iVOD / 170174

Field Value
IVOD_ID 170174
IVOD_URL https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170174
日期 2026-06-29
會議資料.會議代碼 委員會-11-5-22-18
會議資料.會議代碼:str 第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議
會議資料.屆 11
會議資料.會期 5
會議資料.會次 18
會議資料.種類 委員會
會議資料.委員會代碼[0] 22
會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] 教育及文化委員會
會議資料.標題 第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議
影片種類 Clip
開始時間 2026-06-29T12:42:59+08:00
結束時間 2026-06-29T13:02:31+08:00
影片長度 00:19:32
支援功能[0] ai-transcript
支援功能[1] gazette
video_url https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/05a40576d455a9dbd3a207389de09b3c7e55e861df8cbb7091b00f25105a8ff6023078813c0ffac65ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8
委員名稱 羅廷瑋
委員發言時間 12:42:59 - 13:02:31
會議時間 2026-06-29T09:00:00+08:00
會議名稱 立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議(事由:一、審查教育部函為修正「高級中等以下學校教師解聘不續聘停聘或資遣辦法」部分條文及「公立高級中等以下學校教師成績考核辦法」第五條、第六條之一條文案。【本案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書,則不予審查】 二、審查 (一) 委員蘇清泉等20人擬具「國民教育法第三條條文修正草案」案。 (二) 委員邱鎮軍等20人擬具「國民教育法第三條及第四條條文修正草案」案。 (三) 國民黨黨團擬具「國民教育法第三條、第四條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。 (四) 台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「國民教育法第三條及第四條條文修正草案」案。 (五) 委員葉元之等18人擬具「國民教育法第二十一條條文修正草案」案。 (六) 委員邱鎮軍等22人擬具「國民教育法第四十四條及第四十八條條文修正草案」案。 (七) 委員徐欣瑩等17人擬具「國民教育法第三條、第四條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。 (八) 委員邱鎮軍等19人擬具「國民教育法第四十四條條文修正草案」案。 (九) 委員林倩綺等21人擬具「國民教育法第十三條條文修正草案」案。 (十) 委員羅廷瑋等18人擬具「國民教育法第三條、第四條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。 【進行詢答及逐條審查】【6月29日及7月1、2日三天一次會】)
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transcript.whisperx[0].text 好 現在有請羅廷維 趙偉來做詢答好 謝謝主席 有請張亮萬監次長好 有請次長
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transcript.whisperx[1].text 好市長有幾件事情我們現在先來順便釐清我想今天早上來排這個校事會議相關的辦法來審查有委員有提到是不是現在如果我們退回這一次的校事會議我稱之為一月這樣的版本也就是不可匿名來檢舉
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transcript.whisperx[2].text 会不会现在退回然后就会导致会回溯到最原始的版本回到可匿名来检举申诉我想我们还是要清楚明确的告诉大家哦关于立法委员自卷新司法我们这个立法委员的手册很清楚的了解62条行政命令的违法之救济的一个相关程序啊很清楚的看到第三项
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transcript.whisperx[3].text 第一項經通知更正或者是廢除制命令原定頒布的機關應於兩個月更正或廢止預期未更正或廢除的該命令失效
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transcript.whisperx[4].text 簡單來講跟大家特別報告這裡清清楚楚寫的很明明白白就是告訴我們現階段如果我們退回兩個月內一定要補更正要不然就是廢除如果超過兩個月才會回溯到原本可匿名檢舉的那一個版本
transcript.whisperx[5].start 121.457
transcript.whisperx[5].end 142.638
transcript.whisperx[5].text 可是我们已经经过两次询答不管是教育部部长以及我们现在的张亮万间次长都清楚的告诉我们六月底会收集许多的相关意见会在七月的时候来推出相关的更新版本
transcript.whisperx[6].start 143.459
transcript.whisperx[6].end 168.952
transcript.whisperx[6].text 所以這根本沒有衝突這個實際上透過這些審議的過程都希望讓更新的版本能夠更加的精進另外我想請問一下這個次長你有掌握今天部長的行程嗎今天部長在地方考察在地方考察巡視巡視
transcript.whisperx[7].start 170.697
transcript.whisperx[7].end 188.57
transcript.whisperx[7].text 我必須非常非常的...唉...遺憾然後甚至感到被欺騙憤怒喔我剛剛收到這一個貼圖我們的部長6月29號禮拜一9點50在西湖鎮10點45在普延鄉1點在彰化市
transcript.whisperx[8].start 198.424
transcript.whisperx[8].end 226.975
transcript.whisperx[8].text 考察沒有問題我還是再次的強調關心教育沒有問題現在的問題是什麼我擔任召委部長跟我講身體不是部長跟我講說身體欠安我給予最大的體諒在排案委員會的時候我同意讓次長來代替就是因為考量他身體不好
transcript.whisperx[9].start 228.931
transcript.whisperx[9].end 257.162
transcript.whisperx[9].text 上次在委員會的時候部長也親口對著直播對著麥克風說他最近身體真的不好我的體量卻換來了變成他在地方服選這不是很單純的那怎麼沒有來我台中要不要跟我預約一下台中要不要各縣市所有的巡查跑透透
transcript.whisperx[10].start 258.732
transcript.whisperx[10].end 287.737
transcript.whisperx[10].text 我今天沒有說不准去彰化喔我支持他教育考察喔可是我的前提是怎麼會跟我說他身體不好希望不要給他排到委員會坐在那邊不是比較輕鬆嗎怎麼今天候選人還特別了公佈他要去所謂的地方考察難道沒有帶來好消息明眼人都知道
transcript.whisperx[11].start 289.295
transcript.whisperx[11].end 317.975
transcript.whisperx[11].text 我要譴責的是一方面告訴我擔任召委要給予體諒不要讓他來到委員會一方面在地方跑透透我剛剛還強忍著直到我問次長次長都證實他在地方走透透那請問到了地方難道這樣子他就不會身體欠安我還是要再一次強烈的抗議
transcript.whisperx[12].start 320.219
transcript.whisperx[12].end 349.292
transcript.whisperx[12].text 今天我們排案的事情所有的委員可以有意見可以不支持但是教育部作為主管機關竟然沒有到由次長代替校事會議相關的辦法關係到整個教育體制關係到所有的孩子部長沒有到配合著候選人來發這樣子的一個圖卡
transcript.whisperx[13].start 351.052
transcript.whisperx[13].end 376.636
transcript.whisperx[13].text 告訴昭偉他身體欠安我想在這樣子的一個過程當中讓我看到對於部長的體諒卻化為欺騙我們譴責我也要再一次的在這邊特別拜託次長校事會議我上一次特別提到
transcript.whisperx[14].start 378.254
transcript.whisperx[14].end 398.793
transcript.whisperx[14].text 要支持教師在整個行政程序調查的過程中給予支持但是部長還有教育部次長在後面面對所謂的媒體詢問的時候有說教育部支持老師你納入法律的資源
transcript.whisperx[15].start 400.407
transcript.whisperx[15].end 420.896
transcript.whisperx[15].text 目前規劃法律的資源具體包括的內容有哪些可不可以請次長說一下好我想這是因為我們在公聽會跟座談會裡面也提到包括在詢答的時候有委員建議所以我說我們會納入考量那可能的因為現在還要跟地方政府談我們過去教師諮商輔導系統也是擬定計畫之後
transcript.whisperx[16].start 424.577
transcript.whisperx[16].end 447.654
transcript.whisperx[16].text 然後呢到各地縣市政府去推然後一個縣市一個縣市成立然後我們把那個經營比較好的縣市然後再來匯充報告請其他縣市能夠做那我相信法律諮詢也是一樣那現行的資助裡面其實是有的譬如說它因公社送是可以補助的這部分我們國立的體系的高中職也遇過我們
transcript.whisperx[17].start 448.615
transcript.whisperx[17].end 477.887
transcript.whisperx[17].text 因公射送 可是問題是行政調查的過程的陪伴也需要嘛所以輔佐人制度 但是我們在乎的是請了輔佐人專業的陪伴有可能會有費用的產生啊 對不對那到底是法律諮詢而已嗎那區公所就有提供啊還是協助撰寫書狀 媒合律師補助訴訟費用以外的等等陪伴也有可能 你知道諮詢費大概法律諮詢啊 公定價你知道一個小時多少嗎
transcript.whisperx[18].start 479.107
transcript.whisperx[18].end 504.972
transcript.whisperx[18].text 大概不曉得大概幾千塊五千這些費用我們上次也在講啊光是校事會議的相關審查請委員喔都還要要求家長會來幫忙募款出資那現在教師呢教師過程中輔佐人的陪伴萬一輔佐人也就是專業律師要求一個小時五千呢
transcript.whisperx[19].start 506.144
transcript.whisperx[19].end 531.195
transcript.whisperx[19].text 那你說他是不是任的教師那就算了他萬一是還他的清白我們上次有講嘛還清白我們最後呢要把相關的不管是本縫研究家籍那這些過程中的支出還有身心俱疲誰來補助所以次長我想問嘛一個小時假設五千啊那這個行政的過程當中輔助人萬一跟他收費誰來賠
transcript.whisperx[20].start 533.64
transcript.whisperx[20].end 554.729
transcript.whisperx[20].text 誰來給予補助我想有關這個輔佐人制度要怎麼樣子來落實需不需要有一些經費上的補助或者法律諮詢的支持的系統地方政府在研議的時候我們要怎麼樣來協助這個我們都會把委員的意見跟相關的意見都納入我們來儘速來推動我們也很急啦希望說明年能夠上路啦
transcript.whisperx[21].start 554.889
transcript.whisperx[21].end 582.626
transcript.whisperx[21].text 所以我真的希望喔這些東西不要只是喊喊的不要只是媒體喊話他要有一個具體的項目法律諮詢很好啊大家都有啊我的辦公室也有提供法律諮詢歡迎來找我啊可是問題是這樣子而已嗎只是諮詢有用嗎這個過程的陪伴有費用的產生誰來給予幫忙這個我們一定要好好的來探討另外今天我們現在在為了這個國教向下延伸到五歲啊
transcript.whisperx[22].start 583.266
transcript.whisperx[22].end 609.806
transcript.whisperx[22].text 在提到這個部分之前我有幾個訴求要再一次的再提供第一我們不斷的之前都有在講公幼教師的工作獎金來設置現在網路上有很多人連署請求公立契約禁用人員應比照公立教師設立考積獎金的制度這個部分國教署
transcript.whisperx[23].start 611.138
transcript.whisperx[23].end 624.389
transcript.whisperx[23].text 能不能給予具體的一個回應在回應的過程我再補一下我也接到許多現在很多的公立 教保員 幼師的陳情待會這兩張的陳情書我也要轉交給我們黃副委員署長
transcript.whisperx[24].start 629.611
transcript.whisperx[24].end 658.605
transcript.whisperx[24].text 希望在爭取公立幼兒園教保員在簽調的加分項目的權益他的核心訴求就是落實教保平權正是簽調的困境目前簽調的困境現行制度的不公身份的不對等忽視人身的安全這些他都有具體的寫出來待會我也希望提供但是我想問一下署長有掌握這樣子的一個狀況嗎第二現職幼教工作者向我反映
transcript.whisperx[25].start 660.134
transcript.whisperx[25].end 687.501
transcript.whisperx[25].text 教保員取得教師資格後實習制度所面臨的困境教保員已經在幼兒園第一線工作多年了甚至累積超過五年以上的教學班級經營親師溝通這樣的經驗然而在教師資格考試後仍需在進行半年全時的教育實習所以他認為這個部分是不是能夠具體的回應
transcript.whisperx[26].start 688.701
transcript.whisperx[26].end 708.433
transcript.whisperx[26].text 能不能夠 還有我剛剛講到的 設立考積獎金的一個制度 這個部分剛才委員提到的 就是教保員如果考上那個幼教師他有一個時期半年 這個我們已經有在研擬這個部分看要是用一般教學人士來替代這個 目前就有了
transcript.whisperx[27].start 709.033
transcript.whisperx[27].end 737.876
transcript.whisperx[27].text 目前就可以了我是希望說能夠更清楚明確啦今天他已經教學多年具體了嘛他今天不是新手一個嘛對他不用再兼顧他六個月對對所以我是說這都是第一線教師教保員不斷在反映如果是限職的教保員是有的是可以的但是我剛剛講的還是有民眾在陳情所以這個問題還是希望那個委員的陳情書可以給我們喔我再麻煩你那這個考級獎金制度的部分呢我們也是一樣我們在給委員那個
transcript.whisperx[28].start 738.817
transcript.whisperx[28].end 759.654
transcript.whisperx[28].text 因為真的等很久了啦是不是考級獎金制度一個月內給我回覆好好不好那再來我要講的就是說今天我們一直在努力剛剛也有委員在講這一個我們要效仿歐美歐美可能芬蘭說他的這個國民鄉下教育是在7歲那我講啊
transcript.whisperx[29].start 761.141
transcript.whisperx[29].end 789.762
transcript.whisperx[29].text 歐美甚至美國歐洲我們在探討他們的教學環境他們大概三四點以後啊就放學了那怎麼不全學就體制不同嘛我們要參考的是鄰近周邊亞洲國家嘛所以我就已經多次的在講韓國剛剛也有委員講到韓國我就再問一下次長韓國目前向下延伸教育五歲這個部分他已經修了沒
transcript.whisperx[30].start 791.305
transcript.whisperx[30].end 815.139
transcript.whisperx[30].text 他說2010年2010年就休了嘛對不對所以還有委員在舉錯誤的案例在講說沒有啦韓國現在也是七歲也是六歲沒有啊我們查到的資料跟立法院公告的資料韓國2010年就執行了啊不過委員就像你講的齁就是說各國的情況不一樣不一樣我都知道但是我們先講錯誤資訊啦我一定要把這些
transcript.whisperx[31].start 818.202
transcript.whisperx[31].end 828.481
transcript.whisperx[31].text 台灣目前是減輕加配合少子化政策我知道你們有在做所以今天我們要講的是政府的法令已經在執行
transcript.whisperx[32].start 829.827
transcript.whisperx[32].end 848.667
transcript.whisperx[32].text 我們把目標更加的明確該強迫的要強迫不該強迫的我們可以來討論但是訴求是什麼訴求還是一樣在五歲的時候義務教育真正落實到學費不是只有學費而已
transcript.whisperx[33].start 849.81
transcript.whisperx[33].end 860.955
transcript.whisperx[33].text 我們一直在講現在只有學費而已嗎你只有補學費而已耶所以其他的費用呢所以我們看到這些義務教育向下延伸我也要問啊
transcript.whisperx[34].start 862.401
transcript.whisperx[34].end 885.871
transcript.whisperx[34].text 很多人講不要倉促修法結果不好意思國民義務教育向下延伸討論了不是十年欸是數個十年欸這個不倉促也太不倉促了吧這涉及的層面當然很廣我知道啊有課綱有教師有教室有設備有經費等等但是這些年
transcript.whisperx[35].start 887.54
transcript.whisperx[35].end 904.341
transcript.whisperx[35].text 只有公聽會而已嗎教育部難道有真的痛定思痛好好的來馬拉松式的來探討該怎麼樣具體的來增加我們能夠把這一個法規補上的最後一個漏洞嗎
transcript.whisperx[36].start 904.881
transcript.whisperx[36].end 921.78
transcript.whisperx[36].text 報告委員我們10年透過這個公共化教保平價名額的那個計畫我們的公幼費力幼兒園的興建690幾間10年增加690我相信所以所以今天才要探討就是因為看到有進度了
transcript.whisperx[37].start 923.151
transcript.whisperx[37].end 947.74
transcript.whisperx[37].text 不是只是說倉促我們今天就來討論這個法令嘛關我自己的選區我在擔任議員的時候我們公脫公幼不斷的在興建這也符合每一個縣市首長正在做的事情啊我們也剛剛透過你講的十年又增加了六百多嘛所以這個部分我們都希望這個應該要納入到今天的探討什麼叫做
transcript.whisperx[38].start 949.444
transcript.whisperx[38].end 973.771
transcript.whisperx[38].text 倉促沒有討論取消討論這才是真正忽視了我們現在正在面對的一個問題再來我也要講你們說跟地方政府探討地方政府說什麼說要兩歲專班他們比較需要目前家長的需要要兩歲專班嘛彭署長我是不是也跟你開過協調會有關於小朋友滿三歲
transcript.whisperx[39].start 977.486
transcript.whisperx[39].end 998.697
transcript.whisperx[39].text 一滿三歲他就要離開幼稚園這件事情來做一個想辦法延你可不可以到當學期結束再來你們給我的回應是什麼已經從二歲延到三歲了如果再讓他到當學期截止會影響到兩歲小朋友的入學的進度
transcript.whisperx[40].start 999.998
transcript.whisperx[40].end 1027.634
transcript.whisperx[40].text 那也是兩年前的事囉我們一直在講兩歲專班到現在兩歲專班的興建已經出現了很大的瓶頸已經基本上學校相關的一些可以使用的校舍空間基本上都沒有了基本上都已經沒有了我自己也一直在呼籲啊就是沒有場地兩歲專班也好公托公幼的興建已經出現瓶頸了
transcript.whisperx[41].start 1028.715
transcript.whisperx[41].end 1051.59
transcript.whisperx[41].text 所以我們沒辦法再等下去啦我們也希望透過別的方式能夠來讓所謂的五歲義務教育多一點真正實質的幫助年輕家庭讓他們減少支出可是今天呢全部被抹黑攻擊說倉促啦修了數十年叫倉促啦
transcript.whisperx[42].start 1053.527
transcript.whisperx[42].end 1081.03
transcript.whisperx[42].text 說這些花大錢啊教育本來就應該花大錢啊我感謝這些委員每天幫我宣傳我在幫所有的大學生爭取學代免利息幫所有的小孩子爭取營養午餐爭取營養午餐更好吃幫所有的人來爭取現在的補助甚至是幼照法修法讓年輕家庭減緩更多的一些壓力
transcript.whisperx[43].start 1082.901
transcript.whisperx[43].end 1101.099
transcript.whisperx[43].text 教育本來就應該花大錢更何況是砸在我們的人民身上砸在未來的孩子身上很可惜待會諮詢完以後我們就要結束今天的會議因為我們沒辦法進入主條討論我們被沒收的討論所以我還是要再一次
transcript.whisperx[44].start 1102.386
transcript.whisperx[44].end 1123.525
transcript.whisperx[44].text 跟大家呼籲剛剛次長你也講啊現在目前五歲的就學率喔是96是公立跟私立對加起來已經基本上已經是共識了小朋友進去讀書已經是大家基本都要做的事情了但是如果強迫入學的話但是強迫入學大家可以探討嘛
transcript.whisperx[45].start 1124.506
transcript.whisperx[45].end 1153.588
transcript.whisperx[45].text 所以可以不要這個部分入法我們待會來討論可是被沒收了但目前你也知道我一直在跟你強調我的中心思考是什麼減緩家庭的支出讓他們減少一切生活支應的負擔這是我們的目標大家就要討論嘛今天我也沒有說一定要強迫入學入法大家要討論啊結果被沒收很可惜我還是希望
transcript.whisperx[46].start 1155.097
transcript.whisperx[46].end 1171.447
transcript.whisperx[46].text 您一直主張您是次長也是我立法委員的學長我想孩子就是未來這是您一直不斷的在呼籲的我們一起朝這個方向來努力也希望教育部能夠提出因應的措施以上好 謝謝
transcript.gazette[0].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[0].start 2026-06-29T12:43:08.696000+08:00
transcript.gazette[0].guessed
transcript.gazette[0].end 2026-06-29T12:43:08.716000+08:00
transcript.gazette[0].text 謝謝主席。
transcript.gazette[0].quality 1
transcript.gazette[1].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[1].start 2026-06-29T12:43:08.776000+08:00
transcript.gazette[1].guessed
transcript.gazette[1].end 2026-06-29T12:43:09.457000+08:00
transcript.gazette[1].text 有請張廖萬堅次長。
transcript.gazette[1].quality 0.75
transcript.gazette[2].speaker 主席
transcript.gazette[2].start 2026-06-29T12:43:09.517000+08:00
transcript.gazette[2].guessed
transcript.gazette[2].end 2026-06-29T12:43:09.937000+08:00
transcript.gazette[2].text 有請次長。
transcript.gazette[2].quality 1
transcript.gazette[3].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[3].start 2026-06-29T12:43:25.231000+08:00
transcript.gazette[3].guessed
transcript.gazette[3].end 2026-06-29T12:43:25.231000+08:00
transcript.gazette[3].text 召委好。
transcript.gazette[3].quality 0.333
transcript.gazette[4].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[4].start 2026-06-29T12:43:26.673000+08:00
transcript.gazette[4].guessed
transcript.gazette[4].end 2026-06-29T12:43:29.095000+08:00
transcript.gazette[4].text 次長,我們現在先順便釐清幾件事情。
transcript.gazette[4].quality 0.667
transcript.gazette[5].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[5].start 2026-06-29T12:43:29.656000+08:00
transcript.gazette[5].guessed
transcript.gazette[5].end 2026-06-29T12:43:57.119000+08:00
transcript.gazette[5].text 今天早上安排校事會議相關辦法的審查,有委員提到,是不是現在如果我們退回這次的校事會議,我稱之為1月的版本,也就是不可匿名檢舉,會不會現在退回,就會導致回溯到最原始的版本,也就是回到可匿名檢舉、申訴?
transcript.gazette[5].quality 0.854
transcript.gazette[6].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[6].start 2026-06-29T12:43:58.200000+08:00
transcript.gazette[6].guessed
transcript.gazette[6].end 2026-06-29T12:44:33.644000+08:00
transcript.gazette[6].text 我想我們還是要清楚、明確地告訴大家,立法院職權行使法第六十二條是在規定行政命令違法之相關救濟程序,其中第三項很清楚地規定:「第一項經通知更正或廢止之命令,原訂頒機關應於二個月內更正或廢止;逾期未為更正或廢止者,該命令失效。
transcript.gazette[6].quality 0.608
transcript.gazette[7].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[7].start 2026-06-29T12:44:35.585000+08:00
transcript.gazette[7].guessed
transcript.gazette[7].end 2026-06-29T12:44:59.637000+08:00
transcript.gazette[7].text 」簡單來講,跟大家特別報告,這裡寫得清清楚楚、明明白白,就是告訴我們,現階段如果我們退回,二個月內一定要補更正,不然就是廢止,如果超過二個月,才會回溯到原本可匿名檢舉的那個版本。
transcript.gazette[7].quality 0.936
transcript.gazette[8].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[8].start 2026-06-29T12:45:00.457000+08:00
transcript.gazette[8].guessed
transcript.gazette[8].end 2026-06-29T12:45:33.284000+08:00
transcript.gazette[8].text 可是我們已經經過兩次詢答,不管是教育部部長以及現在的張廖萬堅次長都清楚地告訴我們,6月底會蒐集許多的相關意見,會在7月的時候來推出相關的更新版本,所以這根本沒有衝突,實際上透過這些審議的過程,都希望讓更新的版本能夠更加的精進。
transcript.gazette[8].quality 0.76
transcript.gazette[9].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[9].start 2026-06-29T12:45:33.284000+08:00
transcript.gazette[9].guessed
transcript.gazette[9].end 2026-06-29T12:45:41.528000+08:00
transcript.gazette[9].text 另外我想請問一下次長,你有掌握今天部長的行程嗎?
transcript.gazette[9].quality 1
transcript.gazette[10].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[10].start 2026-06-29T12:45:41.528000+08:00
transcript.gazette[10].guessed
transcript.gazette[10].end 2026-06-29T12:45:43.990000+08:00
transcript.gazette[10].text 今天部長在地方考察的樣子。
transcript.gazette[10].quality 0.75
transcript.gazette[11].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[11].start 2026-06-29T12:45:45.410000+08:00
transcript.gazette[11].guessed
transcript.gazette[11].end 2026-06-29T12:45:45.991000+08:00
transcript.gazette[11].text 在地方考察?
transcript.gazette[11].quality 1
transcript.gazette[12].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[12].start 2026-06-29T12:45:46.591000+08:00
transcript.gazette[12].guessed
transcript.gazette[12].end 2026-06-29T12:45:47.952000+08:00
transcript.gazette[12].text 巡視啦。巡視?
transcript.gazette[12].quality 0.8
transcript.gazette[13].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[13].start 2026-06-29T12:45:49.697000+08:00
transcript.gazette[13].guessed
transcript.gazette[13].end 2026-06-29T12:45:55.021000+08:00
transcript.gazette[13].text 我非常非常的遺憾,唉!
transcript.gazette[13].quality 0.889
transcript.gazette[14].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[14].start 2026-06-29T12:45:56.622000+08:00
transcript.gazette[14].guessed
transcript.gazette[14].end 2026-06-29T12:46:19.505000+08:00
transcript.gazette[14].text 甚至感到被欺騙、憤怒,我剛剛收到這一個貼圖,部長在6月29日禮拜一9點50分在溪湖鎮,10點45分在埔鹽鄉,1點在彰化市,考察沒有問題。
transcript.gazette[14].quality 0.86
transcript.gazette[15].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[15].start 2026-06-29T12:46:19.505000+08:00
transcript.gazette[15].guessed
transcript.gazette[15].end 2026-06-29T12:46:25.167000+08:00
transcript.gazette[15].text 我還是再次的強調,關心教育沒有問題,現在的問題是什麼?
transcript.gazette[15].quality 1
transcript.gazette[16].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[16].start 2026-06-29T12:46:25.167000+08:00
transcript.gazette[16].guessed
transcript.gazette[16].end 2026-06-29T12:47:08.819000+08:00
transcript.gazette[16].text 我擔任召委,部長跟我講身體不適、部長跟我講身體欠安,我給予最大的體諒,在委員會排案的時候,我同意讓次長來代替,就是因為考量他身體不好,上次在委員會的時候,部長也親口對著直播、對著麥克風說他最近身體真的不好,我的體諒卻變成他在地方輔選,這不是很單純的……
transcript.gazette[16].quality 0.956
transcript.gazette[17].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[17].start 2026-06-29T12:47:08.819000+08:00
transcript.gazette[17].guessed 1
transcript.gazette[17].end 2026-06-29T12:47:10.440000+08:00
transcript.gazette[17].text 他在巡察……
transcript.gazette[17].quality 0
transcript.gazette[18].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[18].start 2026-06-29T12:47:10.440000+08:00
transcript.gazette[18].guessed
transcript.gazette[18].end 2026-06-29T12:47:11.260000+08:00
transcript.gazette[18].text 怎麼沒有來我臺中?
transcript.gazette[18].quality 1
transcript.gazette[19].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[19].start 2026-06-29T12:47:11.260000+08:00
transcript.gazette[19].guessed 1
transcript.gazette[19].end 2026-06-29T12:47:12.260000+08:00
transcript.gazette[19].text 他有排行程……
transcript.gazette[19].quality 0
transcript.gazette[20].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[20].start 2026-06-29T12:47:12+08:00
transcript.gazette[20].guessed
transcript.gazette[20].end 2026-06-29T12:47:16.142000+08:00
transcript.gazette[20].text 要不要跟我預約一下臺中、要不要各縣市所有的巡察跑透透?
transcript.gazette[20].quality 0.96
transcript.gazette[21].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[21].start 2026-06-29T12:47:17.732000+08:00
transcript.gazette[21].guessed
transcript.gazette[21].end 2026-06-29T12:47:34.395000+08:00
transcript.gazette[21].text 我今天沒有說不准去彰化,我支持他教育考察,可是我的前提是,怎麼會跟我說他身體不好,希望不要給他排到委員會,坐在那邊不是比較輕鬆嗎?
transcript.gazette[21].quality 1
transcript.gazette[22].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[22].start 2026-06-29T12:47:34.395000+08:00
transcript.gazette[22].guessed
transcript.gazette[22].end 2026-06-29T12:47:44.657000+08:00
transcript.gazette[22].text 怎麼今天候選人還特別公布他要去所謂的地方考察,難道沒有帶來好消息?
transcript.gazette[22].quality 0.968
transcript.gazette[23].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[23].start 2026-06-29T12:47:45.877000+08:00
transcript.gazette[23].guessed
transcript.gazette[23].end 2026-06-29T12:47:46.717000+08:00
transcript.gazette[23].text 明眼人都知道。
transcript.gazette[23].quality 1
transcript.gazette[24].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[24].start 2026-06-29T12:47:48.295000+08:00
transcript.gazette[24].guessed
transcript.gazette[24].end 2026-06-29T12:48:12.472000+08:00
transcript.gazette[24].text 我要譴責的是,一方面告訴我擔任召委要給予體諒,不要讓他來到委員會,一方面在地方跑透透,我剛剛還強忍著,直到我問次長,次長都證實他在地方走透透,請問到了地方,難道這樣子他就不會身體欠安?
transcript.gazette[24].quality 1
transcript.gazette[25].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[25].start 2026-06-29T12:48:14.713000+08:00
transcript.gazette[25].guessed
transcript.gazette[25].end 2026-06-29T12:48:52.654000+08:00
transcript.gazette[25].text 我還是要再一次強烈的抗議,今天我們排案的事情,所有的委員可以有意見、可以不支持,但是教育部作為主管機關,竟然沒有到,由次長代替,校事會議相關的辦法關係到整個教育體制、關係到所有的孩子,部長沒有到,卻配合著候選人來發這樣子的圖卡,告訴召委他身體欠安。
transcript.gazette[25].quality 0.973
transcript.gazette[26].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[26].start 2026-06-29T12:48:55.477000+08:00
transcript.gazette[26].guessed
transcript.gazette[26].end 2026-06-29T12:49:07.788000+08:00
transcript.gazette[26].text 我想在這樣子的過程當中,讓我看到對於部長的體諒,卻化為欺騙,我們譴責。
transcript.gazette[26].quality 1
transcript.gazette[27].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[27].start 2026-06-29T12:49:07.788000+08:00
transcript.gazette[27].guessed
transcript.gazette[27].end 2026-06-29T12:49:44.329000+08:00
transcript.gazette[27].text 我也要再一次的在這邊特別拜託次長,我上一次特別提到校事會議,要支持教師在整個行政程序調查的過程中給予支持,但是部長還有教育部次長在後面面對所謂的媒體詢問的時候,有說教育部支持老師,你納入法律的支援,目前規劃法律的支援,具體包括的內容有哪些?
transcript.gazette[27].quality 0.929
transcript.gazette[28].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[28].start 2026-06-29T12:49:45.349000+08:00
transcript.gazette[28].guessed
transcript.gazette[28].end 2026-06-29T12:49:46.470000+08:00
transcript.gazette[28].text 可不可以請次長說一下?
transcript.gazette[28].quality 1
transcript.gazette[29].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[29].start 2026-06-29T12:49:47.490000+08:00
transcript.gazette[29].guessed
transcript.gazette[29].end 2026-06-29T12:50:16.086000+08:00
transcript.gazette[29].text 這是因為我們在公聽會跟座談會裡面有提到包括在詢答的時候,也有委員建議,所以我說我們會納入考量,因為現在還要跟地方政府談,過去教師諮商輔導系統也是擬定計畫之後,然後到各地縣市政府去推,一個縣市、一個縣市成立,我們把經營比較好的縣市再來會中報告,請其他縣市能夠做。
transcript.gazette[29].quality 0.967
transcript.gazette[30].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[30].start 2026-06-29T12:50:16.547000+08:00
transcript.gazette[30].guessed
transcript.gazette[30].end 2026-06-29T12:50:26.654000+08:00
transcript.gazette[30].text 我相信法律諮詢也是一樣,現行的制度裡面其實是有的,譬如他因公涉訟是可以補助的,這部分我們國立體系的高中職也遇過,我們也……
transcript.gazette[30].quality 0.891
transcript.gazette[31].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[31].start 2026-06-29T12:50:27.615000+08:00
transcript.gazette[31].guessed
transcript.gazette[31].end 2026-06-29T12:50:31.937000+08:00
transcript.gazette[31].text 我知道,因公涉訟,可是問題是行政調查過程的陪伴也需要嘛。
transcript.gazette[31].quality 0.8
transcript.gazette[32].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[32].start 2026-06-29T12:50:32.997000+08:00
transcript.gazette[32].guessed
transcript.gazette[32].end 2026-06-29T12:50:33.657000+08:00
transcript.gazette[32].text 有,我們有一個輔佐人制度。
transcript.gazette[32].quality 0.455
transcript.gazette[33].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[33].start 2026-06-29T12:50:34.178000+08:00
transcript.gazette[33].guessed
transcript.gazette[33].end 2026-06-29T12:50:42.001000+08:00
transcript.gazette[33].text 但是我們在乎的是,請了輔佐人專業的陪伴,有可能會有費用的產生,對不對?
transcript.gazette[33].quality 1
transcript.gazette[34].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[34].start 2026-06-29T12:50:42.701000+08:00
transcript.gazette[34].guessed
transcript.gazette[34].end 2026-06-29T12:50:44.722000+08:00
transcript.gazette[34].text 到底是法律諮詢而已嗎?
transcript.gazette[34].quality 1
transcript.gazette[35].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[35].start 2026-06-29T12:50:44.722000+08:00
transcript.gazette[35].guessed
transcript.gazette[35].end 2026-06-29T12:50:56.887000+08:00
transcript.gazette[35].text 那個區公所就有提供了,還是協助撰寫書狀、媒合律師補助訴訟費用以外的等等,陪伴也有個……你知道法律諮詢公定價一個小時大概多少嗎?
transcript.gazette[35].quality 0.912
transcript.gazette[36].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[36].start 2026-06-29T12:50:59.027000+08:00
transcript.gazette[36].guessed
transcript.gazette[36].end 2026-06-29T12:51:00.748000+08:00
transcript.gazette[36].text 不曉得,大概幾千塊……5,000。
transcript.gazette[36].quality 0.889
transcript.gazette[37].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[37].start 2026-06-29T12:51:03.868000+08:00
transcript.gazette[37].guessed
transcript.gazette[37].end 2026-06-29T12:51:16.190000+08:00
transcript.gazette[37].text 我們上次也在講,光是校事會議的相關審查,請委員都還要要求家長會來幫忙募款出資,現在教師呢?
transcript.gazette[37].quality 1
transcript.gazette[38].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[38].start 2026-06-29T12:51:16.751000+08:00
transcript.gazette[38].guessed
transcript.gazette[38].end 2026-06-29T12:51:23.952000+08:00
transcript.gazette[38].text 教師在過程中的輔佐人陪伴,萬一輔佐人也就是專業的律師要求一個小時5,000呢?
transcript.gazette[38].quality 0.879
transcript.gazette[39].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[39].start 2026-06-29T12:51:25.704000+08:00
transcript.gazette[39].guessed
transcript.gazette[39].end 2026-06-29T12:51:42.532000+08:00
transcript.gazette[39].text 你說他是不適任的教師,那就算了,萬一是還他的清白,我們上次有講,還清白,我們最後要把相關不管是本俸、研究加給,這些過程中的支出,還有身心俱疲,誰來補助?
transcript.gazette[39].quality 0.939
transcript.gazette[40].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[40].start 2026-06-29T12:51:43.993000+08:00
transcript.gazette[40].guessed
transcript.gazette[40].end 2026-06-29T12:51:52.780000+08:00
transcript.gazette[40].text 次長,我想問一個小時假設5,000,在這個行政的過程當中,輔佐人萬一跟他收費,誰來賠、誰來給予補助?
transcript.gazette[40].quality 0.925
transcript.gazette[41].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[41].start 2026-06-29T12:51:53.260000+08:00
transcript.gazette[41].guessed
transcript.gazette[41].end 2026-06-29T12:52:13.569000+08:00
transcript.gazette[41].text 我想有關輔佐人制度要怎麼樣落實,需不需要有一些經費上的補助或者法律諮詢的支持系統,地方政府在研議的時候,我們要怎麼樣來協助、我們都會把委員的意見跟相關的意見都納入,我們儘速來推動,我們也很急、也希望明年能夠上路。
transcript.gazette[41].quality 0.99
transcript.gazette[42].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[42].start 2026-06-29T12:52:13.889000+08:00
transcript.gazette[42].guessed
transcript.gazette[42].end 2026-06-29T12:52:18.772000+08:00
transcript.gazette[42].text 所以我真的希望這些東西不要只是喊喊的、不要只是媒體喊話。
transcript.gazette[42].quality 1
transcript.gazette[43].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[43].start 2026-06-29T12:52:18.772000+08:00
transcript.gazette[43].guessed 1
transcript.gazette[43].end 2026-06-29T12:52:19.772000+08:00
transcript.gazette[43].text 不會只有喊喊。
transcript.gazette[43].quality 0
transcript.gazette[44].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[44].start 2026-06-29T12:52:18.972000+08:00
transcript.gazette[44].guessed
transcript.gazette[44].end 2026-06-29T12:52:28.318000+08:00
transcript.gazette[44].text 它要有一個具體的項目,法律諮詢很好,大家都有啊,我的辦公室也有提供法律諮詢,歡迎來找我,可是問題是這樣子而已嗎?
transcript.gazette[44].quality 0.98
transcript.gazette[45].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[45].start 2026-06-29T12:52:28.318000+08:00
transcript.gazette[45].guessed
transcript.gazette[45].end 2026-06-29T12:52:30.519000+08:00
transcript.gazette[45].text 只是質詢有用嗎?
transcript.gazette[45].quality 0.857
transcript.gazette[46].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[46].start 2026-06-29T12:52:30.519000+08:00
transcript.gazette[46].guessed
transcript.gazette[46].end 2026-06-29T12:52:36.342000+08:00
transcript.gazette[46].text 這個過程的陪伴有費用的產生,誰來給予幫忙,這個我們一定要好好的來探討。好。
transcript.gazette[46].quality 0.97
transcript.gazette[47].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[47].start 2026-06-29T12:52:36.342000+08:00
transcript.gazette[47].guessed
transcript.gazette[47].end 2026-06-29T12:53:12.120000+08:00
transcript.gazette[47].text 另外,我們現在為了國教向下延伸到5歲,在提到這個部分之前,我有幾個訴求要再一次的提供,第一,我們之前不斷都在講設置公幼教師的工作獎金,現在網路上也有很多人連署請求公立契約進用人員應比照公立教師設立考績獎金的制度,這個部分國教署能不能給予具體的回應?
transcript.gazette[47].quality 0.939
transcript.gazette[48].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[48].start 2026-06-29T12:53:12.120000+08:00
transcript.gazette[48].guessed
transcript.gazette[48].end 2026-06-29T12:53:53.223000+08:00
transcript.gazette[48].text 在回應的過程,我再補一下,我也接到許多現在很多公立教保員幼師的陳情,待會這兩張的陳情書,我也要轉交給彭富源署長,希望在爭取公立幼兒園教保員在遷調加分項目的權益,他的核心訴求就是落實教保平權,正視遷調的困境,目前遷調的困境,現行制度的不公、身分的不對等、忽視人身的安全,這些他都有具體的寫出來,待會我也希望提供,但是我想問一下,署長有掌握這樣子的狀況嗎?
transcript.gazette[48].quality 0.95
transcript.gazette[49].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[49].start 2026-06-29T12:53:53.223000+08:00
transcript.gazette[49].guessed
transcript.gazette[49].end 2026-06-29T12:54:26.501000+08:00
transcript.gazette[49].text 第二,現職幼教工作者向我反映,教保員取得教師資格後,實習制度所面臨的困境,教保員已經在幼兒園第一線工作多年,甚至累積超過5年以上的教學班級經營、親師溝通這樣的經驗,然而在教師資格考試後,仍須再進行半年全時的教育實習,所以他認為這個部分是不是能夠具體的回應?
transcript.gazette[49].quality 0.983
transcript.gazette[50].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[50].start 2026-06-29T12:54:28.962000+08:00
transcript.gazette[50].guessed
transcript.gazette[50].end 2026-06-29T12:54:33.565000+08:00
transcript.gazette[50].text 還有我剛剛講到的設立考績獎金制度這個部分。
transcript.gazette[50].quality 0.95
transcript.gazette[51].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[51].start 2026-06-29T12:54:35.045000+08:00
transcript.gazette[51].guessed
transcript.gazette[51].end 2026-06-29T12:54:48.533000+08:00
transcript.gazette[51].text 剛才委員提到教保員如果考上幼教師,他有一個半年的實習,我們已經有在研擬這個部分,看要是用一般教學演示來替代,目前就有了、目前就可以了。
transcript.gazette[51].quality 0.918
transcript.gazette[52].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[52].start 2026-06-29T12:54:48.574000+08:00
transcript.gazette[52].guessed
transcript.gazette[52].end 2026-06-29T12:54:54.799000+08:00
transcript.gazette[52].text 我是希望能夠更清楚明確,今天他已經教學多年,具體了嘛,他今天不是新手一個嘛!
transcript.gazette[52].quality 1
transcript.gazette[53].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[53].start 2026-06-29T12:54:54.939000+08:00
transcript.gazette[53].guessed
transcript.gazette[53].end 2026-06-29T12:54:56.160000+08:00
transcript.gazette[53].text 對,他不用再經過那六個月。
transcript.gazette[53].quality 0.727
transcript.gazette[54].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[54].start 2026-06-29T12:54:56.720000+08:00
transcript.gazette[54].guessed
transcript.gazette[54].end 2026-06-29T12:55:01.304000+08:00
transcript.gazette[54].text 所以這都是第一線教師、教保員不斷在反映的。
transcript.gazette[54].quality 0.947
transcript.gazette[55].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[55].start 2026-06-29T12:55:01.424000+08:00
transcript.gazette[55].guessed
transcript.gazette[55].end 2026-06-29T12:55:04.466000+08:00
transcript.gazette[55].text 如果是現職的教保員,是有的、是可以的。
transcript.gazette[55].quality 0.938
transcript.gazette[56].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[56].start 2026-06-29T12:55:05.327000+08:00
transcript.gazette[56].guessed
transcript.gazette[56].end 2026-06-29T12:55:09.170000+08:00
transcript.gazette[56].text 但是我剛剛講的,還是有民眾在陳情,所以這個問題還是希望你們能具體的考慮。
transcript.gazette[56].quality 0.758
transcript.gazette[57].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[57].start 2026-06-29T12:55:09.430000+08:00
transcript.gazette[57].guessed
transcript.gazette[57].end 2026-06-29T12:55:10.571000+08:00
transcript.gazette[57].text 好,委員收到的陳情書可以給我們。
transcript.gazette[57].quality 0.786
transcript.gazette[58].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[58].start 2026-06-29T12:55:10.831000+08:00
transcript.gazette[58].guessed
transcript.gazette[58].end 2026-06-29T12:55:11.372000+08:00
transcript.gazette[58].text 好,我再麻煩你們。
transcript.gazette[58].quality 0.714
transcript.gazette[59].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[59].start 2026-06-29T12:55:11.372000+08:00
transcript.gazette[59].guessed 1
transcript.gazette[59].end 2026-06-29T12:55:13.313000+08:00
transcript.gazette[59].text 我們再回復辦公室。
transcript.gazette[59].quality 0
transcript.gazette[60].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[60].start 2026-06-29T12:55:13.313000+08:00
transcript.gazette[60].guessed
transcript.gazette[60].end 2026-06-29T12:55:14.695000+08:00
transcript.gazette[60].text 考績獎金制度的部分呢?
transcript.gazette[60].quality 0.9
transcript.gazette[61].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[61].start 2026-06-29T12:55:15.115000+08:00
transcript.gazette[61].guessed
transcript.gazette[61].end 2026-06-29T12:55:16.856000+08:00
transcript.gazette[61].text 也是一樣,我們再給委員。
transcript.gazette[61].quality 0.9
transcript.gazette[62].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[62].start 2026-06-29T12:55:17.817000+08:00
transcript.gazette[62].guessed
transcript.gazette[62].end 2026-06-29T12:55:22.521000+08:00
transcript.gazette[62].text 因為真的等很久了,是不是考績獎金制度一個月內給我回復?
transcript.gazette[62].quality 0.92
transcript.gazette[63].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[63].start 2026-06-29T12:55:22.941000+08:00
transcript.gazette[63].guessed
transcript.gazette[63].end 2026-06-29T12:55:22.941000+08:00
transcript.gazette[63].text 好,OK。
transcript.gazette[63].quality 0.333
transcript.gazette[64].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[64].start 2026-06-29T12:55:23.802000+08:00
transcript.gazette[64].guessed
transcript.gazette[64].end 2026-06-29T12:55:24.262000+08:00
transcript.gazette[64].text 好不好?好。
transcript.gazette[64].quality 0.75
transcript.gazette[65].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[65].start 2026-06-29T12:55:24.863000+08:00
transcript.gazette[65].guessed
transcript.gazette[65].end 2026-06-29T12:55:47.847000+08:00
transcript.gazette[65].text 再來我要講的是,今天我們一直在努力,剛剛也有委員在講我們要效仿歐美,提到芬蘭的國民向下教育是在7歲,那我就講,甚至美國、歐洲,我們在探討他們的教學環境,他們大概三、四點以後就放學了,那怎麼不全學?
transcript.gazette[65].quality 0.953
transcript.gazette[66].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[66].start 2026-06-29T12:55:48.887000+08:00
transcript.gazette[66].guessed
transcript.gazette[66].end 2026-06-29T12:55:50.388000+08:00
transcript.gazette[66].text 就是體制不同嘛!
transcript.gazette[66].quality 0.857
transcript.gazette[67].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[67].start 2026-06-29T12:55:51.389000+08:00
transcript.gazette[67].guessed
transcript.gazette[67].end 2026-06-29T12:56:08.742000+08:00
transcript.gazette[67].text 我們要參考的是鄰近周邊的亞洲國家,所以我就已經多次在講韓國,剛剛也有委員講到韓國,我就再問一下次長,韓國目前教育向下延伸到5歲,這個部分他們已經修了沒?
transcript.gazette[67].quality 0.928
transcript.gazette[68].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[68].start 2026-06-29T12:56:10.305000+08:00
transcript.gazette[68].guessed
transcript.gazette[68].end 2026-06-29T12:56:12.186000+08:00
transcript.gazette[68].text 他們是2010年……
transcript.gazette[68].quality 0.5
transcript.gazette[69].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[69].start 2026-06-29T12:56:12.206000+08:00
transcript.gazette[69].guessed
transcript.gazette[69].end 2026-06-29T12:56:14.427000+08:00
transcript.gazette[69].text 2010年就修了嘛,對不對?
transcript.gazette[69].quality 0.875
transcript.gazette[70].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[70].start 2026-06-29T12:56:14.427000+08:00
transcript.gazette[70].guessed
transcript.gazette[70].end 2026-06-29T12:56:18.690000+08:00
transcript.gazette[70].text 所以還有委員在舉錯誤的案例,講說:沒有啦!
transcript.gazette[70].quality 1
transcript.gazette[71].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[71].start 2026-06-29T12:56:20.251000+08:00
transcript.gazette[71].guessed
transcript.gazette[71].end 2026-06-29T12:56:22.552000+08:00
transcript.gazette[71].text 韓國現在也是7歲、也是6歲。
transcript.gazette[71].quality 1
transcript.gazette[72].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[72].start 2026-06-29T12:56:22.552000+08:00
transcript.gazette[72].guessed
transcript.gazette[72].end 2026-06-29T12:56:22.913000+08:00
transcript.gazette[72].text 沒有啊!
transcript.gazette[72].quality 1
transcript.gazette[73].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[73].start 2026-06-29T12:56:23.393000+08:00
transcript.gazette[73].guessed
transcript.gazette[73].end 2026-06-29T12:56:28.856000+08:00
transcript.gazette[73].text 我們查到的資料跟立法院公告的資料,韓國2010年就執行了啊!
transcript.gazette[73].quality 1
transcript.gazette[74].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[74].start 2026-06-29T12:56:29.096000+08:00
transcript.gazette[74].guessed
transcript.gazette[74].end 2026-06-29T12:56:31.878000+08:00
transcript.gazette[74].text 不過委員,就像你講的,各國的情況不一樣。
transcript.gazette[74].quality 1
transcript.gazette[75].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[75].start 2026-06-29T12:56:31.878000+08:00
transcript.gazette[75].guessed
transcript.gazette[75].end 2026-06-29T12:56:33.559000+08:00
transcript.gazette[75].text 不一樣,我都知道,但是我們先講錯誤資訊……
transcript.gazette[75].quality 1
transcript.gazette[76].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[76].start 2026-06-29T12:56:33.559000+08:00
transcript.gazette[76].guessed 1
transcript.gazette[76].end 2026-06-29T12:56:34.559000+08:00
transcript.gazette[76].text 臺灣目前其實是……
transcript.gazette[76].quality 0
transcript.gazette[77].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[77].start 2026-06-29T12:56:33.779000+08:00
transcript.gazette[77].guessed
transcript.gazette[77].end 2026-06-29T12:56:34.119000+08:00
transcript.gazette[77].text 一定要把這些錯誤資訊給更正。
transcript.gazette[77].quality 0.462
transcript.gazette[78].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[78].start 2026-06-29T12:56:37.202000+08:00
transcript.gazette[78].guessed
transcript.gazette[78].end 2026-06-29T12:56:39.807000+08:00
transcript.gazette[78].text 臺灣目前是減輕加配合少子化政策、人口政策。
transcript.gazette[78].quality 0.789
transcript.gazette[79].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[79].start 2026-06-29T12:56:39.947000+08:00
transcript.gazette[79].guessed
transcript.gazette[79].end 2026-06-29T12:56:41.049000+08:00
transcript.gazette[79].text 我知道,你們有在做。
transcript.gazette[79].quality 1
transcript.gazette[80].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[80].start 2026-06-29T12:56:42.311000+08:00
transcript.gazette[80].guessed
transcript.gazette[80].end 2026-06-29T12:56:57.616000+08:00
transcript.gazette[80].text 今天我們要講的是,政府的法令已經在執行,我們把目標更加的明確,該強迫的要強迫,不該強迫的,我們可以來討論。
transcript.gazette[80].quality 1
transcript.gazette[81].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[81].start 2026-06-29T12:56:57.616000+08:00
transcript.gazette[81].guessed
transcript.gazette[81].end 2026-06-29T12:57:00.199000+08:00
transcript.gazette[81].text 但是訴求是什麼?
transcript.gazette[81].quality 1
transcript.gazette[82].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[82].start 2026-06-29T12:57:00.199000+08:00
transcript.gazette[82].guessed
transcript.gazette[82].end 2026-06-29T12:57:12.291000+08:00
transcript.gazette[82].text 訴求還是一樣,在5歲的時候,義務教育真正落實到學費,不是只有學費而已,我們一直在講,現在只有學費而已嗎?
transcript.gazette[82].quality 1
transcript.gazette[83].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[83].start 2026-06-29T12:57:12.291000+08:00
transcript.gazette[83].guessed
transcript.gazette[83].end 2026-06-29T12:57:14.452000+08:00
transcript.gazette[83].text 你們只有補學費而已耶!
transcript.gazette[83].quality 0.9
transcript.gazette[84].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[84].start 2026-06-29T12:57:14.813000+08:00
transcript.gazette[84].guessed
transcript.gazette[84].end 2026-06-29T12:57:15.533000+08:00
transcript.gazette[84].text 其他的費用呢?
transcript.gazette[84].quality 1
transcript.gazette[85].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[85].start 2026-06-29T12:57:16.453000+08:00
transcript.gazette[85].guessed
transcript.gazette[85].end 2026-06-29T12:57:32.746000+08:00
transcript.gazette[85].text 我們看到這些義務教育向下延伸,我也要問,很多人講不要倉促修法,結果不好意思,國民義務教育向下延伸討論了不是10年,是數個10年耶!
transcript.gazette[85].quality 0.982
transcript.gazette[86].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[86].start 2026-06-29T12:57:34.466000+08:00
transcript.gazette[86].guessed
transcript.gazette[86].end 2026-06-29T12:57:37.008000+08:00
transcript.gazette[86].text 這個不倉促也太不倉促了吧!
transcript.gazette[86].quality 1
transcript.gazette[87].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[87].start 2026-06-29T12:57:38.128000+08:00
transcript.gazette[87].guessed
transcript.gazette[87].end 2026-06-29T12:57:40.049000+08:00
transcript.gazette[87].text 這涉及的層面當然很廣,我知道啊!
transcript.gazette[87].quality 1
transcript.gazette[88].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[88].start 2026-06-29T12:57:40.349000+08:00
transcript.gazette[88].guessed
transcript.gazette[88].end 2026-06-29T12:57:48.923000+08:00
transcript.gazette[88].text 有課綱、有教師、有教室、有設備、有經費等等,但是這些年只有公聽會而已嗎?
transcript.gazette[88].quality 1
transcript.gazette[89].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[89].start 2026-06-29T12:57:48.923000+08:00
transcript.gazette[89].guessed
transcript.gazette[89].end 2026-06-29T12:58:03.341000+08:00
transcript.gazette[89].text 教育部難道有真的痛定思痛,好好地、馬拉松式的探討該怎麼具體增加,讓我們能夠把這法規補上最後一個漏洞嗎?
transcript.gazette[89].quality 0.957
transcript.gazette[90].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[90].start 2026-06-29T12:58:03.881000+08:00
transcript.gazette[90].guessed
transcript.gazette[90].end 2026-06-29T12:58:14.834000+08:00
transcript.gazette[90].text 報告委員,我們10年透過公共化平價教保名額的計畫,公幼、非營利幼兒園的興建有六百九十幾間,10年增加了六百多間。
transcript.gazette[90].quality 0.681
transcript.gazette[91].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[91].start 2026-06-29T12:58:15.134000+08:00
transcript.gazette[91].guessed
transcript.gazette[91].end 2026-06-29T12:58:37.997000+08:00
transcript.gazette[91].text 我相信,所以今天才要探討,就是因為看到有進度了,不是只是說倉促,我們今天就來討論這個法令,光我自己的選區,我在擔任議員的時候,公托、公幼不斷地在興建,這也符合每一個縣市首長正在做的事情,透過你剛剛講的,10年又增加了六百多。
transcript.gazette[91].quality 0.949
transcript.gazette[92].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[92].start 2026-06-29T12:58:41.198000+08:00
transcript.gazette[92].guessed
transcript.gazette[92].end 2026-06-29T12:58:48.444000+08:00
transcript.gazette[92].text 我們都希望這個應該要納入到今天的探討,什麼叫做倉促?
transcript.gazette[92].quality 1
transcript.gazette[93].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[93].start 2026-06-29T12:58:49.244000+08:00
transcript.gazette[93].guessed
transcript.gazette[93].end 2026-06-29T12:58:57.027000+08:00
transcript.gazette[93].text 沒有討論、取消討論才是真正忽視了我們現在正在面對的問題。
transcript.gazette[93].quality 1
transcript.gazette[94].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[94].start 2026-06-29T12:58:57.027000+08:00
transcript.gazette[94].guessed
transcript.gazette[94].end 2026-06-29T12:59:03.268000+08:00
transcript.gazette[94].text 再來我也要講,你們說跟地方政府探討,地方政府說什麼?
transcript.gazette[94].quality 1
transcript.gazette[95].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[95].start 2026-06-29T12:59:03.268000+08:00
transcript.gazette[95].guessed
transcript.gazette[95].end 2026-06-29T12:59:03.869000+08:00
transcript.gazette[95].text 說要2歲專班。
transcript.gazette[95].quality 1
transcript.gazette[96].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[96].start 2026-06-29T12:59:05.129000+08:00
transcript.gazette[96].guessed
transcript.gazette[96].end 2026-06-29T12:59:07.610000+08:00
transcript.gazette[96].text 他們比較需要、目前家長的需要。
transcript.gazette[96].quality 1
transcript.gazette[97].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[97].start 2026-06-29T12:59:08.010000+08:00
transcript.gazette[97].guessed
transcript.gazette[97].end 2026-06-29T12:59:08.390000+08:00
transcript.gazette[97].text 對,要2歲專班嘛!對。
transcript.gazette[97].quality 0.714
transcript.gazette[98].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[98].start 2026-06-29T12:59:09.990000+08:00
transcript.gazette[98].guessed
transcript.gazette[98].end 2026-06-29T12:59:11.611000+08:00
transcript.gazette[98].text 彭署長,我是不是也跟你開過協調會?
transcript.gazette[98].quality 1
transcript.gazette[99].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[99].start 2026-06-29T12:59:11.611000+08:00
transcript.gazette[99].guessed
transcript.gazette[99].end 2026-06-29T12:59:26.411000+08:00
transcript.gazette[99].text 有關於小朋友一滿3歲就要離開幼稚園這件事情,想辦法研擬可不可以到當學期結束再來?
transcript.gazette[99].quality 0.946
transcript.gazette[100].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[100].start 2026-06-29T12:59:26.411000+08:00
transcript.gazette[100].guessed
transcript.gazette[100].end 2026-06-29T12:59:27.852000+08:00
transcript.gazette[100].text 你們給我的回應是什麼?
transcript.gazette[100].quality 1
transcript.gazette[101].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[101].start 2026-06-29T12:59:27.852000+08:00
transcript.gazette[101].guessed
transcript.gazette[101].end 2026-06-29T12:59:37.677000+08:00
transcript.gazette[101].text 已經從2歲延到3歲了,如果再讓他到當學期截止,會影響到2歲小朋友的入學進度。
transcript.gazette[101].quality 1
transcript.gazette[102].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[102].start 2026-06-29T12:59:38.998000+08:00
transcript.gazette[102].guessed
transcript.gazette[102].end 2026-06-29T13:00:00.891000+08:00
transcript.gazette[102].text 那也是兩年前的事,我們一直在講2歲專班,到現在2歲專班的興建已經出現了很大的瓶頸,學校相關一些可以使用的校舍空間基本上都已經沒有了,我自己也一直在呼籲啊!
transcript.gazette[102].quality 1
transcript.gazette[103].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[103].start 2026-06-29T13:00:01.591000+08:00
transcript.gazette[103].guessed
transcript.gazette[103].end 2026-06-29T13:00:06.614000+08:00
transcript.gazette[103].text 就是沒有場地了,2歲專班也好,公托、公幼的興建已經出現瓶頸了。
transcript.gazette[103].quality 0.962
transcript.gazette[104].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[104].start 2026-06-29T13:00:07.715000+08:00
transcript.gazette[104].guessed
transcript.gazette[104].end 2026-06-29T13:00:28.568000+08:00
transcript.gazette[104].text 所以我們沒辦法再等下去了,我們也希望透過別的方式讓所謂的5歲義務教育對年輕家庭多一點真正實質的幫助,讓他們減少支出,可是今天全部被抹黑、攻擊,說是倉促啦!
transcript.gazette[104].quality 0.9
transcript.gazette[105].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[105].start 2026-06-29T13:00:29.089000+08:00
transcript.gazette[105].guessed
transcript.gazette[105].end 2026-06-29T13:00:30.369000+08:00
transcript.gazette[105].text 修了數十年叫倉促?
transcript.gazette[105].quality 1
transcript.gazette[106].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[106].start 2026-06-29T13:00:32.527000+08:00
transcript.gazette[106].guessed
transcript.gazette[106].end 2026-06-29T13:00:33.508000+08:00
transcript.gazette[106].text 說這些是花大錢啦!
transcript.gazette[106].quality 0.75
transcript.gazette[107].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[107].start 2026-06-29T13:00:34.248000+08:00
transcript.gazette[107].guessed
transcript.gazette[107].end 2026-06-29T13:00:35.650000+08:00
transcript.gazette[107].text 教育本來就應該花大錢啊!
transcript.gazette[107].quality 1
transcript.gazette[108].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[108].start 2026-06-29T13:00:36.250000+08:00
transcript.gazette[108].guessed
transcript.gazette[108].end 2026-06-29T13:01:00.009000+08:00
transcript.gazette[108].text 我感謝這些委員每天幫我宣傳我在幫所有大學生爭取學貸免利息,幫所有小孩子爭取營養午餐、爭取讓營養午餐更好吃,幫所有人爭取現在的補助,甚至是幼照法的修法,讓年輕家庭減緩更多的壓力。
transcript.gazette[108].quality 0.963
transcript.gazette[109].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[109].start 2026-06-29T13:01:01.901000+08:00
transcript.gazette[109].guessed
transcript.gazette[109].end 2026-06-29T13:01:08.187000+08:00
transcript.gazette[109].text 教育本來就應該花大錢,更何況是砸在我們的人民身上、砸在未來的孩子身上。
transcript.gazette[109].quality 1
transcript.gazette[110].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[110].start 2026-06-29T13:01:09.068000+08:00
transcript.gazette[110].guessed
transcript.gazette[110].end 2026-06-29T13:01:09.329000+08:00
transcript.gazette[110].text 很可惜!
transcript.gazette[110].quality 1
transcript.gazette[111].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[111].start 2026-06-29T13:01:10.690000+08:00
transcript.gazette[111].guessed
transcript.gazette[111].end 2026-06-29T13:01:19.058000+08:00
transcript.gazette[111].text 待會質詢完以後我們就要結束今天的會議,因為我們沒有辦法進入逐條討論,我們被沒收了討論。
transcript.gazette[111].quality 0.9
transcript.gazette[112].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[112].start 2026-06-29T13:01:19.218000+08:00
transcript.gazette[112].guessed
transcript.gazette[112].end 2026-06-29T13:01:29.453000+08:00
transcript.gazette[112].text 我還是要再次跟大家呼籲,剛剛次長也講了,目前5歲的就學率是96%。
transcript.gazette[112].quality 0.926
transcript.gazette[113].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[113].start 2026-06-29T13:01:29.814000+08:00
transcript.gazette[113].guessed
transcript.gazette[113].end 2026-06-29T13:01:33.177000+08:00
transcript.gazette[113].text 這是公立跟私立。對啊!
transcript.gazette[113].quality 0.778
transcript.gazette[114].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[114].start 2026-06-29T13:01:33.177000+08:00
transcript.gazette[114].guessed
transcript.gazette[114].end 2026-06-29T13:01:39.262000+08:00
transcript.gazette[114].text 就是加起來已經96%了,基本上已經是共識了,小朋友進去讀書已經是大家基本都要做的事情了。
transcript.gazette[114].quality 0.897
transcript.gazette[115].speaker 張廖次長萬堅
transcript.gazette[115].start 2026-06-29T13:01:39.382000+08:00
transcript.gazette[115].guessed
transcript.gazette[115].end 2026-06-29T13:01:40.724000+08:00
transcript.gazette[115].text 但如果是強迫入學的話……
transcript.gazette[115].quality 0.9
transcript.gazette[116].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[116].start 2026-06-29T13:01:41.244000+08:00
transcript.gazette[116].guessed
transcript.gazette[116].end 2026-06-29T13:01:42.505000+08:00
transcript.gazette[116].text 強迫入學的部分大家可以探討嘛!
transcript.gazette[116].quality 0.786
transcript.gazette[117].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[117].start 2026-06-29T13:01:43.506000+08:00
transcript.gazette[117].guessed
transcript.gazette[117].end 2026-06-29T13:01:47.729000+08:00
transcript.gazette[117].text 所以這個部分可以不要入法,我們待會可以來討論,可是被沒收了!
transcript.gazette[117].quality 0.778
transcript.gazette[118].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[118].start 2026-06-29T13:01:48.890000+08:00
transcript.gazette[118].guessed
transcript.gazette[118].end 2026-06-29T13:02:04.802000+08:00
transcript.gazette[118].text 目前你也知道,我一直在跟你強調我的中心思考是什麼,就是減緩家庭的支出,讓他們減少一切生活支應的負擔,這是我們的目標,大家就是要討論嘛!
transcript.gazette[118].quality 0.951
transcript.gazette[119].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[119].start 2026-06-29T13:02:05.322000+08:00
transcript.gazette[119].guessed
transcript.gazette[119].end 2026-06-29T13:02:09.205000+08:00
transcript.gazette[119].text 今天我也沒有一定要讓強迫入學入法,大家要討論啊!
transcript.gazette[119].quality 0.955
transcript.gazette[120].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[120].start 2026-06-29T13:02:10.006000+08:00
transcript.gazette[120].guessed
transcript.gazette[120].end 2026-06-29T13:02:11.527000+08:00
transcript.gazette[120].text 結果被沒收了,很可惜!
transcript.gazette[120].quality 0.889
transcript.gazette[121].speaker 羅委員廷瑋
transcript.gazette[121].start 2026-06-29T13:02:17.279000+08:00
transcript.gazette[121].guessed
transcript.gazette[121].end 2026-06-29T13:02:30.447000+08:00
transcript.gazette[121].text 你是次長,也是我立法委員的學長,我想孩子就是未來,這是你一直不斷呼籲的,我們一起朝這個方向努力,也希望教育部能夠提出因應的措施。以上。謝謝。
transcript.gazette[121].quality 0.968
transcript.gazette[122].speaker 主席
transcript.gazette[122].start 2026-06-29T13:02:30.947000+08:00
transcript.gazette[122].guessed 1
transcript.gazette[122].end 2026-06-29T13:02:35.232714+08:00
transcript.gazette[122].text 謝謝羅廷瑋召委的質詢,請次長回座。
transcript.gazette[122].quality 0
transcript.gazette[123].speaker 主席(羅委員廷瑋)
transcript.gazette[123].start 2026-06-29T13:02:35.532714+08:00
transcript.gazette[123].guessed 1
transcript.gazette[123].end 2026-06-29T13:02:39.818429+08:00
transcript.gazette[123].text 辛苦了,翁曉玲委員,今天的壓軸,有請。
transcript.gazette[123].quality 0
gazette.lineno 782
gazette.blocks[0][0] 羅委員廷瑋:(12時43分)謝謝主席。有請張廖萬堅次長。
gazette.blocks[1][0] 主席:有請次長。
gazette.blocks[2][0] 張廖次長萬堅:召委好。
gazette.blocks[3][0] 羅委員廷瑋:次長,我們現在先順便釐清幾件事情。今天早上安排校事會議相關辦法的審查,有委員提到,是不是現在如果我們退回這次的校事會議,我稱之為1月的版本,也就是不可匿名檢舉,會不會現在退回,就會導致回溯到最原始的版本,也就是回到可匿名檢舉、申訴?我想我們還是要清楚、明確地告訴大家,立法院職權行使法第六十二條是在規定行政命令違法之相關救濟程序,其中第三項很清楚地規定:「第一項經通知更正或廢止之命令,原訂頒機關應於二個月內更正或廢止;逾期未為更正或廢止者,該命令失效。」簡單來講,跟大家特別報告,這裡寫得清清楚楚、明明白白,就是告訴我們,現階段如果我們退回,二個月內一定要補更正,不然就是廢止,如果超過二個月,才會回溯到原本可匿名檢舉的那個版本。可是我們已經經過兩次詢答,不管是教育部部長以及現在的張廖萬堅次長都清楚地告訴我們,6月底會蒐集許多的相關意見,會在7月的時候來推出相關的更新版本,所以這根本沒有衝突,實際上透過這些審議的過程,都希望讓更新的版本能夠更加的精進。
gazette.blocks[3][1] 另外我想請問一下次長,你有掌握今天部長的行程嗎?
gazette.blocks[4][0] 張廖次長萬堅:今天部長在地方考察的樣子。
gazette.blocks[5][0] 羅委員廷瑋:在地方考察?
gazette.blocks[6][0] 張廖次長萬堅:巡視啦。
gazette.blocks[7][0] 羅委員廷瑋:巡視?我非常非常的遺憾,唉!甚至感到被欺騙、憤怒,我剛剛收到這一個貼圖,部長在6月29日禮拜一9點50分在溪湖鎮,10點45分在埔鹽鄉,1點在彰化市,考察沒有問題。我還是再次的強調,關心教育沒有問題,現在的問題是什麼?我擔任召委,部長跟我講身體不適、部長跟我講身體欠安,我給予最大的體諒,在委員會排案的時候,我同意讓次長來代替,就是因為考量他身體不好,上次在委員會的時候,部長也親口對著直播、對著麥克風說他最近身體真的不好,我的體諒卻變成他在地方輔選,這不是很單純的……
gazette.blocks[8][0] 張廖次長萬堅:他在巡察……
gazette.blocks[9][0] 羅委員廷瑋:怎麼沒有來我臺中?
gazette.blocks[10][0] 張廖次長萬堅:他有排行程……
gazette.blocks[11][0] 羅委員廷瑋:要不要跟我預約一下臺中、要不要各縣市所有的巡察跑透透?我今天沒有說不准去彰化,我支持他教育考察,可是我的前提是,怎麼會跟我說他身體不好,希望不要給他排到委員會,坐在那邊不是比較輕鬆嗎?怎麼今天候選人還特別公布他要去所謂的地方考察,難道沒有帶來好消息?明眼人都知道。我要譴責的是,一方面告訴我擔任召委要給予體諒,不要讓他來到委員會,一方面在地方跑透透,我剛剛還強忍著,直到我問次長,次長都證實他在地方走透透,請問到了地方,難道這樣子他就不會身體欠安?我還是要再一次強烈的抗議,今天我們排案的事情,所有的委員可以有意見、可以不支持,但是教育部作為主管機關,竟然沒有到,由次長代替,校事會議相關的辦法關係到整個教育體制、關係到所有的孩子,部長沒有到,卻配合著候選人來發這樣子的圖卡,告訴召委他身體欠安。我想在這樣子的過程當中,讓我看到對於部長的體諒,卻化為欺騙,我們譴責。
gazette.blocks[11][1] 我也要再一次的在這邊特別拜託次長,我上一次特別提到校事會議,要支持教師在整個行政程序調查的過程中給予支持,但是部長還有教育部次長在後面面對所謂的媒體詢問的時候,有說教育部支持老師,你納入法律的支援,目前規劃法律的支援,具體包括的內容有哪些?可不可以請次長說一下?
gazette.blocks[12][0] 張廖次長萬堅:這是因為我們在公聽會跟座談會裡面有提到包括在詢答的時候,也有委員建議,所以我說我們會納入考量,因為現在還要跟地方政府談,過去教師諮商輔導系統也是擬定計畫之後,然後到各地縣市政府去推,一個縣市、一個縣市成立,我們把經營比較好的縣市再來會中報告,請其他縣市能夠做。我相信法律諮詢也是一樣,現行的制度裡面其實是有的,譬如他因公涉訟是可以補助的,這部分我們國立體系的高中職也遇過,我們也……
gazette.blocks[13][0] 羅委員廷瑋:我知道,因公涉訟,可是問題是行政調查過程的陪伴也需要嘛。
gazette.blocks[14][0] 張廖次長萬堅:有,我們有一個輔佐人制度。
gazette.blocks[15][0] 羅委員廷瑋:但是我們在乎的是,請了輔佐人專業的陪伴,有可能會有費用的產生,對不對?到底是法律諮詢而已嗎?那個區公所就有提供了,還是協助撰寫書狀、媒合律師補助訴訟費用以外的等等,陪伴也有個……你知道法律諮詢公定價一個小時大概多少嗎?
gazette.blocks[16][0] 張廖次長萬堅:不曉得,大概幾千塊……
gazette.blocks[17][0] 羅委員廷瑋:5,000。我們上次也在講,光是校事會議的相關審查,請委員都還要要求家長會來幫忙募款出資,現在教師呢?教師在過程中的輔佐人陪伴,萬一輔佐人也就是專業的律師要求一個小時5,000呢?你說他是不適任的教師,那就算了,萬一是還他的清白,我們上次有講,還清白,我們最後要把相關不管是本俸、研究加給,這些過程中的支出,還有身心俱疲,誰來補助?次長,我想問一個小時假設5,000,在這個行政的過程當中,輔佐人萬一跟他收費,誰來賠、誰來給予補助?
gazette.blocks[18][0] 張廖次長萬堅:我想有關輔佐人制度要怎麼樣落實,需不需要有一些經費上的補助或者法律諮詢的支持系統,地方政府在研議的時候,我們要怎麼樣來協助、我們都會把委員的意見跟相關的意見都納入,我們儘速來推動,我們也很急、也希望明年能夠上路。
gazette.blocks[19][0] 羅委員廷瑋:所以我真的希望這些東西不要只是喊喊的、不要只是媒體喊話。
gazette.blocks[20][0] 張廖次長萬堅:不會只有喊喊。
gazette.blocks[21][0] 羅委員廷瑋:它要有一個具體的項目,法律諮詢很好,大家都有啊,我的辦公室也有提供法律諮詢,歡迎來找我,可是問題是這樣子而已嗎?只是質詢有用嗎?這個過程的陪伴有費用的產生,誰來給予幫忙,這個我們一定要好好的來探討。
gazette.blocks[22][0] 張廖次長萬堅:好。
gazette.blocks[23][0] 羅委員廷瑋:另外,我們現在為了國教向下延伸到5歲,在提到這個部分之前,我有幾個訴求要再一次的提供,第一,我們之前不斷都在講設置公幼教師的工作獎金,現在網路上也有很多人連署請求公立契約進用人員應比照公立教師設立考績獎金的制度,這個部分國教署能不能給予具體的回應?在回應的過程,我再補一下,我也接到許多現在很多公立教保員幼師的陳情,待會這兩張的陳情書,我也要轉交給彭富源署長,希望在爭取公立幼兒園教保員在遷調加分項目的權益,他的核心訴求就是落實教保平權,正視遷調的困境,目前遷調的困境,現行制度的不公、身分的不對等、忽視人身的安全,這些他都有具體的寫出來,待會我也希望提供,但是我想問一下,署長有掌握這樣子的狀況嗎?第二,現職幼教工作者向我反映,教保員取得教師資格後,實習制度所面臨的困境,教保員已經在幼兒園第一線工作多年,甚至累積超過5年以上的教學班級經營、親師溝通這樣的經驗,然而在教師資格考試後,仍須再進行半年全時的教育實習,所以他認為這個部分是不是能夠具體的回應?還有我剛剛講到的設立考績獎金制度這個部分。
gazette.blocks[24][0] 張廖次長萬堅:剛才委員提到教保員如果考上幼教師,他有一個半年的實習,我們已經有在研擬這個部分,看要是用一般教學演示來替代,目前就有了、目前就可以了。
gazette.blocks[25][0] 羅委員廷瑋:我是希望能夠更清楚明確,今天他已經教學多年,具體了嘛,他今天不是新手一個嘛!
gazette.blocks[26][0] 張廖次長萬堅:對,他不用再經過那六個月。
gazette.blocks[27][0] 羅委員廷瑋:所以這都是第一線教師、教保員不斷在反映的。
gazette.blocks[28][0] 張廖次長萬堅:如果是現職的教保員,是有的、是可以的。
gazette.blocks[29][0] 羅委員廷瑋:但是我剛剛講的,還是有民眾在陳情,所以這個問題還是希望你們能具體的考慮。
gazette.blocks[30][0] 張廖次長萬堅:好,委員收到的陳情書可以給我們。
gazette.blocks[31][0] 羅委員廷瑋:好,我再麻煩你們。
gazette.blocks[32][0] 張廖次長萬堅:我們再回復辦公室。
gazette.blocks[33][0] 羅委員廷瑋:考績獎金制度的部分呢?
gazette.blocks[34][0] 張廖次長萬堅:也是一樣,我們再給委員。
gazette.blocks[35][0] 羅委員廷瑋:因為真的等很久了,是不是考績獎金制度一個月內給我回復?
gazette.blocks[36][0] 張廖次長萬堅:好,OK。
gazette.blocks[37][0] 羅委員廷瑋:好不好?
gazette.blocks[38][0] 張廖次長萬堅:好。
gazette.blocks[39][0] 羅委員廷瑋:再來我要講的是,今天我們一直在努力,剛剛也有委員在講我們要效仿歐美,提到芬蘭的國民向下教育是在7歲,那我就講,甚至美國、歐洲,我們在探討他們的教學環境,他們大概三、四點以後就放學了,那怎麼不全學?就是體制不同嘛!我們要參考的是鄰近周邊的亞洲國家,所以我就已經多次在講韓國,剛剛也有委員講到韓國,我就再問一下次長,韓國目前教育向下延伸到5歲,這個部分他們已經修了沒?
gazette.blocks[40][0] 張廖次長萬堅:他們是2010年……
gazette.blocks[41][0] 羅委員廷瑋:2010年就修了嘛,對不對?所以還有委員在舉錯誤的案例,講說:沒有啦!韓國現在也是7歲、也是6歲。沒有啊!我們查到的資料跟立法院公告的資料,韓國2010年就執行了啊!
gazette.blocks[42][0] 張廖次長萬堅:不過委員,就像你講的,各國的情況不一樣。
gazette.blocks[43][0] 羅委員廷瑋:不一樣,我都知道,但是我們先講錯誤資訊……
gazette.blocks[44][0] 張廖次長萬堅:臺灣目前其實是……
gazette.blocks[45][0] 羅委員廷瑋:一定要把這些錯誤資訊給更正。
gazette.blocks[46][0] 張廖次長萬堅:臺灣目前是減輕加配合少子化政策、人口政策。
gazette.blocks[47][0] 羅委員廷瑋:我知道,你們有在做。今天我們要講的是,政府的法令已經在執行,我們把目標更加的明確,該強迫的要強迫,不該強迫的,我們可以來討論。但是訴求是什麼?訴求還是一樣,在5歲的時候,義務教育真正落實到學費,不是只有學費而已,我們一直在講,現在只有學費而已嗎?你們只有補學費而已耶!其他的費用呢?我們看到這些義務教育向下延伸,我也要問,很多人講不要倉促修法,結果不好意思,國民義務教育向下延伸討論了不是10年,是數個10年耶!這個不倉促也太不倉促了吧!這涉及的層面當然很廣,我知道啊!有課綱、有教師、有教室、有設備、有經費等等,但是這些年只有公聽會而已嗎?教育部難道有真的痛定思痛,好好地、馬拉松式的探討該怎麼具體增加,讓我們能夠把這法規補上最後一個漏洞嗎?
gazette.blocks[48][0] 張廖次長萬堅:報告委員,我們10年透過公共化平價教保名額的計畫,公幼、非營利幼兒園的興建有六百九十幾間,10年增加了六百多間。
gazette.blocks[49][0] 羅委員廷瑋:我相信,所以今天才要探討,就是因為看到有進度了,不是只是說倉促,我們今天就來討論這個法令,光我自己的選區,我在擔任議員的時候,公托、公幼不斷地在興建,這也符合每一個縣市首長正在做的事情,透過你剛剛講的,10年又增加了六百多。我們都希望這個應該要納入到今天的探討,什麼叫做倉促?沒有討論、取消討論才是真正忽視了我們現在正在面對的問題。再來我也要講,你們說跟地方政府探討,地方政府說什麼?說要2歲專班。
gazette.blocks[50][0] 張廖次長萬堅:他們比較需要、目前家長的需要。
gazette.blocks[51][0] 羅委員廷瑋:對,要2歲專班嘛!
gazette.blocks[52][0] 張廖次長萬堅:對。
gazette.blocks[53][0] 羅委員廷瑋:彭署長,我是不是也跟你開過協調會?有關於小朋友一滿3歲就要離開幼稚園這件事情,想辦法研擬可不可以到當學期結束再來?你們給我的回應是什麼?已經從2歲延到3歲了,如果再讓他到當學期截止,會影響到2歲小朋友的入學進度。那也是兩年前的事,我們一直在講2歲專班,到現在2歲專班的興建已經出現了很大的瓶頸,學校相關一些可以使用的校舍空間基本上都已經沒有了,我自己也一直在呼籲啊!就是沒有場地了,2歲專班也好,公托、公幼的興建已經出現瓶頸了。所以我們沒辦法再等下去了,我們也希望透過別的方式讓所謂的5歲義務教育對年輕家庭多一點真正實質的幫助,讓他們減少支出,可是今天全部被抹黑、攻擊,說是倉促啦!修了數十年叫倉促?說這些是花大錢啦!教育本來就應該花大錢啊!我感謝這些委員每天幫我宣傳我在幫所有大學生爭取學貸免利息,幫所有小孩子爭取營養午餐、爭取讓營養午餐更好吃,幫所有人爭取現在的補助,甚至是幼照法的修法,讓年輕家庭減緩更多的壓力。教育本來就應該花大錢,更何況是砸在我們的人民身上、砸在未來的孩子身上。很可惜!待會質詢完以後我們就要結束今天的會議,因為我們沒有辦法進入逐條討論,我們被沒收了討論。我還是要再次跟大家呼籲,剛剛次長也講了,目前5歲的就學率是96%。
gazette.blocks[54][0] 張廖次長萬堅:這是公立跟私立。
gazette.blocks[55][0] 羅委員廷瑋:對啊!就是加起來已經96%了,基本上已經是共識了,小朋友進去讀書已經是大家基本都要做的事情了。
gazette.blocks[56][0] 張廖次長萬堅:但如果是強迫入學的話……
gazette.blocks[57][0] 羅委員廷瑋:強迫入學的部分大家可以探討嘛!所以這個部分可以不要入法,我們待會可以來討論,可是被沒收了!目前你也知道,我一直在跟你強調我的中心思考是什麼,就是減緩家庭的支出,讓他們減少一切生活支應的負擔,這是我們的目標,大家就是要討論嘛!今天我也沒有一定要讓強迫入學入法,大家要討論啊!結果被沒收了,很可惜!你是次長,也是我立法委員的學長,我想孩子就是未來,這是你一直不斷呼籲的,我們一起朝這個方向努力,也希望教育部能夠提出因應的措施。以上。
gazette.blocks[58][0] 張廖次長萬堅:謝謝。
gazette.blocks[59][0] 主席:謝謝羅廷瑋召委的質詢,請次長回座。
gazette.blocks[60][0] 主席(羅委員廷瑋):辛苦了,翁曉玲委員,今天的壓軸,有請。
gazette.agenda.page_end 184
gazette.agenda.meet_id 委員會-11-5-22-18
gazette.agenda.speakers[0] 羅廷瑋
gazette.agenda.speakers[1] 羅智強
gazette.agenda.speakers[2] 柯志恩
gazette.agenda.speakers[3] 伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe
gazette.agenda.speakers[4] 林宜瑾
gazette.agenda.speakers[5] 吳沛憶
gazette.agenda.speakers[6] 吳思瑤
gazette.agenda.speakers[7] 陳秀寳
gazette.agenda.speakers[8] 郭昱晴
gazette.agenda.speakers[9] 葉元之
gazette.agenda.speakers[10] 陳培瑜
gazette.agenda.speakers[11] 蔡春綢
gazette.agenda.speakers[12] 許忠信
gazette.agenda.speakers[13] 張雅琳
gazette.agenda.speakers[14] 翁曉玲
gazette.agenda.speakers[15] 葛如鈞
gazette.agenda.speakers[16] 徐欣瑩
gazette.agenda.page_start 105
gazette.agenda.meetingDate[0] 2026-06-29
gazette.agenda.gazette_id 1155801
gazette.agenda.agenda_lcidc_ids[0] 1155801_00004
gazette.agenda.meet_name 立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議紀錄
gazette.agenda.content 審查一、委員蘇清泉等20人擬具「國民教育法第三條條文修正草案」案;二、委員邱鎮軍等20人 擬具「國民教育法第三條及第四條條文修正草案」案;三、國民黨黨團擬具「國民教育法第三 條、第四條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案;四、台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「國民教育法第三條及第 四條條文修正草案」案;五、委員葉元之等18 人擬具「國民教育法第二十一條條文修正草案」 案;六、委員邱鎮軍等22人擬具「國民教育法第四十四條及第四十八條條文修正草案」案;七、 委員徐欣瑩等17人擬具「國民教育法第三條、第四條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案;八、委員 邱鎮軍等19人擬具「國民教育法第四十四條條文修正草案」案;九、委員林倩綺等21人擬具「國 民教育法第十三條條文修正草案」案;十、委員羅廷瑋等18人擬具「國民教育法第三條、第四條 及第二十八條條文修正草案」案
gazette.agenda.agenda_id 1155801_00003