| IVOD_ID |
170174 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170174 |
| 日期 |
2026-06-29 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-22-18 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
18 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
22 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
教育及文化委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-06-29T12:42:59+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-06-29T13:02:31+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:19:32 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/05a40576d455a9dbd3a207389de09b3c7e55e861df8cbb7091b00f25105a8ff6023078813c0ffac65ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
羅廷瑋 |
| 委員發言時間 |
12:42:59 - 13:02:31 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-06-29T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查教育部函為修正「高級中等以下學校教師解聘不續聘停聘或資遣辦法」部分條文及「公立高級中等以下學校教師成績考核辦法」第五條、第六條之一條文案。【本案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書，則不予審查】
二、審查
(一) 委員蘇清泉等20人擬具「國民教育法第三條條文修正草案」案。
(二) 委員邱鎮軍等20人擬具「國民教育法第三條及第四條條文修正草案」案。
(三) 國民黨黨團擬具「國民教育法第三條、第四條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(四) 台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「國民教育法第三條及第四條條文修正草案」案。
(五) 委員葉元之等18人擬具「國民教育法第二十一條條文修正草案」案。
(六) 委員邱鎮軍等22人擬具「國民教育法第四十四條及第四十八條條文修正草案」案。
(七) 委員徐欣瑩等17人擬具「國民教育法第三條、第四條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
(八) 委員邱鎮軍等19人擬具「國民教育法第四十四條條文修正草案」案。
(九) 委員林倩綺等21人擬具「國民教育法第十三條條文修正草案」案。
(十) 委員羅廷瑋等18人擬具「國民教育法第三條、第四條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。
【進行詢答及逐條審查】【6月29日及7月1、2日三天一次會】） |
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好 現在有請羅廷維 趙偉來做詢答好 謝謝主席 有請張亮萬監次長好 有請次長 |
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26.231 |
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45.77 |
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好市長有幾件事情我們現在先來順便釐清我想今天早上來排這個校事會議相關的辦法來審查有委員有提到是不是現在如果我們退回這一次的校事會議我稱之為一月這樣的版本也就是不可匿名來檢舉 |
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会不会现在退回然后就会导致会回溯到最原始的版本回到可匿名来检举申诉我想我们还是要清楚明确的告诉大家哦关于立法委员自卷新司法我们这个立法委员的手册很清楚的了解62条行政命令的违法之救济的一个相关程序啊很清楚的看到第三项 |
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77.293 |
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94.664 |
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第一項經通知更正或者是廢除制命令原定頒布的機關應於兩個月更正或廢止預期未更正或廢除的該命令失效 |
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簡單來講跟大家特別報告這裡清清楚楚寫的很明明白白就是告訴我們現階段如果我們退回兩個月內一定要補更正要不然就是廢除如果超過兩個月才會回溯到原本可匿名檢舉的那一個版本 |
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可是我们已经经过两次询答不管是教育部部长以及我们现在的张亮万间次长都清楚的告诉我们六月底会收集许多的相关意见会在七月的时候来推出相关的更新版本 |
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所以這根本沒有衝突這個實際上透過這些審議的過程都希望讓更新的版本能夠更加的精進另外我想請問一下這個次長你有掌握今天部長的行程嗎今天部長在地方考察在地方考察巡視巡視 |
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我必須非常非常的...唉...遺憾然後甚至感到被欺騙憤怒喔我剛剛收到這一個貼圖我們的部長6月29號禮拜一9點50在西湖鎮10點45在普延鄉1點在彰化市 |
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198.424 |
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226.975 |
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考察沒有問題我還是再次的強調關心教育沒有問題現在的問題是什麼我擔任召委部長跟我講身體不是部長跟我講說身體欠安我給予最大的體諒在排案委員會的時候我同意讓次長來代替就是因為考量他身體不好 |
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228.931 |
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上次在委員會的時候部長也親口對著直播對著麥克風說他最近身體真的不好我的體量卻換來了變成他在地方服選這不是很單純的那怎麼沒有來我台中要不要跟我預約一下台中要不要各縣市所有的巡查跑透透 |
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我今天沒有說不准去彰化喔我支持他教育考察喔可是我的前提是怎麼會跟我說他身體不好希望不要給他排到委員會坐在那邊不是比較輕鬆嗎怎麼今天候選人還特別了公佈他要去所謂的地方考察難道沒有帶來好消息明眼人都知道 |
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289.295 |
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317.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
我要譴責的是一方面告訴我擔任召委要給予體諒不要讓他來到委員會一方面在地方跑透透我剛剛還強忍著直到我問次長次長都證實他在地方走透透那請問到了地方難道這樣子他就不會身體欠安我還是要再一次強烈的抗議 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
320.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
349.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
今天我們排案的事情所有的委員可以有意見可以不支持但是教育部作為主管機關竟然沒有到由次長代替校事會議相關的辦法關係到整個教育體制關係到所有的孩子部長沒有到配合著候選人來發這樣子的一個圖卡 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
351.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
376.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
告訴昭偉他身體欠安我想在這樣子的一個過程當中讓我看到對於部長的體諒卻化為欺騙我們譴責我也要再一次的在這邊特別拜託次長校事會議我上一次特別提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
378.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
398.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
要支持教師在整個行政程序調查的過程中給予支持但是部長還有教育部次長在後面面對所謂的媒體詢問的時候有說教育部支持老師你納入法律的資源 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
400.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
420.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
目前規劃法律的資源具體包括的內容有哪些可不可以請次長說一下好我想這是因為我們在公聽會跟座談會裡面也提到包括在詢答的時候有委員建議所以我說我們會納入考量那可能的因為現在還要跟地方政府談我們過去教師諮商輔導系統也是擬定計畫之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
424.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
447.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
然後呢到各地縣市政府去推然後一個縣市一個縣市成立然後我們把那個經營比較好的縣市然後再來匯充報告請其他縣市能夠做那我相信法律諮詢也是一樣那現行的資助裡面其實是有的譬如說它因公社送是可以補助的這部分我們國立的體系的高中職也遇過我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
448.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
477.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
因公射送 可是問題是行政調查的過程的陪伴也需要嘛所以輔佐人制度 但是我們在乎的是請了輔佐人專業的陪伴有可能會有費用的產生啊 對不對那到底是法律諮詢而已嗎那區公所就有提供啊還是協助撰寫書狀 媒合律師補助訴訟費用以外的等等陪伴也有可能 你知道諮詢費大概法律諮詢啊 公定價你知道一個小時多少嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
479.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
504.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
大概不曉得大概幾千塊五千這些費用我們上次也在講啊光是校事會議的相關審查請委員喔都還要要求家長會來幫忙募款出資那現在教師呢教師過程中輔佐人的陪伴萬一輔佐人也就是專業律師要求一個小時五千呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
506.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
531.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那你說他是不是任的教師那就算了他萬一是還他的清白我們上次有講嘛還清白我們最後呢要把相關的不管是本縫研究家籍那這些過程中的支出還有身心俱疲誰來補助所以次長我想問嘛一個小時假設五千啊那這個行政的過程當中輔助人萬一跟他收費誰來賠 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
533.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
554.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
誰來給予補助我想有關這個輔佐人制度要怎麼樣子來落實需不需要有一些經費上的補助或者法律諮詢的支持的系統地方政府在研議的時候我們要怎麼樣來協助這個我們都會把委員的意見跟相關的意見都納入我們來儘速來推動我們也很急啦希望說明年能夠上路啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
554.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
582.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
所以我真的希望喔這些東西不要只是喊喊的不要只是媒體喊話他要有一個具體的項目法律諮詢很好啊大家都有啊我的辦公室也有提供法律諮詢歡迎來找我啊可是問題是這樣子而已嗎只是諮詢有用嗎這個過程的陪伴有費用的產生誰來給予幫忙這個我們一定要好好的來探討另外今天我們現在在為了這個國教向下延伸到五歲啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
583.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
609.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
在提到這個部分之前我有幾個訴求要再一次的再提供第一我們不斷的之前都有在講公幼教師的工作獎金來設置現在網路上有很多人連署請求公立契約禁用人員應比照公立教師設立考積獎金的制度這個部分國教署 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
611.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
624.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
能不能給予具體的一個回應在回應的過程我再補一下我也接到許多現在很多的公立 教保員 幼師的陳情待會這兩張的陳情書我也要轉交給我們黃副委員署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
629.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
658.605 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
希望在爭取公立幼兒園教保員在簽調的加分項目的權益他的核心訴求就是落實教保平權正是簽調的困境目前簽調的困境現行制度的不公身份的不對等忽視人身的安全這些他都有具體的寫出來待會我也希望提供但是我想問一下署長有掌握這樣子的一個狀況嗎第二現職幼教工作者向我反映 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
660.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
687.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
教保員取得教師資格後實習制度所面臨的困境教保員已經在幼兒園第一線工作多年了甚至累積超過五年以上的教學班級經營親師溝通這樣的經驗然而在教師資格考試後仍需在進行半年全時的教育實習所以他認為這個部分是不是能夠具體的回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
688.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
708.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
能不能夠 還有我剛剛講到的 設立考積獎金的一個制度 這個部分剛才委員提到的 就是教保員如果考上那個幼教師他有一個時期半年 這個我們已經有在研擬這個部分看要是用一般教學人士來替代這個 目前就有了 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
709.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
737.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
目前就可以了我是希望說能夠更清楚明確啦今天他已經教學多年具體了嘛他今天不是新手一個嘛對他不用再兼顧他六個月對對所以我是說這都是第一線教師教保員不斷在反映如果是限職的教保員是有的是可以的但是我剛剛講的還是有民眾在陳情所以這個問題還是希望那個委員的陳情書可以給我們喔我再麻煩你那這個考級獎金制度的部分呢我們也是一樣我們在給委員那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
738.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
759.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
因為真的等很久了啦是不是考級獎金制度一個月內給我回覆好好不好那再來我要講的就是說今天我們一直在努力剛剛也有委員在講這一個我們要效仿歐美歐美可能芬蘭說他的這個國民鄉下教育是在7歲那我講啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
761.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
789.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
歐美甚至美國歐洲我們在探討他們的教學環境他們大概三四點以後啊就放學了那怎麼不全學就體制不同嘛我們要參考的是鄰近周邊亞洲國家嘛所以我就已經多次的在講韓國剛剛也有委員講到韓國我就再問一下次長韓國目前向下延伸教育五歲這個部分他已經修了沒 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
791.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
815.139 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
他說2010年2010年就休了嘛對不對所以還有委員在舉錯誤的案例在講說沒有啦韓國現在也是七歲也是六歲沒有啊我們查到的資料跟立法院公告的資料韓國2010年就執行了啊不過委員就像你講的齁就是說各國的情況不一樣不一樣我都知道但是我們先講錯誤資訊啦我一定要把這些 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
818.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
828.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
台灣目前是減輕加配合少子化政策我知道你們有在做所以今天我們要講的是政府的法令已經在執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
829.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
848.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
我們把目標更加的明確該強迫的要強迫不該強迫的我們可以來討論但是訴求是什麼訴求還是一樣在五歲的時候義務教育真正落實到學費不是只有學費而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
849.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
860.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
我們一直在講現在只有學費而已嗎你只有補學費而已耶所以其他的費用呢所以我們看到這些義務教育向下延伸我也要問啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
862.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
885.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
很多人講不要倉促修法結果不好意思國民義務教育向下延伸討論了不是十年欸是數個十年欸這個不倉促也太不倉促了吧這涉及的層面當然很廣我知道啊有課綱有教師有教室有設備有經費等等但是這些年 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
887.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
904.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
只有公聽會而已嗎教育部難道有真的痛定思痛好好的來馬拉松式的來探討該怎麼樣具體的來增加我們能夠把這一個法規補上的最後一個漏洞嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
904.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
921.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
報告委員我們10年透過這個公共化教保平價名額的那個計畫我們的公幼費力幼兒園的興建690幾間10年增加690我相信所以所以今天才要探討就是因為看到有進度了 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
923.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
947.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
不是只是說倉促我們今天就來討論這個法令嘛關我自己的選區我在擔任議員的時候我們公脫公幼不斷的在興建這也符合每一個縣市首長正在做的事情啊我們也剛剛透過你講的十年又增加了六百多嘛所以這個部分我們都希望這個應該要納入到今天的探討什麼叫做 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
949.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
973.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
倉促沒有討論取消討論這才是真正忽視了我們現在正在面對的一個問題再來我也要講你們說跟地方政府探討地方政府說什麼說要兩歲專班他們比較需要目前家長的需要要兩歲專班嘛彭署長我是不是也跟你開過協調會有關於小朋友滿三歲 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
977.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
998.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
一滿三歲他就要離開幼稚園這件事情來做一個想辦法延你可不可以到當學期結束再來你們給我的回應是什麼已經從二歲延到三歲了如果再讓他到當學期截止會影響到兩歲小朋友的入學的進度 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
999.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
1027.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
那也是兩年前的事囉我們一直在講兩歲專班到現在兩歲專班的興建已經出現了很大的瓶頸已經基本上學校相關的一些可以使用的校舍空間基本上都沒有了基本上都已經沒有了我自己也一直在呼籲啊就是沒有場地兩歲專班也好公托公幼的興建已經出現瓶頸了 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
1028.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
1051.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
所以我們沒辦法再等下去啦我們也希望透過別的方式能夠來讓所謂的五歲義務教育多一點真正實質的幫助年輕家庭讓他們減少支出可是今天呢全部被抹黑攻擊說倉促啦修了數十年叫倉促啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
1053.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
1081.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
說這些花大錢啊教育本來就應該花大錢啊我感謝這些委員每天幫我宣傳我在幫所有的大學生爭取學代免利息幫所有的小孩子爭取營養午餐爭取營養午餐更好吃幫所有的人來爭取現在的補助甚至是幼照法修法讓年輕家庭減緩更多的一些壓力 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
1082.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
1101.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
教育本來就應該花大錢更何況是砸在我們的人民身上砸在未來的孩子身上很可惜待會諮詢完以後我們就要結束今天的會議因為我們沒辦法進入主條討論我們被沒收的討論所以我還是要再一次 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
1102.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
1123.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
跟大家呼籲剛剛次長你也講啊現在目前五歲的就學率喔是96是公立跟私立對加起來已經基本上已經是共識了小朋友進去讀書已經是大家基本都要做的事情了但是如果強迫入學的話但是強迫入學大家可以探討嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
1124.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
1153.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
所以可以不要這個部分入法我們待會來討論可是被沒收了但目前你也知道我一直在跟你強調我的中心思考是什麼減緩家庭的支出讓他們減少一切生活支應的負擔這是我們的目標大家就要討論嘛今天我也沒有說一定要強迫入學入法大家要討論啊結果被沒收很可惜我還是希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
1155.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
1171.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
您一直主張您是次長也是我立法委員的學長我想孩子就是未來這是您一直不斷的在呼籲的我們一起朝這個方向來努力也希望教育部能夠提出因應的措施以上好 謝謝 |