| IVOD_ID |
17286 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/17286 |
| 日期 |
2026-03-19 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-35-4 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
4 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
35 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
外交及國防委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2026-03-19T08:35:19+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-03-19T13:09:59+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
04:34:40 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/7a505bc1fba11f2d8ecfe646390efd90f972e27c5d9f23dd157d0edf07c12ea683bf45374b045af15ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-03-19T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請外交部部長林佳龍報告業務概況，並備質詢。） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:35:19 - 13:09:59 |
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報告委員會初席委員13人已足法定人數現在開始開會請議事人員宣讀上次會議議事錄立法院第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第三次全體委員會 |
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1635.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
委員會會議議事錄時間中華民國一百一十五年三月十八日星期三上午九十一分至十二十一分地點紅蘆森林醫會議室出席委員陳俊宇等十四人列席委員鍾嘉斌等八人列席人員僑務委員會委員長許家青及所屬人員主席馬周及委員文君報告事項依宣讀上次會議議事錄決定確定 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
1636.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
1653.282 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
二 邀請僑務委員會委員長許家青報告業務概況並備質詢僑務委員會委員長許家青報告委員陳俊宇等13人質詢均有僑務委員會委員長許家青及其答覆決定已登記質詢在場委員均已發言完畢報告及詢答結束 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
1654.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
1670.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
二委員陳永康、蔡春籌所提書面諮詢列入記錄刊登公報三委員所提書面及口頭諮詢未及答覆或要求提供資資訊請求委員會與二周內已書面答覆本會全體委員並複製本會委員令指定期限者從其所定宣讀完畢 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
1675.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
1691.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
請問在場委員對於上次會議事錄有遺漏或錯誤需要更正之處沒有 我們議事錄確定請議事人員宣讀報告事項報告事項邀請外交部部長林佳龍報告業務概況並被質詢宣讀完畢我們現在介紹在場的委員以及與會的官員首先介紹陳永康陳委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
1705.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
1730.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
羅美玲羅委員以及今天出席的官員外交部部長林佳龍林部長亞東太平洋司林昭宏林司長亞西及非洲司嚴嘉良嚴司長歐洲司李秀堯李副司長拉美及加勒比海司韓志正韓司長 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
1732.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
1747.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
北美司 焦國祐 焦副司長條約法律司 李憲章 李司長國際組織司 孫簡元 孫司長國際合作及經濟事務司 葉志成 葉司長國際傳播司 張秀珍 張司長研究設計會 柯良瑞 主任 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
1763.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
1772.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
禮賓處 貴志雲 貴公使秘書處 陳景林 陳處長人事處 呂士一 呂處長政風處 孔憲台 孔處長主計處 李佩華 李處長資訊及電務處 張家政 張處長 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
1789.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
1818.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
公众外交协调会肖光伟肖执行长公众外交协调非政府组织国际事务会江振伟江执行长台日关系协会林玉慧林副秘书长台湾美国事务委员会孙喜忍孙秘书长外交及国际事务学院黎倩怡黎副院长 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
1820.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
1842.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
領事事務局鄭政勇 政局長財團法人國際合作發展基金會史立軍 史副秘書長財團法人台灣民主基金會廖達祺 廖執行長財團法人太平洋經濟合作理事會中華民國委員會許俊斌 許秘書長 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
1847.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
1853.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
本日會議邀請外交部部長林佳龍報告業務概況並被質詢現在請林部長上台報告主席 各位委員 各位女士先生 大家早安感謝貴委員會邀請本人前來進行外交業務報告並被質詢書面報告請參閱 以下就重點說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
1877.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
1895.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
自我上任669天以來也見證了國際局勢的動盪中國不斷打壓台灣國際空間我國面臨嚴峻的外部挑戰但在國人和政府的努力之下我們仍然繳出了一張 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
1897.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
1918.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
這上面寫亮眼 及格的外交成績單首先我要感謝大院各位委員對外交工作的支持並協助推動國會外交近兩年來大院委員約有300人次130多團赴美日等30多國 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
1919.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
1947.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
聘外交包括去年9月韓院長率團訪問日本11月江副院長率團訪問巴拉圭美國等協助拓展台灣的外交空間令人欽佩本年也率領外交同仁兢兢業業全力推動各項工作迄今總和外交已經取得了一些成果其中包括我們有效的故邦 榮邦 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
1949.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
1962.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
除了維繫12個邦交國的關係之外我們也正逐步落實龍幫八大旗艦計畫而元首外交的成果也顯著外交部也在積極規劃總統適當時機再度出訪 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
1966.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
1979.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
那我們也讓世界走進台灣讓台灣走向世界自賴總統上任以來外交部已經接待超過730個訪團7200位外賓也見證國際挺台力量升溫除了賴總統訪問太平洋三友邦蕭副總統順利出訪歐洲本人也已經走訪超過20個國家 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
1991.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
2016.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
足跡遍及六大洲也深刻感受到國際友人對台灣的支持和溫暖我們也讓世界關注台海安全支持台灣近兩年來有高達122則來自友邦和友盟國家的聲明肯定台海和平穩定的重要性美國去年12月公布的國家安全戰略也強調台灣的重要性 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
2017.415 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
2040.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
另外本部每年舉辦玉山論壇和凱達格蘭論壇兩大主場國際論壇也增進國際對台海安全及台灣重要性的了解成效顯著我們尤其重視外交政策要符合多數民意的期待讓國能能夠有感而近兩年來本部委外所做的四次民意調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
2041.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
2067.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
也都顯示有過半數受訪國人對政府外交整體的表現滿意超過七成支持總和外交超過六成支持榮邦計畫這對外交同仁是很大的鼓舞此外本部也持續精進簡正便民的服務近兩年來全球外館處理超過一萬三千件旅外國人急難救助案幫助超過一萬八千人 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
2068.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
2083.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
但是去年一年就發行超過230萬本護照我們也鼓勵我國籍的航空公司徵聘了美國德州、亞利桑那州以及華盛頓特區的直航的航線 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
2085.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
2106.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
那麼也持續在開拓歐洲的航點包括增加航班那另外也反映了這個國人的這個經貿還有觀光旅遊的實力那在文萊泰國菲律賓也提供了我國的免簽的待遇再展現 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
2107.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
2131.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
我們本部簡正辨明工作的一些成果眾所周知當前我國仍然面臨非常多的外部挑戰本部會會持續的密切關注相關情勢發展並妥為因應而這些挑戰主要包括以下幾點首先是全球地緣衝突加劇台灣戰略重要性與日俱增 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
2132.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
2146.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
烏厄戰爭已經超過四年中東南海等地的情勢動盪尤其上個月底中東地區再度爆發戰事本部和相關外管這二十多天來都全力應變確保國人安全包括已經協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
2148.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
2175.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
兩千四百位以上的國人平安反抵台灣其次呢台灣的經貿充滿變數全球的經貿充滿變數世界也更需要台灣面對全球政經變局台灣會繼續發揮在經貿科技等領域的能量加深與美國和其他理念相近夥伴的合作及鏈結讓台灣成為最值得信賴的夥伴也讓世界更需要台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
2176.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
2202.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
另外中國始終是我國外部最大的威脅而且這個威脅日增但是維持台海和平穩定已經是國際社會的共識中國近來全面推進企圖把民主台灣變成中國台灣的行動透過混合戰的方式扭曲聯大第2758號決議甚至對我國人跨國鎮壓的手段來加以對我們的施壓 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
2202.978 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
2219.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
那對於我國以及區域和全球的和平穩定都構成重大的威脅然而台海和平穩定攸關全球繁榮已成為國際社會的高度共識外交部會與民主夥伴加強合作密切關注並因應中國在海外的相關動態持續捍衛我國國家主權 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
2222.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
2247.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
尊嚴與利益那麼今天呢我們的外交政策在總和外交的一個整體的指導之下已經也達成了一些預期的成果其中也有一些創新與突破之舉僅僅要說明如此第一 榮邦計畫與協作聯隊榮邦計畫已經取得許多項的重要成果那請參閱書面的報告至於在協作聯隊方面 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
2250.867 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2267.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
除了成立行政院經濟外交工作小組進行經濟外交佈局外交部目前已經和經濟部等10個部會建立雙部長的會議機制而整合各部會的資源發揮Team of Teams也就是聯合艦隊的一個力量 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2269.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2285.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
再來台美關係穩健增進台美深化安全夥伴關係如川普總統上任迄今已兩度宣布對台軍售台美也擴大經貿共生夥伴關係本年雙方已完成簽署台美ART及投資合作備忘錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2287.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2307.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
美國國會跨黨派持續以訪台、立法等具體行動挺台,美國也持續支持台灣拓展國際參與,尤其美方已多次公開反駁中國對聯大2758號決議的錯誤解釋。此外,台美也在國際合作、教育交流及地方互動等領域成果豐碩,各項成果也請參閱書面報告。 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2309.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2332.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
那麼在第三方面是有關於台日關係相當的密切跟友好日本政府已經多次公開重申維持台海和平穩定的重要性展現高度重視台日友好關係的一貫立場而日本國會議員若意訪台高層交流頻繁我們因日方的邀請也循大阪勢博的模式參與2027年 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2334.439 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2357.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
明年的這個橫濱園藝博覽會那麼也請國人拭目以待那麼2025年台日雙方互訪突破821萬人次展現台日深厚的情誼那麼第四點是在台歐關係方面也屢創新局肖副總統在就任前後二度訪歐也創我國副元首在歐洲議會演說的首例 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2358.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2366.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
陳前副總統以總統特使身份惡訪教廷展現台泛身後的情誼而本人也適度 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2368.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2395.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
問歐洲國家首度獲邀在華沙安全論壇演說寫下我國外長與會的心願另一方面歐洲政要訪台的交流刷新記錄單單去年我們推動台灣文化年也開拓了外交的新空間此外台灣與理念相近國家合作人道援助烏克蘭也受到國際友人的讚揚那麼第五方面是總和外交展現新樣貌 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2397.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2415.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
國會會今年邁向30週年組織改革也啟動了轉型提升政府發展援助的海外影響力而無人機外交小組開拓台灣自主防衛與國際合作的新局那麼外交部也推動設立實體的台灣Ingo中心 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2416.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2431.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
那麼增強全球社群的鏈接我們也開闢了四大領域14個面向的多元外交其中我們以國會外交突破威權封鎖連結民主友盟以台灣科技和資安的優勢深化與友方 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2432.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2451.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
資安外交那更以青年外交來展現台灣的軟實力擴大台灣實質國際的影響力第六點是因應中國對台法律戰那麼經過近兩年的努力推動今天已經有13個國家的行政部門與歐盟以及15個國家的立法部門包括歐洲議會 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2452.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2464.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
那麼和IPEC這個跨國的這個中國的這個政策的一個這個聯盟公開駁斥中國錯誤詮釋聯大第2758號決議研劇中國內政化台灣議題我們也積極拓展國際參與包括透過IPEC擴大台灣影響力去年中國作為IPEC |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2475.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2502.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
本年中國作為APEC的主辦方我們也積極的參與那麼不因中國的主辦而改變本年也在各市場合運用創新的論述突破中國的法律戰強調台灣主權屬於台灣人民反制中國對台法律戰的決心那麼展望未來外交部將在既有的基礎上持續推進總和外交的各項工作同時結合國內各方力量團結國外的民主夥伴 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2503.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2530.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
捍衛自由民主價值 拓展國際空間也為區域與全球的和平穩定和繁榮做出積極的貢獻最後再次感謝貴委員會對本部的支持和協助也請對本年外交部的預算給予鼎力支持那我也最後以今年馬年我們的春聯此審還雨 龍中馬祭作為祝福 期許和承諾期待在新的一年 台灣外交會更強更好 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2531.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2534.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
與世界做朋友以上敬請視角謝謝好 謝謝我們現在開始詢答本會委員8加2分鐘非本會委員5分鐘10點30分截止發言登記如有臨時提案請於10點30分之前提出11點左右處理現在請陳俊宇委員上台質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2567.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2570.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
好 謝謝趙偉 我們請林部長請林部長部長早 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2579.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2608.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
委員長部長我想我先以這個非洲地區相關友邦的這些國家來先跟部長您做一個討論那之前也曾經請教過部長那這個南非自從從2024年開始打壓我們住處從去年的7月份更直接來發布公告直接要把我們的住處改為辦事處那後續我們也看到政府將原先採取這個晶片出口管制的 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2610.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
2624.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
這個方式來做反制但是南非政府有請我們請求我們這邊來進行協商那我們也同意暫緩來做這一項的管制那近期包括當地的這個台橋也對這件事情感到非常的憂慮甚至在 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
2624.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
2648.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
南非的這個國會議員也認為雙方關係務實且互利那不應該因為短期地緣政治考量而被這個犧牲而最近的這個消息來看外交部希望雙方能夠進行實質的這個協商那我想請教部長目前我們雙方協商的一個進度到底到哪裡那能不能保住我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
2649.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
2667.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
在首都的代表處是 報告委員首先我們駐南非的代表處還是都在原地運作就他們首都Pretoria至於說他們在交涉中有給我們一個版本可以怎麼樣談我們也就時間先前因為他們要召開G20 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
2669.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
2690.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
那有延後那現在也還在交涉當中就什麼去談的方式啊也建在談之中所以目前我們實質上在南非的這個代表處還有這個包括在開普敦的我們的辦事處啊都還是如常的運作好那這個中國的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
2692.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
2707.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
壓力不斷的施壓在另一篇報導當中我們看到南非我們的廖大使也表示在這種壓力與日俱增之下並且當局的局勢不但是造成不穩定感 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
2708.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
2729.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
那更帶來挫敗感那我們在南非住處面臨如此困境之下我們還是希望有理念相近的這些友人能夠來協助我們那我想請教部長在這種情況之下我們有沒有爭取到相關有某國家或是南非國內的相關政要給予我們一定的支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
2730.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
2734.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
報告委員我們外交處境艱困是越戰越有不會有什麼挫敗感我們捍衛我們國家的主權跟利益依然還是在世界上立足當然也是因為有很多的國際友人的相助比如說包括美日 G7 等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
2752.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
2773.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
他們也都去幫我們跟南非政府反應希望能夠不要去變更我們其實是台灣跟南非之間是建立在當時曼德拉政府的時候簽署的一個雙邊的這個有關於社畜的協議那裡都有具體的法律的效力跟依據的 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
2774.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
2783.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
另外就是其實現在南非的ANC的政府是聯合政府他們聯合政府其他的政黨也都反對ANC的這種做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
2784.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
2809.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
那就是因為我想他們的執政黨NC跟他們的外交部做了這些決定其實在國會也沒有得到一定的支持那尤其民間的輿論這個很影響到台灣跟南非關係他們也是表達關切所以我想得到者多助我們也是廣泛的去結合各界的力量 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
2810.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
2828.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
那我想南非政府他現在也感受到那這個要幫我們就是說降級然後簽署然後包括改名事實上是他們的就是說單方面的意見我們並不同意而且我們會持續交涉來捍衛我們應有的權利 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
2830.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
2853.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
好 那部長我們在非洲另外一個友邦史瓦帝尼近期因為這個發函邀請我們賴總統能夠去訪問那也受到大家的關注那我們也當然也希望說我們總統可以順利的出訪那相關的這個評論內容也有帶我們這個外交部跟總統府來做一個適當的說明那針對這個中國試圖要透過 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
2856.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
2884.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
這個投資的方式來挖我們的牆角譬如在去年八月份他曾經標下這個斯瓦地尼的一個水壩計畫那有沒有可能會造成什麼樣的影響還是我們在長期經營雙邊關係還有包括我們投資的這個台灣產業創新園區的各項榮邦計畫政策之下其實會更有這個優勢那針對這個部分部長您的看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
2884.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
2899.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
是 報告委員 當然中國善於用這個所謂大型工程去滲透甚至去影響當地的國家的政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
2899.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
2922.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
那斐克尼大壩呢這個案子是屬於非洲開發銀行的一個融資的一個案子那中國當然去蓋它低價競標那也引進了一些中國的功能也造成了一些問題所以我們密切的關注那至於我們的跟斯瓦爾丁尼的這個我們的合作模式像我們對於戰備儲油槽 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
2924.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
2940.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
這樣的一個他們史國最大的一個國家重大工程的建設得到各界的好評這個就是一個很好的對比所以史國跟我們的邦交還是相當的穩固那我們也有一些創新的做法特別是農邦計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
2941.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
2955.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
那我在去年四月以總統特使身份去訪問史瓦帝尼那也跟史王就後續的農幫計畫的推動除了我們現在做的很好的醫療、外交、農業還有這些數位治理我們對於引進產業 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
2958.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
2973.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
創造就業是他們當地國最重視的那台灣有很好的經驗所以有關於台灣這個產業創新園區那目前也有相當多企業有興趣這裡面也涉及到他的投資環境相對是比較好除了資安穩定以外他跟美國 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
2974.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
2997.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
包括有一些比較最低的關稅18%它還是阿哥亞非洲成長這個機會法案最重要的受惠國所以在非洲一些投資的台商現在也想群聚在史瓦帝尼那其他的國家也希望說加強對史國的投資所以這個也就是我們的經濟外交在發揮一定的一個效果 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
2998.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
3017.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
好 謝謝部長另外我們台灣和索馬利蘭在2020年互設代表處以來我們積極地爭取雙方的認同雖然在去年4月份的時候我們也曾經因為中國的施壓導致我們護照無法在索馬利蘭進出 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
3020.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
3034.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
首先這個問題在多方的努力之下也獲得解決而去年以色列宣布承認索馬利蘭為主權國家雙方建交成為第一個對索馬利蘭地位表態的聯合國會員國 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
3036.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
3058.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
那對於東非和中東區域的一個戰略佈局產生了很大的一個影響那我想多年來索馬利蘭推動有關的農業醫療還有資安等多項合作甚至在去年我們七月的時候還協助他們開通了一條台灣大道那接下來如何提升我們雙方支持的關係 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
3058.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
3082.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
是 包括委員 確實台灣跟索馬利蘭都是民主國家其實它民主選舉已經有將近30年 是尤其在最近的總統選舉得到各界的肯定我們也積極在協助那它的制度跟能力建構我們當然除了這個基礎建設剛剛提到的我想包括道路啦或者是這一些像包括醫療 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
3084.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
3104.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
還有這個教育方面我們也積極的協助其實它有在地緣政治上它是鴻海啊可以說這個區域裡面重要的這個航行安全所以我們也在海巡方面有簽訂合作的一個這個協議那另外呢對於他們開採礦產 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
3106.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
3134.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
他們也有很多的關鍵礦物我們也有參與評估投資所以剛好現在國際情勢特別是地緣政治的變化美國對於索馬利蘭像我們台灣在那邊的關係他們也都很重視那以色列當然基於雙邊他們的利益他們正式的建交互設大使館我們在那邊的代表處事實上已經就是實質上就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
3135.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3155.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
發揮的功能可以說就是大使館的功能所以我們在這個基礎上就台灣跟索馬利蘭雙邊的外交關係進一步的發展正在密切的諮商當中那我們當然也會協調、溝通這些友盟包括美國、以色列等等大家一起能夠來協助索馬利蘭它的一個發展那部長有沒有可能會再提升到建交的可能性 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3163.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3190.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
我們都是穩健的在推動最近中東在戰爭也是一個很關鍵的時刻所以我們事實上發揮的功能就是其實雙邊是幾乎是甚至比有些邦交國都還要更緊密的關係那有關於就是所謂的不管是正式的建交或設大使館那這個當然是秉持雙方面的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3193.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3219.978 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
基本的我們講都有在討論但是我們也會因應整個國際情勢的變化來做推展好 謝謝部長也期待我們許多這些外交的工作還有我們榮邦的這些課題能夠在我們外交部努力之下來深化與理念相近的這些國家做更密切的一個連結 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3220.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3241.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
以提升我們跟這些國家能夠有更密切的一個合作關係也讓台灣可以在世界每一個國家認同之下來提升我們的國際地位謝謝部長 謝謝部長好 謝謝委員關心非洲的關係台灣跟非洲有一個很大發展的空間我們會用總和外交來積極推動 謝謝好 謝謝接下來我們請羅美玲委員上台質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3256.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3257.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
謝謝主席有請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3265.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3290.101 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
委員長部長早安部長卓榮泰院長在這個月7號以私任行程到日本為世界棒球經典賽的台灣隊選手來做加油那這是在1972年以後台日斷交後第一位到日本去的現任行政首長那部長你認為在台日外交上面是不是有一個很重大的意義甚至是一個突破 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3290.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3312.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
那是不是表示說台日高層往後的互動空間會比以前更加的有彈性那我們要如何把握這一次的機會進一步轉化成未來更加穩定更加紮實的台日交流的這個成果請問部長對這個卓院長這次到日本去您的看法如何台日關係會不會比過去更加有彈性 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3313.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3335.978 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
包委員台日關係不但是友好而且持續在發展的更好那我想對於高層的出訪不管是以什麼名義我想這在外交上都是有意義的當然因為台灣的外交處境也很艱難很特別所以我們都要兼顧到他可能的一些衝擊 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3337.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
3361.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
但是像我個人也到過東京在去年舉辦這個大阪世博的時候那也很自然的會有一些跟我想對台日關係來講最主要是要看我們做什麼不是看我們說什麼那所以我想告訴小苗政府他們的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3364.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3384.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
要表達他們有看到我們卓院長對外的說明所謂的私人行程但是我想對於像公眾人物尤其是國家的高層的官員我想他都一定有他的一個政治上的影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3386.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3411.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
可是這不是我們去用說的因為我們已經用行動走出去那日本也是一個民主的國家是一個自由旅行的社會我們也跟他都有免簽等等所以是在這樣的一個法制的基礎上我們就是積極的去促進台日的交流合作所以這個當然也是都在這樣一個大的趨勢之下在發展的 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3415.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3439.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
其實卓院長這次到日本去不管是說針對這個為我們的台灣隊加油或是是在外交上面的這個突破理應來講國人應該是要予以肯定可是很可惜的我們看到很多在野黨在枝枝結結上面呢挑毛病正是非常的不可取就像之前蕭美琴副總統在歐洲議會的這個演說其實這個也是一個非常大的 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3444.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3460.996 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
我們知道說外交部在這方面盡了很大的這個努力很難得我們現任的副元首可以在歐洲議會這邊來做這個演說這也是首例像這種外交上面上的突破國人都應該予以支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3462.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3468.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
而不是在很多地方挑毛病這是讓本席覺得我想很多國人很遺憾的這個地方畢竟這是很難得的一個外交突破好 那再來我想請問最近我有看到有很多有關於洪都拉斯想要跟台灣復交的這個消息那洪都拉斯的這個總統阿斯普拉總統在去年競選的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3486.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3503.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
他就曾經說過 紅國和台灣有邦交的時候 情況是比現在好百倍那承諾當選之後呢 將要跟台灣來做互交然後這個月初呢 我也看到跟阿斯普拉同屬於國家黨的國民意義 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3506.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3530.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
的議長Zambrano他也曾經表示跟中國建交三年毫無成效那對這個國家的這個經濟呢更是一大打擊因為中國當初的承諾不但沒有兌現而且呢還造成嚴重的這個貿易的失衡像出口下降尤其他們這個白蝦白蝦真的是他們我在想這次讓他們非常 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3532.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3557.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
沒有難以想像的一個地方居然跟台灣斷交之後這個養殖蝦產業居然受到這麼大的這個衝擊那甚至呢造成這個貿易逆差是不斷的這個擴張所以呢宏國現在可以說是苦不堪言然後一再的說要跟台灣來做互交所以我想請教部長我們這個青台的宏都拉斯的阿斯夫拉總統已經上任了 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
3559.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
3583.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
那這幾個月來到底他們有沒有跟我們做接洽有沒有洽談到底後續有沒有這個復交的可能請問部長報告委員我們跟洪都拉斯包括中美洲各國即使我們沒有邦交關係也都有一些互動那特別是洪都拉斯阿斯普拉總統跟我們過去也有一定的認識所以從他競選期間的主張說要 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
3584.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
3606.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
恢復跟台灣的邦交我們都非常的重視那也有一定的溝通那當然什麼樣的時間方式對於洪都拉斯最好的一個決定我們是以開放的態度那但是我想台灣過去因為他才跟我們斷交三年嘛我們過去在做有點既定的成果所以得到他們國人的支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
3607.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
3631.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
那至於說未來進一步的發展我想包括現在的地緣政治上包括川普政府他們的西半球政策我想對於整個中美洲地區有一定的影響那最重要是我們推動總和外交特別榮邦計畫他們也看到包括在他們林邦在瓜地馬拉跟貝里斯做的而阿斯普拉總統他有的競選政見最重要就是醫療教育跟創造就業的機會 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
3632.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
3655.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
那台灣這個方式是台灣模式相對於中國的模式他們用一帶一路然後大量的傾銷然後控制他們的一些基礎建設那導致很多的貪汙腐化這個後遺症是很大的所以我想很多人已經有基本的認識那對於宏都拉斯至於他要去可能要面對也要有一些內外的一個情勢的評估比如說你如果像華為 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
3656.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
3669.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
華為已經滲透進去很多國家之後這裡面操控他們的資訊或者一種所謂的政商勾結等等這個當然也會衝擊啦所以怎麼樣我想我們是密切的關注也維持聯繫也尊重對方在適當的一個時機做出決定 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
3682.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
3707.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
所以我們這邊我們台灣這裡的態度是如果是說南斯拉夫這邊有意要跟我們做互交我們也是樂觀其成嗎不只樂觀其成我們是有一定的期待但是我們因為外交是要雙方面基於目前都還沒有對方都還沒有跟我們洽談這個部分我們當然是有溝通我意思說我們現在外交不是說我好像 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
3708.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
3729.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
就是為了要去建交或者是這種關係因為那會流於可能會變成在競標那我們就是不走金錢外交的路以我們台灣模式讓他們具體去了解說這個對他國家發展的意義比如說最近我們辦玉山論壇也跟智慧城市展一起 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
3729.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
3759.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
所以像昨天聖文森的副總理去年也是選舉政黨人體他組團來台灣之後就去看了智慧城市展他說這個是我們國家要的我們的國力是呈現在我們台灣各方面不是只有我們政府的預算當然我們的預算也要拜託因為我們的榮邦計畫很多新興計畫都還沒有立法院通過我們要啟動會有點困難所以要再次懇求大會的支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
3759.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
3763.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
謝謝部長 因為部長之前你也曾經接受某一個電視訪談你有曾經提到說其實現在有很多的國家其實很願意跟台灣來進行實質的外交當然我們也有看到世界各國其實也陸陸續續對台灣的慈禧釋出了善意 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
3779.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
3782.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
像例如說像中國之前長期來扭曲這個聯合國2758號的這個決議像這個英國國會也好或是說捷克的眾議院、比利時眾議院、歐盟議會等等其實都已經做成了這個決議指明就是2758號其實它是沒有涉及台灣地位這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
3798.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
3814.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
所以我們可以看到就是歐洲各國其實最近已經形成一個反制中國論述壟斷的類似一個陣線那像今年初美國也再次的聲明就是說反對以武力威脅或脅迫改變台海的這個現狀日本也好 加拿大 韓國 法國等等這些國家 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
3815.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
3833.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
都在今年初呢都公開的聲明說台海和平穩定的是他們共同關切的這個事項那其實今天我有在這個你們的專報裡面有發現就是有看到你們有一段文字因為時間的關係可能部長你這個部分沒有提到為什麼這些國家會這麼重視台灣目前的這個這個國際地位台海這個和平喔因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
3838.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
3842.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
因為你們專報自己就有提到台灣身處國際供應鏈的樞紐而且全球有九成的先進晶片是在台灣製造的我們幾乎是支撐了全球的半導體的供應鏈再來還有台灣海峽世界上其實有五成的世界貨運其實都是要經由台灣海峽來通行 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
3861.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
3887.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
所以這個台海的和平對這些國家來講其實是非常重要的那現在很多國家都看到台灣的這個價值所以部長想請問這是台灣最好的時候嗎我跟委員補充一下以前我們在講台灣的重要性之外我們現在在講台灣可以跟對方創造什麼價值那27582其實為什麼重要是因為中共發動法律戰 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
3888.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
3911.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
如果台灣是中國的話 那我們所有的東西我們就沒有主權就沒有產權嘛 也不會有人權所以其實一開始有些國家像歐洲國家他們對2758決議的解釋文 他們感覺這有什麼重要可是你看美國的國務院正式的試點立場的說明而且特別又提到台灣是可以貢獻國際的那在這種情況之下 大家才意識到這是中共的法律戰 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
3912.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
3938.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
也就是他從去年三個八十年的所謂的這種論述啊到一支2758的決定到現在在要求一些中國的他們的這些受他們影響的所謂全球南方的國家為什麼在我們有一些名稱上面或是用像像比如這個這個路徑電磁卡電磁化之後這麼重要的其實他們都在落實他們所謂的一個中國原則 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
3939.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
3955.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
所以這個我們去說明之後,不是說它只是一個某一年的解釋文這個是中共法律戰的基礎,法理基礎,所以我們一定要破它所以透過包括美國,像美國現在的所謂的RCO,就是所謂的區域中國觀察員 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
3958.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
3972.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
那我們也跟包括各國都在交流所以中共的所謂法律戰啊然後這個所謂假訊息啦這個跨境鎮壓其實滲透到各國啊都跟這個台灣的這個所謂2758的決議啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
3974.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
3991.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
阿雖然二十五號決議根本沒有一個文字一個字提到台灣所以這是為什麼IPAC通過決議這麼重要然後各國都會一一通過我們反手為攻希望說讓這個台灣的法律地位不要被中共所壟斷變成一中這樣的一個法律基礎 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
3992.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
3997.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
所以部長是認為就是說經過台灣的不斷的論述其實現在各個國家其實都可以了解2158號決議真正的它的這個內容跟這個內涵因為時間的關係部長剛剛有提到其實我們的外交工作是越挫越勇當然真的是很不容易台灣一直在國際的這個從過去的我們會覺得說自己像小媳婦現在能夠站到世界這個舞台當然 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
4020.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
4032.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
外交部的努力各個單位的努力讓世界看到台灣那我也相信台灣會越挫越勇也會讓台灣的價值在這個世界發光發熱以上謝謝謝謝委員謝謝接下來請黃仁委員上台質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
4048.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
4077.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
有請林部長 謝謝主席好 請林部長部長好 喂好那個由於美國和伊朗的發生了一個戰爭那這一段時間國人都非常的關注那這個徹橋的一個狀況那外交部和駐外人員也面臨非常大的一個壓力那今天報告中有特別提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
4078.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
4104.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
應變這個因應中東的地區的一個戰火那外交部和相關的外管第一時間成立一個專案應變小組協助了超過兩千一百多位國人平安的反台那本性首先想了解是面對突發的一個狀況那外管的具體的這個處置的能力那在這個暫時在 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
4108.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
4120.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
2月28號開始政府協助第一批中東地區僑胞回台用了多少的時間第一批回台的人數大概多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
4121.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
4142.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
報告委員,當然我們有統計到2400多人有協助的其中有些是在地僑民或台商或學生另外有一些是因為轉機過境的旅客前面那個部分我們都聯繫的很好第一時間我們都有建立通訊的那個時間多少?大概你們那個時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
4143.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
4165.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
我們幾乎在因為這個中東的戰事發生也不是今天所以我們大概所有的這些外館我們總會有八個相關的館處在這個地方我們都有一個群組也密切聯繫所以第一時間就已經都會跟這個僑民或者說在地的這些台灣人保持聯繫那他們也會回報那至於說 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
4166.064 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
4185.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
後面出去旅遊要回來或是這一些當然我們涉及到交通部跟觀光署啊對旅行社這邊的聯繫那我們在做會診部長為什麼要問這些問題因為我們在撤僑的過程因為常常會發生中東的一些戰事的問題太多了 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
4186.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
4209.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
有很多我們台灣國人在橋外裡面萬一發生要他回台的時候你們外交部的扮演的角色非常的重要所以在第一時間在應變中心在因應的這樣一個狀況我們要很清楚大概我們在應變因應的時間裡面大概有多少的時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4210.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4223.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
所以這個是我要問你的問題是我剛剛同仁有進一步說明從3月1號開始嘛從陸陸然後另外後續陸續的包括從以色列到阿聯酋都有對好那所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4225.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4245.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
這個就是我們外交部,當然外交部扮演的角色非常重要但是我們也應該不能孤精的來奮戰外交部孤精的來奮戰,也要其他的部會相同的大家一起來協助外交部在駐外的這樣一個狀況來幫忙這些僑胞 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4248.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4275.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
那個撤僑因為以下待會我要講的就是因為撤僑的考驗不只是外館臨時應變的能力也是對制度熟練程度的一個檢視理論上外館都會有緊急應變的計畫那為了遭遇緊急事件能夠依計畫安排那平時還要做到什麼要定期更新僑胞的名冊和建立聯絡網 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4277.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4294.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
所以相信這些外交部都有在做只是做了多少考量到許多外管人力有限本席比較擔心平時是否有落實包含非戰鬥人員和僑胞撤離的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4295.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4313.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
演練這就是我擔憂的地方那另外我想請問一下駐外的外館外館處是否每一年都有安排撤僑的演練那頻率是多少頻率是多少部長我們因為有緊急應變計畫那也會針對新的情勢做這個應變的演練那至於 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4324.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4342.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
那個每一個地方的情況要帶來跟他戰爭的情形像以色列我們就沒關係這個這樣子你就把這些相關的資料這個外交部提供相關資料給我好不好好的那這樣的話我就比較知道你們大概多少的頻率在演練的過程裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4343.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4357.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
這樣我們就很清楚只要是有發生任何在國際發生戰事的時候我們的外交部在駐外的演練的頻率大概還有在應變的能力大概有沒有隨時在激動時要面對著國際的情勢 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
4366.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
4381.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
那另外就是在過去的國際上的典範典範的案例例如2006年的韓國的黎巴嫩策巧的行動2021年美國在阿富汗的喀布爾 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4382.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4394.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
這個撤離的行動2023日本在蘇丹的撤僑行動所以本席發現他們有一個共同的點是一他們事前都經過實際的演練第二 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4398.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4420.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
都會安排由經濟或國營民航機的撤僑第三將撤僑的列為國家安全層級的跨部會行動這不是只有外交部的一個單一的責任所以部長你們有沒有這個整個像這樣的一個過程 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4421.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4428.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
不是只有你們外交部單一的責任那是不是要請求其他的各部會的一些協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4429.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4454.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
報告委員所以行政院也有政府協助里外國人跟僑民緊急應變的處理原則也包括這個所謂的緊急避難作業程序那我們外館也都會因地制於訂定包括撤僑在內的緊急應變計畫滾動式的檢討修正那當然每個國家的情形不太一樣因為我們其實跟很多國家都沒有邦交過甚至我們在當地的館處 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4455.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4475.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
有一些也不具有這麼樣的外交上面的特權所以在處理上我們會跟我們的友盟保持密切聯繫像我們看到包括這一次日本他也會跟我們諮商有沒有需要所以這一個也是台灣比較處境特別的地方至於說 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4476.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4502.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
行政院也是有這個機制跨部會我們也都在群組裡面那也有開會那如果要涉及撤僑那會涉及到交通工具那就是屬於交通部那因為如果說是要旅行社他帶的旅客那這個當然就涉及到觀光署所以確實是除了就是需求啦有沒有這樣子的一個我們僑民的需求我們要調查了解這是外交部做得很好 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4503.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
4531.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
幾乎都列車每一個人第一時間的狀況然後就是說他們怎麼去避難我們都有掌握但至於說是旅客因為過境啦或是那個這個部分我們就需要交通部觀光署的參與跟協助我也希望是這樣子啦那當然本席過去訪官來觀察我國過去撤僑的一個狀況通常會有一初期的撤僑速度太慢第二非常依賴外國的協助第三 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
4531.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
4556.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
缺乏政府其他部會的協助以上第一個狀況可能和缺乏真實的撤僑的演練有關第二情況是因應因為我們我國受到特殊的國際的因素的限制這是一個客觀條件限制的一個無奈那第三撤僑是外交部部門的孤精奮戰 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
4557.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
4571.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
所以其他部會的參與被動和協助不足甚至行政院可能都沒有主動協調其他部會協助所以這個就是我們的盲點在這裡所以我要點出的問題請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
4573.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
4601.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
能夠清楚我們應該在跟行政院加強的橫向聯繫萬一有發生任何在國外間撤僑的時候我們外交部除了第一個主動出擊幫忙撤僑第二一定要請行政部門來相關的來做一個協助這樣的話外交部才不會孤精奮戰孤精作戰好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
4602.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
4628.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
我們會不斷的來精進特別是跟行政院也有個機制我們來反應委員很好的一個寶貴的觀察跟指導比較安心嘛 好不好那另外就是我常常聽到這個駐外人員提到就是這個各部會協調的問題顯示一個國家涉及到外事務主要是由外交部負責 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
4629.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
4658.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
不單純是外交部的事務我國的駐外單位也不只是有外交部例如111年1月退步會在首度派員駐美強化以退伍軍人組織的一個聯繫經濟部、國安局衛福部等也都會有駐外的人員在國外但目前除了外交部以外還有外派駐外人員的部會有哪些大概有多少人 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
4659.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
4673.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
報告委員 當然主要是經濟部啦 國科會 文化部然後也當然特定領域剛剛講 包括退伍會有些也有那教育部也是 主要我們總體上來講有628人是這個駐外那目前在 其實各部會 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
4685.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
4713.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
在本部啦大概所謂借用我們的員額大概35人這幾個數字啦沒關係你這個給我一份好不好那另外就是因為實驗因素在請主席再給我一分鐘那我國派駐國外的使團員額是否受到這個這個住在國這個在國限制 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
4714.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
4739.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
債國的限制那另外就是那外派的人員以外其他部會外派的人員使用卻而是否他們自己和住在住在國另外的一個協議還是由外交部的員額借給他們借員額的情況非常的嚴重大概有多少 名次也給我一分好不好我跟委員補充報告我正在處理這個問題因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
4741.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
4764.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
借用名額或用這個預算其實從總和外交的角度來講我們應該整體的去檢視現在的外管或110個外管然後需要的人力跟他的預算然後做一個整體的規劃我也想大大院的支持是很重要那我們不是歐洲專案我們去年跟人事總署溝通 協調他就有跟我們增加院額 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
4764.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
4789.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
外交官要經過考試訓練那是很冗長的事情所以各部會過去在駐外管我們怎麼去整合發揮館長制整體的總和外交的效果制度面我們也在變革但是在人的緣額還有預算上我們也是希望說一次性的完整的能夠找到解決的方法因為外管的業務非常的繁忙那大多數的外管 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
4791.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
4811.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
管處都有一個人身兼數職啊吼 調來調去然後調來然後借用然後又回到本職這樣的一個狀況對外管實在是不公平啦所以這個你們要通辦一個檢討那對外管應該要專職在他本職本職的工作 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
4813.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
4830.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
很多現在駐外的提醒給我很多的一些建議那駐外的人不能身兼數職然後呢 自己本職除了做駐外還要兼到其他的部會裡面這樣對他們來講是不公平的好不好你們要通盤檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
4831.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
4854.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
好 我也期待我們除了外領人員的這些條例之外有一個外交人員的服務法像美國它就有這個Foreign Service Act我想也有很多委員表達關心我們也請一些專家學者在指導能夠建構一個台灣現在是很特別因為我們真的是各國都想跟我們來往 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
4855.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
4872.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
那就是透過我們的外館可是我們外館的能量如果不足或者是您剛剛講的因為一人間素質還有他們的工作上面的環境 權益這也是我作為外交部長很重要的一個工作這敬請大院能夠支持 謝謝謝謝 接下來請陳永康委員上台質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
4893.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
4895.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
好謝謝趙偉 呃有請華膠部林部長請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
4903.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
4928.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
部长早安委员长刚才因为听到前面我们委员提到就是有关驻外人员的编制复合之中我提一个另外的一个建言就是我们现在杰出的女性外交官比例上是非常多但是在很多驻在国它当地的local labor force是不够的我们建议在当地本地的雇员 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
4929.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
4946.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
可以增加人数那在预算的需求上这一点我们来支持外交部因为有很多的工作除了白天的外交事务以外还有当地有一些行政协调的工作可是这些事情由我们的真正驻外人员来负担的话是不堪负荷 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
4946.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
4969.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
那我們可以建議增加當地local employee的員額那這個預算上面其實外交部可以做規劃那這是第一個建議非常感謝 這個委員看到一個最關鍵的問題怎麼因地制宜 然後有個彈性然後因為這也涉及到我們的怎麼樣的聘用的辦法能夠符合需求 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
4970.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
4999.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
第二個建言也是剛剛您提到的就是這個2758這個條款因為1971年10月25號它已經經過好多次投票算那一次變成支持中共的票多過我們但是它在這個條款裡面它有一點點貓膩因為它是講什麼這個Restoration of the Lawful Rights of the People of the Republic of China in United Nations它是用Restoration |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
5000.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
5030.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
但在联合国的创立中华民国是原始的主要国签字到宪章还是中华民国那你现在怎么去恢复中国大陆呢他不敢用一个字他不敢用replacement所以他不能讲取代中华民国或提到台湾因此这个部分的文字我觉得我们未来在授课过程学院里面对年轻的外校官在国际法里面的用字要强调这个让大家认清因为现在被扭曲的解释 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
5032.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
5042.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
對 委員這是最關鍵啦因為中華民國是聯合國的創立國又是安理會的常任理事國所以這個確實是涉及到中國代表權但是對台灣來講在這個2758決議裡面150個字裡面並沒有去觸及啦謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
5057.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
5060.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
下面這個圖提供做參考這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
5063.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
5088.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
川普在去年的4月2号提到了对等关税他说这不是经济问题他这是已经国安问题当他提到国安问题的时候就涉及到地缘政治地缘经济地缘战略因此这三个地缘的问题已经纠结在一起正如同您今天的报告书里面讲全球地缘冲突持续加剧台湾的战略自主也越行重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
5089.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
5109.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
我在这边也持续向贵部或者其他部会提出建议希望我们政府在这个任内提出我们的国家安全战略因为刚刚您提到了在美国国家安全战略去年11月公布的时候提到台湾八次但是到了美国国防战略的时候就没有提到台湾 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
5110.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
5136.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
那最主要的原因是国家安全战略国防战略国防军事战略在作战区它是一层一层的下来的那么有重叠有指导从上到下是政策指导从下向上是实力支撑那要产生一个coherent strategy那目前在这一块我们并没有所以从这个图上里面可以看到川普跟这个 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
5139.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
5148.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
习大大他们见面的时候谈不谈触及不触及台湾基于他们双方的利益那我们要保持我们自己的核心价值 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
5149.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
5170.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
所以說全球的經貿持續充滿變數世界需要台灣的科技同樣地緣衝突加大這個衝突不只是經濟的政治的軍事問題在這種格局下我們需要運用AI的大數據也建議我們在外交部強化AI工具上的運用 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
5171.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
5194.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
就是把全世界有关我们叫开源情资就是open source information那这个部分要用这个AI来做整合对于国际情势发展可以产生一个预应的作为那么在下张图我们现在看到国际现实中大国基本上就是两手策略左右换利 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
5196.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
5224.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
這個前後施壓啊這個雙重標準上下調序變換主題使他的友盟啊在對手中啊不得不做出讓步那這個中間呢就是國家安全戰略的關聯性啊包括你的實力包括你的價值觀包括你的利益當然有這個軍事經濟治安政治啊還有核心利益啊長期利益短期利益再加上我們的價值觀啊民主自由法治但是這個呢這三個關係啊是互聯互動性的 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
5225.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
5236.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
我们需要把我们的 center of gravity透过国家安全战略能够及早定位出来那这种情况下可以看到美中两边呢他是斗而不破 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
5237.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
5258.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
和是维持和平但不合作那我们在中间的角色会越来越重要但是自我核心价值定位啊还是要靠一个文字的文字版本的中华民国的国家安全战略那美国的这个和平啊手段他后面一定是个实力支撑所以你看这个和平哥后面他是他的B2轰炸机啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
5259.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
5270.982 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
所以顯示出是他這個永遠呢在彈後面有實力這個不彈他要從另外一個管道做迴路那這個做您參考最後這個圖啊就是從 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
5273.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
5290.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
川普一啊到拜登一到川普现在任了那这是强权主导的外交政治跟政军精心的模式啊他是强势威择斗而不破合而不合制造议题主导谈判这是强权的主导但是这里面的每一个项目都可以排序出来 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
5291.155 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
5316.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
它是前后调整那我会把这个图提供给这个会部那另外我们也建议用方法论在这里面每一个产生的但书跟回馈的条款它可以左右调整那这个时候如果变成一套运用的工具对我们外交部的同仁来讲就是变成预印而不是等到事情发生的反应我想这个部分请大家一起共同努力 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5317.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5342.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
好 謝謝委員 這個很要有架構跟理論的一個對外交的角色啦 跟他的功能定位那確實我們外交學院也希望把這個納入這個對外交官的訓練 那我們的研社會還有幾個單位我們也待會再注意 這個委員不只諮詢您在接近外賓還有有一些 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5345.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5368.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
談話裡面這也跟我們總和外交是高度契合謝謝因為剛才前面的委員已經提到了就是這次美伊在伊朗中東周邊國家的外交部隊我們駐外僑民的掌握這個協助當然這個是大家共同努力因為在國家安全戰略裡面我們可以加上一條就是對於育嬰如果 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5369.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5387.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
在某個地區發生了戰爭那這個時候跨部協商的機制如何來主導是不是在這個狀況下我們要做一個特別專案預留一些預算要特別的員額因為靠住在我當地可能人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5388.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5416.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
或者是它的复合也不堪能够协调要透过友好国家的共同努力那么未来我们在规划的时候希望把这一个特别案例因为全世界将来发生军事冲突的几率都仍然存在那做出一个特别案例预做预算阴影及人力复合以及跟这个航空公司的包机如何处理我今天早上还接到一个华航机师回报的从这个多哈出来的飞机是满的 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5417.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5435.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
就是座位定不到那當然不是光我們的同仁那我覺得我們外交的同仁在這個領域上也付出很多我們希望共同努力育育這個危機而不是這個危機發生了以後如何做危機控管這個提供部長您做參考好 謝謝委員好 謝謝這邊就可以了好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5457.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5469.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
好 我們下面請馬文君委員質詢謝謝謝謝主席 麻煩請林部長有請林部長謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5479.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5495.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
其實今天早上在夜報的時候我發現部長做了一件很好的事情因為這個已經很久我們看到民進黨政府都做不到的事因為在夜報上面寫到我們的外交交出量力的成績單 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5496.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5515.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
那部長大概覺得不太妥所以你把它改成及格其實我覺得不管是外交或者各項的政府推動的任何政策都有可能面臨困難或者你有做得不夠的部分不可能百分之百那我們就務實的去面對尤其是外交的事務 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5516.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5520.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
我們不會不知道我們的外交的處境我們也很清楚現在的國際態勢對我們從過去到現在我們一直知道存在這樣的一個問題可是我們不要過度的美化我們現在政府很喜歡用那種內宣外宣的方式然後都說我們做得非常好可是大家當看到結果的時候又不這麼認為其實那種落差反而 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5541.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
5545.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
會讓人民不信任所以我發現部長今天這個部分我覺得做得很好我們也希望未來我們在任何的討論如果說大家可以朝向這樣子因為你說及格那表示有一些是做得不夠好的那些不夠好的部分我們應該用什麼樣的資源或者我們應該要怎麼樣去強力的補強或更精進這才是大家去討論的一個重要的目的 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
5571.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
5585.813 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
所以今天從這裡看起來我們希望說接下來我們有很多在可以討論的部分或可以做得更好的部分大家可以共同來努力那剛剛有委員提到就是說在這一次美以一戰爭的時候我們這個撤僑的這個行動因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
5590.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
5599.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
過去其實在日本三一大地震或者燕子颱風或者像之前俄烏戰爭的時候其實我們都會面臨到有一些國人或者大家會關注到是不是要撤僑或者是不是我們國家可以提供什麼樣的一個協助讓我們的國人也好我們的僑民也好他們有一個更安全的一個保障 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
5613.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
5641.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
在這一次美伊伊戰爭的時候事實上真的有一些人其實是困在那裡那我們在這裡要釐清的是其實大家不要把它過度政治化因為在面對生死交關的時候大家只是想要安全或者活著找一個出路或者可以找到一個活著回家的一個路所以這是政府應該要提供的那今天如果我們還沒有辦法做到 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
5642.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
5669.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
更好的時候更周全的時候其實我們應該讓他們有機會去做任何的事情這一次包括中國大陸其實他們也讓我們的國人其實可以上他們的飛機即使從上海轉機回來我們也有國人其實可以坐日本的包機日本是把他們剩下的座位也提供給其他的國家只要你願意出來可能包括我們台灣人 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
5671.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
5700.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
所以只要有這樣的機會我們都應該讓他上去因為我不相信有些人說那個有什麼風險如果今天在海上發生海難的時候周邊最近的就是中國大陸的一個船隻他可以提供救援他可以提供所有的救生圈救生設備可以讓你上船我不相信那些在這裡說有風險的人他寧願自己在冰冷的海上繼續漂他不會上船 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
5700.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
5705.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
今天如果我們設身處地的去想,不要所有都把它政治化我們也有接到國人其實在對我們請求,他說事實上他們回不來可是後來他們就是搭上了飛機坐到上海轉機回來的我覺得這個不需要去苛責,我們也沒有苛責我們自己的政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
5721.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
5732.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
因為我們有一些困境可是當你做的沒有辦法做到的時候你應該要讓國人有這樣的機會而不是再去限制他所以這是我們藉這個機會要特別提出來的剛剛說到的撤僑因為有很多我們可能 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
5738.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
5758.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
沒有辦法去做包機或者有專機過去因為這個牽涉到很多相關的問題可是我們在這裡要反過來提到因為這個部分我們還是請外交部可以做準備因為現在這樣的機會可能越來越多我們所有的氣候的變遷造成在哪一個國家會發生重大的這樣子的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
5761.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
5787.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
風險影響或者只要像現在世界的局勢這麼不穩定的情況之下哪一個區域會發生戰爭即使不是發生在你那個國家不是在伊朗可是在周邊國家包括杜拜大家都會去的地方你也不知道就是會被打了所以這樣子的因應的作為我們必須要有先有一個處置的方式所以我們現在把它推回來外交部現在有出國登錄月月抽的這個活動 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
5789.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
5804.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
這個部分我們希望大家可以在政策上面怎麼樣去做一個連結因為近期外交部跟媒體發布國人旅遊補助只要符合資格出國玩最高可以領五千元或者有一千或五百元的小禮物等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
5806.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
5822.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
那這個部分說是為了讓國人海外旅遊安全便利外交領事事務局推出這個出國登錄的活動可是我們發現這個可能也有一些問題因為你這個是自主登錄所以你沒有辦法去記錄到所有人 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
5823.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
5840.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
所以當他在哪裡 世界那麼大 國家那麼大他要去旅遊也好 去工作也好 各方面出國任何形式都可能所以當他沒有的時候 其實你也沒有辦法掌握所以我們把錢花在這裡與其要花在這裡 是不是把它用在 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
5841.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
5846.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
強化我們外交部怎麼樣在就我們剛剛說的像現在因應各項的情勢發生的時候我們怎麼樣讓國人知道第一時間要怎麼樣聯繫我們的外交部所有的駐外管處或者怎麼樣有一個幫他們協助的一個管道跟窗口我們去強化這個部分在他們出國的時候因為出國就只有一個就這些就只能從機場出從那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
5868.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
5892.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
海關出所以那樣子的一個管控應該非常容易讓他們得到這樣的訊息比你去抽獎還要好因為我們看不出他抽獎可以有什麼這樣海外安全的意思因為大家要去哪一個國家比如說要去義大利 扒手很多大家都會做一些預防的措施所以我們希望在必要的時候提供協助而不是這種抽獎的活動這個部分部長有什麼看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
5896.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
5921.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
我是同意委員的觀察跟建議當然一開始的時候就是五年前開始包括這個所謂旅外國人動態登錄包括LINE官方帳一開始是要宣導可是到了一個期間之後因為這次其實中東的戰事也讓很多國人知道這個有登錄也可以保平安另外一個很重要是跟旅行社 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
5922.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
5930.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
因為這個資訊就是到最後聯繫的時候我們比較知道怎麼去其實不會因為你如果不是發生在中東因為部長我們現在因為我們資源很有限所以我們一直認為說與其要花在這裡臨時事務局那時候不是說護照要做沒錢嗎放在那裡我們特別要提出來是說如果發生這樣的事情的時候我們其實讓國人知道應該尋找什麼樣的窗口 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
5951.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
5969.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
這個政策我們比較擔心的另外還有一點因為我們覺得他好像沒有太大的必要另外一個是因為現在我們台灣的詐騙橫行國際也是也不只台灣可是這樣的詐騙是因為他有很多的個資是很容易取得 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
5969.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
5990.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
或者被拿到了以後其實大概就做這些使用所以這個活動推動以來我們國人出國登錄的比例到底有提升多少是有提升了11倍啦這個以去年是6萬7千多人每個月但我剛剛講委員把他講完我覺得外交部門跟交通部尤其是觀光署因為他們跟旅行社這個是團體的 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
5992.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
5996.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
這個好好的來溝通他們透過這個管道的話可能效果會會很快的增加我們掌握旅行社就好了啊因為旅行社有最全面的因為我萬一我一團30個人去我只有兩個人或讓你一半15個人登錄還有15個人沒有啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
6009.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
6024.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
所以你在旅行社上面你會有最完整的資料只要他出去他到那個國家你所有的你都要通報我們馬上可以知道了所以就在海關跟旅行社其實可以掌握所有資料因為我們怕說你國人參與這樣的登錄的資料的時候活動結束以後他會不會被徹底的銷毀然後這些資料外流或不當利用的風險評估跟防範機制我們到底有沒有做到因為你這個只是一般的 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
6037.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
6045.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
這樣子的一個登錄的行為而已所以你的治安的管理的強度絕對不會很高可是這個記錄到說你所有的去的地方你很詳細的個資其實全部在裡面所以我們擔心的是這個部分如果我們任何一個政策提出來我們希望還是對國人真的是好的對我們的政策是好的對我們的外交是好的 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
6061.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
6068.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
那如果說有需要去改進或者我們可以修正方向的我們還是希望外交部這邊可以去審慎的評估好不好好 我們檢討這個經濟然後也會跨部會來協調因為目標是要關心跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
6077.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
6099.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
協助國人萬一在戰爭或天然災害或是什麼樣的緊急應變所以這個抽獎只是一個方法一開始也許為了要促銷宣導但是到了一個程度之後我想效果我們會來看方法上面怎麼去精進因為我們一方面就是說各自的這個保護因為我們還是希望這個才是很重要的考量因為我們做不到 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
6100.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
6110.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
幫這些國人他們提供這麼詳細的資料以後我們可以確保多少這個是我們可能要提出來的好那就這一方面我們希望未來有很多不管在預算上面因為預算我們還是期待 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
6115.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
6122.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
我們中央政府就是我們在行政院其實他們也可以釋出這樣子的一個善意今天不是只要求在野黨應該要去通過怎麼樣的預算任何的預算其實大家都希望可以好好的去執行可是當很重要的預算通過這樣子相關法律或者應該要編列的時候沒有編因為軍人的照顧警消的照顧其實事實上他就是重要的他不管對內對外 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
6144.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
6169.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
他都是站在第一線的這些執勤的人員或者所有服務的人員如果他們沒有受到照顧我們政府其他說非常重要根本都是假的所以就這個部分我們也期待如果說政府願意釋出善意其實沒有這麼多的問題那這個部分我們也期待部長有機會也跟高層建議一下 謝謝好 一起來努力 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
6177.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
6191.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
現在我們請王逸川委員來質詢主席請林部長有請林部長謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
6199.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
6223.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
委員好部長好剛剛聽到你說我在交通委員會我就是為了你來的啦我這個會期就來這裡幾個問題請教我們現在有十幾個友邦嘛推薦一下我們如果國人要去友邦觀光建議哪些我去過是去過帛琉啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
6224.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
6231.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
那梵蒂岡也去啦其他國家我不熟其他國家還有哪些國家是適合我們去觀光的 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
6232.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
6252.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
謝謝委員因為您當過交通局長對於觀光很熟我也當過交通部長對觀光也了解我認為我們有12個邦交國當然也還有像友好的像索馬利蘭等等如果說邦交國我認為要區塊化的話一個當然是拉丁美洲有7個國家那其中瓜貝 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
6255.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
6280.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
瓜地馬拉跟貝里斯是中美洲所以我們很常去LA或是去佛羅里達這些地方我認為是可以延長到瓜貝因為是很不一樣的兩個國家一個英語系 一個西班牙系第二個我要講的是三聖聖路西亞 聖文森 聖克里斯托布尼維斯另外一個是南美洲可以單獨巴拉圭確實南美有另外的風貌然後再來就當然是 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
6281.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
6287.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
太平洋三個國家你總介紹完 我想說你會讀後哪幾個國家我建議這樣 外交部把這12個國家也幫他們做個觀光簡介 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
6298.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
6316.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
讓我們的國人想要去友邦,也知道要去哪裡,去哪裡轉機,安排旅行社有沒有要辦這種團,不然我們就友邦那友邦,不去觀光,都去投資,就是說觀光也是一種消費,投資 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
6318.112 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
6322.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
我們去年台北國際旅遊展已經幫他們設那個攤位那另外一個就是確實包括像雄獅等等他們現在就是從LA準備要攔客到貝里斯我也建議他們掛地碼所以我們會跟旅行社也事實上有一些合作不過您剛講那個測試怎麼樣我們能夠透過我們的網頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
6345.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
6370.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
還有各方式啦 其實我們很多的促銷活動 瓜地馬拉的這個咖啡啦 或是這個芭芭拉粿等就好啦 市長 剛剛馬文君委員在講的登錄啦 登錄抽獎 嗯 如果去這個友邦的齁 抽獎 蓋滿12個 抽獎的帳篷比較大 好 因為登錄去這個友邦的 如果我們有友邦的 那就會鼓勵大家去嘛齁 第二個 集滿12個 印章 好 集滿12個是你的事啦 呵呵呵 好 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
6376.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
6385.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
南韓最近遇到電子入境卡的事看外交部也有一些反應現在又傳出包括丹麥那這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
6389.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
6410.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
不管你們要怎麼做,或者是說設計系統的人在用的時候,那個國民、國家的名字有一點要把我們矮化,那外交部也做了一些相對應的措施那這當然軟硬兼施嘛,也不能說直接要怎樣現在進度怎麼樣,跟國人講一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
6415.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
6431.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
當然最近因為各國電子化政府因為有些不同的系統所以比如說可能簽證是一個然後另外就是護證或其他的相關的部會那它現在電子化之後就產生了 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
6432.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
6447.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
就是要一致 它內部這個時候我們都要去交涉也有一些國家發現因為這個樣子沒有辦法允許我們用原來的但是我們除了表示我們的立場以外繼續積極交涉因此而改變的國家也很多 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
6448.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
6470.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
但是你剛剛提到的所謂南韓政府我們是有跟他交涉因為他去年2月開始就是用電子路徑卡所以我們就必須要在這個時候跟他很交涉就是反映我們的立場以外我想他們已經有聽到了那對等跟尊嚴我們要有一些作為比如你剛剛提到丹麥 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
6471.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
6486.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
因為是兩年前突然間就是他們的這個外交部長就是一個這樣的一個改變造成了我們被矮化那我們當然就交涉那也透過G7國家去溝通那我們也相對的對等 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
6487.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
6507.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
我們就降低他在台灣的外交的特權南非也是這樣子處理我覺得外交就是秉持的這個國家的這個主權跟國民的尊嚴這樣子來做對外事務的交涉第三個我今天看這個報告裡頭啊一期都沒寫到卓院長去日本說私人行程啊 嘿私人行程 所以你們都不寫 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
6515.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
6533.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
我是方面那個台日關係有好交流,但也包括這一項啊,因為副總統,蕭副總統去的你們有特別寫,叫你有關的,叫外交部有關的,蕭副總統那一攤就跟外交部有關係都有關係啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
6534.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
6557.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
都有關係,因為既然私人行程,下去外交部看起來也怪怪的所以很好,我很怕你跟卓院長私人行程,如果私人行程可以下去,連私人行程你也要下去它是有一些外交上的效果啦,這個是必須要很清楚的肯定 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
6559.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
6569.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
對 運動外交也是我們很重要的一部分最後跟你談一下這個中東這一次戰爭的事情我們有一些旅行團在那裡的狀況當然網絡上面就會出現說有一些事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
6578.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
6585.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
像剛才馬文清委員講的,為什麼要去找中國的,才可以回來中國一直在載人,我們都沒有在載人,一直在等,中華民國在幹什麼,外交部在幹什麼旅行團去到中東,他可能是 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
6600.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
6614.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
過境,可能是轉機,有可能是去那裡工作,有些人是要回台灣了,有些人是剛出發就類似上次去阿布達比有沒有,劉建國委員是一團在婚禮的阿布達比去轉機,有一個人他的名怎麼叫,劉建國從頭到尾 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
6623.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
6640.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
聽說都打電話給你,叫你外交部到什麼地方那時候的那些機制,我相信當時在阿布達比那裡的外交我們的同仁也都很積極在處理這些事情這一次,中東站的部門,外交部叫這個觀光署 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
6641.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
6657.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
因為這有時候是旅行團旅行團你現在要改班機叫他換地方做走陸路到別的國家離開那個地方跑要去歐洲玩這牽扯到觀光署牽扯到外交部各式各樣的狀況都有你要不要跟大家講一下接下來這個醫療要不要改進 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
6659.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
6663.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
你如果有一個處長、代表好,車開了,又在那裡開機啊,開機啊,去機場,到三港,台灣人也很感謝嘛,這個過程一定要精進。好,我跟委員報告,外交部就很像台灣的阿信, |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
6674.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
6696.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
我們在外館111個外館很多外館沒有外交特權但我們拚死拚活就是要服務國人那但是剛剛講有一些旅行社的那個團啊他要玩完才要回來所以我們有將近兩個禮拜都是後續後面轉機的團不是原來在當地的啊因為他會給他出門而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
6697.841 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
6702.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
要去杜拜轉機,我回到,他可能九十幾萬,要去澳洲,九十幾萬你說阿媽,你回去,我九十幾萬要回去,誰要陪我,理情社說我沒辦法陪你,現在也沒辦法陪你,不然你住飯店住兩天,越住就越緊張,可能你住飯店旁邊,附近都住了,我就崩潰 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
6719.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
6730.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
有可能這個觀光署在這個過程當中 包括貧寶協會啊這要當成一個過程當中 叫外交部到底你們的合作關係因為國人 包括他們的家人一齣都會有煩惱嘛 他們說要團結啊啊我們中華民國外交部哪都沒在處理 啊他們團的人可能裡面一團二十個 有國會說我們要回去 我們不要去算了 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
6743.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
6745.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
有五個會說我們還要繼續送,有十個會說我們還在這裡等一會這個時候角色是什麼?這齁,就是說很惡心啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
6754.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
6773.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
就是人家找外館也不會分你哪個部會啦可是行政院的機制很重要比如說你剛講的觀光署嘛你掌握旅行社像我有當過交通部長啊你跟旅行社協調出一個好的方法旅行社和華益港灣很好做我們這邊是在地有些都入籍了 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
6775.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
6794.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
比如說我們在這個阿聯酋我們在杜拜結果他是阿布達比在那邊轉機我們的代表齁只會冒著槍林彈雨啊還被車騎去救人上次講那個雲林就是這個例子所以我是覺得大家去了解之後我們這個在中東的處境是特別困難 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
6795.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
6815.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
所以當然我是說政府是一體的啦我們就是總和外交吧所以這個有一些值得我們可以再檢視怎麼去經濟像以色列就做得很好因為以色列面對戰爭不是今天我們那個大使他是陪著我們的國人要撤離的是躲飛彈欸 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
6819.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
6839.159 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
然後還在高下橋下面,那個影片看起來你會不會覺得很心酸的呢?我跟馬文經委說一個很好的事,你要繼續推動,你還做過交通部長就是說我們這些旅行團出去的時候,到底我現在想說,現在全世界,到底現在多少台灣旅行團是國外的?我們的觀光署現在也不知道,我可以這樣說嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
6841.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
6850.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
有幾團有幾個人啦現在此時此刻在外面的旅行團因為我們沒有登錄現在還有人要去杜拜 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
6852.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
6877.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
這幾天旅行團有些還要出去因為我看你們外交部的政府是盡力啦但是也是有限的這個部分可能因為我們現在討論中東局勢國人在問說我們現在到底有多少旅行團在那裡嘛外交部恐怕又要去問我想你可能要問旅行全聯會或是憑保協會 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
6880.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
6881.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
我覺得觀光署可能也不知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
6910.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
6915.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
不分國家啦 種族啦大家都一起來這個人道救援像我們講到所謂的撤僑或護僑 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
6920.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
6941.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
國際也很關心比如台海的局勢這個就是我們共同的目標吧也就是說我們政府都要照顧人民所以這個不分彼此所以反而是我們外交很重要的一個可以說撤僑跟護僑的外交這個我們當然是會好好去精進不斷地去檢討所以現在大家要離開 要有日本的危機 日本的危機有台灣就借台灣嘛要有中國就借中國嘛 這外交部也不會去動啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
6948.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
6975.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
對 賣賣嘛所以這...我們...但是他的選擇對他最好 他才知道嘛中國的飛機你不可以借沒有啦 沒有這個東西嘛就是說他願...這個...那個包機啊 飛機反正可以離開那個區域基本上呢 國人安全是最優先嘛好 所以喔 因為這個...你們的什麼撤離多少人 那些人數啊 每天在統計我跟那個時間點喔 裡面大概慢了一兩天 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
6976.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
6991.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
就是人家在忙的時候 你們才開始慢慢出現 包括電話類似這樣的東西可能一開始國人可能第一天第二天就開始緊張的時候外交部以後要主動我們會檢討這一次整個處理 現在戰爭還在發生中我為了主持視訊會議 我要求往前去檢討之後 趕快 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
6999.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
7006.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
得出改進的措施啊團在那裡的人 我知道沒有那個資訊歐洲團 非洲團 中東團 當然出國的實力很強可能旅行團的家人是台灣嘛 你這訊息如果發出去可能這家人就會傳去外交部 你現在回到那裡有什麼困難 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
7021.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
7034.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
卡在一個電話這樣就會可能主動然後提早看到就可以做這個發佈讓這個訊息更完整啦好 我們會進入這個整個資訊系統通報等等謝謝好 謝謝好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
7041.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
7059.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
我們說的是世界各國大家在那個環境底下大概面臨的狀況都會是一樣的所以我們精進的作為還是希望可以有更多的一個有效的一個資訊提供那接下來請徐巧欣委員上台質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
7070.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
7074.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
謝謝主席 我們有請林佳龍林部長請林部長我也好部長好 我想先問你知道台灣GD是誰嗎有人笑就是你們知道你們果然是外交部的專業同仁不會是你們取的吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
7092.947 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
7119.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
他們有時候這樣叫我是有點害羞啦不好意思因為你是good dragon嘛對不對有人這樣講但我不敢去沾光喔這不是我講的了解了解那但是因為這樣子那我想您對韓國應該很了解也很友善才對對我很多好朋友從學術界到現在那但我也要請教一下就是說從今天開始我們要如何來稱呼韓國勒 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
7122.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
7141.519 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
南韓呢?南韓,好,南韓,OK好那麼呢,好,我們要從這個整個事件開始講起來是在去年12月的時候南韓的電子入境卡把台灣寫成這個台灣China之後呢引起很大的討論那在這個事件出來的時候,我想請問一下我們外交部的第一個做法應該是跟這個南韓這邊的相關的外交部門來做聯繫跟溝通希望他們能夠做調整,對嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
7148.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
7174.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
那對方是給予我們樣子就是在交涉我們先講交涉的這個部分那對方是給予我們什麼樣的一個回應他們本來是二位一號就要統一就沒有紙本統一什麼就是那個就是這個入境那個電子卡電子卡以前還可以用手寫那統一的話就變成是都是寫台灣China的意思就是都用電子入境卡對啊電子入境卡不允許你用手寫的我知道現在他們延後了他們現在還是沒有說把它合併 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
7177.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
7194.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
是 但是沒有啊 因為你電子入境卡上面Taiwan China有被做任何的修正嗎?他們在這個部分 那表示說我們跟他交涉之後啊我們去年底交涉之後 他2月1號齁 呃 是要整合的 他就先放的那我問一下 那你們去交涉的時候 你們只是說 哎呀 這個分開讓我有兩種選擇還是你們是認為說 你交涉的是你的南韓電子入境卡的這個部分 不要寫Taiwan China |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
7203.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
7221.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
對那你剛剛講的那只是就是一種備案而已啊實際上面我們主要訴求人家沒有接受啊他們現在在處理中啊處理中對啊他說他們有了解我們的立場啊然後他們也在這個研究啊好等一下我會再跟你進一步討論說他們他們您剛剛的意思是我們一個一個來 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
7222.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
7245.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
他們現在正在處理中要把南韓電子入境卡上面寫的台灣 China用其他的方式表示您的意思是這樣嗎對 他們就說他們正在研究正在研究 那他有告訴你說要研究多久嗎他們有一個規劃 有一個期程嘛總是要有一個時間點嘛 不然我永遠都在研究 研究100年內結果委員今天的質詢之後 我想他們應該會聽到了沒有 我沒有那麼偉大 我不是台灣GD我沒那麼厲害 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
7247.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
7263.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
沒事 那但是南韓的媒體卻指出呢在南韓的官方文件當中一直都是用台灣China來標註台灣的那這個政府20多年來包含這個其中有8年是蔡英文總統的執政他說我們都沒有提出異議那請問一下南韓的媒體這樣子報導是有符合事實嗎還是過去其實我們有經過多次的抗議但對方沒有去做改善呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
7273.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
7286.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
這個是確實韓國一直這樣但是他現在是就是所謂的目的地跟他旅遊的上一站他把它用成China包含台灣所以這個是新制 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
7288.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
7294.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
心智是從什麼時候開始 因為它要電磁化所以就要整合 去年二月整合是它原本本來有一個 但它有兩種辦法它現在本來要改成只有一種辦法那我先不談紙本的部分 我針對的是電子入境的部分那南韓的媒體它的報導是說因為如果南韓媒體講的是錯的 那我覺得我們也有責任在這裡公開告訴他們說你們這樣報導是不實的 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
7313.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
7328.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
那他們的說法是說呢南韓的電子入境卡不講紙本喔一直以來都是用這樣的一個方式去做標註那你們都還說我們20多年來都沒有意見現在突然對我有意見過去都有意見只是沒有像我這麼樣的清楚直接有力的表達懂你的意思所以就是說過去確實有提出異議但是林佳龍部長是對於這個事情最強而有力去表達的 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
7339.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
7343.768 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
因為他去年二月開始就在我上任外交部長然後他要把整合啊那整合就會連這個空間都沒有的時候我們當然要表達立場他也聽到了他也暫緩了我們不能因為他暫緩我們就不做我們該做的所以我們該做的就是呢所謂的反制措施也不是反制啦就是如實的紀錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
7362.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
7377.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
不是啦 我們反制措施是把韓喬拘留證改成南韓嘛那原本是怎麼寫 現在改成怎麼寫跟大家說明一下好不好就是第一步啦 因為他們其實南韓政府曾經跟我們拜託嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
7379.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
7389.101 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
就是以前最早的時候都用南韓然後呢後來變成韓國然後現在我們就說你這樣子對我那我要再叫你南韓是這個意思所以他給我們這個對不起校長China 台灣所以我給你Korea South你是這個意思是對等跟尊嚴對等跟尊嚴好有底氣那再來就是說呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
7406.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
7419.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
他們電子的不改我們改用紙本那這個也是屬於我們反制行為的一環嗎應該是說我們交涉啦我們其實我們是希望說這個東西能夠大家有一個解決的方法他也說聽到他也暫緩把它整合了 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
7422.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
7436.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
對啊所以這個就有時間來談但是我們3月1號因為是基於超支在我們的部分我知道我想要問的是我們用了哪一些我們用了哪一些的手段方式然後去宣傳說大家不要用電子入境卡都要用紙本沒有啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
7436.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
7443.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
就是有這個選項至少還維持有些人想用台灣還可以用台灣那你有沒有建議嘛因為這也是報導報的如果他說電子化就沒有這個空間了對 這個你剛剛講過了我現在在講的是說呢因為現在有電子的嘛然後跟紙本的嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
7454.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
7462.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
那外交部是否有建議國人不要使用電子入境卡而改填紙本這個報導的這個標題是否屬實那具體是怎麼樣呢你所理解的是怎麼樣那如果說對於China括號台灣我們有些國人他很有他的立場他有另外一個選項 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
7477.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
7494.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
所以你沒有建議他要改資本只是說如果你個人覺得那你不想要用這個方式的話那你就填資本這個人的程式是這樣子但在國家的程式我跟他交涉就是基於說你必須要尊重台灣然後用可識別最簡單就是這個我清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
7496.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
7502.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
那剛剛講到嘛那我們現在呢就要把這個喬韓的居留證你說以前我們叫你南韓現在後來呢這個韓國政府請託我們就叫你韓國好那現在呢我要把你改回這個Korea括號South南韓那部長您今天接受媒體訪問的時候你覺得這個會有效還是有效在哪個地方可不可以再具體幫我們解釋就是說你們是怎麼評估評估它會有效的那有效是有什麼效 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
7523.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
7528.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
有沒有效當然我們先表達我們的立場交涉中他也聽到了也做了初步先暫緩合併這個紙本跟電子卡但是呢進一步我們也設定了一個時間3月11號我們希望說他有具體他得出來到底研究的結果是如何所以他有跟您訂一個時間點就是3月11號我們訂的我們交涉的時候給他一個時間點我們下一步 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
7549.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
7554.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
3月31號會有進一步我們的作為都有先知會他所以是這樣子我們給對方的Deadline叫做3月11號那如果3月11號對方就是還是這樣子3月31號3月31號對 因為我想11號已經過了Sorry3月31號所以我們給對方一個Deadline叫做3月31號 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
7572.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
7585.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
那如果對方還是依然顧我沒有把韓國的這個入境標示卡去做調整的話我們還要再有進一步的動作是這樣嗎是那你們已經 我不問你喔我們跨部會有協商過給你到時候時間宣布這個我就不直接去問你反正3月31號之後我們就知道了嘛但是總之你們已經準備好新一波的這個反制作為等到3月31號不如我們預選的時候我們要推出來是這個意思嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
7599.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
7619.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
我們交涉中啦當然我們相信對方已經有表達他有知道我們的意見對方有沒有成功我還不是很確定喔你這個也不是現在講說成功就成功因為這個所言甚是啦因為這種外交的事情都不是單方面能夠決定因為很難講嘛因為我們看一下喔這個給大家看一下這個是呢今天我要來跟部長講因為雖然你是台灣之第一但你不見得有在看韓國的這個論壇 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
7626.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
7640.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
那這個呢FM Korea網站呢它是韓國的一個大型的綜合網路社團就有點像我們的PTT或是Dcard那他們因為台灣祭出這樣的一個措施之後其實給予了很多對台灣的這個負面評價 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
7642.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
7644.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
那裡面呢當然我們台灣有這個網友講話有時候比較酸然後可能比較直接那韓國當然也一樣這個世界各國的公民都一樣所以呢比如我一個一個念部長你不要介意這部我寫的一 完全沒有打擊感 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
7659.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
7665.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
二不是說南韓嗎英文標示是South Korea那又怎樣改了又怎樣背景那些改了嗎他們發表的時候不是也是中國台灣嗎完全沒被戳到干我什麼事連對中國都不敢吭一聲的傢伙們那是一樣的道理啊哈哈你想做什麼就做什麼啊就算是倒台灣那邊的傢伙說到骨子裡還是中國啦戰爭爆發的時候你們終究還是得向別人尋求協助但你們認為你們現在的態度正確嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
7687.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
7708.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
我念這些的意思是說我們在做這個調整之後對於韓國的民眾來說似乎對台灣開始產生一些敵意而且這一些的內容不是說這個是什麼中國大陸的這個認知作戰或是什麼中共的人然後在那邊寫這個基本上韓國很多民眾確實就我們想嘛你像報告委員啊這個是假的 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
7713.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
7724.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
韓國的名義我充分掌握你意思說這上面的人都是假的韓國的年輕年輕人都很支持基於對等尊嚴尊重台灣用我們的名字你怎麼知道是誰告訴你說這是假的我都有搜尋資料後來中共大陸大力的介入開始發動網路作戰認知戰所以有一些想要去扭曲其實這件事情是相對來講其實是很清楚的我們就是說你幫我們就是變成中國台灣這個事情我們有意見嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
7742.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
7764.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
所以基本上大部分的人都是支持的包括韓國人你怎麼知道大部分的人都是支持的南韓的人也都很支持你怎麼知道他們都是支持的我有在搜尋啊你有搜尋啊你搜尋到的節目但是後來因為有一波大量的認知作戰進來所以你認為說洗過了啦因為你不能講說是假的因為這些人他可能是真的有這個障就是說確實在論壇上 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
7766.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
7771.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
那個部長我跟你講確實在論壇上有這樣的討論但是你可以認為說這一些討論是來自於你認為是中國大陸他們來做的認知作戰那你不能講說這個是假的因為我今天不可能說沒有出現的東西我自己做一個假的論壇然後我來這邊然後跟你實習一個假的東西我只是問你說為什麼他們會有這樣子的一個討論所以部長您的意思是你覺得 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
7792.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
7804.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
南韓的民眾其實是支持我們現在的反制作為然後甚至因此要求希望他們的政府能夠去改善他的電子入境卡的標示方式而在網路上這一些論壇上面有不同意見的 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
7808.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
7823.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
韓國所謂的韓國民眾是因為中共他們在透過認知作戰介入所以才會有的內容是這樣我再為你簡單講第一時間以及我們先前掌握的資訊其實大部分人是覺得這件事情就尊重台灣的立場 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
7824.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
7848.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
但是後來確實有介入 這個境外的這個部分不是說是假的 而是說它有網路作戰在操作中的那最後就是呢 那台灣的媒體也有很多因為我跟你講 因為我比較時事求是所以我是直接去南韓的這個網站上面去看他們的討論但是呢 在台灣我們也有許多的媒體他們的報導是這樣 比如我隨便找一篇叫做 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
7849.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
7867.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
外交部被嗆爆反制韓國改稱南韓遭韓網集體狂酸自卑作祟這些就是台灣媒體的標題那你有什麼想要跟台灣媒體說的嗎因為如果你認為這個是一個中共的認知作戰那台灣的媒體也跟進報導的話那是不是也被認知作戰 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
7868.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
7872.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
有時候不小心會被他利用所以你現在是呼籲大家也相信媒體他應該有判斷的這個能力因為這個論壇裡面相關的這個瀏覽人士其實超過49萬那留言數是900多則所以當然我們台灣的媒體也會注意到那可能也會去報導或是引用 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
7890.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
7905.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
但是呢今天部長您的說法是說所以我才在這裡講的比較直接一點所以您的說法就是說你所了解的情況這些人是少數中的少數而且是受到中共他們的這個介入所以才會有這樣的一個發言應該說中共已經發動認知作戰但是不代表說裡面的每一個留言都是來治癒這樣亡群 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
7913.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
7926.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
那最後一個問題就是說3月31號如果韓國沒有去修改電子入境卡我們會提出比什麼改成Korea South更加強烈的一個外交的 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
7928.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
7946.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
對峙的一個措施我們期待我們的交涉對方也已經有收到也在研究我們就給對方一些時間我要講的是說最壞的打算最好的打算當然是就我們外交部去協商的事情都能夠成功我也祝福外交部能夠成功但是我作為一個立法委員在這裡監督我還是要問那最壞的打算我們3月31號我提出的那具體的作為一定是比 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
7952.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
7960.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
現在只是單純就說你把我改名我也把你改名這樣子的一個措施更加更加的劇烈程度上面提高強度是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
7961.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
7987.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
我們目前就是一步一步來可是你剛剛都講到一半你話都已經講一半大家都聽到了我們現在只是改的是他那個所謂的僑民拘留證是完全是我們自己的我們還沒有去更改這一個所謂的路徑的登錄的了解了那我大概了解你的意思了那也希望這個交涉能夠一切順利好不好謝謝謝謝部長謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
7993.232 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
8002.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
好 謝謝接下來我們先行宣告待會兒王安祥委員質詢完畢以後休息五分鐘我們現在請沈伯陽委員上台質詢謝謝主席 有請部長 謝謝請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
8027.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
8042.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
最近外交有所突破但是我想提另外一件事情就是我們的女主這一次在澳洲比賽的時候發生了一些打壓的現象比如說她喊台灣加油 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
8048.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
8063.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
這個被請出場那又有呢這一個所謂他這個是因為美國職棒以前大都會有那個台灣日嘛所以他是穿那個台灣日的那個衣服那結果呢因為台灣日的衣服背後就只有印台灣而且是英文台灣那這個球衣也被要求要拿下來 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
8063.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
8089.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
那我就想說當然其實我看到後來這個全場球迷還是喊聽台灣提喊得很大聲那這整件事情其實說真的我們理論上澳洲對我們來講也是友善的國家那在想到底是第一線的這個工作人員對於這些規則他有一些自己的解讀那還是說我們在事前有沒有什麼可以以後防範像這樣的一個事情發生不然的話這其實也是在破壞兩個國家的關係 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
8091.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
8106.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
而是中共他長期在外國去要求甚至是解釋包括跟奧運或者其他的運動比賽其實這並不是他那樣子他也是一個認知作戰為什麼不能叫台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
8108.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
8131.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
為什麼在觀眾席人家比較不干擾比賽人家要穿什麼衣服這是一個民主社會自然會尊重的一個社會這不是政府要去介入的可是中共就會去要求他有些進入單項或那個委員會因為中共在國際組織包括運動的這些協會都有很大的力量他在控制為什麼今天就是聯合國周邊組織都被中共控制他長期把祕書處佔領 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
8133.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
8146.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
所以是這個問題變成很多是變成是受他影響有些人不了解狀況每一個事件發生我們就要趕快去交涉也是一個機會交易那以澳洲這一次來看你看他們澳洲人的反應就很自然支持台灣就是台灣他們 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
8148.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
8163.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
一些運動的這個協會或是主辦單位他也會知道他也會去權衡或有時候會稍微有一個空間他就念一念跟中共交代但是你要怎麼去揮旗子穿衣服那剩下來就是你的自由 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
8164.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
8184.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
我是覺得一個自由的社會會有這樣的空間只要你不干擾比賽大家會加油像博士受邀訪去表演的原住民團隊一下子可以一下子不可以主辦單位也很失禮他們私底下都會說抱歉可是公開因為老共就盯著每一個人像是在法國辦奧運的時候滿場的人他們都坐在那邊他這一種所謂的 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
8190.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
8217.754 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
這個所謂的這個跨境的這種管轄跟鎮壓無所不在所以這個是我們機會教育所以台灣人要有這樣的一個我們要如果很清楚機會來了我們怎麼樣去處理讓國際知道中共的那一種做法其實是沒有什麼依據的是因為他這個久了之後就按照他的方法大家不想去得罪他我們就委屈那委屈也無法求全所以我們就是做我們該做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
8218.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
8241.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
剛剛替部長的回答我覺得當然就是兩個軸線第一個軸線就是說因為畢竟對方是用政治去干預這場運動那當然一定會造成對方的反感那我們在這個之前去做溝通的時候也一樣啊對方也覺得說那就是你們兩個國家的政治所以我們當然會有一個fine line要特別的小心就是我們盡量能夠事前溝通這是一定的第二個 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
8242.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
8262.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
剛剛我覺得第二條軸線剛剛部長提到的我覺得很重要就是我們要去凸顯也就是說它的打壓已經成為了一個既成事實它就是一定會做這件事我們也預判得了它做這件事那我們不如讓大家知道這件事情的發生所以越讓大家知道其實澳洲人民一樣就是他們的人民反而是會反感的 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
8263.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
8284.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
這是另外一種反向的操作所以我不是每一次都一定要是跟他硬碰硬但是我們後續的這一個處理反而去凸顯這個中國的阿爸我覺得這件事情是非常重要那這個就拜託外交部總和外交就是人人都是外交官隨時隨地一有機會當然為台灣發聲但是也要有智慧的處理所以這個之後就拜託外交部能夠協調懸橫 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
8287.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
8309.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
那當然大家都會期待我們政府啦就是但是我們我們就是大家跟各界一起來因應那剛剛也是就是大家都很關心就是說這一個目前來講韓國這個以前只是在去年就已經開始這樣的事情我看媒體朋友其實也問過很多次那我們在每一次回答的時候也都是告訴這個媒體說在交涉當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
8310.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
8334.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
就是我們畢竟不想要去破壞兩個國家的外交關係那這個因為丹麥這一個政府核發給台灣人的這個拘留證那這個也出現了這個矮化的這個現象那因為剛剛韓國已經被討論很久我想知道就是在其他國家的情形比如說像剛剛提到的丹麥的情形我們目前的狀況處理的狀況如何我想丹麥政府也不希望格林蘭變成美國的 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
8335.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
8359.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
那為什麼要把台灣變成中國的所以我們的交涉很有道理他們是躲起來就是他們有一個外交官很堅持其實他們政府大部分人都覺得國會議員也覺得為什麼要這樣之類的我看丹麥人民的反應也是應該如此才對所以他反而可能有一些個別的外交官可能做出相關的決定我們就要給他壓力所以我們也去交涉G7 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
8360.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
8382.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
很多國家也都覺得這個歐盟大部分的國家都很正常的啊為什麼你要去給人家改成China國號台灣或什麼這個居留證就突然去改你的依據是什麼嘛就是亂解釋一通啦現在一中連則已經都在北京亂解釋啦大家你看2758號決議為什麼人家很多國家歐盟包括G7都不講 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
8383.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
8397.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
現在連一中政策都不講因為會被混淆成一中原則一中不一中是中國的事我們台灣就是台灣這是川普總統講的台灣是台灣所以我是覺得為什麼用台灣有罪嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
8398.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
8425.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
用台灣不行嗎台灣是個很中性的名詞啊所以我們已經退無可退啊是在這個情況之下我們得到國際的支持因為每個人很自然都會講台灣嘛你講全台北就很奇怪但是因為有些國際組織我們參加用那個名字可是你如果要擴張解釋裡面都不能出現連台灣大學也不能出現嗎National也不行台灣也不行那就變成University |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
8426.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
8444.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
這真的很奇怪 誇張啦全世界都認為說他就是霸凌啊 中共啊因為久了之後大家都 對不對就像俄羅斯對不對 兩頭得寸進尺今天就是打了烏克蘭 下一國要打哪裡那中國要欺負台灣 霸凌台灣那下一國哩 菲律賓嗎 日本嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
8446.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
8473.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
所以大家現在都知道這個問題不是在台灣在中國我相信這個部長這樣的一個態度在國際上我認為是非常重要那我們長久以來這一個中國的打壓我們大概是已經忍受了非常的久那目前世界各國慢慢對這件事情尤其你看在這個總和外交的狀況之下認知的人越來越多我們在之前質詢的時候也一直不斷的強調我們除了面對這些什麼智庫啦政府官員之外人民真的很重要那現在很多國家的人民對這個是有認知的 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
8475.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
8494.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
那當然在越來越多人站起來這個反作用力一定還是在本來很習慣於中國打壓的跟中國在那邊好來好去的有利益交換的這些一定都還存在而這一些人還是會不斷地冒出來那我們用這樣的一個堅決的態度就是要告訴他們我們是不會退讓的謝謝部長這樣的一個態度那接下來海建 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
8495.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
8519.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
事情就是就是剛剛前面應該很多委員都有問到就是這一次我們在這個杜拜我們去做這些相關的協助啦反國啦那這個部長應該也知道中國在這邊做手腳嘛就跟關西機場那時候一模一樣嘛他想要去製造一些假資訊啊等等之類的我認為這一次政府的應對是很快的比如說一開始最早的有多少人要協助請他們填表單後來的關懷卡我覺得這個部分看起來是應對得當 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
8525.282 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
8545.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
我現在擔心的是我看到有這一個這一個也是當時的這個僑胞他有出來拍了一部影片這部影片現在這個也是近30萬的觀看他在指出一個問題就是說當時這一個我們的大使館的人員在凌晨4點的時候來迎接國人 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
8545.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
8559.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
那就可以看到這個下方這個畫面這個是華視新聞的畫面裡面就有講到說這一個我們的僑民也非常的開心說謝謝這個大使給予台灣人這個溫暖的照顧看起來是很好的一件事情嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
8561.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
8584.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
結果呢在另外一台新聞他就發現一樣的畫面講的完全不一樣另外一個畫面在右邊叫受購外交部然後呢這一個呢累翻這一個呢逃難之旅終於落幕所以這個受購外交部這一個很明顯就是明明就是同樣的一個場合同樣的一個畫面但我們的新聞呈現變得完全不同 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
8585.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
8606.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
那我說當然新聞有它新聞的觀點台灣各式各樣什麼樣的新聞都有有些跟中國站在一起的新聞是多得很但是新聞還是要根據事實所以我想知道當時的事實到底是什麼報告員就是我們的駐外的管處的外交官即使沒有外交特權我們都是拼命 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
8607.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
8630.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
在就是幫助國人那有些資訊怎麼樣去獲得因為發生戰爭不是我們希望看到可是這時候一個人當然我們政府有政府在這個是大家比較安心可是每一個人怎麼樣去做處置這個資訊我們能夠把資訊網先建立起來這個才能夠應變所以我剛剛講有兩種人一種人是居住在當地國家的甚至入籍的台灣人 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
8631.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
8652.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
台商 或者是留學生 另外是旅客因為這些資訊大量的是我們必須要掌握不然的話我們也不知道怎麼去幫忙至於說幫忙 因為有一些地方 舟車 勞動很遠到了之後我們的外交官也一樣進不去因為我們有些沒有外交豁免或特權這個時候有一些體諒 我們也互相體諒 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
8654.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
8675.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
所以我都跟我的同仁講說我們做什麼除了做之外也要讓社會知道所以後來才有這些影片陸續有一些旅客或者是台灣人他們就把它拍上去我照片我就說你拿到這個也要分享因為分享大家才知道我們有政府在在那個地方所以這些事情就是有時候難免 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
8678.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
8706.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
損失有一定比例我們沒有照顧到我們趕快來補救我也是用這個心情跟我們駐外人員講我們不是萬能的但一遇到國人有狀況他有一些處境我們要設身處地同理心我又跟同仁講所以我們去幫忙他讓他比較安心一點所以我想後來大家看到的就是我們外交部在做的事情不只是說到機場到學校到有一些地方去關心也了解然後也協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
8707.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
8709.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
我覺得這件事情外交部是非常的辛苦 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
8711.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
8737.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
大家知道外交部的辛苦這件事情我覺得反而是重要的因為如果你不讓大家知道外交部在這件事情辛苦的過程其他的東西就會一直冒出來就是不斷地在作戰不斷地去告訴你說這個外交部有多無能這個對我們來講會是一個非常大的傷害所以尤其是就過往都發生過有這樣的一個外界就是帶風向 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
8738.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
8753.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
然後帶風向的形成那個批評之後呢結果這個批評到最後又落入到這一個我們基層同仁的身上我覺得這個是一定我們要避免的那我相信剛剛部長在捍衛我們台灣的主權捍衛中華民國的主權的時候已經講得很清楚我們不會這個中國的打壓 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
8754.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
8783.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
我們在國內也是一樣我覺得國內有太多是跟著在中國硬核的一群人我們也一樣我們不能夠去畏懼這樣的一個打壓我們不能夠畏懼這樣的一個抹黑事實是什麼我們把它講清楚讓大家知道外交部現在的困難然後外交部現在也的確有預算還沒審嘛對不對就是這都是問題那但是我們在這一個有限的預算之下該做的能做的然後要補足的外交部都會去做這個拜託外交部再多多push出去 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
8783.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
8797.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
我再跟委員回應一下我們外交部有很大改善的空間我們要不斷去精進因為有時候發生事情但是我們有做的也要會講剛剛委員有提到因為這個也會涉及到我們或後續再比較好做那這一個發生這種 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
8798.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
8815.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
危機啦這種第一時間每一個人的情況我們怎麼樣去掌握資訊我想只要是在在地不管經商留學或已經入籍的我相信幾乎我不敢講百分之百可能90%以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
8816.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
8842.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
我們都有建立聯絡所以在第一個時間像我們的這些外館都馬上就會發訊當然有時候通訊不行那會有一些要去解決的問題可是旅客啦過境有時候怎麼樣會是能夠對他們有幫助而他們也能夠幫助自己我們一起來面對這種危機讓他們每一個人都可以平安好 謝謝部長那後續我就在下一次的這個夜報我可能再來詢問謝謝主席 謝謝部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
8849.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
8850.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
王安祥委員上台質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
8874.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
8896.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
我想因為我從學界來其實我都了解在學術界Official的部分其實外交非常非常困難包括我們協助一些像NGO的組織的參與其實也面臨很多困難所以我今天大概就想要特別提到一下所謂的Culture文化外交的部分就我的經驗來說我覺得這個部分是台灣非常非常強的一個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
8897.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
8921.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
所以希望台灣能夠利用這個文化外交能夠勇敢的走出去而且就我接觸很多外國人他們其實都說非常非常喜歡台灣我想部長應該認同這個我們應該好好發揮文化外交是那這個因為前幾天這個總職學院也有韓委員提到就是有關於這個台灣review這個刊物的這個停刊好像跟這個數位化有關係不曉得部長是不是要藉機跟大家說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
8922.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
8939.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
對 因為我想數位匯流嘛內容很重要平台是可以多平台所以我們也要因應AI時代所以我們也在做一些就是新興科技的應用包括數位科技所以有關過去都是利用紙本第一個紙本你發了出去嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
8940.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
8963.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
如果發布出去的話印了那麼多堆積在那裡再來就是說那個內容怎麼樣與時俱進甚至現在可以用AI去傳播所以我想兩方面一個是內容很重要另外一個就是它的媒介也很重要我們看到很多部長個人的網頁其實流量非常非常高 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
8964.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
8980.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
我們常常很多官方的網頁其實這個流量其實不是這麼高所以有關於剛剛我們必須要透過這種所謂的數位化的方式來傳播也請部長多多留意說怎麼樣透過這種比較official或是比較民間的力量來傳遞這個相關我們台灣的一些文化的訊息這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
8980.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
9003.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
我再提供委員資料就是這兩年來我們在點閱或者是我們官網這個跟我個人的網頁當然也會互相連動怎麼去代中英文的啦那剛剛講的各種多語言我們怎麼樣就是說因為現在的包括中央社啦台灣Plus很多新的這個他們也在做這個工作的時候我們也要跟他一起來看怎麼樣分工合作過去我們在學校常常說 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
9004.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
9024.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
內容最重要每一屆可能只是輔助的功能所以接下來我就想要跟部長討論一下其實有關於我們實際上到底怎麼樣定義台灣的品牌到底什麼東西可以代表台灣接下來我們可能就來看一下過去我們知道現在外交部其實跟文化部有一些合作就我剛剛說的文化外交 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
9024.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
9037.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
我們當然也非常樂見只是我們可能要討論一下到底什麼樣的內容比較適合現在台灣文化的一個主體那接下來就前幾天的新聞曾經的新聞就是這個檀香山的狀況是不是部長借這個機會跟大家說明一下這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
9043.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
9064.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
我們這個是因為外交部有一個台美會的資產那我們已經跟這個檀香商市政府已經見面了他們要做都市更新我們要積極的來參與這個是一個Downtown Area是一個非常重要的因為疫情的關係就沒落了我們認為這是一個很好的可以共同開發的案子 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
9065.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
9092.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
他們現在的態度也覺得好像媒體的報導好像對我們有一些都停留在先前的階段因為他們那個市長寫了很多信當然有一些單位並沒有去回回復的很好那我是從去年開始就積極的跟他們希望說共同來開發是 所以部長說這個問題已經解決了嗎就是他們要弄一家公司已經雙方面已經有一個共識要來做都市更新來一起開發好 我們也很樂見 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
9093.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
9120.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
接下來我們就剛剛我一直提到文化的軟實力我認為台灣的最強的部分部長是不是可以跟大家藉由這個機會說一下大概部長覺得我們文化外交我們現在最強的文化實力是什麼文化外交是總和外交非常重要特別是對於民主國家他們很尊重甚至喜愛多元的文化所以你看我有個歐洲專案之後你看為什麼故宮到捷克去展到法國去展 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
9120.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
9148.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
那我們的部門的官員也可以到嘛因為對他們來講這個就是一個文化交流甚至到了維也納我也可以去這個愛樂廳去聽然後到了義大利羅馬一樣我們幽靈神谷的這個表演我意思是說文化是世界可以說共同語言而且文化強調的是多樣性多元文化嘛大家互相欣賞只有中共啊它是沒有允許多元文化所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
9149.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
9169.3 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
用文化外交對比比中國現在的這種戰狼外交我們最走得出去所以去年在歐洲專案我們找文化界包括文化部一起來整合我們既然有一些表演團體甚至金管會現在也發函我們的企業補助文化團體出國表演也可以適用於ESG可以抵稅 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
9170.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
9183.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
再來就是文化外交我們那個主題叫From Tech to CultureTaiwan Leads the Future因為台灣不是只有在德國半導體的投資我們的文化其實跟他們是互補的謝謝部長因為時間的關係所以剛剛沒有錯部長一直在強調這個所謂的多元 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
9187.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
9210.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
那所以很多其實台灣現在很多對外國人的印象其實很多我們傳統的一些東西像一些宮廟像一些我們的這個這個比較傳統的東西還有行李對所以我覺得就是因為台灣現在很容易就被扣上這個統戰的這個概念這種紅帽子所以我也是希望就是我們有一個有一個很清楚的概念怎麼樣區隔我們跟這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
9212.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
9224.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
這個對岸的這樣子的一個文化差異這幾年其實台灣有發展自己的一個模式我覺得都已經非常不一樣了這個問很多來台灣的外國人問他們要不要改學他們就會告訴我們說他們喜歡台灣這樣子的一個有理非常非常而且先去傳統的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
9229.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
9246.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
那部長應該同意我這樣的說法非常同意他們會愛上台灣大部分都是在體驗台灣多元文化台灣的人情味以外其實我們對於不管族群文化先來後到或是世界像當代的這些精緻的文化台灣都可以兼容並需所以跟我其實有關於這種 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
9248.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
9259.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
就東方的文化其實我們也可以搶這個主導權不要都一直在挨打基本上可以看到這一頁投影片我們先日本還是哈韓像Korea Japan或者是Korean Rave這種其實在國際上都蠻有名的我們今天是不是來討論一下部長覺得台灣有沒有什麼很好我覺得這一陣子因為大家打棒球 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
9271.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
9287.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
這個聽台灣其實應該是不錯的一個品牌不知道部長有沒有什麼新的想法確實我們現在請除了跟文化部合作以外我們把文化界我們台灣外交部有一個叫做品牌優化的一個小組所以怎麼樣去做台灣Branding |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
9288.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
9299.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
然後怎麼反映在我們的禮品我們的這個空間的佈置甚至我們辦的活動裡面好像去年我們那個所謂的這個歐洲台灣文化年我們的那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
9302.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
9323.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
一個Logo就是用羅馬柱再加上台灣的晶片形成的一個像歐洲的這種神殿那個得到非常大的一個評價我再分享給我們外委會每一個委員那是一個很好的品牌化的一個例子所以我們在進行就是台灣這個跟世界要交朋友裡面文化是共同的語言 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
9324.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
9348.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
而且可以創造一些差異化避免被對岸的打壓這個就是日本文化外交的策略我也希望說就文化外交部分希望外交部能夠琢磨更多因為好像剛剛很多前面的委員提到所謂的編制、外館、駐典部分的人員比如像文化類的,剛剛部長說很多類的 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
9351.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
9378.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
這個外交部可以在他們那裡一下就可以主導很多的事情其實我們國傳司也在做轉型因為以前我當過行政新聞局長就負責國家品牌跟行銷後來當了交通部長負責觀光署那也是跟品牌有關的台灣的形象然後在外交部現在我們總和外交所以跟文化部有形成一個文化外交我們的一個小組也把文化界的專家弄進來所以這個確實 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
9380.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
9406.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
我們認為台灣傳統外交我覺得有兩個部分一個是現在之外是科技外交跟文化外交是兩個最走出去到世界我們能夠走出去的所以我就提到因為剛剛前面也有委員提到這個南非這個事情現在剛剛部長好像說還在協商那接下來因為好像有提到這一類的東西像這個我們的晶片外交是不是接下來有一些這樣子的一些策略 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
9407.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
9425.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
我們從來不以我們的台灣的我們的不管科技文化作為武器可是當對方這個沒有平等待我們的時候比如說我們在推動這個半導體所謂的信賴的供應鏈那為什麼我們除了跟美日歐以外比如說菲律賓是 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
9426.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
9441.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
它在地緣上它也是面對中國的威脅那它也跟美國比較親近所以這個時候我們怎麼樣把半導體的供應鏈把菲律賓納進來所以晶片是可以作為促進龍幫計畫但是有些國家對我們很不好那我們不用是一廂情願 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
9443.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
9451.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
去迎合他那我們當然會有親疏遠近這也是我在印尼他有一個很大的雜誌跟報紙跟電視採訪我的時候我們會對於平等待我是國家啦我們絕對是會加倍的 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
9458.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
9477.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
來去珍惜然後來去了解剛剛前面委員在提到這個南韓的部分我想我這個意見基本上就是因為現在有很多啦對我們不是非常友善的那也顯然不能夠把這些都想進去跟委員補充一下是在十年前南韓政府跟我們拜託交涉 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
9478.768 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
9506.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
我們用大韓民國啦但是很多國家也是用South Korea或Korea括號South那這個其實是一個我們的立場他也了解我相信我們也期待啦我們對台灣海洋關係是可以很好的不管在這個產業上在文化上可是這個對我們國家的這個不管是尊嚴或國人的這個他的一個尊重啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
9506.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
9523.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
好 感謝部長所以最後我就是把我剛剛講的再中整一下大概就這幾項包括我們的文化外交的總要戰略還有我們定位我剛剛說的希望能夠跨部會合作那請部長多多再來拓展我們的外交是好 謝謝維恩好 謝謝我們現在先休息五分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
9904.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
9909.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
好 請各位就座 我們繼續開會接下來請黃建斌委員上台質詢好 謝謝 稍微我們有請林家永部長請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
9937.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
9938.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
喂哈 伯弟弟好 伯長好 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
9939.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
9967.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
部長那個近期因為這個美國跟伊朗的衝突升高那中東地區的這個安全情勢持續的緊張許多國家都密切的關注他們當地的這個公民的安全問題因為當戰爭區域衝突發生的時候如何確保海外的公民他的安全是政府最基本也是最重要的責任那對於身處海外的台灣人而言在局勢 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
9968.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
9988.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
不穩定的情況之下 他們關心的就是一件事真的有一天發生異化的時候 我們的政府能不能領領 能不能安全 得到我們的處 這樣那一直本市這邊要關心的重點就是我國在面對海外衝突或戰爭風險的時候 是不是具備完整也清楚的這個撤僑或撤離的這個機制 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
9989.594 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
10013.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
那本市有注意到最近中地區台灣旅客這個撤離的事件在社會上引發了不少的這個討論那有媒體有報導就是在這一次事件有兩個台灣人在巴林搭乘日本政府安排的包機離開當地那我們外交部都要表示說這展現我們台日之間的這個禁忌時刻的互相扶持的友誼 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
10015.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
10033.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
只要是任何國家願意在危急的時候對需要幫助我們台灣人來伸出援手我覺得我們都要心存感謝因為對現在生在國外的國人來說最重要的就是安全的回家但是另外一方面有媒體在報導說有七十幾個 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
10034.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
10062.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
台灣的旅客因為中東班機取消滯留在海外就是旅行社這個事件嘛那也是透過後來是透過這個中國大陸方面的協調跟安排然後經過上海轉機返回台灣那最後這件事情相關單位表示是說從網路的訊號判斷這可能涉及所謂的認知作戰本想要請教部長就是說一樣都是協助我們台灣的人民離開危險區域一樣都是讓國人安全的回家為什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
10063.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
10078.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
日本的協助撤離是友誼共互助那中國大陸這邊的協助會被認知是認定是認知作戰我想政府在面對撤僑或撤離國人這件事情應該是以人民的安全為最高的原則 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
10080.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
10107.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
應該不是正題的角度來看這個事情所以本身也注意到我們中央社這個報導我們外交部表示這個在中地區還有79名台灣人需要協助離境那我想既然外交部我們都掌握這樣的數據本身想要請教部長就是我們政府目前是不是已經建立好完整的撤僑評估跟應變機制那如果局勢持續惡化我們政府是不是有具體的撤離方案 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
10108.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
10134.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
好 報告委員 確實政府有不管是撤僑或護僑的標準作業程序那經由這一次中東的戰爭也是一個檢驗那我們也不斷地在改進那至於說您剛剛提到其實日本 那當然他因為他的這個包機的這個空位有先諮詢我們的需求所以我們政府有協助促成至於中國他並沒有 那個是轉機 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
10136.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
10163.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
是去上海中國是說的多做的幾乎沒有啦如果去了解在中東的僑民他們都認為台灣做的比他們中國的大使館好太多倍了但是呢我們不是在計較我是說救人優先如果當事人有需要提供什麼服務可是有時候正在戰爭中連一些機場都關了航空公司他也沒有飛的時候那我們怎麼樣讓我們的國人了解他也比較安心不然他會緊張部長其實本協議是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
10165.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
10187.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
把人安全帶回來是最重要的另外一個讓我更關心到我們這次的外交部次長吳志忠部長在接受媒體訪問的時候說中東地區空域關閉因此外交部先讓僑胞留在當地並且提到其他國家也沒有撤僑 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
10190.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
10207.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
我們在面對海外戰爭衝突或戰爭風險的時候撤僑的標準到底是什麼是依據戰爭的風險評估來做還是依據空域是不是有開放還是要依據其他國家是不是有啟動撤僑或撤離才來做這些判斷 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
10210.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
10228.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
報告委員因為所謂撤僑就涉及到行政院跨部會也有一個機制在處理因為包括交通工具包括當地是不是落地那我們外交部可以做的很重要所以於就是說我們當地的國人的一個關心跟整個調查瞭解說瞭解他們的需求 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
10229.685 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
10246.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
那我們的第一時間的了解是這一些僑民並沒有表現這樣的需求至於說過境的旅客那也涉及到怎麼樣去他們的需要到時候空域放不開是最重要我們跟當地國的交涉因為這個時間都涉及到一些這個空域的這個問題這個安全應該也涉及到主權啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
10255.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
10272.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
我剛剛講委員我們有個例子有個中國人因為想要跟我們一起撤出我們也是很樂意把他納入所以我是同意委員的看法在戰爭或天災發生的第一時間人道的原則救人是最重要讓他們有選擇可以離開 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
10274.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
10303.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
部長為什麼本席會問這個就是說如果因為我們一聽到是因為其他國家也沒有撤僑我想問我們的啟動機制是看其他有沒有才做嗎這代表你都沒準備呢低不動或不動還是跨數反數我同意議委員的講法因為這有標準作業程序所以各部會啊都要啟動是是保證這個是本席要問的那另外剛好部長提到就是說空域的部分嘛那我們撤僑難道除了飛機以外沒有其他的方式嗎陸域我們也有可以嘛對不對所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
10303.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
10322.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
有一些如果可以移動的話我們在這一次裡面有很多跨國的移動也是透過我們的管束啊協助然後讓他們可以從可以離開的不管這個這個飛機或者是說其他的陸域是是所以其實本席要了解就是我們到底有沒有準備好這件事這個因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
10322.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
10345.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
未來這樣的情況如果再發生的時候我相信大家不樂見但是真的發生的時候我們在海外的這些我們台灣自己的同胞我第一時間我要怎麼想因為我當我聽到這個時候其實換作是我我的家人是在海外遇到這種情況我一定會覺得說你都沒準備我們要怎麼辦所以這個部分布裡面這邊也是要做就是我接下來想要 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
10346.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
10367.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
具體的幾個問題就是第一個我們的風險評估報告是不是海外撤銷風險評估報告是做好了那這些撤離的指標是依照哪一些來判斷那第二個就是說我們是不是掌握目前在中東各國的人數那分佈跟安全的狀況我們是不是有建立即時聯繫跟協助其實包括旅遊包括 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
10368.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
10379.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
我們的華僑第三個就是說如果中東在進一步情勢升溫我們是不是具備有隨時可以撤離的這個方案 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
10381.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
10407.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
跟周邊的哪些國家是不是有做好這樣的互助或是說因為不可能是有有時候要透過其他關係嘛或鄰近的國家嘛那大概怎麼弄嘛那最後就是要強調是撤僑這真的是人命的安全問題啦那我很好奇想問就是說我們像現在中東地區現在在旅遊警示是被列為什麼警紅色警戒嗎紅色或橘色 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
10408.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
10423.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
就橙色啦因為我很好奇就是說當時如果說照媒體說的請我們在中東的這些台灣人說在原地待那都已經是這麼緊急在另外那邊待的意義是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
10424.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
10448.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
所以這個部分其實都是 其實如果是本縣 多少國人都要關心的事情那我想 當然很多外交的事情不是這麼的單純 我也相信那我也知道外交部很努力 但是我們更想要確保就是在這件事情給我們帶來的應變狀況 未來應付這樣的情況的時候特別是如果在周邊都沒有邦交國的時候 我們怎麼去把我們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
10450.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
10472.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
國人能夠安全的帶回來台灣另外就是再補充一個比較輕鬆的問題就是講到台東這件事情我想這幾年其實我們比較少看到外交部跟台東線有在做一些合作的事情不管是在推銷台東或者是說外國的友人來台灣或者是要宣揚台灣的這些文化本身在這裡建議 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
10473.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
10488.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
我們台東其實是 台東是一個德國的社會我們除了是擁有最多原住民族群的縣市以外我們人口其實是有民 客 員 還有外籍這些東西很符合台灣的精神就是多元跟包容 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
10488.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
10494.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
我們是希望外交部能夠多多的讓台東這樣的精神跟這樣的文化的特質讓其他的國家看到以來行銷我們台東縣跟台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
10510.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
10531.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
我們會做重點請益委員因為我在擔任交通部長的時候幾乎把我們環島的鐵通路都串聯然後那時候疫情發生我們也導入深度旅遊沒有來過台東很難體驗到台灣我們只能說定位台東一方面是他的生態 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
10533.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
10547.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
板塊擠壓產生的不管是海岸山脈或整個地質再來就是文化多元族群所以我們最近也有一些原住民外交跟太平洋國家包括 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
10549.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
10557.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
獨木舟還有無動力的帆船那其他的我想如果真正要來第二次深度體驗台東比較長的時間去做度假我們現在的民宿我們現在年輕人的這一些創業的食宿遊過型都有來過台東會完全不一樣會愛上台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
10572.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
10590.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
看的中央山脈我們是澳洲啦但是面對太平洋我們是在台東的最前面當我們是一個海洋國家我們想要更開放的方式讓大家看到我是委員我可不可以建議一個其實雙東我覺得我們高雄現在去的人多其實透過南回鐵路 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
10591.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
10616.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
那個鐵道觀光把台東跟屏東串聯起來是完全是我想都是世界級的體驗啦也許我們會來討論進一步應該都有些畫面我們日後可以一起來合作啦那最後還是請部長就是將我們今天我本席提到這些關於撤僑這些準備或是這些機制然後以及提到一些問題在一周內將這些報告能夠送到本席辦公室也讓人了解我們現在多高薄面對這樣的情況我們要怎麼處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
10619.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
10637.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
好 我們把已經做了跟應該怎麼做會更好啊做個檢討 因為這個事情還在發生中是前事也不忘後知之所以我們會滾動式的檢討跟精進謝謝部長 謝謝謝謝委員謝謝主席 謝謝好 謝謝接下來請王定宇委員上台質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
10647.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
10649.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
好 謝謝主席 麻煩林佳龍部長請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
10659.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
10686.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
我們外交部在部長擔任部長以後不管是綜合外交或者是整體國立的呈現過去這兩年多來確實有一些新的面貌而且台灣在國際舞台被看見的風貌越來越多元越來越豐富不像以往都透過被打壓或者透過災難或者透過幫忙被看見這一點本席在這邊給我們外交部部長跟所有同仁很高的肯定 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
10687.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
10709.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
真實的戰場其實是在外交其他的海巡警政國防是面對威脅但是每一天在面對這樣的挑戰其實外交部駐外人員都相當辛苦那我們也曾經討論過駐外人員相關的防捕、教捕各種那一塊我們已經討論一段時間我今天就不再著重在這一塊 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
10710.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
10736.146 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
我先請教一個問題賴總統就職到現在邁向第三年出訪一次目前有一次出訪到南泰今年第三年有沒有出訪的計畫有 我們有接到邀請但因為出訪除了國事訪問也有時候會配合對方國家有重大的典禮目前有哪幾國邀請我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
10740.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
10745.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
斯瓦帝尼最近有邀請台灣 因為他們有重大的節慶應該是死亡奔機40年 以及他們58歲的生日 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
10757.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
10773.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
所以斯瓦帝你有邀請 還有沒有其他的地方其他當然一般來講我們有一些比如說有新政府產生的國家或是因為他有來訪我們也是有要回訪這些也都在評估的範圍 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
10774.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
10798.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
所以今年確實有受邀也在評估出訪的可能性那我們元首外交其實對台灣很重要我們特別困難所以透過元首外交有的是鞏固邦誼有的是做外交突破那有的是希望被看見那你估計今年我們元首外交的頻率會一次兩次三次或者不僅限於一次能回答就回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
10799.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
10800.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
我們一般來講會朝兩次來做規劃當然也會因應情勢的發展來做調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
10809.605 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
10828.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
OK 好 所以我們樂見也希望今年的不管是國事出訪或元首外交能夠有好的消息那接下來我們要看一些面對的狀況在立陶宛的部分我們原來期待的是一個正骨牌效應也就是當時立陶宛設立台灣代表處 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
10829.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
10855.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
那我們希望連動不管是這個愛沙尼亞啦或者捷克啦其他國家能夠仿效讓台灣代表處能夠陸續成立那確實當時中國在歐洲尤其中東歐本來是他們有幾家級那個很強勢的外交力量在那個狀態下加上COVID-19的期間所以中國在這個Central Europe它確實是降下來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
10856.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
10862.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
目前我們觀察到的現象是立陶宛的總理盧錦尼涅 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
10866.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
10890.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
認為設置台灣代表處是一個巨大錯誤那他們的前任總理呢也向中國提案要恢復中國跟立陶宛相關的互動跟關係那這是一個警訊因為這警訊除了我們原來期待的正骨牌效應沒有發生我擔心的是逆骨牌效應也就是設立台灣代表處被定義為一個巨大的錯誤 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
10891.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
10913.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
那接下來對我們在歐洲的外交工作不管是多瑙河沿岸九國啦或者其他國家要開展往前更進一步讓台灣被看見讓台灣被證明可能會遇到更大的困難我先請問立陶宛發生什麼事情他會做出這樣的表述然後對於我們住處的更名目前立陶宛的態度是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
10914.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
10935.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
報告委員雖然他們總理曾經有這樣的發言不過後來也有修正然後在他們總統老薩達出面召開國安會議之後也定了調有跟台灣的關係怎麼樣持續的來發展所以說他們要跟中國的關係那個也不是操之在立陶宛要看中國到底怎麼做 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
10935.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
10955.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
所以我覺得經過這樣的一個總統召集的國安會議之後啊我們也很清楚他們也是很肯定跟台灣的這個我們的這個社畜的關係就外交部的評估我們目前跟立陶宛的狀態包含住處的名稱編制是不會有影響不會有改變OK那 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
10956.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
10983.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
骨牌效應的部分因為2758號決議文事實上是對台灣非常重要的一個法律跟國際事件當中國濫用扭曲解釋2758號決議文作為一中原則或一中政策的基礎對外宣稱代表台灣2300萬人那個虛幻的幻影讓台灣參加不管是聯合國或相關的國際組織遭受阻礙我們跟各國建立正常的邦交關係呢也因為這樣子台灣已經被代表的假象 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
10985.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
11013.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
傷害了台灣幾十年那從澳洲開始到歐盟許多國家甚至於連義大利的外委會參議院的外委會到美國到加拿大主流的民主國家都說2758號決議文無關台灣這是一個在法國際法理上破除所謂的中國代表台灣一中原則一中政策非常重要的法律戰的一個我認為是一個勝利那這也是外交部長期很努力美國國務院也幫了很多的忙那 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
11014.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
11036.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
在2758號決議文加上立陶宛的效應原來我們期待是歐洲像愛沙尼亞 埃斯多尼亞也許我們可以設置一個台灣代表處或其他住處做一個證明目前愛沙尼亞的設處其實講了很久很久包含雙邊的合作互訪也相當多現在的諮商的階段進到哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
11037.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
11055.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
報告委員 我們在他通過國會賦予的法源 已經在進行施行細則那這施行細則會針對 當然他是把台灣放在整個法案裡面 就是某一類我們實質上在周邊國家也都有一些涉處 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
11056.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
11064.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
我們的外交的這個地位跟特權還有豁免等那這個就都有在溝通中可是因為那個施行細則要完成我們才能夠正式的來提出那個方案 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
11071.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
11095.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
這個Astonia他們的是用一個法律去框架不同的外交關係的定義嘛是所以設出那個法源細節出來就可以處理了那住處名稱呢住處名稱當然也都會交換意見在這個階段啦目前傾向是台北經貿或者是台灣因為對方在通過國會這個法案以及他們內閣的這個決定的時候其實他們是用台北 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
11096.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
11110.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
他是用台北是所以目前是往台北辦事處做他們的先前的這個就是用的希望如果台灣有設處是以台北那我們外交部的態度呢跟工作的方向呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
11111.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
11126.945 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
我們基本上就是建立實質的外交關係那有外交的這種代表性這是我們的目標那每一個國家也都會因應他的情況我想這個是就是不是單一的方案 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
11129.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
11155.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
外交部長在這邊不適合把我們底牌縮死啦但我們還是期待讓台灣2300萬人像我台南我就不是被台北代表的啊就是說我們還是希望能夠被看見被代表的名稱我們希望我們各位同仁繼續努力啦但是底牌當然實質的台灣的困難我們都知道困難的來源我們也知道所以往對的方向努力不代表輕鬆啦所以請你們繼續加油因為我移到巴拉圭 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
11156.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
11181.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
最近巴拉圭的用那個超級豪華的旅程邀請了巴拉圭的國會議員去中國訪問那確實也產生一些效應他們回巴拉圭之後這是我們在拉美唯一的邦交國在南美唯一的邦交國他也表達說建議要調整對台的相關關係那我們都曉得中國習慣性或者中國會把經貿當外交武器 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
11182.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
11207.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
中國也會把貪腐當作外交的機會跟外交的工具這是中國的習慣有時候中國答應要買你的白蝦像洪都拉斯跳票沒關係洪都拉斯的人民付出代價沒關係但是他掌握key man就好了那key man用什麼方式來掌握眾說紛紜所以有關巴拉圭的部分我們外交部目前評估狀態是怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
11210.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
11237.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
因為我們的前駐巴拉圭大使現在是拉美師長我待會請他補充師長剛從那邊回來對對對中共對巴拉圭要挖我們牆角是不擇手段他動用的資源那個是非常可怕可是為什麼今天台巴關係還是穩定包括貝尼亞總統包括他們國會因為他們要跟台灣合作是看到台灣發展模式所以在巴拉圭就是台灣模式對中國模式在拉美的一個對決 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
11238.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
11254.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
所以最近包括宏都拉斯他當然旁邊有瓜地馬拉跟貝里斯就是林邦所以我們跟對方比的不是比金錢或比霸權而我們比的是台灣的發展經驗的模式所以巴拉圭 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
11254.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
11270.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
我們現在做到榮邦計畫包括八個旗艦包括他的醫院有資訊系統智慧醫院是全拉美最好的我們在巴拉圭榮邦計畫坦白講做得相當不錯我有去拜訪那個Gustavo他現在是巴拉圭駐美國的大使 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
11270.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
11284.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
江啟臣副院長也有組團去跨黨派所以這個巴拉圭本身 榮邦計畫是做得還不錯那中國往我們墻角所以你們現在目前評估巴拉圭狀態還可以那被他們的總統佩妮娜邀請賴總統訪問的邀請還持續中嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
11288.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
11301.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
對 當然我們也邀請他啦他來我相對看起來比較簡單啦那我們總統出訪比較起來要考慮比較多啦所以巴拉圭的邀請還存在 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
11303.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
11321.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
對,我們市長一直點頭嘛,那時候你團的嘛,大使大使來那時候邀請的時候你還是大使嘛是,8月的貝納總統從上台以後就一直不斷的在公開或私下的場合表達希望賴總統有時間有機會能夠去訪問今年會安排嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
11324.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
11347.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
你這樣的笑容很燦爛我們隨時在準備但是實際是適當的時候那個有些要讓虎方來宣布好啦謝謝我真的懂了我最後兩個問題第一個是史瓦帝尼的基礎建設因為他也跟非洲的開發銀行申請當然史瓦帝尼跟我們非常友好 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
11348.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
11373.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
那史瓦帝尼還是會跟非洲銀行申請一些貸款、基建的計畫現在他的那個培克尼大壩的計畫申請到42億台幣的基建的融資結果飆到的是中國的公司用低價切到了因為我剛才還是講那句話中國會把經貿當外交工具、武器中國會把貪腐當作外交機會 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
11374.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
11390.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
就你們判斷斯瓦帝尼跟這個培克尼大壩對我們有沒有什麼值得擔憂或關注的地方我是非常關注啦因為我這個這個當然是他們低價競標我關注就是說這個大壩有沒有發電 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
11391.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
11406.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
如果發電後續的營運可能中共就會進來那還好這個大壩是純粹是一個水壩它沒有發電再來就是我們現在在我們的龍幫計畫已經進入這個石瓦地你就暫備儲油槽 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
11407.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
11428.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
那個計畫更大所以我們也讓台灣的包括OIDC啦 OECC啦還有包括這個台灣世襲國會都進去所以其實也許那個BAR弄起來我們台灣來幫他弄發電也是一個方式啦對 後續我們都可以去接手的但是他們的品質會不好我們不敢接因為他們的BAR有時候會破洞 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
11429.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
11454.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
大波動是會垮掉的還沒有碰啊 要賠償啊 包括在二瓜多啦那個會壞東西我們不要問了我最後提醒一句話目前南韓的部分我們是採取不升級對應的方式處理這是好的但我提醒外交部還是要一些實質的處理方式因為韓國這種做法非常不禮貌當然有網友說應該叫他南朝鮮但我們未必要做到 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
11455.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
11484.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
跟他們一樣這樣失格的事情但是我要提醒說對韓國來講我們應該還有一些實質的工具但是採取外交不升高衝突的方式展現國格我個人是給予支持但這個事情應該要盡快有一個處理方向謝謝接下來請牛許廷委員上台質詢謝謝主席 林部長有請 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
11485.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
11485.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
11496.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
11514.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
剛剛黃建斌委員有關心撤僑的問題,這本席也蠻關心的,我做幾個補充跟再做一些比較詳細的一些提問。這一次我們目前為止還有多少國民,或者是僑民等等,留學生甚至是旅客,目前以外交部的掌握,還有多少人滯留在伊朗及相關的海灣國家? |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
11515.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
11540.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
目前我們如果估計是八個管處,當然加上土耳其,因為有些從那邊土耳其不算,我們有六個國家七個管處土耳其我們也把它放進來,因為周邊有時候轉機或者是需求那我們的僑民僑民總共有三千人我說現在還滯留的嘛,因為有一些回來了,然後有一些還在,現在狀況怎麼樣嘛沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
11541.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
11568.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
目前已經沒有那個滯留那我們更重要的是說他有沒有意願想要離境現在是沒有現在都沒有 一個都沒有大家都安全回來這我們來瞭解一下因為剛剛這部長在答詢的時候有講或者是說我們前面不管是在新聞媒體或怎麼樣就很多人講也不是大家都用包機或等等的方式來處理不過是這樣子嗎 部長其他國家針對僑民的撤離跟當初在短時間內做的決策你有瞭解嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].start |
11570.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].end |
11594.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].text |
所謂專機 當然有用軍機 有用民航機看當地的情形我們的初步調查是在地的僑民是沒有這個需求因為他們當然也比較有經驗可是旅行社帶的那些旅行團曾經在一段時間內因為要安置在那裡的時候我想交通部 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].start |
11595.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].end |
11618.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].text |
跟觀光署 因為他們是直接掌握這個旅行社所以這個方面我們也跟他都很密切我不會太為難你外交人員因為這本來就是第一個跨部會協調第二我們的國際處境本來比較狹窄不過我還要舉幾個例子比如說日本就安排了先搭乘巴士從陸路轉到一個相對安全的地方然後有這個包機可以回來我們還順便 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].start |
11619.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].end |
11645.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].text |
幫忙我們這些國民 當然都是一些好事然後他們也準備軍用運輸機 以備所有的不時之需新加坡也一樣 11號撤離218米他也用包機的方式來做處理其中一半就留學生嘛 我剛剛有講留學生就是這樣那也都有這個甚至都有軍事上的一些準備 你總算要護航的嘛那美國也有撤僑班機法國是安排航班 紐西蘭政府也下令軍用飛機先預作準備 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].start |
11646.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].end |
11672.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].text |
所以我講這件事情你總不能講說其他國家都沒有做所以我們也不做對不對這個在現在我們雖然階段性的任務已經完成了但你確定後面都不會有事大家安全無虞這個可不可以掛保證戰爭還在發生中所以我們也需要持續因應所以有關於包機以及可能的需求跟方式行政院有在評估因為這涉及跨部會 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].start |
11674.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].end |
11698.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].text |
我想院裡面都會有整體評估之後的決定這本期我沒有要求說你一定講我也要派軍機啊或者是我也要一定要做好應變的準備包括這個選項但是我希望第一個方法多元啊第二個這個如果其他國家做得到我們也要盡量做到啦就我不是講現在就一定要做因為沒有需求不一定做得到要有這個準備一個方案有這個能力去執行如果需要的話那再來就剛剛也有提到嘛就有一些旅客 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].start |
11698.996 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].end |
11718.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].text |
到最後他是透過中國東方航空回來那他顯然是透過中國大使館的協助我請教一下部長這幾位旅客或者是旅行社當初有沒有尋求我們外館的協助我是說這個資訊我們都有掌握然後他要透過哪裡去轉機我們先了解之後哪些航班是有的就像也有中國人透過我們台灣來轉機的我有在聽所以我了解 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].start |
11722.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].end |
11739.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].text |
所以他們有透過外交的這個就上海這個例子基本上並沒有說有什麼樣的爭論因為盡快的讓當事人可以選擇他認為最好的方式離境我覺得這個是我們的共同目標所以部長可以基本上也是可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].start |
11739.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].end |
11768.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].text |
怎麼評價這個事我覺得這個轉機到任何地方去只要是從戰場離開我就覺得我們應該都要支持啊都要支持 好 OK這我希望外交部這邊你至少做一點事不要讓這些人受到非難因為你講的這很敏感就是大家考量什麼政治立場你要比照日本還表達感謝之意也太為難你們了這本席我不會強加於你但問題是有些人講認知作戰啊他會形成國安破口這些然後甚至側翼啊想要去攻擊我覺得至少我們國家可以確保這些人不要受非難 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].start |
11769.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].end |
11789.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].text |
因為外交部已經公開表態嘛任何的方式只要能夠安全的、迅速的、有效的脫離混亂回到台灣都應該要正面看待部長可以承諾這事嗎?對在這地方公開承諾希望大家不要再針對這群人的非難趕快翻篇好不好因為每一個的處境都很特別啊當事人最在乎他的生命跟安全所以我們全力來協助他能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].start |
11790.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].end |
11818.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].text |
所以撤僑這兩個提醒第一個因為戰事可能會延長後面可能會有需求該部委在這裡呼籲有一些國人可能這個時候不要再過去包括去旅遊或者是轉機或者是萬一戰爭又升高然後又困住了降低風險是一環嘛你該宣導要宣導但是做好準備嘛隨時對那邊的人隨時動態做掌握確保安全第二不管透過任何手段進來不要再讓政治的立場去干擾這個事情讓它可以順利秉持這樣的原則就好 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].start |
11819.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].end |
11833.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].text |
另外花一點點時間跟部長探討一下國際局勢的一些變化最近美國川普總統的外交政策跟路線跟傳統的外交圈子裡面認知的其實有非常非常大的落差其中最重要的一點基本上就是國際組織的參與這個部長這個川普政府參與國際組織是積極的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].start |
11839.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].end |
11859.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].text |
他自己在形成以他們的國家的這個為中心的國際的聯盟嘛 組織嘛當然也退出了一些組織 這對我們來講有挑戰也有機會OK 他退出了很多的組織 或者是用聚角會費啊 或者是消極參與等等的方式他其實是往後退嘛 大的方向來說他的參與率是下降的 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].start |
11861.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].end |
11875.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].text |
那剛剛部長很好這是我正想問的問題啊這個美國在這個地方建區消極的這樣子的一個大環境下我們參與國際組織的策略啊要怎麼樣來做因應您剛剛講的所謂的機遇或者是挑戰分別是什麼您簡單說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].start |
11876.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].end |
11898.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].text |
其實美國雖然推出一些國際組織 它還在聯合國所以對於比如說聯合國2758號解釋它不但有更完整的 它還發函各個這個使節團那另外就是說它在形成中的新的國際的組織或聯盟 比如像細勝市這種供應鏈 那當然跟半導體AI有關那我們就是變成裡面不可或缺的夥伴 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].start |
11899.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].end |
11919.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].text |
那這個也是機會那至於說你說我們原來想積極爭取的一些國際組織那美國退出之後當然會有一定的影響所以我們也會跟G7其他國家在協商就是說是不是由他們這個比較有分量的國家也能夠來領先因為有時候要集體去洽或者是支持我們的時候的一些行動 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].start |
11920.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].end |
11944.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].text |
好 這個剛好也是我要問因為美國雖然推出了很多國際組織但同時在2758號決議上面他做了非常強的政治的表態加大了一定的力道但本席想要問的是實質上他改變了什麼比如說以聯合國來講因為他對2758號的全世界講這些東西不應該排除台灣有意義的參與國際組織的各種方式嘛 對不對那我們長期以來不管誰在執政的時候大家都希望比如說國際刑警組織 對不對國際民航組織大家可以用實質參與的方式來做處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].start |
11947.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].end |
11974.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].text |
那這段時間現在進度如何?有沒有遇到狀況跟...委員提到聯合國昨天有四個組織是我們特別集中要爭取的嘛剛剛除了這個Akeo這個Akeo或Interpol以外那當然他退出的那個UNFCCC跟這個WHA嘛所以WHO所以我們在這兩個是不一樣的處理方法比如說以國際民航組織跟這個國際刑警組織其實沒有台灣世界是會有一個漏洞是啊 這大家都這樣說啊這個時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].start |
11975.982 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].end |
12002.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].text |
我是覺得他們對著我們支持的力道其實是有持續甚至增強甚至包括日本在這樣子的一個局面下面比如說我們還是要想辦法加入或是想辦法參與對不對國際刑警組織或民防組織也好你現在外交部的策略是怎麼樣正面突破因為我現在反正可能各個國家形成集團跟陣營所以我只要站在人多這邊我正面突破或者是我要迂迴的參與或者是因為怎麼樣都繞不過中歐大陸的打壓所以我乾脆死了這條心 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].start |
12002.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].end |
12031.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].text |
現在外交部打算用什麼樣的策略因應有些輪值主席國是比較友善的國家比如說國際民航組織日本他們擔任主席秘書處因為過去有一些是中共長年的經營他就掌控所以我們當然我們有道理是一回事但是涉及到投票或涉及到政治力的角力這個時候我們的議程聚焦幾個國際組織我們也要有策略而不是說都是去call們結果都沒有進展 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].start |
12032.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].end |
12053.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].text |
所以正面突破可能有一些困難另外我再跟委員補充比如說世界衛生組織我們今年有去因為那時候江啟臣副院長有希望說我們去辦智慧醫療展我們的智慧醫療跟健康產業我想在那裡就形成會今年一起我們也期待如果委員們能夠到場去指導但是美國也在 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].start |
12054.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].end |
12073.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].text |
也可能會形成新的這種跟世界衛生組織性質相近的組織的時候那我們也講嘛我們總是ready準備好我們也可以我覺得這個時候就是有時候就是挑戰有時候是機會就看我們也要做好各種準備 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].start |
12074.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].end |
12093.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].text |
這部長有提到四大組織啦因為今天時間比較有限我還有最後一個問題你要四大組織的參與策略你會有提供一份報告好不好讓我們做長期的追蹤跟了解因為我們也希望有突破嘛如果任何哪怕你只是迂回參與我覺得都是在外交上都可以或多或少加分我講我沒有要求一定要突破或你要在多少時間內達成什麼目標這太為難你們我都非常清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].start |
12093.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].end |
12108.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].text |
然後最後一個問題就是剛剛部長有提到因為國際局勢的改變美國策略的改變很多時候它可能變成多邊轉雙邊比如說最近的河母之海峽的這個狀況顯然大家都想說這照理來講過去應該要共同 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].start |
12109.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].end |
12132.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].text |
國際社會共同處理來確保海峽航路的暢通但為了沒辦法處理呢我想跟我剛剛提到的美國撤出國際組織降低參與你少了一個很大的平台啊少了一個協作的空間所以就變成美國要個別雙邊的去找各個國家來協調這件事情那顯然以現在的消息露出來講好像不是特別的順利大家對於這件事情心態是比較保留的我覺得也合理啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].start |
12133.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].end |
12144.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].text |
因為從外交角度大家以本國利益為優先的情況之下我幹嘛去擔負這樣子的一個高風險的這樣子的一個狀況呢所以這是一個大的問題但我要提醒部長而且這是預料問題當大家這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].start |
12147.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].end |
12174.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].text |
外交的這個專業的人員做了共同的考慮所以不管是多邊跟雙邊這要暫時都陷入僵局走不通的時候有台灣內部竟然有一群人說我們要率先響應這樣的一個協議然後要派甚至要派武力等等去響應川普總統的的的的說法然後認為這樣可以帶來新的外交突破部長從外交的專業來講或者是各位外交部的人員可以來做補充這樣的說法對台灣的安全也好或者是對國際利益來講是有幫助的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].start |
12175.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].end |
12202.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].text |
外交是一定以自己的國家利益還有包括主權跟安全為出發點所以第一個美國也沒有邀請再來就是說我們的角色我們比較不是透過軍事方式我想台灣的外交走得出去跟我們整體我想比較不是在軍事方面的角色但是安全面 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].start |
12203.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].end |
12225.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].text |
很多情報的交換 各種可能我想包括像你看俄烏戰爭對不對我們也是有一些我們可以做的事情那也是在確保我們國家的利益跟這個委員組之下所以因為美國沒有邀請然後也不太適合嘛 對不對其實部長我也不多為難你但你看我點了這個事情跟剛剛我講的因為那會捲入一個我們比較不能夠掌握的一個戰場 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].start |
12231.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].end |
12244.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].text |
所以這部分也希望外交部適時的有一些比較合理的說法我常常講國防題目跟外交題目不要有太多政治的色彩去介入的時候它其實推動會比較順利專業才會比較被尊重外交就是多交朋友少...少...少... |
| transcript.whisperx[455].start |
12248.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].end |
12273.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].text |
少找敵人啊對啊朋友多多敵人少少嘛對不對所以我想不管是剛剛我講撤僑的題目有一些人透過中國大陸的角度就不要讓他們受到非議跟責難或者是我講和睦之海有一些基於這個短視的政治利益然後去搞煽動跟操作這時候外交部要適時的站在專業的立場以國家利益為優先因為涉及到能源我們確實是要很專注的做一些因應但是不能亂搞啦好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].start |
12274.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].end |
12283.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].text |
好 幾個事情提醒部長 也謝謝部長詳細的回答 謝謝好 謝謝委員好 謝謝接下來請林楚英委員上台質詢謝謝主席 主席有請林部長請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].start |
12308.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].end |
12311.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].text |
部長午安從早上到現在剛好中午12點鐘了輪到我質詢我想幾個這個時事題我想前面的委員們都已經針對部長來進行質詢了不過有關於韓國的這一題我想進一步的來提醒的是確實韓國這樣的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].start |
12328.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].end |
12346.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].text |
而做法是傷害了蠻多台灣朋友尤其是台灣年輕朋友的感情因為我們都知道不論是這個韓國的娛樂產業來台灣發展這個很多的這個女子團體啊等等來這邊開演唱會台灣的年輕人都很支持那麼台灣到韓國去旅遊的年輕人更多那麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].start |
12347.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].end |
12370.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].text |
這樣的一個做法其實確實會到我們造成一些影響而且是民間的交流是非常熱絡的我想要比較具體的來提出來是說其實韓國的民間對於台灣同樣比如說我們去的很多但是韓國來這裡根據我剛剛特別要了一個最新的資料是如果以去年來看的話韓國是訪台的人數是第三名那麼在今年來講的話韓國已經躍升為第一名了 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].start |
12376.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].end |
12401.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].text |
言下之意兩邊的交流互動是非常頻繁的就像部長您剛剛也說了我們在外交上面就是多交一點朋友那麼我是非常肯定就是說外交部這些年來不斷地在透過所謂雙邊互惠的方式包括我相信現在很多的年輕朋友可能去韓國是可以直接用快速空關那麼我們也看到了兩邊的這個互惠的狀況呢是持續在增加我比較想問的是 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].start |
12404.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].end |
12433.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].text |
在我們跟一些國家雖然也許在正式的公文交流上面確實受到一些阻礙但是在實質上面的這些互惠是有進展的首先包括像我們現在的這些動作會不會影響到接下來包括我們雙邊互惠使用所謂的快速的空關 自動空關這樣的一些比較實質的部分那麼第二個問題當然就是我們也看到2025年連紐西蘭其實我們也都有快速的空關我現在列出來的像 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].start |
12434.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].end |
12445.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].text |
美國、澳洲、義大利、德國、新加坡、馬來西亞可是可能很多朋友並不知道啦但是如果有商務上使用的人會了解那麼在這個部分部長你怎麼來研判 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].start |
12446.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].end |
12474.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].text |
其實台灣的關係是很密切也相當有互補性所以我想作為政府我們都是在促進就是不然人流物流金流交通流等等但是因為涉及到我們國家的這個地位因為這涉及到兩邊他單方面這樣子用我們認為這不適合我們也跟他交涉他現在也知道就是在處理中 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].start |
12476.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].end |
12496.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].text |
所以在這個部分我必須要肯定的是說其實在被拉高成為政治層次的問題的時候或外交層次問題的時候當然我們必須要展現我們國家應有的主權的對外發聲但是持續的就是民間交流的部分我們也當然希望不要受到影響因為兩邊可以看得出來彼此之間的交往民間是很熱絡的 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].start |
12501.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].end |
12506.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].text |
那麼另外一個我要肯定的是其實這兩天包括16 17號有這個第九屆的玉山論壇那麼我知道外交部包括部長在內都非常的忙碌然後呢包括19號就是今天還有台北國際的智慧城市論壇 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].start |
12518.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].end |
12545.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].text |
雖然說是掛台北國際智慧城市論壇啦但是很多外交的訪兵也都是外交部在做協助言下之意就是我們都知道中央政府怎麼預算卡住但是外交的工作不會停止本席特別就是處理了整理了一下就是外交部現在的幾個新興計畫包括部長一直提到的榮邦計畫還有國際交流活動跟訪兵的部分以及包括民眾最關心的就是護照印製跟領悟服務 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].start |
12549.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].end |
12556.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].text |
單位的營運經費龍總統統加起來呢這些計畫是不是會因為真的總預算到現在還沒有審理而受到影響那麼尤其是我特別畫紅線的是可信賴的網路跟數位治理還有就是我們主權AI這個部分剛剛前面這個在野黨的委員也特別提到了不論是國防或外交不要把政治擺進來 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].start |
12573.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].end |
12593.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].text |
可是事實上一直以來不是我們要擺政治進來而是中國不斷的給壓力或者是在國際間讓我們穿小鞋或者是施壓跟我們在民間交流上面非常好的單位所以說像這個包括剛剛特別提到的有關於伊朗戰爭美伊戰爭的過程當中這種所謂撤僑的行動這種所謂的中國的認知作戰不是我們發起的啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].start |
12602.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].end |
12632.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].text |
是他們在發動我們要防守我們只好做澄清我們只好強調沒有這樣的事情所以現在包括兩個非常重要那包括我們台灣在主權上面的AI的辨識中國不斷的在為資料我們一定也要有所動作那麼這兩筆的預算目前是沒有辦法動之的時候會造成哪些影響那外交部這裡部長這裡有沒有什麼其他的可以來做的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].start |
12633.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].end |
12651.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].text |
好 報告委員 龍幫計畫很多是新興計畫所以必須要立法院通過預算我們才能夠啟動所以當然會影響 因為現在已經是三月了嘛因為很多事情是需要去做討論跟對方能夠來同意之後一起來推動 那也需要預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].start |
12652.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].end |
12673.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].text |
那所以您剛提到比如說現在大家其實台灣在智慧城市展裡面很重要的就是數位治理我們提供了智慧解決方案從智慧城市、智慧交通、智慧醫療這個是人家看上台灣想跟我們交往那我們當然不把它列入榮邦計畫就是所謂的可信賴網絡跟數位治理另外當然有非常多這些新興項目會影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].start |
12675.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].end |
12699.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].text |
那國際交流因為我們報告也有寫到為什麼這兩年大量增加是我在上任第一年之後我就解開了過去的平均分配然後邀訪的預算很少所以你知道我們歐洲31個管處像德國我們還有三個是辦事處一個代表處有一些一年邀不到一個團體因為沒有預算那我就是說我來找錢大家盡量去因為你要去諮商國會議員來 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].start |
12702.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].end |
12727.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].text |
女業單位包括波蘭的國會議員的這個友好小組真的需要花個好幾個月時間人家也要考慮他可以來所以為什麼我們現在有一些突破也是因為這兩年大院的支持啦那我們有增加一些項目所以這個去國際交流跟訪兵比如像我們現在玉山論壇完再來就是凱達格蘭論壇那半年後要舉辦我們現在就是要找到 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].start |
12728.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].end |
12752.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].text |
邀請了貴賓的時候確實會預算會影響我們所以說本席還是認為在這個部分我們包括現在的智慧城市的這個論壇裡面大家會希望跟台灣有做一些更多的合作而這樣的合作其實不是只是單一面向的台灣付出預算跟經費在這個部分其實台灣獲得跟國際友人的合作的時候也是帶領著我們的企業 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].start |
12754.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].end |
12758.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].text |
包括我們這些網路的資訊安全的資通的企業其實有機會落地到這些沒有邦交的國家我認為這個點必須要透過部長這裡或是透過外交部讓外界知道不然的話又會被講說哎呀我們就是撒錢啦我們又是凱既外交不是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].start |
12774.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].end |
12788.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].text |
從原住到轉成去投資就是榮邦計畫其實效果已經出來了包括帛琉還有包括巴拉圭甚至好幾個國家像在波蘭跟菲律賓波蘭的外交部長他是副總理 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].start |
12789.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].end |
12807.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].text |
在國會他在這個報告的時候是第一次正式提到台灣是科技上合作的戰略夥伴那更不用講菲律賓解除了對台灣的交往這些都是非邦交國最重要的就是我們這個龍邦計畫的項目跟他可以對接的很好這個東西有一些計畫必須要盡快來啟動所以我也是 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].start |
12810.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].end |
12826.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].text |
懇求我們大院如果盡早鋪圍之後我們的外委會可以盡快的審查因為現在已經三月在下去之後因為外交都需要很多諮商的時間我想幫部長下一個結論就是我現在所羅列的這些部分它確實它是一種投資 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].start |
12827.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].end |
12841.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].text |
他並不是過去大家對於說我們在外交上面的付出認為是所謂撒幣這個都是一種投資投資回來的是對於不只是我們台灣的主體被看見台灣被看見之外我們也是可以就像您所說的榮邦計畫可以把這個更多的這個產業企業可以往外走 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].start |
12847.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].end |
12867.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].text |
那另外一個我要關注的題目是我們現在看到的是有關於海外的這個疾難救助的部分因為當大家都有提到就是伊朗戰爭的部分本席在民間聽到的蠻多的是很多人他早就已經計畫好了要到中東國家來做旅遊 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].start |
12868.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].end |
12883.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].text |
那麼有一些是自己訂的沒有問題但是有一些呢是跟了旅行社那旅行社現在就會跟他們講說你要退錢可以啊你不去也可以啊但是訂金不退甚至於還要要求他們額外做一些付費跟負擔那麼當然旅行社是跟這個外交部沒有關聯啦是跟這個交通部比較觀光署相關的比較有關聯 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].start |
12889.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].end |
12918.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].text |
但是本席在這裡提醒的是喔對於民眾自發性的自己在面對現在的這樣一個中東的局勢跟狀況外交部除了市警之外我們是一個自由的國家我們不可能限制人民說啊 那要賣去 那要賣塞去我們只能用燈號來做市警可是第一個包括救助的系統如何的讓民眾了解如何來救援 求援之外是不是外交部也應該跟交通部相關的單位對於這些有一些業者 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].start |
12919.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].end |
12926.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].text |
他們用這種方式逼得已經付錢的這個國人我訂金買就算了我還要再額外 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].start |
12928.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].end |
12952.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].text |
補一筆什麼費用那像這樣的狀況會逼著民眾往前走那這個部分有沒有可能透過外交部交通部能夠了解有沒有這樣的狀況委員是要看到問題的關鍵我舉個例子分享當然我是外交部長我不是先前的交通部長不過在這個所謂武漢肺炎疫情發生的第一時間我們要 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].start |
12954.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].end |
12975.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].text |
管制禁止一些航班那也影響到旅行社這些旅行社其實都很有組織我們可以跟他們的工協會討論做適當的一個補貼然後他們少損失一點但也不要都由他們出不然他們會轉嫁給旅客啊旅客就說我不去我就 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].start |
12976.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].end |
12995.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].text |
這就虧啦可是我去又有一些風險啊那我覺得在這個關鍵時刻我想大家都了解啦政府如果可以出面跟透過旅行社然後讓這一些已經訂票要出遊的大家都能夠減少一點損失啦這個可能會 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].start |
12996.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].end |
13018.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].text |
避免現在又有不少人又要去杜拜這個也是一個對我們外交部來講既有的才處理完2400多個現在新的又一直出現這個是因為已經戰爭發生三個禮拜了不是說剛發生所以我們也不能說請大家都不要去因為我們是一個法治的社會所以倒是 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].start |
13019.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].end |
13035.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].text |
一個整體算一下看多少預算可以處理所以這是委員您的建議我是非常支持因為特別提出來質詢就是說因為剛剛前面好多委員都在講是不是處理好了有沒有處理完了現在也都講了都處理好了那我們現在就是要面對這樣的狀況因為戰爭什麼要停止我們無法決定 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].start |
13038.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].end |
13062.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].text |
但是至少我們要認知到確實在民間還有可能潛在的會進行旅遊或移動的那這裡本席通過質詢也要提醒外交部雖然這不是外交部主責但是外交部似乎必須要跟交通部來做一個通盤的了解好嗎那因為時間到了後面還有委員所以我的質詢就到這裡好謝謝那把你們公布的狀況是不是再讓本席以及委員會知道好不好謝謝好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].start |
13065.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].end |
13068.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].text |
我們接下來請賴氏寶委員上台質詢謝謝主席以及各位先進有請外交部的林部長請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].start |
13087.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].end |
13099.517 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].text |
委員好來 部長你好春風滿面啦齁來 最近你紅啊 你講到你那個回應那個China 瓜福 台灣 瓜福齁這個事情啊 你說三月底之前會 他們會善意回應嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].start |
13106.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].end |
13108.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].text |
他們外交部有表示會怎麼樣 會怎麼樣回應他只要知道我們的立場那也要他們研究跟相關的單位諮商之後來回覆他們要收回去嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].start |
13120.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].end |
13128.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].text |
你說三月底會有回復是什麼那我們有跟他交涉我們要什麼 要什麼他也告訴他說我們當然也要壓個時間不然無限期拖下去雖然他們現在已經有暫緩把紙本跟電子卡整合整電池卡但是你的訴求是什麼這個動作也代表他有重視我們的意見我們的訴求是什麼我們的訴求 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].start |
13149.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].end |
13165.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].text |
就是尊重我們的意見啊不要把我們變成中國台灣啊不要把我們變成中國台灣啊不要寫中國寫台灣就好了是這個意思嗎我們在世界各國大部分都是這樣子啊要講清楚啊你書寫我沒有聽清楚川普也這樣講台灣是台灣啊二郎喔你沒關係你怎麼說可是你現在說很多話 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].start |
13173.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].end |
13179.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].text |
動作很虛啊人家講你 恰那瓜虎台灣這是實打實啊 這叫實錘按照你的觀點就是把你矮化 叫實錘可是你說我要稱它為南韓這個虛的 虛虛的韓國本來就是南韓啊啊這個來講的話 你隨便去Google 隨便去看這是一個中心名詞啊 沒有任何的矮化報告理緣喔 他們支持大韓民國啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].start |
13201.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].end |
13205.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].text |
不管怎麼樣 你把他講南韓 說南韓他可以接受嗎你隨便去看 隨便去看報告委員 十年前他跟我們拜託再拜託就是不要叫他們南韓 叫大韓民國簡稱韓國你要真的去用這個來講我們叫做實錘的話 應該講什麼北朝鮮 國有南韓 還這樣這個委員的建議我們是不是要待會反應你要反應我們以前 這個東西 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].start |
13228.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].end |
13234.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].text |
如果立法院做成決議的話增加我們談判的空間啊對增加你空間嘛這個才實錘嘛人家實錘你是虛的南韓這東西你隨便Google拜託各位Google一下南韓中姓名稱韓國本來就是南韓就是這樣南北韓他們是稱為國號叫大韓民國不是南韓喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].start |
13252.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].end |
13253.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].text |
我們很少講大韓民國啦 這麼落口或者你要進一步的 你說要 對不對手法改回來 漢城 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].start |
13263.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].end |
13266.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].text |
這委員的建議嗎要掛刺激 要這樣掛刺激啊是不是我們在列入啦 就是說我們會反映委員的意見你都可以去跟他談啦 我們作秀給你啊在這實錘 你是虛的啊 部長你打高空啊 這虛的 你非常虛啊外交就是要虛實相宜啊不能夠都是實也不能都是虛啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].start |
13287.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].end |
13291.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].text |
這樣要死就這樣啦開始了你看喔台灣去韓國一年一百八十五萬你要不要請交通部說我們開始減半或者不要去這個沒有我們滿例以前不要去 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].start |
13306.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].end |
13312.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].text |
沒有啦 這是我們政府跟政府的交涉我們民間的交往還是非常熱絡喔 好 所以這樣就沒武器啊不然就是說我們的貿易逆差一兆多咧我們拿韓國鑽一兆多 你敢沒武器說你這樣對我 我就跟你這個地方我家鄉檢驗 那個地方我給你不要出去你敢嗎 你說不敢啊觀光也不敢 貿易的東西也不敢 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].start |
13334.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].end |
13340.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].text |
我們能夠講道理告訴他我們的立場國與國之間不是講道理啦國與國之間講實力啦我們也是以實力做後盾嘛你有實力在這裡你有實力就是說我們怎麼樣採取我讓台灣人少去韓國 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].start |
13351.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].end |
13354.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].text |
對不對 我要讓韓國的東西少進來台灣這個就是實力啊 你實力擺在這裡你可以用武器 不用你覺得我難衡我聽到說我們還是期待港南政府他能夠就是說務實的處理這件事這個 我的感覺部長人家是打你一個很大的巴掌啦然後你輕輕碰一下他的衣服這樣撩起來 這樣而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].start |
13379.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].end |
13386.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].text |
我替你很委屈的 外交部長我替你委屈我知道很艱難啦 要捍衛我們的國格啊然後也是要注重我們雙方面對不對因為也是有很多來往的關係啊不艱難就不會找你當部長了啦當然艱難啦 大家也知道中華民國的外交到現在為止沒有哪一年是不困難的都非常困難來 我再問你盧秀燕市長 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].start |
13408.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].end |
13410.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].text |
好 你很熟悉了喔 日本啊你認識了喔認識啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].start |
13414.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].end |
13440.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].text |
請問他去美國你有沒有幫助安排活動我們都是全力協助任何不管國會議員或是縣市首長這個對我們來講都是總和外交當然是外交但外交就不分黨派像我跟江啟臣副院長一起到了布拉格我們就在故宮文物展或他去不管是巴拉圭或現在去澳洲我們也都全力支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].start |
13441.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].end |
13447.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].text |
立法院走出去就是代表我們國家好 那佐隆佐隆他院長去日本看棒球你們有沒有幫忙我知不知道知道啊有沒有幫忙 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].start |
13451.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].end |
13456.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].text |
有沒有幫忙我們外交部做我們外交部該做的事啊所以有幫忙嘛所以不是 一定都會涉及待對嘛 當然啦這東西大家都 大家這東西就大概天空說亮話他去了你一定知道不知道的話你可以下台第二個你一定有幫忙沒有幫忙你也可以下台這東西就是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].start |
13472.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].end |
13491.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].text |
因為他定位在私人行程你們都不予評論嘛該做的事還是要做啊但是行政院長就像你外交部長24小時都是外交部長沒有說我今天去應援不是我今天應援不是外交部長我叫林佳龍教授或者什麼的不可以的事啦著弄待24小時 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].start |
13495.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].end |
13502.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].text |
一年365天就是行政院長沒有什麼私人行程啦所以你一定要知道你一定要幫忙否則你就失職同意嗎 同意我的話同意就是因為日本叫你不要講所以你不要講啦所以委員講了是啦 所以你也沒有否認啦這個我們很辛苦啦我就回憶起當初跟前副那時候我當時國大代表他是國大代表的議長 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].start |
13525.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].end |
13552.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].text |
他帶了一兩個國內代表去跟日本的經濟部長日本的交通部長見面他告訴我 我那時候學到了他說跟日本 實質能夠碰到這個隔遠對外絕對不能講 否則就沒有第二次所以我們理解 不能講但是呢 這不是什麼制 什麼制而形成這個公務形成然後外交部知道 外交都有幫忙就行錯誤了好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].start |
13555.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].end |
13561.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].text |
謝謝委員好 謝謝我們接下來請鍾嘉斌委員上台質詢主席在場的委員先進 列席的任務決定事項 官員會長 工作夥伴 媒體記者 女士先生有請林部長請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].start |
13585.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].end |
13594.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].text |
部長 我們算是認識很久了 從大學一起嘛 你是我的學長如果看到同學有些口角 你是會勸架 還是三分點我叫他們打起來當然是勸和啊對嘛 所以如果有人說 喝到你把他撐下去 這種人的話你不要聽你說我在講什麼 來 請問部長 那個TECO啊 是商標嗎TECO 我們外交部有一些地方叫TECO啊可是我們常看到TECO是動源電機啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].start |
13614.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].end |
13626.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].text |
所以這個TECO是什麼?是這個嘛,是這個什麼?台北經濟文化辦事處,對不對?是這樣啦,好,可是國人不見得熟啦,考你一下一般人的,iPhone聽過嗎?iPhone,iPhone就是iPhone啦,對,AI勒?AI就是AI啦,那請問一下啦,這個TECO的TR是什麼?代表台北還是台灣? |
| transcript.whisperx[515].start |
13641.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].end |
13653.532 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].text |
看那個地方啊看什麼地方呢如果是在我們住處的牌它是寫Taipei啦但是如果我們網路上外交部的社群平台都是寫Taiwan啊所以你這個T到底是Taiwan還是Taipei |
| transcript.whisperx[516].start |
13655.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].end |
13678.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].text |
有什麼趨勢嗎他的登記名字剛剛剛剛講了 台北嘛登記的時候 早年登記是台北但是現在我們自己表達都用台灣不只如此不只台灣 現在我們自己表達台灣美國也是啊美國是要展現台灣的主權意向啊台灣保證落實法案是不是讓我們鄭麗君副院長去的時候台灣的國旗跟美國的國旗並列這是正式的官方場合 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].start |
13680.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].end |
13708.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].text |
對 是嘛 是不是過去我們的軍事人員跟他們交流都不能著軍服現在可以明白的把我們的備章台灣的國旗放上去嘛 是不是這樣對 川普也講台灣是台灣啊對 所以誠實地圖條款 川普還下令啊只要是聯邦政府出資的地圖上不能把台灣化為中國的一部分 有沒有對 好 所以這是美國主動修法來展現我們台灣的主權意向外交部有沒有掌握 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].start |
13710.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].end |
13734.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].text |
有掌握阿有沒有去參與推動不能講有啦但是不方便講我們當然是希望樂見其成這落實川普總統講的嘛台灣是台灣很好來我們往下看其實美國國會通過很多友台法案啦就2026國防授權法案對不對無人載具的產業可以合作台美的海巡人員可以合作譬如說台灣國際團結法案禁止中國打完台灣的國際處境 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].start |
13736.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].end |
13761.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].text |
甚至呢終結中國對台灣威脅法案台海衝突之後可以阻斷中國的金流請問外交部美國國會通過友台法案你們都知道嗎都知道列了一張長長的表很好哪些友台的議員已經通過了努力中要通過的那這個你有去拜託嗎幾乎啦 跨黨派的啦因為這個動輒連署都是有時候都是幾十人上百人是 那這些你有主動去拜託過嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].start |
13763.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].end |
13779.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].text |
我們美處整天都在國會還是說他們議員有來訪過就覺得要幫台灣來推動這個法案我們都會跟他們在推動這些法案的時候做很好的溝通配合 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].start |
13781.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].end |
13798.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].text |
部長是不是這些法案都有這幾位重量級的國會議員在後面譬如說眾院的台灣連線主席對不對譬如說軍事委員會的主席參議員譬如說外交委員會的亞太小組的主席還有呢連民主黨的首席參議員都是嘛對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].start |
13799.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].end |
13820.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].text |
是這些你都熟嘛對 都見過達克沃斯這個女眾參議員我們印象深刻她們都沒有來過台灣我有包粽子給她吃喔 很好所以你看請她來包粽子給她吃她感受到台灣的友情回去就持續推動台美關係強化對不對對 所以部長要不要多邀請一些來 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].start |
13824.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].end |
13831.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].text |
那我們預算要趕快通過是是是所以要講給大家聽嘛我要規劃喔不然來不及你知道沒有錯但是除了這些邀請友台國會議員來訪台可以促進台美關係深化跟實質化之外我們怎麼樣還可以促進台美關係我們台灣的朋友除了去日本巨蛋球場幫聽台灣加油之外我們在美國的 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].start |
13848.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].end |
13860.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].text |
我們的僑胞們他可以怎麼樣來促進兩國的關係是不是有聽說一個FAPA持續遊說美國國會連署支持台灣住宿證明有沒有看到這個有有外交部的看法怎麼樣是不是要加強力度知不知此我們FAPA連署要求國會澄清讓台灣的住宿證明台灣我們樂觀其成啊樂觀其成暗中失利 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].start |
13872.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].end |
13893.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].text |
就是我們 我覺得民間自發的在推動這個我想對於美國 美國是個民主的國家 很重視民意是的 所以呢 國下而上 是然後跨黨派 然後行政立法部門都能夠來進行遊說所以呢 外交部不只我們要具體的行動告訴其他國家不可以矮化台灣 不可以把台灣扭曲他們的國格 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].start |
13894.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].end |
13910.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].text |
負責在中國底下我們在美國的住處我們是不是就像您剛說的川普說沒什麼好問的台灣就是台灣對不對他們的盧比歐國務卿也說台灣不會美國不會把台灣當籌碼跟中國換取任何協議對不對這都是他們公開講過的所以你認為現在我們在美國的住處有幾個我們現在代表住處還有12個辦事處啊12個我怎麼寫呢我查了13個 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].start |
13919.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].end |
13925.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].text |
代表處算一個啊代表處算一個所以12加1有沒有把握未來這些代表處跟辦事處讓它證明台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].start |
13927.867 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].end |
13946.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].text |
因為這也涉及到我們跟美國之間涉處的規定所以需要美國國會議員推動友台法案需要我們台灣的僑團聯名連署請願請美國民主國家尊重民意把這個事情讓台灣就是台灣好不好好那我現在問你一個私下的問題來我們看一下台積電在鳳凰城設廠你喜歡哪個名稱台灣科技園區還是台美產業園區 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].start |
13953.766 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].end |
13974.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].text |
這都可以納入討論我也是如果這兩個名字任何一個我都接受也希望部長能夠去私下推動讓台積電在美國的社廠明明白白的告訴人家這是台灣的科技園區在美國科學園區我們台灣的科學園區是一個世界上的一個楷模也讓世界知道好不好好 謝謝謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].start |
13981.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].end |
13995.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].text |
接下來請王洪威委員上台質詢好謝謝主席請林部長請林部長部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].start |
14004.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].end |
14025.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].text |
部長我知道我們外交部其實要維持還有經營我們中華民國的對外關係是非常非常艱苦的因為台灣的國際的這個外交情勢的環境確實是很難的那我剛在上來之前有人傳給我一個在網路上PTT |
| transcript.whisperx[532].start |
14026.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].end |
14044.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].text |
有一個爆料那個爆料是日本日本針對這一次卓榮泰院長到日本去看球那在這之前其實日本政府因為這個當然是日本政府不會不知情的不管是之前的 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].start |
14044.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].end |
14060.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].text |
我們的賴清德以副總統身份到日本去做調驗或者是卓榮泰院長去看球那當然日本是希望不要有任何的surprise也不要把它變成是一個外交的宣傳 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].start |
14061.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].end |
14074.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].text |
但是因為這件事情後來的曝光使得這個爆料的內容是說日本高層極為震怒所以呢我們我方還有去跟這個日本相關單位來做說明因為我剛來之前我看到有人傳給我說網路上已經有這樣的一個爆料我不曉得 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].start |
14086.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].end |
14103.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].text |
他們這樣的相關這樣的一個這個敘述最近以來其實我們都一直有聽聞所以請問一下部長知不知道有這件事情還是你們所了解這個爆料完全是子虛烏有呢還是呢他其來有之 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].start |
14104.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].end |
14128.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].text |
報告委員因為我還沒有看到這個爆料我會來加以了解那我想雙方面啊卓院長有已經有公開講嘛他這是私人行程然後對方那個他們的這個這個官房長官他們也有提到根據我方講這是這個私人行程所以他們也沒有評論我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].start |
14130.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].end |
14151.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].text |
那個部長可能要趕快去了解因為按照這個披露的內容是說因為日方得知在這個卓院長的這個團裡面還有發言人與攝影官也在訪團名單之中所以呢 讓日方質疑是不是有意要對外來揭露 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].start |
14153.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].end |
14176.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].text |
因為他們希望的是低調 我剛講不要有任何surprise所以請部長可能要趕快的去了解 好不好所以其實我想你可能也有耳聞因為這個說法其實這一陣子事實上在我們台日之間一直都有一些傳聞另外有一件比較重要的事情是要請教部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].start |
14177.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].end |
14182.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].text |
因為呢今天3月19號再過兩個月就是賴總統就職兩週年如果我們看過去啊過去包含蔡英文總統或者馬英九總統他們在就職兩年的時候呢他們都已經先後的以所謂的元首外交出擊 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].start |
14199.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].end |
14218.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].text |
那都已經對外出訪已經達到五次不管馬總統或蔡總統那陳水扁總統呢他比較少是起碼也有三次可是到目前為止賴總統幾乎都一直宅在國內所以呢我想請問一下部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].start |
14218.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].end |
14232.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].text |
在520賴總統就職兩週年之前賴總統有沒有機會能夠出訪否則這樣比一比實在次數太少那會讓人家質疑賴總統的元首外交做得不夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].start |
14234.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].end |
14259.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].text |
報告委員我們當然在評估中是有收到斯瓦帝尼政府的邀請因為他們是有重大的慶典其他當然也有一些有我們的友邦有表達邀請以前我們有時候元首出訪說一般國事訪問也會比較配合慶典因為這樣子所以現在都會去 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].start |
14261.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].end |
14270.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].text |
會去嗎 我們還在評估中因為說4月4月那就是在520之前如果4月是在5月之前對 沒有錯所以確實有機會去 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].start |
14273.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].end |
14297.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].text |
這評估中其實今天很多人問到有關於韓國的對我們的電子入境卡用中國台灣方式我們予以反制當然在網路上有人講說不如改南朝鮮不然的話其實就直接改高麗高麗當年因為她的宗主國是中國 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].start |
14299.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].end |
14314.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].text |
這當然是網友認為說今天既然我們要反制就要讓人家覺得我們的憤怒否則僅僅是這種改一個男孩不痛不癢無法來顯示然後讓 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].start |
14316.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].end |
14341.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].text |
這個韓國知道我們對這件事情的憤怒那另外一個比較好具體的當然其中有一個比較我們最擔心的事情因為原來他是在二月底他就要取消好紙本的入境卡好那個如果取消紙本入境卡的話那變成我們只能要去韓國只有這個先這個電子入境卡不過他現在呢要延後 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].start |
14342.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].end |
14363.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].text |
要延後所以我要說啊我們抗議聲音大一點我們兇一些我們在意一些當然對韓國來講他至少如果採取雙軌並行的時候那國人可以可以做選擇所以我想請問部長在我們的交涉過程裡面有沒有要求如果韓國拒不 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].start |
14365.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].end |
14374.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].text |
我們的這個中國台灣的這樣的民意是不是要求韓國不要取消資本入侵行我們認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].start |
14376.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].end |
14403.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].text |
就是最根本的方法還是要正視我們的立場我們倒不是用憤怒的方式我們是用不斷的跟他諮商一開始他不太理我們最近開始有反應了就剛剛委員講的本來2月就要把那個資本取消他們至少先保留那有些用適緩折元所以我們就開始跟他在交涉那交涉的時候我們也設了一些時間跟方案那也先尊重他讓他知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].start |
14404.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].end |
14419.146 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].text |
就是說你做什麼我們會做什麼你不做什麼我們大概也會做什麼部長這件事其實我們真的要高調反應你知道台灣是韓國就是它的旅遊市場裡面我們的客源排第幾大嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].start |
14421.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].end |
14445.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].text |
我們是前三大我們是前三大所以當然我們的反應他們要重視啊當然也許我們不一定要把他搞到說我們今天就抵制韓國不去韓國什麼等之類也不要弄到說好像你去韓國你就變成不愛台灣我覺得不需要做這樣的操作但是 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].start |
14447.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].end |
14460.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].text |
其實韓國有一種聲音希望南韓政府應該要從善如流改掉對我們的稱呼所以這個已經有產生他們大部分韓國的人也覺得他們政府那樣做就是搞混了我們一年去韓國超過180萬人次我們是他的第三大的客源國 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].start |
14472.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].end |
14480.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].text |
那當然我們今天就是用比較理性的方式去做溝通那我覺得所以你今天變成是一個變成我們給他改成男孩你當然會被我們自己的網友笑嘛就覺得你這種改名有什麼不痛不癢 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].start |
14488.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].end |
14515.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].text |
所以我覺得這件事情它既然發生一種啦老蔣我的建議有一種是鴕鳥建議啦就是說你至少紙本你要維持住你讓國人我有機會選擇不然你通通都是用電子入境卡是可能就會覺得說那我到底要去不去我覺得這是老蔣我這種建議是比較鴕鳥式的但是呢我還是希望我們既然要做抗議 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].start |
14516.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].end |
14542.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].text |
就不要做半套 好不好不然的話你這樣子真的會被國人笑啦好不好 那就絕一點 真的啊改南朝鮮 改高磊啊在歷史上他確實曾經啊什麼大宋高磊 什麼大元高磊什麼都有過啊 對不對我們不希望去開啟這種什麼樣的外交的這種征戰但是呢 我覺得基本的互惠這是必須要維持的 好不好好 對等跟尊嚴對 好 謝謝好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].start |
14547.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].end |
14551.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].text |
接下來請羅志強羅志強羅志強委員不在請楊瓊英楊瓊英楊瓊英委員不在請陳青龍委員上台質詢請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].start |
14575.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].end |
14591.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].text |
喂好部長好回為八年了都沒有跟我們部長在對話了在議事廳上執行所以整整八年了那今天 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].start |
14592.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].end |
14618.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].text |
我對部長針對我們今天已經有好多外委員針對我們把韓國對我們的入境從去年2月其實就更改了但是到現在我們外交部終於有動作那部長今天也直接對外媒體在委員會的詢問通通都改稱為南韓了 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].start |
14620.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].end |
14633.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].text |
好 那肯定補責嘛那再來 我想我們一直主張的就是我們要相互尊重平等對待 對不對那你現在給 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].start |
14634.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].end |
14661.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].text |
南韓3月31號希望他有一個回應如果他根本不管你呢那我們外交部有沒有更積極的作為好 剛委員報告我們是從3月1號開始啊把這一個南韓的這個在台的僑民啊這個拘留證你先改了嗎對 先改了嘛對那再來就是我們當然是這個入境啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].start |
14662.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].end |
14671.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].text |
就電池這個卡的登錄那個表所以我們外甲不能做到這樣子但是我們現在知會的地方韓國 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].start |
14673.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].end |
14701.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].text |
南韓還是原來的電子路路徑還是一樣全南台灣那資本給你保留他就是這樣的作為你外交部就吞了吧不會不會啦我們就略三略底之前他要回應我們不是只是現在這個情形的保留你有把握嗎我沒有辦法說超支在我百分百但超支在我的部分啊我就是把它做到百分百好 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].start |
14703.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].end |
14720.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].text |
這個就看我們外交部怎麼作為好 看外交部的作為今天很多委員也提到了我們在美國伊朗中東戰爭這個部門關於撤僑護僑這件事應該都提出很多的討論 已經很多的討論那我現在直接問部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].start |
14729.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].end |
14744.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].text |
到今天為止我們在中東在這樣的一個戰爭維繫之下我們還有多少僑民或是我們的國人同胞要回來台灣還沒有回來到目前為止還有人嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].start |
14745.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].end |
14760.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].text |
沒有 因為我們有公佈三個數字嘛已經協助回來的然後有續住的有啊 我們有公佈現在將近三千人了對 我們都隨時密切注意至少我們在地的這一些僑民 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].start |
14762.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].end |
14777.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].text |
我們都掌握到他們目前是沒有我們都主動聯繫是不是但至於說觀光旅遊因為有出有進進進出租又有一些新的我們現在也請交通部跟觀光署跟旅行社能夠密切聯繫把這個資訊跟我們同步 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].start |
14781.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].end |
14796.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].text |
保護你們國人在海外人生生命的安全碰到這樣的一個戰爭或是這個緊急的狀況外交部當然就是第一線要來擔負起這個責任那過去 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].start |
14801.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].end |
14812.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].text |
我們對包機啊我們也曾經有包機過嘛對包括過去我的資料來講過去我們曾經在在這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].start |
14814.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].end |
14838.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].text |
俄羅斯戰爭還有在以色列跟哈馬斯的衝突我們曾經都有這樣的一個例子但是這一次在我們的中東每一個戰爭我們根本把這個包機讓國人可以回來這個部分我們把它列為甚至沒有把它列為備案都直接 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].start |
14839.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].end |
14865.685 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].text |
做保持說有聯繫協助更改機位更改航班做這樣的當然這很多是旅行團的我知道你早上已經解釋很多但是我要談的今天我們不管旅行團不管國人他可能透過國際友好國家包括日本就是有協助我們了解但是我們有部分是由大陸這邊幫忙好 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].start |
14867.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].end |
14878.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].text |
為了國人的生命安全其實能夠平安的回到台灣是最好的但是我這邊就要有一點還是要跟我們執政黨做一個說明明明回來了我們還是要用任職作戰來處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].start |
14885.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].end |
14902.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].text |
還是要用任職作戰來處理包括部長你早上也提包括我們講南韓韓國我們有一些網路的聲音部長還是會把他導引說這是網民的任職作戰等等等我在這裡講部分啦 一開始不是啦我覺得我們做一個執政黨我們還是要很正面的很正面的去處理我們國人同胞的安全 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].start |
14912.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].end |
14938.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].text |
所以我在這邊強烈建議我們以後過去有日本合作有一個經驗我們也曾經透過美國的幫忙我們外交部應該要有一個跨國的協作來精進保護我們的國人同胞在國際上國外有生命危險立刻要護橋撤橋能夠來做一個SOP一個標準的一個這個流程 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].start |
14939.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].end |
14960.702 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].text |
部長這樣OK嗎我跟委員報告幾點第一點行政院是有召開過會議有關於要不要包機或鑽機去所謂撤僑或護僑但是後來行政院的決定並沒有這是行政院的決定我們都是準備的我們的外交部應該要去把這個我要跟委員報告的是其實我們的管處跟美日 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].start |
14969.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].end |
14993.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].text |
歐 這些國家都有協調 歐洲參與歐洲參與所以讓我們台灣人一家一家的性命安全讓他們安全 真的我們台灣就是我們最重要的國家我跟委員舉這個例子 比如說以色列我們是隨時跟其他國家派駐的大使館你一切都在做你講的那個跨國協作我們會把它當作重點因為我們自己做不到的有些有門可能國安法這樣下去做 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].start |
14996.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].end |
15011.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].text |
好 謝謝好 謝謝部長好 謝謝接下來請鄭振淺 鄭振淺 鄭振淺委員不在請蔡易瑜蔡易瑜 蔡易瑜委員不在請陳冠廷委員上台質詢主席麻煩請部長請林部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].start |
15032.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].end |
15050.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].text |
委員好 部長好 部長我們先從美洲這邊開始講起直接問我們在中南美有過去許多邦交國最近有沒有可能有沒有機會來去復交或者是來拓展加一個邦交國 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].start |
15052.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].end |
15070.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].text |
報告委員這個是我們努力的方向那當然現在天時地利人和也比較具足可是因為這個建交或涉觸也涉及到雙方面我想各自政府可能也要有內部還有很多配套那當然因為現在的美國政府重視西半球 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].start |
15071.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].end |
15096.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].text |
你也知道川普總統剛剛在邁阿密開過所謂美洲之盾也把一些理念相近國家召集馬克.魯比歐國務卿更是積極在推動他們也都對台灣在當地國家如果有設大使館或代表署都有發揮很好的功能這也是符合美國現在的政策所以剛剛講所謂加一我們也是同步在進行 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].start |
15098.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].end |
15111.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].text |
當然我們是希望基於兩國是長久的這種關係而不是一時然後為了要增加數字上的變化所以確實是都有在推動當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].start |
15113.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].end |
15136.064 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].text |
好那就是有樂觀的可能性就是我們可以樂觀的預期說有機會在林部長的任期內增加邦交國我們會努力好謝謝那接下來我談一下玉山論壇玉山論壇這幾天有邀請到許多重要的國際的政治人物來訪那包含波蘭前總統這個華勒莎 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].start |
15139.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].end |
15166.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].text |
他是在前天的御山論壇表示他說在當前的幸運局勢下中華民族必須統一團結等等等等然後由台灣引領中華民族的統一等等我想請教一下部長對這個的看法是怎麼樣為何我們邀請的這些訪兵他跟地區盛行的主流民意是脫節的而且我們不只是讓他脫節讓他講出來之後我們甚至還要宣傳強化這樣子的說法嗎我想請部長來簡單回應一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].start |
15168.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].end |
15190.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].text |
報告委員如果你詳細去了解華勒莎總統她的所有的談話其實她有幾點重點第一個她反共她認為共產黨跟共產主義應該要消失也不可能成功第二點就是反對武力解決衝突包括戰爭所以要用和平的手段第三點她是認為台灣要積極 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].start |
15192.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].end |
15210.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].text |
因為我們的成功的模式不是說所謂的統一這些東西的翻譯是有問題的它是意思是說它講的是一個華人社會的概念因為它也看到我們就是說在一些不管是各種的族群 膚色 語言上面所以我們怎麼樣積極的 有創意的 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].start |
15215.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].end |
15242.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].text |
改變跟中國的關係而且他相信我們會勝利而他甚至講他一生都要為這個來奮鬥站在台灣的這一邊就是我覺得聽了也是有他自己整套他的團結公聯的經驗他說當時蘇聯多強我們他都可以不用戰爭最後能夠得到波蘭的獨立跟民主化那台灣現在的實力也在這個不在這個之下甚至更有機會 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].start |
15243.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].end |
15265.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].text |
我覺得這是一個比較正面的不是說要去統一或是什麼這樣的一個方式去論述的如果詳細一點完整來看你剛剛講的我同意第一個它是反共的然後第一個你剛剛提到這個說引領就用我們的軟實力用我們的民主的經驗然後結合波蘭過去的經驗這些我都理解但是我必須要強調當他說出這樣子的 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].start |
15268.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].end |
15288.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].text |
特別是跟民族相關所謂的中華民族相關的話某種程度就會被用於中共的這種敘事模式裡面他沒有要專注在你剛才講的他要專注在他講的中華民族的部分什麼統一的部分但我必須要強調你台灣你自己自我認同怎麼樣我們不會去一一的來去干預每一個人的自我認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].start |
15289.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].end |
15309.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].text |
但是2300萬人民裡面有許多他專注在鞏固台灣也就是說台灣是我們的共同的一個identity所以我們不見得是要照他的這個什麼中華民族的這種identity下面去做自己身份認同那這樣子的說法某種程度會誤導國際大眾那我認同剛才部長講的每一句話 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].start |
15310.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].end |
15339.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].text |
包含這個反共他希望說是共產主義這一種等等來去消滅等等這些都可以但是重點要強調我們對自己的認同就是台灣那你再講到中華民族的話等於是說把我們過去剩一二十年想要建構自己主體的部分某種程度是有點削弱那當然他的這個利益是良善的那他有他自己理解台灣的一個狀況不過我報告委員他講那個Chinese nations是複數 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].start |
15343.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].end |
15357.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].text |
他的概念不像我們生活在這裡的區別很多而且我們自己的認同我想他有提到一個觀念我覺得是自由他認為自由是一切的基礎共產主義是不可能允許自由 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].start |
15357.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].end |
15379.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].text |
就是說台灣在這方面讓他感受到這也是歐洲後來蘇聯倒了之後整個歐盟形成也是一個跨國家的另外一種制度安排因為我跟他談得比較深他甚至講過他一生沒有到過去中國中國各方邀請他他的條件就是他要在天安門事件的現場 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].start |
15382.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].end |
15407.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].text |
去講出對這個被屠殺的這一些人就是在那邊要說話他們連怕就怕是不敢去所以他是一個蠻有趣的就是說蠻有他是一個style的所以我是覺得不用有時候陷入到一個因為媒體當然抓標題有時候他的需要不過我覺得我想他這次來其實整體來講 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].start |
15410.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].end |
15416.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].text |
是有讓玉山論壇我想他的這個角色跟重要性發揮出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].start |
15417.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].end |
15444.234 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].text |
好 謝謝部長 但是我還是強調我們台灣自己的主權我們沒有要追求跟中國任何他講到的什麼中華民族的追求這種統一的對 他也很討厭跟尊重我們我不會 我不做此想那我也不希望說這樣子的說法被過度詮釋那我們重心還是一樣我們未來在這個不管是預算論壇或者是改革安論壇等等的時候我們可能要注意一下哪些 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].start |
15445.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].end |
15473.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].text |
可能會被中共作為曲解或者是拿來做他們的大外宣用我們自己也要注意不然變成說我們好不容易辦好的找這麼多這種國際有影響力的政治人物來的時候反而走向對我們比較不利的地方我覺得這個會比較可惜好那第二個部分想請教部長這一次的中東的這一個衝突在中東衝突發生之前包含美國跟以色列有沒有透過外交渠道先讓我們有預先的防範 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].start |
15475.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].end |
15500.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].text |
我們是都密切注意到底川普總統什麼時候會打會不會打打了之後的情形所以當然他打是沒有告訴我們說什麼時候打不過我們的綜合研判這個是會打的所以大概對我們來講也在危機的應變裡面已經有做一些就是一些想定一些劇本 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].start |
15504.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].end |
15524.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].text |
OK所以我之所以講這個事情是因為說我們希望說現在如果沒有這樣子的渠道的話那可能不見得是在公開講但是說如果未來能夠爭取我們的盟友在做任何大型的可能會影響到周遭國家或者是全球的因為貿易影響等等的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].start |
15524.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].end |
15540.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].text |
能夠有事先的就是你也可以說under the table的這種渠道讓我們能夠有所預備那特別是在假設特別要撤僑或者是做一些相應的防範的時候我們會更有準備我覺得不管他們願不願意給我們都要有這個要求在 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].start |
15541.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].end |
15563.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].text |
特別如果真的是把我們沾很重要的盟友的話我相信這是對彼此之間都會互惠的那如果事先得知這些訊息的話甚至我們可以事先來協助美方在我們的能力的範圍之下那我想這都對我國未來不管是在貿易談判軍事採購等等都會有所幫助讓他們知道我們是真正的沒有特別是對美國這個我覺得我們可以做那最後 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].start |
15564.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].end |
15586.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].text |
總和外交部長是非常重視的那外交部去年10月有成立無人機外交的小組那這一個部分要透過也是榮邦計畫嘛來推動無人機學院推動友邦捐贈飛手栽培認證接軌等等的那我這個是非常認可的因為我們嘉義民雄航太園區未來也是無人機培訓未來也是需要媒合的一個重點 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].start |
15587.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].end |
15603.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].text |
所以既然部長有這樣子的宏願就是把這個外交部那人人都是外交官部部都是外交部就是等於是說把經濟安全上面領域你都要做到這個能夠來協助的部分那我就希望說接下來外交部可以更主動的跟中科院來談 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].start |
15604.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].end |
15626 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].text |
合作或者是協助的方向那特別是比方說中科院最近有三次來去跟對外公開說明未來無人機航太園區包含一些招標的期程未來廠房的這個配置實驗室的配置等等可是這是中文嘛所以上次我在行政院長質詢的時候我特別希望說外交部來協助首先把各國的把語言翻譯 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].start |
15626.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].end |
15640.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].text |
提供給歐洲、美國、日本這些相關可能會進駐的新創團體我覺得這是很有幫助的也就是我們讓更多人知道說米雄航太園區現在是歡迎各個國家的創新、新創的團隊進駐威恩基產業的團隊進駐 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].start |
15643.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].end |
15667.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].text |
那其實包含SHELL AI、ANDROID等等這些全部都是現在美國等於是創新破壞性科技的新科技的這些無人載具的公司那我們不把它當成是就我們只找成熟的其實有一些新創創新的這些公司它甚至還沒有成型但是如果我們可以提供像是民用航站園區相關這樣的資訊的話等於是一個很好的服務益趣這個部分部長可不可以簡單來回應我們一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].start |
15668.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].end |
15685.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].text |
報告委員 確實如你所說 台灣發展無人機是我們國家的政策在外交上面我們去推動成立無人機外交 還有包括一些國際的學院也是基於龍幫計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].start |
15687.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].end |
15698.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].text |
的需要我們台灣有很好的法規制度然後也有場域的經驗然後另外很多的未來的檢測認證然後到我們現在雅創包括整個產業聚落 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].start |
15701.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].end |
15725.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].text |
這個確實是現在外賓來參訪很想去嘉義的一個地方所以在這個部分呢我們已經有具體的規劃那也透過龍幫計畫比如說我們現在很多的人才訓練我們就可以在台灣以及在他們那個國家設立一些分處甚至我們也可以跟美國合作這個都在進行一個所謂外交因為很多國家 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].start |
15725.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].end |
15740.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].text |
都透過我們的館處跟我們講說想跟台灣交流所以這個是包括美國當然那個考察團事實上在兩年前我也帶團到歐洲就是那個無人機商機拓展的這個聯盟也確實後來得到很好的效果包括在波蘭 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].start |
15742.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].end |
15769.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].text |
這個立陶宛跟這個拉脫維亞等地不然我補充一點就是說因為他們的這一個要邀請各個國家的團隊進駐的時候有包含他們要跟他們解釋各種稅務上面的優惠土地政策的土地稅收等等的就是優惠跟這些國外的這些廠商希望他們來進駐嘛那我們現在除了國內我們當然也很歡迎國內但是特別是跟美國的關係如果能夠合資合建合造的話那 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].start |
15770.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].end |
15795.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].text |
效果會更好所以我希望說不要把它當成是中科院的事情外交部能夠主動把它當成是一個專案那跟中科院來談一下看怎麼樣把這個東西再把它擴大我們現在不是只有民雄航太園區包含在太保的這個亞創等等還會有在這個海邊的這個包含無人載具就是水面上水面下的無人載具等等所以它是一個很宏觀的東西我是希望說部長可以主動來掌握 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].start |
15796.232 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].end |
15824.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].text |
自己當成是一個發起的一個對象不要讓他都讓中科院因為中科院還是負責研究維持嘛因為工研院現在也積極的在推動無人機也是未來我想在產業創新合作上跟國際接軌啊其實他是在尤其是兩用的這些無人機居民兩用方面的一個角色也是非常重要我們會重視我這樣聽起來不然你是願意就是開始跟中科院之間開始建立一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].start |
15824.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].end |
15853.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].text |
有有有 我上次廚房也有找他們院長一起去包括漢祥 包括所有這些因為林文委員說的其實您應該了解我當交通部長的時候那個無人機的這個納入名昂好的專章然後到怎麼跟嘉義合作然後今天然後整個發展剛好我還在扮演外交部的角色所以無人機外交會是我們這個階段的一個推動的重點也非常的成熟國際也想跟我們合作 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].start |
15853.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].end |
15872.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].text |
可能先把我們這個手冊pamphlet就是關於那個英文化第一優先然後再來就因為其實有很多日本的廠商也有興趣日本 英文還有一些主要的歐洲的語言這樣好 謝謝我們再施下一個請教好 謝謝好 謝謝接下來請葉元之委員上台質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].start |
15892.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].end |
15894.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].text |
主席好我們先請林部長請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].start |
15903.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].end |
15925.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].text |
現在外交部針對韓國電子路徑卡把我們變成China跨乎台灣提出反制嘛對不對現在是要在那個現在這個反制做法第一不是說要在僑民的那個拘留證上面現在改成南韓嘛我想先確定一件事情因為南韓他現在是把我們標示為China跨乎台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].start |
15926.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].end |
15953.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].text |
然後把對岸標示為China 跨乎PR然後香港或澳門他是把後面是跨乎PR China所以看得出來就是他其實把台灣跟中國大陸、香港、澳門已經有所區隔了那現在外交部的立場是希望他把就是南韓我們現在也叫南韓把台灣變成The Republic of China還是台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].start |
15954.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].end |
15974.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].text |
還是The Republic of China台灣還是怎麼樣因為在我們台灣裡面這個包括我們政府也都對我們這國家也好幾種稱呼啊有時候中華民國有時候中華民國台灣有時候台灣那你是希望那個韓國是要標示哪一個是以哪個為主還是三個隨便一個都可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].start |
15974.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].end |
16002.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].text |
因為他現在是說你的下一個目的地跟你上一個這個地點這個把他寫成China他人家以為我們是要去中國啊沒有台灣啊你要說中華民國當然也很好啊所以如果是ROC是OK嘛ROC是OK的然後ROC台灣因為現在世界上認定的那個China尤其他這樣列法那當然就是我先確定一下嘛所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].start |
16005.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].end |
16018.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].text |
他可能就是少了RO啦如果他是ROC然後台灣你就OK啦但是他如果是他如果是China 跨乎台灣因為實際上 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].start |
16020.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].end |
16031.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].text |
應該也不會搞錯因為上面就是有寫台灣嘛因為我們的英文名稱也有China嘛The Republic不能這樣解釋那以後全世界都包容我是要跟你確認啦我是要跟你確認說你是希望變成怎樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].start |
16036.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].end |
16053.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].text |
就是ROC可以然後ROC台灣也可以然後台灣也可以嘛所以你是用這種最簡單台灣就是台灣所以你是用這種方式跟他交涉但是不能China就直接台灣這樣人家會誤會誤會說是別的地方嘛對 目前會誤會因為為什麼我要這樣問呢因為我是不知道說外交部到底就是我們政府有沒有一個跟全世界的國家一致性的說法就是說你們以後稱呼我們就要稱呼什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].start |
16064.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].end |
16084.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].text |
那剛剛的部長去目的地是去台灣不是去中國的台灣剛剛部長的講法是說三個都可以啦三個都可以中華民國 中華民國台灣台灣都可以那其他國家到底知不知道這件事啊大部分的國家都叫我們台灣啊你以為目的地去台灣喔丹麥就不是啦這個是其實是比較正常的啦所以你是用目的地來 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].start |
16085.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].end |
16097.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].text |
在抗議而不是以國家名在抗議你是以目的地是因為他把目的地搞錯怕我們的這個人家會搞錯地方去錯地方你是基於這個原因去抗議不是因為他把我們的國家搞錯 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].start |
16101 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].end |
16120.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].text |
因為你剛剛一直在扯目的地嘛所以部分是因為這個原因所以這是目的地的原因那你就是要跟大家講 全世界講到底稱呼我們什麼我覺得要講清楚那像比如說像丹麥的2020他是把國籍啦他是國籍 不是目的地他是國籍他把台灣改成中國那你也有抗議嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].start |
16121.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].end |
16127.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].text |
駕照或者是其他的證件都會受影響那個部長我會講喔丹麥是不是 葛雲南是不是丹麥的還是美國的部長我現在只是講說就是我們也支持你去抗議但是你要讓人家知道說什麼是可以什麼是不行嘛對啊如果是目的地的話那要寫清楚不然會走錯地方如果國籍的話那到底你要寫什麼對不對在我們這邊你們 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].start |
16150.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].end |
16166.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].text |
政府就講三種說法其他國家更不會知道啊所以第一個你要講清楚嘛然後第二個我覺得我也不希望說我們跟南韓變成一種惡意螺旋那之前南韓的總統尹錫悅在宣布戒嚴的時候然後執政黨、民進黨黨團 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].start |
16168.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].end |
16196.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].text |
就PO了篇文章 他說南韓總統尹錫悅為了守護自由憲法宣布戒嚴然後說什麼南韓國會被親北韓勢力操控就是發文附和附和之後自己可能也覺得好像太見獵心喜把它刪掉但問題是南韓很多人就對這個很不滿奇怪了 我們國家被宣布戒嚴這是破壞民主的事情你們台灣的執政黨的國會居然在附和尹錫悅 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].start |
16197.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].end |
16218.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].text |
那所以這個事情後來也不了了之啦我也沒看到好像民進黨有對這個事情做什麼處分但是當時南韓的輿論就對這件事情非常不滿啊就覺得執政黨怎麼這樣我們被戒嚴欸那麼違反民主的事居然台灣在執政黨附和很不爽啊那這個事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].start |
16219.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].end |
16233.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].text |
今天這個事情當然他如果做一些事情我們不OK我們去抗議我覺得正常可是也不希望說一直敵意螺旋所以我們對於南韓除了有一些比較負面的互動之外你們也積極的想要化解一些敵意有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].start |
16233.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].end |
16262.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].text |
我們是溝通溝通再溝通我們都是真的是希望大家能夠針對這個問題來解決所以他們本來是因為入境這個電子卡要整合紙本現在先暫停有這個時間我們才正視我們的問題所以我們不希望這樣的一個所謂的登記卡或者是去影響到 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].start |
16265.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].end |
16291.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].text |
我知道你的做法我沒有說不OK我現在講的是另外一個層面我是說因為最近好像跟南韓有一些比較負面的新聞出來外交部這邊有沒有也很積極的去跟李在民政府或什麼做一些比較正面的互動有沒有我們那個邱高偉代表以前是我當總統他是第三局局長他層次很高都有跟他們交涉現在至少見得到人以前 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].start |
16293.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].end |
16317.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].text |
所以在跟南韓 他的外交部連科長都不見你啊而且很多公文的往來真的是超乎我們一般外交的規範在處理的那如果變好的話不是單一事件但是我們在這個事情上要有一種如果有往好的方向那理論上來講電子入境卡這個事情就應該很好解決啊那為什麼會拖得那麼久 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].start |
16317.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].end |
16343.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].text |
拖了一兩年因為你們是從去年開始就在跟韓國交涉了所以感覺上應該可能跟韓國關係也不是你講這麼好的也有很好的地方啦真的我們也是在各個產業上也是有合作觀光旅遊文化各方面都有然後剛剛前面的委員也有問我們現在能不能增加邦交國因為我一直在什麼自由時報看到洪都拉斯的新聞 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].start |
16345.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].end |
16362.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].text |
他很關心那個洪都拉斯白蝦賣得好不好嘛然後就一直講說洪都拉斯自從跟台灣斷交之後那個白蝦賣不出去啊什麼的然後兩個禮拜前啊洪都拉斯的議長說要希望重新與台灣恢復外交關係那外交部這邊有沒有什麼回應啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].start |
16364.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].end |
16370.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].text |
對洪都拉斯人家都那麼正面了我們也做好準備但是他們國家政府的決定什麼樣的一個決定我們當然是也都會溝通所以外交部這邊的態度是 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].start |
16379.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].end |
16408.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].text |
反正我們就看看他怎麼說白蝦賣不出去受不了來找我們不是白蝦是台灣模式其實阿斯普拉總統他很重視是醫療教育跟創造就業這三項他競選政見他最重視我的問題是說針對建交這件事他們都已經有國內都那麼多呼籲我們是有積極的去接觸還是說我們暫時按兵不動我們都有在持續溝通中所以你會有有什麼信心嗎就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].start |
16409.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].end |
16429.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].text |
前民進黨委員在問 水到渠成是洪都拉斯還是其他國家因為說實在中國跟之前洪都拉斯的政府卡斯楚他們到底簽了些什麼東西也是要釐清這個都是他們需要一點時間 因為有對外講 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].start |
16430.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].end |
16439.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].text |
然後華為在那邊的影響力也是很大所以你的意思說沒有像只有10%他們想樂觀還是有一些因素我們應該說我們也是好 這樣就繼續努力好 繼續努力謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].start |
16453.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].end |
16454.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].text |
謝謝大家辛苦了 謝謝 |