| IVOD_ID |
170428 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170428 |
| 日期 |
2026-07-13 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-22-19 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第19次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
19 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
22 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
教育及文化委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第19次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-07-13T14:00:49+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-07-13T14:15:22+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:14:33 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/0e832b2683ee9ececabd4f07dc38778d160bf55e4e25a139d628d7a5d7489f418773759d3bad123a5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
洪孟楷 |
| 委員發言時間 |
14:00:49 - 14:15:22 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-07-13T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第19次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請教育部部長鄭英耀、衛生福利部政務次長林靜儀、行政院食品安全辦公室主任許輔列席就「校園食品安全把關機制及致癌油事件因應作為」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
二、邀請教育部部長鄭英耀列席就「學生出缺勤管理及校園秩序維護政策亂象檢討與改善措施」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
三、審查教育部函為修正「高級中等以下學校教師解聘不續聘停聘或資遣辦法」部分條文及「公立高級中等以下學校教師成績考核辦法」第五條、第六條之一條文案。
四、審查
(一)國民黨黨團擬具「教育經費編列與管理法第三條條文修正草案」案。
(二)委員林德福等25人擬具「教育經費編列與管理法增訂第三條之二條文草案」案。
(………因系統字數上限，詳見議事日程)） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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不好意思,先請問一下洪孟凱委員,有要請食安辦主任說明嗎?沒有的話,因為他還有宴會,要先讓你來。沒有問題。可以嗎?可以。好。OK。好,那請部長跟衛福部次長,是不是?請林靜儀政務次長。然後跟我們教育部政部長。 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
34.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
58.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
好 我先請教一下次長 衛福部的相關我們現在看到是說這兩天又爆發是說到底中聯4月到6月生產多少噸的食用油我們有沒有掌握有 中聯我們總共29個批次那它每一個槽是1300噸所以全部目前是預防性下架那整個如果是全部算起來的話是 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
59.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
59.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
57萬噸27532.7公噸 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
71.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
99.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
兩萬多公噸這幾個批次4月到6月29個批次那我們看到新聞有報導是說昨天石崇良部長還講是說現在是預防性下架13個批次所以到底是現在預防性下架13個批次還是29個批次我們29個批次裡面目前都請他們目前這29個批次全部都是預防性下架那其中到現在有查到有問題的是5個批次 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
100.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
123.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
五個批次所以其實從一開始的一個批次兩個批次到現在五個批次會來會不會再增加不知道但是現在所影響的食用油致癌的已經高達了不是一千三百噸是現在有可能我們以最壞的打算的話可能兩萬多噸那現在幾個批次是有問題的五個批次那五個批次總量多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
128.16 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
134.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
所以至少現在食藥署衛福部確認的五千多公噸是有問題了對,這五千多公噸是必須下架好,來 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
145.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
169.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
市長那我請教到目前為止源頭知道了嗎中聯對中聯為什麼會產生致癌油製程的問題製程對他在製程過程目前在我們當然這個部分還會在後續再跟專家討論不過6月30收到目前為止我們看到媒體也好或說你們相關的食藥署的報告裡面都沒有講到說到底是源頭運輸製程還是哪一個環節出了問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
171.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
192.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
目前在6月30收到通知之後我們在7月份跟專家的會議裡面目前認為是他們在整個製程過程中的品管對所以品管的問題是目前認為是品管就是不符合HACCP那這個過程裡面它有好幾個我們其實在品管上必須要設立的節點那中聯這邊並沒有達到一定的標準所以次長這樣很明顯這件事情是徹底的人禍 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
200.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
218.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
因為品管如果說出了問題然後還有檢驗沒有辦法檢驗檢驗如果說他又知道然後他又造假這個相關的數據的話這是徹底的人禍造假這個部分目前就是讓檢調來做調查所以說我們現在要釐清的是說到底我們影響有多廣我們現在可以釐清那四月以前呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
219.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
239.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
有沒有相關的問題因為如果說你現在這樣講的話自成有問題那我想請教一下中聯它從過去到現在自成了多少批會不會其實前年去年如果就您剛剛講自成我們最後一次不管是地方政府或是中央部會我們去稽查中聯是什麼時候的事 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
240.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
252.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
委員這個部分我們其實111年到114年我們是有食藥署是有這個食用油脂製造業稽查專案那地方縣市政府在111年到114年所以2025年所以中聯什麼時候被建因為現在是三大系統嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
259.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
280.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
全台灣三大系統業者嘛如果說以食用油來講的話中聯算是其中之一嘛它生產的一個食用油算是全台灣三分之一那我們現在想要問的是只有四月五月六月有問題嗎之前呢如果說就市長你剛剛告訴國人的是製程的問題那他用這樣的一個製程方法多久了 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
281.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
308.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
我們這樣子說我們當然一開始會把他抓在4月是因為我們在6月30收到通報他是在4月4號的那一批你會抓到是因為4月4號那也是南橋查出來南橋查出來再跟那個福壽福壽再往上講嘛所以我們拉近就是南橋他後來這樣一路找到6月30跟我們通報之後我們往前拉那個是因為還有吹哨者或是說他們這個上下游那上下游廠商他們自己查出來嗎對 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
309.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
327.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
那但是現在本席的問題又更精進了本席的問題是說那這樣子我們食藥署或衛福部能夠確認只有四月到五月六月嗎那往前呢他到底做假了多久我們現在這個部分是不是做假他這邊做假的程度是什麼這個部分我們現在檢調正在處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
328.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
349.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
我刚刚提到111到114年的使用油脂这个部分专案其实查核起来在当时不论是GHP就是我们讲的那个标准我们资料里面是204家地方政府报上来都是合格的所以说至少市长你刚刚跟我们讲的是说从111年到114年我们的专案那从114年之后 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
350.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
374.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
是不是我們都可以合理懷疑他其實製程師有問題114年之後現在我們在115年由地方衛生局給我們的資料裡面目前都是合格的來那個部長我們請教一下部長剛剛次長也講了這件事情不是只是像一開始爆發說1300噸雖然1300噸我們聽起來已經很大了很多了但原來現在有問題叫做5000多噸 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
379.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
401.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
五千多噸而且四月五月六月它其實生產了兩萬多噸其中現在被檢驗出來有五千多噸可能有問題或是說數據造假那還有多少沒有檢出來不知道那我們比較focus在是學童的一個部分那我想請教過去就至少這三個月五千多噸裡面有流向多少是流到校園我們有沒有個數量統計 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
403.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
431.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
跟委員報告這確實就我手邊我是比較不清楚但是你要告訴我說有多少的油品總量當然啊部長你不覺得這重要嗎過去這幾個月我們有問題的油現在衛福部告訴我們有問題的油叫做五千多噸不是一開始的一千三百噸那我們想要問是五千多噸有多少已經被我們的學童吃掉了只要食藥署公布的我們馬上立即就在 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
431.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
458.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
所以你知不知道現在有五千多噸現在知道了 謝謝現在知道了我們今天討論了半天然後經過衛福部的資料到底有沒有跟教育部跟相關部會來去做一個勾結或是釐清所有的這個品項我們就全面下架這個是我跟委員保證的那我們學童到底吃了多少 不知道是不是現在沒有這個統計 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
462.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
476.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
怎麼了 這個問題不能問嗎 部長委員 我們現在部長 這個問題不能問嗎 可以問了因為今天小孩子他吃飯吃了多少他裡面到底含油量對不起 我不是這方面的專家所以你要去統計啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
477.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
498.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
所以你應該要統計 所以應該欸 部長我覺得這個問題有意義欸有意義在哪裡第一 新天是擠牙膏式的一開始跟我們講1300噸後來講是3P後來講5P現在剛剛講了5000多公噸那5000多公噸如果我們沒有辦法理解或是掌握我們的血統到底有多少如果說你在意的話那你就不會現在還講不出這個數字再者 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
506.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
511.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
剛剛還有委員在這邊講說後續的球場如果你現在都還不知道到底有學童吃了多少的致癌物質的油的話你要怎麼協助球場 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
529.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
553.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
你要怎麼協助球場 你要怎麼協助球場是嘛 欸 一個多禮拜過去了欸一個多禮拜過去了 你今天 我們今天開這個專案會議你難道不知道是說要問這相關的問題嗎一個多禮拜過去了 難道不知道應該要跟國小國中幼稚園來釐清說到底我們有多少的致癌友已經流入校園了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
556.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
580.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
你現在跟我裝無辜在裝什麼無辜啊我要跟委員報告是只要食藥署公布的我們不合格的品項我們全部22個縣市都全部下架這個是我在學校裡面我確保它是這一個不會再你講得很好聽但是我現在就講是說連剛剛我問出來說有5000多公噸那我怎麼知道說5000多公噸到底有沒有確實下架對不起委員問我這樣的一個我沒有辦法回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
581.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
601.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
我問你有很標專的問題嗎這個問題難道不是我們全國家長想要知道的嗎這就是我們教育部部長想要告訴國人的部分部長 為什麼本席今天會特別再跟你講因為在這中間你還去了哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
604.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
613.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
這中間你還去地方輔選耶連衛福部部長都知道避嫌就知道說6月30號爆發事件的時候就不要去了這個資訊是不對的來 什麼資訊不對我現在在講是7月4號我現在在講7月4號本席在講7月4號來 部長本席在講7月4號這一場活動在新竹 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
633.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
658.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
是6月30號爆發有品事件了本來你要跟衛福部長一起去的衛福部長都知道要避嫌了衛福部長不去就要換經濟部長結果你還去啊我要跟委員報告來哪裡不對任何一個人只要他想要知道我們國家教育政策怎麼推動只要我時間允許我都樂意去分享所以那一天是誰邀請您去的 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
659.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
673.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
是這個台灣智庫的執行長台灣智庫執行長是在哪邊台灣智庫執行長貴姓大名莊執行長這一位啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
675.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
697.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
只要任何一個人想要了解教育政策只要我實現我都樂意所以當天是台灣智庫莊進城執行長邀請您去的是主動跟您電話聯絡跟我的秘書聯絡跟您秘書聯絡就可以來你看一下它上面的title是寫什麼它不是寫台灣智庫耶 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
698.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
714.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
他是新竹市長候選人我任何去的行程基本上今天是一個新竹市長候選人然後結果就可以直接跟我們教育部的秘書來聯繫然後教育部長就可以親自出席哇surprise |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
715.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
740.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
真的是顛覆國人的認知尤其是在我們已經爆發6月30號已經爆發食用油危機之後大家都要釐清是說到底什麼狀況結果我們教育部長居然還可以因為一位縣市長候選人邀請然後你就可以前往我跟委員調我的這個電話紀錄我事實上還當天打電話給署長說這個整個油品一定要再重新操體檢查一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
741.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
748.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
最後啊你看很多的新聞啊很多的新聞啊都在講說這個不只是問我我到底哪裡可以去哪裡不能去我如果有健在教育基本的職責你來挑戰我 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
760.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
780.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
來 我不用挑戰你來 部長我直接跟你講過去馬政府時代的時候怎麼對待我們的政務官的過去馬政府時代的時候也有教育部長他只是出席一個初選場合他還沒有上台分享就已經被在野黨抨擊並且當時的行政院長還講說 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
784.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
811.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
是自由公民的權利但是法務部教育部國防部警政署等單位應該保持行政中立不宜服選這是當時國民黨執政時候馬政府的態度對於政務官的態度對於法務部教育部國防部跟警政署單位應該保持行政中立不宜服選現在是民進黨執政之下對於我們的教育的態度是這個樣子尤其是尤其是在 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
814.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
822.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
石安有爆發的時候還用這樣子的一個態度人民會看在眼裡人民看在眼裡所以最後 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
823.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
848.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
不清楚目前到底有多少的食用油被吃掉校園裡面消化多少食用油我們回收多少食用油致癌的不知道衛福部現在講五千多公噸教育部現在還沒有辦法掌握我們掌握的就是食藥署公布的所有的這個不好的油有問題的油我們全面把它下降勸保把它全部下降本來還是希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
849.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
871.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
衛福部相關同仁要給全國國人最清楚的答案那尤其是我們還有一個行政院的食品安全匯報六個月開一次必要時候可以臨時召開這個部分也要考慮是不是現在應該要建議行政院長以行政院長之資召集跨部會來做相關的匯報以上 謝謝 |