| IVOD_ID |
17250 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/17250 |
| 日期 |
2026-02-24 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
黨團協商-2026022453 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
立法院朝野黨團協商 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
黨團協商 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
立法院朝野黨團協商 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2026-02-24T16:01:29+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-02-24T17:39:00+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
01:37:31 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/cbbd4ed0b5fcd3a0ad4b369430ec4979e8337fb7b1f7a2d3e5c851d1a80dd3156b3baeef337a7d065ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-02-24T16:30:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院黨團協商（事由：研商「邀請賴清德總統至立法院進行國情報告」相關事宜。） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
16:01:29 - 17:39:00 |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
1562.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[0].end |
1572.643 |
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熱情歡迎台灣民眾黨三位黨鞭我再說一遍 轉學的同學上課永遠第一個到特別認真 熱情歡迎 再次熱情歡迎 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
1782.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
1782.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
民進黨團呢? |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
2039.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
2043.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
熱情歡迎蔡總召來來來 熱情歡迎 熱情歡迎莊書長 范幹事長 熱情歡迎嘉賓兄來來 肥兄來來熱情歡迎 熱情歡迎 請坐請坐好 請坐請坐 請坐 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
2056.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
2075.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
好沒問題沒問題好請坐請坐謝謝各位黨團幹部都已經到了再一次向大家祝賀新年快樂那今天現場有老同學有新同學有轉學的同學都有所以我想大家不見得全部都認識容許我花一點點時間快速介紹一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
2077.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
2100.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
國民黨團副總召 這個大家都知道了 掌聲 來來來副總召我們新任的國民黨團書記長 林沛翔 魯市議長 歡迎以及新任的國民黨團首席副書記長 徐宇珍新任的民進黨團總召 蔡其昌 蔡總召算回鍋吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
2101.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
2110.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
我們回鍋的 我們民進黨團的幹事長 莊瑞雄我們新任的民進黨團的書記長 范雲 歡迎您台灣民眾黨團新任的轉學同學 陳青龍 陳總召 歡迎 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
2118.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
2142.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
王安祥副總召 歡迎您邱慧如幹事長 熱情歡迎還有我們民進黨團今天剛卸任的我們中嘉賓委員陳培宇委員 一併歡迎好 謝謝今天要主要拜託各位黨團幹部來討論就是上午院會我們通過了協商結論進行總統國情報告的協商那也跟大家特別報告一下上會期我們有通過一個建請案 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
2143.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
2151.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
請總統至本院進行國情報告有關總統府秘書長也對該案子含附已經列入了上午的報告事項 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
2153.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
2176.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
院會的決定是交付由黨團協商會議處理所以我們現在就進行本案的協商今天上午在溝通議程的時候也有黨團幹部提到有關總統國情報告的日期問答的方式等要進行溝通因此我們本院聽取總統國情報告是憲政上重要事項 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
2177.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
2201.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
基於總統昨日上午在查序中提到化解化誤解為理解我們今天就針對國情報告一案我們來先進行溝通等到我們達到一定共識之後再請總統府問相關決定是否接受我們再來處理後續的事宜現在我們就請各黨團來表示意見那國民黨團來請表達意見好嗎民進黨團 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
2209.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
2210.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
那我們請陳金榮總召進發言 好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
2215.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
2236.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
那我就攻堅不是從命啦有關我們立法院來見請總統到我們立法院來做國警報告其實這個案子是我們台灣民眾黨來提出那也謝謝我們中國國民黨的黨團來協助才會有這樣的一個決議那也在二月 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
2246.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
2250.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
11號我們立法院收到總統府秘書長的一個函物也經過我們這個韓院長在總統府的查詢有確定這個我們賴清德總統 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
2263.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
2280.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
要到我們立法院來做國情的一個報告那台灣民眾黨在這邊最主要的就是第一個希望我們能夠來確認賴清德總統到立法院來的國情報告這個國情報告的內容 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
2284.322 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
2290.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
這個內容包括我想軍購嘛軍購賴總統直接投書到媒體也跳過行政院對軍購賴清德賴總統也在總統府開的 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
2300.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
2322.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
記者會那我覺得他到立法院我們民意的最高殿堂軍購的這個報告的這個內容是我們一定要要求的第二個當然就是我們的這個台美的這個貿易協定這個是我們要求的一個內容不管行政院認為這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
2326.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
2350.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
關稅的協定是在行政院的一個職責但是賴總統多次的對我們關稅的一個協定他也下了指導期所以我們臺灣民眾黨黨團對這個貿易協定的內容我們也一定要要求在報告的內容之內另外賴清德總統是應該是第一位 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
2352.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
2372.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
在我們立法院經過刪除通過的法律案我們請德賴總統不公佈 行政院不附屬這樣的一個破壞憲政的一個狀況那是不是我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
2373.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
2399.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
也要求建議要求賴總統也要在這個國情報告裡面作為他報告的內容因為就是牽涉到我們立法院我們的尊嚴還有我們的這個權益好 就是以上針對報告內容的部分台灣民眾黨黨團先行提出以上 謝謝謝謝陳總召的發言蔡總召 副總召哪一位要第二位發言 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
2402.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
2429.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
好 蔡總統沒關係 你就加油好 謝謝院長 立法院的各位同仁這個今天本席第一次坐在這個位置那我想總統到立法院做國情的報告這不是新聞我想過去多多少少在朝在野的委員都做過這樣的提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
2430.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
2446.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
但他最涉及最根本核心的問題在於他不能夠違憲所以有些委員會自己加碼就國情報告是不違憲的總統本來在相關的法規憲法總統來立法院做國情報告沒有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
2447.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
2470.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
但因為立法院的同仁過去都曾經出現加碼譬如說這個要求那個,這個要求這個然後要求像比照行政院院長的方式要來做相關的這些質詢那因為這個是涉及違憲所以後來其實都沒有辦法成行所以我想這個是過去總統國情報告在立法院,民進黨也在也過啦,這個都發生過 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
2472.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
2499.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
所以呢在這樣的一個前提底下今天我們這個來提這個問題我想原因還是要謝謝韓院長因為韓院長在新春茶會裡面跟總統提到這個事情那以我的理解總統對韓院長的意見是相當重視那也對韓院長表達尊重那更重要的總統很希望透過這個國情報告可以來促進 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
2501.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
2529.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
這個朝野更進一步把國家最重要的問題趕快來解決這是人民所期盼的從總預算一直到軍購案一直到台美的關稅問題其實這些都是中華民國重中之重的事情所以也因為這個如此賴總統願意釋出在韓院長的建議底下賴總統來釋出善意所以呢我想今天民進黨團在這裡也會清楚的表達 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
2532.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
2546.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
對於賴總統來立法院做國情報告基本上我們是支持的但是我們還是在強調希望大家在共同遵守憲法跟相關法規的規定底下我們來促成這個事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
2547.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
2573.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
就是說今天大家說白話是要把事情做好你如果要加碼在那裡說一些危險的事情就辦不成也辜負了韓院長的一番好意所以民進黨團很願意來促成這個事情所以我也來之前跟府方也做過初步的聯繫那我想賴總統還是秉持著跟韓院長的談話他很願意來立法院做國情報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
2574.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
2593.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
那所以呢這個他也願意說如果委員在國情報告結束之後有任何的想法要跟總統來分享總統也願意留下來聽大家的這個聲音但是名稱上可能韓院長所提那個統問統答四個字可能就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
2593.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2610.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
要稍微因為這個還是有違憲的爭議啦但是形式的內容他很願意在不違憲的情況底下形式的內容都遵照韓院長的方式大家他也願意留下來聽然後呢聽完之後他也願意再做第二次的發言 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2611.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2634.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
所以我想這個精神是韓院長定下來的韓院長提出來的所以民進黨團很願意來支持這樣的一個想法國家才能夠往前走問題才能夠可不可以由總統來立法院做國情報告之後大家朝野可以有一個新的開始能夠讓國家的這些關鍵的問題可以趕快解決所以我大概 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2634.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2636.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
表達初步這樣的一個想法 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2646.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2670.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
謝謝主席 謝謝院長在開春希望大家能夠一切順順利利圓圓滿滿所以您的呼籲國民黨也一一都接受也尊重對於賴總統是不是有機會成為中華民國第一個到立法院來做國情報告的總統 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2672.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2698.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
這是一個歷史的里程碑我想我們大家都會很慎重我想溝通的形式跟讓全國國人了解總統希望迫切解決的國家的問題是什麼他的想法是什麼他想提出的做法 具體的做法是什麼我想人民都很願意來傾聽 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2701.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2730.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
其實國家的總統就是國家的大家長很多事情在國會可以溝通對人民都可以溝通因為畢竟立法院就代表2300萬所有基層的民意所選出來的人是一個全覆蓋的民意在這裡正如美國最高法院所做的判決川普大帝 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2732.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2760.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
他任何的施政也必須要符合法律行為更需要有國會的授權所以我們在這裡要特別強調我們非常歡迎賴總統能夠到國會來也成為一個寫歷史的人倒是覺得大家不要太把很多的框架把它設限在那裡那如果說 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2762.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2790.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
今天我們還是要走回去過去的老路國內可以溝通但沒有溝通要用國際投訴的方式其實國內已經有很多發聲的管道更可以到立法院來直接告訴全國的國人對呀當然執政者跟在野者 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2791.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2820.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
我想民進黨也在野過嘛過去在野對執政的總統 要來國情報告也提出了相當多寶貴的看法我們都記得非常的清楚我也在想當時為什麼民進黨在野的時候會提出這樣的一個看法跟想法無非就是讓他們秉承的民意能夠徹底有機會能瞭解總統想怎麼做 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2822.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2849.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
他們也跟代表人民提出相關的問題也希望總統能夠解惑事宜讓大家能夠了解我想這個完完全全有別於在總統府開記者會所以我們覺得這個方式啊不要太拘泥要真正能夠解決問題讓大家能夠充分的了解我想這個才是啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2853.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2881.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
對賴總統的歷史定位啊會有非常高的一個評價希望這個我們今天的討論現在是第一輪的討論我們希望不要任何的框架的情況之下設限的情況之下能夠好好的充分的把大家的想法講一下我想第一輪第一次發言國民黨講得很清楚希望不要在設限的情況之下 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2883.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2910.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
總統能夠到國會不只跟人民做國情報告對各個政黨提出的問題也能有一個清晰明白的回答讓全國國人能夠來瞭解謝謝三個黨團委員第一輪都已經發言完畢基本立場表達了台灣民眾黨團非常清楚我就希望針對軍購啊關稅啊這些重要問題帶政黨必須要報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2913.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2931.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
民進黨也講得非常清楚要符合憲政的慣例不能侵犯到行政院長的權責這一點非常清楚國民黨團是不拘泥不框架但是針對國情報告完畢之後所有委員所提的問題也希望總統能夠答覆這裡面我們要思考一個問題100跟0的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2935.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2952.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
如果我們今天達成共識總統來了我們就成功了如果我們沒有辦法達成共識我們就變成零分又是虛晃一兆那我們要考量如果總統來大家國人立法委員本身要很多問題急切的需要了解 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2953.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2970.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
那明年總統會不會來?不知道下一任總統會不會來?也不知道但是我們就開創我們在場的加上總統一起我們開創一個新局起碼成立一個典範我覺得這是一個100跟0所以我非常希望能夠達成大家一個共識 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2972.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2995.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
那這裡面蔡總召所講的有她要尊重的就是你不能侵犯行政院長備詢的管理因為她畢竟不是行政院長被我們一問一答一問一答所以我昨天離開卓中蔡院長講的也很有意思她一問一答交給我放心韓院長一問一答交給我因為她行政院長所以我們顯然一問一答這個形式是在行政院跟立法院的互動那總統國情報告完畢之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2998.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
3017.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
針對各位委員所提的是第二個部分第二個part委員提出一些問題我們可以提出各黨團派幾位代表提完第三個part總統說明完我們就把很漂亮的ending創下一個先例這是我的一個希望能夠促成的一個方法一個想法好 第二輪發言我們請莊惠雄 莊惠雄請發 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
3022.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
3032.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
現在先發一個,就是總統府來了,總統府剛剛來了一個文,早上總統府潘秘書長來了一個文,我們先把他發下去,發下去之後請莊銳雄書記長請發言,我們先發下去 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
3045.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
3046.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
這是同一份?同一份 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
3081.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
3107.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
莊瑞雄,你跟上,請,請發言。好,謝謝韓院長。那,先感謝啦,韓院長,這個在查會裡面這樣一提出來以後,我們,我相信各個政黨啊,朝野之間都希望啊,總統啊,有機會啊,到立法院來做國情報告。任何人其實都可以到國會來,最難到國會的人,就叫做總統。也不是總統想來就可以來。 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
3109.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
3136.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
按照我們立法院的職權限制辦法裡面我們的規定啊我們要總統要進來還要我們要四分之一提案院會決議邀請總統到立法院來做報告他才可以到國會裡面來做報告憲法徵修條文第四條第三項的規定是立法院在每年集會的時候得聽取總統的國情報告都是來聽取總統的國情報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
3138.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
3161.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
那剛剛台灣民眾黨的講法其實談了一些啦也很具體啦就是軍購啊還有整個台美協議啊或者是立法院的這些狀況啊這個確實是國家的大事啊那這些大事呢我相信在整個國政方針裡面啊總統他國情報告完以後啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
3163.3 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
3188.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
聽到各個黨團這樣在講的話我相信重大的事情他會列入考慮總統的腦袋不會長得跟大家不一樣大家都認為很重要的他認為不重要我相信也不至於但重點是說你說我就是要用來拘束你總統你到立法院必須要來講些什麼那我講這個好像是又跟憲法的規定又不符合就是總統是受邀而來這次是受邀而來 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
3191.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
3213.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
因為這個大家看到這個113年憲判日第九號為什麼會被憲法法庭把它宣告成違憲就是跟憲法的設計會有所不同韓院長在提出這樣的一個建議的時候我第一個聽到其實我是非常開心然後第二個在我腦海裡面我這個浮現的是美國總統 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
3215.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
3232.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
到國會去發表演說法國總統到國會去發表演說為什麼我扶起的是美國跟法國而不是日本或者其他內閣制的國家因為我們顯然我們現在不是內閣制的國家我們就比較傾向於總統制的國家美國總統是講完走人法國總統發表演說完就是國情之文講完以後愛討論你們國會自己去討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
3242.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
3258.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
走人了可是以現在這樣的方式你說完全是仿造美國跟法國在我們這個國家裡面似乎又覺得沒意思了所以你總統就永遠就沒有辦法走進國會就可惜了國家的施政方針 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
3261.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
3282.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
跟在野黨之間大家來一個互動聽取這樣的一個報告好事剛韓院長提到了我更開心了就是說總統報告完以後啊在野黨或者朝野政黨之間的國會議員來跟總統提出一些建言剛韓院長的用語是總統再來說明棒 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
3285.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
3309.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
我沒有想到說今天韓院長帶領了大家一起來守護這個憲法在這個憲法的規範底下大家來做一個運作讓總統有機會到國會裡面來做這樣的一個國情報告我相信大家的目的都是希望來達成這是美式一創啊啊 枝枝節節的事情啊那其實我是覺得說 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
3310.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
3318.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
因為今天他們要拜天公啦 要拜天公的最大的禁忌就是都不要說壞話 大家都說好話不要去動怒 天公聽了都開心 有辦法成局的話這個韓院長今天真的是 不給你多按一點讚都不行 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
3331.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
3349.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
好 謝謝莊委員 臺灣民眾黨要二輪發言嗎 邱委員王委員請我們第一次來 發言就是在寫歷史 所以真的是好兆頭順著剛剛前面的不管是國民黨這邊還是民進黨這邊的一些意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
3351.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
3368.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
因為我們先前就是前幾天的那個報導來看就知道賴總統傾向可以有類似這種所謂的問統答的方式就是這個概念當然剛剛蔡總統也想過是避開這種問或答的概念也許就可以成立 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
3368.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
3397.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
那所以基本上我們是不是可以做出大概初步大家的共識就是一個諮詢的概念那剛剛那個韓院長也用了一個很好的turn叫說明叫避開那幾個字啦那看起來這個應該是沒有什麼太大的爭議也就是說這個看起來這個立法委員這邊立法院這邊還是可以提出一些諮詢那也希望總統能夠在聽取這些諮詢之後能夠給予一些說明我想我的意見大概是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
3400.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
3400.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
謝謝王委員 請國民黨團 二人發言請來 林培祥書記長請 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
3407.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
3431.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
好 謝謝沒有錯我們現在正在寫歷史畢竟來講國情報告在中華民國憲政史上是第一份但是老實說我會認為是說因為目前的世界局勢也是特別的詭譎多變那不管說是忽然說我們有這些軍購的問題也好還是說台美關稅也好還是說很多我們現在看到很多的訊息 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
3432.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
3458.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
基本上我們現在看到的訊息我們都需要一個答案我們都期待說我們更明確的一些我們可以去不管是身為立法委員還是身為中華民國的國民我們都期待說我們知道有一個一定程度的答案來去解惑而且我們想知道的是說過去這一個算是從四月份來從去年四月份來我們有很多東西不只是身為一個國會議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
3460.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
3480.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
而是身為一個公民身為一個知識分子有很多東西我們需要去了解但是我們就很期待說了解這一切就是應該是我們的國家領導人來跟我們來解惑所以說當我們聽到說有機會總統來國情報告的時候我們會期待說我們想要解惑的到底是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
3481.594 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
3507.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
當然我們現在遇到三大問題關稅、對美投資、軍購但是三大問題呢總統沒有錯我們對於所有事都不設限但是我們的求知欲我們希望說以身為國會議員也好身為一個知識分子也好我們需要取得滿足而且我們的民眾這兩千三百萬人對於目前的整個國家的狀況也需要獲得一個瞭解尤其是說我們現在看到的軍購案 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
3508.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
3523.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
軍購案裡面對於我們不是只有單純的是一個國際局勢的變化而已而是更現實的我們也很清楚的知道說這個軍購案對我們的整個國家未來的總預算未來幾年之間的總預算甚至 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
3524.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
3536.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
你想可能長達十年之久的總預算那未來到底是怎麼樣那我們期待說我們有聽到一個從國家領導人口中給我們一個正確的訊息那我想這一點來講是國民黨黨團希望能夠得到的 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
3541.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
3569.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
謝謝林培祥委員各位黨團幹部容許我把它分為三個部分看看是不是我們已經達成共識了第一個部分就是總統來立法院做一個國情報告第二個部分各政黨推出代表來諮詢總統第三個部分總統來針對各政黨委員所關切他提出說明像這樣子三個部分可以不可以如果大家同意這三個部分我們就開始來研究這三個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
3571.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
3597.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
好 請宗教兵們請我非常認同院長的這樣的一個描述只是說我這邊因為我們自己立法委員自己法治局印的這個說明我們要注意不要踩雷考試的時候要得的分數我們都要拿但是不要踩到雷被扣分那剛剛院長講那個部分容許我用我們立法院法治局的法條我們稍微把它做一些修整讓它更順 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
3598.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3623.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
不會造成外界認為立法院自己沒有合法合憲那首先這個彩色版的部分是不是我也拿給我們院長看一下因為我們是在立法院手冊法治局印的這個關於立法院職員刑事法當中被宣告違憲的部分我們把它整理放大那各位手上都有一份因為這個本書大家可以跟法治局拿字很小 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3624.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3648.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
大概呢我可以來說明一下就是目前我們小心不要去踩雷的他這裡面憲判的主文有提到說總統是否何時以何等方式到立法院聽取其國情報告是否國情報告的主題跟涵蓋範圍是總統本於自己的權責來決定那大家互相尊重那這是OK的 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3649.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3658.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
但是呢要小心喔他說立法院沒有指定國情報告內容之全所以我們不要去指定大家認為重要的總統一定會講第二個呢也無就其國情報告的內容對總統為詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3664.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3669.728 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
要求總統答覆或要求總統聽取建言之權啊那這裡面我們就避開幾個我們不要去說詢問啊或者說要求總統答 總統也不是答覆那我們我們是建言還是我們表達看法總統照他說的總統也沒有聽取要求總統聽取建言的權利那所以我們是不是建議說我們就避開了什麼建言啊 詢答啦 答覆啦通通不要用這個字眼 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3692.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3720.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
那我容我這裡來做一個剛剛院長的一個描述啦就是總統來做國情報告沒有人規定總統只能講一次嘛所以他可以先講第一次稍後再做第二次的補充我想這個部分呢完全不會踩到我們憲判的內容那至於第一次跟第二次的補充之間我們國會委員各黨團想要表達看法那當然是我們的權利嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3721.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3737.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
所以我是建議說就用剛剛院長所講的這個部分那我們在對外表述的時候或者我們要落住於行之於明文的時候呢避開大法官憲判所說不可以有違憲的部分那最後呢 容我很不好意思 上次也跟院長請託了因為呢 現在的徵修條文它的嚴格從1994年到2000年到2005年呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3748.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3773.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
這個總統的國情報告歷經了幾個階段我大概 容許我很短的跟大家報告在1994年的時候啊那時候國民大會修改 徵修條文準備1996年總統直選那大家知道在1994年之前呢國民大會是選總統的六年集會一次集會那一次就是投票選總統那當文保總統改成直選之後你國民大會留著要做什麼事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3774.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3787.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
要每年集會所以在1994年的時候我們的政修條文就寶出了一條國民大會集會時得聽取總統國情報告並檢討國事提供建言總共18個字得聽取總統國情報告9個字並檢討國事提供建言 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3798.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
3820.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
因為這樣的修憲的關係國民大會從單純的選總統多了每年可以集會聽直選後的總統來跟他做國情報告而且還可以怎樣國民大會可以檢討國事因為國民大會沒有立法權他怎麼表達對國事的看法就那麼一年一次提供建言 檢討國事提供建言那麼總統幹嘛 總統在台下聽那因為我曾經做過 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3825.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3849.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
不是做總統,我曾經做過國大代表所以李統統的時候,李先統統是在那裡是這樣做的但是呢,這個憲法的嚴格呢,在2000年的時候第六次的修憲的時候呢,產生了一個變化國民大會沒有了那國民大會這個聽取這個總統的國情報告提供建言的事情呢變成什麼?變成憲法徵求條文第四條第三項 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3850.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3859.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
他就只有幾個字喔立法院於每年集會時九個字得聽取總統國情報告沒有了為什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3862.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3891.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
這個檢討國事提供建言不見了呢因為那時候在修憲的時候認為說並檢討國事提供建言立法院不需要因為立法院每個會席都跟行政院進行施政總諮詢所以不需要再跟總統來進行檢討國事提供建言要提供建言你平常就可以了所以如果我們從法律的嚴格來看本來有這九個字還可以檢討國事提供建言後來立法院繼承了這個聽取國情報告的 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3892.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3894.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
那個權力的時候呢沒有了這九個字連 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3896.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3923.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
檢討國事提供建言都不適合在這裡面表達所以我是建議說剛剛院長那個部分我們第一趴總統發表國情報告第三趴他在補充他的國情報告那在第一趴跟第三趴之間我們委員各黨團是不是在有限定的時間限定的人次我們表達我們對於看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3924.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3940.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
也不要說建言啦也不要說檢討啦也不要說提供建言也不要說是檢討我只是要表達我們各委員或各黨團的看法那這樣的話我們接下來的討論就聚焦在哪裡聚焦在說這第二趴要多少時間多少人次那以上建議 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3942.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3969.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
謝謝鍾嘉賓委的補充發言哪位黨團幹部要補充發言的沒有這三個part如果各位同意的話第一個階段就是國情報告了嘛第二階段就是各黨團大家推派幾位然後把你們的憂慮你們的關切甚至你們的懷疑講出來第三part總統就做一個收尾了我想這樣我們就寫下了一個從來沒有發生過第一次的歷史事件那請問大家有沒有什麼看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3970.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3986.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
如果沒有我們來討論第二個part就是我們各黨團推派幾位來提大家我們來進入第二個部分好不好那國民黨團你覺得副總長你覺得提每個黨團幾位委員比較適合 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
4000.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
4015.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
關於那個方法我想補充一下就是因為聽起來好像民主進步黨這邊對於問跟答這樣的一個字眼感受到比較敏感 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
4016.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
4026.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
比較忌諱 理解所以採取了一個折衷方案我想我們之前傳統的模式就有討論到統問統答 即問即答因為這兩個模式都有個問字也有個答字聽起來就是好像有點比較抵觸你們的慎重原則感覺起來你們聽到這個比較敏感 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
4042.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
4060.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
其實不管是統問統答或者是集問集答其實我們求的都是一個實問實答雖然實問實答裡頭也有你們比較忌諱的問跟答可是我們要求的就是像那個宗嘉斌委員你說的就是一個實質的回答這樣子 對那 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
4063.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
4072.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
實質的對話那現在就是說大家對於問跟答這兩個字比較敏感那我現在聽起來好像就用 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
4075.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
4096.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
以立委這個角度就用提供看法取代問然後以總統的角度就用答就用說明取代答這個角度所以就有一點比較用包裝的方式用包裝的方式去進行這是我理解到的那我想我們民眾黨我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
4098.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
4105.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
要求的就是一個時問時答一個實質的總統能夠針對問題來給我們一個回覆這樣 以上說明 謝謝我們建議這邊兩位就回答剛剛主席的問題我們建議是兩位每個黨團兩位 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
4123.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
4140.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
這個我還要遵循一下國民黨團跟民進黨 不好意思台灣民眾黨團希望222 那國民黨團請表達意見還有 這個基本上喔因為過去還是有一定的比例嘛我們的制度還是要 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
4141.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
4159.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
因為剛剛一直在強調制度嘛早上我在質詢的時候院長也說制度很重要嘛那所以我想這個部分這個部分我們過去因為我們先尊重民眾黨嘛民眾黨之後提出這兩位嘛他們希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
4160.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
4185.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
我覺得他提的兩位是代表民眾黨希望有兩位上場不是說各政黨都是兩位所以民進黨接口接得很快這是他們慣用的手法突然就失憶了我們過去的遊戲規則所以這個部分我想應該可能民眾黨要兩位我覺得我們都可以尊重那其他的話因為過去不是771就992嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
4187.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
4190.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
我想992的部分應該是會比較適合啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
4199.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
4220.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
我不知道過去是指哪一次啦不知道哪一個總統有來立法院做過國情報告所以我也不知道哪一個是992的所以我還是覺得因為其實算一算邏輯很簡單如果我們總統大概報告個三四十分鐘跟院長時間應該都很接近 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
4221.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
4227.768 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
那大概如果我們其他各個委員222或者331因為過去 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
4230.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
4258.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
我們你們要兩個222我們是沒意見啦但如果如果今天啊這個依照慣例上行政院在過去我們分配各個政黨發言的時候331是最長的啦221也有啦就看院長跟大家怎麼共同協商這個沒有叫做規矩啊這個大家怎麼協商好啊所以呢如果我們以時間來算啦我不知道一個委員要讓他講多久院長這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
4260.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
4281.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
對五分鐘嘛所以如果說我們一個委員講五分鐘那大概兩個小時以內一定要把它結束掉嘛對所以用這樣的回過頭來推大概我們就可以知道說什麼樣的分配比較合理啦那我再強調一次啦齁就是說站在民進黨團立場我們是希望促成 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
4282.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
4304.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
在這個憲法的時刻讓總統第一次到立法院來國情報告總統來這裡更重要的是希望總統用他的誠意行動配合院長的主張把一些爭議可不可以親自跟大家做一個說明叫做國情報告那我們的體制不是總統制嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
4304.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
4324.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
所以各位如果要達成那個目標其實我一直在強調內閣制總統制我都尊重憲法學者意見都很多每個人都很專精地道我也沒意見但現在我們就不是所以我們現行的制度裡面在座的各位委員你們都可以很認真的去質詢部長行政院院長 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
4325.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
4351.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
那因為總統他就不是在我們現行的架構就不是美國的制度也不是其他的這個制度所以中華民國現行就是這個樣子所以憲法就是我們最基本的依歸嘛所以在這個情況底下我就很抱歉我不是要批評啦也不是說跟大家在那邊唱反調或者要惡意成口水之戰沒有我只是說明說我們都希望促成它所以不要再 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
4352.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
4361.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
你刻意就要違憲,然後刻意違憲就讓他弄不成因為我剛剛,嘉賓委員他本來三張已經退休了 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
4362.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
4383.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
那他堅持要來,我就一定要讓他講話,因為他對於憲法他研究很深入,而且他很堅持,不能違憲所以我也希望把他的意見,在我們民主金融黨黨團裡面不一樣的聲音,我也希望他來朝野協商裡面讓大家知道一下所以我們希望促成,又不希望違憲,我們希望讓總統來 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
4385.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
4398.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
呼應韓院長的講法,但不希望違憲所以我一直在一開始我就講大家不要刻意去一直在違憲的邊緣在那邊加碼這樣就最後又事情又做不成了嘛做不成大家又開始要罵,罵總統罵最好罵罵罵罵罵,罵到院長那裡去所以我的意思說,我希望他成功 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
4408.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
4434.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
所以時間抓了 譬如說好 兩個小時之內結束那結束如果院長說才是一個人五分鐘那就大概可以有多少人那我覺得以這個邏輯來看事情就比較容易能夠行得通謝謝 各黨黨幹部我想如果我們從頭到尾以兩個小時為計算說第一次國情報告的話首先總統做國情報告大概三十分鐘左右 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
4435.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
4461.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
那後續呢就變成我們委員各黨人推派的代表來發言那一個人如果以五分鐘的話呢可以接受度大概在12位左右因為後續還有第三部分總統還要再做說明那大概也再給他20到30分鐘所以總共大概在兩個小時所以這個人數呢我初步的建議你們可以修正沒有問題就是552就每一位委員五分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
4462.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
4485.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
那十二位委員正好是一個小時總統前面國軍報告三十分鐘一個小時各位委員提出各個不同的看法最後他再說明三十分鐘這樣就比較完整而且兩個小時內而且總統六十六歲了考慮他攝護線一個小時讓他休息總統要休息十分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
4487.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
4513.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
這樣子你看怎麼樣?552好嗎?那請問國民黨團這邊有沒有?沒有,你們可以變,沒有問題,不一定要我只是提出我的一個建議而已,我們都還沒有結論大家可以提出不同看法,請謝謝學院長,因為552基本上就一個小時嘛對,前面三十,前面三十幾分鐘後面還好,還有第二次,再說你後面還好 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
4517.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
4543.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
那個我們這個部分好不好我想院長有這樣的提議我們這個部分是不是先暫定如此啦好不好還是保有可以修正的沒有暫定我們要簽字啦如果我們打成協商就沒有暫定就定 不行我就休息五分鐘你們私底下再討論一下我們等一下再來沒問題這一定三部分都要講完了才能簽字啊對啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
4544.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
4567.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
第二部分訂的話第三部分他是根據各位所提出的問題加上他自己覺得他本人覺得還有其他地方重要的那他把它做說明這邊第三部分我們不需要幫他越組帶跑嘛我們現在最確定就是第二部分這一部分如果你們有意見我現在休息五分鐘大家私底下溝通沒問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
4569.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
4589.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
院長其實這個問題也不用私底下啦就是說有一些例可以參考啦剛剛院長提到了就是說差不多你倆兩兩千嘛你把它想我們這個都很輕鬆三個政黨包括院長大家都希望這件成就一件美事嘛你看那個川普 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
4591.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
4606.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
到國會去啊,隆重轉播時間,我剛才查一個小時39分32秒,川普從走進去到結束馬克宏一個小時30分鐘,那他們都抓一個半小時,可能川普比較多話,愛講話 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4608.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4624.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
如果國會外交到國會裡面去差不多40分鐘那如果我們是抓兩個小時那我們就比美國跟法國多長了差不多半個小時好事那這是好事因為要時間來分配嘛那我們也可以總統來了你不用講那麼久嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4628.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4646.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
分配給 如果我們抓兩個小時的話這個時間跟國會來共用就是要邀請你來創造一個歷史跟國會之間大家更和氣的大家來聽聽看你的國政的一個方針然後聽聽各政黨提出他們希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4647.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4669.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
他們的國家的願景跟總統來做交流然後就像院長講的那總統再來說明那所以民進黨對於剛剛提到的我們在時間抓好的話三個五個七個我說實在話我沒有那麼堅持啦變成說這是好大家都希望這件事情可以把它成就一件美事嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4671.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4699.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
那如果說這樣的話變成我們建請總統我們連時間都要把它畫得很清楚前面20分鐘總統做出國情說明後面我們可能要調為662因為多了10分鐘出來了嘛這個人662接下來總統再做說明連這個時間我想不用畫得這麼清楚嘛因為這個就變得很怪了嘛對不對而且顯得我們一點都不大氣所以我覺得552如果大家覺得國民黨團有意見那改為662我想這樣他總TOTAL兩個小時他 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4700.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4725.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
總統府一定知道嘛,他會根據這個來調,我們予以尊重那國民黨台如果是662,您看副總召林處理長徐...徐...徐真...有第二次讓總統講話的時間,恐怕會比較受限對,所以我的意思剛剛你的552,我剛剛計算了一下,我覺得552可能時間比較剛好 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4728.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4730.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
我們台灣民眾黨這邊是非常贊成因為對我們就比例來講我們真的也讓我們很有機會來對總統提出這樣一個分享那現在就看國民黨團這邊的看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4758.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4765.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
如果現在沒有辦法決定我們就休息一下可以決定我們現在就敲定就只有這個問題了好那我們休息五分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
5811.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
5832.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
好 謝謝各位黨團幹部的多人發言謝謝大家用心關於本次我們要探討的議題那顯然我們沒有辦法達成共識我想我們就持續溝通我們再擇期協商向各位黨團報告一下好嗎好 那非常感謝今天參與 好嗎 謝謝 |