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
6871.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
我想我們過去已經對外正式要出訪前正式對外發布要搭乘航的這個專機那出訪前大概都做了很多的規劃當然也知道很多的變數那國安會這邊做了縝密的安排維安為什麼會臨時 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
6874.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
6896.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
這個暫緩出訪就是因為以總統安全為考量國家尊嚴整個飛航的安全這三大原則是我們在出訪必須要去兼顧的所以國安會經過整命的規劃評估那我們會去做一部分的有些A案B案C案的一個備案的相關的做法那基於這樣的安全因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
6897.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
6919.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
中國的阻撓我們已經大家都很清楚臨時在把這個飛航的這種情報區這是全世界從來沒有過的所以我們只能採取ATA的方式就是到達之後再公布那這個這是我們國安會的零核這是我們外交單位尤其國安單位全程掌握的零核 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
6920.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
6926.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
所以總統決定之後我們就這個做幕僚座位我想這一點還是要謝謝國安單位相當的這十萬時間從這個出訪前到回訪之後整個相關落地相關的安排這絕對不是說去搭別人專機這個是在整個 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
6939.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
6940.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
在國際的這種中國這種極端打壓而且整個把這些用這些外交的力量經濟壓榨的力量去逼迫這些小國去改變這樣的一個非常的我想這一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
6955.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
6972.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
歐洲歐盟國家也好美國也好全世界也好都已經針對這樣的一個在做IQ的一個要求的檢討不能把國際的行權變成一個智能的一個政治工具我想這一點是也因為這樣凸顯了全世界大家的重視 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
6972.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
6988.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
對 我想其實台灣的外交處境非常非常的艱難每一次的突破其實都需要值得所有國人跟所有委員們的肯定才對那我想藍白如果真的這麼在乎我們的外交困境你就不要亂刪我們的外交的預算啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
6989.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
7001.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
那特別是說我們一直都非常全世界都非常的清楚的知道中國的對於區域為安全的一個威脅所以是非常需要增加我們的相關的國防預算其實最重要要譴責的人其實應該是中國 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
7004.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
7030.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
可是每一次對面對中國的時候呢藍白完全不敢說一句話我認為如果真的是在乎台灣在乎台灣人的安全其實最要譴責的就是中國所以接下來我就想要來請教有關於我們這個川普的發言就是他也有提到我們的這個他就是他很快的就決定這個總額約140億的這個美元的對台軍售但是他也有說他可能會批准可能不會批准 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
7032 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
7052.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
所以我想說這個其實在下一波的140億美元的軍售是否能夠順利的推進其實已經是成為一個非常重要的觀察指標所以我想要請教就是說對於這個140億美元的軍售案延宕分批降規被抽換項目甚至被附加政治條件總統府有沒有一個具體的方案跟因應的做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
7053.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
7074.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
謝謝委員的垂行我想這個部分都是很多的各界的揣測因為川習會進行當中川普也在當場拒絕習近平他自己也對外講習近平的要求對台軍售他不跟他談他也沒有給任何的承諾所以川習會之後證明了三點台海 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
7075.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
7090.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
維持現狀對台的政策不變第三 軍構只跟台灣談所以基本上我們樂觀而且也不會很大的變數因為美國的參議院 眾議院包括軍事外交委員會的主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
7090.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
7115.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
跨黨派共和黨民主黨而且符合美國的目前的整個第一島鏈2025年的國家戰略裡面宰明的很清楚第一島鏈的協防是美國的利益也是第一島鏈各國的區域的聯訪所以在當整個區域聯訪行說這些必要的自我防衛的武器反制的武器是必要的所以你看這個韓國在今年的南韓的總預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
7120.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
7129.728 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
增加了到整個軍購的部分這個國防預算增加到1.4兆今年度喔日本增加到2.2兆台幣台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
7132.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
7155.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
還沒到連菲律賓連續三年菲律賓連續三年都是二字頭的這樣的總預算的增加額度但台灣還在原地踏步但好不容易我們有個整個總體的整個國防政策的從整個台灣之盾到整個陸海公垂直整個AI指管系統很遺憾的這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
7156.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
7159.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
經過一部分7800億的這樣的一個這個還要每一年來報告所以這個部分設了很多條件讓我們在整個經過上很不順但針對未來的這一筆140億美元的這個都已經國會都通過了那我想國會已經國會議長已經講了希望這個川普總統進出批准我想這一點我們在樂觀而且也不會應該不會有什麼變數 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
7186.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
7211.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
那接下來我想要先肯定一件事情就是昨天賴總統在520的談話裡面就有講到一個家庭支持的一個方案就是從過去的我們可能是生育補助的單次補助變成一個系統性的長期的支持一個津貼的概念那我自己從這個家庭的就從兒少的專業來講的話我其實是非常肯定因為等於過去我們是因為你有生小孩所以我給你補助到變成是我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
7212.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
7235.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
國家真的是跟家庭們站在一起承擔了一個國家的共同責任家庭養育的共同責任所以這點我要高度給予肯定那接下來我也想要詢問就是關於兒少友善的部分我們還有沒有辦法再更進一步就是說其實像我們在今年呢就是有辦開放兒童總統府啦針對於兒少的部分我們其實有一些的活動那我認為其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
7236.996 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
7256.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
當天我也有去 那其實評價非常非常好家長非常非常喜歡 甚至有些活動都秒殺所以我只是在想說我們是不是有可能再做一個更積極的做法就是說我們有兒童友善的導覽或者是說我們有一些像這是美國白宮的書 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
7257.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
7281.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
他就是用插畫的方式來讓兒童更了解我們的總統府那我認為這也是一個深化民主教育非常重要的方式那同時呢除了兒童導覽之外他們也有做一些線上的總統府的一個介紹啦日本也有類似總督府的一個介紹的概念所以我只是也想請教說我們有沒有可能在這一點呢用更兒少友善一點想請教秘書長的意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
7281.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
7295.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
好 謝謝 委員長期在關注兒少包括很多的一些婦女的權益那這一點特別謝謝委員長期在這個公共議題社會議題的一個關注跟投入 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
7296.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
7320.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
也謝謝委員的這個部分的提醒那我想在這個總統府兒少版的這個轉型的方向這個來讓我們參考因為總統府它本身是一個歷史建築有很多的這個動線上很多的設限在我們盡可能來達到最友善的空間那給婦女兒少甚至身障者的一些友善空間那至於未來的這個兒少的導覽 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
7322.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
7323.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
我們來強化在整個導覽系統那因為我們這一年去年因為整個總統府的預算被刪了那包括我們原來這個兒童節有一個非常大的活動也因為這樣取消了這實在是很可惜 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
7337.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
7341.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
那今年的兒童節也沒辦法因為預算還沒過所以我們整個本來今年度給兒童的最好的一個禮物但這個很可惜預算還沒過 今年沒辦法執行去年預算被刪了也沒辦法執行所以我們本來這個部分本來最大的 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
7355.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
7363.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
這個檢視啦所以這一次拜託委員能夠多支持我們本年度的預算那至於未來的這個兒少的導覽的一個方案我們會來做調整在整個導覽解說裡面怎麼樣對兒少兒童有更好的友善空間包括導覽的語音或這個志工這個部分我們會做加入 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
7377.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
7393.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
那最後一個我快快問一下 就是說剛剛其實MISO有提到預算被刪減因為據我所知原本那個活動其實規模非常非常龐大而且是綜合了很多民間的力量一起來去支持讓總統府跟兒少友善而是因為預算的刪減也讓這些活動沒有辦法舉行 那我想問 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
7396.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
7411.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
就是說因為玉山的大比三節特別是業務費的部分到底有沒有哪些其實已經嚴重的影響我們在不管是跟國際的一些交流啊接軌啦或者是說對於我們的國家最高政治機關的尊嚴而受到影響是不是可以簡單回應一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
7413.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
7436.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
當然預算悲傷這個坦白講總統府這個年度預算不多啦去年度大概10億今年變成10億那因為本身有很多歷史件大概有七成是佔在人事費用六七成那大概業務跟一般的行政支出大概只在三四成裡面那所以坦白講那這四成裡面你還要去做這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
7437.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
7459.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
管社的發包工程維修常常隨時因為歷史建築那甚至業務費很少能夠動用到的業務費真的很少那所以我特別謝謝我們同仁包括總統府的很多內外的一些同仁很辛苦他們出差或怎麼樣預算被刪之後大家尊爵一開始尤其去年那總統府因為整個水電的這個預算被刪被動之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
7463.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
7476.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
我們去年也因為這樣讓我們熱井褲袋有很多不方便他們那個引硬 碳粉都要登記一支碳粉用多久而且都有很大的一個限制那當然也讓我們去年一整年節電25萬度 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
7479.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
7495.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
大概25萬度讓這個店的部分就已經結下來但是因為很多的老舊還是要更換所以還是這樣啦總歸一句話我們預算不多但是還是希望委員能夠高抬貴手能夠來協助支持讓我們預算通過 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
7495.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
7524.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
了解 我想就是說因為去年我帶了一些鄉親去總統府他們都有感覺到非常非常的熱就是因為節電的關係所以我希望大家在審查預算的時候還是要考量就是說在預算春節開車之外人權舒適度還是要顧及不要讓我們包含去參觀的鄉親很多都六七十歲了實在是有點受不了這樣子希望委員們高抬貴手 謝謝好 謝謝文好 謝謝張雅玲委員的詢答接下來請洪孟凱委員來做詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
7533.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
7536.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
好主席謝謝麻煩請潘秘書長跟我們吳釗燮吳秘書長請潘秘書長吳釗燮秘書長好潘秘書長吳秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
7547.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
7565.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
身為中華民國國民身為中華民國立法委員我們執政在野都是一個信念都是要捍衛中華民國都是要守護台灣2350萬人的立場也因此不管是這個所謂的特別軍購我們也認為跟美國政府能夠有發架書的話一定 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
7565.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
7585.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
跟美國政府好好的來溝通因此我們也在上上禮拜通過七千八百億的特別軍購這是支持中華民國國防的堅實力量所以我想我再一次就事論事希望說秘書長希望說這個我們很多的朝野委員說實在的話執政黨委員你要怎麼樣發言是你的 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
7586.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
7613.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
自由但是刻意用質詢時間來唱賀我覺得這也一昧的又在攻擊在野黨我覺得這也不是好事但秘書長今天我還是想要就事論事我想先請教這兩天以來剛好就媒體美國總統川普也有兩度公開提到可能會跟我們台灣的總統來去做一個討論通話那目前有沒有在進行我相信應該都有在進行是不是來 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
7615.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
7641.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
謝謝委員的關心啦那我想這個從川普總統在上飛機以前到昨天晚上又有這樣的對外公開發布那我想我們這邊都隨時跟這邊的保持聯絡但因為有時差12個小時那看他怎麼說我這個AIT或是跟我們國安會總統府這邊大概都保持密切的聯繫怎麼來進行至於目前我們還沒有接到任何電話 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
7642.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
7665.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
還沒有接到 您指的是還沒有接到美方任何電話還沒有接到川普總統的電話或是有相關的那個我相信如果接到的話應該就是大新聞了來 那個吳秘書長因為本席也看到就是說很多的媒體或說我們當然會想到就是八年前 可能九年前就美國總統川普當時上任 當選 但還沒有就任當時有跟我們蔡英文總統來做對話 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
7667.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
7680.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
而本席也看到很多的一些新聞報導都講說當時時任國安會秘書長的吳釗燮是幕後的推手最後想請教一下到目前為止有沒有進一步在這一次也會由您這邊也有大力促成嗎謝謝委員剛剛的垂詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
7683.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
7706.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
那有關於這個事情的確是台美之間的一個重要的項目我們會認真的看待那我們也會保持密切的關注那至於說這個事情我還沒有任何相關的這個訊息可以跟委員來做說明那如果事情比較成熟的時候再跟委員說明好來那我請教一下兩位秘書長的態度喔因為我覺得這個態度很重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
7707.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
7733.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
我們雖然美國現在可能全世界國力最強第一名中國大陸可能第二名這可能是世界大家公認但是中華民國的主權立場不能被矮化我相信我們對外任何國家也都一樣保持所以我想請教美國總統川普他接受媒體訪問的時候講到說他會來解決台灣問題他的原話是什麼We will work on that, the Taiwan problem好 我請教兩位秘書長 台灣是個問題嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
7736.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
7747.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
不是 來對麥克風講台灣不是問題台灣不是問題所以如果說是沒錯就是這樣子所以說川普總統說要解決台灣問題那要解決什麼問題那川普總統在上面你覺得川普總統講這句話是對的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
7755.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
7774.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
我想這個都是簡略的語意他對我原文已經幫你講出來了我現在講是說因為我們現在一致對話我們都是中華民國國民也因此當其他國家的元首講到說他要來work on Taiwan problem的時候那我想請教什麼是台灣problem |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
7775.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
7801.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
台灣就是最重要兩岸維持現狀這是川普的一個最重要的原則也是美國最重要的原則也是我們台灣目前最希望的狀態就是兩岸這個維持現狀這個就是在所謂的台海的議題所以你們會建議如果說賴清德總統真的有機會跟川普總統談到話的時候會跟他證告講是說這不是台灣問題嗎當然 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
7803.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
7818.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
當然從來台灣台海議題中來不是台灣去創造的好來吳秘書長你會因為上一次陪同上一次在通話的時候你有陪同嗎你會給這一次我不知道會不會陪同啊你會給賴清德總統什麼樣的國安建議 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
7820.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
7848.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
有關於這件事情賴總統已經對外有所說明就是說我們台灣所以賴總統建議之前是你有跟他提供相關建議嗎這方面我就不適合來跟委員講但是賴總統已經講得非常的清楚就是說我們台灣的政策立場就是不卑不亢維持現狀那台灣不是問題製造問題的絕對不會是台灣那中國在第一島鏈製造各式各樣的問題中國才是問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
7849.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
7869.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
來那個潘邦泰秘書長最後啊本席還是要強調一件事啊很多人也都講到說美國總統川普他至少講一句話是我們中華民國國民沒有辦法接受台灣人民沒有辦法接受就是美國總統川普不只講了一次台積電偷走了台灣偷走了晶片半導體 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
7871.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
7887.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
到目前為止沒有看到政府相關有針對這件事情有任何的嚴正抗議發言或是要求美國總統能夠正視歷史的事實這是事實嗎台灣有偷走半導體偷走晶片嗎台灣絕對台積電絕對沒有偷走它的半導體 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
7893.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
7917.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
他們的意思 我想第一個台灣政府已經有正式對外講而且因為沒有看到總統府 上至總統府 行政院各個階層的人都沒有而這一句話 你如果說再看一下現在的新聞這是賴清德總統最相信的這個甚至可以奉為上賓國師之一去年大惡霸的時候主要幕後推手曹新成講的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
7919.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
7943.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
曹新城他現在還公開點名說政府嚴重失職連國際記者會都沒開那所以本席身為在野黨委員我們政治立場可能不一樣但是對於國外我們應該有一致的說法而如果美國總統川普一而再再而再用這種扭曲的話根本不是事實的話你會建議賴清德總統在跟他談話的時候也請美國總統川普來更正嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
7945.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
7970.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
這個謝謝委員我想政黨立場可以不一樣但國家的利益是要一樣的所以美國總統川普講說台灣偷走半導體這是事實嗎這當然不是事實那是不是要請賴金德總統如果假設有機會通道話的話也要請美國總統川普來更正他的話當然當然我們要講事實不是去跟這個這一句話我修正一下第一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
7971.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
7989.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
在所謂的半導體台灣在30年前的確是跟它買技術的移轉是跟Intel經過30年的淬鏈經過30年整個供應的提升台灣才有今天的地位這是整個台灣全世界這個半導體產業鏈的 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
7990.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
8017.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
一個現實也是一個事實只是他太簡略了他也不知道這些製造過程過去他的專業背景或者他的幕僚可能是在這個是商業上但製造業完全不是這麼一回事我在講的是一個事實所以我們也事實當他第一次聽到這個時候在談判的時候在關稅談判的時候我們的團隊就已經適時的跟他們團隊講這個製造業 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
8020.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
8038.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
不是像一般的商品買賣那很顯然我們的團隊跟他們的團隊並沒有下情上達川普持續在講這樣的話我們的談判團隊還是川普有意為之還是川普就是明明知道但是他刻意要扭曲我們台灣他怎麼樣這個我不予揣測 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
8039.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
8056.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
我們如實的把目前半導體產業跟TSMC的所有產業的結構鏈也跟他們整個談判團隊都挺好他們財政部 商務部都非常清楚整個產業結構鏈所以他才要求大家成為AI |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
8059.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
8074.982 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
這一個最重要的基地的時候更需要台灣這一點我要跟委員來做分享廖長我讓你把話講完因為我也尊敬您是過去我們立法院的前輩啦但是本席還是再一次強調主席也站起來本席為什麼要這樣子再一次編因為我認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
8077.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
8097.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
對外一致中華民國立場不容許犧牲不管是任何國家不要讓我們認為不要讓某些國人認為是說我們政府現在面對到美國政府就矮半截連美國總統川普講這種明明不是事實的話還可以連更正都不願意更正我覺得這會讓國人看到失望謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
8100.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
8122.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
好 謝謝 謝謝洪孟愷來來來你們能給我幾秒鐘說明一下就是說在第一次有這種話題出現的跟委員報告啦在第一次有這個話題出現的時候現在不是備詢欸 主席立法委員現在執行完畢我現在剛剛從以前 欸不 我覺得這樣子就完全沒有尊重立法委員 不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
8122.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
8127.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
我不是 我 沒關係 剛剛本席問的是總統府但國安會 國安的問題我會問國安沒有 這個 我覺得不是說我怕你講什麼 不是不是 秘書長 但本席現在講的是說我們已經結束了你怎麼還會變成官員好 謝謝洪委員的詢答秘書長拜託我要請你尊重國會的尊嚴 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
8144.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
8164.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
其實這個議題這個主席也很好回答啦川普總統這個講法其實我們光明星經濟部長其實他也一直去強調台灣的半導體的發展尤其是台積電是經過台灣我們這邊40年的一個努力那川普總統這種講法其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
8166.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
8192.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
其實大家很清楚嘛是加大對台灣的施壓看有沒有辦法讓台積電到美國台灣的半導體到美國多做一點投資政治上的語言啦這個平常心來做一個看待接下來請楊瓊英委員楊瓊英委員楊瓊英委員不在鍾嘉斌委員鍾嘉斌委員鍾嘉斌委員不在徐宇貞委員徐宇貞委員徐宇貞委員不在接下來請我們最帥的賴士寶寶哥賴委員來做訓導 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
8204.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
8215.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
謝謝我們民進黨團的哲大冠我們的莊瑞雄 莊氏大家好 以及各位先進大家好 我想請兩位秘書長上來請潘秘書長 吳秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
8223.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
8227.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
委員 老闆 稍後有更好嗎很好的 現在最好的時候來 這個我們五位秘書長啊這個自從當了國會秘書長幾乎都沒有來喔幾乎都沒有來 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
8237.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
8259.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
這樣子我先請教吳秘書長對於這次川普到大陸去你們有沒有全程掌握他的一些行蹤他的強化全程掌握有沒有我們是盡量在掌握那也掌握很多相關的訊息他你知不知道他會一離開以後就打電話給高樹昭淼打電話給李在民這個都掌握到吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
8264.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
8276.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
這個部分我們是了解的而且他在事前也透過事前有跟你們講嗎到日本去的時候那相關的訊息你們有掌握到說他要跟我們的治理台灣的領導者講話嗎有這句話嗎這個部分是我們事後才看到的事情沒有掌握了 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
8288.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
8307.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
我所了解的 他打電話給高市 打電話給李善明你們也沒有掌握 也是事後才知道 可不可以這樣啊 要說要打這個 Demand Running Taiwan這個那個人 賴清德總統 你們也沒有掌握 事後才知道你跟我們一樣 看報紙才知道 可不可以這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
8310.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
8336.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
有關於委員說的那個可能跟事實不太一致我們在針對川習會這個部分我們事前有做過很多的這些研析也跟美方保持非常密切的聯絡所以對於很多的這些資訊都有相當的掌握我請教潘秘書長川普總統到現在為止有沒有打電話給賴總統 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
8337.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
8352.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
目前還沒有接到這個訊息因為是他要離開北京上這個時候上飛機空軍離開的時候提過一次昨天晚上又提了一次但我們今天早上就來這裡了所以我現在還沒回府內 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
8353.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
8375.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
請問他要先跟吳秘書長講還是跟你講一定是國安單位先處理國安單位先講以後再轉到你這裡因為這裡面涉及到原所的這個部分有些保密啦或是通現在有一個講法喔他說Running Taiwan現在來講可能是賴總統可能是左院長可能是AIT鼓勵員啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
8376.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
8398.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
這三個都有可能啊 是不是這樣喔 你也同意喔不是啦你也同意這樣喔你當然不同意啊 你說就是賴清德啊當然啊你這麼對喔他應該會問過他們主管台灣事務的人然後了解背景之後再來跟台灣領導者來談我提醒兩位啊他如果真的打電話給賴清德這個算不算外交突破請問國安委的吳秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
8404.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
8429.996 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
的確在台美的溝通過程當中如果說能夠往上這個層級往上走的話對我們台灣來講是重要的因為過去他打給跟蔡英文親總統那時候他還不是總統對吧現在是兩個都信任總統是外交突破可是我們跟蔡英文的時候他講什麼內容今天我們期待的是華家叔趕快給我們啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
8431.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
8446.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
他講的是說 我可能會 可能不會我要跟那個人談 他也不講什麼人就那個人 軟領台灣那個人 治理台灣的人這樣一來的話就 我們就有理由擔心嗎他還要簽AOA Letter of Acceptance 發架書就簽不好啊 哪怕卡電話卡電話就表示說 他在簽可能打折扣可能說 欸 抱歉喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
8460.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
8467.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
Mr.賴可能我們簽一本Mr.賴可能我們等到我期中選舉完畢以後我再簽這個可能性有沒有 吳祕書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
8475.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
8502.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
有關於我們台美之間不管是軍購或者是其他的那個邦交關係的這個議題都要去看這個結構那如果說去看結構的話不管是國務院的發言人或者是國安會的這些相關的人員甚至是盧比歐國務卿還有美國駐中國的大使每一個都出來跟我們講就是對台政策不變仍然是依照台灣沒有你沒有回答問題啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
8502.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
8527.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
我現在就說委員說的這個議題對我們來講就是在這個架構裡面的一個議題他會不會或者是說 但是前提你不搞台獨我才賣你搞台獨我就不賣我可能這樣嗎委員知道的非常的清楚我是第一個被中國制裁的但是他制裁錯了啦就是我是維持現狀的我們台灣政府現在也是維持現狀的 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
8528.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
8534.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
我們是要維持中華民國現狀所以我們沒有所謂的這個台獨的問題我也能夠很清楚的知道這個所以你不搞台獨了我們就是要捍衛現狀避免現狀被現狀不是台獨現狀不是台獨我們要維持現狀現狀不是台獨在中國的定義之下連中華民國都是台獨啦那你就給它抗議啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
8556.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
8562.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
你來抗議中華民國不是台獨 你要想為什麼一百一十億我們就是要維持現狀來一百一 可是不是這樣講啊來總統的禮拜天下午就講啊就講因為這個現狀是台獨啊 他說的啊來一百一十億可以不打電話為什麼一百四十億美金要打電話 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
8582.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
8593.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
就不要去打折扣啊你以為說他那個卡他就給你簽了Sign要Donald Trump簽了就好了對不對啊為什麼要打電話這打電話就代表說這樣我們有理由擔心尤其他前面在鋪村 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
8599.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
8625.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
不做什麼 只有二次要第二次全席會替他助選在這個之前 我認為他不會簽他會跟他講說 我要選舉 要簽名或者說你簽一部分這可能性都很高所以他如果真的打電話給賴新德總統我們要高興 可是以前不用太高興因為會救水啊 會救水我這樣講我對吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
8630.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
8635.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
委員我們都在勞動書有兩個啦您剛剛這個slogan第一個我們對當然啦您的議員的委員的這個擔憂我們可以接受那外界的疑慮大家都應該來討論當然基本上比較沒問題啦不用擔心啦第二個在您剛剛講說不台獨台賣這個隨時都會賣 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
8656.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
8667.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
這個我們在大前提這次川習會有三個重點就是對台軍唆使跟台灣談維持現狀沒有對台軍唆使他也跟北京談喔不會 所以就沒有拒絕給他任何承諾所以代表了他要跟台灣談這也是兩兆雙方長期的四十幾年來幾十年來的默契所以那在中國的定義裡面你不支持統一你就是台獨啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
8686.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
8693.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
這個東西可以不統不獨啦 不統不獨維持現狀也可以啦不支持統一就是態度沒得獨立啦 沒得獨立啦我們不同意啦 這個叫做求統存義 擱置爭議不是這樣 他說你不支持統一就是獨立 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
8709.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
8718.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
我拒絕我們現在捍衛現狀也是台灣所有的人在捍衛捍衛真的啦中華民國從1912年的中華民國你不能把它斷頭是個中華民國啦我們捍衛現狀是誰在破壞現狀我想大家都很清楚最後一個小問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
8728.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
8731.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
他上網兩次說我們是炒辣的我們是小偷的你們都沒發聲啊然後現在川習會來第二個我提問雖然我時間到了但是謝謝主席喔讓我稍微拖一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
8742.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
8757.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
第二個問題就是傳習會之後大家看得很清楚是美中兩大強權共管台灣我們當事人都沒發聲你們也要看一看 我在這裡你們也要問我一個意見 我要發聲一下I'm here怎麼他們兩個人就這樣決定那是要怎樣 那到底是怎樣我們又主權獨立我大聲的說我最氣憤 常務五二零賴總統說我很大聲 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
8769.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
8777.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
對不對 台灣講了幾十次 有人說六十幾次 有人說五十次我都算了啦 總共就五十一次啦啊中華民國講一次 中華民國台灣講一次還兩次啊這個東西都沒關係 因為法語就好 還有這麼大聲結果 當世界都定調 都看到是 美 中 共 共 台灣我們都點點 叫做可憐 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
8794.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
8813.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
就是扣人拜託你們兩位跟你們老闆講一下非常謝謝賴委員有關於第一個問題在前年HalifaxSecurity Conference在台灣第一次召開的時候我受邀去那邊致詞去那邊講話 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
8814.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
8831.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
那當時也有人問我有關於說我們台灣是不是偷了美國的晶片我說得非常的清楚而且都還有公開的記錄就是說我們台灣是誠實的生意人我們不偷不搶我們做我們這種科技的研發 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
8832.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
8837.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
會偷會搶的會偷會搶的就是有期人這個第一個問題第二個問題有關於共管的問題其實所有第一島鏈以及美國澳洲等等的大家都知道說發生問題的製造問題的製造困擾的要改變現狀的是中國所以大家要團結起來去共管 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
8859.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
8861.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
中國所可能造成的風險謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
8880.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
8884.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
NEW YORK TIMES 或是WASHINGTON POST都還在紀錄上面對 最近他應該每講一次你就等你吃每講一次等你吃 這個錢絕對支持好 謝謝賴思寶這個預算絕對支持 他每講一次等你吃謝謝能不能承諾 來來來 承諾一下承諾一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
8901.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
8908.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
他沒講一次 我就說爛慘啦他就等一次他聽到就說預算都沒給你支持非常謝謝你支持我們國安會的預算不是不是你要承諾我啊說他只要講一次我就等一次非常謝謝委員支持我們國安會的預算那我剛剛已經說了我之前所說的都在紀錄上面 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
8923.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
8924.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
好 謝謝賴世保委員的詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
8943.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
8947.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
接下來陳冠廷委員我們所有登記發言的委員均已發言完畢 詢答結束委員質詢時要求提供的相關資料或已書面答覆者請相關機關盡速送交個別委員及本會 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
8968.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
8972.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
那委員蔡其昌所提書面質詢列入紀錄刊登公報並請相關機關以書面來做答覆那上午的會議我們就進行到此因為需要時間來整理預算的批案跟製作會整表 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
8986.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
8992.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
我們先休息到下午兩點 因為今天的提案我們是到十點半 按照慣例十點半才截止所以等一下要來整理預算提案跟製作會總表那我們下午兩點繼續開會進行議程討論事項就是115年度總統府主管的預算審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
9008.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
9011.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
下午兩點開會以後先進行宣讀宣讀以後我們就進行整理因為宣讀的時間差不多兩分鐘而已所以請提案委員準時到場來畢立我們整個會議的一個進行我們先來休息 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
16111.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
16112.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
MING PAO CANADA MANGA |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
19443.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
19459.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
我們現在繼續開會進行討論事項前請議事人員先宣讀115年度中央政府總預算案關於總統府主管不含中央研究院收支部分的全部預算數跟委員的提案宣讀時間差不多兩分鐘請宣讀 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
19464.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
19486.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
115年度總統府主管稅務部分第二款罰款及賠償收入第一項總統府第二項國使館第三項國使館台灣文獻館均無劣數第三款規費收入第一項總統府一千元第二項國使館三十萬元第三項國使館台灣文獻館三十一萬三千元第四款財產收入第一項總統府 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
19487.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
19512.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
二百二十五萬元第二項國家安全會議五千元第三項國史館四十六萬元第四項國史館台灣文獻館十二萬一千元第七款其他收入第一項總統府三十三萬七千元第二項國家安全會議一萬八千元第三項國史館五十萬元第四項國史館台灣文獻館七十二萬三千元稅出部分第一款總統府主管 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
19512.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
19530.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
第一項總統府十一億六千三百八十一萬一千元第二項國家安全會議二億四千六百六十三萬一千元第三項國史館二億五千一百七十三萬三千元第四項國史館台灣文獻館一億二千六百二十二萬二千元 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
19531.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
19549.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
繼續宣讀一百一十五年度中央政府總預算案委員提案彙整表總統府主管收支部分稅務部分第三款第三項國事館台灣文獻館使用規費收入為第一案稅出部分第一款第一項總統府業務費為第二案至第十案 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
19549.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
19567.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
第一幕一般行政為第十一案至第十四案第二幕國務機要為第十五案至第十七案第四幕研究發展第一節國家發展研究及諮詢為第十八案及第十九案第五幕新聞發布為第二十案至第二十二案主決議部分為第二十三案至第二十九案 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
19568.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
19590.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
第一款第二項國家安全會議人事費為第30案業務費為第31案至第36案第一幕一般行政為第37案及第38案第二幕諮詢研究業務為第39案至第42案主決議部分為第43案及第44案第一款第三項國使館主決議部分為第45案至第52案 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
19592.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
19620.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
第一款 第四項 國史館 台灣文獻館主決議部分為第53案至第58案以上提案及修正內容請委員參閱書面資料 宣讀完畢預算數跟所有提案均於宣讀完畢我看你們這五十八案裡面今天跟總統府的溝通都很不順利但是沒關係 還是大家繼續那我們進行討論前先說明預算案的處理方式 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
19621.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
19645.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
那按照委員會處理預算提案的慣例稅入的部分我們依照來源別以巷為單位那稅出的部分我們按照機關別以木為單位那分別依序來進行審查那各單位的預算當中在處理委員所提的增三提案以後呢其餘未涉及的預算部分我們就均以照列那有關正式別稅出預算隨同機關別 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
19647.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
19651.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
審查結果來做調整那預算提案經由整理除了所有委員提案裝訂成這個提案本的基本並在編列序號以後呢製成這個彙整版那方便委員在審查的時候來參考接下來我們來進行審查請各位也一併參閱提案本跟彙整版來進行討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
19674.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
19678.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
那另外我們請機關也注意稍後在討論的時候在經過討論決議修正的預算提案請機關將修正內容經提案委員簽名同意以後送交主席台並列入公報記錄那預算審查的一個過程當中列席的幕僚或首次的答覆等一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
19698.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
19706.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
答覆委員問題發言的時候請也介紹一下介紹一下職稱姓名因為要以利於公報人員來做記錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
19709.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
19733.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
那我們現在進行預算的審查我們先處理稅務的部分請參閱提案版跟會整版稅務部分只有一個案而已我們現在是不是我們就依例就依來源別主款主以上的機關委員單位來進行依序的進行那我們先請提案委員來針對提案內容進行說明再請機關代表來答覆之後再來做決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
19739.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
19752.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
那第一案啦 這個德蘭的張雅玲委員稅入的部分請張雅玲委員來做說明好 那基本上就是看到台灣文獻館在110年度的使用規費收入裡面只有編列五萬塊啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
19754.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
19776.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
主要是在特展市、簡報市等地的一個場地使用收入但是因為根據去年的決算在110年的實際收入其實有169,000112年也有22萬113年有31萬114年是13萬那看來就是說其實這幾年是有一定的需求也有一定的一個活化的成效不過因為這幾年明顯都沒有高於 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
19778.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
19805.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
這幾年其實都明顯高於五萬塊可是一百一十五年度卻只有編列五萬元我就並沒有如實的反映實際的營運狀況所以所以我才會希望說從原本的這個五萬塊調整為二十萬元那這基本上也是根據最近這幾年的一個趨勢啦以上說明好 謝謝那我們請機關來做答覆主席 張委員以及各位委員大家好那有關於本館這個場地設施使用費 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
19806.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
19823.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
主要來源是一個是特產式的使用規費另外一個是外界場地的使用規費這兩種那特產式的使用規費在111年到113年是呈現這個增長沒有錯那主要是因為外界案件比較多 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
19824.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
19842.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
但是這個特展是外界,光看外界團體的意願而定,並不是本館所能決定的所以它的不確定性跟變動性的幅度非常的大而且自114年之後,本館要規劃主要展出本館典藏的一些文物 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
19843.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
19867.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
幾乎已經沒有外界場地的空間所以說會沒有收入然後第二點就是有關於外界場地使用費這個主要是以簡報室為主那其實根據我們自己內部的統計那我們簡報室最多使用是南投縣政府因為他們好像內部這個縣政府那邊內地在整修而且空間有限所以外溢到我們中興新村的這個文獻館這邊來 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
19868.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
19882.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
那其實說真的這個也都是等他們南投縣政府他們場地設施完成之後那這可能也是有關於這個廠租的部分也會當下來所以所以然後再來就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
19883.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
19901.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
就115年1月到3月第一季我們的收入才一萬一千塊錢那四季的話頂過四萬四我們五萬塊說真的已經是就是說很如實的匡列了再者我 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
19902.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
19911.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
根據我的統計,其實說真的在簡報室的租借方面其實南投縣政府一直佔我們租金比例從44%,從112年的44%到113年的79%現在去114年佔69%,其實比例非常高啦所以這個一旦他們的會議室、會議設施整治完成之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
19926.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
19934.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
那我們可能有關於這個場地的...對啦,我看這樣啦,這大委員你從稅務到一個15萬的他是說你們那個預算後你們有增加啦他認為你們那個有活化應該算有成效啦要給個15萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
19946.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
19964.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
補充一下好不好好來補充一下就是說我想就是說因為其實因為這是國家的場地啦然後其實空間也蠻大的那過去也其實都有在租借我認為是應該積極的活化不是就是閒置被動的等大家來租借我覺得應該要積極的去拓展自己的業務增加更多的收入啦對還是該主決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
19968.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
19993.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
那還是說提供一個你們的活化計劃呢你要如何的去爭取更多的收入呢好啦 那你們這個稅務的部分齁那張雅玲委員的意思也是說希望說你們這裡已經活化了 覺得有效果啊照理說稅務應該要加擔保養就代表你們的成效不然這樣子啦 這個就稅務的部分就撤案那你們提供一個主決議等一下寫一下好不好可以齁 好 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
19998.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
20026.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
那第一案稅入的部分就改組決議啦那我們針對稅入第三款規費收入第三項國使館台灣文獻館這個第一幕使用規費收入第二節場地設施使用費提案第一案就改為組決議那我們繼續來處理稅出第一款總統府主管第一項的總統府業務費 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
20027.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
20039.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
提案的案號是從第二案到第十案 五 七 二 三 四 五 六 七 八 九 十都很漂亮 都你的案 請說明好 謝謝張偉 那麼各位委員好那麼針對總統府的預算案 那麼經過本席這裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
20050.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
20064.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
看過總統府讀書案發現有一些問題那麼首先在本席所提出的第二案是涉及到總統府的教育訓練費用那麼這個教育訓練費用事實上就是經過我們看他每 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
20065.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
20075.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
經過我們審查總統府的這些近三年的資料每年大概的決算數字是40萬可是他們大概都是編列130萬也就是說他們基本上都超編那實際上也無法執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
20083.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
20093.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
把這些費用有真的可以去執行完畢所以基於這樣的一個情況那本席認為說他們今年又在編列136萬事實上是 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
20099.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
20122.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
實際上也用不了那麼多錢啦因此呢我就是提議就是說3減90萬那麼而且這個費用是不得流用雲芝那麼如果以3除90萬的這個角度來看的話其實也足夠他們115年的運用以上這是第二案那我一併講嗎那我先問一下你們那個第一案你們那個教育訓練那個執行率多少虎尼 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
20124.824 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
20135.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
百分之三十二 三十二喔對 一定都用不完 用不完啊好來 繼續吧好 那麼接下來就是有關於在水電費的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
20137.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
20164.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
水電費的部分經過本席考慮到就是他們的這個114年的預算決算是2815萬然後115年基本上也沒有漲電費那現在115年執行數應該也差不多也應該這個相同所以如果再加上用電成長6%估計大概他的執行數大概就是3000萬所以以現在來講的話基本上也是有 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
20166.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
20170.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
增編 增編還不少 所以本席在這裡提議就是3減280萬那麼第4案的話是 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
20183.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
20200.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
報告主席就是我這裡因為我後來其實總統府給我一些說明我當時雖然說在第三案有提案要減列280萬可是我看過他們說明之後我認為說可以刪減100萬就好因為你們其實真的用不了那麼多然後經費也要遵截使用 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
20201.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
20205.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
第三案妳就減列100萬就對了對我只減列100萬然後經費不得留用我本來是減列280萬280變減列100是這樣總統有意見嗎可以尊重 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
20219.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
20246.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
好 那麼接下來是第四案那第四案是涉及到通訊費的部分那麼原本我們也是認為說總統府的通訊費其實還可以在這個遵截使用那麼他們今年是增立了34萬那三年的平均執行率大概也就差不多80%左右剩餘數都在100到250萬左右可是經過他們的說明本席也考量到就是現在確實網路通訊費用也比較高所以就拙減了 拙減10萬然後這不得留用 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
20249.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
20265.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
所以第四案就檢列110改為檢列10萬好那麼第五案的部分是有關於約用人員酬金的部分那麼這些年他們這次他們編了163萬喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
20268.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
20290.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
可是他們三年的平均執行率大概就86.5%然後去年因為下降到77.7%還剩下36萬元那麼我有看了他們的說明那麼因為114年的預算這個刪除的比較多而且他們這些錢可能還要用在這個勞健保費所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
20291.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
20308.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
經過我的重新審視,我是想說就是,不叫減掉30萬,那就是少減10萬,那麼就不得留用,好嗎?第五案,減列10萬。10萬就不得留用。你這多一萬,你減這十萬,整個都給他就好。好,那第六案。 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
20311.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
20337.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
這個 重要是說要不得留用的指定科目的留用沒關係啦 訂案就好啦 訂案就好啦你們可以接受嘛 那就第六案來好 第六案的話是案日案件祭資酬金那這個部分來說的話是他們115年的預算比114年的預算要多增加27萬然後成長比例是5.2% |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
20339.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
20368.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
那麼事實上就是按日案件計酬的酬金在112年到114年他決算數來說大概也就只有用掉差不多300多萬400萬他們今年編了500多萬坦白說真的是過高那麼當然他們的說明是說之後可能因為可能會辦理什麼監察委員提名作業還有專家學者出席費可是很奇怪為什麼你們這裡都沒有說要辦理大法官補助您的作業費 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
20369.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
20375.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
那麼如果說你113年當時還有辦理大法官的提名作業費那時候也不過就是決算數是430萬那你們今年115年就編列了543萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
20383.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
20400.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
如果說我們總統都不再提名這些權力機關的候選人大法官或監察委員 監察委員大家還不知道他會不會提名那麼事實上是沒有必要編這麼多的按日案件計資籌金所以我這裡原先說是提案簡列135萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
20402.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
20418.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
可是呢考慮到說今年的確也還有監察委員的審查費用我希望還是能夠如期的提出監察委員的名單那麼因此就是比照像是113年的這個費用那我這裡3.80萬不得留用第六案簡列從135萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
20425.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
20440.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
就是改成三減八十萬然後不得留用機關請說明跟網委員可不可以拜託就是三十萬就好因為大法官是在另外一邊啦不是在這一筆預算裡面那應該是吧對這個這應該是吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
20443.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
20462.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
因為你們是叫按日案件計酬嘛然後如果說是以你們這裡說明來講你們辦理你們兵列預算還包含有給選屆小組委員的出席費審查費所以大法官的費用理論上也是辦在這邊那麼你們113年因為當時有提名大法官所以那時候的整個的費用是430萬你們決算數字將近430萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
20467.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
20472.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
然後去年也沒提然後今年就算是加拿大法官我想整個來說你們有460萬的經費是綽綽有餘 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
20476.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
20501.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
請機關再說明好不好這個就跟提案委員的認知上就落差很大了提案委員 翁委員是認為你大法官的這一些項目的提名的項目費用也是在這個是當然這一案前面這個業務費的部分是跨目的啦但是呢你這個內容裡面就跟提案委員說明有所落差代表連這個溝通了沒有請機關再說明好不好誰有辦法解釋清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
20506.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
20507.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
報告主席 報告委員這個部分案件祭籌資金是放在那個機關請那個職稱講一下我是地局局長郭鴻那這個地方經費用途因為案件祭籌籌金有放在國政規劃與諮詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
20530.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
20555.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
所以這部分呢我們當初編列的時候第七屆監察委員的提名作業其實整個是需要八十萬那有一部分其實納在我們原來經費去挪用所以我們已經沒有增加到八十萬這麼多我們只有增加二十八萬一千塊所以這個地方是不是可以請委員這個如果覺得有必要刪減可不可以如同剛剛我們這個代表副秘書長所提的是不是可以縮減少一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
20556.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
20568.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
因為我們已經自行在業務費裡面去去融資了所以我們的沒有照原來的八十萬全部都增加以上聽不懂啦也就是說你們114年當時的決算邀請專家學者出席費等等的這些是367萬嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
20576.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
20585.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
當時就是你們自己給我的說明啊367萬那我現在你們說如果說辦理監察委員的審查費用大概只需要28萬那就是從400萬加上28萬好了我把你前面的今年的出現400萬再加28萬也就是430萬左右所以你們現在編得過高啊編了540多萬啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
20604.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
20620.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
請那個第一局再說明好不好包委員因為這個部分不是只有第一局的預算我們還要包第三局的我們醫務室的醫師的案件計次的酬金所以這個部分是好幾個單位的案件計數我意思是說委員這樣說對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
20622.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
20633.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
歐元現在說的說你們的說明不清楚嘛你們的說明數據上使用的那個預算就有落差嘛你們要不要反駁一下 不然對嗎是給她洗腦一下 這樣說清楚一點沒有在說你們說的是對的啊我這個人是 我不是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
20640.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
20645.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
是啦 我就一直在講清楚 因為你們現在落差就很大這個看起來不是只有第一局啦 那機關這個地方有沒有辦法針對第六案來做完整的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
20659.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
20682.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
好 文委員在這邊再拜託這裡面其實它包含東西就是我們有很多專家學者會來出席然後或者是有些講稿的審議審稿還有資訊跟資安的這些強化那過往我們的質詢率都來到八成以上那因為114年度上半年我們預算有所凍結那 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
20684.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
20710.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
所以我們執行率目前看起來也許不夠漂亮但是這一筆預算對於整個國政的推動是重要的那此外這個監察委員我想剛剛也多位委員一直在垂詢那這裡面是包含整個監察委員因為馬上就要進行作業了嘛那所以是否可不可以懇請委員我們是否刪十萬好不好這個部分懇請支持懇請幫忙 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
20713.087 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
20728.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
跟富民這邊說你看你們113年的決算也不過才430萬例行性的什麼法律諮詢費用然後醫生費用包含就是這邊講什麼英文審議稿的這些費用等等這113年算 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
20731.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
20740.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
也不過才430萬那時候還包含一些其他的這個大法官等等一些作業提名吧然後那你現在115年你的確就是編列的金額過高我本來3年135萬都不算是過分啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
20747.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
20762.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
好 第六案先保留我們先保留第七案 報告主席跟報告問問員那是否可不可以從您原本是三八十我們是不是三五十好不好這樣對我們副業起來第六案一彎來是給你貸一百三十五萬欸對他剛才說八十 說八十 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
20765.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
20792.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
我是說減劣八十因為減劣八十之後呢你們還有四百六十萬都比你們一百一十三就是回到你們一百一十二跟一百一十三年當時編列的預算的這個額度嘛所以你們實際上也用不了那麼多好啦 咖啡先喝下去先保留先喝咖啡先喝咖啡第二案先保留第七案請說明我都已經釋出我的善意了她剛才是說八十嘛咖啡喝下去看人家是不是輸了來 第七案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
20794.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
20818.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
來第七案的話是就是有關於一般業務費一般業務費的部分的話就是總統府這裡也是編的比過去要成長了大概318萬然後但是基於就是現在國家政府這個支出龐大舉債高達4000多億那我們認為說應該還是要節約使用所以我這裡提案就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
20819.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
20832.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
簡列450萬不得留用但是也有看到總統府的一些說明我綿羽就是可以改刪為300萬但是同樣的也是不得留用就改簡列300萬不得留用來請機關回覆 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
20838.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
20845.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
可以嗎 確定可以嗎 太多了 你確定可以你確定可以 300很多耶你要不要先稍等 還是就先稍等 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
20854.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
20870.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
報告主席 我們這一案可不可以先懇請保留好嗎哪一案這一案 第七案第七案喔 好啊 第七案先保留沒有啦 你怎麼先那個啊他現在是跟你說減三百萬啊你們要 你們不是很保留啊 你們要先答覆啊不是說這個 你覺得這樣不好你也可以叫他貸三萬就好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
20881.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
20903.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
總統府第三局古文件報告那報告委員 高樂主席那這筆預算是我們全府的這個一般的業務費那包括因為去年那這個山的情形這個比較多一點所以我們執行率可能稍微不是那麼好那這個地方是因為牽涉到全府的一些預算的這個通用的這個部分所以懇請這邊能夠給我們是不是能夠濁山這個剛才這個建議的這個兩百萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
20912.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
20930.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
王委員 查理的查一百而已 檢視署 查理來總統府去討不用去討啦 只要總統把五項法律都公佈了今天我這預算我全部都可以放 應該是 請找我要去跟我們賴總統講一下好啦 我給你轉達 好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
20932.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
20948.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
如果說是這樣的話就是因為其實你們過去雖然你們去年的預算雖然少但是你們也還是維護的不錯所以理論上來講是不需要更多的錢不過既然這樣的話那我們就減兩百萬好 第七案減列兩百萬可以齁對 這客戶不想用來 第八案請說明謝謝委員 謝謝主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
20953.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
20960.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
好那麼第八案的部分是房屋建築的費用那麼這房屋建築養護費 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
20962.594 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
20967.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
我這裡原來是提案要減列1300萬因為他們今年編了6657萬然後比去年的法定預算成長成長了16%多了939萬那麼經過剛剛總統府這裡給我看的他們的書面的說明我認為的確有些 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
20990.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
21006.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
這個項目是需要就是有些設施設備是需要修繕的可是呢像是外牆立面等等的這個修繕的費用呢多增加了比去年多增加了400多萬我認為這部分是不是還是可以再更尊潔 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
21007.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
21029.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
使用所以我原來提案簡列1300萬那現在就是改簡列200萬然後不得留用因為其他的內容我認為是我可以支持的像是要汰換空調主機送風機的系統然後憲兵這個住營設的空間改善工程這些我都可以支持但是呢對於你們這個設計費是不是可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
21032.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
21043.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
找一個就是要考慮要節省啦多增加的設計費用這個費用太高了所以第8案你的減內200對 只減內200來 機關請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
21048.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
21060.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
可不可以拜託翁委員可否簡列150號嗎抱歉抱歉因為我們這邊真的是一個百年以上的古蹟然後不知道您信不信我們有時候像我們兩年的時間來到總統府參觀的民眾有 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
21064.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
21077.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
其實有三十多萬人那很多其實有一些牆面都在斑駁那甚至之前還有女兒牆因為結構或地震它要產生軍列的狀況還有漏水那所以我們這邊那 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
21080.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
21085.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
這有一點辛苦所以懇請委員是否我這裡要回應副秘書長的就是我基本上我都支持你們的中央空調主機的汰換增編的費用還有憲兵211營的住府營產空間改善的費用那麼我這裡我都支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
21100.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
21129.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
但是在你們外牆立面的陸台防水改善工程裡面的規劃設計費本席認為增加太多了比去年要多增加400多萬那現在我剛剛已經不斷的重複嘛我們的政府舉債4000多億然後民進黨政府又不斷的擴大國防預算現在都已經上兆了耶這個經費一定會勢必會排擠到其他機關的使用所以總統府應該要以身作則 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
21130.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
21158.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
能夠節省的就節省我原來是認為說其實不需要有這麼多的改善但是經過你們說明之後我覺得有些急需項目我認為也合理可以接受所以這裡從減劣一千三改成減劣兩百這個如果說還要再討價還價我不太能接受我們減劣兩百遵照辦理好 第八案就減劣兩百第九案請說明減劣兩百並不得留用 這費用 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
21160.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
21187.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
好 第九案請然後第九案的話是車輛及辦公器具的養護費那麼因為這一筆費用是純粹就是養護費這個今年是憋了224萬比去年多增加了22萬左右那麼這個雖然認為說在按照你們過去的持續率來說其實也沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
21188.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
21211.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
要用到這麼多的養護費大概平均就是一年大概20萬左右的養護費可是你們今年也超編了嘛對不起你們過去大概都是編差不多200萬左右的250萬左右的養護費然後真正使用的是大概200萬的養護費所以我認為說其實你們今年有多編啦那麼但是 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
21212.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
21221.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
基本上我還是免於給你們一些支持不刪五十五萬就是小刪十萬這個費用也是不得留用第九案 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
21223.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
21238.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
車輛及辦公器具養護費減列10萬 機關有沒有意見報告委員跟主席 我們遵照辦理好 那第9案就減列10萬第10案就是短程車資這是什麼 請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
21243.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
21267.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
有關於短程車資的部分就很有趣因為我們有看到總統府他們基本上每年都會編列大概26萬的短程車資可是實際上真正的用到的大概就差不多3萬左右那去年用的短程車資也只有1萬3那麼既然你們歷年來用掉的短程車資本來就不多那為什麼要編到26萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
21269.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
21272.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
趙偉還有文委員我們最近不是要辦總統府音樂會對不對那趙偉會出席很感謝那我們其實很多幕僚他是需要先到現場去會堪勘察 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
21289.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
21296.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
那我們也尊爵公務車的使用 因為他可能就下高鐵之後可能坐公車或者是坐計程車 短程短程的這種車子或者是說我們幕僚要去開會 那大家可能共乘計程車這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
21305.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
21319.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
這樣的支出是在這裡那或者是說跟委員一起出席等等的他們沒有公務車的話這是真的是給最基層最基層同仁使用的短程的這些車子所以這邊可不可以拜託委員就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
21320.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
21334.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
我都願意去坐計程 坐那個公車啦可不可以我們就減列五萬好不好拜託是可以不是我這邊我跟何富密講就是你看看你們每年變二十六萬然後但是每一年最後使用的只有三萬塊 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
21336.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
21352.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
我現在我減20萬那麼但是我就想說那或許你們今年有成長三倍的需要吧也許高達10萬所以我現在我同意就是可以從20萬減為改減列10萬但是不能留用也就是說你們今年還有16萬的車資是可以報這已經是你們過去的5倍 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
21357.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
21381.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
好 第10案 那個短程車資就本來減列20 現在減列10萬機關有沒有意見 我看你們比較開心 每年都開3萬那這也怪怪 好啦 那我們就遵照辦理那好啦 這條這卸掉了 這條錢不要在那裡來 那我們再往前來看一下 剛剛是保留第6案是吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].start |
21382.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].end |
21395.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].text |
來 第六案 第六案 那個案日案件記仇這個是不是那個翁委員這邊再說明 考慮一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].start |
21396.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].end |
21424.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].text |
是我剛剛的提案基本上已經說得很清楚了就是說以縣總統府他的按日按電計從過去的執行率來講還有就是他們所使用的項目來說他都有一定的規律規則不可能要編到要花掉五百多萬了所以實際上沒有必要那我已經也提出我的善意了就是從原來減的一百三十五萬然後呢改減列為八十萬就像我說的我希望總統府的經費能夠尊潔使用你們要帶頭做表率 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].start |
21425.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].end |
21447.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].text |
然後而且更何況我也不是說是刪的比你們這個就是跟你們我現在刪的額度是維持回復到你們112年113年的那個他們預算數460萬嗎翁委員我可不可以表現誠意我站起來跟您拜託好不好我只要舉一個案例就好 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].start |
21448.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].end |
21460.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].text |
我們114年我們網路駭客供給是1億次那今年預估會高達3億次跟過去比起來成長是5倍啦因為現在又有AI的生成所以其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].start |
21461.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].end |
21473.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].text |
這一筆預算裡面有很多像問委員跟各位委員長期在垂詢要求資安資安資安資安就是國安所以我們會請一些資訊安全的專家來進行專題演講大家怎麼保障我們的國安等等的 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].start |
21478.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].end |
21496.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].text |
那還有裡面的醫生 還有一些講稿 還有專家學者所以在這邊我們是否可以懇請翁委員酌三一百好不好剛剛原本懇求的是八十 剛剛您說是八十我這邊是否懇求我們就三一百好不好 我自己再讓二十三一半 不然這樣啦 翁委員五百好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].start |
21506.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].end |
21506.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].text |
5%就56萬5%就56萬5%就56萬5%就56萬5%就56萬5%就56萬5%就56萬5%就56萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].start |
21527.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].end |
21548.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].text |
我們現在總統府被網路攻擊這也不是今年才發生的而且我相信總統府裡面的資安人員能力非常的厲害很高超所以我不需要再去請什麼更多的資訊通案的通識講座而且還是找通識講座來演講出席費我認為說這筆費用能省則省雖然說八十萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].start |
21555.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].end |
21558.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].text |
不要在這邊吵架還價了啦我現在的意思就是說我就回到你們112年113年的編列的460萬的預算數嘛你460萬預算數你當時也112年才花了360萬它根本也沒有那麼多的執行率啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].start |
21579.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].end |
21603.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].text |
廷安委員是講得很清楚啦那機關這個地方是不是再回應一下您自己的業務要弄得更清楚呢我覺得不要為了這個案子好 第六案先保留那第二案再來確認第二案來確認一下第二案我們剛才數字沒說啦 翁委員第二案我們剛才數字說你第二案你是減劣90萬啊你剛才是有要 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].start |
21606.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].end |
21633.101 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].text |
二岸 你剛才有要放行 但是你沒有說受益啊喔 教育的 對啊我剛剛已經說我減了零等一下減二十萬減二十萬 要二十 要二十五不是是他們說要減二十 但是我不同意減二十不然你給我一萬二十一就是因為他們這三年的 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].start |
21635.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].end |
21642.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].text |
就是执行率只有30%左右我就是不懂为什么总统府都要高编预算高编很多 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].start |
21644.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].end |
21651.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].text |
你們實際上沒有用到這麼多的錢啊不不不我現在講112年113年請那個何複命你仔細看我這裡所拉出來你們的這個數字啊你們112年編了130萬最後的決算數只有43萬113年當時你們也是編了130萬決算數是40萬欸你們那個跨年度的齁那個那個執行率都不高餒 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].start |
21674.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].end |
21695.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].text |
說明一下好不好就是我也發現了總統府現在編列預算的一個問題就是你們實際上執行率不高可是你們卻要編很高的錢這就不禁讓我懷疑說你們是不是最後把這些錢呢又科目又可以自行調整然後經費又留到別的地方去用了沒有 那個也要決算啦所以他的執行率這樣也沒辦法撈到外面去 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].start |
21696.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].end |
21725.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].text |
跟主席和各位有報告我是總統府人事處處長雷辰關於這個案子教育訓練費用謝謝歐委員的提醒確實我們在12113我們的執行率只有32%30%這樣的一個數字可是在114年因為114年我們已經被通山了37萬了而且114年它有凍結我們是在實際執行的時候是下半年才開始執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].start |
21726.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].end |
21751.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].text |
那麼在有通山而且又下半年才開始執行的情況之下呢我們在半年之間我們的執行率還是達到了43.78%啦就是因為我們有注意到說過去的在教育訓練這邊執行率不高的問題那我們在114年就有開始努力的這個照顧同仁的教育訓練要等我解釋一下為什麼112跟113的執行率都低於33% |
| transcript.whisperx[442].start |
21753.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].end |
21768.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].text |
你這邊要講清楚一二跟一三那這邊回頭來講到這個教育訓練的本質因為它有兩筆錢一筆錢是同仁他自行去進修跟這個業務有關的一個這個學校的教育像是研究所啦或者是參加相關的訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].start |
21770.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].end |
21780.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].text |
那這部分機關只能用在一個鼓勵的方式去希望同仁去多接受訓練那機關比較沒有這個實際的主動的掌控權那另外有一筆當然是我們能夠主動掌控的就是在這個我們主動辦理的訓練以及選送同仁去參加外面的訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].start |
21789.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].end |
21800.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].text |
那過去我們確實在這個部分沒有很用力的去執行我們的預算那謝謝歐委員的提醒所以我們2014年有開始改善這樣的一個狀況那我們在115年的訓練計劃裡面我們有新增了很多的訓練進修的部分這部分跟各位委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].start |
21808.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].end |
21828.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].text |
在被動式的就是同仁主動自行去參加教育訓練的部分我們在學分的補助費上面我們的金額有加倍然後我們在選送的同仁參加訓練的項目我們有增加就自行到外面的英語的補習班或者是英語的訓練機構 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].start |
21829.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].end |
21857.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].text |
有訓練這個參加英語的訓練的時候我們也會把它列入這個補助的項目我們的補助項目有增加補助的金額也有提高那在我們機關主動的部分呢剛剛副秘書有跟副秘書長跟各位報告資安非常重要那麼去年呢資安人員的他的增資資安加給的他的要求呢從原本的兩項資安專業證照已經提高為三項所以我們府內的資安人員和資訊人員我們會 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].start |
21858.768 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].end |
21879.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].text |
這個選送更多的同仁去參加外面的資安的訓練然後取得專業的證照這部分的人數和項目都會增加那我們府裡面最近對外的開放參觀的人數越來越多所以我們對於這個府裡面的這個消防安全和這個急救相關的訓練選送去參加訓練的人數我們會增加我們這些訓練的項目和選送的這個內容我們都有放在我們115年的訓練計畫當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].start |
21887.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].end |
21897.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].text |
所以我們115年一定一定在訓練的人數和訓練項目當中會增加那肯齊委員是不是不要刪除90萬這麼多以上報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].start |
21898.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].end |
21919.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].text |
那這樣的話我就三七十萬好不好都給你們這個已經多了大概百分之五十以上比這個你們的決算就多五十以上的這個經費那希望說你們今年真的就是對於總統府同仁的教育訓練你們能夠努力的去做努力的支持但事實上 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].start |
21921.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].end |
21947.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].text |
我不認為因為編了這個教育訓練費用一定就是要努力花完或是說所有的業務費編了之後當然就是錢要用在刀口上嘛不該花的就不用花那我相信總統府的同仁可能工作也很忙碌你硬是要叫逼他們去做教育訓練也沒有必要更換如果說他是每年都有類似的課程他可能參加一次他三年之後也許再參加一次就好了所以不要為了花錢而去花錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].start |
21949.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].end |
21957.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].text |
各位報告齁我現在這邊就是建議就是我應該這樣講我就結束啦你們那個總統李毓民應該你們自己要很熟才對啊你現在我聽你的說明好像你要拜託你們裡面的人去教育訓練幫忙沒人要去啊所以說你們做什麼錢都花不完的這個說法也不太對來張雅玲 張委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].start |
21974.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].end |
21999.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].text |
那因為其實我今年是有希望來爭取我們那個兒童友善導覽的部分因為這裡面也涉及到教育訓練因為最主要是因為有越來越多的兒小其實進了總統府但是我們並沒有一個相對應的兒小導覽的一個program所以我比較擔心的是說這樣子大量的刪減的話我們爭取的一些訓練會不會因此而受影響那這個部分是不是也可以再清楚的說明大概你們可以接受多少呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].start |
22002.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].end |
22027.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].text |
教育訓練我覺得可以做很多因為我們這邊是立法院我們不是行政機關應該你們那個必要性可以講得很好的像比如說很多AI各方面有的有的有很多訓練的跟主席的各位報告我剛才講到的是被動的部分那個部分是佔一個少部分那我們今年訓練計畫是把主動的部分我們有拉高就剛才報告的我們的治安的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].start |
22028.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].end |
22056.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].text |
專業證照那個是要持續維持的從兩個證照變成三個證照那我們的資安人員就勢必要選送許多的同仁包括我們的不只資安人資訊同仁我們也會送去參加這個資安的訓練那這個訓練費用其實都蠻高的一個人大約要一萬塊錢那你們今年執行率可以幾%啦今年的執行率我們估計大概最少應該可以到達70%啦所以如果刪掉這個70萬我們覺得還是太多了一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].start |
22057.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].end |
22081.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].text |
這樣歐元是不是跟劉瀟查看一下?我剛剛已經都說了很多了那我也不是說是在刁難總統府而是回到你們之前合理的這個預算的編列的部分嘛已經也給你們很多的這個寬裕就經費寬裕使用的空間啦我剛剛已經很有誠意了從九十萬三減為 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].start |
22084.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].end |
22106.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].text |
就是改列 減列為70萬 對不對 這個部分的話很合理啊來 請何物蜜再說明那個 趙偉跟各位委員總統府跟所有的行政機關跟台灣都一樣我們是不斷地在進步那在過去各位委員在質詢的很多的議題從消防到性騷擾 職場霸凌 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].start |
22108.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].end |
22134.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].text |
教育環境甚至生命教育我們也不斷的在學習我們也鼓勵我們的同仁在學習那剛剛我們業務單位其實有講到近期像是剛剛有跟您報告過深層式的AI數量超級大暴增那這些資訊管理有一些是在國內的有一些是這種從線上在處理這些證照有取得不是重點重點是我們有辦法跟這個社會一起再進步 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].start |
22135.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].end |
22151.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].text |
那今年我們預計這個整個質詢力有辦法過七成以上那剛剛雅玲委員稍早的質詢也提到我們對兒少有沒有的導覽等等我們會做得更精進這些都需要有專業人士來告訴我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].start |
22152.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].end |
22170.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].text |
那汪委員以前您也是老師也不斷的強調要不斷的學習這都是我們一直在做的所以在這邊是不是懇請汪委員我們這邊如果來到最終的數字的話可不可以刪五十萬的這樣子是否可以同意再拜託從簡列九十萬然後變成簡列五十萬你的意思是這樣嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].start |
22178.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].end |
22205.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].text |
對我們蠻多的 50萬可以嗎 50萬 拜託這樣好啦 那第二案好 我還要再講最後一句話我一直認為說經費就是當用則用而不是為了要去花錢而用我要重申就是總統府的這些年來看起來你們的確編列經費有這樣一個傾向就是執行率不高 可是呢你們編了很多的錢然後最後這個錢不知道到哪裡去了所以我是很 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].start |
22206.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].end |
22215.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].text |
質疑縣總統府預算編列的做法那這個案子來說我可以同意改減列為從減列90萬改為減列50萬第二案就 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].start |
22223.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].end |
22238.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].text |
教育訓練費減列50萬那請提書面報告 之後我們這邊WORDING我們再寫好不好提書面報告要告訴我你們到底教育訓練的議題減列到有這個書面 減列就檢調起來有不得留用 那交換那就是了來 那個第六案第六案來 第六案我們來做決定 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].start |
22251.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].end |
22277.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].text |
第六案我想我就堅持啦就三八十萬不得留用如果說不同意的話我們就直接送保留第六案檢列八十啦機關有沒有特別要再說明跟召委還有委員報告我們是否就保留這案好不好第六案啦 第六案就先保留啦來那我們接下來我唸這個來 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].start |
22291.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].end |
22302.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].text |
我們稅出稅出的第一款總統府主管第一項業務費從第二案到第十案那第六案就保留了那業務費 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].start |
22307.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].end |
22330.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].text |
除以上個案以外檢列590萬不得留用案號是第二到第五案789那我們繼續來處理第一幕一般行政提案案號第十一案到第十四案那請提案的委員說明第十一案請徐宇瞻徐委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].start |
22334.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].end |
22346.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].text |
這是有關總統府在115年度在基本行政工作維持向下針對中央空調的主機跟送風機的系統汰換的計畫那是最後一年的經費是5756萬那這個計畫的總經費已經由 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].start |
22351.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].end |
22357.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].text |
原合定的9089萬3000增加為9960萬增加的幅度是增加的大概870萬7000元增加的幅度是9.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].start |
22364.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].end |
22371.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].text |
那115年度單年的預算也比114年度大幅的增加4906萬增幅高達577.18%那因為這個部分以114年度到8月底該計劃的累積執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].start |
22382.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].end |
22396.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].text |
只有112萬佔累積預算數的2.66%也就是說執行率到8月連一成都不到那尤其是這個工程的工地負責人也未經許可在總統府內擅自動工 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].start |
22397.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].end |
22419.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].text |
動火施工引爆火災而且產生大量的濃煙所以本席認為就是說這一個案子既然到現在已經執行率去年的執行率也不高然後而且承辦的廠商又有發生這樣的一個公安事件所以本席呢就提出應該是要凍結該筆預算三千萬待總統府於兩個月內向立法院的這個我們委員會提出專案報告後時的凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].start |
22428.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].end |
22444.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].text |
來 機關請說明 這是基本行政的工作維持不然你動三千 又是專案報告 來 請說明跟學委員報告 謝謝你的關心 這一題很重要那剛剛說專案報告可否改為書面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].start |
22447.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].end |
22467.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].text |
好不好這是第一個請請託這樣子那第二件事情我想快速說明一下總統府一他是一個百年建築二他是佔地一整個街坡五層樓吼那這邊的冷氣的管性很多其實已經二三十年以上那他的修復修整跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].start |
22467.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].end |
22483.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].text |
太宦其实是非常好工的那我们又受文资法的保护所以厂商其实是真的不愿意来那后来终于来了一个厂商那如同刚刚委员非常了解整个脉络的过程有一度他在 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].start |
22483.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].end |
22501.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].text |
沒有授權的狀況下偷偷使用明火那造成這個失火的狀況好險我們即刻馬上撲滅只有農煙那在這裡還是要跟委員報告一下因為這個管縣施作的這個難度真的太高了那而且總統府 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].start |
22502.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].end |
22521.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].text |
這兩年來的人真的很多所以當有賓客來的時候所有的施工都要佔款所以我們今年會要求加速加速加速整體的施工那在這邊也跟徐委員再報告一下有去跟我們的吳宗憲委員有做過報告了那他的他是同意是動 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].start |
22525.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].end |
22544.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].text |
5%但是要尊重徐委員的提案的話可否您的凍結是凍結3000萬是否可以調整為凍1000萬好不好凍結1000萬因為我們今年其實管縣已經開始準備我們7月份的時候我們的冰水主機跟冷卻水塔都會進場 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].start |
22546.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].end |
22573.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].text |
那這個部分可能會造成因為時間很快現在五月了那等大院走完程序我們有點擔心看可不可以懇請支持我們就凍結一千萬好嗎現在的問題就在於就是說他的施工不但不良而且進度落後嘛導致說這個工程到現在還沒完工那你現在講到說七月份可以冷氣可以進場那但是整體的完工會是什麼時候還有因為他釀成這樣子一個災害 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].start |
22576.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].end |
22588.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].text |
損害的賠償嘛那所以整個的工程的這個經費也相對一定會縮減那這個部分的話是不是所以我才會提出要那個凍結那也不至於影響你們的這個整個的經費的支出 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].start |
22592.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].end |
22607.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].text |
這位修緣,昨晚我們假沒行的,因為你這是凍結案,凍結沒你看你給他撿一束,給他書面,把他督促而已,你這不是前列案嗎?你昨晚報告你沒行駛,我跟翁小玲說要再擺,賣賣賣,我賣賣賣賣 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].start |
22615.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].end |
22627.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].text |
現在我想了解的是說這個廠商到底他現在的施工的進度還有就是說他針對這個上次釀菜的部分的這個損害賠償的部分他們是不是有提出這樣子的一個請機關說明清楚來 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].start |
22628.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].end |
22646.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].text |
是這邊第二次報告那跟委員報告這個廠商因為這個施作不良長期這個供進沒辦法提升然後他的這個施作的這個品質也一直沒有通過那加上您剛才這個委員非常關注到的就是他這個在他 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].start |
22646.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].end |
22675.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].text |
沒有獲得授權的情況下造成這個火災所以我們已經跟他解約了那解約的這個部分呢目前在跟他做這個求償還有這個結算的這個部分那因為這個工區很長工區很大然後這個管線比較複雜所以我們這個結算也花了一些時間那等到這個結算在這個善後工程做完善後工程招標之後就可以把它做一個這個確認把這個執行率提上來那麼今年呢我們預計呢是換這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].start |
22679.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].end |
22693.454 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].text |
我們現在這一期是做這個冷卻水冷卻水塔那今年的七月份這是已經是我們的第三期第三期已經做這個冷卻水塔在今年的七月份就會做完那麼我們現在115的這個部分呢是要做這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].start |
22694.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].end |
22715.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].text |
最重要的冰水主機那冰水主機我們預計這個下半年也可以順利的招標希望獲得大運的支持我們能夠順利的招標然後完成這個如期如質的完成我們這個第四期也就是最後一期的冰水主機的汰換我再允許這樣是一千好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].start |
22716.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].end |
22723.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].text |
董一千 書面 或是你專案大選 我們兩個一起審我願意陪趙薇一起審 沒問題不要啦 不要在那裡專案啦 書面啦 好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].start |
22727.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].end |
22753.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].text |
所以針對這個部分的話就是其實你們現在好像看起來也不曉得我們的冷氣用了20年了這個已經是很老的冷氣了那我們預計如果說可以加速整個工程的話這個部分你們當然我想剛剛聽你們的其實你們工程你剛剛講說7月就會完成是嗎冰水主機7月份是這個冷卻水塔這是我們的第三期那整個工程什麼時候完成 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].start |
22755.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].end |
22770.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].text |
整個工程最後一期就是115年然後是最後是冰水主機是我們最後一個項目因為看起來就說這個工程照理說應該還要再簡列才對那因為其實你都沒有那個啊就廠商應該還要跟廠商索賠咧對不對所以照理說應該簡列啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].start |
22774.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].end |
22799.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].text |
第一二期的這個廠商我們正在跟他索賠跟這個這個球場那個進行當中那所以我們現在是新的廠商在第三期跟第四期是新的廠商因為他做的標的物不一樣第一個第三期就是所謂的這個冷卻水塔那我們今年現在115年要做的就是新要做的就是最後的一個冰水主機所以這個部分會在下半年我們希望能夠如期的這個進行下去 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].start |
22801.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].end |
22823.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].text |
那就凍結一千萬啦改書面好 第十一案那我們就基本行政工作維持凍結一千萬書面報告 使得凍資感謝遵照辦理第十二案來請翁小林官委員來說明一般行政的業務費 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].start |
22825.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].end |
22850.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].text |
這個部分的話是針對有關於特別費的問題就總統府的特別費那主要當然還是重複我一貫的刪減預算的理由就是現在中央政府年度的負債金額已經高達四千多億然後國防預算不斷的增加然後年度預算都已經將近上兆再加上特別預算又多了七千八百億所以只要是非必要性的支出基本上都應該要遵截使用 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].start |
22851.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].end |
22854.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].text |
不應該要編列過多的經費所以就特別費的情況來講也是一樣的所以本席在這邊提出認為說總統府的特別費應該要刪減提案解列5成150萬並且凍結150萬6千為什麼要凍結主要是因為總統其實基於憲法的義務他應該要 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].start |
22876.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].end |
22902.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].text |
公布法律還有要提名大法官以及相關的其他院的權力機關的成員可是我們現在賴清德總統他拒絕公布立法院三讀通過的法律沒有履行他的憲法的義務所以本席在這邊也提出凍結他的特別費150萬然後等到總統公布了相關法律之後才予以解凍以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].start |
22903.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].end |
22910.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].text |
BJ三百萬六千,你減劣一百五,凍結一百五六千,這樣就等於零了好啦,機關說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].start |
22912.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].end |
22939.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].text |
這個預算處理上可否懇請我們直接做通案的處理啦然後也跟汪委員報告一下其實這一筆錢的運用想跟您簡單的做一個簡述我這個禮拜不知道您有沒有看到一個新聞在大同區那邊有一個24歲的孩子他英勇救人所以自己離世了那很多時候我其實會代表總統去探訪這些 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].start |
22941.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].end |
22946.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].text |
用這些比較難過的社會角落或者是這些不同的這些緊急的狀況的人 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].start |
22951.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].end |
22977.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].text |
那這一筆錢裡面會有一些犒賞、慰勞或者是安慰等等那對我來講這都不會用在自己的身上它都有相對應的規定啦那也是懇請委員支持那但是在預算的部分當然是期待是否可以免於刪除免於凍結那但是如果在這是一個選項那不然就是我們直接做所謂的通案處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].start |
22978.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].end |
23004.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].text |
好 第十二案先保留 接下來第十三案 十三案吳宗興已經跟吳宗興溝通好了 第十三案就凍結5%那就304萬7千元 然後書面報告第十四案第十四案就是警衛行政工作維持 請提案委員徐宇貞委員說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].start |
23006.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].end |
23028.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].text |
這個本席是針對警衛行政工作維持的部分提出就我先重申改善基層的這個憲兵的住府營區的空間本席是絕對支持的但問題是就是目前的這個我看到的編列方式實在是讓我覺得很疑惑第一個就是總統府在第一幕的一般行政向下的警衛行政工作維持新增編列1800萬要辦理憲兵211營 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].start |
23033.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].end |
23050.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].text |
住府營社的空間改造工程但本席查閱預算書發現總統府在同一個年度又在基本行政工作維持裡面另編了一百萬叫做憲兵211營住府營社的養護也就是說在同一個年度同一個營區 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].start |
23051.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].end |
23070.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].text |
同樣編列了空間改造但又編列了例行養護那這樣子的一個狀況之下呢到底是既然已經在整這個裝修那為什麼還要這個養護所以本席就提出來就是說針對這個案子呢本席提出要簡列 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].start |
23071.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].end |
23072.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].text |
請機關說明報告委員這是兩筆預算 總統府歸總統府 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].start |
23093.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].end |
23113.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].text |
然後211營歸211那1800萬是歸211其實不瞞您說總統府我有私下去問過了因為之前像他的女兒牆有一些結構破裂其實總統府幾乎每一天都看得到老鼠那有些洞都還沒補起來所以我也跟委員真的實際報告說這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].start |
23115.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].end |
23135.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].text |
一般的基本行政維持這個100萬跟這一筆1800這個是兩邊兩個建築物啦所以懇請委員是否免於刪除跟凍結而且這一筆錢是真的是照顧24個小時在這邊輪班的這一群市官兵所以懇請委員支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].start |
23138.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].end |
23152.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].text |
當然我們是支持要照顧我們的這個憲兵這個沒有問題只是說必須要知道說這兩筆到底你剛說在不同的這個建築物那同樣都在211營的改善工程那到底是在哪兩棟不同的建築物一個是一個像 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].start |
23153.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].end |
23169.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].text |
包含像是水管管線 下水的水管的養護這是兩棟建築物 一個是總統府 另外一個是2121它要分開編列 它不是一起編在一起的我們是否也請我們業務單位這邊還有世衛室這裡來做回應好不好業務單位說明清楚來 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].start |
23175.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].end |
23200.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].text |
主席委員大家好我是總府侍衛室的副侍衛長關於這兩筆預算它是不同的用途但是都是使用在我們憲兵211營它的營舍那我也知道說各委員還有主席都非常照顧國軍的基層官兵211營它這棟營舍已經有70多年的歷史了所以說第一筆100萬的這個維修預算它是每年幾乎都編列 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].start |
23201.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].end |
23221.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].text |
讓他做一般性的維修比如說水管堵塞門把壞掉門窗壞掉玻璃破掉這是一般性的給他做維修因為這已經70多年的這個老建築了所以勢必這例行性維修這100多萬是非常有必要另外1800萬的部分這是延續去年去年我編列一筆針對他整個結構的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].start |
23225.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].end |
23253.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].text |
整修做一個規劃的設計那今年我們延續這規劃設計的成果在今年編列1800萬針對這老舊的建築做一個整體性的結構性的一個維修包含了它頂樓的漏水女兒牆的這個裂縫還有官兵隔間的改善比如說它在頂樓的漏水跟女兒牆因為70多年歷史都有崩落的這個危險性那因為它銀色比較老舊 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].start |
23255.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].end |
23275.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].text |
他在室內的空間我也把它做擴大讓官兵他們有可以有更舒適的生活空間所以這1800萬是做比較大方向結構性的這個整建100萬是做小的例行性的維修通水管然後修玻璃修門把類似這種小筆的維修以上報告那像這樣的維修不能在比如說你的1800萬的這個空間改善工程裡面就請他們維修嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].start |
23286.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].end |
23292.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].text |
這100萬的部分就是隨時壞掉我就有錢可以去做隨時的維修那這1800萬是做比較大規模結構性的一些整建我們就11齁 到14 整木動我們在想油 菜市場咧整木看差不多動多少 讓他們輸面 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].start |
23315.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].end |
23318.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].text |
是啊,你現在這樣凍多少?1304萬你這樣已經凍1304萬了我們是不是整目11到第14案我們看你差不多凍結數,像譬如說你凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].start |
23337.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].end |
23363.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].text |
我建議啦 好不好 妳現在1300多 妳現在對啊 可是我的第12案那個是特別費呢我知道 我現在意思說我們整幕來處理整幕來處理 可是我的凍結條件我不會改變我可以掃凍 可是我要付凍結條件那當然啦 各幕的解凍條件是個別啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].start |
23364.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].end |
23384.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].text |
各木的解凍條件當然是個別啊好不好 這樣不然你現在這個現在一千三百多 要不然來 何夫蜜我們整木來處理 你們才要凍多少這邊嗎 11到13因為第一到 你的第十一案到第十四案整木 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].start |
23387.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].end |
23404.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].text |
那個如果在剛剛14案討論完畢嘛 如果許委員意見加進來的話是否可以整筆的話 動1500好不好好 我們就11到14案許委員如果沒有意見的話差不多啦 動結1500萬12當然沒有啦 12當然就沒有 12是特別費啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].start |
23414.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].end |
23422.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].text |
不好意思 趙薇 我的意思是 我再問清楚就是說您剛剛講的是11案 13案跟14案這三案是嗎11 13 14包括12案嘛沒有啦 那就沒有啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].start |
23428.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].end |
23454.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].text |
十一十二十二還是保留十一十三十四第十四案的部分我是覺得因為事實上你很多的平常的這個養護工程其實你在整修的過程中應該就會做所以應該不用編到一百萬有需要編去年的是多少你每年編的是多少報告 報委員這邊一百萬後其實就有點類似誰到誰修的性質 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].start |
23458.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].end |
23471.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].text |
譬如說這邊壞掉,我這100萬就可以使用我說你們去年大概使用了多少?去年用了80萬左右去年的滋用是80萬2000元所以今年你多編20萬就編100萬?是,因為去年也是編100萬那是用80萬?是,去年用到80萬2000 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].start |
23487.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].end |
23498.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].text |
他們兩個都去菜市場買菜 跟你們斤斤計較十一 十三 十四現在十一 十三 十四沒有了這樣啦你的凍結就一千五啦然後書面報告使得凍滋啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].start |
23499.605 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].end |
23520.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].text |
許委員因為你剛剛的意見我有加進來原先的動資的金額是一千三現在就增加到一千五那這都是時報時銷而且是最後一筆這個就是給士官兵他們的生活起居啊當然我是支持的但是我只是覺得這個錢不要再重複的編列然後使用在這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].start |
23521.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].end |
23546.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].text |
同樣的地方來請張雅玲張委員我想補充一下我想聽起來這比較像是一個開口合約的概念就是說一般我們在公園各縣市政府的一些建設裡面都會編一個類似開口合約因為哪個零件壞掉就趕快隨編隨修所以我覺得聽起來像是有這樣子一個臨時彈性的需求畢竟就是一個古蹟而且是給官兵的一個空間所以我覺得聽起來是蠻合理的 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].start |
23555.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].end |
23564.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].text |
謝謝委員11 13 14 凍結1500 書面使得凍之徐委員 因為你前陣子已經一千三百多了嘛對 這個部分我們也是同意增加凍結的金額是啦 我說的 跟你說這個數字不可以同意 謝謝好 那就11 13 141500 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].start |
23578.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].end |
23596.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].text |
那第一個就動一千了咧那等於這裡只剩一百五我們現在一千三百幾,我們現在三目一併處理啦都用動前骨、輸面齒的動肢,這裡都算小條的啦你如果動而已,你這不是檢列啊我又有一個檢列,我又有一個檢列一百耶是啦,你也不要再加下去了 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].start |
23598.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].end |
23603.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].text |
好不好就11 13 14就我們凍結來整幕凍結1500我們第一幕一般行政提案第11案到第14案凍結1500萬就是案號是11 13 14然後呢針對並針對各凍結提案的要求依審查會決議提出書面報告後使得動之我們接著 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].start |
23623.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].end |
23634.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].text |
好了 第12案保留 這12案剛才已經有宣告 12案保留接著處理第二幕 國務機要費的部分提案案號第15案到第17案來 15到第17 我們第15案請國務機要費 請翁曉琳委員說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].start |
23643.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].end |
23650.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].text |
那麼同樣的就是國會計要費它也不是一個必要性急迫性的一個支出那麼基於尊潔公帑那麼同時也要督促就是賴清德總統應該要履行他的憲政義務而盡速地將 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].start |
23660.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].end |
23677.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].text |
五項沒有公布的法律儘速公布所以本期在這裡提案簡列國務績要費一千萬並且凍結兩千萬那麼等這個賴清德總統他公布法律之後就可以立刻解凍了那麼這筆費用也不得留用雲芝那麼以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].start |
23678.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].end |
23692.911 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].text |
好啦 第15案就保留啦 你這樣定義零啊 你就減裂1000 凍結2000你的凍結解凍條件跟第12案又一樣 就是相同的事由我們第15案先保留 來接下來第16案 請徐以珍徐委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].start |
23694.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].end |
23717.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].text |
謝謝主席 針對這個國教費的部分就是相較於這個115年度是編列3000萬相較於114年度的1000萬就增加了這個2000萬那在這個部分呢 我們可以看到就是說去年增加的 去年編列1000萬那事實上的執行也沒有問題那為什麼今年還要再增加2000萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].start |
23719.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].end |
23735.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].text |
那還有就是說總統府也這邊有講說這個刪減國際交費可能會影響對弱勢團體或社福的機構的關懷照顧那其實弱勢的這個照顧應該有社福政策制度預算還有主管機關有衛福部內政部其他部會都可以來承擔 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].start |
23737.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].end |
23759.813 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].text |
那我不是說國際藥肺都是用來包裝成這個社會照顧然後要請我們說不能刪不能審所以針對這個部分的話本席就是要求就是能夠減劣一千萬然後凍結一千萬請示召委員可以回應委員的對請機關來做說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].start |
23762.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].end |
23763.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].text |
第二件事情委員的邏輯非常清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].start |
23777.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].end |
23799.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].text |
弱勢團體社福應該是有政策面去執行沒有錯但是實際大型的一些NGO像是燒燙商的孩子或者是各式各樣弱勢團體等等他們其實都會有稅入跟稅出就在去年他們其實很詫異我們總統府的國務及要費被刪掉之後他們的鳳梨酥我們不能買了 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].start |
23800.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].end |
23805.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].text |
他們的手工香皂我們不能買他們的稅務有減少那這一塊其實是幫助這些社福團體他們有自行在自行很努力在用自己的雙手站起來這一群孩子或這一群老小孩等等的給他們一個機會然後也讓他們社會更認識他們那這個部分所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].start |
23819.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].end |
23835.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].text |
要拜託委員支持我們這些弱勢團體支持我們這些社福團體那第二件事情要跟您報告就是說我們的軍警銷打比方說裡面會有一個加菜金也放在這個國務局要費裡面他們一年四季 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].start |
23836.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].end |
23855.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].text |
一個禮拜七天24個小時包含過年的時候東海在海上在山上吹冷風我們在維魯他們在那邊執勤那個加菜精就放在我們的國務紀要費裡面所以也要再拜託那另外一個部分國務紀要費 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].start |
23856.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].end |
23877.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].text |
像我剛剛有跟您報告過 像鏟子超人 挖土機超人 當然是代表台灣的精神這些人不幸離世 那總統會親自本人抵達 並且用國務及要費表達國家的一點點的心意這個部分 所以要拜託可否支持 那另外一個我也要跟委員再報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].start |
23878.3 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].end |
23905.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].text |
這一筆錢都不會用在總統個人的身上個人的身上絕對不會而是用在這些社會上面弱勢的照顧還有我們軍警銷他們的這些慰問以及加菜金所以 懇請支持一些過往也從來都沒有刪過可否支持我們這一筆預算我們這一筆預算也沒有任何做任何的增加只是回復到跟以前一樣而已再拜託 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].start |
23907.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].end |
23917.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].text |
其實十五跟十六是一樣的,我保留十五,我跟你們說十六、十七是假的但是你們要再說明,我覺得我也很樂意,來請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].start |
23920.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].end |
23925.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].text |
是這樣的 因為剛剛何富密這邊講的有關於國務機要費過去都沒有刪但是我有想 前幾屆的總統也沒有像賴清德總統這樣就是都不遵守憲法義務然後該公佈的法律也沒有公佈然後該提名的大法官也沒有提名所以我已經說了 此一時彼一時也更何況就是說現在國務機要費聽起來 從剛剛何富密的說法聽起來好像就是給總統做面子 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].start |
23947.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].end |
23964.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].text |
我很支持總統要有愛心我也很支持核蜂蜜要有愛心就是我們大家所有的立法委員民意代表也都很有愛心但是我們都是掏自己的腰包去買這些東西然後去慰勞我們的員工或慰勞其他的弱勢團體結果現在這個國務卿要費變成是說拿來 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].start |
23971.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].end |
23990.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].text |
這個給總統去發慰問金然後去買這些愛心的禮物加菜金總統每個月的薪水有六七十萬吧總統如果說真的是認為說這些國軍弟兄們這些員警銷要給他們鼓勵要給他們這個想補助他也可以自己 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].start |
23991.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].end |
24018.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].text |
自己表示他的意思啊為什麼要用國務紀要費要用特資費我再講就是說如果說我們今天沒有那麼多的經費的支出我們沒有那麼高的舉債我們可以了解或許可以容許就是總統有一些特別費然後有一些國務紀要費現在就是因為我們的政府大幅的舉債我們政府支出非常之多所以我才一直希望我們總統府能夠帶頭表率 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].start |
24020.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].end |
24027.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].text |
能省則省有些愛心是不打折扣的總統自己就可以做了為什麼一定要拿國庫紀要費來做我唱歌給你聽跟劉德華唱給你聽就完全不一樣嘛那這一筆預算是代表國家代表國家不一樣完全不一樣一個是個人 一個是代表國家行使這個原錦霄博士一定說我相信對於當事人來講 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].start |
24046.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].end |
24050.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].text |
你們不要說了 這段我替你們說你們對自己的業務應該再熟悉一點國家元首 國務績要費國家元首在行使職權所需相關的費用這三千萬是訪視 犒賞 講助 慰問 接待那政理跟其他相關的一個費用但是我看起來因為剛剛第十五 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].start |
24074.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].end |
24089.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].text |
十五加一 十四 八八八 十五十五里 翁委員那裡就已經剪裂一千 又動兩千那那個徐委員的部分是是剪裂一千 然後凍結一千 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].start |
24090.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].end |
24113.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].text |
你第三個林佩祥比你們兩個更有良心,這個答案20%而已所以這條就保留了,不然再多說你們兩個,說你們如果說不下去了當然我也可以少動啦,但是我的解凍條件還是要在,我可以簡列一千然後凍結一千但是你的解凍條件的定義就不定義,好啦我也把它遵守了先保留啦,你那個簡列的部分是變多少?零 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].start |
24113.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].end |
24143.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].text |
要不要檢列一千啊檢列一千喔是跟徐宇政委員一樣啊檢列一千要保留咧就是檢列一千要凍結一千啊只是說我的凍結條件要在檢列一千凍一千對啊徐委員啊就跟徐委員一樣啦是說解凍條件不一樣啦對嗯那先保留吧 好不好那個所以三案都保留嗎三案先保來 我就看你們你們會不會 我不相信你們會不會再接受你們解凍條件等於你們做不到的喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].start |
24144.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].end |
24145.155 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].start |
24147.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].end |
24174.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].text |
那個報告召委跟委員我們這15案16案17案肯請保留好嗎要保留啊來我先來宣告那個第二幕國務機要提案案號15到17案第15案16案17案保留送協商那我們接下來處理第4幕研究發展提案案號第18案到第19案18案許徐毅曾委員請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].start |
24178.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].end |
24200.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].text |
針對第18案本席是這個提出115年度的總統府在這個國家發展研究跟諮詢上下的國政規劃跟諮詢編列了457萬5千那這筆錢是用來辦理總統公佈法律任免官員提名監察委員以及召開專案議題會議等核心幕僚的作業問題是這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].start |
24203.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].end |
24225.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].text |
總統府既然拿這筆預算做國政規劃跟憲政幕僚就不能只在政治上服務總統喔那尤其是現在這個剛剛講說提名監察委員現在也沒有提名嘛還有近期的多項的重大的人事的提名跟政策的推動總統府也都沒有充分的尊重國會的知情權跟監督權喔那尤其是這個像我們的這個剛剛 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].start |
24228.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].end |
24253.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].text |
剛剛翁委員也特別提到了我們現在很多的像不管是監察委員各項的這個提名作業現在也一直都還沒有完成那所以針對這個部分總統府如果編列國政諮詢的預算卻不能在重大人事跟重大的國防政策重大的財政支出上建立跟國會的事前溝通的機制那這筆的這個預算的功能到底在哪裡所以本席 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].start |
24255.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].end |
24278.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].text |
剪裂該項預算的一百萬並凍結兩百萬那也要求總統提出專案報告說明未來有重大人士提名的時候要如何尊重立法院的同意權那重大的政策如何避免外媒優先國會滯後並提出重建國會互信的這個具體方案來第四方案請機關說明那我們有請一位單位主席各位 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].start |
24288.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].end |
24304.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].text |
報告主席委員我是總統府第一局局長郭鴻榮關於委員提案的第18案談到的國家發展研究及諮詢的這一塊我分三點說明第一個這個預算的部分114年我們的執行率是89%就是說我們編列435萬那我們決算是385萬4千這是第一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].start |
24314.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].end |
24340.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].text |
第二個這次增加的部分主要是因為第七屆監察委員提名作業提名作業那剛剛委員所垂行的跟委員這邊報告是總統這個在進行這些提名作業的時候一定會尊重國會的人事同意權那依法我們也會提供這個被提名的相關資料也會配合黨團問卷另外秘書長也會協同被提名的人拜會立法院爭取黨團的支持所以不會不尊重國會 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].start |
24341.91 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].end |
24364.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].text |
至於委員剛剛所特別提到的第三個地方是國防特別預算的部分總統投書國際媒體是為了面對區域的安全挑戰向國際社會說明台灣自我防衛的決心並不是取代國內的民主程序所以相關條例也一定會送到立法院來接受立法院的監督這個案子我們是不是懇請委員不要簡列就並案凍結100萬這是我們的建議 以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].start |
24371.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].end |
24385.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].text |
不過事實是立法院確實是先看到國外的媒體才知道這件事情並沒有先跟國會這邊來溝通事實上不是這樣嗎還有現在監察委員的你剛剛講說相關的提名作業到現在目前進行到什麼程度 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].start |
24387.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].end |
24399.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].text |
現在正在進行 因為我們省建作業已經對外公開徵求監察委員應該是要這個換屆的時間已經到了監察委員第六屆監察委員是7月31日任期屆滿那我們按照期程會在一定時間之內會把名單送過來那這個 徐委員前列我們就把它總結了 好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].start |
24414.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].end |
24416.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].text |
那主席的建議是不是10萬塊讓我們這邊比較好運作因為監察委員的省監督已經都在進行當中了 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].start |
24439.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].end |
24455.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].text |
好啦 這樣十八 第十八案 許惟弘我們就提案的部分我們就減列十萬好不好減列二十啦減列 怎麼記住了好啦 那第十八案減列二十萬比較完整預算啦然後 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].start |
24457.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].end |
24483.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].text |
這樣就凍結了,不用拿那不然我們就遵照辦理,檢列20萬好,第18案檢列20萬但是因為目前到底這個會最後會不會怎麼進行,要不然很多其實我們像之前的這個什麼我們在這個中選會的這個委員也是一直拖拖拖拖到後面中選會是行政院負責,那監察委員我們一定會送過來對,所以我的意思是說也沒有在期限內那個完成 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].start |
24486.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].end |
24493.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].text |
問題是你們沒有公佈三組的預算第十八案就檢列二十萬 第十九案因為我們檢列二十萬但凍結五十萬請兩個月內然後提出書面報告好不好第十八案檢列二十萬凍結五十萬提書面報告這樣好嗎我們遵照辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].start |
24515.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].end |
24526.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].text |
第十九案,提案委員沒來,我們就交18案做決定,第十九案我們就不處理,那這兩目一起來 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].start |
24530.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].end |
24550.895 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].text |
我們第4幕研究發展提案案號第18案到第19案第19案我們就不予處理然後本幕合併就簡列20案的提案號18案凍結50萬那提出書面報告後 使得動之我們接下來處理第5幕新聞發布的提案案號第20案到第22案 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].start |
24555.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].end |
24563.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].text |
20案到22案 第20案請提案委員 徐委員 徐宇貞委員請說明針對這個總統府在新聞發布是編列869萬8千比114年度的590萬9千增加了278萬9千元增幅高達47.2%大概已經快要增加五成了 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].start |
24579.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].end |
24607.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].text |
那因為其實新聞的聯繫跟發佈確實是這個總統府必要的幕僚作業但是現在其實是已經一個這個數位治理跟AI工具快速發達的一個時代所以說現在其實有很多都是可以用AI來執行而且可以節省很多這個重新的這個行政作業書面作業那所以針對這個部分我覺得在政府這個裁員有限各機關都應該尊潔的一個狀況下總統府作為最高的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].start |
24610.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].end |
24626.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].text |
這個機構應該是要帶頭示範所以本席就提出要檢列這個一百萬元那也請總統府要全面檢討新聞發布的業務建立數位化精簡化的作業模式以達到以更少的經費達到同等的溝通的一個效果 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].start |
24627.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].end |
24641.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].text |
好 這個報告召委員機關請說明報告召委跟委員齁我進來總統府之後還真的給他全面檢討我們的作業我發現幾件非常驚人的事情齁總統府那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].start |
24642.766 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].end |
24660.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].text |
這個打燈的燈啊居然已經存在那邊二十幾年了然後我還去摸一下它的電線它已經水解氧化你摸下去的時候會黏黏的我很怕再放著放著它那個裡面的電線就跑出來了然後呢那個燈喔開下去的時候有時候還會有一些味道跑出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].start |
24661.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].end |
24676.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].text |
所以的確有尊潔也需要全面檢討所以我們極度的需要這一筆預算那我也知道徐委員徐委員的瞭解就是說這一筆預算到底實際上面在做些什麼為什麼增加這麼多為什麼這一筆預算會增加這麼多是因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].start |
24684.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].end |
24700.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].text |
我們去年三胎多所以今年的增幅才會增加47%那有幾個大幅度的影響第一個就是說我們去年總統府的Line整個關掉了那也暫時無法運作那第二件事情是針對 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].start |
24701.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].end |
24717.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].text |
全球的受眾還有全國的受眾他們知的權利怎麼說像我們有一些朋友他耳朵可能他有聽力的一些比較辛苦的地方他們會很希望有字幕這是對國內的 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].start |
24718.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].end |
24741.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].text |
那對國內的受眾來講其實台灣現在新聞等等或任何節目都還是有字幕所以國內的受眾很期待要有受眾之外我們對國外的使館或國外的友邦等等的當總統像史瓦帝尼在發表談話的時候會有一個AI的即時字幕那是以見濟酬所以我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].start |
24742.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].end |
24759.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].text |
前一陣子有時候沒有很多使館的朋友都會說可不可以請我們恢復但是我們真的沒有錢沒有錢去做AI的即時字幕那第三件事情就是說我們部分的直播等等的其實我們薪資有所調漲基本公司也調漲了 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].start |
24760.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].end |
24771.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].text |
所以我們才會把這個預算做一些增加那最後一個部分因為不是增加一些是增加快五成那所以我們還是有點困惑我們去年被刪太多了所以你剛剛講說什麼電線老舊什麼的話跟這筆經費有什麼關係是因為剛剛委員您的提醒我一直放心裡你說我們應該要全面檢討總統府整個新聞的作業 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].start |
24781.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].end |
24782.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].text |
請問一下去年的新聞發布你們做的怎麼樣? |
| transcript.whisperx[577].start |
24799.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].end |
24823.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].text |
我們去年的新聞發布都在最最最最結局的狀況下去完成的那既然去年也可以完成今年為什麼要增加我們我們其實有很多國內外的朋友也很期待說像是我們AI的即時字幕可以恢復那這一筆預算裡面在這邊有很重要那這一筆錢跟所謂的台灣的任何的媒體都完全沒有配額純粹是我們總統府總統 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].start |
24826.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].end |
24849.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].text |
他在做任何重要的發言的時候的作業的經費所以懇請支持那還是再跟委員重複報告一次他會增加的原因是因為去年算太多那我們很期待要讓我們及時正確的還有精準的訊息可以對國內外包含對委員們來表達清楚這個部分我跟大家說啦你這樣說下去 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].start |
24852.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].end |
24881.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].text |
現在就是說許委員現在要減劣一百萬總統府機關這個地方希望怎麼樣我們希望是否全面支持我們這筆預算不要做任何的刪除 要拜託許委員你會看法沒有減一百萬就好因為今年真的增加滿多的 增加47%多啊所以我覺得要減劣一些啦因為其實其他兩位委員他們一個減兩百萬一個減六十六萬七千嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].start |
24882.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].end |
24897.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].text |
可不可以建議減50就好了因為其實總統府總統的發言也是國際上對我們整個中華民國的情勢很重要那有必要提升那我們看到地方政府其實他們的新聞的相關費用都更高那也請那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].start |
24899.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].end |
24905.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].text |
徐委員能夠支持就減50%去年編列多少就是今年增加278萬9千沒有這樣啦 今年增加278萬9千就照范委員所提的 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].start |
24916.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].end |
24944.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].text |
沒有 我沒有同意因為其實就是其實比上年度增加了278萬9千所以我提出減了100其實是已經還增加了178萬9千我想請教一下就是說因為這個增幅47.2%那你們原本在114年原本你們編列的預算是多少那113年你們的決算數字又多少我覺得可能從這樣子來看會比較知道到底增幅是多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].start |
24944.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].end |
24966.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].text |
是 跟那個委員報告 我們113年的時候也是編列800多萬那114年的時候被刪到590萬那今年115 所以是原本是800多 113 800多 114 500多 115回到800多所以我們是回到正常的運作狀態 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].start |
24967.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].end |
24987.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].text |
那過去一直以來這一筆預算都維持一個很穩定的運作去年真的是非常特別非常特別我要在這邊懇請委員支持因為國內外其實都很重視台灣那委員也一直在強調期待我們總統府可以對外的這些講話要多一點點所以這一筆錢就是讓總統可以說話的錢再拜託懇請支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].start |
24992.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].end |
24998.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].text |
許委你本來提案是減一百 我減一百 或者可不可以以凍結的方式處理對 拜託委員拜託委員這筆真的太重要太重要了我已經我就是減 減裂一百啊或者是可不可否 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].start |
25016.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].end |
25023.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].text |
可否改為動100好不好我們很期待如果減10萬塊我們覺得我們還是可以啦如果10萬塊可否拜託拜託拜託 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].start |
25046.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].end |
25057.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].text |
對 可是如果說從這個角度來看 你們去年新聞發布也沒有說這個講的話不夠多啊 或是講的內容也不夠精彩啊 人家是很精彩啊 人家是總統還是講話講很多 又有團結五講 團結四講嘛所以基本上就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].start |
25063.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].end |
25076.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].text |
由此可見就是這個經費多寡並不影響到你們的新聞發布那麼還是基於這個剛剛的理由嘛這個政府的經費就應該要增結然後許與鄭委員已經很好心了你們是多增加248萬他只有減列100萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].start |
25080.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].end |
25096.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].text |
我認為說其實總統府應該要接手啦但是我剛剛聽他們說明的時候啊我覺得那個LINE的工具上面他們好像因此沒有辦法去散播嘛所以經驗度還有增加 因為我減了100還有增加178.9萬對 可是因為你剛剛還有講到AI字幕的導入嘛不可能 那個需要到可能減50就好不要啦 一百啦 因為要增加很多你給他增加那三五十 凍五十啦三五十 凍五十 這樣可以嗎三五十 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].start |
25109.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].end |
25121.415 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].text |
剪裂五十啦 剪裂五十然後凍結五十剪裂五十好不好 剪裂五十就好 不凍嘛對不對剪裂五十凍五十啦 剪裂五十凍五十 輸免報告這樣就剪裂五十 你的許委員這大咖都給你提了幾十萬的行情都要補位 剪裂五十 凍結五十 輸免報告使得凍資 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].start |
25145.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].end |
25162.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].text |
第五幕新聞發布提案案號第20案到22案21案 22案我們就不予處理啦那本幕合併檢列50萬 凍結50萬並針對各凍結提案的要求依審查會決議提出書面報告或使得動之我們繼續處理第一項總統府之主決議提案案號23案到29案 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].start |
25174.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].end |
25186.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].text |
來 那個23案主決 我的這個有問題嗎?遵照辦理好來 24案有問題嗎?遵照辦理25案有問題嗎?遵照辦理26案文字修正 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].start |
25190.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].end |
25195.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].text |
我們來沒問題啦齁 文字都已經修正過了27案 文字修正好 28案 29案 30案啊沒有 那就算了 到29而已啊30案 還有一個撥下去 全部都過關了 來 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].start |
25207.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].end |
25229.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].text |
那個組決議提案案號第23案到第29案照案通過是23到2528案29案修正通過是26到27案那第一款第一項總統府處理完畢我們繼續處理第一款第二項國家安全會議人事費提案案號第30案30案來國安會提案委員簽請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].start |
25240.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].end |
25249.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].text |
他上廁所上廁所這樣我們就先停一下好不好因為你三十還是先休息 主席休息一下先休息五分鐘好不好 休息五分鐘你們總統府的玻璃有了喔保留的是總統府的處理所嘛那總統府的可以先離開啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].start |
25269.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].end |
25270.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].text |
這樣可以了這樣他們保留幾個人 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].start |
25703.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].end |
25719.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].text |
我們繼續開會現在開始國安會國家安全第三十案到第三十案來 提案委員翁曉琳委員請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].start |
25724.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].end |
25741.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].text |
好謝謝主席那麼在國安會的這個部分基本上他們編列預算的方式跟總統府還蠻像的就是實際上他們執行的費用並不多就執行率並不高可是呢卻每年都是編這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].start |
25743.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].end |
25766.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].text |
多好幾倍的這樣的費用所以在這一次有關於約聘僱人員待遇的部分本席也看到一些狀況那麼包含就是說主要我現在想講的就是在114年當時我們的預算數是只有200萬左右但是他決算數竟然是暴增了 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].start |
25767.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].end |
25787.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].text |
兩倍多到了593萬那麼明明就是說我們的預算沒有給那麼多錢為什麼可以去這個超額的聘僱這些人員然後整個的約聘僱的費用是多了將近三倍那今年的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].start |
25790.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].end |
25814.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].text |
他們編的約聘僱人員的費用也是比往年多了兩倍到三倍比去年就多了三倍那本席認為說其實國安會的約聘僱人員並不需要再多增加那麼維持之前一二年一三年的那樣的一個狀況基本上也就夠了那為什麼要 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].start |
25816.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].end |
25840.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].text |
增加這麼多的人數而且經費也大幅的暴增所以我在這裡提案就是減劣一百萬並且凍結一成然後不得留用請機關做說明好非常感謝主席謝謝翁委員其實我剛也參與到總統府的這個預算審查也感謝委員對於說凍結國家預算凍結人民血汗錢的一個堅持這部分是非常敬佩 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].start |
25841.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].end |
25855.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].text |
但至於說這個人事部分尤其是這個月聘僱的部分其實最主要是因為當時到108年的時候就是因為當時的法令有調整所以因此我們也報這個行政院專案同意要新增加三位這個月聘僱的人員 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].start |
25856.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].end |
25874.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].text |
那這三位約聘僱的人員其實當時是放在其他的這個預算科目下面因為那預算是沒有辦法去支應的那115年開始我們就把這個三位約聘僱的人員放到正常的科目裡面也就是這個約聘的一個科目裡面所以主要增加的大宗是來自這裡153萬是來自這裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].start |
25877.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].end |
25902.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].text |
那當然我們現在主要我想就是我們約聘跟約僱的部分就分別為七個人跟三個人這都是依法處理的那平均的年薪分別為七十七萬跟五十一萬所以無論是一百一十四年或一百一十五年我們都是以足而禁用所以也沒有超額而且也不會就是繼續的禁用但確實這個涉及到的預算需求就是六百六十二萬那這個就是完全用於薪水的使用以上報告這樣說明翁委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].start |
25907.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].end |
25931.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].text |
它確實也是實際上人員的禁用我的疑問就是說因為在過去的十年基本上維持原來的規模就是原額的規模並不會影響到國安會的功能會影響到他們的業務影響到你們的業務那為什麼要增加這麼多的人比如說增加這些錢基本上也都是公帑 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].start |
25933.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].end |
25947.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].text |
事實上是沒有必要 而且更何況你114年還先斬後奏對 我跟委員報告 其實主要是這第一個我認同 就是說如果我看到這預算科目的話我也會覺得說這怎麼會這麼離奇 增加221%我還是回到 因為最主要是108年 當時那個勝仗法生效之後所以因為本會議要符合這個法規的條件所以必須依法增加這三位這位同仁來禁用 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].start |
25959.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].end |
25979.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].text |
但三位同仁經營的時候因為當時編的預算也不足以去指引這三位同仁所以後來這三位同仁我們在115年就今年的時候我們就把他納入到該有的一個科目所以主要增加的大宗是來自於這個依法的這個要求並不是我們今天進來了之後突然之間說要增加這個三位約顧所以導致的 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].start |
25982.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].end |
26007.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].text |
這樣說明我看國際安全會議看起來他也符合法令的一個依據是這樣的我基本上我也只是從他們662萬然後提案檢列100萬然後但是就這個部分來講的話其實還是跟你們這個114年就算你們已經先斬後作新拼了三個人也是600萬嘛所以我基本上我這樣子的檢法這樣的刪減 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].start |
26010.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].end |
26017.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].text |
並不是不合理頂多就是說可以拙減個要不然就是不減一百萬但是我認為還是要緊因為如果不這樣的話你們就會無限膨脹你們的員額數然後再說你們剛剛講的說竟然是又說是什麼聘身障的人員那這部分我完全沒有看到你們目前現在聘過的狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].start |
26033.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].end |
26037.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].text |
我們其實說明裡面第二點有提到這部分就是本會議三位約僱人員的這個職缺是經108年行政院專案同意的所以這個部分是後來才納編到我們這個編制職員的待遇中但是如果說是因為要聘伸帳人員他是要符合法規的一個規定條件 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].start |
26052.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].end |
26065.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].text |
那這個部分的話我可能我可以這個您與同意但是我現在我沒有看到你們所聘的這些約聘僱的人員他的身份是如何所以我的想法是說那委員可不可以動下來我們提供報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].start |
26071.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].end |
26096.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].text |
按照法規來 因為法規的改變 按照法規來禁用所以三十案這個 翁委員我們現在檢列的部分就賣了但是呢 翁委員就認為說你們這些人到底是哪些人你們再說明啊 不然我們就先跟凍結看幾趴 阿輝跟你說明我基本上還是要檢列 因為檢列100萬檢列但是它現在法規規定啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].start |
26099.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].end |
26102.65 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].text |
因為這只是用於付薪水的部分如果這樣的話你前面幾年不是也全部都違法你現在反而還自曝我們沒有違法因為當時是行政院專案有同意我們有包合行政院規定如果說這是勞基法規定的話你們這個沒有拼滿的話你本來就違法當時法律是108年生效的 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].start |
26116.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].end |
26129.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].text |
對 所以你1 2 1 3 1 4 你都沒有增加啊有 我們都有 但是我們是報行政院專案同意所以當時 並不是算在現在的預算科目裡面是啦 這也是定義符合我們立法院來修法的一個要求啦但是我想委員提到這個確實2.2倍我覺得這個是我們要深度說明所以如果委員可以同意的話我們提供書面報告那委員看了書面報告覺得這個是符合法規而且是符合相關的一些要求的話我們再動之 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].start |
26141.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].end |
26147.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].text |
這樣凍結10%提供書面以後使得凍資好不好因為這是一個說明的問題啦好不好那第三十案我還沒有說好所以是我我仍然是認為說這個費用太高就是我要求就是提案檢列50萬然後凍結我可以凍結少一點然後請他們提供這個相關報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].start |
26166.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].end |
26181.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].text |
等一下我再問一下那個減60萬以後你們這樣可以符合規定嗎就是薪水就變成說會付不可能要請我們人事室主任再來說明來來來說明一下說明一下急救但是我怕你們這樣變成不符合規定請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].start |
26186.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].end |
26200.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].text |
報告主席及委員就這個部分當然如果簡略的話在我們約聘僱人員的人事費的支應上是確實是會有一點困難那就剛才就是我們複密報告所提到的就是就增加2.2倍的這個部分因為之前的 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].start |
26204.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].end |
26231.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].text |
約聘僱的人事費當時是因為行政院專案核准嘛所以我們是用職員的員額去做指引所以當時的約聘僱的人事費是編載職員那個部分那在115年的人事費在編列的時候呢我們就把它區隔開來回到約聘僱這邊來做一個處理那以至於說就看起來好像照片上就會多出很多那 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].start |
26235.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].end |
26247.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].text |
可不可以容許我們之後再報告的部分就這個部分再詳細做說明以上你們662萬662萬假設通過662萬你們的執行率要夠多現在是人都已經滿額了嗎是 報告主席現在已經是滿編的狀態所以這是核實計算的結果就是一個約聘人員意思是說如果給你貸多少萬有人就念不住心碎了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].start |
26262.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].end |
26266.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].text |
其實這個是核實計算的結果就如同剛才鳳咪所提到的就是我們的約聘的人員一個人的年薪就是77萬然後約顧的部分就是51萬那目前真的確實是滿邊 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].start |
26284.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].end |
26296.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].text |
那如果就是在決議上就是增加科目不能留用的話那這樣子這同仁真的會薪水付不出來以上說明這樣是不是 翁委員他這個很詳細的說明這條因為定義臨時費用啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].start |
26302.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].end |
26313.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].text |
我知道這個人事費用我是支持啦但是事實上就是說他這邊也是講你115年是編列是508萬可是你這裡的話是編了662萬代表說你們還是想要再擴編不是嗎他現在是講說已經滿編了那你們自己這裡又寫說在第二說明裡面就說你們在125年預算中編列508萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].start |
26331.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].end |
26344.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].text |
再說明報告委員其實508萬的部分是我們的約聘人員那我們的約聘人員是工作內容是什麼其實是因為我們是國安機關然後負責就是諮詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].start |
26346.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].end |
26371.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].text |
研究相關工作那依照我們的出入規程的第6條規定我們為了諮詢研究工作可以組成工作小組那成員呢可以是來自會裡面的同仁或者是戒掉其他機關的同仁又或者是可以聘用就是約聘的助理那我們這裡所列出來的500多萬的這個人事費呢事實上就是這幾就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].start |
26372.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].end |
26388.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].text |
依照行政院的規定只能各機關禁用約聘人員只能5%嘛所以那我們就是六位那另外的話一個是行政院專案核准資安人員也可以用約聘的方式來禁用所以總共就是七位的約聘人員 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].start |
26389.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].end |
26404.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].text |
那委員垂詢到就是過去在2011年就是在約聘人員的編列上就是不管是預算書或者是執行率上面都比較低的 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].start |
26404.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].end |
26427.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].text |
原因是來自於說剛才有提到這些諮詢研究工作的工作小組成員可以是來自於其他機關的借調所以過去呢我們本於尊潔行政經費的原則所以長官們就是如果可以借調他機關的優秀同仁一起來參與國安工作的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].start |
26428.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].end |
26446.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].text |
我們就是長官們會用這樣的方式來做處理那到114年的話我們就回歸到體制內回歸到會裡面的同仁來做一個領補所以在數據的呈現上才有這樣子的一個差異 以上委員我做個補充比較白話的 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].start |
26452.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].end |
26476.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].text |
借調到國安會的人員的薪資到底是哪個單位來給原機關原機關是原機關不是國安會是原機關所以你們現在國安會到底有沒有借調人員委員我們國安會一直都有借調人員是哪個機關的借調人員 防務部嗎會有不同機關的借調人員那至於確切的部會可能要回去我再跟委員後續補充資料是不是可以請人事主任現在比較清楚現在有哪些機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].start |
26477.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].end |
26494.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].text |
好 報告委員現在我們借調的同仁呢會來自於像外交部經濟部然後還有就是國防部沒有法務部那法務部只有一位調查局的專員調查局的專員那目前的借調的情形是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].start |
26495.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].end |
26510.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].text |
那所以他們借調來的話 他們的薪水是由國安會來負擔不是 也是原機關原機關負擔原機關那所以你現在意思說你們要改變做法以後他們的薪水是要由國安會來負擔報告委員 並不是這一些借調的人員都還是在原機關執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].start |
26512.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].end |
26541.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].text |
所以剛剛講說是現在之所以多編的那個薪水是怎麼樣我們現在不管是114年足額的禁用或115年的足額禁用都是我們本會議的同仁都是你們自己屬於國安會的是對這個編制內的是是是好那所以你們在剛剛在說明二裡面說你們只有編只需要用508萬這個就是七位七位的約聘同仁 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].start |
26542.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].end |
26554.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].text |
然後再加另外三位的月僱然後月僱的部分是153萬6千所以合計起來就是662萬的部分跟委員報告其實委員第一個問題就是會不會再增加我們就是現在已經是滿編的狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].start |
26558.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].end |
26579.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].text |
但是我還是希望知道說你們現在就是除了這七位再加上三位的約僱人員那約僱人員你剛剛說是因為又基於勞基法要聘請身障的人士那這些資料的話也麻煩請你提供給我還有就是剛剛因為填到國安會議的計較人員的部分因為法務部一直說法務部有說好像有計較檢察官 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].start |
26581.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].end |
26601.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].text |
這個我跟委員報告我們後來真的有去釐清這件事情因為確實我們有看到新聞的報導我可以跟委員報告就是沒有我們沒有去戒掉這個所謂檢察官的部分沒有只有調查局如果按照你們剛剛說的法案是有調查局而且那個應該是比較長年的這不是近期所以他們工作地點是在國安會還是說是在在國安會那個調查局幾年 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].start |
26604.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].end |
26612.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].text |
調查局那個同仁應該在國安會已經服務三年多三年多了 對 以上但是他們還是有一個期限在所以期限到底還是會回到原機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].start |
26613.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].end |
26638.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].text |
那個借調的題目如果跟這筆經費沒有關係我們是不是改天再質詢他們那我想剛剛講的10個人的耶這個年度662萬一個人平均66萬你再減下去就變低薪了耶我是覺得這樣子好像不太好啦因為他畢竟也是為了國家安全在這邊努力的人士我們不要就是說可能動一點點讓他們再說明什麼10萬之類的這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].start |
26641.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].end |
26646.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].text |
那個我來說明一下 我就把它整個國安會的人員 我看一看這個我認為我們倒是可以放行啦 但是他那個現在是滿邊啦你注意去把它看喔 我本來是說你國安會是多大的哇 你這間八十六公有六個 駕駛十六個 聘用七個 約顧三個你都做合計也到一個一百多個 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].start |
26669.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].end |
26681.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].text |
你其他的電影都叫救人救人 救人你要發薪水啊你們就是A個部會而已啊是要救人力而已啊所以我看這個齁 合作合作這個不是像我們說的 什麼高薪啦他這個也不是 他這個是約聘然後滿編你看那個薪水也不高啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].start |
26687.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].end |
26701.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].text |
而且還是身障那一部分,所以我是覺得翁委員這個給予他啦,這是臨時的給予他啦,他也沒有改變,他現在是滿編,也不是今年突然增加,以上也跟翁委員來做一個說明,我告訴你,翁委員你如果跟我說得清楚一堂,來給他運好啦,我不給你騙啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].start |
26703.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].end |
26721.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].text |
好那這樣的話我就不簡列但是我要凍結因為我需要看到就是說你們實際上的那個報告好 這樣就法委我們遵照 你們就記錄他好不好坦白說我現在對於其他機關不是那麼相信喔是啦是啦 所以就要看我們會提供書面資料這樣就凍結10%還沒 你就凍結10%你們趕快提供書面然後凍資啦好謝謝委員 謝謝朝委不好意思 不好意思這大家說得清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].start |
26734.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].end |
26748.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].text |
第二項國家安全會議人事費提案第三十案那我們就凍結六十六萬兩千元那並針對凍結提案的要求依審查會決議提出書面報告後 使得凍資 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].start |
26750.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].end |
26765.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].text |
那繼續來處理國家安全會議業務費提案第三十一案到第三十六案三十一到三十六來三十一案是業務費翁曉琳委員提案委員來做說明你這簡略是十二萬嘛請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].start |
26770.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].end |
26775.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].text |
這個國安會議所編的這個教育訓練費用它情況跟總統府一樣它其實執行率都很低你看112年只有執行率是42%113年15%然後這個114年32%平均大概只有30%來說所以呢也就是說他們實際上他們每年都編20萬但是實際上用的錢是很少 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].start |
26796.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].end |
26820.439 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].text |
你一一三年才用了三萬一一四年用了六萬所以我就不懂了為什麼一定要編二十萬那我在這裡呢我原來是提案說是減列十二萬那麼就是等於說還有八萬是可以讓他們去做教育訓練之用但是因為剛剛之前總統府也有說明也鼓勵他們的這個員工去做教育訓練所以我這裡我就左減就是改為減十萬然後經費不得留用 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].start |
26822.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].end |
26849.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].text |
來 機關請說明好謝謝 謝謝召委 謝謝委員其實剛剛總統府已經充分有做了一些說明我就盡量不要重複但原則上為什麼近年來執行率比較低第一個我們要深刻檢討但是第二個主要是因為本會議沒有這個同仁在申請這個在職進修的補助那因為在職進修的補助過去也是佔了這個大宗所以導致說我們這個教育訓練的費用用資的比較少但這個是我們要檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].start |
26850.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].end |
26866.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].text |
同時如果我們今天真的去刪減了這一筆費用的話那就會設了一個天花板那未來如果我們成功的可以去促使有同仁來申請的話我們可能會遇到沒有經費那說實在我們這都是實報實銷也就是說沒有花的錢我們一定就繳國庫這是當然的 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].start |
26868.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].end |
26893.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].text |
但是我也是希望說我們未來還是有機會可以鼓勵更多的同仁去進修而且申請相關的一些經費來做補助那如果可以做得到的話我覺得這個是我們今年來的一個成就但是我同意我們要完全檢討所以是不是委員可以讓我們有個機會這個部分就洞解我們在庭會書面計畫我們如何去改進未來我們的一些相關的課程是什麼我們要如何鼓勵更多同仁去進修委員覺得可以的話我們再來動之 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].start |
26895.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].end |
26909.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].text |
我要再說明就是有關於國安會的回覆我的提案的說明裡面其實他都有提到一點就是如果說這筆費用沒有用完的話他就會融資到其他的經費裡面去 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].start |
26910.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].end |
26925.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].text |
那麼這也是我現在看到不管是總統府國安會議或是乃至於之後其他機關都出現同樣的問題所以我的想法就是說是我們今天並不是說是沒有我今天三減的預算剩下的經費不是說是沒有給國安會有 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].start |
26928.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].end |
26953.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].text |
有多的經費可以去做教育訓練就像我說的你們平常就只有8萬、3萬、6萬那我現在就算是減了你們還是有10萬可以用如果你們在今年而且今年已經到5月、6月了然後在接下來這半年裡面然後同仁們在今年如果說真的很努力的可以去完成也願意去做教育訓練那你們明年還可以再增加增編所以我這邊的話我認為說一定負責我們訓練生 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].start |
26957.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].end |
26982.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].text |
對 我跟主席報告 委員報告其實我覺得委員去檢討我們的資訊率這是完全合理 我們虛心接受但是我還是擔心說設個天花板所以如果可以的話是不是委員還是可以拙減個五萬塊但是讓我們留用假設真的有需要再去補充有需要再把錢就讓更多同仁去訓練的話我們就讓他去做但是我覺得確實我們也是要檢討為什麼我們資訊率這麼低我們虛心接受這部分但是是不是委員還是可以拙減一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].start |
26983.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].end |
27011.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].text |
因為我覺得這個還是讓同仁主要是讓同仁進修的啦我們自己當然都其實不太可能去使用到這個教育訓練費因為我們的任期可能都在相較之下比較沒有保障所以這個部分如果委員讓我們就是左檢然後再留院的話我覺得這個是我們同仁可以去指引的一個方案剛剛已經都說了我從12萬就是減成10萬就是讓你們大概維持有10萬的經費是可以去做教育訓練了這已經是我很大的誠意了 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].start |
27012.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].end |
27023.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].text |
減一半 減五十半 實在是 高委員因為我們的錢真的很少 可是你看他之前他只有用三萬 是啦 只是說你們前陣子的消費訓練的部分你們都沒應對啦 來 范雲委員你們這個大委員都講這個幾萬五萬我覺得我們在場那個五個立委現場超過一百個人然後再檢討這個二十萬我們如何從三十二萬變十萬這個就是說我會有一點點覺得 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].start |
27038.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].end |
27053.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].text |
效益就是當然每一分錢都很重要可是國安會的錢真的很少那我是不是建議我們能不能從31到36一起討論看他們因為這幾個都是業務費嘛本來的錢就不多了然後我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].start |
27054.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].end |
27075.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].text |
山洞多少可以一起討論讓他們可以去就是31到36都是業務費你看你這個20萬要山12萬53萬山15萬的那他們錢真的不多一個一個討論不如整體就給他一個數字讓他們看是要洞啊然後翁委員有什麼需要了解的他去說明好嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].start |
27079.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].end |
27095.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].text |
妳的看法呢 因為這樣 基本上我不太同意這樣的看法 因為我會 我認為說我知道啦 妳不要有人留用啦 我說不對第一個我不同意留用 第二個的話就是妳每個科目妳之所以編就是有它的理由嘛好 為什麼要這樣編 那我今天不是沒有做功課啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].start |
27095.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].end |
27111.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].text |
對不對我今天有說的有哪一句是是有啦 我知道妳有做功課啦但是她也做功課跟妳很認真 她寫到手要生死的所以我現在要講說是歐委員 妳這個我要挑剔的話妳這每一頁下面寫的都一樣妳只有那個數字的部分是不一樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].start |
27112.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].end |
27127.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].text |
所以你的功課 事情也得跟他溝通嘛對啦 我剛剛已經認真的讀你好多頁了啦那當然啊 為什麼我要提很類似的理由就是因為我們政府的這個財政支出過多 舉債四千多億 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].start |
27128.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].end |
27151.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].text |
然後又有這麼多的特別預算 完全排擠了所以包含總統府在內的所有機關你都應該要尊潔使用我今天是真的覺得說在我們審理法院也要尊潔使用我們審理法院那時候也一起尊潔使用一下子就把我的提案就破掉了我們隔壁的 你看我跟委員會報告 我們隔壁的台 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].start |
27152.91 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].end |
27154.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].text |
我覺得最主要是如果委員堅持要這個刪減的話我們其實說實在的 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].start |
27172.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].end |
27187.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].text |
要減同仁的訓練我們也就減那如果不能提供這麼多機會也就不能提供這麼多機會但我覺得還是要請委員是不是還是給我們一個彈性在就是至少留用這個部分讓我們大家可以互相去補充好像我是對於你們國安會同仁好像很差勁然後不給他們教育訓練我沒有這樣說但因為這項目確實就是教育訓練費教育訓練費我現在是說你們合理的編列而不是腐爛編列你們自己的說明都很清楚啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].start |
27202.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].end |
27223.91 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].text |
這筆錢沒有用完之後怎麼辦 流用到其他科目啊所以說不定又流用到我們秘書長的特別費啊 流用到秘書長的委員這是完全兩回事 這是不可能的事情你們自己上面寫得清清楚楚 這個費用跟特別費是完全截然不同的科目啊這個兩者之間是不可能流用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].start |
27224.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].end |
27248.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].text |
委員我們還是據實 我們這個不可能是流用到秘書長的特別費這委員也非常清楚 這個當然是涉及到業務費的部分所以他其餘經費 並迎之其他經費的不足數所以他會流用到其他項目 也許不是流用在特別費也許他是流用在其他的什麼參旅費 國外的參旅費好 我現在就要講 就是不要再為這兩萬塊要不然我就直接送保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].start |
27250.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].end |
27255.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].text |
我們還有很多的案子這條先保留 這條16文件說12萬貨 不好30個案先保留 我們先看32案第一款 第二項國家安全會議業務費 這權力行使的費用請田安委員 翁曉琳委員來做說明這個權力使用費的部分 事實上在之前國安會議也沒有這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].start |
27279.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].end |
27297.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].text |
就是他在去年他其實只用了35萬他現在每年他都變53萬那從他們的說明來看的話的確他們現在提出來的一些要購買的學術期刊或是資料庫使用費用有些部分基本上是不需要譬如說像JSTOR |
| transcript.whisperx[668].start |
27299.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].end |
27323.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].text |
這個涉及到法律方面的資料庫你們就可以直接跟中研院那裡去請他們給你們這個方便讓你們就可以去使用去登錄一些資料所以呢本席認為說國安會的這筆費用是可以做尊潔支出啦所以我提出來就是說3減15萬然後而且不可以留用那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].start |
27328.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].end |
27346.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].text |
主席我就回應一下這部分那個鮑委員其實基本上我有部分是認同的我覺得有一些學術期刊說實在的它的用處也不高了然後它的這個我們可以從其他的方式去遞補所以這部分我覺得委員提這個是讓我們也深刻檢討然後有關JSTOR的部分說實在我自己也認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].start |
27347.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].end |
27367.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].text |
這個用意已經不大了我們會把它終結掉但是委員是不是這個部分還是留給我們一個彈性因為說實在的我們確實這個費用都不高真的都不高所以我們現在目前看的包括在今天早上跟今天目前在其他機關的一些看來的質詢這相對之下其實這金額真的都不高 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].start |
27367.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].end |
27392.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].text |
但是對於說一個本來預算就只有兩億多而且絕大部分是用在人事費的國安會來說每一筆確實都會有一些影響所以我完全認同尊潔預算這樣子的一個概念我們會減四JSTOR我卻會取消掉但是是不是委員還是開放我們第一個可以濁三減十萬塊的部分第二個部分還是讓我們去留用以免說到時候真的有一些需求權利金的需求等等大家還是可以互相地補 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].start |
27395.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].end |
27417.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].text |
我同意可以減10萬就是改成減列10萬但是經費不得留用是有關這個留用的部分因為委員其實我看今天其實稍早總統府很多也涉及到這個委員有提到不得留用但是至於說我們有很多的這個項目都涉及到這部分不得留用這部分有沒有可能就是保留出因為確實對於我不是說對於說我們國安會只有 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].start |
27420.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].end |
27439.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].text |
把人事費砍掉之後只剩幾千萬的預算而言每一筆確實都會很重要而且這涉及到的可能都是一些業務的工作所以我已經非常認同委員的精神然後這部分我們會去檢視去調整但是請委員還是給我們一些方便讓我們去做必要的一些預算算的運用因為這個你把本地前列師傅你減十萬嘛五萬而已不可以留用他下去啦 還好啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].start |
27446.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].end |
27457.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].text |
因為今天在總統府之前我們基本上都是不得留用的每一個案子都是不得留用所以我希望能夠就是以一視同仁就是同一個原則去做事就簡列十萬然後並不得留用雲芝 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].start |
27468.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].end |
27495.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].text |
郭文貴議員 現在文貴的意思是你選擇這個就是你覺得它已經很硬了很硬了它可能又有高開 它可能又流用回去它意思是這樣我知道 其實我跟委員報告這部分我們其實已經就超值我把這次都砍掉其實也就差不多就等於那個十萬塊左右但是我很擔心說因為不得流用這件事情會繼續延續下去對我們國安會的運作確實會有一些限制在 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].start |
27496.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].end |
27521.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].text |
你也承認就是說你們的經費也是浮邊嘛我們不是浮邊所以你才要把這個經費剩下用不完的然後經費去用到別的地方我跟委員報告其實你現在怕說情勢變更對 我跟委員報告情勢變更可以追加預算啦我也很難去保證說我們國家安全會不會因為新的國安情勢或者一整年不會有新的國安情勢發生所以導致大家可能在思考上在使用上甚至於涉及到研究跟全面經營上必須做必要的調整我沒有辦法做這個保證啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].start |
27524.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].end |
27552.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].text |
我沒有辦法保證說明年一年的國安整年的情勢我都可以去預判這是沒有國家做得到的所以如果我沒有辦法去預判接下來的情勢的話至少我還有一些彈性我在研究我在權利經我在相關的一些費用上面我有一些彈性去支應但是說實在這筆費用這邊也不高那不高不是說不重要但是只是說不高會讓我們的彈性變得很低很低因為這件事情如果不得留用繼續延續下去的話我真的會覺得說我會受限於我們國安會相關的一些業務 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].start |
27554.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].end |
27578.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].text |
這邊也想要支持一下因為基本上啊就是說我覺得看因為我們其實在審這個預算真的他們預算數規模真的很少可是因為這個涉及到國際安全的變化就真的很多嘛所以習慣變那我覺得保留一些彈性讓他們可以去做一些調整啦我覺得這一點聽起來我覺得這樣子的說明我自己聽起來覺得非常的清楚也非常的合理啦好啦 不然這樣啦我們聽大家 給大家講一下啦這條給大家講一下啦減多少 減10萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].start |
27582.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].end |
27584.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].text |
三十一案就減列 三十一保留啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].start |
27592.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].end |
27614.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].text |
32減列這個權利使用費減列10萬啦你不得流用不要啦 這個就不要啦這個你差300多而已因為你不是說你要說你們今天說這樣的話基本上是違反預算法精神的沒有 基本上是不能做原則上是不可以流廢季制度有限制財政資源限制於浪費就是讓它有某種程度我委員是很表達不清楚了為什麼他這樣的說明的原因他希望不得流用還是雙尊 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].start |
27630.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].end |
27641.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].text |
33案就是第一款第二項國家安全會議業務費案日案件這個技資酬金提案委員 翁委員請說明33案 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].start |
27647.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].end |
27662.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].text |
33案也是涉及到就是按日案件祭資酬金的部分那麼國安會他12年到14年每年大概就是編差不多300萬左右可是他的執行率也都是 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].start |
27664.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].end |
27682.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].text |
差不多平均只有20%吧113年执行率只有16.56%也就是说他编了310万的预算他实际上支出的只有52万所以我也不懂得为什么他要编这么高的费用那么在这个去年 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].start |
27683.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].end |
27710.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].text |
去年的執行率只有執行18%左右那麼因此他今年又提出了要編317萬的經費那本席認為說這樣的編列經費也是服編服編所以我這裡提出就是減列250萬但是也可以考慮到就是他們可能有一些需求我可以改減列為200萬然後這筆費用也是不得留用 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].start |
27713.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].end |
27721.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].text |
來 請國安會詳細的說明一下因為你剛剛從31跟熱愛到進那看起來你們的執行率確實要充分來做一下說明 來 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].start |
27722.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].end |
27740.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].text |
好 謝謝主席 謝謝委員我們這個執行令確實要檢討因為確實我想這個執行令怎麼看起來都不是非常好看那我們今年因為我們執行令確實往年都不如預期所以我們已經有自己去檢了這個部分我們其實已經自己去做了一些這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].start |
27742.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].end |
27756.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].text |
調整的層面就是我們也認為說如果委員要桌刪的話我們其實不會反對但是是不是委員至少還是可以三個五十萬就好因為三個五十萬就好主要是我也跟委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].start |
27758.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].end |
27774.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].text |
說實在如果我今天在國安會我們明年還沒有去改善這個狀況的話我覺得我沒有什麼立場在拜託委員說可以保留但是確實我們今年我們已經想了部分的層面部分的做法要去改善這樣子的一個執行率 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].start |
27775.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].end |
27790.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].text |
第一個是因為我們去這個新成立 依法新成立一個安全衛生的這個防護委員那這個其實有四位的外聘學者那這個會按照這個案日案件的這個技資酬金來支應但第二個部分呢 我們也新增了這個國際 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].start |
27791.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].end |
27816.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].text |
法應該是說不是行政強化國際法這個領域包括這個林志傑老師的這個投入就代表說未來在國際法尤其在反這個所謂的法律戰這樣子的領域上我們會投入更多的一些研究所以我想為一開始就講為任同委員說卓山我們這個部分我們不會去再去辯駁但是至於說是不是可以刪減部分就好 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].start |
27817.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].end |
27843.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].text |
那另外一部分還是一樣如果有必要的話讓我們去留用今天我們真的遇到了一些非必大家需要集體來研究來找這些外部的學者大家集體共商的一些項目的話至少我們還有這個選擇來做但是不是委員這可以接受這樣子的一個折衷我們也刪減部分看50萬如果委員覺得可以的話但是另外一部分就讓我們來留用您 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].start |
27846.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].end |
27847.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].text |
王國仁在說明?王國仁在說明王國仁在說明王國仁在說明王國仁在說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].start |
27869.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].end |
27878.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].text |
因為在你們每一份的說明裡面你們都有講嘛你們這個經費用不完就是去雲枝其他的經費啊所以這讓我認為說你們為什麼要撫編這麼多的經費就代表你們另有其他的動機 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].start |
27885.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].end |
27897.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].text |
包委員其實沒有如果真的另有的動機的話我每一筆都拜託拜託委員我有部分認同就包括委員剛剛提到的過去可能沒有發生這個問題但是我現在我發現這個問題所以呢我認為就是應該要核實對啊所以你們執行率我們基本上執行率低的項目其實委員也挑出來了我們其實也承諾會做精進改善的我們並不是每一個項目執行率都偏低我們就是這兩個執行率確實比較低我也承諾會精進改善的 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].start |
27913.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].end |
27919.3 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].text |
但委員不能把這個擴散到說你每一個項目我們都是服邊每一個項目都是在挪用的這不是如此我現在是在講說我提出來的案子裡面我的確有觀察到有這樣的情況從總統府到國安會都有這樣的狀況更何況剛剛這個張副秘你的意思是講說這筆費用反而用不完我還可以去支應其他的業務費我其實剛講的是反過來的方法是不可以這麼做的更何況我現在這裡我都已經說 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].start |
27941.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].end |
27969.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].text |
我們一定是依法執行相關的預算絕對不可能違法的任何行為讓你們可以差不多有一百萬的經費然後去做按日案件祭資籌金對不對你一個專家學者請問一下這個人事主任來跟我們講一下按日案件祭資籌金你們一個專家學者出席費是多少錢報告委員一次祭資是兩千五百元 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].start |
27970.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].end |
27996.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].text |
對嘛 2500元 現在多了50萬多了50萬 你今年可以用掉多少你可以聘請多少的專家學者所以我的意思是說 我不是說是認為這個對國安會我把你們所有的這個案件機資籌金刪掉我是給你們有差不多你們實際上可以花掉的錢的一倍的錢的這個還可以有一倍的經費的使用空間 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].start |
28000.454 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].end |
28025.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].text |
這樣講了我覺得我們今天討論那麼久了啦如果說你們不答應的話就算了其實我們國安會省預算目前好像還沒省得很久啦那委員是不是還是給我一個機會說明一下就是有關這個使用的部分因為我剛剛其實有提到這個科目自行調整的部分其實這個都是受限於會計法所以包括就是一般的行政類也只能用於一般的行政那絕對不可能去挪用到所謂的特別費或人事等等等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].start |
28025.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].end |
28044.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].text |
所以其實也簡單說就是相關的一些費用這個都是符合會計法的相關要求這個我也說明一下喔就是預算法63條有對流用有做規定它一定要是同一個工作計畫然後某用途別科目不足另用途別科目有剩餘所以要同一個工作計畫下 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].start |
28046.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].end |
28074.815 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].text |
那人事費是不能流用所以是有嚴格的規定還有流用齁這個有百分之多少的上限那我想翁委員應該有申請過過去科技部或是國科會的研究計畫嘛其實關於流用都是有嚴格的規定但是即使如此學術界都一直在爭取希望彈性大一點因為研究的環境一直在變化那你其實有某種程度流用大家會更節省資源才不會齁就像你講的才不會閒置齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].start |
28076.155 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].end |
28085.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].text |
那這個部分我是希望翁委員他們的經費真的很少你給他留下合法的彈性那這樣子國家的安全才會更有保障啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].start |
28100.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].end |
28108.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].text |
是啊 我就看到了 我就說你開始有時候執行率比較低阿主席我們去年是編300萬5千去年編300萬5千執行率多少我們執行率去年就是非常差勁是17.84這一點我們會深刻檢討所以你們現在就今年變的你們就今年變的你們又低多200多萬喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].start |
28130.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].end |
28152.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].text |
他那個原劣數的部分是沒有增加那麼多啦 只是說你們的執行率的部分啦現在就是說你們來預計啊 你們去年變三百幾萬 你們的執行率那麼低啦那你們今年的原劣數又比去年多了一點點的話 那你們今年預計你們的執行率多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].start |
28153.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].end |
28163.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].text |
我們今年的執行令會有所大幅改善因為最主要是我們新設立這個安全衛生防護委員其中也有多位外部的學者安全衛生那個部分你們會增加多少錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].start |
28164.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].end |
28183.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].text |
這個經費的部分因為今年我們也是才剛所以可能還沒有去推估那個相關的經費使用但是包主席我們今年的執行率會大幅的提升啦但至於說左減的部分我們也接受啦這個我們確實過去就是變太多了這樣啦我們這個部分既然它有變成有新的計畫這樣你賣250看減的50萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].start |
28191.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].end |
28202.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].text |
沒有 我剛剛講 減兩百萬啦五十萬 你那兩百萬你減不掉 你也是把我們台積省了那減五十萬還是不得留用減五十萬不得留用啦 好不好還是你們覺得怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].start |
28204.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].end |
28232.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].text |
因為跟主席報告我們去年整個那個業務費的資訊已經達99點 對不起 90113年是96.22這個112年是99.32然後114年的部分是98.39所以這就是為什麼提到這個這個彈性的部分因為國安的情勢其實本來就是每一天可能就會有一些變化我們其實希望還是這個小機關還是有一些彈性跟靈活性去因應不同的可能 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].start |
28235.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].end |
28238.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].text |
我們也提一個折衷看委員覺得好不好我們不得留言但是至少可以用於一般的一些小額的採購包括碳粉匣 紙張等等因為確實 我就跟委員報告我們其實已經在最大的彈性 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].start |
28256.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].end |
28284.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].text |
因為凸顯出你對預算編列還有執行的問題我之後我要跟審計處我要跟審計部要去請他們去你們那裡查帳你們是不是有這樣子如果有任何需求我相信我相信我們都會全力的配合但是委員也不要這樣子做指控因為今天其實剛剛這個方案也是後面的公務人員想到委員好像很堅持要不得留用 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].start |
28284.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].end |
28310.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].text |
大家集體想出來 公務人員不可能去因為這件事情去提一個違法的作為所以報告委員也非常清楚 坐我後面這一排全部都是常任公務人員他們剛剛聽到說委員一定要堅持留院 大家還是要想到機關的一個未來的運作所以提了這樣子的一個辦法出來 然後被委員說這涉及到有可能違法這樣子我覺得對後面的這些同仁也不太公平啊要不然這樣不就減你五十萬了 不要附帶條件啦 好不好沒有 我堅持 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].start |
28312.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].end |
28324.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].text |
我都已經從250萬我同意減列50萬但是不得留有如果說這樣的話那就不好意思就不要浪費時間我們還有後面的案子我們就這個就保留吧他們希望保留啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].start |
28325.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].end |
28330.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].text |
三十四案請提案委員來 翁委員業務費的委辦費用的部分請說明這個委辦費在一百一十五年他編列了一百六十萬然後比一百一十四年雖然說有減但是事實上因為整個國防支出大幅增加 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].start |
28354.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].end |
28365.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].text |
那麼而且他整筆的這個預算我當時是提出減列110萬還有一個原因也是因為他們執行率很低他們根本錢也用不完你看113年才 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].start |
28368.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].end |
28386.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].text |
用了百分之八然後一百一十四年用了百分之二十六那今年又編了一百六十萬雖然比去年少編了一點點但是它整個來講就是執行率很低啊那為什麼要編那麼多錢所以整個國安會我接下來幾個案都同樣的問題都是同樣的問題就是不禁真的讓我覺得說國安會議就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].start |
28393.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].end |
28394.16 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].text |
包主席 委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].start |
28403.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].end |
28418.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].text |
真的要說伏編的話其實剛剛委員還沒有提到112年112年的話我們執行率就是74%那在之前其實我們有執行率非常高的時候那為什麼會有執行率這麼大幅度的一個調整呢112年74%112年8%112年26%為什麼這個調整因為委辦費其實簡單說就是找不同領域的研究學者來集思共來這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].start |
28429.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].end |
28454.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].text |
思考這個未來我們的一些這個國安的方向跟一些需求那當然這個委辦要不要執行會因著國際情勢而所調整所以我也跟委員報告我覺得如果這樣繼續下去的話我覺得我們的委員的論述很類似我們的論述很類似就是我們還是希望一個小機關應該本來我們的職長跟業務作為一個總統的一個重要諮詢機關就應該要有一定的一些彈性所在 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].start |
28454.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].end |
28479.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].text |
但顯然委員這部分是不太認同的所以這個部分我覺得會變成一個僵局因為我們認為的 我們對國安會的定位跟認知甚至於我們在憲法裡面 所定位的一個認知跟委員這樣子的一個認同 好像有所落差好啦 第34案就先保留啦來35案 那個物品的部分 也是業務費請提案委員 翁委員來做說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].start |
28480.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].end |
28502.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].text |
35案的部分主要是涉及到物品了 因為我看到他們提供給我的資料 我也不太確定他們的物品到底是買了哪些物品雖然說他們的執行率還不錯 只是說對於他們的說明不是很清楚那就這個部分來講 因為實際上成長幅度也沒有很大了 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].start |
28503.895 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].end |
28520.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].text |
當這個比去年來講大概就是多了7萬那麼如果說是在這樣情況之下的話我這個案子基本上就可以就是就不剪裂了就不剪裂了你現在一直喊窮那這樣的話就是多給你一天345萬就照列了 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].start |
28523.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].end |
28546.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].text |
這樣就整個撤案就好 30萬就撤案那第36案第二項的國家安全會議業務費 國內的旅費的部分簡例60萬請提案委員 翁小玲委員來做說明因為他們今年的預算編列國內旅費比去年多增加了 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].start |
28548.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].end |
28575.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].text |
38萬然後增加幅度是42%那麼但是從過去他們的使用率還有索化經費來講其實也沒有必要要編這麼高的錢所以在這裡的話我是提案就是減列60萬那但是也可以考慮到說或許他們接下來有一些需求那麼我可以就是改減列40萬然後這筆經費仍然是不得留用 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].start |
28577.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].end |
28590.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].text |
來請機關來說明就翁委員的提案是簡列40萬那你機關這裡說明一下來是那個報告主席委員因為我們其實114年的部分我們原本是爭取這個105萬後來通過的部分是90萬2000元我們實質的部分是61萬所以確實我們執行率是68%那我想這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].start |
28601.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].end |
28618.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].text |
委員其實也都很理性看待這些該使用的一些狀況要有所改善是不是可以建議委員我們這個減劣的部分有沒有可能就是減劣我們這個25萬幾乎就是比照我們去年沒有執行的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].start |
28620.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].end |
28632.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].text |
聽不懂我現在給你們簡列40萬你們還有80萬可以用你們前幾年的這個最高執行的也不過就是73萬所以80萬對你們今年來講是綽綽有餘去年多少去年才用了60萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].start |
28638.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].end |
28644.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].text |
阿姨 去年的原列數多少90萬妳都擠都開不完對 委員 委員抱歉抱歉這個部分因為我們這邊資訊有誤那這個有關委員減列40萬我們就准辦 謝謝委員好啦 那第30旅費的部分那第36萬國內旅費的部分就減列40萬來 接下來 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].start |
28672.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].end |
28675.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].text |
接下來是特別費嗎 不是 接下來是什麼費業務費提案案號第31案到第36案 35案撤案 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].start |
28686.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].end |
28689.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].text |
保留送協商的部分是31 32 33 34這4案保留送協商然後業務費合併就減列了40萬經費不得留用這是第36案繼續來處理第一幕一般行政提案案號第37案到第38案 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].start |
28708.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].end |
28709.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].text |
來37個38案來我們請37案是基本行政的工作維持業務費請提案委員翁曉琳委員來做說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].start |
28719.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].end |
28745.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].text |
那麼這個案子是涉及到國家安全就是國安會的首長特別費用那同樣的就是基於遵截這個經費要遵截支出然後和其他的機關也是相同就是本人就是提案就是減列特別費106萬減列九成然後而且不可以留用雲芝特別費我看要通案嗎其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].start |
28749.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].end |
28766.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].text |
我特別會先保留啦建議這就通案處理啦特別會我們就先保留啦那一個38案我們就不予處理啦37案先保留啦37案就保留送協商嘛是不是那都先保留啊對 就是之後送那個 政黨協商嘛我也宣告你不用煩惱 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].start |
28774.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].end |
28787.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].text |
那草野協商再來處理啦第一幕一般行政就第二項的國家安全會議第一幕一般行政提案案號37到第38案第38案我們就不予處理那37案我們就保留眾協商 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].start |
28790.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].end |
28813.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].text |
那接著處理第二幕諮詢研究業務提案案號39案到第42案39這個是林倩琪委員沒來我們這個就沒處理啦但是也遇到她溝通這個43已經溝通了溝通後是怎樣是凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].start |
28823.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].end |
28835.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].text |
5% 167萬3千元這樣對齁然後書面報告好那莊委請問一下那個37萬38萬都涉及到特別費是不是就是一併保留送協商 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].start |
28837.232 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].end |
28852.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].text |
三十七案你會比較嚴重 其實你有處理就等於有處理因為你的是減劣一零六 他是減劣五十而已所以保留你的 即使保留那個最大的他小小的好不好 我們完全按照慣例好不好來 第四十案我們來 第四十案就是凍結五趴 就是一百六十七萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].start |
28866.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].end |
28868.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].text |
169萬3000元第41案第42案請提案委員翁曉琳委員來做說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].start |
28892.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].end |
28903.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].text |
這個案子是跟國安會的國外旅費有關在今年國安會所編列的旅費 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].start |
28905.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].end |
28908.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].text |
比114年是成長幅度是1.6倍在114年的國外旅費當時編的是771萬115年則暴增到1231萬那麼如果說看整個分析表來看的話就是本身在提案裡面我們有 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].start |
28922.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].end |
28927.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].text |
做一些分析啊這每項計劃費用77萬美人每天費用3.2萬然後比112年還要加倍那最重要的問題就是說國安會到目前為止他的所有的國外的這個行程還有他去哪些地方然後基本上都沒有有一個就是必要性的一個揭露了我當然知道說國安會的 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].start |
28943.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].end |
28953.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].text |
它的這個機關的特殊性但是它畢竟就是公務機關你現在所編列的預算也是依照公務預算來編列該有的出國報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].start |
28955.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].end |
28984.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].text |
應該也要提報但是到目前為止國安會基本上都沒有做在去年吳釗燮秘書長有到我辦公室我們有討論過這個事情我希望他能夠在今年的預算裡面要改變或是在去年他的做法要有些改變他當時也認為說我提出來的說法並沒有說不合理對不對縱使你不要說我們去拜訪哪一個機關的哪一個人那可以去識別化但是總是還是要清清楚楚知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].start |
28985.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].end |
28997.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].text |
到底憋了这些参旅费去了哪些地方做了什么事情为什么连这个事情都不能讲如果这个真的是属于机密的话你们就提机密预算 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].start |
28999.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].end |
29025.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].text |
然後至少我們立法委員可以監督可以了解我們不要說監督可以了解你們的實際的狀況所以我在這裡我就提出來就是在這次的經費的編列顯不合理那麼提案就是簡列一千兩百萬並且凍結一成不得留用您這個四十二案 安委員跟國安會提案你都沒有先跟他說明嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].start |
29027.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].end |
29052.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].text |
主席跟委員來說明一下 其實剛剛委員提到說為什麼不得揭露其實不得揭露的原因非常簡單嘛 因為對岸在看嘛我們的所作所為 說實在都是影響到中華民國的國家安全那如果是對岸的話 不監視這個要監視什麼呢不去看我們跟哪一些對象接觸 去看誰呢不去看我們去哪一些國家看什麼呢所以這當然我們知道 我們所有做的事情都會放大檢視 而且放大的是對岸 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].start |
29053.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].end |
29077.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].text |
所以這是為什麼我們對於說出訪出國這個部分我們確實我們會比較謹慎來看待但是剛剛委員有提到說吳委員對不起吳秘書長去拜訪委員我也陪著吳秘書長去我想我自己也有去拜訪委員我們確實是很大的善意跟誠意不要說善意啦這不對是很大的誠意希望可以跟委員來說明在適當的一個狀態下去說明我們怎麼去使用這些經費 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].start |
29078.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].end |
29100.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].text |
所以或許也不是只有單對委員我們當時也跟委員透過同仁跟委員方式三度聯繫也跟委員說如果委員可以找任何去關心我們國安會差旅費的委員我們都願意在適當的一個狀況之下來做簡報甚至於來做說明這都是我們已經說出而且已經是跟過去不太一樣但是如果叫我們今天在一個公開的場合 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].start |
29101.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].end |
29122.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].text |
去把我們去哪裡去見了誰怎麼去使用這一筆我相信最終其實最得意最得利的就是對岸這是為什麼但是我今天可以在委員會我可以這樣子說我們要增加這一筆預算不是沒有道理在的包括113年度我們總共的這個邀訪跟出訪的計畫20項114年度28項115年度也就是今天我們在省的預算是46項增加了7成 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].start |
29132.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].end |
29142.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].text |
全球各國現在都非常好奇我們的國安狀況非常想了解如何強化我們國安安全的一些相關交流那我們不希望有錯過這個機會所以我也跟委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].start |
29145.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].end |
29166.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].text |
說坦白的沒有人想去執行這些出國業務啊這出國業務不是好的業務啊我到現在在國安會沒有一次出國不是在週末出去的為什麼因為我要盡量讓工作日可以回到台灣裡面繼續工作所以這就是為什麼我說多編這一筆錢並不是有任何國安會的人受益想說太開心了我現在有多的錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].start |
29167.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].end |
29182.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].text |
其實大家只覺得說事情更多了但是這是一份責任感我過去在台北市議會對不起這是不好的案例但我還是講一下台北市議會我應該是唯一一位議員我當時是要求蔣事府多編因為我說你多編的話你才能多做事情啊甚至當時有國民黨黨籍 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].start |
29184.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].end |
29201.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].text |
議員把他參與費刪我還要求他在大會的時候要求說可不可以把他放回去因為我覺得你市府多出差多去執行國際交流這是好的一件事怎麼會是壞呢所以今天我們國安會為什麼會多編這一筆費用這才拜託委員可以多理解是因為我們確實第一個看到需求 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].start |
29202.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].end |
29215.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].text |
各國對於現在台灣的一些邀訪跟邀請變多了但第二個部分我們也希望說在現在瞬時萬變的一個國際情勢當中我們確實是有機會可以跟這些重要理念相近國家接觸 以上所以實在 我要再講國安會議喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].start |
29224.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].end |
29243.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].text |
他是總統府底下一個組織那麼事實上他並不是在我們現在法律上來講就賦予他可以所謂的秘密作業或秘密編列預算秘密出訪等等這樣的一個任務那麼所有的國安會議裡面的業務理論上都應該要接受 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].start |
29245.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].end |
29270.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].text |
國會的監督接受全民的監督縱使有一些基於國防安全國家安全的考量可以不需要完全這個逐字的揭露但是必要的揭露還是必須要做的國安會議不是黑機關那麼我想就是在現在這個國安會議也不是說今天才成立了已經成立這麼多年了但是我們可以知道這兩年我們台灣的 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].start |
29273.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].end |
29290.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].text |
國安有做得比較好嗎?國防有做得比較好嗎?我們連這次總統出訪國安會基本上也都沒有辦法把總統出訪這件事情搞定啊總統確實有出訪而且確實有展現出我們台灣的聲音跟台灣的韌性我們確實外交困境是一直都有的國民黨執政 民進黨執政 中國打壓沒有變化 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].start |
29298.702 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].end |
29318.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].text |
編了那麼多的錢然後國外的旅費今年暴增一千多萬今年編了總共是兩千萬的經費可是我們卻不知道你們到底要花在什麼從過去到現在都是如此我認為說是有必要把這件事情在制度上面要處理好不是說今天國安會 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].start |
29319.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].end |
29336.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].text |
跟個別委員報告告訴說你們去哪個行程我們就接受重要是說要能夠讓全民檢驗到底國安會議有沒有做事嗎高委員全民檢驗的問題就是因為對岸也在檢驗所以我們也希望說在適當的一個狀況下跟委員做個報告我們每個機關都有檢驗我們難道我們國安會議沒有去檢驗這個對岸的這些政策嗎所以其實委員認證了說確實對岸在檢驗 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].start |
29347.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].end |
29364.3 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].text |
第四十二案保留啦 四十二案保留啦我們國安會其實也很用心 用力來盡量說服現在的金額的部分 我看處理的方式可能還沒有達到共識 我們就先保留可以請您提案 以後立法委員的交報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].start |
29377.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].end |
29382.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].text |
現在機不機密是有國安會自己去定義 並不是說是他來第二幕 諮詢研究業務 提案第39案到第42案39案到39案 41案就不予處理 42案保留送協商那本幕的合併就凍結169案3000 就是案號40案 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].start |
29408.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].end |
29417.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].text |
這個就沒有了 提出書面報告後 使得動之我們繼續來處理第二項國家安全會議之主決議提案案號第13案跟第44案來 第43案包主席我們都遵照43跟44 43沒問題好 第44案我們遵照辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[761].start |
29432.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[761].end |
29449.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[761].text |
那接下來來主決議提案43跟44案召喚通過第一款第二項國家安全會議處理完畢我們繼續處理第一款第三項國使館的主決議提案案號45案到第52案40案的主決議包主席遵照辦理好46案也一樣遵照辦理47案 |
| transcript.whisperx[762].start |
29461.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[762].end |
29471.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[762].text |
遵照辦理48案遵照辦理49案遵照辦理50案遵照辦理51案遵照辦理52案 |
| transcript.whisperx[763].start |
29473.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[763].end |
29487.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[763].text |
遵照辦理好 這樣就主決議第三項國事館主決議提案號45案到52案 照案通過就是第45案 46案 47案48案 49 50 51 52案第一款第三項國事館處理完畢我們繼續處理第一款第四項國事館台灣文獻館之主決議提案案號第53案到第58案第53案 有沒有意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[764].start |
29503.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[764].end |
29517.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[764].text |
遵照辦理好54案遵照辦理55案遵照辦理56案遵照辦理57案遵照辦理58案遵照辦理好來這樣就主決議提案案號53至58案照案通過第53、54、55、56、57、58案第一款第四項國事館台灣文獻館處理完畢 |
| transcript.whisperx[765].start |
29531.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[765].end |
29533.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[765].text |
來我們討論事項以處理完畢做以下的宣告115年度中央政府總預算案關於總統府主管 |
| transcript.whisperx[766].start |
29547.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[766].end |
29555.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[766].text |
不含中央研究院收支的部分我們審查完略提報院會院會討論前須交由黨團協商院會討論時由中央召集委員瑞雄來做說明那有關本日的會議通過修正之預算提案請機關將修正內容經提案委員簽名同意以後送交主席台均列入公報記錄通過之決議依例 |
| transcript.whisperx[767].start |
29575.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[767].end |
29583.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[767].text |
文字授權主席跟議事人員來做整理本次會議議程所列的事項均已處理完畢會議進行到此結束 |