| IVOD_ID |
17458 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/17458 |
| 日期 |
2026-05-21 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-35-17 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第17次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
17 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
35 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
外交及國防委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第17次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2026-05-21T08:37:05+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-05-21T17:51:00+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
09:13:55 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/7a505bc1fba11f2dd1a6f5ee3635aa4f57458167e0bc50a3601341028818003dd3d7a8418589cc4d5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-05-21T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第17次全體委員會議【含秘密會議】（事由：繼續審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於國防部主管收支公開及機密部分（不含國家安全局部分）。（處理）（5月18日、20日及21日三天一次會）） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:37:05 - 17:51:00 |
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我們現在開會請議事人員宣讀本日議程跟討論事項討論事項繼續審查一百一十五年度中央政府總預算案關於國防部主管收資公開及機密部分掛乎不函國家安全局部分宣讀完畢那我們現在介紹在場的委員首先是陳永康委員謝謝陳永康委員沈不揚委員 |
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那接下來我們介紹在場官員顧立雄部長副參謀總長執行官黃志偉上將常務次長陳文興中將全民防衛動員署署長廖建興中將總督察長是總督察長盧建忠中將參事石文榮中將 |
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政務辦公室主任孫逆芳中將政治專案局局長史順文中將軍備局局長林文祥中將主計局局長謝其賢中將軍醫局代理局長陳元浩少將戰略規劃司司長黃文啟中將資源規劃司司長藍靜婷女士法律事務司司長吳義聖中將整合評估司司長苗慧芬女士 |
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1517.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
國防採購事主任趙雅中中將政風事主任陳世偉先生主計事主任王慧金女士人事事主任吳幻化女士人事參謀次長事次長王志輝中將情報參謀次次長助理次長吳天仁少將作案及計劃參謀次次長 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
1520.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
1529.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
侯嘉倫中將後勤參謀次次長林鳳翔中將通信電子資訊參謀次次長謝俊山中將訓練參謀次次長郭俊德中將陸軍指令部參謀長陳建義 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
1535.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
1561.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
中將 海軍司令部參謀長朱惠民 中將 空軍司令部參謀長李慶蘭 中將 後備指揮部參謀長薛淵泉 少將 憲兵指揮部參謀長文念忠 少將 陸軍後勤指揮部參謀長梁永坤 少將 直通電軍指揮部參謀市長周文祥 少將 軍事情報局執行長李永康 少將 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
1564.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
1588.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
電訊碼是執行長林振偉上校國防部國防大學教育長李承忠少將中正國防幹部預備學校校長詹惟潮少將國家中山科學研究院院長李世強先生主計中央處公務預算處專門委員邱碧珠女士本日會議繼續審查115年度中央政府總預算慣例國防部主管收支公開及機密部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
1589.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
1605.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
不含國家安全局部分現在進行處理處理先公開後秘密首先審查公開的部分請醫生員宣讀預算書及委員提案宣讀期間在場人員有需要可自由離座宣讀完畢之後移到協商座處提案請宣讀 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
1607.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
1623.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
一百一十五年度中央政府總預算案國防部主管收支公開部分依稅入部分括弧不含國家安全局部分第二款罰款及賠償收入第七十八項國防部五萬元第七十九項國防部所屬六億八千八百二十萬元第三款歸費收入第六十四項 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
1624.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
1633.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
國防部1萬5千元第65項國防部所屬168萬7千元第4款財產收入第88項國防部84萬5千元第89項國防部所屬55億3102萬7千元第5款營業營餘及事業收入第3項國防部所屬5列數第7款其他收入第87項國防部65萬4千元第88項國防部所屬13億9597萬8千元二稅出部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
1651.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
1664.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
不含國家安全局部分第九款國防部主管 關我不含機密部分第一項國防部17億5085萬7千元第一幕一般行政8億6784萬3千元第二幕國防政策規劃與督導6億457萬1千元第三幕國家軍事博物館2億7427萬8千元第四幕一般建築及設備407萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
1674.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
1697.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
第五幕 第一備金九萬五千元第二項國防部所屬五千三百四十二億兩千九百九十七萬四千元第一幕軍事行政六十四億兩百二十二萬八千元第三幕軍事教育訓練業務一百二十三億八千零六十萬四千元第四幕後勤級通知業務一千六百三十六億三千四百六十三萬一千元第五幕一般裝備 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
1698.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
1709.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
一千一百八十九亿三千四百八十一万五千元第六目军事人员一千九百七十六亿七百一十万三千元第七目非营业特种基金十三亿三千九百四十七万四千元 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
1711.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
1738.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
第八目 一般建築及設備 兩百四十億八千零三十二萬一千元第九目 第一預備 近二十八億元第十一目 一般科學研究 十八億三千八百九十五萬六千元第十三目 環保業務 二十三億七百七千八百五十四萬兩千元第十四目 退休撫恤 十五億一千八百萬元第十五目 軍券維持 十三億一千五百三十萬元現在宣讀委員制預算提案第一案 第四款 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
1740.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
1759.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
第一幕 利息收入增列八十萬元 委員黃仁等人提案第二案 第一幕 一般行政 凍結兩百萬元 委員羅馬林等人提案第三案 第一幕 基本行政工作維持 凍結兩百萬元 委員王電宇等人提案第四案 至十案為第一幕 基本行政工作維持業務費之提案第四案 教育訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
1760.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
1783.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
教育訓練費凍結10萬元委員陳冠廷等提案第五案水電費減列2000萬元委員黃仁等提案第六案物品凍結500萬元委員馬文君等提案第七案物品凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第八案一般事務費凍結100萬元委員黃仁等提案第九案設施及機械設備養護費凍結500萬元委員黃仁等提案第十案設施及機械設備養護費凍結200萬元委員馬文君等提案第十一案特別費凍結10% |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
1790.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
1817.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
委員王安祥等提案第12案特別費凍結5%委員王安祥等提案第13案第一幕基本行政工作維持機械設備費減列844萬2千元委員馬文君等提案第14案至第15案為第一幕基本行政工作維持對國內團體之捐助之提案第14案減列71萬8千元委員林楚英等提案第15案凍結20萬元委員王逸川等提案第16案第一幕 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
1819.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
1840.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
資訊服務費凍結50萬元為黃人等提案 第17案第二幕戰略規劃減裂1000萬元凍結30%為馬文君等提案第18至20案為第二幕戰略規劃業務費之提案第18案日案件技資籌金凍結3%為王逸川等提案第19案國外旅費減裂1000萬元為馬文君等提案第20案國外旅費凍結3%為王文祥等提案第21案第二幕整合評估 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
1849.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
1860.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
凍結200萬元為王定宇等提案第二十二至二十三案為第二目整合評估業務費之提案第二十二案教育訓練費凍結10%為黃潤等提案第二十三案一般事務費減列1億5055萬元凍結1000萬元為馬文君等提案第二十四至二十六案為第二目整合評估對國內團體資捐助之提案第二十四案 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
1871.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
1900.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
檢列五千萬元委員王定宇等提案第二十五案檢列三千零五十五萬元委員馬文君等提案第二十六案凍結兩千萬元委員黃仁等提案第二十七至三十案為第二幕國防資源管理之提案第二十七案凍結十%委員陳冠廷等提案第二十八案凍結兩百萬元委員王定宇等提案第二十九案凍結一百萬元委員盧美玲等提案第三十案凍結一百萬元委員盧美玲等提案第三十一至第三十四案 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
1902.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
1926.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
第二幕國防資源管理業務費支提案第31案凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案第32案違犯費凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案第33案違犯費凍結300萬元委員黃仁等提案第34案違犯費凍結10%委員陳冠廷等提案第35案第二幕法律事務凍結100萬元委員盧敏玲等提案第36案第二幕 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
1927.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
1948.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
案日案件機資籌金凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第31至第38案為第二目督查作業業務費資提案第37案凍結100萬元委員林儲英等提案第38案國外旅費減利20萬元委員黃仁等提案第39案第三目國家軍事博物館建置凍結1億元委員馬文君等提案第40案 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
1950.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
1974.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
國家軍事博物館房屋建築及設備凍結五千萬元五元黃人等提案第四十一案第三目國家軍事博物館維運減列一千七百一十七萬八千元五元馬文君等人提案第四十二至第四十三案為國家軍事博物館維運業務費之提案第四十二案水電費減列一百萬元凍結兩百萬元五元黃人等提案第四十三案 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
1976.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
1985.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
國內組織匯費凍結5萬元為零儲應等提案第44案第三目國家軍事博物館業務推展減列5710萬元為馬文軍等提案第45至第46案為第三目國家軍事博物館業務推展違犯費之提案第45案減列1000萬元為黃人等提案第46案違犯費凍結10%為零儲應等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
1999.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
2000.91 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
第47案第4目設備及投資運輸設備費凍結50萬元委員黃仁等提案第48案至第60案為主決議現在宣讀主決議之內容 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
2013.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
2041.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
第四十八案 建議國防部因實際任務需求寬裂相關預算以確保國軍戰備任務稅型及後勤維持能量並依中共基軍艦常態化侵擾軍事通盤檢討各軍種油料裝備維修及相關後勤資源預算編列情形就現行執行情形未來需求及預算缺口提出具體規劃於三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告 提案人委員林楚英等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
2042.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
2066.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
第49案國防部應責成參謀本部建立首人美國軍售商售流程及武器價格評估之專業人才培訓與延攬機制強化軍事裝備採購談判能量價格合理評估及履約風險控管於6個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出專案報告後 使得環部提升商售比例提案人委員徐曉新等人第50案查少子化趨勢 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
2070.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2095.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
已成不可逆之結構性挑戰國軍需與民間就業市場、產業爭取同一批青年人才如何就薪資待遇、職癌發展、訓練品質、營區生活品質退伍後就業輔導等面向提供整體性誘因攸關志願役、人力招募與留營成效請國防部以三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員王玉川等人第五十一案 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2096.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2122.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
查歷年為國犧牲之國軍官兵其崇高精神來自於對國家與人民之忠誠並分來自於特定領袖之個人崇拜國防部以教育官兵承襲勇於用生命換取國家百姓安全唯有保留兩獎象徵物請國防部停止上開旅遊迴避處置威權象徵之法律義務並於三個月內提出全數移除或處置 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2123.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2150.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
講中正同向之具體計畫 提案委員王一川等人第五十二案近期國軍連連發生幹部管教師當言語霸凌歧視之違紀事件國防部處應查明事件從嚴究責主動將違紀者移送法辦外也應思考從制度面強化教官與主管素質及督管作業以確保訓練紀律提案委員沈伯陽等人第五十三案 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2151.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2178.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
帮航空管理局日前批准美军在境内使用高能雷射系统来击落威胁性之无人机,因此建议国防部在依国军战力需求发展或寻访相关技术之同时,也开始思考与国土办、民航局研议未来可行性做法与相关规范,在国家安全与航空安全之间取得技术性之平衡,提案人委员沈伯扬等人。 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2179.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2206.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
第五十四案今年國防部未落實後備擴編將過去十四天新制教召五至七天就制教召同時並行之模式調整為全面十四天制除了召集天數之延長後備專長與部隊需求相互銜接之外建議國防部也應基於後備訓練與作業量能研議如何讓後備戰力多元化提案人委員沈伯陽等人 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2207.813 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2235.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
第五十五案國防部於二零二五年十二月十一日預告修正體位區分標準本次修正高達一百八十項次修正項次甚多其中涉及重大疾病性別不安氣喘糖尿病嚴重型憂鬱症精神光能症等因此建議國防部除了與內政部協調溝通諮詢專家之外也需充分聽取相關民間團體之意見以立政策推行順利提案人委員沈伯陽等人 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2236.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2254.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
第五十六案國防部應禁訴邀請相關單位嚴寧規範限制軍港周邊民間建物之樓高陽台與開窗位置頂樓視野設計等提案人委員沈伯陽等人第五十七案一審計部一百一十三年度決算審核報告指出 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2254.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2268.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
海陸軍飛行部隊所屬勤務單位其任務性質及工作內容與空軍所屬各聯隊機隊分隊雷同卻未比照空軍匡列為戰鬥部隊加級支聯對象予以研議納入 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2269.164 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2294.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
只可行性 原請國防部持續檢討並向行政院爭取待遇調整必提升專業人員招募及留營成效提案人委員陳俊宇等人第五十八案 建請國防部針對台東地區規劃聯合植物宿舍並於兩個月內向立法院為交集國防委員會提出台東地區軍用土地活化與植物宿舍整建規劃專案報告提案人委員黃仁等人第五十九案 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2296.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2309.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
國防部應重新評估東部單位之環境艱苦度於兩個月內完成花東地區軍人地域加急可行性評估報告並送立法院外交及國防委員會以確保國軍官兵權益與待遇之公平合理天然委員黃人等人第六十案 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2313.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2327.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
為了解國防部及國軍部隊在性別平等工作上之作為並督促國防部加強國軍各部隊對多元性別的認知原件請國防部以三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員羅美寧等人 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2330.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2354.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
第六十一案 稅入 第三目 一般賠償收入 減列一百六十二萬八千元 委員黃建斌等人提案 第六十二案 第一目 實證作業凍結五% 委員黃建斌等人 第六十三案 第一目 主計作業凍結十% 委員黃建斌等人 第六十四案 第一目 政戰綜合作業 減列兩百六十一萬三千元 凍結十% 委員黃建斌等人 第六十五案 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2356.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2377.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
第一幕人事行政凍結兩百萬元委員陳俊宇等提案第六十六案第一幕計劃管理作業一般事務費減列三十萬元委員陳冠廷等提案第六十七至第六十八案為第一幕政戰綜合作業之提案第六十七案凍結兩百萬元委員陳俊宇等提案第六十八案 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2378.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2390.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
凍結100萬元委員林儲殷等提案第69至72案為第一目軍事醫療作業設備及投資之提案第69案減列1440萬3000元委員黃仁等提案第70案雜項設備費減列4840萬元委員馬文君等提案第71案雜項設備費減列1440萬3000元委員馬文君等提案第72案雜項設備費凍結2000萬元委員黃仁等提案第73至75案為第三目 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2407.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2418.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
交易行政業務費之提案第73案交易訓練費凍結100萬元為盲軍等提案第74案房屋建築養護費減列1136萬元為盲軍等提案第75案房屋建築養護費凍結100萬元為黃人等提案第76至82案為第三幕訓練綜合作業之提案第76案凍結500萬元為陳俊宇等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2430.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2442.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
第77案 凍結500萬元委員陳俊宇等人提案第78案 業務費凍結10%委員黃仁等人提案第79案 軍事裝備及設施凍結2000萬元委員馬文君等人提案第80案 軍事裝備及設施減列1000萬元委員馬文君等人提案第81案 軍事裝備及設施減列7億元 凍結900萬元委員馬文君等人提案第82案 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2458.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
2462.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
軍事裝備及設施凍結2945萬元委員劉許廷等提案。第83至87案為第四目一般彈藥過滯與維護之提案。第83案凍結200萬元委員王定義等提案。第84案軍事裝備及設施凍結10億元委員馬文君等提案。 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
2479.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
2483.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
第85案軍事裝備及設施凍結1000萬元為馬文軍等提案第86案軍事裝備及設施凍結20萬元為馬文軍等提案第87案軍事裝備及設施凍結10%為黃人等提案第89至90案為第4目運輸作業業務費資提案第88案國內旅費減列100萬元為馬文軍等提案第89案運費減列500萬元為馬文軍等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
2505.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
2518.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
第九十案 運費減列500萬元 凍結500萬元 為馬文君等人提案 第九十一至九十四案為第四目通信電子與資訊管理之提案 第九十一案凍結30% 為馬文君等人提案 第九十二案 軍事裝備設施養護費減列127萬7千元 為馬文君等人提案 第九十三案 軍事裝備設施養護費 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
2525.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
2533.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
檢列三百萬元凍結一千萬元為馬文軍等提案第九十四案軍事軟硬體設備費凍結五百萬元為馬文軍等提案九十五至一百一十八案為第四目軍事單位裝備零附件購置及保修業務費之提案第九十五案軍事裝備及設施檢列兩億元凍結兩億元為馬文軍等提案第九十六案 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
2547.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
2566.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
軍事裝備及設施 檢列一千萬元 凍結一千一百一十四萬一千元 委員馬文君等 提案第九十七案軍事裝備及設施 檢列四百九十萬四千元 凍結五百萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第九十八案軍事裝備及設施 檢列兩百萬元 凍結五百萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第九十九案 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
2567.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
2570.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
軍事裝備及設施凍結3億元為馬文軍等提案第102案軍事裝備及設施凍結4千萬元為馬文軍等提案第103案軍事裝備及設施凍結3千萬元為馬文軍等提案第104案 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
2590.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
2600.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
100萬元委員馬文君等提案第105案,凍結1億元委員黃仁等提案第106案,減列1767萬元委員馬文君等提案第107案,減列697萬5千元委員馬文君等提案第108案,減列2億元凍結1億元委員馬文君等提案第109案, |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
2611.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
2639.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
檢列五千萬元 凍結兩千萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第一百一十案 凍結六千萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第一百一十一案 凍結五千萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第一百一十二案 軍事裝備適用費 凍結三千七百五十萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第一百一十三案 凍結三千萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第一百一十四案 凍結一千兩百八十五萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第一百一十五案 凍結一千兩百二十六萬一千元 委員馬文君等 提案第一百一十六案 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
2640.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
2652.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
軍事裝備設施養護費凍結一千萬元五元馬文君等提案第117案凍結兩百九十六萬一千元五元馬文君等提案第118案軍事裝備設施養護費減裂三千萬元五元馬文君等人提案第119至125案為第四目後勤補給支援業務費之提案第119案凍結5%為完想等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
2667.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
2670.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
第120案凍結10%委員徐曉新等提案第121案物品減列2億元凍結2億元委員馬文君等提案第122案物品減列5000萬元凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案第123案物品 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
2683.322 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
2690.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
檢列4千萬元凍結2千萬元委員馬文君等提案第124案物品凍結2億元委員馬文君等提案第125案雜項設備費檢列3千萬元委員馬文君等提案第126至第128案為第5目一般武器及戰備支援裝備購置之提案第126案凍結200萬元委員王一川等提案第127案凍結200萬元委員陳俊宇等提案第128案優惠凍結10%委員徐曉新等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
2711.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
2719.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
第129案第5目仁溪市短程防空飛彈凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第130至第131案為第5目國軍重要防護營區智慧型警戒系統建置案跨湖第二階段之提案第130案凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第131案凍結200萬元委員王一川等提案第132至第135案為第5目新型戰車之提案第132案簡列400 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
2740.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
2747.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
481084萬3000元凍結20億元委員馬文君等提案第133案凍結5%委員黃建斌等提案第134案業務費凍結3%委員王安向等提案第135案業務費軍事裝備及設施凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第136至第137案為第5目遙控無人機防禦系統之提案第136案凍結20% |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
2768.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
2773.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
委員黃建斌等提案第137案凍結1000萬元委員黃仁等提案第138案第5目陸上機動部雷系統凍結2000萬元委員黃仁等提案第139至140案為第5目空降作戰散具裝備 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
2786.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
2792.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
提案第139案凍結1億元為馬文君等提案第140案凍結1000萬元為黃人等人提案141案戰術型進程無人飛行載具二階段凍結2億元為馬文君等人提案142至145案系第5目無人機反制系統之提案142案凍結4億5601萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
2812.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
2831.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
零一萬三千元委員馬文君等人提案一百四十三案凍結兩億元委員黃仁等提案一百四十四案設備及投資凍結十percent王安祥委員等人提案一百四十五案設備及投資凍結五百萬元委員陳永康等人提案一百四十六至一百四十九系第五目攻擊無人機飛彈系統之提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
2833.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
2839.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
146案凍結2億元委員馬文君等人提案147案業務費凍結3%委員王安祥等人提案148案業務費凍結3%委員王安祥等人提案149 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
2846.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
2862.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
案 軍事設 軍事裝備及設施凍結300萬元委員陳永康等人提案150至153案系第5目 先行步槍之提案150案 凍結10%委員黃建斌等人提案151案 凍結1000萬元委員黃恩等人提案152案 軍事裝備及設施凍結300萬元委員陳永康等人提案153案 凍結200萬元委員王定宇等人提案154案 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
2874.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
2897.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
定位定向系統檢列全案檢列兩億元全案凍結三十萬元委員馬文君等提案一百五十五案高空滲透跳傘訊電模擬器全案檢列三億元全案凍結五千萬元委員馬文君等提案一百五十六至一百五十七案系列五目採購局外購 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
2901.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
2909.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
156案 业务费冻结1000万元委员马文君等提案157案 仁西市短程防空飞弹冻结500万元委员马文君等提案158案 第五目 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
2912.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
2931.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
戰場心理抗壓系統性能提升案凍結五百萬元委員碼黃人等提案一百五十九案第五目第三代陸區系統凍結兩千萬元委員黃人等提案一百六十案第六目一般事務費減列十億元凍結四億元委員碼文軍等提案一百六十一至一百六十三案系第八目 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
2932.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
2940.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
設備及投資之提案161案房屋建築及設備費凍結40萬元委員馬文君等提案162案房屋建築及設備費凍結3000萬元委員黃仁等提案163案公共建設及設施費減列20萬元委員黃仁等提案164至165案C第8目戰車 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
2954.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
2961.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
站甲車掩體興建工程第一階段之提案164案凍結議員委員馬文君等提案165案設備及投資凍結500萬元委員陳永康等提案166至167系第8目公共 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
2970.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
2995.787 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
建设及设施费之提案166案冻结3000万元委员黄安等提案167案冻结5000万元委员黄安等提案168至170系第八目装训部长安营区训练场整建工程案之提案168案冻结1亿元委员马文俊等提案169案冻结200万元委员王定宇等提案170案设备机投资冻结500万元委员陈永康等提案171 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
2997.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
3014.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
議案第八目裝訓部坑子口訓練場整建工程案凍結兩百萬元委員王定宇等提案一百七十二案第八目戰場抗壓管新建工程凍結三千萬元委員馬文君等提案一百七十三案第八目 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
3015.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3024.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
合理冒險訓練場凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案173花房部復興營區訓場新建工程案凍結7000萬元委員馬文君等提案175案部訓部三林機砲校訓場場地整建工程案凍結8000萬元委員馬文君等提案176案清兵器靶場新建工程先期規劃案簡列234萬2000元委員馬文君等提案177案京湯營區 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3044.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3049.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
後備訓場整建先期規劃案凍結582萬1千元委員馬文君等提案178案陸軍室內化靶場興建工程先期規劃案凍結361萬3千元委員馬文君等提案179 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3061.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3075.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
長安營區綜合訓練場整建工程第二階段凍結1765萬4千元委員馬文君等提案180案第八目北側中心湖口訓練場整建工程案凍結841萬8千元委員馬文君等提案181案載人公務車輛籌補凍結10%委員黃仁等提案182案第八目 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3085.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3091.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
陸軍作戰支援服務系統建置安置資訊軟硬體設備費凍結10%委員黃人等提案183案國軍衛生部隊衛勤裝備整備凍結10%委員黃人等提案184案軍品研發凍結10%委員黃人等提案185案 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3105.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3117.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
左營通案的左營蘇澳及基隆地區新建制救火堵漏訓場凍結5000萬元委員馬文君等人提案186案海軍第一幕資訊軟硬體設備費減列150萬元凍結160萬元委員馬文君等人提案187至190案系第一幕 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3129.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3136.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
情報及測量作業之提案187案凍結100萬元委員王定等提案188案通訊費減列1000萬元凍結100萬元委員馬文君等提案189案軍事裝備及設施凍結10%委員黃恩等提案190案一般事務費減列3000萬元凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案191至192案系第一目一般事務費之提案191案凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3161.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3183.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
30%委員零處理等提案192案凍結3000萬元委員馬文君等提案193案計劃作業管理作業之一般事務費減列100萬元凍結20萬元委員馬文君等提案194案第一幕效益評估作業之軍事裝備及設施減列800萬元凍結390萬元委員馬文君等提案195案 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3187.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3202.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
第一幕案管作業資訊軟硬體設備費減列三百萬元凍結三百萬元委員馬文君等提案一百九十六至一百九十八案系第一幕政戰綜合作業之提案一百九十六案業務費凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3204.295 |
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3209.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
20%委員習曉新等提案197案資訊軟硬體設備費減列500萬元凍結450萬元委員馬文君等提案198案雜項設備費減列300萬元凍結440萬元委員馬文君等提案199案第一幕設備及投資減列3000萬元凍結150萬元委員馬文君等提案200至204案系第三幕 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3229.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3237.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
教育行政制提案200案凍結200萬元委員王定宇等提案201案業務費凍結30%委員習曉新等提案202案房屋建築及房屋建築養護費凍結10%委員黃仁等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3246.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3255.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
203案國內旅費減列250萬元凍結100萬元委員馬文君等提案204案國外旅費凍結10%委員黃恩等提案205案動員整備凍結200萬元委員王定宇等提案206案第三目軍事裝備設施養護費凍結200萬元委員黃恩等提案207至210系第三目訓練綜合作業業務費之提案207案軍事裝備及設施凍結100萬元委員黃恩等提案208案 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3277.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3282.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
軍事裝備及設施檢列1600萬元委員馬文君等提案209案軍事裝備及設施凍結1600萬元委員牛許廷等提案210案軍事裝備設施養護費凍結100萬元委員黃仁等提案211案一般彈藥庫 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3302.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3307.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
一般彈藥購置與維護軍事裝備及設施凍結5000萬元委員黃人等提案212-214系粒式木後勤綜合勤務業務費值提案212案教育訓練費減列98萬3000元委員馬文君等提案213案資訊服務費凍結10%委員黃人等提案214案資訊軟硬體設備費減列800萬元凍結600萬元委員黃人等委員馬文君等提案215-216系粒式木設施 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3331.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3343.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
修善维护与管理业务费制提案215案冻结20%委员习晓星等提案216案房屋建筑养物费冻结100万元委员黄仁等提案217案 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3347.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3365.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
一般作戰設施之案日案件計資酬金減列兩千五百萬元凍結一千萬元委員馬文君等提案兩百一十八至兩百二十案西地私募通信電子與資訊管理之提案兩百一十八案凍結三十percent委員馬文君等提案兩百一十九案 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3366.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3395.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
通訊費減列兩千萬元凍結兩千萬元委員馬文君等提案220案軍事裝備設施養護費凍結一元委員黃恩等提案221至223系第四目軍事單位裝備零附件構置及保修之提案221案凍結五百萬元陳俊宇提案委員陳俊宇等提案222案軍事裝備及設施凍結三千萬元委員黃恩等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3396.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3409.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
223案一般事務費凍結10%委員徐曉新等提案224-225案系第4幕後勤補給支援之提案224案案日案件計資酬金減列8337000元委員馬文君等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
3414.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
3437.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
225案設備機投資減列6297萬3千元委員馬文君等提案226案第五目陸用兼增型無人機凍結10%委員黃仁等提案227-230案系第五目長城前設重型魚雷之提案227案凍結五分之四委員馬文君等提案228案凍結10%委員黃仁等提案229案凍結五分之四委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
3443.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
3465.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
黃建斌等人提案230業務費凍結3%委員王恩祥等人提案231至232案系第五目建農及前建戰鬥系統提升提升案之提案231案凍結5000萬元委員黃恩祥等人提案232案凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等人提案233至235案系第 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
3473.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
3489.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
五目前建國造第二階段原型建籌建築提案233案凍結5000萬元委員馬文君等人提案234凍結10%委員黃恩底案235業務費凍結20%委員王安祥等人提案236至238系新一代輕型巡防建第二階段 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
3498.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
3505.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
原型建籌建直提案236案凍結兩億元委員馬文君等提案237案凍結10%委員黃倫等提案238案凍結5%委員黃建斌等提案239-242案系第五目康定吉 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
3517.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
3527.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
建站系統性能提升之提案239案凍結10%委員黃倫等人提案240凍結5%委員黃建斌等人提案241凍結5億元委員陳永康等人提案242凍結1億元委員馬文君等人提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
3539.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
3549.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
243至245系第五目魚叉飛彈海岸防衛系統之提案243案凍結10%委員黃恩等提案244凍結1%委員王恩祥等提案245凍結8000萬元委員馬文君等提案246至248系第五目潛艦國造第三階段後續艦籌建之提案246案凍結50%凍結50%委員黃恩等提案247凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
3568.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
3574.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
100%委員馬文君等提案248軍事裝備及設施凍結10%委員陳永康等提案249快速布雷艇後續艇凍結1億元委員馬文君等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
3582.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
3586.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
第250至第254案254案系第5目新式港琴拖船購置之提案第250案凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第251案凍結200萬元委員陳俊宇等提案第252案凍結100萬元委員王定宇等提案第253案凍結3000萬元委員馬文君等提案第254案凍結10%委員陳永康等提案第255案第5目無人機反制系統凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
3610.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
3621.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
百分之百委員馬文君等提案第256案第5目兩棲徵收橡皮挺成套系統簡列三分之一凍結兩千萬元委員馬文君等提案第257案第5目各式拔具採購案簡列五千萬元凍結一千萬元委員馬文君等提案第258案之第259案為第5目空站即時演訊系統夾槍徵購案之提案第258案凍結就是萬元委員馬文君等提案第259案凍結三十萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
3639.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
3641.996 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
委員黃仁等提案第260案至第261案為第5目下一代作戰件合約設計簡列3000萬元凍結8000萬元委員馬文君等提案第261案凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第262案至第264案系第5目 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
3658.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
3667.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
採購及外購軍品作業費之提案第262案凍結500萬元委員馬文君等提案第263案凍結100萬元委員馬文君等提案第264案凍結100萬元委員馬文君等提案第265案第5目塔型吊車購置減列30萬元委員馬文君等人提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
3679.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
3688.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
第266案第5目拖車及平板尾車檢列1000萬元委員馬文君等提案第267案第8目魚叉飛彈海岸防衛系統軍事裝備及設施凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第268至第271案系第8目 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
3699.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
3705.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
左營二港口擴建工程之提案第268案 凍結十億元委員馬文君等提案第269案 凍結五億元委員陳永康等提案第270案 凍結10%委員薛曉新等提案第271案 凍結5%委員王安祥等提案第272案 第8目 金門縣烏丘碼頭新建工程凍結10%委員黃仁等提案第273案 第8目 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
3723.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
3732.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
綜合教學大樓興建工程凍結200萬元委員馬文君等 提案第274至第275案為第8目彈藥庫除新建整建 簡列1000萬元凍結2000萬元委員馬文君等 提案第275案第8目彈藥庫除新建軍事裝備及設施凍結10%委員黃仁等 提案第276案第8目左營蘇澳及基隆地區新 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
3752.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
3758.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
建置救火堵漏訓場凍結15%委員徐曉新等提案第277至278案為第13目環保業務一般事務費之提案第277案 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
3766.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
3770.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
動結10%委員薛曉新等提案第278案動結10%委員黃仁等提案第279至280案為第一目軍情報及測量作業業務費資提案第279案減列330萬元動結500萬元委員馬文君等提案第280案動結500萬元委員黃仁等提案第281案第一目效益評估作業軍事裝備及設施減列400萬元動結400萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
3793.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
3804.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
委員馬文君等提案第282至283案系第一目突查作業業務費之提案第282案其他業務租金減列100萬元凍結50萬元委員馬文君等提案第283案國內旅費減列200萬元凍結300萬元委員馬文君等提案第284至285案為第一目震戰綜合作業業務費之提案第284案權利使用費凍結90萬元委員馬文君等提案第285案 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
3820.947 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
3829.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
簡列30萬元凍結100萬元委員馬文君等提案第286至287案為第一目軍事醫療作業之提案第286案設施及吸血設備養護費簡列20萬元凍結30萬元委員馬文君等提案第287案簡列1000萬元凍結1400萬元委員馬文君等提案第288案第三目教育行政醫務費委辦費凍結87萬元委員馬文君等提案第289至291案系第三目 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
3849.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
3873.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
作战综合作业业务费制提案第289万保险费减列3万2千亿五元马文均等提案第290案军事装备及设施减列10万亿五元马文均等提案第291案设施及机械设备养护费减列400万元冻结200万元五元马文均等提案第292至第298案系第三目训练综合作业业务费制提案第292案冻结2000万元五元马文均等提案第290 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
3874.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
3880.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
293案 保險費 減列20萬元 凍結10萬8千元為馬文軍等 提案第294案 軍事裝備及設施凍結5000萬元為黃人等 提案第295案凍結60萬元為劉許廷等 提案第296案 減列60萬元 凍結3000萬元為馬文軍等 提案第297案物品凍結200萬元為馬文軍等人 提案第298案 設施及機械設備養物費 凍結600萬元為馬文軍等人 提案第299案 第4目一般彈藥 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
3905.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
3917.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
過滯與維護業務費軍事裝備及設施凍結100萬元委員旁人等提案第300案至第301案是第4目運輸作業之提案第300案其他業務租金減列348萬元委員馬文君等提案第301案雜項設備費減列300萬元凍結400萬元委員馬文君等提案第302案設施機械設備養護費凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案第303案至 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
3932.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
3937.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
第307案 第4目通信電子與資訊管理制提案 第303案 凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
3938.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
3947.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
30% 委員馬文君等 提案第304案通訊費凍結1500萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第305案資訊服務費減列4000萬元 凍結5000萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第306案減列300萬元 凍結1000萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第307案減列4000萬元 凍結5000萬元 委員馬文君等 提案第308至第309案系第4目軍事單位裝備零附件購置及保修 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
3964.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
3968.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
凍結1%委員王安祥等提案第309案安熱案件機制頭金凍結70%委員馬文君等提案第310至第312案系第4目獲請補給資源業務費之提案第310案凍結3%委員王安祥等提案第311案凍結100萬元委員林竹英等提案第312案資訊服務費凍結713萬元委員馬文君等提案第313至第319案系第5目新市高校 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
3992.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
4003.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
高級教訓基知提案 第313案 凍結10%委員薛曉新等提案 第314案 凍結3億元委員馬文君等提案 第315案 凍結5000萬元委員黃仁等提案 第316案 凍結500萬元委員陳俊宇等提案 第317案 凍結200萬元委員王定宇等提案 第318案 凍結10%委員王安祥等提案 第319案 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
4017.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
4028.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
動結五千萬元委員陳永煌等提案第三百二十案I2性能提升及採購I3動結兩億元委員馬文君等提案第三百二十一至第三百二十四案系第五目 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
4029.517 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
4046.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
F16AV型戰機性能提升之提案第321案凍結2000萬元委員馬文君等提案第322案凍結500萬元委員陳永康等提案第323案軍事裝備及設施凍結20%委員王安祥等提案第324案軍事裝備及設施凍結20%委員王安祥等提案第325案第5目F16型機新式增 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
4056.702 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
4066.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
徵召夾槍凍結500萬元五元馬文軍等提案第326案第5目F-16型機遠距精準武器籌購案凍結8000萬元五元馬文軍等提案第327案第5目高高空無人機系統凍結5000萬元五元馬文軍等提案第328案第5目F-16V Block70型機作戰支援夾槍及武器彈藥籌購案業務費凍結1億元五元馬文軍等提案第329案國家先進地對 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4086.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4099.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
空飛彈系統第一階段凍結1億元為馬文均等提案第330案第5目新增警衛排巡邏車凍結1600萬元為馬文均等提案第331案第5目屏東基地ILSE降系統換裝案簡列411萬元為馬文均等提案第332案第5目機場專用3000家輪消防車籌購案簡列9億8800 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4115.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4142.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
八十四萬元至二分之一 凍結兩百八十六萬元委員馬文君等人提案 第三百三十三字 第三百三十五案 第五目空站即時演訊系統夾槍徵購案之提案 第三百三十案檢列一千萬元凍結四千萬元委員馬文君等人提案 第三百三十四案凍結五百四萬元委員黃建斌等人提案 第三百三十五案凍結兩百萬元委員陳永康等人提案第三百三十六案 第五目 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4144.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4151.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
TPS、FPS之117雷達性能提升案 凍結5000萬元為馬文軍等提案第337案第5目 站管新型機動雷達換裝 凍結1億元為馬文軍等提案第338案第5目 HADR及TPS之75V雷達換裝 凍結2億元為馬文軍等提案第339至第342案為第8目 台東基地設施新建工程之提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4173.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4197.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
第三百三十九案 凍結10%委員薛曉新等提案第三百四十案 凍結五千萬元委員黃仁等提案第三百四十一案 凍結5%委員黃建斌等提案第三百四十二案 凍結五千萬元委員馬文君等提案第三百四十三至第三百四十五案 系第八目跑滑道戰備工程之提案第三百四十三案 凍結10%委員薛曉新等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4199.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4209.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
第三百四十四案凍結兩千萬元委員黃仁等人提案第三百四十五案凍結五百萬元委員陳永康等人提案第三百四十六案 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4210.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4235.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
第八幕 西支130型停機棚廠設施興建工程凍結100萬元委員黃仁等提案第347案 第八幕 空軍作戰指揮部沿圈及圍牆主角設施整建工程 減列1億2317萬9千元委員馬文君等提案 第348案 第八幕 空軍軍官學校充實教育設備司案 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4236.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4259.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
簡列五百萬元凍結三千萬元委員馬文君等提案第三百四十九至第三百五十一案系第十一幕創新發展之提案第三百四十九案凍結一億六千三百九十六萬元委員馬文君等提案第三百五十案凍結兩千萬元委員牛許廷等提案第三百五十一案凍結十%委員徐草新等提案三百五十二至三百五三案系第一幕 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
4264.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
4283.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
情报及测量作业之提案352案冻结1亿5360万元委员牛许腾提案353案军事装备及设施全案减列2亿元全案冻结5000万元委员马文君等提案354至359案系第一幕效益评估作业之提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4285.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4290.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
354案 凍結3629萬9千元委員牛許廷等人提案355案 凍結30%委員林楚英等人提案356案 軍事裝備及設施檢列2188萬9千元委員馬文君等人提案357案 軍事裝備設施及 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4308.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4336.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
軍事裝備及設施減列一千萬元委員馬文軍等提案三百五十八案軍事裝備及設施減列四百四十一萬元委員馬文軍等提案三百五十九案軍事裝備及設施凍結五百萬元委員馬委員黃仁等提案三百六十案第三幕訓練綜合作業凍結三千萬元三千萬元委員牛許等提案三百六十一案設施修繕維護與管理凍結一億元委員牛許廷等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4337.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4348.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
362案车辆及办公器具养护费减列200万元委员黄人等提案363之365案系第四目后勤补给支援之提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4348.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4354.036 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
363案檢列2916萬3000元凍結1億元委員牛許廷等提案364案一般事務費檢列667萬3000元委員馬文君等提案365案房屋建築及房屋建築養護費檢列2703萬9000元委員馬文君等提案366案第五目特種戰術車輛檢列1500萬元凍結1000萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4377.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4399.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
委員馬文君等提案367案第五目機動阻絕設施整備凍結三萬八千元委員馬文君等提案368案第五目憲兵勤務頭盔整備凍結一千萬元委員馬文君等提案369案第五目憲兵快增小組裝備汰換簡列一千九百九十 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4400.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4408.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
8万9千元委员马文君等提案370案第5目无线电系统提升案冻结2000万元委员黄仁等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4410.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
4434.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
三百七十一案第八目現訓中心充實教育設施整建案檢列五三萬九千元委員馬文君等提案三百七十二至三百七十三案系第一目效益評估作業之提案三百七十二案檢列一百萬元凍結四百萬元委員馬文君等提案三百七十三案軍事裝備及設施凍結一百萬元委員黃仁等提案三百七十四案第三目動員整備凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
4440.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
4448.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
5%委員羅美玲等提案375至376案系第4幕後勤綜合勤務物品之提案375案簡列100萬元委員陳冠廷等提案376案 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
4456.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
4473.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
减列100万元,冻结300万元委员马文君等提案,377至385系第四目通信电子与资讯管理制提案,377案,冻结30%委员马文君等提案,378案,教育训练费冻结100万元委员马文君等提案,379案, |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
4474.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
4503.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
教育训练费减列50万元委员黄人等提案380案通讯费冻结400万元委员马文君等提案381案资讯服务费减列2000万元冻结4000万元委员马文君等提案382案军事装备及设施减列1000万元冻结3000万元委员马文君等提案383案军事装备及设军事装备设施养护费减列2000万元冻结3亿元委员马文君等提案383案资讯软硬体设备费 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
4504.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
4528.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
檢列兩百萬元凍結一百萬元委員馬文君等提案三百八十五案雜項設備費檢列三百萬元凍結兩百萬元委員馬文君等提案三百八十六案第四目物品檢列三百萬元凍結六百萬元委員馬文君等提案三百八七至三百八十八案系第五目環島第二路由集資通系統微波建置案之提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
4529.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
4537.594 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
387案 凍結2000萬元委員馬文君等提案388案 軍事裝備及設施凍結500萬元委員黃仁等提案389案 第一幕軍事行政凍結1000萬元委員陳冠廷等提案390至398案 西第一幕政戰綜合作業之提案390案 凍結300萬元委員陳俊宇等提案391案 凍結200萬元委員王定宇等提案392案 凍結200萬元委員王毅 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
4557.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
4578.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
易川等提案393案,冻结200万元委员陈俊义等提案394案,冻结500万元委员牛许田等提案390万,业务费冻结500万元委员林楚英等提案396案,委办费冻结10%委员黄仁等提案397案,一般事务费减列2000万元冻结2000万元委员马文君等提案398案 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
4579.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
4597.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
一般數費減列600萬元委員陳冠廷等提案399-401案系第一幕軍眷服務職提案399案凍結8萬元委員劉許廷等人提案400案凍結12萬元委員劉許廷等人提案401案凍結1%委員王安祥等人提案402案第四幕房屋建築養護費減列1000萬元委員馬文君等人提案403案一般武器 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
4608.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
4614.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
及戰備支援裝備購置凍結500萬元委員劉雪婷等提案第5目增防器材汰換檢列604萬2000元委員馬文君等提案第5目戰時及救災採訪裝備汰換之提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
4626.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
4638.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
405案减列2000万元冻结1000万元委员马文君等提案406案冻结10%委员黄仁等提案407案第一幕业务费减列600万元委员马文君等提案408案 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
4640.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
4653.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
第一幕行政事務凍結100萬元委員馬文君等提案409至410案系第四幕後勤綜合勤務之提案409案凍結200萬元委員陳俊宇等提案410案委辦費凍結200萬元委員黃仁等提案410到414案系第四幕營產管理之提案411案凍結500萬元委員羅美玲等提案412案凍結1000萬元委員劉許廷提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
4670.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
4687.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
413案對國內團體資捐助凍結兩億元委員馬文君等提案414案對國內團體資捐助凍結一百萬元委員王玉川等提案415案第七目國軍營設及設施改建基金凍結三千萬元委員劉許廷等提案第451案 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
4699.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
4714.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
第三目 教育行政 業務費值提案第451案 一般事務費凍結50萬元為黃人等提案第452案 房屋建築及社房屋建築養護費減列50萬元凍結300萬元為馬文君等提案第453案至第456案 系第8目 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
4721.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
4732.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
軍事教育工程資提案第453案業務費凍結1500萬元為馬文君等提案第454案業務費減列500萬元凍結100萬元為馬文君等提案第455案減列500萬元凍結100萬元為馬文君等提案第456案設備及投資減列500萬元凍結100萬元為馬文君等提案第457案第8目交通及運輸設備凍結300萬元為馬文君等提案第458案 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
4748.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
4766.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
第八目 軍事教育設備115至119年度充實學校教育設備施減列三千萬元凍結一千萬元為馬文軍等提案第459至第461案為第三目教育行政之提案第459案凍結一百萬元為黃人等提案第460案教育訓練費凍結三十萬元為馬文軍等提案第461案設施及吸血設備養護費減列一百萬元凍結一百萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
4777.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
4779.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
委員馬文君等提案第462案 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
4784.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
4801.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
第四目設施修繕維護與管理設施及機械設備養護費凍結30萬元委員馬文君等提案第463案至第467案為第一目人事行政之提案第463案凍結500萬元委員農美林等提案第464案凍結500萬元委員農美林等提案第465案業務費凍結10%委員徐巧欣等提案第466案 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
4809.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
4830.33 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
一般事務費凍結兩千萬元五元黃人等提案第467案一般事務費凍結兩百萬元五元黃人等提案第468案第一目一般事務費凍結九百萬元五元馬文君等提案第469至第470案系第三目教育行政制提案第469案凍結一千萬元五元農民營等提案第470案 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
4832.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
4834.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
國外旅費凍結100萬元為馬文均等提案第471案凍結200萬元為馬文均等提案第472至第476案系第三目作戰綜合作業業務費之提案第472案檢列2000萬元凍結700萬元為馬文均等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
4851.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
4856.734 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
第473案 教育訓練費減列300萬元 凍結300萬元為馬文軍等提案第474案 軍事裝備及設施減列1000萬元 凍結100萬元為馬文軍等提案第475案 軍事裝備及設施凍結20%為王翔等提案第476案 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
4875.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
4898.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
第三幕教育訓練作戰綜合作業業務費一般事務費減列一千萬元凍結一千萬元委員馬文君等人提案第四百七十七至四百七十九案第三幕業務費減列兩千一百萬元委員馬文君等人提案第四百七十八案稅出第三幕訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
4900.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
4905.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
綜合作業業務費凍結500萬元委員黃仁等提案第479案軍事裝備及設施檢列4000萬元全數凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案第480至第481案系第4目後勤綜合後勤綜合勤務之提案第480案業務費檢列200萬元委員馬文君等提案第481案 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
4927.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
4933.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
資訊軟體設備費減列600萬元 凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案第482案業務費 房屋建築養護費減列2000萬元 凍結500萬元委員馬文君等提案第483至第490案系第4目通信電子資訊管理之提案第483案凍結30%委員馬文君等提案第484案業務費減列500萬元委員黃仁等提案第485案 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
4957.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
4961.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
教育訓練費減列1億元 凍結1000萬元為馬文君等提案第486案資訊服務費減列500萬元為馬文君等提案第487案資訊服務費減列200萬元為馬文君等人提案第488案資訊服務費減列1000萬元 凍結500萬元為馬文君等人提案第489案 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
4979.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
4982.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
資訊軟硬體設備費減列300萬元凍結300萬元委員馬文君等提案第490案資訊軟硬體設備費凍結300萬元委員黃仁等提案第491案第6目各項佳績凍結10%委員徐曉新等提案第492案第8目一般建築及設備交通及運輸設備減列500萬元凍結500萬元委員馬文君等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
5008.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
5018.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
493案 第8目 交通及運輸設備檢列800萬元 凍結500萬元 委員馬文君等提案第494案 第13目 環保設施維護 一般事務費檢列500萬元 凍結500萬元 委員馬文君等提案第495案 第1目 情報及測量作業 軍事裝備設施養護費 凍結500萬元 委員黃仁等提案第496案 第5目 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
5036.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
5041.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
增房車汰換凍結100萬元委員黃仁等提案第497案至第499案第4目設施修繕維護與管理業務費之提案第497案房屋建築養護費減列705萬6千元委員馬文君等提案第498案 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
5059.895 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
5069.702 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
房屋建築養護費凍結100萬元 委員黃仁等提案第499案 設施及機械設備檢列159萬元 委員馬文君等提案第500案第4目 通信電子與資訊管理設施及機械設備養護費檢列1億1933萬4千元 委員馬文君等提案第501案第4目 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
5084.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
5092.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
軍事單位裝備零附件購置及保修設施及機械設備養護費減列44萬5千元委員馬文君等提案第502案第5目節訊網路資訊設備及作業系統升級案減列10萬元委員黃仁等提案第503案 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
5102.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
5119.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
第八目 截訊網路資訊設備及作業系統升級案 簡列490萬3千元 委員馬文君等提案第504至第505案第11目 衛星影像AI自動辨識之提案 第504案 簡列5千萬元 委員馬文君等提案第505案 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
5124.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
5142.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
第十一幕 創新發展衛星影像AI自動辨識 凍結一千萬元委員黃仁等提案第五百零六案 第一幕軍事行政凍結5%委員盧美玲等提案第五百零七案 第一幕軍事行政官兵權益保障作業業務費凍結五十萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
5146.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
5154.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
下一步宣讀416案至450案416案第7幕資安園區凍結6000萬元委員馬文君等提案417案至418案系第11幕軍品研發之提案417案凍結5億元委員牛許廷等提案418案對國內團體之捐助凍結10%委員黃恩等提案419案工綠電子社平產業應用發展計劃凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案420案 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
5175.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
5176.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
野戰全身行動力外骨骼系統開發凍結一千萬元委員馬文君等提案421案無人載具前 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
5184.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
5193.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
無人載具前瞻技術多元整合開發計劃檢列5億765萬元委員馬文君等提案422之426案西地木軍事醫療作業之提案422案凍結100萬元委員林楚瑩等提案423案物品凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案424案物品凍結10%委員黃仁等提案425案 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
5209.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
5213.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
資訊軟硬體設備費減列500萬元委員馬文君等提案426案對特種基金之補助減列200萬元委員馬文君等提案427案第三目設備及投資減列2440萬元委員馬文君等提案428案第四目 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5226.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5230.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
軍事裝備設施養護費減列1050萬元委員馬文君等提案429案第4目物品減列1088萬5000元委員馬文君等提案430字432案西地巴木醫療設備支機械設備費支提案430案減列1億6080萬元委員馬文君等提案431案 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5250.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5254.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
簡列1億6080萬元委員馬文君等提案432案簡列1億元凍結1億元委員馬文君等提案433案 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5262.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5282.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
第十一幕醫學研究凍結一億三千七百五十萬元委員馬文君等提案四百三十四案第一幕權利使用費凍結五十萬元委員黃仁等提案四三四百三十五至四百三十六系第三幕之提案四百三十五案凍結一千萬元委員沈伯陽等提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5282.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5284.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
436案,凍結100萬元委員羅美玲等提案,437至442之案,即第三幕動員整備業務費之提案,437案,凍結5%委員王安祥等提案,438案, |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5297.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5306.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
資訊服務費減列750萬元委員馬文君等提案439案委辦費凍結3000萬元委員馬文君等提案443一般事務費減列2000萬元委員馬文君等提案441案國外旅費減列1000萬元凍結300萬元委員馬文君等提案442案資訊軟硬體設備費減列4000萬元委員馬文君等提案443至447西利斯幕後勤補給支援支支業務費支提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5327.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5336.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
後勤補給支援之提案443案檢列3億元委員馬文君等提案444案物品檢列1000萬元委員馬文君等提案445案物品檢列1759萬3000元凍結1000萬元委員馬文君等提案446案雜項設備費檢列1200萬元委員馬文君等提案447案雜項設備費檢列2661萬7000元凍結3000萬元委員馬文君等提案448案 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5355.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5366.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
國軍高雄燕巢中陵塔興建凍結1000萬元委員馬文軍等人提案449案國軍中陵二店興建凍結1000萬元委員馬文軍等人提案450案第一幕行政事務凍結100萬元委員王定宇等人提案第508案至第529案為主決議現在宣讀主決議之內容 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5377.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5406.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
第五百零八案查國防部創新發展經費涵蓋國防創新小組所推動之公開徵求原型開發各類型計劃微查預算內就本項兩億一千三百九十六萬元創新發展經費之具體運用均為詳細說明預算編列依據之合理性與後續執行之透明度已有具體之說明原請國防部與三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員王一川等人 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5406.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5406.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
第509案F16V |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5409.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
5438.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
飛官為空軍主力作戰兵力查近年空軍F16機隊歷經多次飛岸事件國防部及空軍司令部已陸續推動相關改進措施為於航機基建可靠度飛行員個人保命裝備海空搜救量能及跨機關協調等面向仍有持續強化之必要援請國防部所屬空軍司令部與三省院聯想立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員王逸川等人第510案 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
5440.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
5464.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
查近年國軍智商案件頻傳全軍新輔官人力嚴重不足與民間心理師、智商心理師、社工師之專業養成有相當之落差原要求國防部於三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告並就外離島地區建立遠距智商及定期專案心理師駐點輪訪機制提出具體方案提案人委員王立川等人第511案 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
5466.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
5487.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
一百一十五年度國防部所屬全民防衛動員署第一幕一般事務費編列預算一億四千五百零七萬八千元其中慈湖沿區設置桃園管理署其運作相關經費按基準每月約十八萬兩千元原要求國防部全民防衛動員署戶北指揮部辦理下列事項一 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
5488.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
5514.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
即刻停止池湖營區大溪營區作為兩獎紀念場域對外開放之相關業務二廢止國防部全民防衛動員署後備指揮部池湖營區及大溪營區開放管理要點三裁測桃園管理組投入相關人力與預算編列是將兩獎臨請移至中正紀念堂提案人委員王逸川等人第512案國防部政治作戰局國軍心理健康照顧方案於114年度編列新台幣1748萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
5517.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
5538.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
然115年度僅編列1448萬元於官兵使用後調查高達99%續用之需求明顯不符亦與衛福部相似計劃預算呈現方向縮減允請國防部於一個月內提出完整書面報告說明預算簡列之理由提案人為林楚英等人第513案 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
5539.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
5540.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
第五百一十四案 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
5566.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
5589.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
武防部軍備局規格建設中心兵器試驗場宜蘭大福兵試場為全國唯一之兵器試驗場,然該試驗場長期執行火炮試射及相關測試作業,對周邊沿海地區居民生活安寧、移民作業安全及漁獲生機均造成一定之影響,地方民眾反應補助機制與實際受影響的情形尚有落差,期待檢討改進。 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
5590.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
5605.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
原請國防部持續檢討敦敬慕尼工作要點及相關作業規範,管道地方意見,研議具公平性、合理性及透明性之機制,與確保慕尼經費有效運用。提案人委員陳俊宇等人,第515萬嘉義水上機場為雲嘉地區唯一航空站,每日皆有各一班飛機來回金門縣及澎湖縣兩地, |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
5612.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
5635.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
唯一班次僅各有一班次造成國軍弟兄需要與民眾搶票也常常無票可返鄉請國防部檢討連續假期官兵返鄉之方式並提供相關之協助並於三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告體驗人委員陳冠廷等人第516案國軍近年來發生多起重大靶場安全意外 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
5635.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
5651.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
為避免旱事再次發生,應檢討各級靶場設施及其安全標準是否達標,安全設備是否完善足夠。請國防部與三個院內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出出面報告。提案人委員陳慧婷等人第517案陸軍司令部115年度裝備業務計劃中編列戰術型進程無人機飛行載具第二階段預算,為充實 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
5658.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
5688.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
以下作战征收能力然而该军第一阶段筹获战术行进乘无人机飞行载具之合格操作人员人数仍有不足陆军因持续检讨无人机操作训练成果减少意外发生并经济其训练量能达到战力需求请国防部于三个月内请国防部向立法院外交及国防委员会提出出面报告提案人委员陈冠廷等人第518案国防部所属支通电军指挥部近年领取网路 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
5689.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
5717.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
勤務加急預算支領人數至2021年後逐漸下降且實際支領人數佔預算編連人數比例均不及九成尤其近期中共對我自通電驅加強攻擊十一時期應檢討網路佔勤務人員是否充足也應持續強化網路作戰人員專業訓練能力提案人並請國防部向立法院外交國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員陳冠廷等人第519案 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
5719.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
5741.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
115年度國防部空軍司令部教育訓練業務向下軍事書籍編印預算編列382萬4千元空軍司令部應優先推動空軍軍官雙略刊與空軍學術雙略刊之數位轉型並於六個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員陳冠廷等人 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
5743.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
5771.918 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
第五百二十案一百一十五年度國防部空軍司令部軍事行政向下督查作業中國內旅費編列一百一千零九十一萬元國防部應全面檢視督查作業之執行模式規劃以遠距詢訊書面審查與實地督查分流之精進作為提升督查效能並減少不必要之差旅支出並以三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人為陳冠廷等人第五百二十一案 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
5773.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
5801.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
國防部海軍司令部預算軍事行政向下一般15費預算編列3,546萬元內因中海艦維護經費曝增國防部海軍司令部應就中海艦之後卻處置主動與國文化部行政院相關部會及地方政府完成跨機關協調確認接收單位及完整文化方案後使得進行大規模維護工程並於三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出出面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
5803.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
5815.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
第522案服防部空軍司令部後勤及通知業務向下資訊服務費空軍後勤資訊系統精進整合作業三項勞務委外案預算編列711萬9千元查114年度預算書與編列 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
5820.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
5843.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
相同的名稱同金額之採購案國防部空軍司令部應立即擬清空軍後勤資訊系統精進整合作業等三項牢獄委外案之執行情形並建立資訊系統委外案之全面控管機制避免同名同額預算重複編列並於兩個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員陳冠廷等人第523案 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
5846.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
5852.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
海軍司令部軍事行政向下通訊費預算編列1411萬9千元內含漂浮軌跡觀測漂浮後蓄衛星通訊採購案1185萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
5859.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
5885.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
该采购案属资本门采购性质与通讯费之经常支出明显不符违反预算科目适当性原则国防部因全面盘点所属单位115年度经常业务费中对资本门投资性质之计划并于三个月内向立法院外交及国防委员会提出出面报告提案人委员陈冠廷等人第524案国防部空军司令部后勤及 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
5886.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
5907.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
通知業務項下國外旅費預算編列973萬9千元國防部應通盤檢討國外出席會議之派員規模、出差天數、機票倉等住宿標準建立國外差旅費資金算機制與事前審核標準並嚴應以視訊會議代替部分實體出席之可行性並於三個月內向立法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
5907.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
5916.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員陳冠廷等人第525案空軍司令部教育訓練業務項下雜項設備預算編列1248萬4千元本項經費較144年度增幅達132%顯不合理空軍司令部應建立教育訓練汰換管理制度明定各類設備使用連線汰換標準與採購優先順序並區分核心教學訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
5936.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
5950.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
與一般行政設備制預算編列原則並於三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員陳冠廷等人第526案國防部海軍司令部後勤及通知業務向下水電費編列10億1035萬5000元 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
5957.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
5972.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
較114年度增幅高達41%為國防部所屬單位中水電支出最大者國防部因研擬具體的節能管理措施包括能源管理系統建置智慧電表部件再生能源導入及 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
5973.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
5987.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
水回收等措施並於三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員陳冠廷等人第527案國防部海軍思念部營建工程防務建築及設備之左營蘇澳及基隆地區興建 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
5989.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
6007.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
新建制救火堵漏訓場計劃編列7,210萬2千元本案無故展延三年工程延宕將影響海軍人員救難搶修能量養成國防部應立即檢討本案延宕之行政疏失工程障礙及監照責任並追究 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
6009 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
6015.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
相關責任歸屬並於三個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出書面報告提案人委員陳冠廷等人第528案現代戰爭越來越強調兵力防護與野戰防空 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
6024.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
6047.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
顯見仁溪市防空飛彈對低空飛行物及殺成果著重有利我方進行不對稱防衛作戰為該武器籌購過程多有延宕要求國防部應盡速就相關兵種之教育訓練進行規劃並擴大可操作人員之數量以避免暫時因操作人員傷亡而無法使用該武器原請國防部 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
6048.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
6064.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
所屬於一個月內向立法院外交及國防委員會提出擴大仁溪市短程防空飛彈操作操作兵員訓練相關報告提案人委員黃建斌等人第529萬國防部115年度國防部所屬編列水電供應費54億6834萬6千元相較114年度編列預算增加電費等經費高達15億9580萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
6076.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
6087.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
請國防部一個月內向立法院為交集國防委員會提出國防設施節能檢疫節能節電優化書面報告提案人委員黃建斌等人宣讀完畢 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
6092.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
6107.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
好謝謝醫事人員非常辛苦醫事人員宣讀完畢在進行主案討論之前向各位說明我們一舉往例處理原則如下有關國防部主管預算審查順序按照先例先處理國防部所屬單位預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
6108.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
6131.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
不含國安局的部分並依稅入通案軍種的順序來處理之後再處理國防部單位預算最後處理集密預算如果公開預算案在第一輪無法達成共識我們視情況在第二輪討論如果國防部已經向提案委員們說明的話已經達成共識那就請直接報告溝通成果或者是凍結三檢建議書委員如果有其他提問請再補充說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
6133.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
6156.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
那預算以分支計劃為並案原則是討論彈性處理並案凍結或刪減以選擇其中一個提案為主案的方式處理那主提案人的不在場的提案我們原則上不處理那謝謝大家現在進行審查我們先從國防部所屬第61案稅務部分開始請國防部說明委員好我是人事知事長 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
6157.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
6179.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
那第六十一案為黃建斌委員馬文君委員以及劉旭廷委員提案三檢學生退培培館的收入經費那統計我們學生退學人數從113年到114年實際上是檢討經過委員的指導我們在5月15號有向委員說明之後建請同意預算照列看見委員持續的支持以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
6182.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
6209.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
請黃建平委員要不要簡單回應一下謝謝主席其實這一案最主要還是在我們目前學生入學環境這一塊部裡面也能跟我們說明那我們這部分是同意但是還是要提出那個書面的改善報告是謝謝委員謝謝那就是同意這個照列 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
6212.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
6213.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
同意照例 好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
6219.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
6240.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
好 好 照列好 那我們第62案第62案為黃建民委員針對中海建維護預算編列的問題給予指導並提案凍結跟凍結始政作業以上委員報告是說明因為馬文君委員另外在第191跟192案也有對中海建維護的提案建議是否本案暫不處理後續與191跟192案並同討論跟處理好 謝謝那委員OK嗎並案處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
6250.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
6274.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
所以這個中海艦應該現在是在台南市旁邊那這個曾經參與過823的砲戰也曾擊過一艘解放軍的魚類快艦那也是我們現在海軍服役最久的軍艦那它現在的整個保存方式我想對於這樣一個被指定為重要鼓舞的艦艇 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
6276.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
6297.918 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
那現在反而他的去留大家很不清楚我覺得這有點可惜但是他每年也要花這麼高的養護費用那我想這個部分我們可以我想這個我們可以同一步解凍但是我們也要求國防部要提出中海艦海上博物館這個規劃跟書面報告這沒有問題好 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
6304.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
6323.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
那這個部分就是國防部的意思是希望併案那委員的意思是可以併案處理好那跟其他委員一起處理好那我們第六十案併立191192案處理那接下來是第六十三案 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
6324.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
6340.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
第63案為黃建斌委員針對國軍理財宣教及防詐工作給予指導並提案凍結主計作業經費10%以上委員辦公室說明具體做法建議改列組決議免以凍結進行委員指導好那委員OK嗎改列組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
6343.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
6365.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
這個部分國防部雖然來說明然後也提供歷史宣講的資料但軍中一直發生這樣的案件我想其實我們真的很擔心部隊裡面被詐騙階段來滲透這個部分我們在討論之後我們改凍結一百萬然後也要國防部提供相關的書面檢討報告這個時候才可以通知 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
6366.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
6391.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
好那第六十三案凍結一百萬然後提出書面報告時的凍資OK那我們下一案第六十四案為黃建斌委員針對國軍新府工作未曾完善給予指導並提案簡列政戰綜合作業兩百六十一萬三千元並凍結百分之十以上委員辦公室說明相關策進做法建議改列組決議免予煽動敬請委員指導那我們請委員簡單回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
6397.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
6423.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
我想國軍弟兄在軍中中途離職他的理由有很多那可能也不一定是心理或是工作的壓力有可能還是家庭的因素我想這邊國防部也要積極努力來強化我們軍中同仁的這個心理衛生工作那我這邊我們建議不凍結要求國防部提出這邊不凍結啦但是國防部要提出相關的這個留營的這個書面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
6428.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
6428.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
第64項改組決議第65項 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
6446.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
6472.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
第六組案為陳俊宇委員針對人事行政科目提案指導那本案已知委員辦公室說明建請依這個說明結果建議改列組決議委員陳委員好那個公安部有到辦公室大概說明一下那我們就依照說明的結果請公安部就遵照辦理那我們同意改組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
6473.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
6500.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
好那第65案改組決議第66案第66案為陳冠廷委員針對計畫管理的科目提案指導那這個本案已經自委員辦公室向委員說明現請同意免於簡列預算照列好這個部分還希望未來管控資料印製文書事務的費用還是盡量避免資源浪費那我們同意不予刪除謝謝委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
6503.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
6524.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
然後第67到68案第67、68案為陳俊宇等兩位委員針對政戰綜合作業科目預算提案指導以上兩案已經分別自委員辦公室向委員說明第67、68案件請同意改列主決議請問兩位委員有特別意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
6529.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
6545.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
好 我要先講一下為什麼我會提出這個案子主要是針對最近橋頭地檢署偵辦的共諜案那麼這其中包括有一位少校他自己本身是保防主官所以平常主要他的業務就是負責保密防諜的宣傳結果他自己居然涉入其中 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
6546.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
6552.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
所以這表示在這過程當中已經有出現就是規則擺在那裡但是事實上整個落實都會有問題所以這是為什麼我認為你們應該要提出一個具體的本身保防官如果都可能出現這樣的問題的話那麼在制度上風險的辨識財務的預警還有平時考察還有內部的警覺機制上是不是都出現了問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
6570.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
6579.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
而這樣的過程當中其實我是希望看到你們能夠有一個自己內部的檢視我當然可以就是認同就是因為今天現在時間都已經來到了 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
6581.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
6602.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
五六月了那如果再這樣下去的話你們的預算其實執行上如果凍結會有問題但是如果改成主決議只是決議但是你們沒有事後的檢討的話我本來凍結是希望你們能夠緊速的交出報告其實就可以就可以用了啦所以我其實還是希望啦維持原案六七六八能夠合併凍結一百萬對好或者是說你們認為你們在主決議當中你們會不會附加出相關的檢討缺失的報告好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
6612.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
6640.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
昨天委員知道 我們在組決議附件把相關檢討和進行報告附上去謝謝委員知道好 那我們同意可以改組決議那陳委員也可以改組決議好 我這個案子的話我還是希望說我們國防部能夠對於要如何精進士官兵的相關防詐意識還有我們內部的管控還有預警的機制等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
6642.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
6665.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
可以來強化我們相關的法制還有軍際的相關教育說明結果我是可以接受還是希望說我們國防部對這個部分要提高相關的機制的功能我同意改為組決議謝謝委員知道林委員那就是改組決議可以嗎還是要凍結100萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
6667.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
6683.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
改組決議然後你們文字上面要把就是會提出的檢討包括方式的比如說多多久以內交出來是好不好是然後交給本會跟跟本席是好謝謝那請依照那個林委員的這個做法好改組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
6685.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
6701.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
第69到72案請說明第69到70案為黃仁等兩位委員針對軍事醫療作業科目預算案提出指導那這兩個案主要就是針對 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
6704.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
6718.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
馬雲軍委員他是關切這個救護的民用無線電機6971那7072案是馬雲軍委員及黃仁委員關切的醫療用的帳篷那我這邊做個報告那最主要這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
6721.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
6739.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
醫療用的這個無線電機主要是依照國安會在111年5月召開的戰傷研討會議那衛福部提請我們軍醫局要將戰傷的後送與民間醫療的一個通聯機制來建立那軍醫局也在今年啟動這個案子所以他的 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
6740.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
6746.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
這個全瓶機的使用是由一二級的醫療單位與這個專責地區的專責醫院還有消防的醫療後送機制來建立那與這個特別預算條例裡面採購的汰換老舊的無線電機兩個並沒有重複編列這邊再做個報告那 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
6763.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
6777.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
以上四案已經向委員說明那第六十九七十一案建請同意委員那因為這個原本是刪除本均的一千四百四十萬三千元那這邊還是跟馬委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
6779.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
6806.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
因為這個實在是有它的時序那因為相關的手機建置之後還有相關要跟專責醫療醫院的經藥還有通信協定都要去燒入這道時間所以恐怕也沒有辦法用既有的手機來做挪用建請同意免於刪減預算照列那第七十案建請同意改列凍結為五千萬元提供順便報告跟著五百萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
6808.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
6809.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
黃委員 馬委員有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
6826.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
6846.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
好 針對70案的部分因為這個今年要買發電機這個是很離譜的事情因為之前我們在有兩個案子在111年到115年就是剛執行完畢國軍衛生部隊衛勤裝備整備的部分這個有編列了非常高的預算26億8千萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
6852.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
6853.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
那剛執行完籌備的這些15項的這個裝備那在114年跟115年又執行後備部隊衛勤裝備整備的部分這個也編了大概 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
6867.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
6871.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
一億七千八百萬這兩個案子今年都才剛執行完畢才發現沒有店員你買了帳篷買了醫療零附件買了電燈買了殺菌鍋買了手術燈然後還有手術床在那裡面所有這些我們一直在講輕重緩急那很重要的你像滋味末節都買了 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
6893.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
6914.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
可是最重要的發電機卻沒有買你剛剛買的那些要用電可是你卻沒有發電機現在全部錢都花完了你才發現沒有電所以這個部分有兩個問題第一個就是你的規劃有疏漏第二個就是可能你在這些剛才一個二十幾億一個還有一億多這樣加起來 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
6916.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
6930.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
也許是東西買貴了錢通通把它花掉了沒有按照輕重緩急去採購所以現在又要另外編錢買發電機當然它需要有電可是只有這兩個部分還是要做深切的檢討所以同意凍結500萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
6932.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
6952.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
那另外71案的部分剛剛創辦長所提的說明這是非常不合理的這一次其實我們在花蓮馬太安溪的災害我們的指揮並沒有發生問題現在比較重要的是我們任性預算已經買了一萬八千多具這樣子手持是全品無線電機 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
6955.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
6958.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
我們未來也是全軍幾乎都會有這些全品的無線電機其實它的功能涵蓋應該是完全沒有問題而且它跟民間要通聯其實也沒有問題你現在有問題的大概就三個縣市台東花蓮跟苗栗因為它是用我們現在新型的通信協定是P25 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
6979.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
6985.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
可是這三個縣市沒有 你為了這三個縣市沒有你全部要花非常高額的預算 幾十億吧全案多少八千多萬你還要多花八千多萬去買這樣子的一個就是三區 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
7001.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
7002.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
現在三軍已經有全品的手持式發電機它這個通聯完全沒有問題你現在會發生問題是因為你的通信協定就是這三個縣市沒有所以我們希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
7015.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
7018.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
因為我們全國都有了你這樣的新的通信協定我們應該讓這三個縣市去變成有新的通信協定這樣全國都一致所以我們不要本末倒置然後再去買這些 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
7031.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
7041.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
手持式的還有要跟民間去通聯的這個部分因為我們平常根本不會用到你只有在重大災害特殊狀況的時候才會那暫時更不可能所以我們認為你的經費用在這裡是不恰當的這個部分我們還是建議全案刪減 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
7056.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
7080.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
報告委員 在任性國家醫療的時候 軍局報告我們在演訓的時候 還有消防署 還有戰區責任醫院的進入它的民用無線電都必須要進來包括現在澎湖 外島 並不是說這樣完全就可以遮蓋住 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
7080.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
7095.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
你也是有聯絡官啊 我們聯絡官都會過去聯絡官你們這一次在花蓮的指揮有發生問題嗎這一次花蓮的指揮有發生問題嗎我們所有的部署 我們所有的救災我們所有相關的指揮體系不是都非常順暢嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
7097.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
7104.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
你今天如果民間我們應該提升這三個縣市讓他跟全國一致因為你全國已經所有都是用P25這樣子的新型的通信協定我們不是為了這個部分再去買跟民間要通聯的這樣的一個手持式的這個無線電機因為我們現在已經買了你而且你是全軍買你在任性計劃已經買了 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
7124.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
7153.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
包園向您報告任性計畫裡面一萬兩千部他是配附到特戰部隊的個人以及到我們的守備部隊後備部隊他是到部隊那這次這個所提的案子你戰爭發生的時候一萬八千多就是你在災害發生的時候一萬八千多具不夠嗎你只要從那裡調度一些在事故發生的現場使用就好我就一個實務經驗跟您報那因為這次建制的他是到 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
7153.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
7169.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
每一部救護車有這個車裝型還有他這個車長他來持用那我為什麼說就一個實務跟您報告我過去在花蓮服務的時候衛生局局長也希望我們在任何後送的時候能夠先透過一個協商機制讓他們能夠把 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
7172.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
7193.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
醫療設備和醫官先準備好也就是說我們在整個暫時的後送機日我們透過這個傷患一上車我們就可以跟專責醫院去協商廠工長簡單來講不要浪費很多時間我們現在在任性預算買的一萬八千多具的這個手持式全頻無線電機有沒有辦法去做通聯 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
7195.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
7212.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
你現在買的有沒有辦法通聯如果沒有那個根本就是浪費啊你在這任性運算裡面花這麼多的錢你買這個你的意思是他沒有辦法跟民間的救護車那有辦法通聯為什麼你還要再另外買我們現在講的是這個部分佩服對象我們是佩服給他 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
7215.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
7226.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
你戰鬥部隊你在發生重大災害的時候這些東西不可以拿來運用嗎你這一次在花蓮救災的時候是你本來就有佩附在那裡嗎你還不是把它徵集來用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
7230.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
7249.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
接下來是黃委員之後再請王定宇委員先請黃仁委員回應王定宇委員好 我就針對第69案的經過入侵部的說明已經了解本案採購的無限電的一個裝備以國安任性的特別預算中的 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
7251.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
7272.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
這個設備的一個差異那不過在凸顯了我國整體的防衛韌性的構思確實是有缺失那111年的5月戰山研討會就發現各地方消防署的無線電通信架構都沒有整合 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
7273.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
7301.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
所以導致今年的醫療通聯出了一個問題那結果解決方案方法不是要求消防署做好各縣市的一個整合反而是要讓國軍另外採購可以涵蓋各種通信架構的一個設備所以本案原本是要全數刪除所以本席配合其他的一個提案的委員的訴求並案一起處理以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
7303.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
7318.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
謝謝黃委員接下來我們請王定宇委員好 謝謝主席這個手持的通訊器材剛才我聽起來我希望相關單位再說明更清楚一點我們這個器材到底是集中調度 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
7320.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
7347.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
還是必須要充分配付這個差異我們現在在醫療單位有配付了我剛才聽參謀長講的是現在要採購的是配付到作戰單位任性的是作戰單位那剛才馬慧雲說買一萬八千多具那需要的時候可以調度嘛那你們要把這個必要性再說明更清楚一點也就是說我們在醫療單位戰鬥單位都要配付這樣子的裝備 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
7348.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
7375.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
還是我們勤儉建軍需要時候再把它集中移到甲 移到乙 移到丙那我覺得現在的作戰也好救災也好它是同一件事情這一個通訊質管其實應該是要全面要暢通的那這個是屬於幾乎都屬於各莊了那如果需要各莊的時候現在是花東我們都希望不要發生但88是在南高啊 屏啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
7376.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
7396.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
零二零二四在台南就是說天災也好戰亂也好這種如果是必要而充分配付的那我們應該逐年或者一次把它配付量到到那如果它是一個因應緊急狀態我可以集中調配的那我買這一萬八千具哪裡需要我集中調配給他那我可以節省公帑這是兩個不一樣的概念你們是不是可以說明更清楚一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
7398.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
7424.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
謝謝王委員我這邊說明一下 也就是說還是懇請委員支持因為我們原來的那個手持無線電是來汰換那個舊式的無線電所以剛剛已經提到的是那一筆是撥給到了特戰部隊步兵旅還有後備旅還有後勤部隊那現在這一個部分是我們的這個衛生醫療單位要跟消防署的救護體系 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
7426.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
7434.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
包委員是在醫療單位還有救護車上面而且還有海軍跟空軍海軍跟空軍海軍跟空軍海軍跟空軍陸軍都有救護車三軍的救護車你們沒有聽清楚我們現在手持是全頻無線電機已經可以做 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
7452.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
7479.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
最好的一個通聯不管是哪一個部分所以你買的不管你是一萬八千具還是一萬兩千具它都是足夠的數量如果我們有緊急事件發生的時候就像你在花蓮發生這麼重大天災的時候有些機具的調度還有車輛的調度你也是從外地去的一樣的道理今天你買的現在的要跟民間通聯的 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
7480.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
7487.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
這個沒有比我們現在任性預算裡面買的全屏式的手持式電機更好 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
7488.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
7510.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
對不對 你們現在要把它配到哪裡去你今天如果全屏式的手持電機它都已經配它不是只有在戰鬥部隊可以用它其他都可以用你為了 如果這樣你們以後就不可以再買這些囉你包括你的ATAC 你的TAC全部都不可以買喔因為你們認為還需要再買別的東西嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
7511.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
7515.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
你們一直說要用新的然後你也編了預算結果你為了有一些它的通信協定還沒有改變的你在編八千多萬去買這是非常不合理就像我們今天已經買了一個多功能的一個東西然後它的性能已經更好可是你為了 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
7529.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
7534.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
還要配合可能兩三個還沒有跟上腳步的我們全部再編八千多萬去買這樣子的一個裝備然後再配附下去你平常要配附在哪你平常就有全平式的啊如果這樣你只能選擇一種你如果要用舊的那你新的應該就不要買這麼多因為你已經把它分開了你包括軍醫局你以後會是用那個嗎你們告訴我們未來要全軍通聯的時候是大家一致的 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
7554.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
7577.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
結果你現在退回來為了要跟民間另外三個縣市去做這樣的通聯你另外在變八千多萬買問題是出在這裡不是不能買不是說他缺我們不給而是你已經有更好的裝備你像我們都是派聯絡官他就是一個當地基地台的一個平台他就是一個聯絡官你這一次花蓮的時候也有發生問題我剛剛很簡單的 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
7581.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
7589.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
詢問的部分就這樣,你這一次的救災有問題嗎?跟他們的救護車通聯,跟地方政府有問題嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
7592.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
7613.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
我們總共會軍醫局是446台,483是陸軍,海軍是167台,空軍96台,我們都有仔細的去評估過,那因為他這個演習的時候,戰傷的時候,其實是陸海空一起,以軍醫局的角度,他不是只有陸軍,他是軍醫局一起的,我們醫官都是在所有這三個軍裡面的,所以呢, |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
7615.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
7624.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
這個他還要再跟消防署做聯絡消防署的因為這樣就是有些頻寬消防署是沒辦法跟我們聯絡再加上一些責任的醫院不是我們再去買比較低級的裝備我們要講的是這樣因為你是國防預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
7632.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
7648.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
你是國防預算請注意我們現在要花的是國防預算你已經有比較高階的然後你可以全品的然後你有更好的通聯的裝備結果你卻為了這些民間的或者其他你去降規格去買這些 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
7651.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
7676.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
他就是他為了民間的這個部分你全品的已經可以用這是我們如果沒有我們就到時候再討論這個部分我們建議保守社會公司我均勻可以再補充一下我們這是比較高階的我們這是有三品的真的是比較高階的否則會有個三個縣市會比較高階的真的是比較高階的所以你的全品你剛剛講的這個部分很重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
7677.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
7690.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
如果我們韌性預算買的一萬兩千多具是比這個還要低階那你應該要檢討的是這個你剛剛指的是這樣嗎就是你全品的一萬兩千多具是比現在要買的還要低階 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
7697.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
7712.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
所以這三個地區是不是你應該要去提升他可以加入這個精藥的部分而不是那其他縣市都已經加入了他的問題點出在這裡你讓全國都一致不是比較好嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
7715.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
7744.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
沒關係啊 我們我建議那個沒有共識就先這樣因為我們不但跟消防所救護體系我們還要跟各縣市的急救責任醫院之間要有一個通聯嘛這第一點第二點現在就是居民整合的韌性是我們現在有所重視嘛所以我們才會說分年來採購所需要的那再來就是說剛剛提到那個TECH的部分那這個是涉及到我們整個PACE的通訊韌性因為無線電畢竟有不同的韌性的一個要求所以它 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
7745.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
7762.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
無線電可能在某種緊急的狀態之下當全國進入緊急狀態之下無線電還是一個重要的一個手段的一個通訊手段所以這個部分我們居民之間一定要能夠互通這個才是部長我在 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
7763.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
7771.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
強調一次,這個問題點在於我們現在買的手持式全頻無線電機,在任性預算裡面買的全頻的手持式無線電機它已經具備這樣子的功能,它完全沒有問題,而且它的頻寬更大 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
7781.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
7790.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
他主要這一次要買是因為這三個地區他們在通信協定上沒有辦法進入參與經藥的部分所以其實應該要改的是這三個地區讓他可以跟全國同步而不是我們再去另外買這樣子的一個裝備然後再去跟這三個地區去做這樣子的一個使用 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
7805.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
7826.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
因為你已經買了一萬兩千多據他在任何時候都可以拿來用這是重點好謝謝馬委員那69案跟71案沒有共識我們就保留那第70案跟第72案第72案黃委員我們是不是就是以70案為主決議那並案凍結無辜辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
7830.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
7838.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
保留保留然後6971保留69是按照我們凍結500萬嘛對不對不是不是772現在確定一下70是凍結500萬提書面報告嘛是吧70跟第72案並按凍結500萬並提出書面報告同意後實得凍資6971沒有共識保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
7854.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
7856.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
第73到75案為馬文君等兩位委員針對教育行政科目的預算提出指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
7871.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
7888.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
那我直接報告以上的三案分別向兩位委員說明以及提供完整的資料那第73、75案建請同意併案改列組決議第74案建請同意凍結200萬元題無書面報告 看見委員知道請問提案委員有無意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
7897.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
7914.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
謝謝主席其實三案同意改成主決議因為這個是學生去短期進修的部分可是我們還是希望在學生的學習上面因為我們現在短期進修有的只有四個月或者一年我們希望他可以有更長的時間如果要讓我們的軍人可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
7915.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
7941.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
他在進修學習或拓展人際關係在未來可以從事我們軍事外交因為這個也是我們編列相關預算很主要的一個目的所以不要只是很短暫的大概四個月我們不知道他可以學習到什麼我們希望他可以更具體的然後爭取更長時間的名額這是我們同意改成組決議的部分那74案就官校 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
7943.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
7971.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
北邊跟南邊其實都有用池那南北營區的距離可能不到兩三百公尺所以你教學一般來說可能之前也才剛修好那南邊大概都是長官在使用雖然荒廢很久可是我們還是同意凍結兩百萬可是要具體的說明它的使用率因為希望不要說把錢就是浪費掉了你的使用度非常低的話好 同意凍結兩百萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
7972.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
7975.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
好 謝謝委員那73跟75改組決議第74案同意凍結200萬那藥精書面報告就可以動之嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
7990.996 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
8019.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
本席提案的我們希望都是請同意好那提出書面報告並請同意後時得動之那我們來補宣告剛才的第70跟第72案是病案並且是以第70案為主案那針對所有病案凍結的狀況國防部答覆的書面報告先包括病案委員的提案的諮詢事項以下不再逐一宣告那接下來76到82案請國防部說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
8020.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
8043.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
第76到82案為陳俊宇等四位委員針對訓練綜合作業的科目提案指導那以下就最主要這邊大多都有共識那我就那個第81案馬文君委員關心的多元行政用途無人機採購 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
8044.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
8071.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
那這邊特別向委員補充這個採購它主要是依照一個部隊的訓練的替代型以它的基礎和兼增的無人機為主那建立全軍的無人機操作的基本能量而且這個建置之後也可以有效的節省訓場巡管的人力那最主要這個是屆時會有台營的共同供應契約來採購那它是屬於非紅供應鏈的一部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
8072.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
8093.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
那這個也是建請委員支持那以上的7案已向委員說明那其中第76、77案建請改列組決議第78案建請同意並79案凍結金額500萬元提出書面報告那第79案建請同意下修凍結數500萬元提出書面報告第80案建請同意刪減 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
8106.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
8133.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
報報報報您說委員講那個八八八七十九案七十八七九併案凍結五百萬報告這個是案協商結果七八七九併案那我們七十九案另案凍結一千萬因為上面寫的是一千萬齁七十九案 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
8136.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
8164.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
報告 報告 七十 七十對 報告 那是八十 八十案 三減一千萬 是對 照 照共識是您 呃 為您說的是七十九 您那邊是三減一千哦 哦 哦 凍結一千七十九案凍結一千 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
8169.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
8194.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
七十九案是仁熙四次徵這個資料我們有沒有跟委員報告過?一委員知道那如果依協商結果是委員那邊是凍結一千萬那就一委員知道,是 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
8195.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
8215.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
是 是 鮑委員 這個依您的指導來辦理那 第八十一案是建立全軍官兵基礎的無人機操作建議同意免禦三處 凍結九百萬元 題無書面報告第八十案 建請同意改列組決議 恳請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
8219.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
8238.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
好 那我們請提案委員們說明先依照舉手的順序 劉許廷委員 徐巧欣委員然後兩位委員講完之後再看馬文君委員 陳俊宇委員然後接下來我 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
8239.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
8266.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
好 謝謝主席這個當然本席這次針對國防預算的提案大部分都是針對多人運用行政用途無人機採購這樣子一個暗項在各個國軍單位裡面的預算這個本席都有質疑倒不是講說這些東西不該買而是說既然要買這些無人機不管你是訓練也好 巡場也好你要透過什麼樣的管道來購買也好我想都是沒有問題的但關鍵是這樣就是說我在購買這些無人機之後我的操作 訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
8269.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
8292.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
測考研究系統建置飛行執照等等的一些人的相關的一些配套我想是值得一場非常清楚而且公開的說明所以我想在這若干的案子後面還有很多案子也都跟這個相關本席是希望凍結的數字大家當然可以商量稍微少一點也可以接受但本席要求至少要一場專案報告我們針對未來無人機的整體的人員訓練跟使用等等要一場專案報告之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
8295.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
8303.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
再來進行解凍啦這是本席的要求啦那數額的部分因為好幾家一起嘛大家商量一下吧 以上好 謝謝牛委員接下來許巧欣委員謝謝主席喔那我想呢在這個部分我想要請教一下國防部因為先前我在質詢的時候也曾經提過就是關於無人機的證照這個方面因為我們現在講的是訓練嘛無人機的證照那過去就曾經有幾位陸軍的弟兄 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
8324.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
8335.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
那他們呢被要求就是要去上民用無人機的課程而且要自費所以呢他們有的是自費一萬元有的自費幾千元那就是呢國防部這邊是補助他們但他們要自費可是其實按照我們現在的這個無人機的訓練指揮部裡面我們是軍用的無人機的使用基本上應該是我們軍方這邊自行去認定給予證照的 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
8349.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
8354.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
但是卻一直以來就層出不窮都有就在我們基層上面被要求去考取民間的證照我想是這樣子就是我兩個問題第一個如果說有必要請我們的國軍弟兄去考取證照 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
8367.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
8389.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
是不是未來可以建立全額補助的制度因為請他們去考取這個民間證照對他們未來退伍以後的生涯或許是有幫助的但他們在在役的期間我覺得不宜讓他們去就你只是補貼一部分然後要他們再掏腰包被迫掏一萬元然後去學這樣的一個民間的無人機的使用技巧 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
8389.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
8399.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
所以第一個問題是能不能夠如果有要求就是要去做民間的無人機的證照的話是全額補貼而不是變成他們必須知道要保持第二個第二個問題是有關於軍用的無人機的這個訓練那得到的證照有沒有可能跟民間接軌因為我們這邊軍方這裡我們當然是軍規的無人機可是如果我們的國軍弟兄在這裡已經得到了軍方的使用證照 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
8418.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
8436.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
那我想要請問他未來退伍以後他能不能使用這樣子的一個軍方的證照等同於是他已經得到的民用無人機的證照他未來在他的就業退休以後就退伍以後對不起退伍以後他的就業可以用這一張軍方的去做代表 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
8437.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
8451.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
這對他以後在退伍後的執訓是有相當好的一個發展機會的所以在這邊也是替我們的基層弟兄來請命這兩個問題我覺得可能比我們凍結多少數字還要更加的重要希望可以得到明確的回覆謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
8453.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
8479.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
好 謝謝我們郭幫波要檢要回覆報告陸軍這邊就委員的指導做兩點報告第一個過去的確有些單位是在宣導政令上面有一些導致誤解他鼓勵部分的有興趣的幹部去考無人機證照那這個我們先前也在多次的答詢報告我們的軍用無人機目前都是 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
8480.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
8491.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
沒有需要到這些證照在陸軍的部分我是詢問的是說就是因為鼓勵他們有興趣的人是學不是壞事但是不能他自掏腰包有沒有可能未來是說補貼已經 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
8495.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
8504.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
不能就對了 禁止現在沒有這樣的一個政策說要鼓勵他們去那你們就要禁止這麼做啊是的 已經禁止了有禁止喔 是好 那第二個部分那第二個有關於委員提詢的這個就類似我們所謂換照的概念那這段部分因為我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
8512.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
8538.624 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
這個部分還要協商的包含到民航局還有相關多的單位那我們會視我們目前實際上部隊的一個訓練的成果和民間政策的一個相容性這個委員的指導我們後續會作為一個努力的方向因為如果有民間相容性的問題那是不是我們在軍方的這個訓練上面就可以補以一些民間他所需要的讓他在這個跟未來的這個民航的部分能夠接軌 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
8539.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
8548.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
就是這個部分大概我們需要多少時間然後能夠去了解就是我們需要多少時間可不可以讓我稍微知道一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
8552.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
8571.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
這個王廷文想要先快速的我詢問完了 好無人機是時代的潮流但是它會常常在變以前要人去控制後來AI可以控制群飛所以現在學的證照下一季有沒有用我們不知道那我希望陸軍跟國防部講清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
8571.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
8585.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
我們國防部需要的兵力具備的無人機的技術我們自己會訓我們沒辦法訓我們委訓國家花錢不用阿兵哥自己花錢不用官士兵自己花錢這是一個基本態度我需要什麼能力是國家去規劃好的 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
8587.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
8610.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
我們原來學FPV那可能將來按個鍵一秒就學會了AI就自己控制了所以那個要具備什麼能力我是一個官士兵我不知道啊我現在去考這個證照我有興趣那是我的事不關國家所以國家不用鼓勵但國家也沒有權利禁止我去學啊我要花錢我要繳學費去學我搞不好下個月我要報退伍了我自己有自己的想法所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
8611.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
8629.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
軍方該做的事情是不准要求兵或士官花錢去拿個證照滿足領導幹部的需求這個要禁止不能說我將來你要升士官長你沒有那個證照我不讓你升這個要禁止就不能讓領導幹部去要求官士兵去拿到什麼證照 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
8631.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
8657.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
這個不行因為他花他自己的錢至於我們軍方需要什麼樣的無人機操控的能力請規劃好軍方自訓軍方沒有能力自訓軍方偽訓這兩個都是花國家的錢而不是花官士兵的錢我想這個態度分得清楚我相信學位應該也認同我的想法我完全同意這個要講清楚啦對否則軍方如果下個禁令不准啦不准你去外面什麼某某公司去學也不是這個意思對學位不是這個意思那軍方有時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
8658.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
8662.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
我們了解部隊的文化上面講了一個簡單的指令那個通令下去 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
8664.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
8691.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
這個二等士官長沈伯陽竟然跑去學無人機我處罰你我免禁止來跑去學不是這個事情啊人家退伍自己有自己人生規劃他要去當台北市長了他要學什麼他的事情我的意思是說軍方請把要的戰力能力規劃好按照計劃去訓練去委訓這些要花國家的錢那官司兵自己人生的興趣那他的事情也沒有什麼好禁止不禁止這兩個要區別開來好不好不好意思因為剛剛那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
8694.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
8708.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
王委員我無意不介意你的答段非常感謝你那因為我有那個第二個部分就是說我在這邊就是希望說我們軍方這邊的這個證照它未來是可以跟其他單位去聯合之後就是變成是我今天通過軍方的 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
8709.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
8722.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
那未來我這個證照它是在我民間上面我也可以就是它有用途的不要變成說我軍方的我明明已經會了那我呢出去之後我退伍以後我希望做這相關的產業我還要額外去考一張那當然跟剛剛王委員講到的一些可能哪些東西需要訓練啊這個交給就是軍方跟包含民航局這邊來一起一併的討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
8732.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
8747.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
但是是不是可以讓我們知道大概需要花多久的時間如果認同這樣的方向的話那可以就是往這個方向前進有一個初步的結論這樣子對那其他就是其他委員他們的這個動結說到我都予以尊重謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
8749.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
8769.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
那接下來是陳俊宇委員然後陳俊宇委員結束之後是把文君委員對好我針對七十六案那個還有無人機的部分原本他這個操控手的部分編定的緣額有一點落差的問題那 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
8772.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
8789.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
原本是提案能夠凍結500萬那我們國防部說明之後我覺得應該是有解決的辦法所以我同意改為主決議好 謝謝陳俊宇委員那接下來請馬文君委員馬文君委員之後是我 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
8790.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
8806.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
好 謝謝主席本席提案79案的部分因為我們在仁溪市次增飛彈追瞄訓練輔具的部分要輔具器材要特別編列4900萬 將近5000萬要去採購追瞄訓練輔具可是我們在 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
8815.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
8819.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
軍購的項目裡面其實我們已經有買到標準的模擬器這軍購投資裡面它包括目標搜索目標的獲得還有敵我識別飛彈參數功能等等其實這個在美方的軍購項目的模擬器裡面它都具備這些能力可是我們在現在要採購的這個輔具的部分是偽商自製的那可是我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
8845.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
8868.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
可以發現它的彈道還有瞄準係數相關的參數通通沒有的情況之下我們為什麼又另外要編五千萬去買這些因為我們已經有模擬器了在之前軍購的項目裡面已經有了那甚至都會比偽商自製的好所以這個部分本席同意下修凍結一千萬要說明清楚另外 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
8869.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
8892.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
八十案的部分是減列一千萬因為這個跟社會任性預算重複了就是花房部它已經有了所以大概應該這個沒有問題減列一千萬另外八十一案的部分這個部分本席同意凍結九百萬可是全案要減列七億 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
8897.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
8923.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
對 沒有 我們本來有減劣7億的部分這個部分我們想要清楚的說明無人機剛剛王委員 王廷宇委員其實也有提到它在這個部分其實它不斷的一直在改變不斷的在精進大家也都說它迭代的在進步可是我們這個多元運用行政用途無人機的採購它到底是做什麼用 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
8924.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
8931.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
它的規格是什麼它的數量有多少它到底要怎麼配付因為你是行政用途你不是作為我們的武器裝備所以你一次編了五年它每年都在變啊可是你現在第一年總共你編了八億一千六百萬結果你第一年只編了兩千兩千多萬兩千九百萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
8950.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
8955.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
編非常小的金額我們不知道你這五年要買什麼因為你行政用途的尤其行政用途它的變化更快我們的無人機你在明年後年甚至五年後它都已經改變很多可是你為什麼要一次編你今年如果只有兩千多萬那你到底要買什麼你應該先把它訂定清楚那你明年好好的 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
8974.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
8990.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
每年我們買最好的最新的然後最符合我們需求的這個我們完全同意可是你在這個現在不清不楚的情況之下你只寫了一個多元運用行政用途你是拿來做什麼用我先請觀光部回應之後我再問 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
8996.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
9011.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
謝委員知道陸軍這邊就有兩點報告有關於那個次增飛彈的輔助瞄具這個部分委員剛才講的我們軍售的那個是主要是給這些實際上它就是配附次增飛彈的專責防空部隊 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
9013.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
9034.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
那個軍售案幾乎是仿真除了不能真的發射實彈之外它包含到底我識別相關的目標鎖定和所有的操作程序還有這些整個目標的模擬它的一套要十萬塊它是屬於防空部隊在使用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
9034.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
9059.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
那我們這次採購的這個苗具一百零二套那每一套大概是兩萬塊所以它只是一個大家服役就是它是一個基本訓練那最主要就是在我們的新訓裡面加入這個這個也是結合這個訓練政策我們加入這樣的訓練所以它是它是不一樣那這個新訓的人數每年高達這個七到八萬人我不可能把 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
9060.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
9079.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
其實我把那個軍售的那個很精確的東西第一個那是防空部隊要用的我把它拿來給這些新兵用其實新兵不會操作因為裡面太繁瑣太專業這是一個基礎的訓練那第二個委員剛才所指導的為什麼在我們這個多元的無人機第一年只編了2945萬我們是 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
9083.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
9110.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
第一年我們打算採購的是一個基礎的訓練型和健身型大概是1387架那最主要就是佩服給旅籍單位提升他的基礎的訓練那剛剛我們不管是任何FPV或是投彈自殺乃至於這些軍售的無人機其實他還是都要從最基礎的訓練開始那現行這些部隊如果這些無人 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
9111.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
9124.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
部隊的無人機訓練已經是我們現在駐地訓練的一個必要項目那剛剛也有報告這些除了拿來訓練之外它有兼徵型的也可以去彌補訓場和營區圍管的人力現在請委員支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
9125.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
9140.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
好謝謝說明那接下來我發言簡單講一下因為我看這一個案81案他馬尾文你這個刪減是高達7億是跨年度到19年嗎是不是可以再考量一下因為剛才 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
9142.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
9166.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
官部有說明最開始的一千多架是做訓練、徵訊等等的我覺得這真的很重要我們上次去考察的時候也看到其實有一些不同的問題最基礎的問題請讓他們來訓練一下主席您誤會我的意思因為它全案編了五年它今年只編了兩千多萬你今年編這兩千多萬我們沒有意見你把它說明清楚可是你後面的四年總共要花八億 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
9168.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
9186.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
那現在還不清楚你第一年都不知道你要做什麼你只告訴我們說有尖針其實我們過去也有買尖針型的你拿來做訓練的其實它的金額差很多它訓練用的金額差很多現在市面上非常多的無人機很多人也都會操作那尖針連我們都會操作那它的金額是什麼數量是多少然後應該要怎麼你為什麼要編五年這是我們不能理解所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
9195.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
9199.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
本期在這裡簡列這7億主要是後面的預算我們希望你明年應該需求是什麼然後你把它說明清楚你今年的預算把它說明清楚然後先買然後好用實用你明年編明年應該要用的後年如果有更精進的部分你們一直在說它是跌大概在進步 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
9215.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
9235.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
無人機進步非常迅速像剛剛有提到我們以前還要人去操作現在AI都可以操作你後年已經不一樣可是你現在要買的是什麼為什麼是現在編這樣這是我們質疑的部分所以在全案的部分我們減劣7億主要是這個目的那你明年其實針對你非常確切的需求我覺得你可以編你甚至明年要編7億如果有這樣的需求我們也沒有意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
9242.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
9266.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
那馬委員簡單回應之後那請王定宇委員因為剛才我們剛剛提到說也不知道多少數量可是剛才他第一年就已經講了是1387架所以他其實是可以回應你今天後年之後那等一下我們也可以請中央部再去講因為我還是覺得說這個訓練量能還是有它的需要性是不是可以請馬委員來考量一下不要刪減或凍結這麼多那接下來請王定宇委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
9267.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
9285.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
檢列七億第一個太多第二個我們一直講明年後年大家提醒一下我們現在審查的是去年底應該通過今年的預算我們現在審查的是去年底應該審查完均今年的預算然後現在講的是明年後年然後我們把這七億檢列掉明年可以再編 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
9286.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
9305.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
明年在哪裡我們9月份送進來預算今年能不能審查我自己都不敢那麼樂觀現在審查的是去年應該要審查今年正在使用的預算而今年年度都過了一半所以我們當立法院國會大家政黨不一樣可以攻防可以有不同意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
9306.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
9316.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
但是整個國家的運作會計年度財政年度有它一定的道理存在這第一點第二個訓練是一切戰力的根本 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
9318.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
9340.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
當然我跟馬偉有些看法是一樣的它的迭代進步非常快那不代表現在就停下來等因為我們現在的訓練才會累積到下一代我們現在不訓練等下一代再出來基本的觀念技術都沒有就像我也期待我們空軍可以買到F-35但我不會坐在那邊等 IDF還是要訓F-16還是要訓 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
9343.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
9359.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
迭代進步不代表現在的訓練我們要把它停下來就像剛才講的那個次增飛彈一樣次增飛彈我上次去國防展坦白講那個要操作起來那條紅線要瞄到我們看二五戰爭以為很簡單沒那麼容易你瞄不到一個彈就浪費掉了 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
9359.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
9376.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
所以我們在基礎的新兵訓練五週八週一直到專精訓練到下基地我們在國軍訓練有一個流程的所以在新兵訓練的時候我掌握基本概念但是我是屬於防空部隊的我部署在馬公港外面的防空部隊他會用到軍規的裝備他會有一 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
9378.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
9391.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
一個階段一個階段不同的專長不同的需求無人機也一樣反無人機也一樣所以我真的建議專業的軍事的部分我真的不琢磨太多這個是國防部的專長7億的簡略是不是能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
9395.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
9423.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
請懇請我們的同事思考一下不要把減劣7億適度的凍結要求入軍要求精進當你把減劣就沒了我再強調這個預算是去年要審查的你現在把減劣今年就沒辦法動資了他就沒了那無人機的進步二屋戰場人家正在打仗都他一樣在迭代他不會放棄現在正在學習的東西所以是不是希望這7億適度的凍結不要把它減劣掉這個是 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
9424.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
9436.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
如果真的有意見的話那我們就保留但保留坦白講我們國防預算國人擔心的事情我們在這邊很理性的討論到最後結果常常是用政治去思考這個問題不應該讓國軍面對這個困境 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
9441.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
9463.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
主席不好意思我再補充一下我們今年國防部自己編列的大概只有2900萬你雖然是8億所以雖然現在過了一半我們還不知道說我們現在到底要的是什麼所以其實他對訓練的影響並沒有影響老實說我們去看看很多的部隊他在沒有預算的情況之下各個部隊很多的 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
9463.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
9468.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
單位其實已經買了很多訓練用的無人機我們去考察的時候也看到了然後我相信其實也都佩服到各軍種或者有需要的這些相關的單位他們都可以買到這些訓練用的無人機所以它不會造成這樣子的影響也不用太把它政治化這個跟政治一點關係都沒有我們現在說的是很務實的因為你明年 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
9489.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
9505.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
如果因為你今年就是只有編兩千多萬啊你自己都沒有編足夠的或者你認為應該要的訓練的這樣子的預算這個如果是去年省攤也是兩千多萬而已所以我們現在再一次的強調我們支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
9508.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
9515.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
無人機我們可是我們要用對的方式你明年要需要你今年把它確定下來你明年需要多少數量你應該要什麼樣的規格我應該要買什麼樣的這樣的無人機你就把它定下來你明年就定因為那是不是在我們的市場上有然後我們有多少的數量應該要很清楚所以你即使每年編都沒有問題這樣反而沒有問題你不要一次編五年我們都不知道你要做什麼然後你這八億 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
9537.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
9542.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
到底要做什麼要數量現在你要講多少都可以啊可是我們看不到它的實效性那你現在如果說這五年是要買兩萬架好了假設那你是怎麼樣去算它的價格然後你是用什麼樣的規格去設定的為什麼你無人機一次行政用的要一次編五年這是我們不能理解的地方所以我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
9565.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
9593.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
再一次強調我們雖然簡列這一個全案的數字可是他明年有需要其實他明年都可以照樣編這是我們要特別提醒的所以本期還是維持全案簡列7億我們希望他務實的去把這個需求把它訂出來然後好好的在年度裡面去編列相關的預算那接下來我們先做一下的確認76案跟第77案改組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
9595.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
9614.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
沒有問題那78案要跟黃人委員來確認國防部是希望動500萬然後提出順便報告即可黃委員是否同意好黃委員同意第78案就照案照剛才的宣告那第79案國防部希望溝通 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
9615.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
9641.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
已經溝通好了 動1000萬然後書面同意書面報告並經同意才可以動之那第80案溝通好了那國防部是檢列1000萬科目字條同意嗎同意 馬委員同意好 那第81案沒有共識沒有共識我們就先保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
9643.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
9670.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
那82案跟81案兩個是並案保留嗎好那我們沒有意見好我們接下來我們到第83到87案請說明第83到87案為王定宇等三位委員針對一般彈藥購置與維護科目預算提案的指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
9672.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
9696.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
那這個以上的五案已向委員辦公室說明那第八十三、八十七案依委員提案辦理第八十四案建請同意下修凍結數為兩億元提書面報告第八十五案建請同意凍結數為一千萬元提書面報告第八十六案建請同意改組決議肯請委員指導我們請王委員說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
9707.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
9732.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
這個預算支持國軍是希望讓國軍得到好的裝備所以我的態度一向就是該要求要求那如果真的有影響的我們把預算透過凍結或剪裂的方式希望看到精進的方向以紅准來講這其實我們在委員會之前討論很多紅准衣行的問題在於它的穿深 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
9733.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
9761.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
它的後面的後火就會形成你在壕溝跟那個室內碉堡裡面根本不能打坦白講它跟66火箭彈的性能完全沒有提升還更重還更貴所以當時我們要求說我們支持你買你戰備當然需要這些火力的籌備但我們希望中科院能夠提升它的性能最起碼要達到可以在室內發射否則你一打後面那個兵就變BBQ了 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
9762.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
9781.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
那我再來看中科院有發表一些講法說這個只要後面適度的管制我們就可以不用擔心後火這個不要講這種外行話啦我們城鎮站的環境 壕溝站的環境那個後火問題要解決串列彈藥能夠預測目標否則誰能夠在那個距離都能夠精準達到輪子 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
9782.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
9803.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
你在考驗兵還是考驗敵人的運氣這個不對所以當時要求你們後續的採購應該在性能提升之後有室內發射的能力串列彈藥能夠像N-LOW能夠有預測目標軌跡的這些能力那重量要減輕當時是要求這樣子那我們希望陸軍會來採購是採購符合我們需求的 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
9806.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
9827.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
然後另外在穿深測試我也提建議部長這邊我們常常我們的抗彈陶瓷 防彈背心或彈藥會遇到一些民間的專家挑戰我不是說民間講的都一定對但我建議要給我們國軍官兵弟兄姊妹們的信心就是像我們的兵工廠製造的防彈背心 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
9828.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
9842.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
送去給第三方嘛送去美方用軍規測試嘛他測試過關大家安靜沒話講而不是我們做出來的用一個很專業的測試方式就民間的拿了一打都打穿了齁那跟命有關啊大家信心不足這個問題所以包含這一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
9843.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
9870.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
紅準2也一樣如果我們具備這些能力了我們自己測試第三方找專業單位來測試或者透過美國軍方測試那可以提升我們使用裝備的信心所以我這邊請教中科院就是我看你們這兩天有公佈你們紅準2有拿出來測了變好大一顆那個裝備好像變好有加大變大了那它是不是具備我們在委員會上次決議上次好像跨黨派都同意的決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
9872.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
9898.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
具備那些能力是不是再不影響軍事機密的形象把紅準二經過你們測試什麼測試達到什麼樣的能力然後呢當然軍方也要經過兵監單位看是不效怎麼樣完了之後我們希望未來的預算還是給你但是是不是都來買性能提升後的裝備以上好謝謝王委員那馬委員講完之後請國防部檢二的回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
9900.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
9906.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
好 謝謝針對84案的部分這個是次增飛彈訓練耗損籌補案次增飛彈這個耗損的籌補我們全案要100 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
9915.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
9928.282 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
一十億多那這是消耗用但一百一十五年開始到一百一十九年可是這案子從一百一十二年美方已經報價我們在一百一十三年一百一十四年一百一十五年到五月為止都還沒有獲得發價書今年要付十億所以這個部分我們要求凍結兩億的部分是希望都已經經過這麼多年然後我們也都要付錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
9942.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
9956.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
可是他發架書到現在還沒有來那我們接下來看85案其實也是類似就是這個M884訓練用的這個地雷就是我們火山系統今年要接裝車子也要來了可是我們訓練用的補充彈到現在也是一樣他的發架書都還沒有到 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
9964.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
9969.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
我們都已經開始建案然後也要付錢了那發價書我們一直在特別預算的時候有威脅大家說發價書會過期可是我們現在看到有很多的建案已經都同意的部分到現在我們連發價書都還沒有拿到可是我們也都是在編列預算了這個部分我們也是同意凍結一千萬就我們看到這兩個案子其實都發生相關的問題因為你像這個籌補用的訓練用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
9994.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
10016.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
發價書一直都還沒有獲得他真正需要的其實沒有辦法來對我們來說其實也是非常大的影響那你在訓練上面我們也會造成很大的空隙啊這個我們難道都沒有一個主動的或積極的一個方式去跟美方協調或處理嗎這是這兩個案子主要的一個目的那 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
10018.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
10022.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
還有就是在86案的部分改成同意改成組決議那這個也是一樣我們在這個火焰彈 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
10028.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
10033.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
就MZU-32AB火焰彈這個兩項的軍購案這個部分全案要1500多萬它的經費不是很高那115年我們只編了28萬可是到目前為止美方的發價書也尚未提供這是航特直升機要用的到現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
10050.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
10065.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
發架書也沒有所以這三個大概都是發架書的問題我們希望可以有一個積極的具體的作為如何跟美方要求協調儘速可以取得發架書然後才可以儘速獲得我們需要的籌補彈訓練彈或者相關的這些裝備好 謝謝馬委員接下來徐巧欣委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
10076.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
10104.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
我想對於這個馬文君委員的說法表示認同那我覺得今天在這個審查預算那無論這個凍結數是多少那我覺得呢都有必要說明一下為什麼這三項就明明在115年就編列了而且金額是頗高的那到目前為止的這個發價書沒有提供的原因是什麼那這個跟這個美方之間的溝通有沒有什麼樣的狀況那我覺得可能要清楚的說明我們才知道在這三案上面該如何處理謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
10105.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
10126.841 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
進行國防部二要說明在這個884驅動地雷還有火焰彈的部分那目前我們都有持續的追尋跟掌握那目前正在做發達書的產製的審查進度美方的回覆是預判在今年第三季我們可以取得 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
10127.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
10142.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
那有關於這個次政飛彈發酵書的部分也是每個月的電話會議還有包含到專管會議都有催旬那這個在六月份我們會赴美實施一個入美會議會將這些發酵書 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
10146.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
10161.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
這個我們的急需和跟預算編列相關的關係來再向美方表示關切希望能夠盡早的提交以上報告好 謝謝請問83案王委員最後的結論是要同意動200萬元同意動200萬元那83案請問是書面報告就可以了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
10167.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
10169.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
書面報告好那83案動200萬元書面報告後時的動資那84案馬委員是說動2億國防部 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
10180.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
10201.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
表示尊重巴斯案就照動議那提出書面報告並經同意後使得動之第85案這個動1000萬元也是一樣要書面報告並經同意後使得動之第86案是改組決議那第87案黃委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
10210.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
10231.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
針對87案本案在去年的6月已經向美方遞交發價書需要的一個需求的信函但目前還沒獲得發價書還不確定是不是能夠買得到能夠到貨本席同意改併為凍結1億元 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
10234.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
10251.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
那黃委員凍結一議國防部表示尊重那請問解凍條件是書面報告後時的通知可否好書面報告後時的通知那我們接下來到第88案請國防部88到93案請國防部第8889案為馬文君委員針對運輸作業的科目實施指導那 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
10261.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
10276.734 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
以上的3案已經向委員說明那第88案同意3減100萬元科目字條第89案建請同意免於3減預算照列第90案建請同意免於凍結3減數為500萬元科目字條懇請委員指導好 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
10281.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
10286.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
好 謝謝主席 我簡單說明這三個案子 88案沒有問題那89案跟90案 這個我們要特別請雖然同意照列89案 可是我們請國防部也要特別注意就是說在這個部分高雄到烏丘這個人員跟物質的運輸包船 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
10305.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
10322.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
我們本來簽約是一百一十四一百一十五年兩年已經簽約囉然後是七千六百萬可是廠商突然在這中間說要增加預算就追加變成八千九百萬你都已經簽約然後都已經在執行怎麼可以在中間突然要求增加這個預算然後我們的理由是因為沒有其他人要做然後也沒有辦法去 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
10332.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
10336.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
找到替代的方案所以只能任由廠商這樣子加價這是跟我們合約的精神其實這個是相違背的那第二個是這個烏丘跟高雄縣每年幾乎都在增加而且它的預算越來越高一直漲價一直漲價廠商說多少就多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
10354.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
10370.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
現在只有一家廠商那我們都拿他沒辦法可是我們要注意的是台灣是一個海島國家當我們在這樣的運輸平時的運輸都都必須要被這樣子不斷的漲價然後你一點其他的方案都沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
10370.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
10385.911 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
這是一個很大的警訊九十案也是一樣這個花蓮物資尾商運輸的部分因為我們有二代艦、駝江艦、玉山艦其實我們的運補能力感覺上我們有一些新的艦可是我們運補能力在下降 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
10386.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
10407.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
海島型如果我們都是要靠海運可是我們相對的像剛剛看到的這些運補能力是弱化的然後現在都還是沒有被封鎖航道的一個情況底下就發生這樣的問題那以後要怎麼面對這個部分我們同意造劣或減劣數可是我們希望國防部真的要去正視相關的這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
10409.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
10418.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
好 謝謝馬委員8889 90 剛才跟國防部大概有共識了88案檢100萬科目字條 89案照列 90案檢500萬科目字條謝謝那我們就91案到94案請國防部說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
10426.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
10454.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
第九十一到九十四案委員馬文君委員針對通信電子與資訊管理科目預算提案指導那這邊以上四案已經向委員辦公室說明那主要是在九十二到九十四案都跟委員有共事那專委員的指導辦理那我要特別針對第九十一案做一個報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
10456.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
10470.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
九十一案有關於這個台灣戰術網路部隊決志套件本案它主要是原規劃是納入強化不對稱戰力的採購但是因為在這個相關的案子目前是戰不與納案 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
10472.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
10493.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
那我们陆军所编列的通信电子作业费每年是12亿2000万元主要是我们各级通知部队它的相关的机房、战备、灾防还有指管通信等的一个行政上面还有战演训的需求而且每年都是核实编列那如果预算遭动30% |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
10494.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
10510.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
高達三億餘元對本均的通信作業會產生極為嚴重的影響恳請委員能夠支持本案預算照列好 謝謝這一個說明麻煩委員會不要先考量一下這個部分稍微 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
10511.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
10516.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
就是議案的部分因為未來像剛剛我們包括一個很簡單的這個手持式電機都已經有發生這樣子的一個歧異那未來這個部分我相信還會更多因為它可能高達千億以上的一個預算所以如果我們沒有要栽更精進然後還要 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
10538.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
10547.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
新的也要 舊的也要那我們覺得我們的經費其實真的應該要妥適的去規劃這個部分我們同意改動10%好 馬委員有稍微讓步請國防部確認一下不好意思 那個929394的部分所以是請馬委員確認一下你的92案是要929394的協商你們的協商結果是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
10567.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
10586.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
九二是三減一百二十七萬七千元九三是三減三千萬三減三百萬凍結一千萬我要眼鏡要戴起來九十四案是凍結五百萬九十一案這個剛剛馬委員本來是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
10592.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
10597.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
現在變成動百分之四不知道委員是不是在我這邊再報告一下因為這個案子如果沒有我們就維持原案謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
10602.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
10623.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
那所以說就凍結10%馬委員因為完全沒有辦法說明的狀況底下我們已經調降很多那我們還是希望未來其實這是一個很大的方向他本來就應該要把它說明清楚雖然今年沒有列進去我們常常都是頭過身就過馬委員請稍等一下我們現在正在整理剛才你91到94案的這個確認一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
10628.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
10641.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
那跟國防部的協商完之後91案是動10% 92案是確切金額是1億2652萬91案是動1億2652萬解凍條件是書面報告並經統運時的動值 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
10656.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
10683.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
九十二案是減列一百二十七萬七千元那科目字條那一樣是提出書面報告這個不用抱歉這個減列九十三案是減三百萬動一千萬三減科目字條並提出書面報告同意後實的動之九十四案是動五百萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
10684.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
10707.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
那一樣是提出書面報告經統一後時的動之好謝謝那我們第95案到118案請說明95到118案為馬文君等兩位委員針對軍事單位零附件構置及保修科目的預算的相關指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
10708.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
10728.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
那因為這個併案的部分比較多我就直接報告我們協商的處理的建議以上24案軍相委員說明第95案建請同意下修3減1億元科目字條 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
10731.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
10742.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
動結數為2億元提出書面報告第96案建請同意刪減1000萬元科目字條下修動結數500萬元提出書面報告97案建請同意下修刪減數為200萬元科目字條動結數為500萬元提出書面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
10756.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
10769.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
98案建請同意刪減為刪減數200萬元科目字條凍結數為500萬元提出書面報告第99案建請同意下修凍結數為2億元提出書面報告第104、106案建請同意免與刪減免與凍結預算照列 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
10783.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
10803.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
第101案建請同意下修凍結數為2000萬元提出書面報告第102案建請同意下修凍結數為2000萬元提書面報告第103案建請同意下修凍結數為2000萬元提書面報告第105案建請同意下修凍結數為1000萬元提書面報告第107案建請同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
10815.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
10840.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
3.697万5千元科目字条第108案建请同意下修三减数为5100万元科目字条免于冻结第109案建请同意下修三减数为3000万元科目字条下修冻结数为1000万元提出面报告第110案建请同意下修冻结数 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
10845.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
10858.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
為1000萬元提書面報告第111案 建請同意改列三減數2000萬元200萬元科目字條下修凍結數為3000萬元提出書面報告第110案 建請同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
10875.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
10884.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
改列刪減數為430萬元科目字條下修凍結數為500萬元提書面報告第113案建請同意改列刪減數為1875萬元科目字條第114案建請同意下修凍結數為200萬元專案報告建請委員同意改書面報告第110案建請同意下修凍結數為500萬元提書面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
10905.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
10908.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
第116案 建請同意下修凍結數為800萬元提書面報告第117 118案 建議同意改列組決議 懇請委員知道剛剛說111案是111案減2000減2000 參謀長念對了 2000 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
10936.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
10951.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
報告是那一一減列兩千萬好謝謝張部長的這個說明那我們我們先就直接好蠻會員 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
10961.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
10971.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
像97案我們有簡列然後還有凍結的部分因為之前我們用商購的這是直升機的夜市裝備的部分那我們在觀光館有軍購然後114年11月才獲得 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
10976.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
10979.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
可是我們官方館的軍購案就沒有辦法執行那之前還曾經用商購然後從韓國的黑市買進來所以這個部分也造成很大的影響就是這些相關的可是我們現在發現又有商購又有軍購那總共到底要花多少錢那會不會重複編列這個都應該要把它清楚的說明另外還有在 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
11018.415 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
11024.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
101案的部分那這個部分是我們AH-641型直升機零附件的採購到現在也是美方的發架書還沒有提供這個我們陸續已經有很多像這樣軍購的案件我們的發架書沒有辦法拿到這是很大的問題我們也是希望持續要努力而且今年都沒有零附件飛機會不會有危險 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
11044.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
11066.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
那你如果全案的金額这样子写因为你也没有发架书啊那是不是像空白支票一样这个部分我们也希望可以尽数有一个比较明确的一个回复那102案也是这个是陆军飞采零附件开放式的军购案这一个部分美方的发架书也还没有提供还有103案 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
11070.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
11079.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
ITAS改良型目標獲得系統這個送美回修的案子這個也是軍購案這個部分發架書也還沒有拿到104案這個部分雖然是比較小可是它也是非採零附件的部分它在今年5月美方的發架書我們也尚未獲得 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
11096.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
11100.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
我們剛剛看了很多其實大概都是我們的發價書還沒有拿到的部分如果我們只是急著在預算的時候都急著要編怕發價書拿不到可是我們卻發現我們有更多的部分是我們編了預算可是發價書卻遲遲未到這個部分才應該要去努力去追的還有就是107案這個部分在VB1106 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
11126.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
11131.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
生物偵檢車的這個部分在112年到116年我們已經有編列了維護案那這個執行都沒有問題為什麼到後面我們發現預算不足那這個也是特規的車子我們希望這個都必須要清楚的交代 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
11146.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
11158.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
好 謝謝馬委員那剛才馬委員的說法那國防部有需要調整的部分嗎 沒有那我們好 徐委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
11161.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
11189.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
我這邊提一個問題因為剛才從我們看到那個從84 85 86然後到102 103 104現在目前已經有討論到現在已經有六筆是沒有拿到美方發價數那是不是這邊可以請這個國防部就是做一個總體的整理就是針對說我們已經編列就過去有曾經就有編列預算的部分那有哪一些是還沒有拿到發價數的它其原因為何做一個總體的這個整理我覺得會好一些是不是可以這麼做謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
11190.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
11207.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
包委員是的可以那個我們也可以把我們歷次催旬的文號資料向委員做報告這個都有謝謝委員那我們來確認一下剛才的協調結果如果有錯誤的部分請馬上回應我們就立刻來去做調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
11208.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
11236.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
第九十五案好第九十五案協調的結果是三減一億凍結兩億元然後在書面報告經同意後使得凍資然後科目字條好那第九十六條的部分是三減一千萬凍結五百萬元科目字條書面報告後使得凍資 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
11239.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
11244.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
好 謝謝書面報告經同意 對不起我剛剛沒講到第97條是3減200萬元 凍結500萬元 提出書面報告後經同意後死的凍之第99條 抱歉98條 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
11257.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
11282.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
第九十八案三減兩百萬凍結五百萬元科目字條經書面同意經同意之後使得凍資第九十九條是凍結兩億元那書面報告後經同意使得凍資第一百條預算照列第一百零一條凍結兩千萬元書面報告後經同意後使得凍資 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
11284.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
11287.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
第102條 凍結2000萬元 書面報告後 經同意 實得凍資第103條 凍結2000萬元 經書面報告後 同意 實得凍資第104條 預算照列第105條 凍結1000萬元 書面報告後 實得凍資監統黃委員要書面報告就可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].start |
11305.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].end |
11319.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].text |
好書面報告後就可以動之第106條馬文軍委員預算照列第107條三檢全案697萬5000元科目字條第108條三檢全案5100萬元科目字條第109案三檢全案3000萬元凍結1000萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].start |
11330.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].end |
11332.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].text |
書面報告後經同意時的動資110條凍結1000萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].start |
11346.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].end |
11351.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].text |
書面報告後經同意時的動資111條111案抱歉一次3減2000萬元凍結3000萬元科目字條那書面報告經同意後時的動資第112條3減430萬元凍結500萬元 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].start |
11367.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].end |
11370.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].text |
科目字條書面報告經同意後實的動之第113條3減1875萬元科目字條114條凍結200萬元專案書面報告經同意後實的動之 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].start |
11390.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].end |
11399.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].text |
第115條凍結500萬元書面報告經同意時得凍資第116條凍結800萬元書面報告經同意後時得凍資1718條改列組決議好謝謝接下來119到125萬請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].start |
11426.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].end |
11442.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].text |
119-125案為王恩祥等三位委員針對後勤補給資源科目預算案提出指導以上七案已經向委員說明或提供完整資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].start |
11446.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].end |
11449.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].text |
第119案建請同意並第121案免予刪減下修凍結數為1億元提出書面報告第120案建請同意改列組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].start |
11461.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].end |
11478.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].text |
第122案建請同意免予三檢下修凍結數為500萬元提書面報告第123案建請同意免予三檢下修凍結數為2000萬元提書面報告第124案建請同意下修凍結數為1億元提書面報告第125案建請同意下修三檢數為2000萬元科目字條懇請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].start |
11491.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].end |
11516.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].text |
今天馬委員然後徐巧欣委員然後王委員本期121案的部分我們現在因為我們在目前有很多個裝的部分當然這是數位民才衣就是我們有很多的一些個裝你如果換洗的內衣 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].start |
11517.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].end |
11524.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].text |
內衣褲可能比較貼身的這當然沒有問題可是我們有很多包括像義男教召後備部隊其實我們都有買像這些數位迷彩衣那你如果義男也全部都讓他買了然後 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].start |
11534.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].end |
11540.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].text |
他們大概都可以帶回去然後我們教召也買後備部隊也買都買齊了我們後備部隊現在庫房堆著擺著一大堆那像膠鞋的話大概放個三年五年大概都壞了所以我們現在是不是如果說有些異難的部分我們應該要把庫房的部分全部都提供給他們那至少讓我們大概你114年 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].start |
11559.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].end |
11569.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].text |
支一萬多人嘛那一百一十五年一萬四到一百一十七年如果這些年這樣子我們的庫房大概就會清掉了你只要籌補還有周轉量就好了這個對我們來說應該這個沒有問題嘛我們大概有精進的作為不要囤這麼多那一百二十二案的部分我們也 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].start |
11586.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].end |
11603.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].text |
這個凍結我們是主要是因為買了很多的油桶可是油桶到底要放在哪裡那你如果說有油的話其實在消防安全上面也要特別注意那你買那麼多油桶你是要分除呢還是要全部放在一起那你在暫時你到底要怎麼樣去 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].start |
11608.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].end |
11622.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].text |
再運我覺得這個可能也都要一併的考量所以也請把相關的規劃應該要考量清楚那另外就是123案的部分這個跟前面大概一樣就是說你的數都是用原額數在邊我們每年的各莊戰鬥戰鬥各莊都要花1億多 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].start |
11629.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].end |
11629.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].text |
好那 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].start |
11659.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].end |
11660.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].text |
124這個部分是陸軍的服裝攻售站 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].start |
11671.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].end |
11676.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].text |
然後我們現在因為有一段時間從上一次徐喬歇委員有提到那個毛巾很貴以外那後續到底怎麼樣因為這個還有他可能在網路上面訂購他的獲得率剛開始其實是不好的我們聽到的很多的反應是這樣那我們到底有沒有房廠他備料的情形怎麼樣他優貴的產品到底現在還有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].start |
11698.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].end |
11710.517 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].text |
所以品質品相是否已經滿足這個部分我們也希望可以做一個清楚的一個說明跟交代那另外就是二十五案的部分這個簡列沒有問題因為它在政經預算是重複編列的謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].start |
11713.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].end |
11734.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].text |
好徐委員先講一下我不同意併案也不同意改組決議那我今年呢提案這個煽動的提案數大家可以看其實並不多那都是針對基層官兵的權益我覺得應該要非常重視他們的權益尤其這個案子先前我質詢的時候就已經講過了那要請這個國軍去做一個整體對於這個攻守戰的整體的調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].start |
11741.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].end |
11766.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].text |
但是我非常遺憾的今天要跟大家講就是陸軍攻售站4月1號正式營運營運的當天其實就有很多的基層的軍官他們到現場去買但是呢他們的回報是衣服少尺寸不齊選項少甚至陸軍的長服到現在4月3號得到的資訊到現在在4月3號的時候告訴他們要6月才能取得 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].start |
11766.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].end |
11791.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].text |
那我請問一下你4月1號洋洋灑灑的去撿了彩那見過人家陸軍長服要存量存量全台是零要等到6月的時候才能拿到這個有合理嗎再來陸軍現在我不太確定這個是這個陸軍的整體的政策還是只是有一些單位要求但是有一些的單位要求他們在保養的時候必須要穿技工服 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].start |
11791.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].end |
11816.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].text |
那麼呢他們就想要在供售站去買這個技工服也沒有賣再來裝甲兵的戰車的防災服那防我服對不起一個人是發兩件嘛對不對可是我們現在演習動輒就是十幾天那很多的基層軍官他講說他兩件他個人覺得不夠的部分他要另外去買但是呢我們的供售站也沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].start |
11817.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].end |
11830.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].text |
再來呢因為可能質詢的關係吧所以這個公售站提供了一些比如說像是有品牌運動品牌Fila等等的然後陳列在上面看起來很不錯但是全部自費不能用點數來扣底 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].start |
11832.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].end |
11861.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].text |
可是這個也是讓大家覺得那你放在這不是我看不到吃不到嗎我在你這個供售站買跟我自己在外面Outlet買有什麼差別呢那你把它放在貨架上做什麼呢我的點數也不能用啊再來不給退貨也有人提到就是有些人他們我不知道是不是全部但是有些人買了之後想退不能退貨還有送貨比如說他送貨他的這個APP上面會寫進度碼上面寫說3月13號開始送貨人家等到3月29號都沒收到貨 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].start |
11862.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].end |
11875.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].text |
所以我剛剛一二三四五六七我隨便講就七個問題了七個問題所以這個事情是我覺得要全面性的去檢討全面性的去檢討那 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].start |
11877.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].end |
11904.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].text |
另外那還有有去罰款罰了6500多萬那這個我也要了解一下就是說新舊廠商各的罰多少因為這個我們要了解說針對4月1號以後的這個發生的這所有的事情那是不是有去嘗試去解決它那目前缺貨產品就已經高達126項說要加速生產預計5月底完成可是問題是 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].start |
11906.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].end |
11934.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].text |
你4月1號開始營運坦白說你前面的這個整備期你就應該4月1號營運你就是一個已經完整的讓大家能夠買到他們要買的而不是我們的基層官兵連到攻售站去買東西而且甚至有的是他為了他們可能他訓練所需要的他要額外幫自己購買他都沒有辦法得到這樣的一個裝備我覺得這個是非常離譜的事情希望全部能夠去改善所以在這邊我是不會同意併案也不會同意改組決議的謝謝好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].start |
11936.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].end |
11951.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].text |
那王委員好這個119案是我提的這個案子基本上就跟這個工作站這個過去的這個案子有關的有一位啤酒委員那後來轉任他們這個公司的主力董事那所以這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].start |
11954.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].end |
11978.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].text |
這個後來就產生一些延宕的狀況那經過國防部我們去詢問的結果目前好像已經提起這個刑事民事的一些訴訟不過我還是希望這個國防部能夠把這個案子相關的一些查處再提出書面的報告並提出一些未來這個有效改善這樣子的可能發生情勢的一些報告以上那病棟的部分同一病棟好 王委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].start |
11986.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].end |
12005.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].text |
這個題目雖然我沒有提案其實我們長期在關心這個換了好幾個業者那對國防部對我們國軍來講你們是buyer你們是消費者你們最大就變成要買沒有貨那之前前一家他那個網路的APP服務亂七八糟 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].start |
12007.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].end |
12022.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].text |
坦白講這個應該是買方市場那這個企業端我們只要求飛鴻嘛那我再猜啦其實現在全世界做成一最大的國家全世界那個國家只做一個行業就是紡織業叫做孟加拉 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].start |
12023.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].end |
12051.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].text |
不是孟加拉就越南但現在買越南供貨好像成本上也不划算但我不管哪一國只要只要控制在中國的手上都可以那他的供貨上照理說他貨架上備貨各方面應該要齊全是船運的問題還是問題我建議我們軍方這裡你是消費者你可以要求他把他交清楚他的貨源哪裡來他的船騎多久一趟有沒有受到受到石化業石化業因為伊朗的戰爭影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].start |
12053.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].end |
12082.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].text |
原因可能在那裡就是說它前端是石化業那石化業現在因為伊朗端成本抬高了所以它變成慢慢它希望把成本壓低可是我們是消費者慢的話影響到我們我們國軍弟兄要買東西啊那個點數的執行的問題所以我會建議要求供貨端把他的供貨源交代清楚縱使因為成本現在因為伊朗衝突的問題有產生問題他們在別的國家還是有貨啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].start |
12083.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].end |
12104.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].text |
非洲那邊也有這是一個全球調貨的部分不能犧牲國軍的需求去滿足他們的成本升高我建議這個點這個對於三減動你們有協議好的我沒有任何意見我是希望這個案子我們看了十年了換了我看三次不一樣的廠商了然後廠商不一樣服務 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].start |
12105.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].end |
12124.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].text |
不要讓業者有一個錯誤印象認為國軍就可以當冤大頭國軍弟兄當buyer我就可以欺負你我先滿足民間的國軍的反正你不會挨國軍要能夠做我做一個買方我要能夠要求品質供貨時間買方最大你們當你們是買方的時候可以有這個態度好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].start |
12125.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].end |
12130.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].text |
好謝謝王委員那我們就來宣告以下第119並121案凍結一議員書面同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].start |
12139.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].end |
12156.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].text |
就可以動之好謝謝王委員那120案動8840萬1000元那這是薛委員的部分所以要專案報告可不可以不用專案報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].start |
12157.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].end |
12180.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].text |
可以啊書面經同意好不好 經同意但是我這邊有一個要求就是我剛剛口頭講的這幾項就是因為因為我知道他們都有準備一些報告啦但我剛剛口頭講的這幾項是很具體然後有就是基層官兵他確實遇到的情況我希望在書面回應的部分根據我剛才所述的這幾個項目是能夠有具體回應的好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].start |
12181.766 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].end |
12193.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].text |
好謝謝那就請按照徐曉鑫委員具體的題目來做回應第122條案動500萬元書面同意第123案動2000萬元書面同意第124案動1億元書面同意第125案簡列2000萬元科目字條 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].start |
12213.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].end |
12214.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].text |
1 2 2 1 2 3 1 2 4 1 2 5全部都是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].start |
12219.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].end |
12228.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].text |
我們再補宣告一次第119號的部分是書面報告121案是書面報告經同意後 使得動之然後122 123 124也是提出書面報告並經同意後 使得動之 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].start |
12239.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].end |
12261.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].text |
我們補充宣告第107案全案檢列697萬5千元第115年度檢列139萬5千元客戶字條接下來我們宣告休息12點到1點半休息1點半後再開會 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].start |
12269.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].end |
12269.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].text |
蝦子 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].start |
17719.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].end |
17719.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].text |
好 我們繼續開會 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].start |
17728.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].end |
17743.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].text |
上午處理第96案、108案、109案、122案有關全案三動數及115年度三動數作補充宣告第96案檢列115年度至119年度全案檢列1000萬,凍結500萬115年度檢列200萬,凍結500萬第108案115至119年度全案檢列5100萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].start |
17754.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].end |
17765.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].text |
15年度減列1020萬109案15至17年度全案減列3000萬元凍結1000萬元15年度減列1000萬元凍結1000萬元第122案15年度至17年度全案凍結500萬元15年度凍結500萬元那減列的科目的這個自行調整與解凍的條件同上午宣告 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].start |
17786.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].end |
17802.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].text |
第119案與第121案併案以第119案王岸祥委員提案為主案我們繼續開會國防部主管收支公開部分上午出一支第125案現在繼續取理第126到128案請國防部說明並把協商結果直接一併講 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].start |
17813.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].end |
17824.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].text |
第126到128案為王玉川等三位委員針對一般武器及戰備資源裝備構置的預算案的指導那我們的協商結果是126、127案修訂為主決議那第128案請徐曉鑫委員現場指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].start |
17839.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].end |
17840.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].text |
請 請 等一下喔 請 請休人 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].start |
17847.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].end |
17871.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].text |
謝謝那個凍結金額我覺得我們可以調整但是我要再強調一次上一次我在質詢的過程當中就有提到了就是我們的這一個就是在演訓的過程當中那在這個T112它我知道它T112它就是就沒有把它的這個準心跟參考把它打開來然後也沒有裝光學瞄具的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].start |
17871.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].end |
17888.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].text |
那當時是告訴我們說會改善可是這邊我提一個就是我們中華民國憲兵指揮部在六天前大家可以看一下六天前自己所發布的照片上面還是沒有放光學瞄具啊就是上次承諾我們的事情是說就你們要看嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].start |
17889.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].end |
17916.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].text |
就是上次有承諾我們的事情是說因為我們在2025年有編列了81億然後買8.6萬T112的相關器材裡面就包含了光學瞄具那那一天我是提到就是說你們沒有光學瞄具之外準星跟這個參恐的這種一般的鐵瞄也沒打開那你們就告訴我說呢好會去這個要求然後再去演習試用作戰嘛會再去做處理嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].start |
17916.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].end |
17928.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].text |
那但是我這邊這個真的大家都可以看一下我給趙偉看一下就是說這是縣指部這個部長你可以看一下就是縣指部的縣兵炮兵這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].start |
17930.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].end |
17956.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].text |
部隊訓練他上面拿槍的時候這個也是T1-2他還是他還是沒有裝光學瞄具所以我不太確定為什麼從那個時候就我質詢然後說會改善會改善到現在也沒改善所以這個部分是不是可以先給我一個說明跟交代然後呢我們2025年編了81億T1-1兩代我們都很重視而且跨黨派大家都共同支持為什麼從質詢到現在都沒有做調整謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].start |
17964.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].end |
17965.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].text |
光..光被剪掉說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].start |
17971.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].end |
17994.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].text |
跟委員報告,我們81役的時候是由陸軍統建當時的狀況確實不是每個都有,因為他有分主戰部隊、守備部隊那也經過了委員,還有我們王定宇委員,還有我們部長實際召開各軍種,真的是有作戰需求 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].start |
17994.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].end |
18014.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].text |
所以我們已經完成了最近要建案我上次在立法院也講過了116年到118年我們會再買一批標準的每一把槍都是鋪都是配三鏡這個案子大概在最近就會完成明年會開始量產這個都 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].start |
18015.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].end |
18033.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].text |
三進都有單獨都有就是我上次在跟委員你說明的這個案子都是確實在進行中就是明年的預算書表116年的你們就會看到了那至於王議員給我們指導的雷子氣我也拿到德國了我也拿到了美國的那最近還有很多Smart Show也不錯我們同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].start |
18035.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].end |
18057.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].text |
我們會近期要暫時同意然後假如雷子氣什麼時候跟什麼通通可以然後假如有可以符合我們更高規我們當然同意合作計轉在地生產這個委員順便可以提報另外管理T112我順便還有試題也是一樣委員指導的說我們手批不良的部分呢這憲兵在這邊 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].start |
18058.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].end |
18064.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].text |
我們為了公正心我們不可能自己去我們找了入侵部全國的保修的後勤單位去看那500支牆確實是個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].start |
18067.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].end |
18086.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].text |
什麼 有四個小問題 第一個譬如說準心鬆動 那是王定宇委員給我們指導的準心鬆動啦 擴大啦 那個沒有調整的非常地到定位有三個問題是因為 單位用的工具錯了 因為我們的槍是英製的 他拿工製的工具在做保養 我們也跟他講 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].start |
18090.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].end |
18112.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].text |
不是兵工廠 憲兵 他是一級的單位憲兵的副處長都有來第三個問題我一次說明 後面還有四題都一樣還有一題是槍管的品質不好我跟委員報告 我們原來的槍管是就是那種有螺旋性的那個是假如以前我們當過兵的 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].start |
18113.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].end |
18131.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].text |
那個通香條通完長官都會叫你看看天空很亮不亮亮的喔 這個是插得有乾淨亮而不油 哇 這個是標準的可是我們現在T112是採由奧地利進口的冷斷機它是六角形的 它沒有螳線的所以那個線壁一看 欸 怎麼有紅影 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].start |
18133.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].end |
18142.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].text |
結果我們一檢視 那是好的 那個黑影不是因為是虎蝕這個都經過我們三方 那個憲兵也在我們探方重複再看過一遍那我們非常感謝委員給我們這個機會我們都有售後服務的一個系統啦我們為了這個非常慎重 我們也找第三方來這個憲兵也在這邊 我也跟你說明每一支槍我們都看過 以上說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].start |
18157.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].end |
18179.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].text |
但你們在演訓為什麼還是沒有把光學瞄具拿出來,就是讓他,因為越,好不好,說明一下更委員報告,我是憲兵參謀長,我跟您講那個影片應該是憲兵兩兩八贏目前本部T112步槍,目前是新接裝,就它是屬於202子的步的,目前我們前憲兵接裝是490支 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].start |
18181.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].end |
18196.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].text |
那這個部隊還沒有接裝還沒接裝 那我們接裝的部隊是211332你還沒接裝啊你就好你繼續講他說他是用那個原來的T-791步槍來實施操作那接裝訓練部分我們也做了規劃 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].start |
18198.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].end |
18222.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].text |
以管制各單位在接莊一個月內要完成接莊的三進的配合搭配訓練甚至未來的基地訓練 宿地訓練我們的規劃都已經完備了那就是配合接莊的時序來作弊那你們那天的這個就是演訓的過程當中沒有辦法放光學瞄具的理由是什麼可以再精簡一點的跟我們做說明因為他是就他沒有裝備他是用舊牆他沒有裝備 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].start |
18226.524 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].end |
18235.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].text |
踢狗腰,踢狗腰他還要踢狗腰沒有,兩件事啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].start |
18237.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].end |
18261.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].text |
那是T112是他沒有開準心跟殘孔他沒有立起來他接裝的時候沒接裝好這是一個事情那第二個事情是因為我們看到就是在那個剛剛縣指部這邊他六天前發布的是他準心跟殘孔是有立起來的時候OK但是他是T勾腰嘛那T勾腰還沒有接裝到 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].start |
18261.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].end |
18267.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].text |
沒有配三星那未來有沒有打算讓他們兩槍陸續今年會分期6月份馬上再進來大概600隻左右到年底會全部結裝完畢那這樣子這個我們稍微我這邊的話凍結的部分那我就改動500萬好不好那請就是提供相關的這個包含你們整個結裝然後整個 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].start |
18286.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].end |
18290.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].text |
當初的這個檢討的報告然後接莊的情況然後後續的這個時程表那給我們一個書面那經同意後時的動之那我就從這個原本的10%然後改成500萬元不曉得這樣可不可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].start |
18299.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].end |
18326.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].text |
好 謝謝這個國防部公通完畢那許委員的意見那126、127都是改組決議第128案凍結500萬那經說明報告同意後才實得凍結OK好 那我們再補充一下如果國防部已經跟這些提案委員說明已經達成共識就直接報告溝通成果還有凍結或者是刪減的數額好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].start |
18328.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].end |
18333.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].text |
來第129案第19案為黃委員對仁溪市短程防空飛彈的指導那依協調結果凍結500萬元提書面報告好 黃委員OK嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].start |
18340.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].end |
18346.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].text |
最主要是要再請陸軍說明今年的預計交貨的178套系統和500枚的飛彈那實際交貨的狀況所以本案改為凍結500萬好 那就129案凍結500萬順便報告後動之是的謝謝130案到131案 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].start |
18366.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].end |
18380.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].text |
第130到131案為黃仁等兩位委員針對國軍重要防護重要營區智慧型警監的配置案的預算指導依協商結果130及131案兩案均改列組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].start |
18383.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].end |
18400.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].text |
好 那黃委員就是因為今年議定完成29處的營期目前只完成了8處所以本席還是單席剩下的21處這個年底是不是可以真的順利全數完成所以同意改成一個組決議謝謝委員改組決議132案到135案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].start |
18405.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].end |
18432.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].text |
第132到135案委马文君等四位委员针对新型战车的预算指导那这边因为有一点需要补充的就是说本军已发挥大院核定预算的最大运用效益筹获主战装备为满足全案后续的执行需求那统计需要征服的预算即有新台币48亿那在114年8月奉行政院核定 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].start |
18433.766 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].end |
18449.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].text |
那第二點就是說全案因為上有虛款值需要支付那我們仍積極的與美方協商那美方也在這個最後一批也在四月份完成交運那懇請委員能夠支持本案的預算增付 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].start |
18451.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].end |
18480.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].text |
那建請委員同意免於預算免於刪減預算照列那凍結數為20億元提出書面報告以上請委員指導好 馬委員好 謝謝這一個案子非常離譜我想要請教因為這個案子就是M1A2戰車的預算那我想請教一下它原全案原來的發價數金額是多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].start |
18484.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].end |
18497.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].text |
然後我們預算的編列數是多少公園報告原始版的發價數是16.3億美金那合算清台幣是499億那我們經過這個依照防禦作戰需求檢討採購的品項量然後並 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].start |
18505.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].end |
18534.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].text |
完成了兩次的這個發價數的修訂到111年的時候修正為這個發金額為美金的14.1億然後則新台幣是402.7億那當時匯率大概是28塊28.12那依照修訂後的這個總價金14.1億的美金我們是和與大院所合併的這個預算額度可以指引 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].start |
18540.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].end |
18558.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].text |
原則說起來其實就是它原來的發價數大概是499億對不對我們那時候編的預算有多少我們同意立法院同意編列的預算數有多少405億所以它中間就差了差了80多少40億499跟405差了快100億 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].start |
18565.094 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].end |
18593.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].text |
那時候為什麼會做這樣的決定因為它的發價數是499為什麼送給立法院的時候我們通過的時候是405億這麼長的時間因為我們今年已經拿到最後一批了這從108年到現在115年這中間差這麼多然後你到今年已經到最後一年最後一批的車子都已經拿到了然後才說我們還差了50億 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].start |
18596.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].end |
18617.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].text |
跟委員報告這個部分它有部分的反購案它沒有按照那個發價書來甄列這個預算案那我已經進行懲處了跟委員報告這個不是懲處的問題因為我想部長知道這個事情以後我相信大概也會覺得不可以接受因為第一藐視立法院我們通過的預算就是405億當時你們給立法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].start |
18622.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].end |
18626.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].text |
的資訊是這樣所以通過的預算是405億這中間的過程當然你們跟他們談不管你是用匯差或者我們減向減量這是非常嚴重的因為你們把很多的東西都拿掉了尤其像零附件啊或者像因為它它已經是舊型的車了那for Taiwan的結果你在很多救濟車啊或者很多相關的這些去把它減掉試圖要能夠符合 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].start |
18650.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].end |
18664.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].text |
我們的建案的需求可是這個違背了我們的預算紀律那你現在到最後一年了差了差美軍五十億現在目前是還差長五十億對不對那我們到底要付還是不要付 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].start |
18665.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].end |
18681.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].text |
如果立法院不過呢因為當時要給你的就是405億啊那你經過了這麼多年然後這個過程當中我們所有相關的審核我們所有的審計單位所有相關的那個都沒有發現或者一直瞞著立法院他的問題出在哪裡你現在要大家就不得不要把這50億吐出來是這樣子嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].start |
18696.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].end |
18701.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].text |
這裡面先不談買方賣方角度這個軍售是代為做專案管理不賺不賠不罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].start |
18716.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].end |
18743.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].text |
那因为我们的价钱是用固定价款所以汇率是固定的如果台币升值那么赚到是国家的台币贬值军种要另外提需求那另外美军代表跟美国厂商签约它是成本计价法是保证它的利润百分比是多少所以在这个发价书的过程中间会有涨跌 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].start |
18744.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].end |
18767.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].text |
但是呢如果是我們賺到的那是歸國家的如果不夠了就是軍種要提需求那因為這個過去在國防部沒有把這個細節做出來說明所以你有的時候就反映到為什麼價錢中間有漲有跌那這個是因為兩方的制度不同我們是固定價款美方是成本計價我做一個補充說好謝謝謝謝陳委員的補充 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].start |
18771.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].end |
18798.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].text |
我先講一下就是我同意馬文君委員剛剛講到的這個案子呢我覺得嚴重性非常的高因為我們回顧2019年那美軍在做FMS軍售這件事情的時候他的金額是多少是20億美金啊所以20億美金我們換算下來就大概就是600到640億台幣啊那我們當初我們只列了405億那等於說我扣下來的話最多最多就差了三分之一嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].start |
18798.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].end |
18811.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].text |
那差了三分之一等於說有235億的缺口那我要請教的是這235億的缺口是什麼就是我們漏掉了什麼了具體而言漏掉什麼那漏掉的你以後要怎麼補上 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].start |
18812.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].end |
18839.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].text |
那這樣子的一個過程是不是相當的不合理呢因為美軍他當初給的價錢就是20億美金然後我們最後好我就講台幣都好了640億台幣然後我們編405億那等到到了現在我們發現其實中間短缺這235億他一定有一些具體的項目那我們要知道這些項目是什麼然後呢那後續補上你要怎麼補那我覺得今天一定要給大家一個說法否則的話這個預算上面來說我們這樣怎麼怎麼做審查好不好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].start |
18846.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].end |
18860.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].text |
好好謝謝徐委員那我們先黃委員不在嗎那不處理133案不予處理那132黃委員是134我是134剛剛這個案子還沒有討論完 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].start |
18874.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].end |
18884.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].text |
報告委員,我們這邊針對這個案子在跟大家做整個歷程的報告這個案子在108年完成建案之後當初編制的預算就是405億 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].start |
18893.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].end |
18916.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].text |
那在一百零八年提出發家族需求信函之後一百零九年知會國會的時候是二十億美元也就是將近六百億的台幣那跟各位人報告當時這個六百億台幣因為跟我們原估的預算差別非常的大 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].start |
18917.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].end |
18938.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].text |
我們經過跟美方仔細研討之後因為這個案子裡面有40%的公和所以公和他是不會在那個上面計算那我們當初經過討論之後美方就已經表示公和在他的100%估價裡面因為公和的點 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].start |
18940.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].end |
18964.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].text |
一公合一點並不等於美元一元可是他在計算的時候會把他用美元一元去計算以符合美國在軍售上面不賺不賠不討價還價因為他不負責那個附加成本所以這個600億一開始就是虛的並不是實的這個要核心說明那第二點 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].start |
18966.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].end |
18980.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].text |
有關於這個案子在初期簽約的時候因為第一版原始版發價書來的時候就誠如陸軍講的一樣它所有的附加成本上去之後還是超過了我們原本原編的405億的預算值 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].start |
18984.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].end |
19010.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].text |
那國防部經過內部檢討之後做了兩個決定這個部分其實當年我們在說明這個案子的時候我們有另外跟國防外交委員會這邊有做過報告第一個部分因為台灣屬於比較短潛的重生所以中間有18輛的M1動拐輛重型拖車 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].start |
19012.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].end |
19029.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].text |
當時的部長嚴德發先生,要求只保留訓能,所以將18輛下修到6輛這是第一段第二段,當時陸軍已經啟動了另外一個補充全軍M88A2戰場救濟車的計畫,叫雷池專案 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].start |
19034.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].end |
19060.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].text |
這個雷石專案我們當時也報告了因為在這個M1A2T的案子裡面他採購的M88A2的拖救車數量相對較小如果說我們去溢價的話就會造成成本較高的狀況所以當時的這個決定是先將M88A2的這個案項先納雷石案作為後續檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].start |
19061.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].end |
19089.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].text |
那因為當時發家書已經來了所以這兩個案項這兩個案項在跟美方AIT協調完之後以有條件簽署的方式將這兩個主要案項還有一部分的彈藥列緩購項所謂緩購項就是在第一版出現的時候它的line item的價錢是0就是我們保留選購權後續如果有預算的話然後再去買 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].start |
19091.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].end |
19108.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].text |
那由於是有條件簽署所以當時就已經要求必須在符合後續徵付預算的原則之下或是說會差已經足可剩餘款項支持這個案子的時候才不變動 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].start |
19110.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].end |
19133.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].text |
那這個有條件簽署的條款在A1版到A2版之間A2版因為他作業錯誤的關係所以那一版並沒有出現到了A3版的時候理論上他應該要做一個動作就是他們在當時要把嚴部長指示的 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].start |
19133.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].end |
19156.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].text |
那六輛M10拐梁的重拖車還有部分的M88A2的舊戰場救濟車要納進來應該是要來做專案報告才可以去進行發架書的簽署可是當時陸軍司令部並沒有做這個動作他就直接進行簽署了A3版的發架書所以後來等到 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].start |
19157.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].end |
19179.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].text |
我們在去年發現的時候這是一個行政瑕疵因此針對當時從參謀長以下所有夜館的人員進行行政懲處然後再重新報案子到行政院去做徵付預算的動作所以中間的確是出現了一個行政瑕疵但是就這個部分的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].start |
19180.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].end |
19191.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].text |
會出現這個問題的最重要的一個原因是當時的匯率從108年大概美金對台幣31.5左右從109年、110年到112年的這段時間它從31.5一路下滑到27點幾所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].start |
19203.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].end |
19217.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].text |
各位如果說入境適應部應該是要他之前有做了一個專報就是在這一段時間匯差其實省了幾十億台幣他們也原本很樂觀的認為到時候匯差剩餘的部分足可去支撐結果到了103、113年美金又回來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].start |
19229.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].end |
19257.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].text |
於是才會形成到現在這個價錢沒有辦法滿足的狀況那只好在這個時候提出專案的報告那這個大概是整個過程我要幫國防部解釋一些他自己原先不知道的問題游四方部長在當委員的時候要求要求要做公和美軍講得很清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].start |
19258.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].end |
19280.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].text |
FMS没有工合如果你要那就叫外加假设案子是600亿那就是660亿你那个60亿美金是付给美国转给厂商但是就像刚刚师长讲的那个60亿变成美元点只剩30亿的value而且工合不做继转那这里面讲的美金涨跌最大问题 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].start |
19280.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].end |
19307.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].text |
我们国家的预算制度是用固定价款就说你签八年的约你不管用多少你就是分fix price可是照审计部讲的你台币升值你赚到的钱是归国家的但是贬值了以后你的缺额是军总要编的所以这些问题我希望国防部下面要帮忙讲清楚这也就是我们在强调军售没有工合占不到便宜 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].start |
19308.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].end |
19321.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].text |
也不能抵消我们贸易的顺差只有在直接商售可以来谈判这个提供参考了就是说第一个就是长时期的固定价款边的汇率 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].start |
19322.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].end |
19338.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].text |
赚到了是国家的如果跌了是军总来要年度要提出需求那美军是固定价款保证他厂商的利润所以如果说他通货膨胀他厂商利润要保障他会调整价钱这个是我们军总面对的挑战 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].start |
19341.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].end |
19367.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].text |
謝謝我再補充一下這個案子你們不要把它複雜化因為我們不是只有這個軍購案我們軍購案非常多美元的匯差這個剛剛也講得很清楚我們是賠或者是賺那個各個案子都會有而且每年也都會有我們現在是去回溯說在這幾年它的那個匯差是美元的那個是有起伏的匯率是有起伏的我們要講的是剛開始的 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].start |
19370.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].end |
19376.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].text |
發價書就是499億可是我們立法院同意的是405億它中間就已經差距非常大今天如果你要做任何的調整應該要經過立法院的同意這是很基本的我相信這個案子如果當時提出來也不會反對我們不曉得為什麼到最後一年你的車都已經來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].start |
19392.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].end |
19395.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].text |
才告訴我們說這個差50億現在不要再拿匯差或其他的理由來講這跟這些都沒有關係我們要的是財政的紀律你今天匯差在任何這一段期間其他的軍購案沒有這些匯差的影響嗎我們要講的是因為你不是五千萬也不是五億你是暴增50億那在這個過程當中這幾年從來沒有對立法院提起過你在這個過程當中你知道已經缺了啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].start |
19420.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].end |
19440.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].text |
那以前我們如果經費沒有那麼高的時候甚至你會去考慮我們是不是會少買而不是你減了很多的向量會造成後續影響的比如說你像林復健你把他砍掉了那對我們後來的維修會不會有什麼樣的影響或投產率有沒有影響不知道我們現在就剛剛 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].start |
19443.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].end |
19455.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].text |
如果司長報告的我們甚至工盒拿掉了我們的重拖車從18輛降成6輛還有我們的救濟車我們都用其他新的案子去解決那還有一部分的彈藥也在緩購的這個條件裡面這些拿掉以後可見它已經省掉一部分了 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].start |
19466.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].end |
19481.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].text |
那還缺50億所以我們其實這暴增的經費其實是非常高的現在我們要討論的是當這個過程當中你都已經執行到最後一年才告訴立法院這個好像就是叫我們一定要通過這樣的意思啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].start |
19482.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].end |
19501.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].text |
這是大家不能接受因為你在審查預算為什麼要有這樣子的一個機制就是國家用什麼樣的條件去賦予你多少的預算你應該在這狀況底下執行如果你執行有困難或者你的金額不夠應該在這個期間內你就要讓立法院知道那在這個時間通過那沒有問題你現在是最後一年了 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].start |
19505.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].end |
19529.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].text |
要或不要你如果不要那你們自己去跟美方談是這樣嗎如果我們立法院不同意的話你們自己要去跟美方再談談其他的他什麼東西都給你了你們最喜歡講那個蓋房子你跟我說五千萬可以蓋然後你都已經住進去了房子也拿到了然後說你要六千萬你就是差我一千萬一定要付那到底要不要付 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].start |
19530.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].end |
19546.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].text |
現在是這樣我們就是被趕鴨子上架那這個部分必須要具體的說明當然如果說用懲處就可以那以後其實老實說預算也不用太省因為你到最後反正我就用了你要不要給如果沒有給我們用懲處 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].start |
19547.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].end |
19572.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].text |
這個部分我們同意在這個凍結數我們大概有討論過當然我們最後可能還是會支付因為包括這個戰車到目前為止其實受到很多的討論尤其是近期他到底是不是符合我們的需求甚至王委員之前也提到說M1A2我們根本沒有暫時的指揮系統還必須要用 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].start |
19573.766 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].end |
19592.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].text |
自己的那個去通訊還是用原始的那你拿到的這樣的一個裝備對我們來說又花這麼多現在又要暴增這麼多然後必須要同意你在公務預算裡面如果說是這樣子當然我們的預算會不夠啊這是我們特別要提出來主要的一個目的 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].start |
19593.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].end |
19606.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].text |
馬委員 那個我們在給王委員之前 因為三位提案委員都還沒有表示意見你們如果沒有表示意見 我們就繼續讓王定宇委員先 那個姓王的讓給姓王的 這個謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].start |
19609.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].end |
19631.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].text |
這個案子不是預算夠不夠啦也不是國家有沒有錢啦這件事情其實就是當時陸總有預算的調整忘記或故意不知會國會這個事情的本質就這個也就是當時MMA2T因為預算的問題你們要調整不管是把拖車頭減半 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].start |
19633.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].end |
19652.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].text |
然後後來又把那個88A2救援車把它放進來這個調整項目有變動預算有變動我不管是增加或減少就是要支援國會這一點我相信在國防委員會我們的立場是一樣的因為你不支援國會你動資的預算就不合法嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].start |
19654.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].end |
19681.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].text |
我想我們立場是一樣的不是國家沒有錢 也不是預算問題更不是匯率問題匯率 怎麼會有個軍種我在等匯率最合宜的時候趕快出手因為一塊對一塊嘛每漲一塊錢我就賺一塊錢嘛所以五億就這樣賺五億那反過來咧其實我們國家在軍購案上不會去用匯差做思考因為這是政府做該做的事情那個時間點不可測所以這件事情國防部跟各軍種應該 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].start |
19683.712 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].end |
19701.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].text |
不只是記取教訓這個是一個案例而且根據墨菲定律以前可能也有我們不知道而已以後搞不好還會有就是說這種調整的項目應該要知會委員會這個是行政跟立法部門的基本鐵律這不能改的 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].start |
19702.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].end |
19729.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].text |
那我贊成這個預算因為確實這裝備是我們需要的確實這個程序上如果當時有滿足程序我也不認為我們在場的不同黨派的委員會反對它所以這是一個必要的支出或者必要調整或者尊潔因為你可能先花這個以後再來補這個先撿進軍嘛有時候就當下先有就像剛才馬委員引用我剛才講就是M1A2T最厲害的其實是一個它的指管系統 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].start |
19729.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].end |
19746.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].text |
他車跟車之間可以假看以打可以有不同的作用有點像F35的概念在地面上而已那我們那個系統當時沒有跟著進來所以當時我們跟那個路長師路長師現在退了我們去看才會三台車打一個目標嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].start |
19747.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].end |
19774.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].text |
那現在這個要調整了我知道你們已經有在構思這個軟體的更新因為你們只有為了先拿到硬體再來買軟體預算不足我們可以體會這個先後順序但不能永遠缺永遠缺你只是裝甲變厚腰動五炮變成腰兩動炮它真正的性能沒有發揮啊這個其實這種錢不能省你省了就枉費買這麼好的車子所以這件事情本席是建議國防部一方面當然該懲處要懲處啦那個那時候看陸總是誰負責 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].start |
19776.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].end |
19801.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].text |
那但是這個案子要有一個怎麼講國安部要一個交代啦這個交代其實不是為了處罰什麼而是說這個事情不能再發生因為這不應該發生的啦這又不是不過那至於增加是必要性的增加當時程序如果滿足我們也會同意那我會建議委員主動也好主動也好我尊重你們寫的結果我不變動他但這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].start |
19803.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].end |
19817.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].text |
這個支出的必要性不能因為那一個程序上的錯誤來減損那就變成用那個導因為果了但這個因確實要面對解決這不應該發生的事情主席不好意思我再補充一下就是我們在獲得的時候我們已經知道我們像我們的指揮的這個已經沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].start |
19831.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].end |
19833.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].text |
還在內嗎?這個要跟您說明一下M1A2T它使用的那個指管系統叫FBCB2美國陸軍當時在那個系統的框裡面因為它是跟美軍相容所以我們買這個主要是因為比較大比較重這樣子嗎?我把它解釋完 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].start |
19859.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].end |
19870.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].text |
它有兩個主要的元件一個是指管系統FBC-B2一個是跟其他戰車還有空中載台相連的BFD Blue Force Tracker那因為這兩個東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].start |
19873.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].end |
19893.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].text |
是北約盟國的標準配備美軍在當時一開始的時候給我們留了空間原本機器有可是你沒有駐馬你就是買了機器變得沒有用最後的協調結果就是未來戰車產製出來之後用我們自己的指管系統 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].start |
19895.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].end |
19924.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].text |
那這個部分就是後來因為陸軍的這個戰場執管系統有好幾次的那個變動所以他這個部分陸軍目前也在做調整那因為前面的那個鋭紙在做出來之後他太大了沒有辦法放進去所以這段是由陸軍做後續的檢討那當初原因主要就是美軍不把他那個原始的整套給我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].start |
19926.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].end |
19955.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].text |
那個市長我跟你講美國陸軍的戰那個C2他不賣的啦他不輸出但他有盟軍不管在中東的盟軍北約的盟軍像北約你去查他們都用CitaWare在指揮他們的M1嘛那所以我們台灣也要一樣只管他只是他們自己的軍事機密不提供那當時我們買的是硬體這個軟體沒有跟進來這個軟體要趕快跟上否則你變單車單車在作業是可惜我知道很可惜你不補上浪費了這車的性能 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].start |
19957.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].end |
19968.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].text |
謝謝 在獲得以後然後在全數獲得以後然後才知道現在要去補充這個部分因為你們早就知道美方不賣那在這個部分我們居然這麼長的時間都沒有特別去留意這個部分因為我們有很多的戰場的指管系統本來就有 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].start |
19976.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].end |
19996.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].text |
陸軍也不是只有這個戰車啊那你現在特別為了這個全部戰車到位以後才說要去補強這個部分我們也覺得很奇怪就這個部分我們同意凍結二十億那這個部分我們要求一定要有一個非常具體的一個改善的方案那個不是你說去追究或懲處過去的人 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].start |
19998.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].end |
20012.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].text |
那現在這幾年都沒事嗎這幾年大家都不知道還是也是故意騙這個部分我們不是特別說懲處的部分可是這個部分因為大家很喜歡拿這些預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].start |
20013.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].end |
20024.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].text |
或者發架書一直來做一些無謂的攻擊可是我們看到這一次的總預算裡面有多少都自己沒有拿到發架書你錢一直編然後再告訴大家發架書有多重要然後他如果沒來我們會被罰或者會怎麼樣因為這已經是嚴重的扭曲跟誤導我們現在要的 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].start |
20034.867 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].end |
20038.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].text |
只是你的武器裝備或者我們的國防預算應該要怎麼樣好好的編列然後大家要有這樣的共識如果只是互相攻擊有一些我們甚至應該要具體的甚至去要求更嚴厲的一個追究責任這才是 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].start |
20052.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].end |
20065.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].text |
你應該要有的態度 國防部要有的態度是這個我們念了一堆 今天早上也有一堆啊那些你們都說非常重要 那時候要錢的時候也說非常重要啊這兩年過了以後 發酵署沒來 都沒關係132案 凍結21書面同意後 並經同意後 實得凍資 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].start |
20076.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].end |
20094.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].text |
那133、134、135建議並132案動21請問各位委員有沒有意見我這邊同意這個基本上因為最近剛剛馬委員提到這個M1-2有很多的討論那我們希望廣播能提供一些他信的一個報告我們這邊就同意並動好 那許委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].start |
20104.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].end |
20128.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].text |
听了刚才我觉得这个MIA2T的这个案子真的确实是蛮离谱的那有几个部分那我想后续国防部应该还是要给我们一些确切的说明比如说呢这50亿美金现在就对不起台币50亿台币那现在要增列的部分那如果没有增列的话它到底具体对我们的MIA2T的整个来说是有哪些部分受到影响 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].start |
20129.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].end |
20157.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].text |
因为无论如何我们当然支持MIA2T整个建军的这个状态但是今天既然要增加而这个增加又是来自于过去国防部的这个缺失那我觉得就有必要说明更清楚这个50亿如果没有过的话到底针对哪几个部分是有确切影响的这是第一点第二点呢应该要去说明说为什么2019年就开始要做的这个整个采购到去年才发现有问题 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].start |
20158.146 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].end |
20159.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].text |
就2019年 去年2025年嘛 19、20、21、22、23、24、25怎麼到這個建案這麼久的過程 怎麼剛剛講到說去年才發現為什麼去年才發現 誰發現的 怎麼發現的 這整個事情的原委 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].start |
20179.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].end |
20200.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].text |
我們要這個報告作為一個我們要做一個證明嘛你不能今天這樣子今天講完之後好像這個事情就是就過去了我的意思是說整個過程你有怎麼樣的疏失你當然你要寫清楚講清楚啊再來我覺得最離譜的是說怎麼會國防部裡面想要利用會差去偷偷摸摸啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].start |
20200.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].end |
20218.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].text |
這個沒有道理的事情剛才幾位委員也講了匯差本來就是在整個軍售過程當中它一定會有你不能去期待因為有匯差所以可以補足你你光是有這樣的想法我覺得就是有偷雞摸狗的嫌疑所以到底是誰在想要用匯差去補足原本的這個缺口然後到了現在沒有辦法補足之後才必須得再增列50億 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].start |
20226.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].end |
20242.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].text |
所以我覺得這三個部分的這個整個檢討應該要有具體的就是真的具體的把整個事情的始末用書面的方式做陳述而不是我們今天講完了好像就沒事情就過去了這是我覺得最基本應該要有的要求謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].start |
20243.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].end |
20259.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].text |
好謝謝那第132案到135案並案動結20億元提出書面報告把剛剛各位委員所擔心的部分完整的寫出來那並經同意後使得動之那並以第132案為主案 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].start |
20262.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].end |
20266.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].text |
那接下來我們處理第136到137案謝謝委員指導第136到137案為黃建斌等兩位委員針對遙控無人機防禦系統預算案提出指導那經協商結果建議兩案均列為主決議以上報告好謝謝那委員OK嗎兩案都並為主決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].start |
20287.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].end |
20295.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].text |
OK好沒關係好沒問題136並137改列為主決議那接下來我們第一是一個主決議嗎一個主決議就是136改列主決議那137案並136案 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].start |
20307.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].end |
20315.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].text |
那接下來138案第138案為黃榮委員對陸上機動部的系統預算案提出指導一協商結果建議改列組決議好黃榮委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].start |
20322.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].end |
20341.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].text |
那這個部分來講的話是這個布雷最大的一個問題是後續清除的困難所以提醒務必要熟悉作業的一個流程規範確實依照準則所以同意改組決議好 委員OK好那133案改組決議139案到140案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].start |
20345.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].end |
20361.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].text |
第一三九一四零案為馬雲君等兩位委員針對空降鑽散具裝備的預算提出的指導依協商結果建議一四零案並第一三九案凍結一千萬元好謝謝馬委員那就一百 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].start |
20364.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].end |
20377.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].text |
這個部分我們同意凍結一千萬不過這個是軍購的項目那這個部分驗收不合格我們在這裡要要求其實第一要索賠 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].start |
20378.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].end |
20383.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].text |
第二個就是不可以減相接受因為當時我們是因為數位迷彩的問題然後他提供的是全綠色的所以其實這個對我們來說其實是不符合我們的需求那這兩項一定要要 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].start |
20394.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].end |
20412.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].text |
達到這樣子的一個不是那個T11是傘包因為你驗收不合格嘛我們就兩個要求第一個索賠第二個他不可以檢向接受是好那就黃委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].start |
20413.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].end |
20429.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].text |
那這邊再加強一個T11的閃技雖然對人眼的安全保障較好但缺點也是一個想意見那次工時間長那操控的難度高這些問題都要面對要解決的好不好好 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].start |
20432.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].end |
20451.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].text |
那139案跟第140案並案凍結1000萬然後書面報告並經同意後適得凍置那是以第139案為主案還是以第139案為主案可以嗎OK好第141案 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].start |
20457.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].end |
20470.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].text |
第141案為馬文俊委員針對戰術進程無人機第二階段的預算案指導那依協商結果呃凍結2億元以上報告好 馬委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].start |
20471.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].end |
20475.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].text |
這個部分我們補充因為這個是商用軍規的無人機我們動輒編列的預算這個全案12億那15年在115年編了7億9千萬可是在115年他應該要交期的 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].start |
20488.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].end |
20492.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].text |
這一批想來其實今年大概也不會交大概也交不出來我們應該也都有去訪廠了這個包括他們自己內部的問題廠商之間的問題等等我們現在要說的是我們之前不是沒有編預算我們看到很多無人機不管是反無人機系統或者像這個戰術型的進程無人載具等等其實我們動輒編列的預算都非常的高可是都出問題這也是為什麼我們希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].start |
20518.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].end |
20528.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].text |
我們按部就班來尤其你在很簡單的他可以很迅速的去進化的這樣子的無人機你更不應該一次到位像現在我們碰到的這個就都是你把錢都框在那裡然後我們又拿不到好的東西然後驗收也不會過他也交不出來你也拿他沒辦法所以這個除了凍結以外我們希望所有我們未來應該要建置的這樣的無人機的裝備或者要採購都應該要 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].start |
20548.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].end |
20550.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].text |
拿來當成我們的一個借鏡謝謝 凍結良益 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].start |
20574.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].end |
20574.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].text |
141案凍結2億金書面報告並統一厚實的凍資142案到145案 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].start |
20582.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].end |
20595.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].text |
第142到145案為馬雲君等四位委員針對無人機反制系統的預算案提出指導那經協商的結果第140案是凍結4億元提書面報告那建議143到145案並142案凍結4億元改書面報告請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].start |
20609.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].end |
20636.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].text |
黃仁委員、徐巧欣委員、沈波洋委員最後馬文君委員今天特別說明的是為什麼要改動解肆意的一個問題就是無人機的反制系統到現在的狀況不斷當初陸軍接受經濟部的一個建議不僅沒有做到扶植國防的一個產業反而導致現在的國防漏洞遲遲無法補上 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].start |
20637.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].end |
20663.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].text |
所以本席都不免懷疑當初經濟部要求陸軍這樣做的是不是有什麼樣的一個弊案弊端所以唯一可以肯定的是陸軍面對廠商驗收無法通過那堅持不降格那至於如果之後以廠商的檢驗反制無人機的需求還是存在要如何補救所以陸軍要先做好準備包含檢討以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].start |
20675.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].end |
20678.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].text |
按照我們剛才的順序黃瀾委員之後是徐曉欣委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].start |
20680.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].end |
20701.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].text |
然後接下來是沈伯良委員請繼續發言那這個案子雖然是我支持廢核聯署但是我想馬文君委員這個還有黃榮文他們這提案是很有道理的我這邊要特別強調這個是監察院的糾正函文這監察院糾正函文寫得很清楚就是關於有一家今天也被揭露他廠商名字叫做創未來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].start |
20702.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].end |
20717.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].text |
那國防部是沒有按照監察院的說法國防部沒有循正常的預算及武器獲取程序然後去影響到了評選的公正性跟後續執行能力還有 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].start |
20718.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].end |
20721.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].text |
明明事前知道參與廠商的技術能力不足沒有辦法達成預期成效卻堅持要辦理這個委託案遴選一家廠商進行兩套同樣設備的系統在監察院的糾正文裡面他很明確的標註出一些重點那裡面他就有提到就是說呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].start |
20739.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].end |
20764.91 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].text |
透過委託民意向國公基金會申請六千萬的預算支應那也迴避了正常預算跟國防部所訂定的迫切採購的程序然後呢在沒有同一團隊廠商提供合作意向書的程序的文件就等於是會影響到評選的功能跟成效那也承認了知道他的能力不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].start |
20765.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].end |
20771.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].text |
那另外他其中寫到就是說呢在討論廠商資格審查的時候那對方並沒有提出MOU等等的具體的書面證明文件就憑創未來公司人員他口頭承諾就認定說這個團隊有兩家公司有合作的意願那這也是非常離譜的一件事情所以我覺得在這個事上面呢既然監察院他都已經提出非常具體的這個糾正文了 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].start |
20792.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].end |
20795.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].text |
那是不是國防部在這個部分必須要做很嚴肅的檢討謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].start |
20805.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].end |
20826.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].text |
其實我們好幾位委員在委員會有質詢過這個案子我現在是比較擔心的就是因為畢竟無人機反制線對我們來說太重要了我覺得這些廠商他可能都有不同的技術他這邊有提到他其實是兩次驗收沒有過所以第一個就是因為畢竟我們也是想要國內的產業能夠起來那他到底是技術沒有到位 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].start |
20827.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].end |
20838.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].text |
還是說比如說他能不能夠跟別的公司合作才有辦法做到然後如果他是一開始就不能做到的話那為什麼在程序上的時候一開始沒有發現所以我是希望等一下聽一下國防部對這件事情的看法謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].start |
20845.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].end |
20855.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].text |
好 謝謝主席因為就這個部分無人機反制系統的這個部分這個也凸顯我們在這幾年在無人機的採購上面所凸顯的問題或者我們在很多武器裝備採購上面產生的問題都是我們先框一筆預算然後說我們要買這些東西然後把東西拿到了以後才去做驗測 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].start |
20873.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].end |
20900.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].text |
驗測不過了就像現在這樣就直接耗在那裡因為跟我們說非常重要可是你看這個一晃幾年了然後他一直一驗再驗都沒有過這是我們現在發生最嚴重的問題我們都是預算先框所以我們為什麼一直希望在後續的去在源頭就應該要去管制的目的也是這樣那這個案子到底要怎麼處理也是我們凍結很重要的一個原因你是要 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].start |
20901.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].end |
20903.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].text |
重新開標減價驗收因為一開始這個廠商其實是借裝備來通過原型機的驗測當他拿出來的東西不一樣的時候難道我們都沒有發現嗎也不是只有這一家我們之前買了五行六類的 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].start |
20919.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].end |
20923.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].text |
這個軍用商規的無人機有沒有這種狀況大家再去檢視一下不然如果到時候再爆出來其實可能問題更大會不會有紅色的供應鏈等等我們希望可以一併去檢視那就這個案子我們也希望未來不要再 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].start |
20939.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].end |
20954.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].text |
一直一直不斷的發生因為我們看到從前面到現在有很多幾乎都是一樣的那另外因為今年是這個是113到115年要執行的今年是最後一年那這之前有沒有付過錢因為我們全案沒有都沒有嗎都還沒有付都沒有都還沒有所以這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].start |
20964.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].end |
20974.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].text |
好這個部分我們要求一定就是還要檢視其他的在我們的凍結的條件裡面一併的去檢視謝謝好 王委員好這個案子大概其實我們在那時候我印象是邱國正部長的時候我們討論過我那時候就提醒會發生現在這個事情第一個剛才有委員講說當時這個沒有尋採購程序你知道為什麼監察院那段其實是我講的 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].start |
20994.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].end |
21011.813 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].text |
他本來是一個科研案那科研案就是你本來不會做我鼓勵你我贊成扶植我們國內產業你不會做或者你四項能力具備兩樣我扶植你啊這樣你不會做為什麼給你一個人做兩套啦那不會就是不會給他做十套他也是不會啊所以當時一個科研案應該是兩個三個四個團隊去競爭最後誰做出來我採購誰的 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].start |
21017.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].end |
21045.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].text |
或者最後四個都有瑕疵我把它整合變一個比較完美的這才是買方的立場就是國防部的立場才對所以當時到底是誰做了決定給單一一家同時做兩套因為他都他不會這個是這是歷史奇案那第二個是我希望部長跟君總這邊無人機防禦的需求其實是越來越大不只還在是越來越大 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].start |
21047.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].end |
21048.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].text |
所以對這種案子絕對絕對不可以減價減項驗收 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].start |
21054.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].end |
21078.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].text |
我本來要買這個裝備要擋下這個東西就它不達標只能擋下20% 30% 80%那我就減相驗收吧這個不行這個就要閉案它沒辦法達標就不能達標就不能驗收該罰就罰那你們既然沒有付錢也罰了7500萬算你們有小賺那第三個因為這樣的拖延其實產生了一個拖延利益 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].start |
21079.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].end |
21095.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].text |
因為我們知道這個東西更新迭代很快也因為這樣的拖延它到現在測評沒有過就我們現在抬頭一看發現全世界反制無人機新的技術 成熟的技術越來越多我們原來希望達到的目標是透過科研 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].start |
21096.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].end |
21117.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].text |
經過這樣拖延現貨都有了所以你們應該就正式做這個案子因為需求不只還在威脅越來越嚴峻所以應該要來滿足這樣的目標那沒有達標的該淘汰的淘汰該找到合適的裝備來取代原來的需求因為原來是那個烈雨還是小金門丟石頭事件引發的這些案子嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].start |
21118.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].end |
21144.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].text |
就丟石頭不好看嘛要用這個反無人機系統嘛那當時急救商買了一大堆那個用那個槍型的反制無人機現在那些都變成垃圾我坦白講不要再花任何錢去維護升級這個那個無人機的那個反制槍那種槍是沒有用的東西了他已經根本防不了任何東西了你再去因為財產的受限年限還繼續圍管他浪費錢你倒不如現在利用這個機會他合格買他的 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].start |
21147.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].end |
21166.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].text |
創未來合格我對個別廠商沒有什麼特別意見他不合格該罰就罰然後該把原來的經費去籌貨合適的裝備因為無人機的防禦將來可能是我們台灣面對最嚴峻的不管是軍方或非軍方關鍵基礎設施所以以上我是建議 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].start |
21168.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].end |
21191.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].text |
這個是一個當時源頭做錯事情科研案怎麼會給同一家做兩樣那現在汪洋補牢還來得及嚴格驗收不減相不減價然後需求越來越大請把善用這樣子的案子至少它是一個sample我們可以達到一個目標可以防止那看看現在國際趨勢現在成熟東西是什麼好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].start |
21194.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].end |
21198.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].text |
好142案、143案、143案、145案並案凍結示意那提出書面報告並經統一後實得凍結以第145案為主案接下來處理第146到149案 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].start |
21216.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].end |
21226.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].text |
第146到149案為馬文君等四位委員針對攻擊無人機飛彈系統預算提出指導那依協商的結果 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].start |
21228.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].end |
21237.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].text |
跟著這裡面除了那個王安祥委員有要現場討論指導之外那建議第146案凍結兩億元那改書面報告建議第147 148 149並146案凍結兩億元請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].start |
21249.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].end |
21265.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].text |
好 王委員147基本上就是OTIS所以國防部也來做了一些說明基本上因為最近也是討論很多就在烏克蘭戰爭裡面我們也希望國防部能夠提供的一些書面資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].start |
21266.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].end |
21285.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].text |
然後148案是這個交付期程有一些狀況本來預計是114年4月現在已經115年第二季了所以可能也要請國防部做一些說明之後我們再來做一些處理不過我原則上都同意跟其他案子做一些冰凍以上好 馬委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].start |
21291.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].end |
21296.439 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].text |
好 謝謝 本席146案這個部分供給無人機飛彈系統的部分就是我們原來在預算裡面曾經高達115億後來刪掉多出來的預算然後其實全案是55億就是我們說的彈簧刀300對人的然後還有Artist600 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].start |
21316.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].end |
21338.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].text |
這是對車的那Artis 600其實已經有交了而且是好像我們一直宣稱說它提早交在現階段其實無人機這麼欠缺的情況之下它可以這麼準時的交其實也不容易它其中有沒有什麼問題我們一直有在探討這個部分我們也而且我們這一次在特別 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].start |
21343.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].end |
21368.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].text |
條例裡面特別預算裡面其實也買了這一家的就是這個相同系列的這樣的一個裝備而且這個是我們自己主動提出需求它後續應該要怎麼樣去檢視我覺得這個可能還是要另外討論可是這一個另外我們還沒有拿到的是彈簧刀三白原來這個案子是113年到115年應該要結束可是我們現在因為還拿不到 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].start |
21373.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].end |
21389.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].text |
這個是軍購案我們還拿不到我們又把它延到166年才要結案這個也算是延宕了那為什麼拿不到這個必須要具體的說明因為一直告訴我們這個很急然後像剛剛其實王委員有提到干擾槍那兩年前我們才在這裡討論的預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].start |
21393.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].end |
21408.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].text |
那時候我們說那個那麼重然後你要瞄準兩公里以外的距離的那個標的物可是你們還是買了而且說那是需要的結果現在連網委員都說那像垃圾所以只不過兩年的時間喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].start |
21410.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].end |
21430.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].text |
如果像剛剛提到的如果有延遲利益我們一下編了12億可是完全拿不到或者驗測不過這種延遲利益才一年兩年的時間就會發生我們希望以這些潛力來看我們無人機的採購我再一次強調我們沒有阻擋無人機可是你必須要務實的 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].start |
21434.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].end |
21439.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].text |
去採購無人機不是一次你就花了五年的時間都不知道要買什麼就像我們現在發生的事情一樣它不斷不斷的都是我們的範例今天如果說像去年還跟我們或前年都跟我們說非常好然後它居然驗測都不過那其實這個就是我們需要去注意的部分這也是我們凍結的理由不是只有凍結這個案子而是我們希望每一個都應該要去注意那彈簧刀300 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].start |
21464.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].end |
21472.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].text |
他到底是什么原因未交可能也必须要具体的说明一下什么时候可以交谢谢 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].start |
21481.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].end |
21498.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].text |
146 147 148 149並動2億那經同意後使得動之書面報告經同意後使得動之那是以146 147 148王安祥委員做主題案148案好那我們接下來第150案到153案 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].start |
21501.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].end |
21520.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].text |
第150到153案為黃建斌等四位委員針對新型步槍預算案的提出指導那除了150案黃建斌委員現場討論及指導之外那其他在151到153案建議併案凍結300萬元請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].start |
21525.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].end |
21535.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].text |
這個還是針對之前媒體爆料先前在進行槍支援訓的時候發生一些教育訓練的一些問題那這個也影響了我們國軍的這個單兵作戰能力的印象 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].start |
21545.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].end |
21566.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].text |
那不過這個經過國防部來說明確實是我們基層的疏忽便宜形式那也應該也懲處了相關人士不過本席提到就是這個嚴重影響到國際的形象那還是要為了避免以後發生所以這邊改可以改成凍結成一趴但是要求國防部在一個月內提出書面檢討報告然後再動之以上1%就對了好那接下來黃委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].start |
21573.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].end |
21597.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].text |
主要是點出這個問題是因為今年的一個預定的一個截角16227支步槍目前截角一個多少了所以本席也希望說步槍和瞄準具配罰比例要做到有槍同時也要有勁這是這個建議所以本案改動為300萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].start |
21606.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].end |
21611.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].text |
這個合併凍結300萬本席尊重沒有意見但是我要提醒我們不管是軍備局或是01廠 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].start |
21614.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].end |
21636.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].text |
我們以往各位都很辛苦 我們籌貨裝備不容易所以想辦法能研製就能研製 能逆向就能逆向可現在我們對這種輕兵器 要取得國際先進的技術已經沒有那麼難了那就不用偷的 講偷也不好聽 不用想辦法了所以應該建立在好的技術上 因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].start |
21638.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].end |
21655.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].text |
槍看起來一樣子彈看起來一樣其實差異很大比方說我們是401的雷子器雷子器可見光雷射可見光照明不可見光雷射不可見光照明四個功能嘛你們有一個做不出來嘛對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].start |
21656.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].end |
21673.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].text |
你們的不可見光照明做不出來因為技術沒有沒有我們就花錢每一個都裝上去結果就導致我們的T1122裝上這個雷子器它不具備夜間戰鬥的這個能力CQB的能力沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].start |
21674.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].end |
21693.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].text |
所以這不是四個少一個的概念而是說我缺了這個技術我現在花了大錢一把槍配一個裝上去之後呢明明我上次還半開玩笑講你去拉斯維加斯看那個國際玩具槍大展的雷子器這四個都有就我們做出來的第四種不可見光照明 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].start |
21694.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].end |
21716.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].text |
那個不怪你們那就是有技術門檻那如果能夠計轉我們把技術拿回國內成為我們401的技術很好啊把這個技術那我們國軍配發給弟兄的雷子器就是軍規四項功能都有雷子器而不是少了一樣功能那少了一樣功能我們以往都這個差不多精神有三個就夠了少那一樣在特殊狀況你就 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].start |
21718.164 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].end |
21740.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].text |
你的夜間戰力就打折扣嘛而我們現在看到城鎮戰夜間現在我們都強化戰場訓練實戰訓練夜間作戰訓練是必要的所以第一個雷子氣的部分如果你們第四個功能沒辦法想辦法取得或者我誤會你們你們已經有這個能力了那你們可以提出來這是一個部分另外呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].start |
21741.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].end |
21762.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].text |
你們現在配發下來的我還是從使用端那邊我得到的訊息反饋因為你們500把那讓憲兵他們去用對憲兵都很誠實只是有時候我們當兵當久都知道下屬誠實意見不一定會誠實的跑到上面這邊來他的那個瞄準鏡裡面有的會有積水 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].start |
21763.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].end |
21783.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].text |
會有誤氣那個就是工藝的問題你的密閉性啊各方面我建議不管是憲兵或者是我們陸軍這裡就是說這一個我們的製造的工藝常常我們兵工廠製造出來的給部長看的給我們去看的那把槍都不錯 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].start |
21784.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].end |
21796.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].text |
那個設備都不錯可是膠裝的時候長得就會不太一樣包含防彈背心包含抗彈板人人人腳腳我們看的跟膠下去的都會長得不一樣所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].start |
21797.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].end |
21822.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].text |
我們如果花大錢買飛彈買這些東西是為了打得遠打得準那讓我們一個步槍兵擁有的槍打得準打得遠提高存活率也是必要的陸軍弟兄的這個性命跟戰力也是很重要所以有關這個凍結300我沒有意見我只是提醒我也提醒國防部當我們現在預算比較充分的狀態下像有一個專業的像我們的TC-74的子彈號稱台版的855 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].start |
21826.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].end |
21843.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].text |
可是國外人家855跟我們的TC74好像一樣其實有兩個不一樣我們的火藥比不上人家所以每次雞炭雞一堆然後彈頭的合金的成分硬度不一樣那硬度就穿透力就有差 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].start |
21844.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].end |
21870.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].text |
那這個差別如果是因為我們技術門檻OK 想辦法計轉 取得技術機台不夠好 想辦法買到好的機台那以後我們膠裝的東西就是好的東西而不是讓國軍用到的東西打九折 打九五折 打八折有時候勝敗或者戰力就在那個折扣當中我只是舉這個這個855這個TC-74的彈或者你們的子彈我們有一個叫MOA嘛 散播嘛每100米2.9幾公分的樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].start |
21873.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].end |
21894.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].text |
我們國造槍彈的MOA都幾乎大於3幾乎大於3,就100米你就算3公分,3乘3誤差值,你看那差多遠可是人家國際彈的MOA大概都1到2這個細微的差距在射距超過300米250米以上就會出現差距了 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].start |
21895.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].end |
21920.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].text |
近我才打得到遠的話我會浪費一堆子彈所以MOA為什麼我們MOA在250米以上會大於3人家國際上1到2那這個不是我們不認真做是技術是工藝的技術所以本席贊成接受動300萬我只是透過這一題我希望我們因為未來我們兵工廠自給自足這個防衛韌性是很重要的一環 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].start |
21921.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].end |
21945.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].text |
需要新的機台報到委員會來 我個人願意表示支持我們自己國造的嘛 又不是對外買我們該有新的機台 該買新的技術不管是三菱炮 不管是三菱彈我們的軍備局轄下的401 202 205 不管哪一個廠技術需要提升 需要投資經費 值得就做而不是一直在忍受打折扣的彈藥跟槍管 這樣是不好的余小新委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].start |
21947.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].end |
21963.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].text |
這個有關這個T112的這個部分我們在上午的時候有做過一個討論嘛那說的是因為說新接裝然後呢在這個憲兵這邊T112還沒配完可是我後來越想越奇怪喔回去檢查了一下就是呢這個T111步槍在我4月27號質詢的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].start |
21967.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].end |
21983.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].text |
那這個國防部說每一把槍我直接念每一把槍包含T-111隨著年度建案都要配備三進所以不只是T-111啊T-111它也是有當時有講說要配備三進的啊那所以202指揮部當時沒有接裝這個沒有接裝T-111但是呢說這個是T-111可是兩款型號的苗具附件的導軌原則上是不是共用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].start |
21997.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].end |
22008.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].text |
那如果是的话是不是按照先前4月27号执行的时候的承诺那实际上面我们的宪兵这边他就算他用的是T-111他还没有接装T-112也应该要有相对应的苗具去做使用 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].start |
22014.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].end |
22037.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].text |
我希望這個部分能夠就是盡可能把我們有的裝備好的裝備讓他們在演訓的時候就能夠演習視同作戰讓他們能夠習慣而且不要變好像很多好的東西然後要的發的沒有發下去然後呢沒有辦法用到我覺得這樣有點可惜啊提供一些意見那對於其他預算部分沒有意見好就針對我們洗澡新委員上次我們說明的 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].start |
22039.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].end |
22067.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].text |
我們T-112配合的時候剛剛已經講過了不是每個都配那現在由陸軍統建它是從116到118T-91的滑軌跟T-112都是國際共軌的所以我們也經過部長指導也經過陸軍的精算這一次補齊是含T-91的所有有配戶到戰鬥部隊跟相關部隊的所有的人員含T-91共軌的全部把它配齊 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].start |
22068.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].end |
22083.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].text |
這個案子現在是陸軍在統建我們當時跟委員說明了這是一致性的第二個剛剛我們王委員不在就是說我們的雷子器都是按照陸軍的作戰需求它不可見光就是600公尺 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].start |
22084.139 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].end |
22105.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].text |
那這個我們會去學習啦至於說它所謂的M6A彈的散布彈面啦我們按照我們的測評我們測評都是100公尺打出去它的散布面比如說我打6發我的散布面直徑就是不能超過3公尺這不是我規定的這是美軍規範的那假如是說我們都是拿美軍的那有更優的彈啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].start |
22106.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].end |
22112.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].text |
他打出去竟然的標準是2那這個我們可以探討因為我們的射彈的標準都是Mino都是美軍給我們的標準那第三個是說我們的三進有水器這也是我第一次聽到看看我們去調查我們會因為沒有部隊來跟我們反映因為全國的一個兵監的單位就是入侵部保修處他們是管後衛的 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].start |
22131.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].end |
22148.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].text |
通常他們有這個問題之後他們就轉給軍備局這是我第一次聽到我們會跟憲兵的警醒一樣我們都有說服我們一定會查明了我們一定會看哪個單位因為我們在測試的時候都是有防水性都要丟到水裡面去浸泡幾個小時再拿上來的這個我們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].start |
22151.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].end |
22174.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].text |
驗收都是跟陸軍共同來做驗收的這是非常嚴謹的部分以上說明謝謝150案到153案那接下來請教各位委員是不是全部並案凍結300萬元然後以這個提出書面報告後時的凍資那是不是以黃仁委員的150案為主題案 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].start |
22178.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].end |
22197.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].text |
這邊委員可以嗎好 謝謝因為好那就如同剛才宣告100第154案請國防部就115至119年度全案建議的三動數跟115年度建議的三動數分別說明154154154因為還有全案 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].start |
22207.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].end |
22227.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].text |
154是馬文君委員針對定位定向系統的提案的指導那這個案子我們經向委員說明那也依協調結果建議全案三減八千萬元然後凍結三十萬元科目字條以上報告好馬委員同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].start |
22230.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].end |
22232.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].text |
這個部分我們同意我們其實可以看到我們比較在乎的其實是大家都說我們好像刪減數比那個編列數還高其實就是類似像今天這個案子 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].start |
22244.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].end |
22248.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].text |
他全案從115年到119年他總共是編了8億8千萬可是他在第一年只編了30萬6千我們今天如果減掉30萬6千你還是有非常高的預算可是投過生就過這是最大的問題我們要的是你有 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].start |
22264.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].end |
22267.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].text |
經過非常縝密的然後必須需要支付這樣子的一個預算這是應該是國防支出的一個重點所以我們用全案檢列的方式跟之前他們說我們檢列數超過那個把它變成負數是一樣的道理是這個案例可以作為我們很多提案的一個基本的說明謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].start |
22296.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].end |
22315.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].text |
在做最後的確認的數字等一下喔先確認,所以你們三檢全案八千萬對,全案然後,對對,對三十萬六 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].start |
22318.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].end |
22344.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].text |
全案全案三減八千萬今年凍結三十萬對今年不三今年凍一五不減然後今年凍三十萬在子在子項目上面八千對分支計劃凍結三十萬六千三十萬三十萬三十萬好好 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].start |
22345.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].end |
22365.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].text |
那我們宣告154案15-119年度全案檢列八千萬元然後15年度凍結三十萬元是解凍條件的話一樣書面報告並經統一後使得凍之涉目三檢案科目字條 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].start |
22368.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].end |
22392.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].text |
好剛剛那個我們沒有同意字條因為你那個案子我們後續你們把它說明清楚這個部分要不要再做最後的解釋8000萬而已啊那沒關係啊我們那我們今年先不要執行我們都清楚以後我們再那個再進行好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].start |
22393.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].end |
22416.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].text |
因為這個案子我們本來有意見所以我們是在你全案裡面你八億八千萬你都還說明不清楚的情況之下我們減列八千萬那你這個應該不需要科目字條這個單項不能字條只有這個單項 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].start |
22419.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].end |
22441.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].text |
那我們就115好我宣告115至19年度全案檢列八千萬本案不得自行調整這個案看幾號了第幾號的這個提案不得自調而已就這個案子而已好本案不得自行調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].start |
22443.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].end |
22447.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].text |
15-19年度全案檢列8000萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].start |
22460.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].end |
22468.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].text |
你們每一個提案科目字條你們都會提對馬委員的這個案子不要加上科目字條這四個字就好了這樣比較簡單 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].start |
22480.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].end |
22508.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].text |
我們所有的案子都會加科目字條就這個案不要加就好了那你就沒有影響了如果有其他案子你忘記講科目字條了之後我們還在審查 趕快丟出來第155條155案請說第155案為馬雲軍委員針對高空滲透散具訓練模擬器的提案指導這邊我要特別再跟馬委員報告本案已經向馬委員辦公室說明那也專委員的指導要調降RC的建物的比例 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].start |
22508.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].end |
22532.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].text |
那經過我們重新精算之後若依委員知道如果三減兩億元以目前的物價成本及工資等恐難執行建請本案是否可以允許下修三減數為六千萬元科目字條那凍結數為一千萬元提書面報告請委員知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].start |
22532.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].end |
22534.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].text |
謝謝主席因為這個案子我們特別會有意見是因為台灣目前傘兵它主要的任務它本質上其實是戰區內的機動增援那在關鍵據點或支援特戰的滲透已經不我們根本不像美軍那一種 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].start |
22552.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].end |
22561.33 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].text |
大規模的在敵後空降的這些作戰那也不像諾曼蒂式的那種登陸所以我們現在在台海高強度的這種防空環境底下我們大型運輸機本來也很難去深入敵後安全投送所以我們在這些固定翼大規模散降已經不是主戰方式了 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].start |
22576.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].end |
22582.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].text |
我們用這麼高額的預算直升機的基降跟區域快速增援才符合比較實際的需求所以我們希望基礎的閃訊它所需要的出艙程序、閃距的操作還有PLF落地、夜跳適應跟心理抗壓透過現在有的這些高跳台、閃塔還有實跳跟基礎模擬設備其實基本上已經足夠因為你們這一次要做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].start |
22606.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].end |
22609.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].text |
你們蓋一個RC管你花了五億一千萬你們做這些工程設施甚至比我們要放很貴買回來很貴重的這些飛機蓋的東西都還好你有很多武器裝備其實你是蓋簡易的鋼棚去放 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].start |
22625.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].end |
22629.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].text |
可是你為了這個部分我們的建築物相關的這些卻要花五億一千萬你大概是要做花式的表演訓練而已這需不需要花這個預算你們應該不是去想說它的那個物價調整而是需不需要這個部分因為我們看到你在訓練的時候有很多遊樂場像以前麗寶 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].start |
22649.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].end |
22650.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].text |
它要讓你好像飛它下面那個風在吹的時候你可以漂浮在上面那一種連那種遊樂場都可以設置的它裡面有啊然後就是蓋建築物啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].start |
22664.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].end |
22679.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].text |
所以我們覺得不應該把這預算這麼高額放在這裡你可以做其他的調整我們簡略預算不是讓你要去蓋這些豪華的建築物如果要的話你應該要去存放我們有很多的武器裝備包括我們很貴的 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].start |
22682.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].end |
22685.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].text |
像這些F16V或是什麼樣很多都是用鋼棚我們覺得這個比例原則差太多所以我們要求減列2億主要是這個原因凍結1000萬希望你把後續可以再做的規劃把它提出來我們剛剛講到了這個跳傘已經不是我們的一個主戰的項目了 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].start |
22703.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].end |
22714.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].text |
那還有三億多其實非常足夠了所以這個部分如果大家還有意見我覺得甚至應該要再去檢視說這個案子到底需不需要謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].start |
22716.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].end |
22719.815 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].text |
155案全案檢列2億元其中115年檢列3000萬科目字條全案凍結1000萬元其中115年度凍結1000萬書面報告竟同意後使得動之 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].start |
22741.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].end |
22747.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].text |
他是全岸三你留三億多了他是在組計畫上面三吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].start |
22765.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].end |
22768.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].text |
因為你買的是模擬器 你買的是訓練用的科目資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].start |
22776.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].end |
22799.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].text |
好好再再再宣告一次啊一五年一百五十五万一五年至一一七年度全案减列两亿冻结一千万一一五年度减列三千万元冻结一千万元三千万元的部分是坑夫字条那一千万元的话都是书面报告毕竟同意使得动之好 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].start |
22807.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].end |
22810.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].text |
156157案156157案為馬雲軍委員針對採購及外購軍品作業費的提案指導那依協商結果156案凍結1000萬元157案凍結500萬元改書面專案報告改書面報告以上請委員指導好提案委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].start |
22832.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].end |
22853.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].text |
這個部分因為主要是我們的這些產線它還有我們的工廠在很多工程上面的延宕所以國內自治也發生這樣的問題大概是規劃不好的原因不是產線的問題所以這個我們希望去落實的去解決相關的這些後續的問題謝謝156案 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].start |
22856.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].end |
22879.439 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].text |
動決一千萬經書面報告同意後使得動之第157案動決五百萬經書面報告後並同意使得動之接下來第158案請說明158案為黃委員針對戰場清理抗壓系統性能提升案的指導那依協商結果建議改列組決議好158案黃委員改列組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].start |
22887.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].end |
22908.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].text |
對好黃委員黃委員157 158好157 158黃委員158改組決議好那黃委員不在那其實是做改組決議了好159案 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].start |
22917.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].end |
22945.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].text |
一五九案不予處理一百六十案馬委員一百六十案為馬文君委員針對腐食與口糧的提案提出指導那這個金委員的指導是三 痾 更正見請委員同意三減數下修為兩千萬元然後凍結一億元提書面報告請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].start |
22947.847 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].end |
22963.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].text |
好160案不好意思我說明一下這個部分因為我們增加的預算非常高那同意減劣數修正為2000萬不過我們凍結主要原因是因為我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].start |
22964.918 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].end |
22990.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].text |
編了很多的預算而且增加非常多那增列的原因其實有很多在任性預算有一些最重要的我們希望它是推陳的部分因為它是可以吃的那你在推陳上面應該要怎麼樣去做我們在演習或是常會上面其實我們好像也沒有看到這些對於我們的那個那個伙食費有影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].start |
22991.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].end |
23017.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].text |
那還是都照編所以這個部分推陳的部分請提出具體的規劃謝謝好那就160案就依照協商的結果檢列兩千萬元動議議員書面報告後已經同意使得動之那檢列科目字條那158案普通宣告因為黃安偉不在就不予處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].start |
23019.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].end |
23025.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].text |
161到163案為馬文君等兩位委員針對一般設施工程的預算案提出指導經協調結果建議三案均改列組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].start |
23041.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].end |
23062.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].text |
好 第161案改組決議好 馬委員同意那162 163案那我們就不予處理黃大委員不在第164到165案請說明164 165我有提案的我們要併案處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].start |
23063.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].end |
23086.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].text |
好所以161到163案就併案處理都改主決議他有一些他有提案的部分我們會對他說主決不用了那不然提的提案嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].start |
23089.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].end |
23111.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].text |
好那162 163就並馬委員的主決議好不好先這樣等一下我們有看到再繼續處理好那接下來164到165案164 165案為馬文君等兩位委員針對戰甲車掩體工程的預算案提出指導依協商結果164案凍結3000萬元165案凍結500萬元提出面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].start |
23119.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].end |
23146.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].text |
這個部分因為我們看到很多我們自己國內的這些相關的工程案全部都是延宕幾乎都在115年要執行完畢的現在全部都往後延這個延體也是這個不是都非常重要嗎然後這個也都是最後一年了到最後一年才告訴我們又要延所以這個部分等一下可能後續的也還有很多這些相關的也要一併的去做檢視 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].start |
23147.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].end |
23157.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].text |
那要怎麼樣有精進的作為也請一併提出 謝謝現在是講164那164第164跟165案就是分開嗎那先講164案要併嗎好164併 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].start |
23170.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].end |
23175.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].text |
164案並165案165並164案凍結三千萬元經書面報告同意後時得凍資好16616 黃岡委員不在那就不予處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].start |
23190.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].end |
23198.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].text |
它有一些相關的那個166到167的部分166 167有那個嗎有討論我說它有結論嗎它是166一委員寫上結果凍結五百萬書面報告那167並166凍結五百萬題書面報告就這個部分166 167好不好因為我們也有在 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].start |
23218.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].end |
23224.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].text |
你們剛剛其他的委員也是有166167 病案凍結500萬 經書面同意書面報告 畫面可能也是書面報告 書面報告後解凍好 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].start |
23239.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].end |
23258.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].text |
那我想其實這次的三檢動其實在野黨也是有很強力的在監督所以這些軍事特別條例本來如果1.25兆通過之後你們也是可以做這樣子的監督168案到170案168到170案為馬雲軍委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].start |
23276.524 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].end |
23286.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].text |
第168到170案為馬雲君等三位員針對裝訓部長安訓場工程的預算案提出指導那依協商的結果建議169、170均併168案凍結1000萬元提出面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].start |
23294.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].end |
23301.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].text |
好那馬委員要說明嗎那如果是這樣的話就確認168 169 170並168案動1000萬書面報告經同意使得動之167可以一起啊167不不一樣嗎我現在講168到不一樣167並168不一樣是好那接下來171案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].start |
23321.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].end |
23332.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].text |
第171案為王定遠之類莊區部看守國靶場的預算案提供指導一委員的指導及結商結果 建議改列組決議我剛169是殯安棟1000嗎對殯安棟1000 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].start |
23339.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].end |
23358.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].text |
這個坑之口訓場很重要麻煩把每個訓練項目還缺項的趕快補上來就是買好的裝備要搭配合宜的訓場跟指管系統我就這個建議好 謝謝171案改組決議 謝謝172案請說明172案為馬雲軍委員針對戰場抗壓新建工程預算提案提出指導那1委員的協調及指導凍結3000萬元提書面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].start |
23369.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].end |
23379.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].text |
好 那最後 抱歉剛剛沒聽清楚 凍結3000萬元提書面報告好 那就凍結3000萬 經書面報告同意後 使得凍置好 173案173案為馬雲軍委員 針對河裡冒險訓練場的預算案提出的指導那依委員指導及結賬結果 凍結600萬元 提書面報告好 那就凍結600萬元 經書面報告同意後 使得凍置 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].start |
23397.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].end |
23414.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].text |
這個部分我們也想請問一下就是因為我們剛剛到現在我們看到很多的這些不管訓場也好還是這個訓練場還有模擬館等等如果有延宕的部分它從115年然後應該要執行完畢現在工程進度都往後延有沒有法則我們這幾個案子有沒有法則 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].start |
23419.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].end |
23436.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].text |
從剛剛到現在有很多的案子有沒有發生這個如果是廠商違約會有發生但這主要很多是在工程招標一役的時候那整個的說明會暫停他一役不是他那個往後延不會在工程一役發生的時候往後延 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].start |
23437.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].end |
23462.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].text |
我們現在說的是我們這一次提出來的案子全部都是最後一年本來115年全部都往後延所以這個部分有沒有罰則因為我們不可以幫廠商量身訂做完你每一個案子都延然後他們都沒有問題然後我們還有的甚至還有我們幫他增加預算這是非常不合理的我們的國防預算照理說不可以這樣做那就這個部分有沒有罰則這個部分在我們解凍的條件裡面一併統統 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].start |
23467.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].end |
23493.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].text |
希望可以做詳細的說明如果你們覺得他可以延而且沒有任何需要去處罰的部分請把理由也序明清楚在前面的個案也是是 順勢辦理好 第七四案174案為馬雲軍委員針對化学部復興訓場新建工程的預算案提出指導依委員指導及協商結果凍結3000萬元提出面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].start |
23494.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].end |
23521.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].text |
好 這個也是往後延啦也是延 延 都是時間到了都往後延好 還有一個174案 呃 凍結三千萬元經書面報告同意後 實得凍資好175案175案為馬文君委員 馬文君委員針對撲訓部三菱炮 三菱機炮的訓場整地 呃 工程實施指導那依委員指導及其他結果凍結五千萬元提書面報告凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].start |
23523.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].end |
23546.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].text |
凍結五千萬這也是一百一十五年要完工的也是往後延七十五案凍結五千萬元那順便報告後經同意時的動之第一百七十六案第一百七十六案為馬雲郡委員針對清兵器訓場整建工程現役規劃案的預算案提出指導那依委員的指導及其他結果本案三減兩百三十四萬兩千元 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].start |
23548.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].end |
23550.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].text |
234萬2000元這麼精密喔那176案檢列234萬2000元科目字條 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].start |
23561.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].end |
23576.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].text |
你這個就是現況結案了啊你這個已經是你原來的案子你做不下去了OK 好 那就不科目字條177案177案為馬雲軍委員針對京湯巡場京湯營區後備巡場的先期規劃案的預算指導那這個依協商結果本案3.582萬1千元好 提書面報告這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].start |
23591.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].end |
23613.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].text |
三減跟著跟著三減五百八十二萬一千元好177案這個也是延宕的啦115年要完工到現在也是還沒有完成那177案三減五百八十二萬一千元那就也都也不用科目字條了嘛因為好那178案 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].start |
23616.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].end |
23627.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].text |
第178案為馬雲軍委員針對入軍室內化靶場興建工程先歸案的指導那依協商結果預算照列好依協商結果照列178案 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].start |
23629.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].end |
23648.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].text |
這個部分我們提醒一下好不好因為你前面已經有一個在桃園可能受到民眾的抗爭大概也沒有辦法去興建那就這個部分你是選擇在醫院的旁邊我們希望你要事先把它溝通好不然這個可能會不會有一樣的一個結果比較麻煩好 謝謝178案照列179案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].start |
23656.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].end |
23666.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].text |
179案為馬雲君委員針對長安營區綜合訓場的整建工程第二階段預算案提供指導依協商結果凍結1765萬4千元書面報告好 凍結第179案凍結1765萬4千元書面報告並經同意後實了動之 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].start |
23681.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].end |
23706.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].text |
一百八十案一百八十案為馬雲軍委員針對北測中心湖口訓場整建工程案預算指導一協商結果凍結四百萬元提書面報告第一百八十案凍結四百萬元書面報告並經同意後使得凍資第一百八十一案一百八十一案為黃榮委員對載人公務車籌補的預算案那一委員的協商結果是改列組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].start |
23708.982 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].end |
23719.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].text |
那原則上可以嗎那就改列組決議182案182案為黃人委員針對陸軍鑽資源服務系統的建制案的預算指導 依協商結果改列組決議那182案黃人委員不在還是改列組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].start |
23733.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].end |
23761.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].text |
183案為黃榮委員對國軍衛生部隊裝備的預算案提供指導 依協商結果改列組決議那183案改列組決議接下來 呃 請稍等一下 我們在1818 183你們現在他們在釐清一些事情 等一下喔有可能 有可能大家少講一點 面公事就好 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].start |
23773.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].end |
23779.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].text |
那第183183案也是改列組決議那第184案呢183位黃委員針對軍品研發預算提出指導以協商結果建議改列組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].start |
23790.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].end |
23799.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].text |
184案改列組決議好那我們補宣告一下入軍就第112案及113案有補充說明我們上次是出去還在那邊弄一次 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].start |
23818.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].end |
23828.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].text |
我這邊帶陸軍說明一下第112案剛剛通過的是全案3減430萬其中115年3減86萬建議是不是一樣科目自行調整那113案全案通過的是3減1875萬但是已經超過了115年的額度所以115年3減了375萬那也是建議是不是科目自調就這樣補充 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].start |
23848.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].end |
23849.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].text |
請問各位委員如果沒有問題的112跟113 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].start |
23857.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].end |
23863.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].text |
好 等一下再把文字給我因為這個是整個分支計畫 所以就建議科目自討合理 理性 合理 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].start |
23882.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].end |
23888.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].text |
我們現在就補宣告那112案全案3 430萬115年3 86萬科目字條113案全案3 1875萬115年3 375萬科目字條好那我們先休息5分鐘好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].start |
23903.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].end |
23907.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].text |
那個海軍參謀長來海軍跟空軍是建立在陸軍的壕溝上那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].start |
23924.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].end |
23928.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].text |
那個陳將軍 海軍是你的娘家 也顧著你以前水域戰會有水果片子 還有紅豆炸雞 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].start |
23944.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].end |
23961.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].text |
我還自己帶了咖啡來對啊 我真的是要請導理去說那個一看你做委員會這樣他會擔責操作過程操作 等於說灌的水又拿不到池子海對 他不做計算結果你綜合 假設開個縣假設50億 你就多花5億每個專家廠商 灌成美名給你一點製作開 給你一點工具 沒有基礎 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].start |
23974.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].end |
23996.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].text |
白狗,所以現在就是...白胎啊,對...好...麻煩你,謝謝那他如果說有...有稍微...買到的還買到的嗎?因為有做...買到的跟...小山坡這樣啦小山坡跟有什麼差?可能要定基礎?有負擔事態嘛,像中間有的長有的長,有的長是附近家庭 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].start |
23999.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].end |
24005.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].text |
長的是冰頭褲 疊的是冰頭褲那個費用也都沒差 有啦 那兩種都會高好 麻煩你幫忙修剪好嗎 謝謝我自己是過來看的我可以幫助 激發總統 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].start |
24027.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].end |
24029.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].text |
他比他更拿寫一寫更好 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].start |
24033.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].end |
24038.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].text |
最後才知道海軍那個208208的行政用途當初說要跟海軍一樣那我們就刪海軍8第五年 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].start |
24060.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].end |
24074.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].text |
動物版因為他現在是走共同運行不用管全案沒有說第一年執行就全部執行共同運行就好像我有錢,今年有錢我就跟台銀的共計去買東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].start |
24075.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].end |
24081.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].text |
我今年有100萬,明年有200萬今年1600萬我們之前有三權案,陸軍有三權案可是我們當初寫了之後,海軍沒有寫到三權案但是沒有差別,因為他不是軍頭戒案 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].start |
24102.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].end |
24128.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].text |
所以跟他說要上島你們大概就是潛艦那個案被卡卡的其他還好你們反制無人機在船上的需求跟在陸上的會不會不一樣要求不一樣最起碼抗風抗鹽分沒有沒有 岸上啊沒有看那個俄羅斯都是在船戶被炸的啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].start |
24130.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].end |
24136.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].text |
所以那應該叫岸機反無人機跟艦艇反無人機是不一樣的系統岸機也是有鹽噴風的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].start |
24148.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].end |
24168.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].text |
所以以前我們省預算好像都有紅豆湯還是水果今年為什麼沒有以前都有以前是我們自己買的以前不是國防部買的以前省預算一定會有剉冰紅豆湯要不然就是有一個咖啡有啊 那是我們委員會的啊委員長 你就念共識有共識就念國節 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].start |
24175.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].end |
24179.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].text |
沒共識也解決不了就往後挪這樣你會日子過得比較愉快 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].start |
24208.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].end |
24213.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].text |
有共識念共識沒共識講一講就把它挪後就好了這樣比較快啦到空軍就好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].start |
24230.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].end |
24244.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].text |
沒有共識大家各輸幾次一輪就好了就可以往後挪了陸軍就是要當個坑在那邊磨磨到大家都發洩完了好我們繼續開會接訊處理第185案請海軍說明直接有共識就趕快 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].start |
24254.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].end |
24265.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].text |
第185案提案委員馬文君委員與獲委員同意凍結600萬另第276案是徐曉金委員所提的類案見請委員同意並案處理請委員指導不是這樣吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].start |
24271.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].end |
24284.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].text |
他們想要把我後面的拉上來一起談對剛好跟我說明了沒問題他剛好跟我說明就是276把它拉上來這樣那因為我這邊可以並案凍結所以應該沒有影響185案276案並185案凍結600萬元然後提出書面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].start |
24295.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].end |
24318.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].text |
經同意後使得動之這個部分我要說明一下因為這個案子它原來是它原來是到115年要完成的可是現在要延到118年現在比較嚴重的問題是從建案到現在好像只完成兩個小小的工程而且這個全案18億到現在只用了2億的預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].start |
24319.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].end |
24322.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].text |
這差很多然後像基隆的訓場我們產權也都還沒有取得嘛所以現在取得了所以其實他在剛起案的時候包括選址啊掀起的規劃好像都沒有做比較妥適的這樣子的一個完成以後才去做這樣子的一個案就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].start |
24341.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].end |
24365.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].text |
整個案子的推動所以這個部分我們還是希望因為已經10年了這個案子已經10年了那救火堵漏的部分現在幾乎都是關閉的狀態還好近年其實沒有發生重大的這樣子一個火災或其他的一個變化所以我們希望它可以盡速完成好 謝謝馬委員185為主案那第186案 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].start |
24368.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].end |
24374.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].text |
第186案天安委員馬文君委員以獲委員同意免於刪減與凍結126萬請委員知道好186萬凍結126萬書面同意後書面報告並經同意後時的凍資187到193 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].start |
24388.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].end |
24402.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].text |
第187到190案 天安委員 王定宇委員 盲君委員及黃仁委員以及分別向委員說明其中第188案 獲委員同意預算照列第189案 獲委員同意免於凍結並改例組決議第187及第190案 建期委員同意免於刪減並並按凍結1000萬元 請委員知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[761].start |
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187案並190案那凍結1000萬元書面報告並經同意後使得凍資188案照列189案改組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[762].start |
24428.186 |
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24444.376 |
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好謝謝191案抱歉馬委員跟王委員我這個我同意凍結1000萬元這我的187案那這裡面其實是有關其實就是漂浮軌跡這個東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[763].start |
24446.017 |
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24467.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[763].text |
我們發生過很多這樣的事件所以這個非常重要我凍結1000萬元希望看到你們執行的像我們之前潛艦掉下去的事關到現在還沒找到所以這一個案子我支持你們執行的方式跟內容把它說明清楚就同意你凍結是 謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[764].start |
24469.705 |
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24488.63 |
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好 這個部分190案的部分我要特別說明一下因為其實我們在執行這個地理空間資訊跟服務還有做西南海域水深的這個測量任務過去都是達官艦它就可以執行只是因為它的裝備太老舊可是我們現在有一個問題我們有船 有人 然後又有設備過去都可以做然後因為裝備老舊 |
| transcript.whisperx[765].start |
24497.236 |
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24502.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[765].text |
他主要的原因是因為我們都沒有把預算投入在這裡那你現在這些任務必須要偽商執行我們又說其實這些可能還是有一些相關的機敏性而且台灣以前周邊海域的這個地形啊地形圖都是這一條船做出來的包括台灣海峽 |
| transcript.whisperx[766].start |
24516.38 |
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24523.126 |
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那如果說我們自己本身有這樣的量能我們卻需要偽商我覺得這個也是蠻可笑的因為對我們來說這條船曾經非常的風光雖然它比較老舊可是這一些它本來都還可以做的我們只要 |
| transcript.whisperx[767].start |
24533.456 |
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24539.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[767].text |
我們有很多的預算投入在我們覺得太花俏的部分可是像這樣子的一個達官艦它可以做出這麼多這麼好的這些相關的服務我們卻讓它一直荒廢在那裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[768].start |
24548.353 |
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24569.483 |
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所以如果你真的認為這艘船已經沒用了那你就把它報廢至少它的人也可以釋出啊那你現在又有人又有裝備又有船可是你又不用它它也沒有辦法發揮我覺得這是一種浪費所以這個部分也是我們這一次凍結的理由所以必須從這個部分去做檢討好不好謝謝好那187為主案191案到192案已經併入第62案處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[769].start |
24581.113 |
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24599.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[769].text |
現在191案跟192案第191跟192案及通案的第62案提案委員林淑英委員及馬雲君委員還有黃建斌委員以分別向各委員說明建起委員同意並按三檢一千萬元請委員知道這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[770].start |
24610.141 |
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24628.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[770].text |
這個部分我們補充一下因為我們這艘船其實主要是它有過往的事蹟還有紀念它的一些戰功當時在文化部其實也把它納入一些保存的文物所以雖然台南市政府本來是要認養的可是後來因為這些 |
| transcript.whisperx[771].start |
24632.04 |
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24635.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[771].text |
維護費或者相關的支出的費用太高所以他們後來又反悔了那現在海軍要每年編列這麼高額的這個預算其實也可以跟文化部討論然後怎麼樣發揮它的價值或者可以怎麼樣運用我覺得應該要有一個妥適的一個處置的方式像數位點藏的方式其實也是一個方向 |
| transcript.whisperx[772].start |
24655.038 |
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24663.704 |
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我們應該怎麼做 我覺得可能要 必須朝這個方向去努力好 謝謝 62案跟191案 並192案 並案3減1000萬主席 針菌委員好 主席 針對這一個案子 林柱英委員有委託我大概說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[773].start |
24676.633 |
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24688.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[773].text |
因為這一艘中海艦早已經除役了那海軍今天如果還是要把這個預算放在一艘已經除役的這個船艦上而且他又不具備作戰的用途 |
| transcript.whisperx[774].start |
24689.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[774].end |
24705.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[774].text |
那這本身就是一件很奇怪的事情那因為中海艦已經被指定為重要的這個古物現在只能整艘原封不動的留在那裡那這件事不能只有每年我們海軍這個 |
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24731.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[775].text |
市政作業裡編列一筆預算來繼續維護始終沒有辦法有一個更明確的方向那國防部也應該把這個文物資產的保存還有展示活化空間的安置以及後續的相關預算負擔的整體規劃要說明清楚不然最後還是會變成一艘廚藝的艦艇因為文資身份被卡住 |
| transcript.whisperx[776].start |
24732.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[776].end |
24754.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[776].text |
只能一直放在那裡花錢來維護那這也不是一個長久之計所以在這裡就是要建議我們海軍司令部以及國防部的政務辦公室我們這個軍事博物館單位的合作方面應該盡速跟文化部來做溝通看這艘船要做什麼處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[777].start |
24755.485 |
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24770.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[777].text |
有一個比較妥善的一個這個規劃讓這筆預算不會每年都出現在這個我們的預算裡面好 以上好 謝謝62跟190案並192案3減1000萬元科目字條第193案第193案提案委員馬文君委員以完成溝通說明以獲委員同意預算照列請委員知道193案預算照列第194案 |
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24785.441 |
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24794.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[778].text |
第194項提案委員馬文君委員已完成說明建議委員同意免予刪減並凍結400萬元請委員知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[779].start |
24800.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[779].end |
24821.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[779].text |
這個部分是整評司所做的那現在在有一些軍種裡面大概都有相關的這些規劃的預算經費不過在這個海軍的部分主要大概是要執行水下滑翔機自主巡航及升學追蹤系統 |
| transcript.whisperx[780].start |
24822.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[780].end |
24828.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[780].text |
那看起來好像相關的經費你到底是要做什麼樣的是採購還是用什麼樣的一個方式我們覺得有一些經費又看起來好像不太夠如果是要做這個方向的那有一些我們又編得非常高額我覺得這個好像在預算的運用上面是有出入的那這個部分凍結400萬同意降低可是要說明清楚 |
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24852.468 |
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24860.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[781].text |
好194案 凍結400萬書面報告 經同意後 使得凍值195萬第195案 天安委員 馬雲軍委員 以獲委員同意 預算照列第196案 到198案第196到198案 天安委員 徐孝興委員 及馬雲軍委員 見請 |
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24877.348 |
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24886.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[782].text |
其中197與或委員同意跟著197跟198與或委員同意預算照列另外考量196案建議是下修凍結數到100萬元請委員知道徐委員 |
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24895.739 |
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24913.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[783].text |
同意這個凍結下修到100萬元不過呢在這個提出的書面報告的這個部分那我希望能夠有這個未來跟外部的心腹單位合作轉診或是定期由外部的心腹資源進行評估國軍心理健康的問題喔 |
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24914.455 |
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24924.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[784].text |
因為呢我們可以看到這個各軍種裡面那當然有一個原因可能是這個海軍他有時候在船艦上面這個比較封閉的空間那所以軍官的這個壓力有時候是比較大可是無論如何我們很關心這個軍官的智商案件那海陸的99旅海陸的這個防空警衛群等等都有出現這樣的一個狀況所以說從大概去年開始的這個智商情況應該前年喔 |
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24943.289 |
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24968.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[785].text |
開始治傷情況變嚴重之後那整個就陸海空三軍都做了很多陣戰上面心腹的調整之後我感覺整體來說是有變好一些那在海軍這部分我覺得還有很多需要努力的地方所以在這個凍結數的部分那照這個海軍這裡的這個建議那改為100萬元但是我剛剛所提到的這個部分請在書面當中呢給予具體的回覆謝謝謝謝委員好196案 |
| transcript.whisperx[786].start |
24973.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[786].end |
24982.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[786].text |
凍結100萬元書面報告後 經同意 使得凍資197案、198案照列199案 請說明第199案 提案委員 馬文君委員 以獲委員同意 預算照列199案預算沒有 我這個部分跟錄製一樣啊我是三檢欸喔 是是對啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[787].start |
25000.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[787].end |
25025.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[787].text |
一百九十九萬那要三四幫委員你最後決定是你們有沒有共識建議三減就是兩千四百八十六建議三減OK那觀光部建議三減兩千兩千四百八十六兩千四百八十六萬元不建議買 |
| transcript.whisperx[788].start |
25028.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[788].end |
25033.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[788].text |
這早上有討論過嗎?對啊那移植好了啦因為這個早上陸軍第71案有在討論這個案子已經有保留討論我們建議就是併案好,那199案保留好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[789].start |
25045.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[789].end |
25059.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[789].text |
200-204案請說明200-204案 天安委員 王定宇委員 徐巧欣委員 黃瑞委員 還有馬文君委員其中 第202案 獲委員同意改列組決議第203案 獲委員同意 三減一百萬 科目適應調整第201及204案 建局委員同意 併案凍結一百萬元 請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[790].start |
25069.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[790].end |
25098.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[790].text |
同意好等一下我們理一下二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二零二 |
| transcript.whisperx[791].start |
25100.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[791].end |
25109.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[791].text |
稅務面報告並經同意後實得動之那以以王定宇委員為主案好了兩百案 |
| transcript.whisperx[792].start |
25113.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[792].end |
25129.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[792].text |
202改為主決議203減列100萬科目諮詢調整費好主席不好意思這個我們特別說明一下因為203案這個部分這個在115年原來我們這個是招生用的這個國內的旅費 |
| transcript.whisperx[793].start |
25132.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[793].end |
25136.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[793].text |
那本來都是往年都是五百萬可是今年新增五百萬要變成一千多萬所以它增加這麼多主要是墨濱很困難嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[794].start |
25145.234 |
| transcript.whisperx[794].end |
25173.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[794].text |
因為他一下子增加的那個國內旅費非常高是增加一倍那墨濱用的所以這個部分可能也要有一些說明所以我們同意減列一百可是我們還是希望災招生的部分或墨濱的部分有什麼樣的狀況也要一併的說明 謝謝好 我附帶進一點請部長跟我們軍總思考一下我們現在三軍官校 |
| transcript.whisperx[795].start |
25174.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[795].end |
25192.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[795].text |
在招募正期生的時候當屆畢業生我們就招募那有的人當年他沒有考或者沒有考上或者他去外面補習準備重考大學或者讀了一般文學校大一他想回來讀我們官校的時候我們那個名額給到幾乎是只有一個兩個太少 |
| transcript.whisperx[796].start |
25194.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[796].end |
25214.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[796].text |
那如果我們在招募兵員有必要性的時候對一個十八九歲的孩子他經過一年的沉澱覺得他想讀軍校我覺得這不壞啊他不是當年度考不上大學或者無路可走我們希望的是有志於報效軍旅的他讀了大學一年或者經過一年的思考 |
| transcript.whisperx[797].start |
25214.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[797].end |
25229.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[797].text |
他隔了一年來考可是我們現在這種獨招的那個就慢了一年的名額都是一個很少非常少所以我有跟人賠處說其實這邊應該適度放寬就是我鄭其生在招的時候當屆來考當然我就名額不動他 |
| transcript.whisperx[798].start |
25229.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[798].end |
25256.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[798].text |
我這邊可以放寬一點否則我們ROTC也在招我兩年制的也在招那對於這種我去年沒有考軍校我今年想考官校正期結果那名額少到幾乎那個比中樂透差不多我覺得這個這個部分請部長跟我們軍總這邊思考看看我覺得這邊應該放寬畢竟經過官校正期四年的訓練的子職軍官還是有他的素質在那個是有必要的那個量不能太少太少的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[799].start |
25257.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[799].end |
25263.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[799].text |
那個方隊出來一喊口令就知道是怎麼訓出來的所以我這個部分是建議我們部裡面好好思考一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[800].start |
25270.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[800].end |
25294.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[800].text |
第二百零五案請說明第二百零五案提案委員王定宇委員以獲委員同意預算照列好請知道同意預算照列第二百零六案第二百零六案提案委員黃仁委員以獲委員同意免予凍結並改列組決議請委員知道第二百零六案方委員不在那就不予處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[801].start |
25297.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[801].end |
25301.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[801].text |
好 改為主決議 206案 我再補充宣告 改為主決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[802].start |
25313.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[802].end |
25319.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[802].text |
207案到210案請說明207案到210案 提案委員 黃仁委員 馬文君委員 還有劉勛廷委員已完成說明建議207到209案 並按凍結500萬元令第210案 獲委員同意免於凍結 並改略主決議207 207到209案 |
| transcript.whisperx[803].start |
25344.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[803].end |
25352.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[803].text |
謝謝主席208案這個部分因為我們看到陸海空軍都是編列了將近12億的預算都是從115年到119年都是5年的時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[804].start |
25360 |
| transcript.whisperx[804].end |
25367.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[804].text |
那我們國防預算一般來說因為這一次編列的都是行政用途無人機我們早上已經說過了其實我們不清楚它的規格它的目的還有它的數量那一次編了五年我們覺得這是非常不恰當的因為我們剛剛看了很多的案例包括我們所有的委員大概都有提出來其實它在很多的精進上面其實是很迅速的那我們有很多我們取得的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[805].start |
25389.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[805].end |
25396.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[805].text |
並沒有辦法發揮它的功效尤其像以前這些有些說要拿來訓練有些說要拿來巡查那以前沒有的時候我們怎麼做巡查而且我們現在其實在各個部隊我們有發現其實大家都已經買了那在國土任性裡面也有買一些訓練用的無人機比如說像海軍還有海軍陸戰隊的 |
| transcript.whisperx[806].start |
25412.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[806].end |
25425.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[806].text |
訓練中心其實本身都已經有都已經有這些訓練的無人機了所以就這些部分陸海空軍的部分我們要要凍結凍結500萬這個部分主要是因為三軍 |
| transcript.whisperx[807].start |
25434.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[807].end |
25456.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[807].text |
陸軍,陸軍是什麼陸軍剛剛八十一岸因為我們12億是非常非常高的經費你可以每年編然後你有需要的因為如果像你一年只需要四千多萬你五年其實大概也是兩億而已啊因為你一年你也是買訓練用的你也是買這些 |
| transcript.whisperx[808].start |
25460.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[808].end |
25481.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[808].text |
像這些巡查的部分如果照你編列的你一年你都覺得四千一百多萬其實足夠那你如果是五年也不過兩億的預算可是你一邊編了十二億我們覺得這個是非常離譜啦所以這個部分在這裡我們要先凍結還是凍結 凍五百 |
| transcript.whisperx[809].start |
25486.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[809].end |
25511.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[809].text |
我們早上陸軍是全三喔沒有沒有啊 保留陸軍的是保留啊所以這個是洞截500主席喔洞截500這個外賣零九案是我的提案啦這我一樣嘛 我早上講過了針對行政用途無人機因為你站在各個不同的單位裡面不同的這個說法那你到底是怎麼用還有包含人員的主訓啦這些東西其實本來就很值得一場公開的說明啦所以本席一樣是主張一定要專案報告同意後才能動之啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[810].start |
25511.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[810].end |
25532.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[810].text |
那凍結的經驗大家可以商量但我想這個同樣的專案報告他其實不同的群眾一起來一起講就可以處理合併成一個專案報告這個我是可以接受但至少在那場專案報告裡面公開清楚的跟國人說明整體無人機建軍的軟硬體的相關的一個配套措施我想是非常有必要的所以這個要凍結並經專案報告後實得同意這是本集的堅持以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[811].start |
25536.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[811].end |
25564.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[811].text |
是保留嘛那我們一起保留好不好好好207到209案保留現在這樣子207案黃人委員如果不在的話那就是不以處理那就是208跟209案併案然後保留嘛對不對好那207案不以因為209就是牛委員對那黃人委員的部分的210就改為組決議嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[812].start |
25566.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[812].end |
25592.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[812].text |
對不對是這樣好 207案不予處理 208案 209案保留210案改組決議好211案請說明第211案 天安委委員 黃仁委員已獲委員同意免於凍結改列組決議請知道好 21案改列組決議212到214案 |
| transcript.whisperx[813].start |
25597.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[813].end |
25621.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[813].text |
二一二到二一四案提案委員馬文君委員跟華人委員其中第二一二跟第二一四案以獲委員同意預算照列第二二一三案建舉委員二一二到二一四案照列謝謝好請繼續二一五案到二一六案 |
| transcript.whisperx[814].start |
25622.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[814].end |
25628.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[814].text |
215到216案 提案委員 學校卿委員跟黃人委員也有建議 併案凍結100萬元 請委員知道徐委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[815].start |
25633.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[815].end |
25644.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[815].text |
同意這個凍結100萬元大家併案那我這邊要特別講一下說這個案子其實就是呢有這個當然海軍這邊已經解決完了先講結論但是呢庫城當中就是說有廠商然後呢就是發函然後來就講到就是說他們在驗收過後 |
| transcript.whisperx[816].start |
25653.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[816].end |
25657.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[816].text |
我也看了一下確實就人家2月24號驗收3月4號跟你請款就你50天之內也都沒有把這個錢付給人家但依照我們的這個採購法來說基本上15天內你就要趕快去把錢付完了 |
| transcript.whisperx[817].start |
25668.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[817].end |
25683.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[817].text |
那我覺得說這個陳情會送到這邊來那我覺得對國軍的這個形象是有影響的我提這個事情是已經解決了那病案凍結都OK但是我不希望說有其他的營區的工程有類似的情況就我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[818].start |
25686.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[818].end |
25704.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[818].text |
廠商有問題要他改善但是廠商驗收通過了要付款的時候我們也不應該拖泥帶水我覺得這是我們很基本的一個原則所以說呢這個部分金額的部分跟這個海軍這邊所建議的我們就100萬元併案但我希望未來不要再發生類似的事情謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[819].start |
25711.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[819].end |
25738.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[819].text |
215案凍結100萬元然後經書面報告同意後時的凍資216案黃人委員不在那就不予處理217案第217案提案委員馬文君委員已獲委員同意預算照列好217照列218到220案第218到220案提案委員是馬文君委員還有黃人委員其中第219案獲委員同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[820].start |
25740.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[820].end |
25753.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[820].text |
3.5百萬元另外科布斯一調整第218及220案建行委員同意預算照列請委員知道好那218案220案預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[821].start |
25757.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[821].end |
25771.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[821].text |
黃委員不在220嘛那就是218案照列219案218218沒有照列我建議我們建議照列218 |
| transcript.whisperx[822].start |
25774.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[822].end |
25790.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[822].text |
我們早上是保留 還是多少動10%動10%所以你的意思是如果委員建議是預算照例如果這樣的話我們就比照陸軍的動10%好218案凍結10%金額是一億三千 |
| transcript.whisperx[823].start |
25810.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[823].end |
25833.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[823].text |
來 請算一下好 凍結百分之十一億三千零二十三萬三千元書面同意 書面報告並同意厚實的凍資二一九案是三減五百萬這個部分我要說明好 |
| transcript.whisperx[824].start |
25835.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[824].end |
25837.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[824].text |
219案,謝謝主席,219案其實我們現在會發現通訊費每年預算越來越高因為像過去這個部分,其實速發部的灣衛低軌衛星他給各軍種去使用現在他因為預算被刪了,然後 |
| transcript.whisperx[825].start |
25856.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[825].end |
25873.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[825].text |
就把所有應該要負擔的這個費用全部都推回去給軍種自行去維護那所以今年的通訊費用也非常的高衛星的東西其實越來越多那通訊費也會越來越高這個部分尤其像這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[826].start |
25875.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[826].end |
25891.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[826].text |
沒有 他有啊 抒發部買的啊他那時候他不是分出去 他是現在通訊費要各軍總要自己負擔啊他現在因為 他是通訊費用的部分因為他預算沒了可是他接下來還是會衍生相關的問題因為其實這個英國公司當時在是唐鳳那個部長的時候他買的嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[827].start |
25904.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[827].end |
25906.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[827].text |
可是他有一個問題是頻寬是太窄了所以這個會變成就我們天平在傳戰情情資的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[828].start |
25919.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[828].end |
25922.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[828].text |
因為我們有講到說好像這個頻率是商用的就CW的部分可是又有軍用的這個頻率我們建議國防部在天秤系統裡面其實可能過去我們跟第三國也有合作過而且我們也有發射一顆衛星通信的衛星這個部分是不是可以因為它涵蓋的範圍有台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[829].start |
25945.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[829].end |
25962.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[829].text |
還有金馬跟周邊海域裡面有一顆是商用型的這個部分我覺得國防部是可以考慮把這個資源資源可以拿來用因為它平常也都是備援的它通通沒有使用那這個部分可能可以做一併的考量雖然我們是3-500億的預算不過這一個500萬好 |
| transcript.whisperx[830].start |
25972.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[830].end |
25979.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[830].text |
219案檢列500萬科目自行調整我覺得是應該要考量220案不予處理第221案到223案請說明第221到223案田安委員陳俊雲委員黃仁委員及徐耀新委員以分別完成說明建勤委員同意併案凍結500萬元另有關第222案原文專案報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[831].start |
26002.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[831].end |
26007.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[831].text |
是 請委員指導好 那在場的許委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[832].start |
26009.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[832].end |
26035.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[832].text |
我要讲一下就是从110年开始我们各支部的这个修建的负荷常年都是在百分之百以上那我拿几个数据念给大家看我们左支部、苏支部、基支部、马支部那我就举比较夸张的好了就是苏支部它最严重的那114年它的修建负荷的百分比达到了207那左支部呢也蛮夸张是157个百分点 |
| transcript.whisperx[833].start |
26037.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[833].end |
26047.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[833].text |
但在113年的時候蘇支部是169然後呢這個左支部是122然後如果我們再跳回去看110年的蘇支部跟114年去比是110年是130%然後現在是207%左支部來講的話呢110年是119%現在是157%所以這個修建的負荷量來說是是非常非常大的那你們也都辛苦我知道我知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[834].start |
26065.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[834].end |
26086.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[834].text |
但是呢我们同时我们去看这个约聘雇人员的占比我们也一样拿苏支部跟左支部来讲苏支部在114年我们的这个聘雇人员占了30%到33左支部呢是33到35那这就是大概之前都大概25左右而已所以我们可以看到这个 |
| transcript.whisperx[835].start |
26087.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[835].end |
26106.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[835].text |
聘僱人員他的加班工時全部都是在往上漲的好那所以你們應該要思考要如何解決到這樣的一個問題然後還有就是我也想了解一下如果在暫時的時期的話那這些聘僱人員他們的身份那我們是如何定義他就說他是 |
| transcript.whisperx[836].start |
26107.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[836].end |
26128.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[836].text |
也一樣就是聘僱還是他是屬於國軍的一份子這個部分因為我們有沒有強制力或是他是什麼樣的一個情況因為我們也要了解說平時的我覺得我們分成平時跟戰時平時的部分現在已經真的loading太高了你們要想出一個解決的辦法那同樣的我們也要思考在戰時的時候那這一些人他 |
| transcript.whisperx[837].start |
26129.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[837].end |
26156.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[837].text |
会继续跟着你们还是说那你们有什么样的强制力那能够让他们可以持续的来协助否则的话那你们又没有什么样的一个替代方案对所以我想先了解一下这个海军方面的一个说法之后那我们再来讨论这个冻结金额的部分好不好好主席请陈委员二一案那二一案是针对我们海军所接受第一批的六艘 |
| transcript.whisperx[838].start |
26158.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[838].end |
26180.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[838].text |
這個駝江級巡邏艦的部分有相關的問題那急需改善喔那在我們官部到辦公室說明之後我認為應該會有妥善的一個改善方法喔那所以我同意本案併案動500萬的部分海軍要不要就需要人的 |
| transcript.whisperx[839].start |
26188.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[839].end |
26197.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[839].text |
那這是提書面報告的時候跟委員報告好所以如果那你如果是這樣的話那我就這邊還是在我這個案子我不併案然後去凍結10%可以齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[840].start |
26203.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[840].end |
26223.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[840].text |
這個評估人員他如果還沒到結招的年紀他還沒到結招的年紀的話他是以教召的方式回歸到現在的你要麥克風用麥克風他還沒到達結招的年紀的話他是教召的方式在現在的支部繼續來工作那超過結招年紀的話就是會用動員的方式來 |
| transcript.whisperx[841].start |
26224.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[841].end |
26236.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[841].text |
那這樣的話我們是不是就我的部分因為我不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不不 |
| transcript.whisperx[842].start |
26244.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[842].end |
26251.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[842].text |
那就5%對啊因為我只針對這個部分而已我不是全案嘛我的這個原列數是2936嘛所以我本來是2936裡面凍結的10%嘛那我現在變2936凍結5%嘛這樣可以吧因為我的案子真的跟剛剛這個陳委員是不一樣的我不希望病案啊好收到第221案凍結500萬元書面報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[843].start |
26272.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[843].end |
26288.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[843].text |
使得動之第二百二十案不處理第二百二十三號徐委員的部分是凍結一百四十六萬八千元書片報告均同意使得動之 |
| transcript.whisperx[844].start |
26290.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[844].end |
26312.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[844].text |
好 第224到第225案第224到225案 天安委委員 馬文君委員會委員同意併案三檢3480萬元 科目自行調整請委員知道好 224到225案224預算照列224預算照列 |
| transcript.whisperx[845].start |
26322.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[845].end |
26329.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[845].text |
第二百二十四案預算照列第二百二十五案檢列三千四百八十萬元坑木自行料理 |
| transcript.whisperx[846].start |
26333.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[846].end |
26349.532 |
| transcript.whisperx[846].text |
主席 225案這個部分我們簡列主要是因為海軍在之前其實有做了兩個智慧倉儲的這個設備系統的建置還有庫房的整修那今年其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[847].start |
26350.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[847].end |
26379.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[847].text |
簡列的原因當然是今年來不及做啦12庫51庫的部分可以那現在我們要特別提出來的是這個智慧型的倉儲海軍可以做我相信空軍也可以做因為智慧型倉儲在現在不管是氣液界也好或在很多的場域其實都是成熟的產品那也做的都很好所以應該不需要透過DIU的模式再去 |
| transcript.whisperx[848].start |
26380.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[848].end |
26390.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[848].text |
做這些規劃這一部分待會空軍的時候我們可能也會提到我們也在這裡先提出來謝謝謝謝委員好第226案委員不在不予處理227到230案 |
| transcript.whisperx[849].start |
26398.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[849].end |
26425.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[849].text |
第二期到兩百三十案提案委員為馬文君黃仁及黃建斌及王翔委員見請委員同意併案凍結八千萬其中第兩百二十八案原為專案報告見請同意改為書面報告畢竟同意後值得動之請指導是黃仁委員不處理我不在好有其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[850].start |
26427.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[850].end |
26431.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[850].text |
227.229.230案並案然後凍結8000萬元書面報告經同意後使得凍資8000萬本來是不止 |
| transcript.whisperx[851].start |
26445.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[851].end |
26448.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[851].text |
因為這是超雷的部分我們的重型魚雷其實已經延宕非常久了從到現在已經九年了魚雷是我們很重要潛艦的一個武器所以到現在目前為止連超雷都還沒來一直說超雷可能今天會來 |
| transcript.whisperx[852].start |
26468.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[852].end |
26472.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[852].text |
那我們還是需要的是戰雷那延遲這麼久我們應該要有一些說法比如說什麼時候到他到底什麼原因延宕這麼久我們應該要據理例證啊不然我們一直說淺建的預算不管是建農級或者我們現在的淺建國造的部分這些其實都跟這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[853].start |
26493.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[853].end |
26499.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[853].text |
武器也是息息相關的那你這個都可以延宕這麼久我覺得這對我們自己的建軍可能都是說不過去的啦這個部分我們凍結然後希望可以比較有具體的一個其成的說明謝謝謝謝委員我覺得保安局委員剛剛講到的一個重點就是說因為我看大家就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[854].start |
26517.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[854].end |
26532.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[854].text |
都對這個MK40A跟這個超雷的部分的期程那有想要了解的情況所以我覺得說是不是可以有現場可以說明一下這個情況現在怎麼樣對可不可以說明一下所以請海君簡單說明應該簡單說明一下比較好 |
| transcript.whisperx[855].start |
26537.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[855].end |
26554.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[855].text |
呃 各位報告 現在騎乘的部分 它確實是按照這個目前的這個 美方的一個這個說法 對 還有一個往後延 但是目前具體的騎乘都已經有達成共識就是剛剛委員講的 今年 明年 後年 其實相關的東西都會陸續到位 以上報告好 那 呃 |
| transcript.whisperx[856].start |
26563.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[856].end |
26587.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[856].text |
第二百二十八案黃委員不在二百二十九案黃建斌委員不在我們就不予處理二百二十七案並二百三十案呃凍結八千萬元呃說明報告後並經同意使得凍置那主案為一兩百二十七案馬文君委員兩百三十一案到兩百三十二案請說明馬委員在喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[857].start |
26594.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[857].end |
26615.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[857].text |
231跟232案黃連委員不在那就處理第232案其實你是兩案是在同一個那個向下的其實可以一併處理啦請說明231跟232案田委員 黃連跟馬居委員已完成說明 建請同意併案凍結1000萬請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[858].start |
26618.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[858].end |
26631.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[858].text |
這個部分因為建隆級的升級提升案其實也是有延宕的部分那目前大概去年第一艘還是有一項的缺改的部分還沒有完成那今年要做第二艘在進行當中我們也不曉得 |
| transcript.whisperx[859].start |
26640.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[859].end |
26660.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[859].text |
就是他的進度是不是可以順利那凍結一千萬那其實建隆跟海昆其實應該有一些東西是一致的所以如果有問題應該也差不多都會有問題那這個部分到時候可能也可以一併說明231案並232案凍結一千萬書面報告並經統一後時的凍資徐委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[860].start |
26671.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[860].end |
26691.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[860].text |
這邊我也想要請教一下因為我們前面一個案子講到的是這MK48嘛那因為這個建隆級的這個潛艦那我們如果說完成這個系統的提升之後啊那我們的這個驗證那會不會受到這個因為MK48可能還沒有來的相關影響或我們要用什麼樣的方式能夠去做一個取代包委員是不會的 |
| transcript.whisperx[861].start |
26695.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[861].end |
26705.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[861].text |
包圍那個劍龍劍的那個首超劍海龍他的Mk48和薩提魚雷都用超雷打過也驗證合格好謝謝那我們繼續處理233到235案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[862].start |
26713.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[862].end |
26739.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[862].text |
233到235案提案委員馬文君黃仁基王翔委員也就分別完成說明建起委員同意並案凍結500萬元其中第233第234案原文專案報告建起同意改為書面報告並經同意後時的動之請委員知道請提案委員表達看法謝謝233案這個部分我們一直希望說就這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[863].start |
26742.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[863].end |
26769.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[863].text |
比如說我們的安全性部長也一直強調這個是變案凍結五千嗎五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百五百 |
| transcript.whisperx[864].start |
26772.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[864].end |
26777.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[864].text |
主要在這個過程當中因為現在已經進行到有一些潛航的測試可是我們在過去包括有很多的一些裝備其實它必須包括很多的管線的壓力測試是沒有過的像劍龍級潛艦可能也有類似的狀況那我們在有很多的東西有很多的設備裝備用防爆箱的方式去做測試這個也是不對的 |
| transcript.whisperx[865].start |
26800.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[865].end |
26804.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[865].text |
所以我們在淺深因為這個部分我們到底要淺多深應該是300米吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[866].start |
26810.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[866].end |
26831.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[866].text |
這個到時候這是在會後我們用大概做一些說明那這個部分我們希望要有比較具體的一些數據資料而且我們也希望就不像部長說的他一定要達到安全還有作戰需求因為這個是我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[867].start |
26834.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[867].end |
26856.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[867].text |
去照這樣子的一個淺建的一個重要的一個目標方向那它如果沒有辦法達到它就應該要讓後續建有一個修正的一個依據那所以很重要的這一個預算對它會牽動到我們後續的一些經費的一個支用這個部分我們一併去做考量謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[868].start |
26858.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[868].end |
26883.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[868].text |
好 謝謝那王海祥委員我這邊是2 3 5啦齁其實這個大家對這個事情都蠻關心的啦那我這邊是同意啦齁跟這個其他的案一起併動好 以上謝謝委員2 3 3到2 3 5案併案那凍結五百萬元那書面報告並且同意後使得凍資那我們選擇王海祥委員的2 3 5案當主案 |
| transcript.whisperx[869].start |
26885.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[869].end |
26899.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[869].text |
好 公安部沒有意見好那我們繼續236到238案第236到238案提案委員馬文君黃仁吉黃建斌委員以完成說明建請委員同意併案凍結一役請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[870].start |
26902.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[870].end |
26921.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[870].text |
謝謝主席這個原因很簡單因為他主機沒有交主機沒有交他後面的都做不了因為他是在最底下也沒有辦法封倉所以這個部分我們還是希望要有很清楚的一個來源還有他的進程以後才解凍謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[871].start |
26925.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[871].end |
26943.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[871].text |
那236到238案 併案凍結 引議員那書面報告併經統一後 使得動之 官方不確定好主案選擇馬文君委員 236案好 第239案到242案 請說明第239到242案 提案委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[872].start |
26949.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[872].end |
26957.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[872].text |
體外委員 黃仁 黃建斌 陳永康及馬文君委員已完成相關的說明建局委員同意併案 凍結1億元 請委員知道好馬文君委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[873].start |
26964.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[873].end |
26984.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[873].text |
這個部分因為它大概有一些垂直發射系統飛彈的實彈射擊也還沒有做如果成功以後我們就解凍因為在114年飛彈發射已經半保留所以這個部分對於凍結應該沒有影響可是我們最重要的作戰測評它最後的一項就是實彈發射我們希望它可以確切的 |
| transcript.whisperx[874].start |
26989.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[874].end |
27005.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[874].text |
可以達到這個部分我們再予以解凍 凍結一役謝謝委員239到242案凍結一役書面報告經同意後 使得凍資主案為在場的陳永康委員好 |
| transcript.whisperx[875].start |
27022.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[875].end |
27034.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[875].text |
第243案到245案請說明第243案到245案提案委員為黃仁、王安祥及馬洋軍委員以完成相關說明建區委員同意併案凍結八千萬元請委員知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[876].start |
27036.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[876].end |
27055.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[876].text |
那243到245案定案那以王安祥委員為主案 凍結八千萬元那書面報告經同意後 使得動之馬委員好 |
| transcript.whisperx[877].start |
27057.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[877].end |
27085.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[877].text |
剛剛病案沒有意見我們病案凍結8000萬可是這個部分因為魚叉飛彈美軍第一次試射是失敗的那我們400枚到現在一枚也都還沒有到就這個部分因為魚叉飛彈我們當時也是用戰備機去籌貨的那到目前為止的進度可能對我們也會有影響這個部分還包括它即使試射成功以後要運回來可能也是 |
| transcript.whisperx[878].start |
27086.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[878].end |
27092.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[878].text |
要看做一個全班的規劃這個部分也希望可以一併的做說明謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[879].start |
27095.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[879].end |
27114.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[879].text |
謝委員那我們剛剛已經宣告過了嘛好那第246案到248案請說明第246到248案這個案子是由黃仁 馬文君及陳宏偉委員所提這個內容就是潛艦國造第三階段的後續艦的籌建建議委員同意併案119億5000萬元另外原提案為專案報告 建請同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[880].start |
27124.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[880].end |
27144.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[880].text |
是不是因為之前就已經提到就是說經過海策通過之後就可以凍職啦所以是不是跟那個上一年度的那個後續件嗎對但是我們就是屬於確認一下就是說海策通過之後就可以凍職嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[881].start |
27153.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[881].end |
27169.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[881].text |
我們先把我們立場一樣的部分先陳述我想在場沒有一個人希望我們潛艦造不成我們都希望潛艦造成之後他有艦隊產生嚇阻力保護國家嘛那我知道馬文君委員的想法就是你第一艘還沒有完我這個119億給你 |
| transcript.whisperx[882].start |
27171.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[882].end |
27186.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[882].text |
好像空白授權一樣那我也記得我們顧立雄部長承諾過海策通過我才會用否則我一毛錢不動所以我們在這裡可以找到共識我們同意同意你凍結他一百一十九億但是 |
| transcript.whisperx[883].start |
27187.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[883].end |
27204.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[883].text |
解凍的條件海測完成就解凍因為中間這個騎乘就牽涉到兩件事情第一個我們國際供應商這些紅區的供應商他的信心如果後續的預算都還要經過很多的波折人家沒有必要賠你號 |
| transcript.whisperx[884].start |
27205.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[884].end |
27226.91 |
| transcript.whisperx[884].text |
那我們又要達到國會監督 監督什麼你海策通過我錢才能給你用所以我們是把解凍條件綁在海策通過上既符合監督我們提案委員的用意也不要去讓我們相關的供應商的信心受到挫折也可以讓台船這邊能夠有個穩定就是我把第一艘海策做好來我後續見沒有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[885].start |
27228.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[885].end |
27240.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[885].text |
兼顧到這些造艦人員的工作跟信心供應商的信心以及監督這三方可不可以這樣取得一個平衡就是說119加上海策過後我們就可以解凍 |
| transcript.whisperx[886].start |
27241.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[886].end |
27244.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[886].text |
因為台船現在事實上就後續件的部分也有已經在進行相關的這些備料的一些工作合約還要進行付款所以他都在進行貸款 |
| transcript.whisperx[887].start |
27261.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[887].end |
27274.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[887].text |
那我們上次的就是海策通過就可以動就114年嘛那是不是115年的這一個也是同樣的一個解凍條件是不是大家可以支持好 沈保揚委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[888].start |
27277.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[888].end |
27292.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[888].text |
對我同意因為剛剛就是我們之前的這個去年的做法其實我覺得大家意見在委員會是非常的一致就是希望能夠在SAT通過然後就可以當時有這樣的一個決議所以還是很希望就是因為這跟條例的那個討論不一樣這邊是實質預算的審查那這個不管是刪除凍結這個都是委員的權利 |
| transcript.whisperx[889].start |
27298.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[889].end |
27311.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[889].text |
但是我想這個就像剛剛定宇委員講的一定是沒人想要失敗啦所以我們綁定一個去年大家都已經一致的也都能夠討論的條件用這個條件來當作可以指引那這樣對於台船之後要做這些相關的因應我覺得應該會比較順利啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[890].start |
27315.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[890].end |
27331.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[890].text |
首先要表達對現在這個台船的肯定因為我覺得今年度的這個海昆號它原型艦是有進度的明顯看到相對於以前它有一個比較具體的進度出來了那往這個方向走我想我們大家不分黨派一定都是支持的 |
| transcript.whisperx[891].start |
27332.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[891].end |
27354.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[891].text |
但是畢竟因為他還沒有完成SAT這個整個過程所以剛才我也聽到了王定義委員跟沈維陽委員的說法我覺得基本上我也是認同的但我在這邊也特別提一件事情這是我個人的建議大家可以聽聽看就是因為我們在上次我們在協商的時候也有一些案子是我們在委員會的討論討論完之後因為去年在預算審查的時候政黨協商並不是很健全 |
| transcript.whisperx[892].start |
27360.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[892].end |
27380.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[892].text |
那所以後續就到了這個就等於說沒有政黨協商啦那沒有政黨協商之後後續等於說第二輪的部分又到了大院去做表決那後來跟委員會這邊也不太一樣所以我的建議就是說呢大家可以表達自己的意見像我剛剛有談嘛那表達完自己的意見是不是我們把它保留然後到政黨協商裡面去 |
| transcript.whisperx[893].start |
27381.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[893].end |
27406.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[893].text |
好對因為這樣才不會變成是說我們這邊討論老半天然後到政黨協商又是另一回事到大院又是另外一回事我覺得這個反而到時候造成大家的這整個困擾所以我的建議是說直接就保留到政黨協商的時候但是我們可以有一個基本的共識啊我們在這裡有一個基本的共識包含是說這個海策通過之後結凍等等的但我還是覺得我們到政黨協商的時候那 |
| transcript.whisperx[894].start |
27407.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[894].end |
27426.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[894].text |
作為協商的一部分那我相信各個黨派也都能夠協商最好的結果我知道徐曉勳委員是好意我是好意我是好意我先講我認為他是好意啦我們如果以委員會中心主義來講我們這邊討論的人最了解狀況當我們這邊我們去年發生什麼事情呢我們在這裡大家有共識我們也講好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[895].start |
27426.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[895].end |
27447.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[895].text |
我們有共識的到了黨團協商的時候不要再推翻它了就去那邊沒有參與討論沒有經過細緻討論不了解內情的在那邊變成用政治考量的我幾乎都推翻掉跑去表決所以剛才徐委員是講我是建議說我們是不是這邊有共識的我們各自回去說服黨團到那邊就不要再協商因為這邊的討論最接近現況了 |
| transcript.whisperx[896].start |
27450.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[896].end |
27477.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[896].text |
我想我這樣講這跟黨派無關嘛我們在這邊每一個人經過討論聽國防部的說明到黨團那邊的他的思考反而不是像我們這樣討論事情所以我們是不是如果119億馬委員提案的凍結OK但是我們綁定的解凍條件就是SAT海測過跟去年一樣就可以凍之那我們在這邊達成共識我們各自回去是不是說服這些黨團就不要再去改它了因為這裡是這才是我們長期立法院講的委員會中心主義啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[897].start |
27478.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[897].end |
27505.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[897].text |
如果到變成黨團協商中心主義每個立委的職權在這邊講半天都假的到那邊就是三長講一講就翻掉了不好所以我倒覺得是我們是不是把這邊的結果把它鞏固住然後不要到二三讀又整個變成全部重來黨團那邊他反而脫離現場我們是不是反過來這樣思考比較好一點我覺得是這樣子啊就是說當然也可以啊因為我覺得我沒有意見啊我甚至沒有提案啦但是我只是覺得說第一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[898].start |
27507.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[898].end |
27520.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[898].text |
是不是那不然的話可以看一下誰的這個凍結金額是最高嗎馬文君委員是最高的嗎那就說如果馬文君委員這邊然後可以同意的話對可以同意的話那就按照馬文君委員這裡的意見去執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[899].start |
27522.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[899].end |
27525.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[899].text |
那但是問題是我覺得我還是要強調就是在黨團協商的時候那仍然可能會有這樣的一個變數我覺得我現在也必須要先講那免得說到時候在黨團協商那有不同的這個意見的時候大家又覺得說我們不是在這個委員會的時候已經討論過了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[900].start |
27539.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[900].end |
27555.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[900].text |
因為畢竟一輪二輪他也是立法院的正常的程序正當的程序所以不能說人家不對只是說我同意剛剛王定宇委員講的我們在這裡能夠做出決定是最好的但我也要提就是那如果在政黨協商的時候如果大家不在這裡做保留那好 |
| transcript.whisperx[901].start |
27555.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[901].end |
27582.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[901].text |
按照毛委員他可以同意的話那先通過這樣的一個方向那到了政黨協商有可能再被提出來重新討論這件事情也希望各位委員都能夠先有這樣的一個心理準備那有這樣的一個了解那其他的我沒有任何意見那我剛剛也肯定了這個台船這一年來我覺得有新的進度好的方向那我們能夠支持的盡量來支持但是該監督的部分也必須要來強力的監督謝謝謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[902].start |
27585.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[902].end |
27607.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[902].text |
謝謝主席因為一直以來我們都認為潛艦是一個高風險高技術而且是高成本的裝備所以更應該要尊重工程的規律潛艦不是造出來就成功我們不認為第一的考量我們是以國家的安全防衛為主要的考量 |
| transcript.whisperx[903].start |
27608.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[903].end |
27616.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[903].text |
而且還有軍事官兵的生命安全 這個才是最重要的所以我們希望在潛艦的建造的過程從過去我們一直以來強調的都是一樣 從來沒有變過第一個就是設計完成 建造完成然後你還有博港測試 海上測試 缺改 驗收作戰測評 修正設計 還有決定量產 |
| transcript.whisperx[904].start |
27633.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[904].end |
27642.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[904].text |
因為去年其實前年在討論的時候很多還一直說什麼作戰需求那時候我們一直強調是符合作戰需求可是在外面變成被扭曲成有了作戰需求以後才要建這個都是過程那也沒有關係可是我們現在還是希望海側海側的木 |
| transcript.whisperx[905].start |
27660.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[905].end |
27684.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[905].text |
它的標準是什麼我們不曉得所以這個部分我們全動的原因很簡單因為你上一個年度的那個預算其實還沒有執行就是它還沒有通過基本的海策可是剛剛我們有提到它到底它必須要減薪有多少或什麼這些可能要有一個基礎的標準如果第一艘沒有辦法做得很好我覺得可以理解 |
| transcript.whisperx[906].start |
27685.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[906].end |
27711.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[906].text |
可是必須誠實面對因為你要做的第二艘跟第三艘如果你原型艦還在找問題那你今天第二艘跟第三艘是複製成功還是複製失敗如果我們現在你緩半年不會影響我們最怕的是你過了10年15年因為你最快要到16年以後本來是14年嘛那你現在又慢了兩年至少要16年如果你在十幾年以後才發現我們把錯誤寫進 |
| transcript.whisperx[907].start |
27714.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[907].end |
27735.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[907].text |
第二艘第三艘還有所有的後續艦那我們根本對不起所有的國軍還有我們的納稅人所以這個才是我們要堅持的今天如果你有什麼樣的缺失你應該在原型艦你可以改因為過去我們有很多的原型艦原型機或其他的原型所有的第一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[908].start |
27737.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[908].end |
27742.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[908].text |
可能都會面臨這樣的問題可是不是把它包裝因為這會對我們國家造成非常大的傷害我們不希望複製錯誤這是我們要表達的所以我們這一次提權動的部分也是這樣那如果說在專報以後大家可以同意我覺得我們讓它持續的進行那沒有關係可是我們希望是對我們後續我們所有的國軍還有國家的安全還有我們所有的預算的支出 |
| transcript.whisperx[909].start |
27768.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[909].end |
27774.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[909].text |
現在看起來委員會的討論針對金額的部分先行做全部凍結看起來是還蠻有共識的那只是大家在監督的程度要揭露到什麼樣的程度大家可能還有一點意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[910].start |
27786.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[910].end |
27803.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[910].text |
那我想要尊重這邊討論的結果這我想這個海昆號的造艦這個因為開支龐巨嘛也是重大的這個國軍部件的一個政策我覺得清楚的說明以安民心也蠻有必要的所以我想在海撤完之後來安排相關的專案報告我認為不會沒有正當性 |
| transcript.whisperx[911].start |
27804.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[911].end |
27832.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[911].text |
但當然啦剛剛大家討論的時候有說我們維持過去的這個內部討論的慣例就海車通過之後不要耽誤騎乘趕快動之或者是說今天如果大家可以有共識說海車一完趕快安排一個專案報告清楚對國人說明之後來動之或者是如同剛剛徐曉欣委員講因為這東西難免嘛這雖然大家都講委員會中心主義但我們的立法院就設計了黨團協商制度嘛難免漢格嘛所以會出現變數所以先行保留我認為這三條路都是可以思考的好大家就做一下充分的討論我們尊重委員會的決議吧以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[912].start |
27833.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[912].end |
27862.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[912].text |
好 部長我只是說懇請就是說要體諒台船在這個部分對後續艦的一個負擔那所以我們相關當然後面的這個海測即使通過之後還有各項的一些性能的在驗證然後再符合交艦的需求但是在海測通過之後如果包括114年的還有包括今年的這些都能夠在海測通過之後能夠動之的話我想對台船是一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[913].start |
27863.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[913].end |
27873.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[913].text |
很大壓力的一個解除那在這一點上面還請各位委員能夠支持我只是講好那各位委員的共識是保留嗎還是 |
| transcript.whisperx[914].start |
27874.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[914].end |
27896.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[914].text |
沒有共識才會保留啊大家沒有共識那是不是因為剛才講三個方案嘛我就沒有我覺得這樣講就是說大家剛剛聽起來啦聽起來大家對於就是凍結的部分呢是ok的嘛可是因為對可是因為解凍條件的部分是沒有在這個案就沒有在馬委員的案有裡面的呀 |
| transcript.whisperx[915].start |
27896.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[915].end |
27911.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[915].text |
所以如果是這樣的話那假設是說你們覺得那毛委員的案子可以的話那我要在這邊提醒就沒有所謂的SAT後就直接可以就凍結的情況那對所以說你們可能要討論一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[916].start |
27913.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[916].end |
27926.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[916].text |
我們保留好不好對啊是不是你們也覺得我們覺得說其實在我們的立場當然是希望說都不要凍結嘛那當然這個東西可能沒有這個共識所以我們保留好不好那就 |
| transcript.whisperx[917].start |
27928.234 |
| transcript.whisperx[917].end |
27952.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[917].text |
第26到28案定案保留嗎還是保留就是保留因為上次的主局就是提到完成海車通過以後就可以動之所以還是麻煩一下當然如果大家都沒有共識說那就保留了但是我們還是希望能夠海車通過就能夠動 |
| transcript.whisperx[918].start |
27952.754 |
| transcript.whisperx[918].end |
27970.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[918].text |
其實我覺得也沒有到沒有共識啦大家對於就是說那接下來在政黨協商裡面是否可以加入這個解凍條件這件事情我覺得我們到政黨協商的時候好好的來討論我覺得大家剛剛有這樣的共識就是這個全部全部先凍結它是因為原型件還沒有好嘛對不對那這個剛才顧部長也談了嘛那現在有一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[919].start |
27974.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[919].end |
27988.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[919].text |
所謂沒有共識的地方是在於它的解凍條件嘛那解凍條件我覺得我們在政黨協商的時候那三個政黨好好的把這個事情解凍條件能夠做出來這樣子呢一方面對於我們整個潛艦國造是有幫助的二方面其實大家也可以好好冷靜坐下來去讓它能夠work起來這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[920].start |
27993.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[920].end |
28003.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[920].text |
246到248案保留第249案請說明第249案聽到委員馬文君委員以獲委員同意凍結六千萬請委員知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[921].start |
28007.918 |
| transcript.whisperx[921].end |
28035.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[921].text |
同意凍結六千萬數面報告竟同意使得凍資兩百五十到兩百五十四案第兩百五十到兩百五十四案提案委員馬文君黃仁陳君以及王定宇委員以分別說明建群委員同意併案凍結一千萬請委員知道二百五十到兩百五十四案併案凍結一千萬數面報告竟同意使得凍資兩百五十 |
| transcript.whisperx[922].start |
28037.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[922].end |
28039.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[922].text |
250到254案大概253案的部分這個全案的預算它下修1.1億可是我們獲得的燒數是從7燒下修成2燒這個差距很大 |
| transcript.whisperx[923].start |
28059.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[923].end |
28073 |
| transcript.whisperx[923].text |
這也還蠻離譜的所以這個部分我覺得應該要詳細的說明清楚雖然感覺上你的預算是下降了可是我們我們的那個本來需要7艘變成2艘這樣子的一個說明或者這樣是不是足夠那預算為什麼差異這麼大這個都必須要有一個明確的說明好一動請一起換253案為主案255案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[924].start |
28088.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[924].end |
28092.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[924].text |
第255案是體會委員是馬委員建議尊這個委員的提案凍結3299萬請委員知道因為他兩次都沒有過嘛對這個跟著3799萬凍結 |
| transcript.whisperx[925].start |
28109.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[925].end |
28113.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[925].text |
第255案凍結3799案書面報告經同意後使得凍結第256案請國防部就議再宣告一次255案 |
| transcript.whisperx[926].start |
28130.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[926].end |
28158.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[926].text |
動結三千七百九十九萬三千元說明報告經同意後實得動之第兩百五十六案請國防部就一一五至一一七年度全案建議的三動數及一一五年度建議的三動數分別說明第兩百五十六案呃呃第兩百五十六案條件是馬雲郡委員已獲委員同意預算照列照列好那我們下一案兩百五七案 |
| transcript.whisperx[927].start |
28159.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[927].end |
28185.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[927].text |
第257案 聽到委員馬文君委員或委員同意免於刪減並凍結一千萬請委員知道第257案一樣有全案跟年度的部分沒有刪沒有刪了嗎還有凍一千萬凍結請稍等我們理一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[928].start |
28192.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[928].end |
28212.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[928].text |
我先說明一下那個提案的內容好了因為這個部分我們是要買空中把具跟水下把具兩種這兩個都是消耗品以前大概在14嘛那現在用15那水下的部分現在跟廠商已經有 |
| transcript.whisperx[929].start |
28213.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[929].end |
28233.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[929].text |
有談好了嗎有所以他願意長約嗎現在這個還是我們會休還在討論當中所以這個部分他也還沒有報價嘛所以這個部分凍結主要就是希望後續可以有比較明確的一些結果以後再凍之是 謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[930].start |
28237.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[930].end |
28253.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[930].text |
好 第257案15至19年度的全案是不予三動15年度凍結1000萬元然後書面報告經同意後實得動之第258到259案請說明第258到259案提案委員馬文君及華人委員其中第259案與或委員同意免予凍結並改列組決議第258案建議委員的提案凍結90萬元請委員知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[931].start |
28267.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[931].end |
28286.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[931].text |
我們第258案凍結90萬元然後書面報告經同意使得凍資這個謝謝主席258案的部分這個在中科院其實這個部分要買68顆嘛那空軍是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[932].start |
28297.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[932].end |
28301.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[932].text |
因為這個部分我們希望可以確認過去在101年的時候已經有買的是空軍現在用的那現在是海軍只有4顆的部分放在4條船上 |
| transcript.whisperx[933].start |
28315.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[933].end |
28335.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[933].text |
可是我們現在希望比較確認的就是說確認海軍買的系統然後他要怎麼運用是否可以增加我們在艦艇操演的時候他的相關功能這個部分我們也希望請一併提出說明是謝謝好那剛已經宣告了好第259案不予處理260到261案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[934].start |
28341.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[934].end |
28348.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[934].text |
第260到261案 馬文君委員及華人委員與或委員同意免予刪減並併案凍結九千萬元其中第261案原為專案報告 建請同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[935].start |
28360.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[935].end |
28364.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[935].text |
一樣的我們就病案處理261案病案處理凍結9000萬元可是這個部分我們可能要說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[936].start |
28372.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[936].end |
28374.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[936].text |
謝謝主席因為當初我們鎮海計畫的時候合約設計走完到第二階段那原型艦的建制後來就因為雷達太大或者什麼樣的原因我們把它改成兩艘2500噸的 |
| transcript.whisperx[937].start |
28391.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[937].end |
28400.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[937].text |
那你防空跟反潛的部分現在鎮海計劃原來的合約設計感覺是浪費掉了因為你現在要從頭開始嘛所以我們就而且現在的合約設計以前好像只要4900萬那現在要暴漲到1億4 |
| transcript.whisperx[938].start |
28416.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[938].end |
28423.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[938].text |
因為台灣就只有一家所以就這個部分我們希望在這個部分應該要怎麼樣的調整因為難道這個設計的單位都沒有責任嗎當時我們要照這個我們這個鎮海計畫的時候原來我們是反潛跟防空應該是要是一致的後來因為你根本容不下然後你連 |
| transcript.whisperx[939].start |
28442.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[939].end |
28446.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[939].text |
你又把它拆成兩艘那原來我們剛剛提到的這個原來的合約設計它幾乎是浪費了原來這樣子的預算你現在又要重啟然後我們又要開始結果它的預算卻暴增那對我們來說可能影響也很大這個部分要有充分的說明不然我們對啊你一下子要這樣的計畫然後規劃出來做到一半好像不行了你又把它廢掉現在又要從頭開始 |
| transcript.whisperx[940].start |
28471.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[940].end |
28492.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[940].text |
這對我們的國防預算來說是是浪費的那260案並261案那全案凍結9000萬元書面同意後經同意使得書面報告經同意後使得處理以260案為主案好第200 |
| transcript.whisperx[941].start |
28493.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[941].end |
28498.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[941].text |
第262到264案請說明第262到264案 天安委員 馬雲軍委員 已獲委員同意 預算照列好 262到264預算照列265案 |
| transcript.whisperx[942].start |
28506.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[942].end |
28512.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[942].text |
第265案 提案委員是馬文君委員 以獲同意預算照列第266案 提案委員是馬文君委員 以獲同意預算照列第267案 提案委員是黃仁委員 268案到271案 |
| transcript.whisperx[943].start |
28528.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[943].end |
28544.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[943].text |
268到271案 提案委員是馬文君 陳永康 徐曉新及王安祥委員以分別溝通說明 建請委員同意並案凍結示意其中第268案 委員專案報告 建請同意改為書面報告 畢竟同意後實得動之 請委員知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[944].start |
28547.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[944].end |
28548.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[944].text |
這個部分我們這個原來的金額從404億調增成為590億增加了186億這個金額增加非常的高而且它的時間也拖得很長 |
| transcript.whisperx[945].start |
28569.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[945].end |
28571.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[945].text |
他從95年到108年後來又延成114年又變成121年那到現在在121年當然在這個過程當中因為我們這個項目有增加27億100多186億裡面27億是因為我們的工企延長 |
| transcript.whisperx[946].start |
28589.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[946].end |
28594.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[946].text |
對漁民造成一些生計的損失跟影響所以有要補償的部分嘛這個部分我們當然支持希望可以彌補多少彌補這些漁民的一些損失可是其中159億是新增的工程款我們之前已經增列過一次而且分成四區現在又不夠那到底原因是什麼因為他不但騎乘已經二十幾年了然後我們不斷的 |
| transcript.whisperx[947].start |
28618.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[947].end |
28627.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[947].text |
预算一直在增加这一次又增加工程159亿这个部分必须要详细的说明然后才可以动之谢谢委员那第268案到271案农杰市议员书面报告时候经同意时的动之那以第第268案为主案 |
| transcript.whisperx[948].start |
28649.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[948].end |
28671.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[948].text |
第二百七十二案請說明第二百七十一案是不予處理二百七十三案二百七十三案是馬軍委員建議委員的提案凍結兩百萬元二百七十三案謝謝主席因為這個部分是海軍要拆除有三座教學大樓要拔海 |
| transcript.whisperx[949].start |
28672.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[949].end |
28679.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[949].text |
全部採取以後要興建一座綜合教學大樓我們當然是希望如果說有需要的部分當然可以做一些興建或相關的一個整建的工程不過很重要的是我們這一次在預算上面大概四億五千萬我們需要做什麼樣的一些考量然後我們也希望不要我們看到過往很多的工程 |
| transcript.whisperx[950].start |
28701.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[950].end |
28715.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[950].text |
還有包括很多的建築的費用其實都非常高可是好像對我們的幫助並不大那這一個部分我們希望他在設計的過程當中應該要符合他們的需求那這個部分同意凍結200萬273案凍結200萬書面報告經同意後實則凍結實則凍置274到270萬請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[951].start |
28724.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[951].end |
28728.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[951].text |
274到275案 天安委員是馬文君華人委員已經獲委員同意免予刪減並併案凍結2000萬元 請委員知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[952].start |
28734.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[952].end |
28744.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[952].text |
274案275案就不予處理還是要凍結275案不予處理274案馬委員是同意凍結凍結2000萬然後順便同順便報告經同意時的動之276案已經併第185案處理了那277案到278案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[953].start |
28764.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[953].end |
28764.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[953].text |
第277到278案274 |
| transcript.whisperx[954].start |
28770.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[954].end |
28773.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[954].text |
動兩千萬書面報告後 經同意 使得動之不過我有問題 我們希望在這裡提出來因為凍結的理由 希望海軍要針對這個部分去做說明還有釐清的部分因為現在我們在社會任性裡面 為了要運水雷到港口我們花了三億四千萬要買卡車 |
| transcript.whisperx[955].start |
28795.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[955].end |
28811.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[955].text |
可是你现在因为过去我们可能库房是比较集中的一个存放囤储现在你要把它分开那你分开以后在任性所以未来因为当时任性预算编这个 |
| transcript.whisperx[956].start |
28812.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[956].end |
28826.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[956].text |
卡車的費用三億多主要就是為了運水雷那你現在已經要把它分散開來顯然好像不需要這樣子的卡車所以這個好像這個跟社會認証的預算是抵觸的這個部分必須要詳細的說明如果有抵觸他必須有一些經費預算是不可以這樣致用 |
| transcript.whisperx[957].start |
28837.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[957].end |
28842.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[957].text |
我跟委員說明277到278請說明第277到278案提案委員是徐孝興委員還有黃仁委員已完成說明其中第278案獲委員同意免於凍結並改列組決議第277案建議委員同意下修凍結500萬請委員指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[958].start |
28863.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[958].end |
28869.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[958].text |
好那這個我這邊就是同意下修凍結數額到500萬但我要講一下為什麼這個我們是在海軍司令部第13目環保業務底下的環保設施維護當中的業務非要去做凍結呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[959].start |
28880.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[959].end |
28883.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[959].text |
就是因為呢這個海軍131然後的艦長的執章帽子作業手冊等等都變成是垃圾然後呢一路的飄到這個澎湖馬公岸邊被發現那這個對於我們我們社會來說覺得說欸你們怎麼可以把你們東西要不要丟到海裡面變成垃圾 |
| transcript.whisperx[960].start |
28898.829 |
| transcript.whisperx[960].end |
28919.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[960].text |
所以呢你們對於這個環保上面的這個作業還有你們海上的這個生活垃圾的處理必須要有積極性的精進跟檢討然後要落實下來那不要再有類似的事情發生這對我們國軍的形象我覺得是蠻傷害的所以這個部分呢就五百萬好 凍結 謝謝278案不予處理278他是改組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[961].start |
28923.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[961].end |
28931.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[961].text |
對好那就改組決議想說277已經有凍結500277案凍結500萬順便報告並經同意後使得凍資278案改組決議那我們接下來休息10分鐘然後開始升級空軍司令 |
| transcript.whisperx[962].start |
28940.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[962].end |
28945.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[962].text |
最後一個就是你的 你要壓軸那不叫四千五百 你要最後一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[963].start |
28957.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[963].end |
28967.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[963].text |
還是你要先跟他講?還是我們幫你講?你偏偏壓扯不過這個有道理,DIO有蠻多要改進的我覺得這個是有道理主動下午你也沒拿,美軍是到了2020年 |
| transcript.whisperx[964].start |
28981.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[964].end |
28993.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[964].text |
大概18年以後才開始這個Block 7以後才下令這個是因為長官要打這兩個是他好像就上廁所我希望大家清楚了一點因為那個為什麼要跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[965].start |
28996.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[965].end |
29023.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[965].text |
什麼四千九百萬兩年因為司令人的合卷就是五千萬所以兩年把他設計完因為他後面他不要做這個說是雷達這個不行根本中科院都沒有做來一場所以不是雷達不行你不但拿美軍的雷達我們是帥端低的是小的打擊根本就一點關係沒有我只是不開講話講完了回溯回去那個時候的司令要打雷達他根本不懂建造工程 |
| transcript.whisperx[966].start |
29025.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[966].end |
29029.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[966].text |
既不懂建造又不懂合約對啊會他那個根本沒有再次一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[967].start |
29032.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[967].end |
29059.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[967].text |
我們會差三千七百五十萬一毛多沒有增加然後他的每一年的會差都在這邊 會率都在這邊這不是合約的問題 是中科院的問題沒有 沒有 不是中科院的部分我們這個是純粹是三購的部分沒有三科院 都是美方的部分三千七百五十萬是美金他不是有做繳價嗎對啊 你放在裡面啊不是 我們那個錢一毛都沒有加 |
| transcript.whisperx[968].start |
29060.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[968].end |
29069.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[968].text |
那個錢一毛都沒有加我們純粹就是匯數而已沒有沒有沒有我們那時候有跟住戶那邊講這純粹只有匯數我們中科院的錢從頭到尾一毛都沒有加過這是3750萬美金 |
| transcript.whisperx[969].start |
29079.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[969].end |
29087.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[969].text |
只有美方的匯數而已所以這個案子不太一樣他3750萬美金可是我們給了4800萬美金的預算嘛這是因為匯數的關係我們編的時候是28.43你看我們分時期這個是109年就訂出來分年付款高達1000萬美金 |
| transcript.whisperx[970].start |
29102.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[970].end |
29113.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[970].text |
一千多萬美金是負擔大概多三百多萬台幣報告員真的沒騙你 我們所有的匯率差每一年付出去的匯率 當時的匯率全部加起來四千多萬台幣 沒錯 但是這全部是匯差 |
| transcript.whisperx[971].start |
29127.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[971].end |
29152.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[971].text |
3750萬的匯差 每一年我們付出去的匯差加起來就是少了這麼多錢 但是中科院的錢還有這個全案的錢 我們從頭到尾一毛都沒有動過都沒有變動過現在請委員我們動解一下因為反正你們像美國那麼多這是結案年 包圍也不行 這是結案年啊這是商購 這不是新購 這商購 |
| transcript.whisperx[972].start |
29155.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[972].end |
29165.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[972].text |
請委員幫忙我們動一圈我們動一圈我們動一圈萬不然你們刪一圈不行啦 因為這是純粹是我們一毛都沒有加 |
| transcript.whisperx[973].start |
29167.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[973].end |
29183.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[973].text |
跟委員報告 如果說他欽葬完有多的錢也是繳國庫我們這個錢不能轉用 也不能留用因為是匯出去的匯率匯出去再匯回來也是進國庫可是為什麼你們講的會不一樣他那時候沒有 那天跟委員講 |
| transcript.whisperx[974].start |
29185.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[974].end |
29200.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[974].text |
朱哥一直讓我們說我們是有多付給中科院錢沒有但是委員我們從頭到尾中科院錢可是你們沒有把中科院拿多少錢的那個給我們報告委員我們現在我們現在算出來的就只有匯差是九千多萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[975].start |
29202.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[975].end |
29211.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[975].text |
純粹是有匯差 我們中科院診證一毛都沒有加我們可以再提供資料給你們看我們分時期 真的 這不能騙人 都是水單上面好 不好意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[976].start |
29226.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[976].end |
29227.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[976].text |
因為你不想騎車 |
| transcript.whisperx[977].start |
29256.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[977].end |
29256.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[977].text |
蜂蜜 |
| transcript.whisperx[978].start |
29272.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[978].end |
29272.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[978].text |
空氣很快 |
| transcript.whisperx[979].start |
29571.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[979].end |
29588.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[979].text |
我們繼續開會喔那各位委員我們到下午6點前把它結束可以嗎好不好下午6點前喔那下午6點前就審理到空軍好嗎各位委員OK齁空軍把它走完齁好那沒有異議那我們就繼續齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[980].start |
29594.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[980].end |
29599.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[980].text |
第279到280案請說明是委員好第279以及第280案分別為馬文君委員及黃仁委員針對我們能見度及現代天氣觀測系統等六項採購案的指導 |
| transcript.whisperx[981].start |
29613.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[981].end |
29614.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[981].text |
主席 不好意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[982].start |
29631.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[982].end |
29655.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[982].text |
因為這個部分500萬因為今年我們現在花蓮台東才在蓋而已那工程也不知道來不來得及啊所以你現在還在整甚至整修或者跑滑道都還在整建那這個部分我們希望在這相關的部分裡面都一併要去考量尤其你在蓋的時候有時候可能要把它一併考量進去 |
| transcript.whisperx[983].start |
29659.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[983].end |
29667.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[983].text |
是 好啊 是好 同意好 謝謝委員那第六賣西球案為主案281案請說明281案為馬文鈞委員提新市野戰氣象觀測裝備一案那鈞委員辦公室說明建請棉雨山檢凍結400萬好 那馬委員是否同意好 同意凍結400萬不過這個凍結的那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[984].start |
29686.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[984].end |
29691.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[984].text |
理由我們現在主要是說這個美軍使用的現行裝備那像這個部分廠商的產品應該是拿來測試就好也應該可以直接起案開標不要每一次因為我看這一次在很多的創新小組裡面空軍有做了很多可是事實上這些如果是很成熟的 |
| transcript.whisperx[985].start |
29714.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[985].end |
29720.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[985].text |
應該我們就直接開標買就好了啊你不需要每一次都要做評估而且是外行的來做評估那給你以後我們就覺得我們好像試驗品一樣這尤其是空軍因為大家牽涉到的安全考量是非常多的像之前在我們的那個飛行的那個那個什麼AI的系統裡面其實就有不同的意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[986].start |
29737.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[986].end |
29752.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[986].text |
那我們不斷的拿我們自己去給廠商提供這樣的參考數據我覺得是沒有必要的好 這個部分是我們凍結的主要原因我們希望可以具體的說明 謝謝凍結281案 凍結400萬書面報告金銅一石的凍值282到283案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[987].start |
29759.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[987].end |
29774.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[987].text |
282萬為馬文君委員提營運機及酒測器註令案那跟委員辦公室溝通後建議採組決議282、283採組決議282282案是282案改組決議282案改組決議283案建請預算照列283案預算照列第184案到第185案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[988].start |
29789.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[988].end |
29799.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[988].text |
284到285案請說明284案及285案建起預算都照列馬雲同意284 285案預算照列286到287案請說明286案建起預算照列 |
| transcript.whisperx[989].start |
29806.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[989].end |
29815.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[989].text |
286案照列 287案請說明287案建議跟陸海軍到後面處理保留 287案保留 288案請說明288案 同意委員凍結87萬好 馬委員凍結87萬書面報告經同意後死的凍至289到291案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[990].start |
29835.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[990].end |
29841.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[990].text |
289至291案馬爾園跟著289案凍結三萬兩千元290預算照列291免禦三減凍結兩百萬謝謝主席就289案288是全凍嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[991].start |
29857.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[991].end |
29859.754 |
| transcript.whisperx[991].text |
288已經就是按照你的289的部分是因為這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[992].start |
29865.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[992].end |
29872.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[992].text |
如果說他保險可以理賠那沒有問題因為這不是錢的這錢其實很少三萬兩千塊而已可是因為你這個是無人機演訓的保險這個保險公司已經很明確的說演訓他是不理賠的這個我們談過我們後面再提供各位演訓他可以做理賠好如果你可以的話因為承保不等於理賠啊就像我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[993].start |
29893.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[993].end |
29921.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[993].text |
我們看到的現在好像他們都說不理賠如果你們有談好那當然可以因為他的經費不是很高可是我們還是希望因為萬一保險公司他突然到最後將汽機車禁他也可以保第三責任險可是他有很明確的說你只要是酒駕他就不理賠那他現在我們看到所有保險公司他都提到演訓不理賠所以我們希望要釐清這個部分如果沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[994].start |
29922.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[994].end |
29924.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[994].text |
禮賠的條件我覺得我們應該在國軍的這個演訓的保險項目裡面去做增加你去調整這個禮賠的項目因為未來無人機它的使用會非常的多所以這個部分可能要把它確認清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[995].start |
29941.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[995].end |
29949.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[995].text |
289案那就請確認清楚就凍結3.2萬那書面報告後金同意時的凍資290案照列291案凍結200萬書面報告也是金同意後嗎291嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[996].start |
29966.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[996].end |
29968.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[996].text |
289跟291都要進同意嗎好吧290照列290照列對啊沒錯291291免三動兩百萬好動兩百萬不過這一個部分我們在看到這個向七聯隊圍牆的改建因為你台東機場正在蓋而已那你圍牆 |
| transcript.whisperx[997].start |
29990.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[997].end |
30010.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[997].text |
那時候不知道佔用民地嗎就是你在整個規劃上面我覺得應該可以一併去執行的你現在工程都還在進行當中所以就很多部分我覺得可能在我們各個軍種或國防部相關的這個可能計畫上面不要去分散這些資源是 |
| transcript.whisperx[998].start |
30012.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[998].end |
30018.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[998].text |
好 謝謝那我們再宣告第291案 凍結200萬書面報告 金銅鑰匙的凍制292案到298案請說明292案 王安祥委員案 凍結400萬293案 馬文君提案 建議凍結10萬294案 黃仁委員提改組決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[999].start |
30040.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[999].end |
30047.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[999].text |
是那295級296案因為這是無人機那建議併同陸海軍保留處理297案凍結200萬298萬照列好各位聽眾有無要說明之處如果沒有的話是否就剛好溝通的過程中請王委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[1000].start |
30062.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[1000].end |
30077.322 |
| transcript.whisperx[1000].text |
好 這個2922基本上就是這個AI啦那個空距離是好 同意那個那個我們現在是凍結改成400萬是 謝謝委員好 解凍條件是書面報告即可嗎是好 那我們來進行宣告 |
| transcript.whisperx[1001].start |
30078.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[1001].end |
30085.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[1001].text |
292 第292案凍結400萬書面報告使得凍資第293案凍結10萬元書面報告經同意使得凍資294案改組決議295案跟296案保留297案凍結200萬書面報告經同意使得凍資298案照列我們接下來審理第299案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[1002].start |
30109.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[1002].end |
30114.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[1002].text |
南白99萬為華人委員提案不處理 南300案到301案請說明300萬馬委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[1003].start |
30119.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[1003].end |
30124.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[1003].text |
體列建議預算照列好 300案到301案照列建議3減50萬免於凍結3減50萬免於凍結301案3減50萬科目字條科目字條是好 委員同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[1004].start |
30142.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[1004].end |
30148.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[1004].text |
來 302 案請說明302 案正義凍結 500 萬請發揮好 謝謝主席這個部分 你是電梯系統提升案還有維修跟提升案維修跟電梯系統是要提升什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[1005].start |
30165.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[1005].end |
30181.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[1005].text |
因為它的整個作業系統我們去仿商之後它的作業系統已經沒辦法維持所以整個作業系統要做更換它原來是Windows插頭那你有維修啊你有維修啦這是兩個案子一個是維修案一個是系統體制案我知道我知道是兩個案我的意思是你的 |
| transcript.whisperx[1006].start |
30182.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[1006].end |
30195.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[1006].text |
電梯已經要維修了維修是律行性那個是法規上面每個月都要維修的維修案這是法規規定每一部電梯每個月都要有維修那你提升要提升哪一部分提升的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[1007].start |
30197.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[1007].end |
30226.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[1007].text |
控制盤的部分總機控制的部分它的軟體還有一些DMS問題它原先是韓國廠的一些零附件它沒辦法生產了所以說我們你要換掉這些比如說像它的面板或者什麼按鍵或者什麼相關的軟體面板那個到其次是因為它控制還有一些電梯裡面的一些零附件它原來的韓廠已經不產了所以說我們用這個性能提升就是把它系統提升的這個過程中也幫它的零附件做一個性能提升 |
| transcript.whisperx[1008].start |
30226.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[1008].end |
30253.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[1008].text |
因為它我們說這個部分它有一些是重複的部分是怎麼樣因為你每次檢查要一萬多塊是然後一萬多那個不保你修對我知道它你檢查出來以後如果有問題你壞掉的裝備也是要另外買另外買那你現在又要在電梯要提升也有提升案是所以你不會覺得這個是有一些報告委員這是完全不相關的因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[1009].start |
30254.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[1009].end |
30280.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[1009].text |
例行性的保就像你車子保養一樣那你保養跟你要去換裡面的裝備那你不是同時可以一起進行未來未來他要再去檢查的時候再檢查他只做例行性的保養因為你把它放在一起你的預算是放在一起因為這兩個是一個是一個是柯子木是同一個所以說他的電梯性能提升跟保養保養是例行性這是法規上面規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[1010].start |
30282.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[1010].end |
30286.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[1010].text |
你要去檢查你所有的基建你現在要提升比如說我這個東西壞掉啦你一樣的電梯嘛你現在要把它裡面的東西要讓它變得更好保溫效果更好可是你又同時有檢查跟維修的費用在進行這樣不會是重疊的嗎你今天如果要你提升完以後你應該做什麼樣的一個維護保養或者應該要怎麼樣去做它它例行性的或者它壞掉你現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[1011].start |
30315.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[1011].end |
30327.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[1011].text |
建議凍結五百萬我們提書面報告跟委員做詳細的說明我們還是希望你要這個部分如果說可以你如果需要的那沒有問題可是感覺上好像是重複的啦統一凍結五百萬謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[1012].start |
30330.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[1012].end |
30333.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[1012].text |
302案凍結500萬說明報告金銅一厚石的凍資303案到307案請說明303案這是三軍共通性的就是剛剛那個TAG的部分那凍結10%凍結10%1億5996萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1013].start |
30352.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[1013].end |
30369.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[1013].text |
303案凍結一億五千九百九十六萬九百九十六萬十分之一是書面報告經同意或使得動之是304案304案見行委員同意凍結一千五百萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1014].start |
30371.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[1014].end |
30398.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[1014].text |
304案 凍結一千五百萬然後 數目報告 請同意使得凍結三百零五萬三百零四萬沒有三百零四萬沒有 三百零五萬三百零四萬才有三決因為三百零四案主要是因為你前半年不會執行啊所以有三百零八百 |
| transcript.whisperx[1015].start |
30400.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[1015].end |
30410.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[1015].text |
三百零五萬是三兩千欸對對對我們還沒講到三百零五萬三百零五萬三兩千然後凍結五百萬那三百沒有啊三百零四案凍結一千五百萬不是這個我們沒有更改我知道可是現在因為他主要是你前半年不會執行嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[1016].start |
30427.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[1016].end |
30431.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[1016].text |
這個是衛星的一樣 衛星的對啊OneWeb它是年租費對90萬一台我們高山偏遠地區總共18部可是你們還沒有簽約啊它現在因為其他的也是一樣啊對不對對 這是新增的嘛因為原來是速發部他們去支付這一筆通訊費三軍都一樣所以三軍其他陸海也是減掉上半年度的啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[1017].start |
30459.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[1017].end |
30484.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[1017].text |
這個對啊不是嗎因為你這個上半年你才剛簽約啊是那我們我們比較海軍是減五百萬海軍是減三減五百萬不是你就是你的年度因為你們的預算是比較高的它主要是你根本不會執行主要是你沒有執行嘛我們這個部分是一千六百二十萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1018].start |
30485.867 |
| transcript.whisperx[1018].end |
30510.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[1018].text |
對 所以減800萬主要是因為你前半年度你是沒有執行啊所以海軍跟陸軍是一樣的啊對是 那我們就以半年的預算800萬因為你們是現在才要支付嘛所以你前半年是不會用所以就這個部分 因為通訊費你一次增加因為你是增加1700多萬嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[1019].start |
30513.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[1019].end |
30527.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[1019].text |
那這個部分我們還是一樣啦就是說低軌衛星的費用當時速發部他統一出錢那這個部分他被刪的這個預算的原因還沒有消失可是我們要提醒國防部的是我們衛星的這個可能這個租 |
| transcript.whisperx[1020].start |
30533.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[1020].end |
30547.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[1020].text |
這一個費用就是可能未來會越來越高我們平常他的這個租費其實平常不會用到那救災跟重大事故才會有所以我們可能應該要去考量怎麼樣在暫時因為中華電信也是關國啊應該要跟他稍微討論一下是好 謝謝就是388 動800對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[1021].start |
30562.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[1021].end |
30573.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[1021].text |
可是豬兒不是用不用都要給錢嗎?那我有時候一個月我打手機也才打兩次為什麼要付一個月的月費?這樣子是不是可以少一點?可以少一點嗎?對啊,我們手機也是這樣,我也是要繳月薪不是,他們欠缺就是那些錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[1022].start |
30584.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[1022].end |
30594.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[1022].text |
就是現在才要簽約新增案我們不可以先動之所以結論是3.8百萬304第3103這個3.8百萬然後科目是進行調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[1023].start |
30604.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[1023].end |
30608.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[1023].text |
凍結800萬那順便報告金童又時的3.8百萬沒有凍結數304沒有凍結再重新宣告304案檢列800萬自行調整科目305案305案3減2000萬凍結500萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1024].start |
30628.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[1024].end |
30631.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[1024].text |
這個部分我們說明一下凍結的理由因為這個防堵軟體更新這個可以同意可是我們為了空雲去買設備 |
| transcript.whisperx[1025].start |
30650.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[1025].end |
30664.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[1025].text |
資料庫跟這個資料庫的加密系統其實才剛剛做好這也是國防部做的那現在怎麼會硬碟的容量就不夠而且軟體要授權還有漏洞要修補這不是買斷的嗎因為當時我們中科院他們在這個部分這一筆錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[1026].start |
30673.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[1026].end |
30686.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[1026].text |
是中科院做的嘛那他他才剛做好我剛剛提到的你軟體授權啊漏洞的修補啊這個還有硬碟容量不夠這個很奇怪所以就這個部分應該要要說明一下我們書面報告說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[1027].start |
30705.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[1027].end |
30729.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[1027].text |
同意 同意好 306案 凍結一千萬所有報告後 經同意時得凍結307案 307案建議三減一千萬 凍結五百萬好 這個提案委員是馬委員同意三減一千萬 凍結五百萬 凍結五百萬謝謝主席我也說明一下這個跟剛剛那個是一樣的我們基本軟體 |
| transcript.whisperx[1028].start |
30731.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[1028].end |
30732.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[1028].text |
蛤 不好意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[1029].start |
30737.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[1029].end |
30763.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[1029].text |
這個也是一樣的意思就是說在空軍的雲端更新系統裡面之前才剛剛花了大錢而且剛交貨完就發現一大堆的不足然後必須要花這麼多的錢變一億多然後去做這些補充我們都覺得很奇怪那我們之前到底做的是什麼都是剛完成而已就這個部分就是有簡略跟凍結的部分徐斌說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[1030].start |
30764.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[1030].end |
30778.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[1030].text |
現在這個部分307案已經宣告完了嗎我們剛才已經那我再次宣告307案簡列一千萬 科目字條凍結五百萬 書面報告已經同意後實了動之308案到309案請說明308案凍結三千萬309案凍結五百萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1031].start |
30788.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[1031].end |
30807.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[1031].text |
好 請問王偉 馬偉有無意見是 三百零八案投議啦我們先凍結三千萬就是有一些保修的人給我們一些意見還是要給我們一些報告那三百零八案凍結三千萬書面報告後凍職 使得凍職三百零九萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1032].start |
30809.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[1032].end |
30816.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[1032].text |
謝主席 309案的部分這個是115年要新增鋼棚就是新增棚廠的整建工程這個委託設計 |
| transcript.whisperx[1033].start |
30820.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[1033].end |
30840.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[1033].text |
按日计筹委托设计这个厂房它是整建而已它还不是新建大楼的工程整建它的设计费要1300多万这个真的是天价而且你只是捧场我们不知道为什么要花这么多钱这个部分要清楚的说明和交代谢谢309万冻结500万书面报告金同意后使的冻制310到313请说明 |
| transcript.whisperx[1034].start |
30849.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[1034].end |
30850.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[1034].text |
310案凍結1000萬311案改組決議312案預算照列好那310案凍結1000萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1035].start |
30863.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[1035].end |
30884.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[1035].text |
順便報告動之311案改組決議312案照列312案那個就是也是啦剛剛我們前面有提到那個就是那個供應供售站的部分因為一些狀況也麻煩工具這邊給我們一些資料好 謝謝王委員主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[1036].start |
30885.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[1036].end |
30898.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[1036].text |
好 那個311案的部分 主委委員有交代他這個最主要是因為那個我們空軍的那個供應商的部分他有一個APP那個下單之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[1037].start |
30900.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[1037].end |
30925.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[1037].text |
七八月下單結果到十月十二月的時候那個手機的APP還顯示在減貨中所以他拖到這個今年都還在看到的還是減貨中那個APP的部分所以這部分就是請我們這個空軍的部分就是盡快跟相關的單位去做聯繫然後趕快盡快的來改善請盡快改善謝謝來313案到319案請說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[1038].start |
30929.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[1038].end |
30929.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[1038].text |
313至319案全部併案凍結一役 |
| transcript.whisperx[1039].start |
30934.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[1039].end |
30945.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[1039].text |
那更正313是因為徐曉清委員剛剛講說他改組決議好那314到319並案凍結一役好313案改組決議314案到319案凍結一役然後書片報告後經統一時的凍之謝謝主席主案用嗎還是用哪一位 |
| transcript.whisperx[1040].start |
30961.519 |
| transcript.whisperx[1040].end |
30983.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[1040].text |
用陳永康委員319案不過這個部分就是還可能因為今年漢翔其實還是在做114年的目前還差10架那這個部分可以趕上進度嗎9月30之前他們promise目前是可以因為現在所有的備份件都差一個發動機其他全部都到貨 |
| transcript.whisperx[1041].start |
30984.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[1041].end |
31005.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[1041].text |
發動機不是最大的問題他們陸續會招貨是320案請說明主席我聽一下剛剛那個318案對318案我們的關注的事情跟其他都不大一樣主要是這個友誼機的部分所以這個部分還是請郭局長給我們一些資料是請提供資料是310的部分我們會給委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[1042].start |
31006.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[1042].end |
31032.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[1042].text |
那第320案請說明320案凍結一役好凍結一役說明報告後同意使得動之主席要補充一下因為這個是I2性能的提升以及採購I3的部分我們從早上到現在其實我們有很多的武器裝備尤其是對美軍購的部分其實有很多都是延宕的 |
| transcript.whisperx[1043].start |
31033.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[1043].end |
31035.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[1043].text |
那對我們來說其實會造成什麼樣的影響有沒有整體做過相對的評估不管是陸海空軍我們所有的彈藥所有的武器裝備有很多幾乎都是延宕包括訓練彈或者籌補彈其實也都發生同樣的情形那這些會造成什麼樣的影響應該 |
| transcript.whisperx[1044].start |
31052.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[1044].end |
31055.918 |
| transcript.whisperx[1044].text |
要有一個完整的一個規劃報告如果這些對我們的戰力或者對我們的安全防衛會有影響應該要怎麼樣去因應或者應該要跟美方如何的去談判或者如何的去協調跟爭取而不是我們現在在這裡討論然後只是預算稍微動一下然後我們的很多的 |
| transcript.whisperx[1045].start |
31075.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[1045].end |
31103.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[1045].text |
预算有些是往后延可是我们东西却始终都拿不到这个可能才是我们在乎的如果没有这些我们包括这些冻结的预算都不应该去执行那这个部分因为我们爱二爱三这个也是很重要的一个武器装备我们113年114年两年都没有拿到115年说第四季可能会开始交可是我们看到在其他国家上一次是瑞士吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[1046].start |
31104.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[1046].end |
31126.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[1046].text |
他們已經放棄愛國者飛彈的一個採購因為他們不知道騎乘要排到什麼時候那對我們來說我們也應該要去考量這個部分如果他有空隙的部分我們應該要怎麼樣填補或者我們應該要怎麼做總是要有一個做法這個部分我們要特別提出來因為從早上到現在已經很多件了謝謝好 謝謝320案 |
| transcript.whisperx[1047].start |
31133.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[1047].end |
31134.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[1047].text |
323案 凍結1億 書面報告 請同意 使得凍值321案 到324案 請說明321至324案 併案 凍結2000萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1048].start |
31145.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[1048].end |
31148.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[1048].text |
好321到324案主席這個部分因為這個牽涉到我們這個F16AB升級就AGM154C的這個彈藥然後還有防撞系統也還在美國測試當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[1049].start |
31164.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[1049].end |
31192.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[1049].text |
所以這些都還沒有辦法完成的情況之下所以我們現在一直在延宕這個可能對我們的影響也很大尤其這個期限也拉得很長這些部分可能都要持續的追蹤這部分因為他們跟我們說可以可是我們到現在還是都沒有有確切的那個交期或者真的獲得這個部分可能要特別去要求謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[1050].start |
31196.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[1050].end |
31217.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[1050].text |
那就如果國安部沒有意見的話321案到324案併案2000萬凍結順便報告金童又時的凍資那以馬王安祥委員他比較少那可能要馬文君委員321案為主案 |
| transcript.whisperx[1051].start |
31222.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[1051].end |
31225.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[1051].text |
325萬請說明325萬凍結500萬那325萬凍結500萬這個部分看起來好像也是延宕啦這個部分有沒有說明報告委員他這個下修的原因這個徵兆夾艙已經開始交貨了那他下修的原因主要是一些備份件 |
| transcript.whisperx[1052].start |
31251.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[1052].end |
31270.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[1052].text |
那還是還是不足啊不是備份件往後調整那其實他現在已經他的進度是正常目前交貨是正常是夾艙交貨正常可是他備份件他本來應該要交的因為前面是保固期我們往後移不會有太多的剩餘物資放到我們的那個FRB銀行裡面所以我們把它往後調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[1053].start |
31270.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[1053].end |
31299.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[1053].text |
好這個部分再出書面說明是好325萬凍結500萬書面報告金銅一厚石的凍資326萬請說明326萬凍結5000萬好360這個也是一樣我們的那個錢也是一樣往後調整的原因是因為備份件它今年也是開始交機那好這個部分請空軍要提供但要跟工程的佔比因為你這個有綁工程在裡面嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[1054].start |
31303.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[1054].end |
31312.791 |
| transcript.whisperx[1054].text |
那個工程大概總經費有多少可能要提供一下佔比的金額326案凍結五千萬 書面報告後經同一時的凍值327案請說明327案凍結五千萬他的原因是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[1055].start |
31321.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[1055].end |
31340.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[1055].text |
這也是一樣今年開始交機那今年交兩架他的備份件我們檢討完了之後因為這是一開始編列的時候他把它編在今年那我們檢討之後他的保固期也都還沒到備份件先來我們一樣要押太多的錢在美國的FRB銀行裡面我們把錢往後調而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[1056].start |
31341.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[1056].end |
31358.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[1056].text |
因為115年跟116年是文基相關計劃交機的高峰期啊是他本來就應該要到那現在也確定可以到嗎這個進度是超前MQ9MQ9有稍微超前有稍微超前那工程的部分都是按正常是第327案凍結5000萬書面報告經同意時的動資328案請說明328案凍結1億 |
| transcript.whisperx[1057].start |
31372.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[1057].end |
31377.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[1057].text |
328案凍結 引以書面報告 金同佑時的通知謝謝主席因為他這個部分全案有428億2000多萬那也是有綁了工程這個也請空軍提供相關的這個工程款的部分他到底是做什麼那相關的工程資料另外這個年底要飛回來光是夾艙的廠房 |
| transcript.whisperx[1058].start |
31401.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[1058].end |
31428.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[1058].text |
你都已經知道他今年要回來可是我們廠房的進度才1.31%所以他回來到底要放哪裡這個你早就已經規劃了可是我們的進度我們預算都要很快我們一直在強調的是這一點可是你夾艙來了以後我們要放夾艙的廠房到現在的進度才1.31%這落後非常的嚴重這個部分真的是非常的離譜 |
| transcript.whisperx[1059].start |
31430.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[1059].end |
31434.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[1059].text |
而且好像很多都有陸海空軍大概都有類似的狀況這個部分也請部長可能要 |
| transcript.whisperx[1060].start |
31437.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[1060].end |
31464.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[1060].text |
就這個部分可能要去檢視然後可能要有精進的作為之前是因為流標四次那我們在流標的期間我們都已經做過所有儲存以及運作的備份的這個調整的空間我們都已經全部都規劃完畢那確實我們在這個台東的工程上面有非常多的流標那後來也因為流標的關係工程都就是委員看到的進度都比原來 |
| transcript.whisperx[1061].start |
31465.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[1061].end |
31470.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[1061].text |
它流標不是一般有些並不是正常的狀況我們國防部所有的這些硬體工程所有的相關的訓場還有一些建築物全部全部幾乎全部都是落後的那它在設計規劃的單位也往往都是那幾家我們不知道為什麼我們設計出來的東西常常都是流標而且常常要減像減量 |
| transcript.whisperx[1062].start |
31491.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[1062].end |
31504.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[1062].text |
然後我們又要分第二階段甚至第三階段第四階段再去完成相關的工程而且不斷的加價這是很這個也是很大的問題而且似乎只有國防部比較常發生這樣的狀況而且是近期近幾年特別嚴重然後我們也編了很多的預算在做這些反而應該有的 |
| transcript.whisperx[1063].start |
31514.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[1063].end |
31521.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[1063].text |
可能我們的獲得可能還是比較少這個部分可能也請一併的去檢討 謝謝328案凍結一役書面報告經同意後實得凍值329案請說明329案凍結一役329案凍結一役書面報告後經同意實得凍值330案不好意思 主席329案 這個我們凍結一役 |
| transcript.whisperx[1064].start |
31542.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[1064].end |
31548.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[1064].text |
現在也是一個問題啦那這個因為項目裡面大概有發射架通信機還有飛彈那我們武器系統就是發射架的部分可能已經完成簽約我們通信機的部分也已經完成簽約可是最重要的飛彈發架書已經簽了可是還沒有預約這個也是很嚴重到時候你的通信機來了然後你的發射架來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[1065].start |
31572.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[1065].end |
31595.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[1065].text |
可是我們沒有飛彈 這個也是非常離譜的事情到時候你沒有彈跟沒有所有的武器存備其實是一樣的你有槍 然後沒有彈 可能造成的影響我覺得這個也必須要好好的嚴格控管如果有問題應該要跟美方看怎麼樣的考量 |
| transcript.whisperx[1066].start |
31596.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[1066].end |
31622.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[1066].text |
跟委員簡單的報告第一個彈的部分確實是因為近期俄烏戰爭還有中東戰爭的影響它的彈的產能一直不敢預約完成不敢預約完成但是產能是一直有那後面也有增加產能美政府要求它增加產能這是第一個第二個它絕對不會回來有裝備沒有彈因為它有些彈是跟我們現在空用彈是通用所以我們是可以有空用的彈來先做一個支應 |
| transcript.whisperx[1067].start |
31623.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[1067].end |
31627.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[1067].text |
對 可是我們既然花錢買了我們就是覺得我們有不足嘛可是我們一直強調就是我們到現在應該有的都沒有到貨那連發價數都還沒有這是很嚴重的問題所以而且都是非常重要的就是大家當時都說非常急需的可是從開始到現在我們一直沒有因為美國增加他的產量可是不代表是給台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[1068].start |
31650.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[1068].end |
31669.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[1068].text |
這是比較大的問題那現在俄烏戰爭也還沒有結束還有美伊戰爭其實也還沒有結束這個影響的因素持續都會在那我們沒有辦法放任它一直這樣下去不然你一直建新案沒有意義啊我們應該要去追原來這些欠缺的部分謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[1069].start |
31673.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[1069].end |
31700.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[1069].text |
三百二十九案凍結一宿命報告竟同意使得凍值三百二十案請說三百三十案凍結五百萬三百三十案凍結五百萬宿命報告竟同意使得凍值三百三十一案三百三十一案減列四百萬三百三十一案減列四百萬客戶自行調整等一下單一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[1070].start |
31702.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[1070].end |
31723.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[1070].text |
是那就不用嗎好 那就剪裂400萬那好 剪裂400萬 可沒有自行調整那所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[1071].start |
31725.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[1071].end |
31737.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[1071].text |
我們尊重尊重尊重好自行調整了好好謝謝好332案請國防部就115至116年度全案建議的三動數及115年度建議的三動數分別說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[1072].start |
31750.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[1072].end |
31772.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[1072].text |
332沒有共識嗎這個部分就保留因為第三千加侖的消防車可能在我們的民航局或者美軍的機場其實也都有採購那我們如果有需要我們當然也是支持可是如果說你特殊然後又 |
| transcript.whisperx[1073].start |
31773.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[1073].end |
31783.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[1073].text |
價格很高其實那是不合理的因為我們看到在那個規格裡面他特別寫了一個因為你這一次有一個刺針型的裝備是那 |
| transcript.whisperx[1074].start |
31787.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[1074].end |
31813.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[1074].text |
可是我們特別有寫一個80公分好像感覺是有特別的用意是不是綁標我覺得這會是有問題你已經是最有利標的你就選擇一個最好的然後價格合理的這樣子可能大家比較容易支持這個部分本來是在超出的部分我要全案要減列9900多萬那如果沒有公示就保留 |
| transcript.whisperx[1075].start |
31815.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[1075].end |
31825.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[1075].text |
這邊跟委員還是跟委員爭取預算照列因為我們這個消防車有9輛已經服役39年了有3輛是服役38年這個部分你們應該要去考量那個沒有問題你應該要汰換的就汰換我現在要求的部分是 |
| transcript.whisperx[1076].start |
31832.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[1076].end |
31837.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[1076].text |
因為我們是簡列啊你還是可以去派換那個很舊的所以不要把那個拿來台面上講我現在說的是有一些因為你訂了特殊的規格包括化學藥劑大家都是乾粉型的我們現在要求大概有一個特殊的環保的這些相關的藥劑那也都沒有關係可是顯然這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[1077].start |
31855.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[1077].end |
31882.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[1077].text |
規格上面有訂了特別的標準訂了特別的標準以後是不是價格偏高這是我們在乎的所以應該要釐清的是這個部分如果過高那是不合理我們的國防預算沒有理由要這樣做因為其他的機場不管是棉行局他們也有美軍也有美方的機場也有這個都是可以參考的所以就這個部分我們如果沒有共識我們就是保留建議是不是減列九千萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1078].start |
31885.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[1078].end |
31903.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[1078].text |
因為我們有幾部是缺庄補充我們再把它放到後面的年度來缺庄補充 是那是不是建議委員全案嗎全案減列九千萬十分之一我們把缺庄補充的放到後面九億九千萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[1079].start |
31904.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[1079].end |
31920.947 |
| transcript.whisperx[1079].text |
我們現在全案三點十分之一可是我們還是希望我們剛剛提的狀況你們一定要要留意這個部分因為沒有你今天如果是特殊的規格到時候我們如果有狀況發生或者你要去維護的時候都會相對困難 |
| transcript.whisperx[1080].start |
31924.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[1080].end |
31948.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[1080].text |
因為消防車這種東西你就是越普遍然後它可以及時救援它才可以達到它的效果如果你是特殊的規格甚至我們到時候要去維修的時候其實都會產生比較大的困難所以沒有比較安全這個部分我們希望它是開放的公開的然後是對我們的整體安全是有利的 |
| transcript.whisperx[1081].start |
31949.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[1081].end |
31956.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[1081].text |
我們商情收集再多收集那健行委員同意3.9千萬332案154116年度全案檢列9千萬科目自行調整115年度不煽動 |
| transcript.whisperx[1082].start |
31966.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[1082].end |
31967.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[1082].text |
333案到335案請說明333案以及335案併案動4千萬334案預算照列 |
| transcript.whisperx[1083].start |
31990.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[1083].end |
31993.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[1083].text |
333並335動4000萬334預算照列主席這個部分想要再補充然後也請他們提供一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[1084].start |
32007.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[1084].end |
32010.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[1084].text |
這個部分因為我們訓練夾艙在這是101年的東西有一個通用卡夾那到現在還可以用這樣的規格嗎因為我們這個是提升案嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[1085].start |
32025.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[1085].end |
32038.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[1085].text |
他連卡匣都會新購卡匣都是新購都新購我現在意思是說你這是提升案可是卡匣是很舊的東西因為包括我們卡匣是在那個part裡面是整隻都換掉連卡匣都換 |
| transcript.whisperx[1086].start |
32039.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[1086].end |
32061.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[1086].text |
那現在沒有最新的方式嗎都是用卡夾它的卡夾其實不是那種磁帶的卡夾它就是一個記憶體一個軍規的外面有一個保護有一個金屬保護是全新的我不是說新的東西啦我是說它是新的它的傳輸速度也是最新的提供相關的一個說明資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[1087].start |
32063.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[1087].end |
32092.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[1087].text |
好第三百三十三案跟三百三十五案并案冻结减列四千万冻结抱歉三百三十三案并三百三十五案冻结四千万说明报告经同意时的动之那以三百三十五案三百三十五案为主案三百三十四案照列是好第三百三十六案请说明 |
| transcript.whisperx[1088].start |
32094.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[1088].end |
32100.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[1088].text |
336萬建議委員凍結1000萬那我們把歷年的這個匯率差給委員做一個參考它純粹就是3750萬美金的匯率差歷年的匯率差我們都列出來這是水單實際給美軍的這個水單這個部分我們是簡列一億嘛它主要的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[1089].start |
32120.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[1089].end |
32139.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[1089].text |
原因是因為跟早上我們的M1A2的車子是一樣的意思就是這個完全不太一樣因為我們這是最後青帳年我們每一年付款不會去調整它的匯率差的那其他的案子有發生這樣的狀況嗎以前是匯魚跟匯儲匯魚的部分就是進國庫 |
| transcript.whisperx[1090].start |
32143.624 |
| transcript.whisperx[1090].end |
32149.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[1090].text |
對我是說其他的案子軍購案這麼多因為你現在特別發生的是這樣子的一個案子因為我們過去其實沒有這樣啊因為我們編列的時候是28.43所以說它會比較明顯你其他的軍購案在那個時候也是28.43啊我現在講的是因為在過去其實都已經有類似這樣子的購案 |
| transcript.whisperx[1091].start |
32168.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[1091].end |
32193.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[1091].text |
然後你也一樣在那個時期就是那樣的匯率可是其他的沒有發生這樣的狀況而只有我們這個案子有這樣的狀況甚至其實有一些如果我們在像剛剛陳委員有提到有一些我們還會賺那在那個水庫裡面其實它就是可以雲池啊可是你們現在卻把它提出來說這個部分要去追加預算就這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[1092].start |
32196.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[1092].end |
32200.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[1092].text |
我跟委員做個補充報告就是說每一個軍火案他的起始 |