| IVOD_ID |
16981 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/16981 |
| 日期 |
2025-10-23 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-19-7 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期經濟委員會第7次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
7 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期經濟委員會第7次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2025-10-23T08:42:09+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-10-23T12:20:00+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
03:37:51 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/16eb79f0bb3b77db698c973f844725bd798697611f09b1a90aa126c40303dc2703e049dcb8de56d65ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-10-23T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期經濟委員會第7次全體委員會議（事由：邀請農業部部長及財政部關務署首長就「非洲豬瘟防檢疫後續防疫精進作為」進行報告，並備質詢。） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:42:09 - 12:20:00 |
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304.172 |
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MING PAO CANADA MANGA |
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1202.252 |
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1216.507 |
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好 謝謝我們現在請正式開會請組密報告出席人數報告委員會出席委員14人以足法定人數好 我們現在開會進行報告事項請宣讀上次會議事錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
1218.393 |
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1239.539 |
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立法院第11屆第4會期經紀委員會第6次全體委員會議事錄 時間114年10月22日星期三9時至13時16分 地點紅樓101會議室 初期委員林黛化等14人 列席委員賴世保等26人 列席人員經濟部部長龔明星等 主席楊昭吉委員瓊英 報事項 依宣讀上次會議事錄決定確定 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
1240.419 |
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1266.624 |
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二 邀請經濟部部長列席報告業務概況並備質詢經濟部部長龔明欣報告後委員林黛化等31人提出質詢均由經濟部部長龔明欣等即席答覆決定一 登記發言委員除不在場者外其餘經已發言完畢 詢答結束二 委員牛喜婷及劉建國所提書面質詢列入記錄刊登公報三 書面質詢和未及答覆部分請相關單位於一週內以書面答覆並複製本會 散會宣讀完畢 |
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1268.666 |
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1289.499 |
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好 那我們現在繼續進行報告事項請宣讀邀請農業部部長及財政部官務署首長就非洲豬瘟防檢疫後續防疫精進作為進行報告並被執行 宣讀完畢我們現在介紹在場的委員以及列席的首長首先我們介紹邱益穎委員 |
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1292.421 |
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1311.946 |
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接下來我們農業部長陳俊暨陳部長我們動物植物防檢署署長杜署長以及蓄產試驗所黃所長接下來我們獸醫研究所鄧所長以及財政部關務署署長彭署長好 謝謝 |
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1316.007 |
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1343.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
那接下來本日的議程排定非洲豬瘟防檢疫後續防疫精進作為進行報告並備詢因為這一次發生這個事件國人非常的關心也牽扯到千億的這個肉品的產業所以我們希望大家怎麼樣能夠穩定整個國人的一個安心我們也請政府加油 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
1344.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
1346.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
所以我們現在首先來請農業部長陳俊記請做報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
1363.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
1384.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
主席 各位委員今天農業部奉邀到大約第11屆第4會期經濟委員會報告台中市通報疑似非洲豬瘟案例緊急啟動應變作為案以下請就相關的議案做一些報告書面報告我想都已經給委員了那我就用簡報的方式很快速的做一個說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
1385.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
1411.087 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那整個大概大概分為這四部分 請參考那整個案例場是位於台中市的一個無期區那從10月10號開始 該場開始有一些異常的死亡狀況那一直到10月14號 台中市再再度的去訪視然後到了20號就是送檢體到我們的農業部的獸醫所那21號我們收到以後 做進 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
1411.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
1435.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
立刻做相關的一個檢體的檢查那檢查在當天21號的下午6點06分就發現說整個檢體裡面呈現非洲豬瘟的陽性核酸那整個陽性核酸我們現在初步是利用劇毒的反應去呈一些相關的一個結果那相關的病死豬也有相關的一個症狀那目前已經採行的一些作為大概我們會針對周邊3公里的案場 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
1438.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
1466.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
做相關連的這些實施移動管制那這是在21號的時候9點的時候我們確認用這樣的方式去處理然後同時該場剩下的這些豬隻195頭我們也在20號當天凌晨就完全做鋪紮然後就地掩埋那對於該牧場周邊的一個清潔及消毒然後該案場周邊的3公里我們列為管制區就執行豬場的移動管制開始進行疫調 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
1467.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
1489.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
那在初步第一階段的疫調的過程中那我們發現說我們是從疑似案例場的租資在發病前15天然後開始去回溯追蹤曾經進出這個場的車輛去列入我們最終調查的對象那第一個部分就是還有就是3公里內的這些租場進行移動管制跟電話或視訊的調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
1491.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
1510.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
那根據這樣的一個圈定我們發現說這個豬場之前在9月30號曾經從其他的地方運來的一些豬隻所以我們針對從潭子區購來的這個豬來源場這個來源場我們也去做檢查發現沒有異常的死亡現象那第二個部分就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
1511.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
1533.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
從潭子區載運的這個豬隻的這個車輛的車主他本身也有養豬那我們同樣的也針對這個豬場去做檢查那目前也沒有死亡的一個異常的狀況那同時在半徑三公里內有兩場管制場裡面其中一場是停養了但是另外一場目前也沒有死亡的異常的一個狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
1535.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
1546.815 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
那當它的關聯廠最接近的關聯廠檢測出沒有什麼特別異常以外那我們開始針對運輸車輛的軌跡進行相關聯廠的一個劃定那該車涉及的就是有經過這個這個租廠的相關的這個車輛總共有33場的一個關聯廠那初步我們在 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
1558.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
1574.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
在22號開始做疫調的時候先用電話訪視也沒有發現這個化織車整個化織的數量有異常的現象那運輸車的部分關聯廠大概有7場那現在已經列入疫調的一個現況那 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
1577.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
1592.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
由於非洲豬瘟是台灣第一次發生的那我們從107年開始就是非常非常辛苦的這樣做一個將這個病毒能夠丙除於境外那發生這樣的一個事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
1593.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
1613.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
那我們開始在22號我們召開了移民中心那移民中心裡面大概有幾個作為也在這邊跟委員報告就是台東市的這些病死豬的個別處理的部分就是在台東市處理那其他的相關的這些畫製廠他不得就是不得拒絕其他縣市來做畫製 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
1615.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
1632.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那最主要的原因就是說當你這些因為豬隻飼養的過程中都有一些自然病史或管理不當病史的那這些豬隻如果不讓他進到化織廠的話他可能會導致這些豬隻會隨手丟棄那另外一部分廚藝的部分我們已經協調環境部以現有的 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
1635.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
1661.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
清潔能量來沒有辦法做的時候我們委託清潔業者加強相關的作為那12月20號我們也召開了一面中間的討論會我們每日會追蹤化製廠的藝廠的數量回報那畜牧廠需自主管理那同時我們全面使用廚藝的未往注資那未來會是疫情的狀況做相關的一個延長廚藝關聯的模式那全面啟動整個疫調的掌握關聯 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
1662.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
1686.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
那同時我們也協調冷凍工會釋出冷凍豬肉穩定市場的一個供應量那在昨天下午 行政院院長其實也聽取了相關的報告那比較重要的指示是農業部進行關聯的溯源務必落實相關的防檢疫措施防止疫情的擴大而且要穩定我們國內在這段禁運禁載的期間 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
1688.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
1714.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
能夠穩定肉品的供銷以避免影響到民生的豬肉供應的穩定那相關的部位一定用最高規格的方式來處理防患病死豬的一個流向造成民眾的恐慌那其中就學童營養午餐的部分我們會協調相關的這些冷凍工會來協助然後同時我們也會精進港口相關的檢查的一個措施強化綠線通關的一個開箱 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
1716.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
1744.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
查驗的比例那同時持續加強走私等相關的事宜那特別是提到就是防疫視同作戰我想我們現在最重要的工作就是讓這個疫情的擴散能夠達到降到最低來確保我們的養豬產業那整個的一個落實本身我想我們在10月22號我們在台中的就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
1745.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
1765.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
昨天開始我們在台東的前進應變所由杜文貞市長進駐那進駐的期間最主要的工作就是在做台東市的整個的一個的這個養豬場觀念場的疫調的情形那每天會開召開工作會報那每一天也會對外有正式的記者會對外說明我們的進度那以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
1766.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
1795.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
做这样的一个说明那整个跨部会的这个边境检疫其实我们有大概有七大的面向从宣导到入境旅客到整个的邮包快递的检查电商平台的管理然后还有后市长的稽查跟厨艺的管理跟走私的防范那这些整个的一个检查都是跨部会持续努力的一个情况那以上做这样的一个报告谢谢好谢谢部长的报告接下来我们请官务署彭署 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
1796.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
1816.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
彭署長主席各位委員先生 大家好那以下公務署就公務署執掌的邊境管制有關於非洲豬瘟防檢疫後續的防疫精進作為提出報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
1817.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
1834.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
海關是從107年中國大陸疫情爆發之後就積極協助主管機關農業部邊境防疫的一個管制那我們從這個貨物可能進口的一個途徑包括這個機場港口郵包快遞等進行 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
1836.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
1864.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
攔查違規肉製品的一個邊境管制作為那以下足以說明在入境旅客的部分行李的部分國際機場現在首體行李對中國大陸 越南 泰國39處高風險地區入境旅客的首體行李現在都是百分之百的X光檢查那拖運行李也是百分之百的X光檢查國際三港郵輪小三通入境旅客的行李目前也是百分之百都是經過X光檢查 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
1864.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
1883.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
那進口郵包的部分同樣也都是100%的X光檢查另外中華郵政公司他會預先分流來自高風險地區包括中國大陸 越南跟泰國等這些的進口郵包由海關來加強查核另外有房間署的檢疫權也會加強來繡紋 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
1884.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
1895.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
進口快遞的部分不管是空運的快遞貨物海運的快遞貨物目前都是百分之百實施X光的一個儀器檢查另外有同仁來實施適當比例的一個抽檢 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
1897.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
1915.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
就是開箱查驗 也包括不定期的實施來專案查緝那進口貨物櫃的部分 就是貨櫃跟航空櫃的一個部分那海關是運用風險管控的一個機制 來鎖定高風險的一個貨物 加強查核並且三節 端午節 中秋節跟春節 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
1916.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
1940.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
這些我們棄貨違規豬肉製品的高峰期間我們都會提高查驗的一個強度然後提醒同仁不可鬆懈那從107年1月1號到昨天為止那海關總共查獲豬肉跟含豬肉的製品有13500多件有22000多公斤那旅客的部分是佔大宗有1150幾件那佔 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
1945.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
1962.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
公斤數是18000多公斤那油包的部分有2900多件2700公斤快遞比較少一點是520件1454公斤那查獲後我們都是已有防檢署依照動物傳染病防治條例來做採取 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
1963.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
1979.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
那未來的一個策進作為那我們會跟房間署合作來嚴查高風險的一個旅客我們從統計數字來看的話目前旅客違規查獲的比例是比較多數那佔差不多五成以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
1979.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2008.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
那這旅客當中又屬中港澳從這些航班入境的旅客查獲的比例占6成以上所以我們會針對這些高風險的一個航班入境的一個旅客來加強在綠線區域跟防檢署檢疫隊來合作加強這個旅客的一個行李檢查那一旦查獲的話會由防檢署立即開罰以達到嚇阻的一個效果 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2009.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2037.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
另外我們會加強人工開箱查驗的一個比例那我們會藉由風險控管的方式來鎖定高風險進口人跟進口快遞貨物來加強查核提高我們人工開箱查驗的一個比例有效來攬查步伐在優化查緝的工具部分目前海關有129部的X光機那我們陸續都太舊換新另外行政院也 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2038.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2063.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
核准我們的計畫再增加兩部高科技的X光軌道式的貨櫃檢查儀所以加上這兩部的話我們海關會有7部的軌道式X光檢查儀那有好的一個查緝工具那也要有好的人才跟專業的一個人才所以我們對我們海關同仁X光檢查儀的判讀等訓練課程都會加強這樣的一個教育訓練會持續來推動我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2065.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2087.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
X光检查仪判读人员的一个分级制度那我们当然会分享研讨我们过去查气的一个案例来提升我们海关整体查气统治的一个技巧跟X光判读的一个能力那防堵非洲诸分海关秉持的态度就是一向以最高标准最高规格跟高警戒的一个严谨态度来把守国门 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2087.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2105.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
不曾鬆懈 那海關也會陸續 後續也會進行我們的精進作為來加強一些優化查緝工具來精進風險管理 來維護我們農畜產業的一個安全來貢獻我們海關的一個心力 以上報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2115.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2130.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
好 我們謝謝彭處長的報告那接下來我要請問現場我們的委員足夠三人請問剛剛所宣讀的上次會議議事錄有沒有錯誤沒有 那我們議事錄確認那接下來 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2133.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2149.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
我們有關本次這個要進行詢答的我們在委員詢答之前依慣例來做宣讀 美會委員發言時間6分鐘非本會委員4分鐘 上午10點半截止發言登記 我們首先可以給你講 對 好 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2156.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2181.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
是 是 是 放心好 這我們依照慣例來 接下來我們首先請第一位的邱益穎委員好 謝謝主席我請一下陳部長我們請陳部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2190.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
2211.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
部長好部長您在10月20號左右聽到這個消息嘛對不對21號21號左右聽到這個消息你內心第一個想法是什麼我直接講啦或許你不好意思表達 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
2212.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
2236.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
我們守非洲豬瘟守了六七年好不容易在今年的五月我們獲得世界動物衛生組織的認證台灣是亞洲唯一一個口蹄疫豬瘟非洲豬瘟的三大非疫區結果一夕之間破功我昨天聽到這個消息的時候我非常非常的難過 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
2239.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
2267.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
部長這個是你們整理出來的整個疑似非洲豬瘟的大試劑疑似因為你昨天是用疑似這件事情來開記者會我進一步請教根據您今天的這一份報告我就一項一項來請教你大試劑我看我就也不用再特別看了初步的檢驗結果PCR核酸呈陽性那代表的意思是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
2268.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
2291.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
他就是確認他是非洲豬瘟是不是我想非洲豬瘟的確認等一下我是不是可以請我們的那個獸醫所來報告因為核酸片段是代表他有這樣子的核酸片段但是他還是要做完成的定序所以你還沒有做完完成的定序所以現在還不能告訴大家是不是確定是定序昨天做完了但是根據WOH如果說 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
2294.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
2320.439 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
這個國家發生第一例的時候那你必須做病毒的分類那病毒的分類大概要兩個禮拜的時間那病毒的分類確定了以後才能跟WHO去通報所以這段時間我們是用儀式的方式但是用最高規格的方式來處理好 如果是這樣的話我也尊重你們的處理機制不過部長我想要看的就是說這件事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
2320.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
2343.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
我覺得一定是有某些疏失這些疏失會出現在哪裡比如說在10月10號的時候台中的這個牧場已經開始有出現豬隻死亡14號台中動保處去訪視但是沒有採樣動保處認為沒有異常可是依照中央的規定你只要有 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
2345.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
2367.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
不確定性你只要有不知名原因的死亡都應該要立刻採檢結果台中的動保處拖了10天已經死了117頭豬了拖了10天才通報更扯的是在10月13號的時候這一家牧場還快速運了30頭豬出去賣 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
2370.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
2391.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
我不知道他內心到底知不知道他的牧場出狀況了然後想說趁這個時間趕快把這個豬趕快把它賣掉然後呢我看到最難過的是昨天的新聞我看到最難過的是最愛驗豬肉的盧秀燕市長一盒西部特羅驗了這樣子驗到台塘虧損連連 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
2393.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
2422.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
最該驗的豬隻死亡不驗不開記者會不說明竟然叫大家去參加台中購物節拼經濟到底盧秀燕市長知不知道這個養豬業者的所有的產值所影響的是多少億剛剛我們的昭緯講了昭緯一開始主持會的時候就講了這影響將近千億的產值這千億的產值盧秀燕賠得起嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
2423.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
2445.517 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
盧修彥可以擔得起來嗎台中動保處可以擔得起來這個責任嗎很顯然沒有現在所有的作為幾乎全部是要交給你們農業部去做部長我要請教如果交給農業部去做後面的精進作為幾件事情請教農業部昨天講了幾個方案幾件事情第一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
2447.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
2471.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
禁宰豬肉第二個禁用這個廚餘餵食到底禁宰豬肉跟禁用廚餘餵食期間是要多久過去我們曾經有禁止廚餘餵食一個月那針對今天台中的這個案子你們的禁止廚餘餵食是會多久20天我們跟這個全國的養豬協會 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
2473.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
2489.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
做過電話聯繫做過討論他告訴我們為了要讓消費者安心20天是他們可以撐得住的就是20天賣台幣20天賣用廚餘去吃的他們是可以撐得住的農業部怎麼看 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
2489.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
2503.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
我想農業部針對這樣子的一個禁運禁載跟禁止使用廚餘我們是用他的一個可能發病的潛伏期15天所以我們的整個的禁運或是禁用廚餘是用以15天為 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
2505.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
2532.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
為最大的一個管制的時間點所以你現在是要禁載禁運跟禁用廚餘你現在抓的天數是15天但是我們每5天去做一個觀察那這些觀察就是讓我們的疫調能夠就是更精準的觀察那如果說在這15天之內如果說我們的疫情跟他的疫調的結果他沒有在擴散的時候那我們可能有機會提早解除這樣的一個禁令 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
2533.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
2561.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
所以現在就是很清楚的告訴大家以15天為基準 禁載 禁運 禁用廚餘養豬現在是以15天但是你用5天為一個觀察基數嘛所以是不是衛福不是衛福 對不起農業部是不是也能夠5天就公布一次你們這5天的觀察期的數據跟現在的進程你們的疫調的進程能夠讓社會大眾能夠讓消費者也安心也能夠讓我們的養豬業者安心 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
2561.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
2587.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
我跟委員報告我們在前進指揮所每一天工作會議結束以後每一天都會召開記者會對外說明每一天會把我們的疫調的進度對外說明讓我們的民眾了解好 謝謝部長第二個我要請教昨天你們的昨天我們的這個應變中心啊也特別提到那這些病死豬的處理模式應變中心要求這些所有的病死豬必須焚化 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
2590.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
2617.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
對不對必須要送到焚化爐去焚化但是台中市政府說他沒有辦法焚化台中市政府主張採取掩埋的方式部長您知道這件事情嗎那如果他要掩埋我要請教埋在哪裡如何掩埋對於土壤對於水源會不會造成污染對環境會不會造成影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
2619.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
2623.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
有合法的掩埋廠嗎有合法的病死豬掩埋廠嗎部長你有掌握嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
2625.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
2650.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
有 我跟委員報告就是對一般的病死豬除了主要是送到化織廠但是如果說因為特殊的原因沒有辦法送到化織廠的話它是可以就地掩埋或者是焚燒的部分但是掩埋也有一般掩埋的相關的作業規範而不是說就挖個坑就把病死豬就丟進去了所以相關的就算是掩埋它相關的部分也有相關的一個規範那今天最重要就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
2651.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
2676.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
因為台中本身是現在看起來的主要的疫區那我們做框定我們不希望說台東市裡面的這些豬隻有流到外縣市就是移出外縣市所以針對台東市是特殊的我們希望說他的病死豬的部分能夠就地處理那這個處理包括我們昨天也調度了一些生物處理機讓他去做有效的處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
2677.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
2696.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
部長你還是沒有回答問題啊他就地處理是要就地怎麼處理他是就地掩埋還是就地在地焚化爐去焚化嘛如果你很堅持用在地的焚化爐去焚化那我覺得這件事情我是支持農業部喔昨天我們在中央裡面你可以幫他協助看他要再去到哪裡就地的焚化爐我覺得 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
2696.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
2713.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
立刻把它焚化這個對大家來講會是比較安心埋在土裡你根本不知道他埋在哪一個野埋場那那個野埋場合不合法那個野埋場的處置作業適不適合這個都是大家擔心的一件事情所以這個可能會後我要請部長再 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
2714.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
2736.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
還是部長您現在要說明我們昨天開會的時候我們就請台中市政府送到焚化爐去但是焚化爐太大隻不能弄所以我們也增掉了許多生物處理機在焚化爐旁邊透過生物處理機來處理到一部分以後再進到焚化爐去我們是用這樣的態度台中市願意遵守嗎台中市願意已經媒合了我們媒合了就這個所以未來會這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
2737.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
2755.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
好如果是這樣不好意思主席再給我兩分鐘的時間這個剛剛關務署也特別報告我想這個農業部大概也有密切掌握其實這幾年來違規攜帶豬肉入境的還是層出不窮而且這個數量都還是頗多那我們的宣導 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
2756.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
2777.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
我們一直告訴大家不要攜帶豬肉入境這個會造成台灣有感染非洲豬瘟的風險結果沒有想到藍白兩黨認為你們的煤炫預算太多所以就聯手大砍的煤炫預算偉大的黃國昌委員還說要砍到讓大家有感 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
2778.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
2797.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
這真的大家就有感啦非洲豬瘟進來啦防疫宣傳不夠防疫動作不夠真的讓大家很有感而且這個感是憤怒被他們這樣預算亂砍導致台灣未來有可能成為非洲豬瘟的疫區我覺得這個是讓我們最感到 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
2798.841 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
2821.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
憤怒的地方部長最後一個我要跟您提醒我們現在等於是在亡羊補牢等於是在幫人家擦屁股在處理後續的事情但是後續的事情包括我剛剛講的這個病死豬的焚化處理的流程這個你們一定要趕快建立所謂的SOP第二個我們要求所有的 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
2821.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
2839.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
不管是養豬場也好所有的市場等等都要做清消那這些消毒水的供應是不是也能夠請農業部來協助各地方縣市政府趕快發送到各個養豬場或者是肉品市場或者是屠宰場等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
2840.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
2866.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
相關的場域這一些消毒水的發放甚至類似這樣的一個防疫的補助經費是不是也能夠請貴府部趕快盤點然後趕快來協助地方政府來做總之我希望雖然已經被突破了但是後面的亡羊補牢的工作後面的圍堵我們還是要持續加速甚至加緊加嚴來進行部長這個可以做得到嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
2867.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
2888.101 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
我想謝謝委員的提醒這四點我們已經第三點第四點已經昨天就宣布了而且在做了那我在這邊要特別特別藉這個機會呼籲各地方政府因為現在各地方政府本身的一些畫製廠他是不允許其他縣市進到那邊畫製的那我覺得在這個時間點除了台東市我們單獨處理以外 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
2888.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
2909.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
那其他縣市的這些正常的病死豬的部分希望各縣市能夠一起合作讓他的豬隻能夠進到花枝廠這樣的話才不會流露到非法的這些丟棄我們希望說大家一起努力好 謝謝好 謝謝接下來我們請林黛華委員請做詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
2919.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
2921.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
好 有請部長我們再請陳部長好 部長 這個政策其實是要做預防 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
2933.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
2959.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
是要预防危机的发生那这个本席呢是也只针对您今天的简报也就是一个非常短期中的短期的一个究极因应还没有看到你中长期的一个怎么的预防的机制好那所以呢我还是要讲一直倡议的叫做智慧管理决策要智慧管理 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
2960.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
2985.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
那其實是從陳吉仲主委到您這個陳俊濟部長來講四年前本席就一直在倡議這個基因定序當中的重要性那它對於豬價的穩定對於防疫所有各養豬場的距向的掌握以及到你的一個生產力的提升 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
2986.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3001.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
成本的降低生產力的提升其實全部都可以避其功以役而且是24小時365天所以今天我還是回到從4年多前30年前開始倡議的藉著你這次非洲豬瘟的普查 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3002.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3030.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
一定要結合生物安全資料庫也進而建立了穩定豬價的供應跟價格跟守住食安跟產業的信任豬價的穩定在上週的時候我說這個不是本席神預測現在從去年就在提醒說豬價一定會上漲您說你們會知道漲結果搞到今年我們豬價是全球第二高的國家 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3031.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3047.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
好那所以呢這個防疫講回來說到防疫守了7年那這個東南亞少數能維持非疫情的國家你們也做了因應了但是這些因應當中改以冷凍豬肉停止停止屠宰跟交易5天 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3048.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3075.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
這表示什麼一件事情我們的市場供應鏈是非常脆弱實安的資料是分散的所以呢再次提醒你在上一週本席的警告租價的穩定不是短期的問題是結構的問題政府痛定思痛務必建立全國租資的生物安全資料掌握環境與生物風險變化才能在疫情 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3076.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3094.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
價格 食安三者找到平衡所以今天的重點是希望藉著與非洲豬瘟的普查整合變成系統性的長期防疫防線冷凍豬肉的調度跟食安全國目前的冷凍豬肉的儲產量是6.2噸每日的消費是9500噸只能撐6天 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3100.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3110.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
所以您後續屠宰的時間如果延長了市場供應的供給一定是非常的緊急 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3112.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3131.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
所以我在這邊有兩個要求第一個市場的冷凍豬肉來源結構你必須立即公開這個公開是在疫情情節的食安透明度最基本的社會信任你要在48小時內明確的將這批冷凍豬肉的國產比例跟進口比例公開 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3132.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3157.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
第二個產地批次與倉儲溫控紀錄是否可以上網可查其實這兩個如果你有在本席三四年前就開始建立起你的智慧決策的一個共用平台的話其實這些你隨時我隨時問隨時都可以答全國人民都可以看好那你不做 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
3158.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
3177.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
那你就只好本席再次的要求這是在疫情期間食安透明度對社會最基本的信任要公開這兩項第二個在這個禁載期間供應減少導致批發價格我現在都講民生我現在是講人民不是講你講你這個農業部你的食安你的價格 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
3180.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
3201.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
你的價格如果超過了10%你現在租價已是天價如果因為這一波進展之後你再上漲10%必須拜託兩件事情第一個冷凍儲備的釋出這你已經在做了請你也要啟動平易租價基金趕快的穩定市場價格 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
3203.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
3226.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
不要把豬長期為農業部所苦也不要把豬變成行政團隊的包袱所以避免你只要市場的價格再次的變成讓民眾有恐慌性的採買這對現在的行政團隊又是雪上加霜所以綁上消費者保護農民的底線所以這邊是兩項要求再來 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
3231.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
3248.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
建立普查能夠結合普查建立組織的生物安全資料庫非洲防疫不是的這個防疫非洲豬瘟的防疫不是靠臨時應變現在你們叫臨時應變這次全國的普查是建立起結構化資料的絕佳機會 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
3250.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
3273.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
我再次再次的第二次的要求非洲豬瘟的普查結合全國豬隻生物安全資料庫的建設結合辦理具體三個第一個場居層級的資料第二個分子層級的監測第三資料整合與AI的預警你場居層級的資料由縣市防疫所協助採樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
3275.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
3281.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
輔導 具規模的中大型養豬場進行輔導記錄每座養豬場的環境倉庫你的溫濕度餵食來源進出人員場區消毒記錄建立數位防疫檔案 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
3291.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
3307.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
這個如果你有做從三四年前本席的倡議到現在你有做你現在就不會現在查到幾天了黃金的兩天內三天內你到現在還查不出來你的溯源還查不出來數位防禦痛定思痛做起來吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
3308.064 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
3333.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
我所謂中對增大型 台糖如果你你事先做 台糖是最大宗台糖你先導入了這樣每座養豬場環境的參數的導入建立數位防疫的資料那中小型的那我們就不用看了因為如果連中小型本席的選區也有啊中小型要這樣要求下去進出人員場區的消毒劑 他們做不來 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
3334.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
3362.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
但是中大型你要先導入中小型的你次看他的狀況看什麼的要求第二個分子層級的監測國營事業台糖自先導入基因育種跟分子檢測以市場的機制提升豬隻產續產的生產效益跟安全性你的屠宰場端與樣具中對豬隻檢驗進行兩件事情分子菌向檢測跟結合生物晶片 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
3363.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
3373.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
你百分百的掌握每隻豬啊豬隻環境的微生物豬的組成變化你怎麼可能還有疫情的發生 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
3374.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
3402.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
你都會掌握這不僅能提前發現病毒的跡象而且用來追蹤環境汙染跟抗藥性的菌株對未來食品安全管理奠定科學基礎都是建立在科學最後資料整合與AI預警由防菌署整合各縣市的防疫資料庫統一建立起株質健康環境檢測平台並以AI演算法監測異常菌群的變化自動發出預警 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
3404.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
3422.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
所以依照歐盟食品安全局的報告導入了分子檢測也就上述這三件事情非洲豬瘟的再發率是下降42%這不是理論這是實證台灣應該成為亞洲第一個以遜向資料防疫的國家 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
3423.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
3448.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
好再來講到價格價格與防疫是可以並行的從短期應變成長期的治理短期你穩定租價從冷凍調度跟平益基金平益基金是本席今天提出就長期穩定就還是一樣靠著資料科學與透明的決策建立租資生活安全資料庫之後你建立這個之後你可以有三件事情你就坐著 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
3449.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
3472.787 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
吹冷氣做你這個部長就夠了第一個透過即時檢測你這個安全庫有做出來你透過即時檢測預測疫情對供應鏈的影響第二個你可以提早釋放冷凍庫存避免價格的劇烈波動第三個以資料驅動補助政策資料驅動補助政策連你的補助都在建立在數據之上 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
3474.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
3493.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
針對高風險地區強化環境改善跟消毒設施這樣的系統能夠幫助地方政府掌握實際豬隻分布跟廚餘使用的狀況避免非法養豬或者不當廚餘流入市場從源頭穩定價格跟食安好 再來防疫科學化 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
3494.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
3522.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
守住食安重建人民的信任台灣已經防堵非洲豬瘟7年這呢防疫是長期戰豬價穩定是民生戰講好豬價穩定是民生戰防疫需要決心市場是需要制度的防我一再強調防疫不應該只是一時的禁止措施更應該建立長期的科學化結構的防線這邊短期長期我再次的要求 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
3523.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
3551.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
容業部期許容業部從上禮拜本席的質詢之後您我在沒有要求兩個月內要建立豬隻安全資料庫並且今天我一併的再次強調與非洲豬瘟的普查一同實施到包括價格的波動你也有要求你了在冷凍庫包括你的評議基金那包括你這個豬掌握豬隻的分布跟廚餘的使用這都您在簡報當中都有講本席都認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
3552.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
3561.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
未來結構性的防疫精進邊境的防土持續的做落實的做百分百的X光檢驗率市場的管理這邊 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
3563.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
3589.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
這個我也講了 結合國際GSI Summarize2027標準的推動這個Summarize是標籤的一個國際化的一個組織它2027年全球要推動 就是像ISO等等的類似這樣的一個標籤的一個全球的組織 它要推動那我們就是配合做 諸之圖宅導入QR Code |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
3591.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
3608.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
確保租資流通的通訊透明可追溯這不就是也是AI管理智慧平台嗎人要做好租才能管好守住食安就是守住農業更是守住人民的信任好 最後本席主張你們現在有一個基金 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
3610.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
3625.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
在百億基金在去年就已經截止了你們呢在去年6月24就已經呈報行政院 行政院到現在還沒核定這所謂的百億基金的第二期計畫那說百億也不到百億也不過68.8而已請農業部務必 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
3629.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
3649.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
行政院本週核定第二期的百億計畫從去年到現在還沒核定一年了放在行政院長辦公室一年了所以你現在趕快的核定這第二期的這樣的一個68.82億的計畫但是我認為要更名叫什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
3650.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
3672.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
不叫做百億基金了 百億基金它做在什麼 它是在租場設備現代化在你們做了很多的補助 這認同第二期這68.81% 或者你認為 我認為都應該要增加預算叫做續產復興計畫 著重三件事情生產效益 防疫安全和科學管理好 來 以上 部長你請回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
3674.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
3703.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
我想非常謝謝委員的一些期許然後我個人對大部分的一定百分之百認同特別是您特別提到生物安全庫的資料的一個建立這是一個非常重要的對於我們後續的租場的這些管理跟有效的掌握那相關的菌項的資料的一個部分那菌項至於說哪些菌項這個會回到專業去討論然後第三個就是透過這樣的方式做資料的整合跟AI的管理這個我想我百分之百認同那至於說 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
3704.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
3730.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
冷凍豬肉的部分的國產跟國外的去公佈因為這個東西都是不是政府購買的如果是政府購買一定百分之百公開但是我們是透過一些其他的冷凍工會冷凍廠商他們來釋出那這個東西就是由他們我們沒有辦法得到說他們的一個資料這個但是我們會去努力將我們自己能夠掌握的資訊能夠對外講 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
3731.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
3759.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
那不管是國產的或是國外進口只要符合安全的我想對產地批次倉儲溫控紀錄這當然可以上網啊不是如果是我們自己生產的自己掌握的所以你對進口的你完全是沒有辦法掌握他的場地包括批次在他上到國內的哪個地方包括他在哪個倉儲的溫控紀錄現在是不可查以現在的管理法規跟現在的制度是沒辦法 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
3762.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
3779.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
這是對於你在疫情期間釋出的冷凍豬肉當中的食安透明度你認為不必要嗎我產的部分沒關係你如果不必要就對大眾說這個在冷凍豬肉的釋出當中是沒有食安是一個空窗期的 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
3779.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
3794.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
我們是不需要把他的產現在沒做 未來也不需要做那麼請部長再詳細研議後我說國產的部分我們一定會有一個完整的溯源那國外進口的部分你要不要研議去建置呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
3795.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
3811.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
沒有 國外進來的部分是衛福部他主責的國外進來是食品的部分所以國產的部分我們會努力你跟衛福部討論我們會跟衛福部溝通去對於在你疫情期間的食安透明度我意思講你疫情期間食安這個沒問題對食安的透明度就沒有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
3812.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
3834.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
謝謝部長 請將委員所提詳時研議後那您對於這個第二期的百億計畫其實只有68.82億您要不要請怎麼樣的要去跟行政院報告這件事情你今天就要馬上報告啦我想這個部分我們之前也在行政院溝通應該很快就會核下來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
3835.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
3863.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
那你的做法我主張是要續產復產基金生產效益防疫安全科學觀尤其科學觀你不是只有防疫包括你租資的競爭力你的生產成本是導致你的價格是全球這個租價全球第二高你不覺得這是很丟臉的一件事情好我們請部長因為時間的關係因為超過一半的時間你那麼認同在這個第二期的這樣的一個百億計畫當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
3866.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
3886.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
叫做素產復興計畫著重在生產效益防疫安全科學觀如果沒有你還是只有在廠租廠的現代化設備的投入你並不會對於你防疫跟科學管理跟生產效益當中你是沒有錢的你拿來的錢你沒有靠這筆錢你怎麼可以推動剛才本席所講的這個智慧管理呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
3887.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
3906.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
好 谢谢林委员的发言我们也请农业部请将委员所提的详实给委员说明清楚我已经提醒了我没有意见主席我没有意见我只是提醒部长谢谢好 接下来我们请郑天才委员请做询答 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
3918.829 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
3947.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
主席 國務委員 有請部長還有關務署好 我們請兩位 謝謝好 部長辛苦了還有關務署這個昨天22號這個農業部的新聞特別提到檢驗非洲豬瘟病毒核酸呈陽性反應所以你們 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
3948.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
3976.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
他很快的去做了很多的這個相關的緊急的防疫的作為所以從這個報告裡面是非洲豬瘟所以是 主要還是境外好 這個昨天22號你們也開了這個記者會然後相關的新聞提到這些這裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
3978.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
3998.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
這裡面都沒有提到防範境外當然你先就國內的都沒問題當然今天的你的報告就提到了第一個就是加強民眾防檢疫的意識 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4001.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4029.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
當然昨天很多的媒體或者是媒體比較沒有啦主要是一些網路一直在網傳國民黨在這個刪減114年度房檢署的梅仙的預算事實上那個都是錯誤的因為國民黨最後通過的所提案的並沒有提這個案 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4030.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4059.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
是測案所以這個部分然後今天也有很多昨天也有很多網路在傳追加預算的時候也刪事實上追加預算的時候所刪減的這是三個黨團都同意的除了外交部的保持維留維持這個預算追加預算之外其他的都是三個黨團都同意的 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4060.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4089.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
所以这个部分其实我们最重要的还是我现在你今天的报告里面提到的民众的先导这个恐怕不是用媒体去报导就好了很重要的就是我们的国人出国的时候你就告诉他你就用一张纸给他去国外不要买什么东西回来 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4092.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4119.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
最重要的是這個他才會因為很多而且你要告訴他你買了東西你要仔細看裡面是不是有豬很重要的是這樣一般人民出去買東西也不會去看細項他含的是什麼通常也不會所以無論是 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4121.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4145.824 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
農業部房檢署或者是公務署都要朝這方面去努力防範境外第二個你提到針對39個國家高風險國家入境旅客S光機100%檢查行李到底有沒有這樣做房檢署跟公務署如果我們看這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4147.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4176.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
这一些媒体的新闻报道这是去年的12月15号事实上就没有没有完全的全部的来去做彻底的来去检查事实上如果这样的这个报道是正确的话事实上是没有那我们怎么样应该要防范于境外 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4177.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
4198.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
这个才是最重要的好这里面你提到除了旅客输入另外就是电商电商平台卖家这个怎么样去做最有效的去检查你这边都提到了 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
4200.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
4228.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
防范查緝遺傳走私這些你都提了那怎麼樣去落實因為已經進來了之後怎麼樣去就很難了有它的難度了所以境外防范與境外因為畢竟它是從國外來的所以這個部分是我們要去加強要去做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
4230.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
4258.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
請問一下這個公務署要不要說明一下要怎麼樣去加強未來我先說明一下我想謝謝委員的一個說明我分兩個部分第一個部分就是整個境外的防範是一個跨機關跨部會的一個合作我們在107年12月12號成立中央一面中心以後就不斷的去檢討我們的強度是越來越強我們的強度從來沒有說 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
4261.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
4274.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
107年跟現在有越來越疏於管理而且是越來越精進越來越強所以我們才能夠守住這過去7年來的一個努力這第一個說明但是宣傳的部分我要跟委員講 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
4275.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
4297.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
就是農業部就房檢署的部分他3000多萬刪了大概2000萬但是就算預算被刪了我們還是非常努力的去做相關的一個宣導不會說預算被刪了以後而不做宣導沒有這回事我們還是很努力的去做相關的一個宣導這個我剛剛講了這個宣導要落實啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
4298.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
4321.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
你光去那个媒体其实大家不会去在意不会去注意媒体的寻找是一个多元的不管是用媒体我刚才我介绍一下飞机上面的萤幕都有部长我刚刚的建议可不可以做就是说只要出国的乡亲你就告诉他不能买什么 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
4322.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
4329.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
进来可以吗这个很重要这个最能落实啊不然一般乡亲也不会去注意啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
4331.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
4359.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
这个才是最能够落实你们去处理好不好我们在今年的端午节就有试着这样子在check in的时候就给他一段相关的宣导对 很好 就是要继续这个部分我想我刚才说的我们的边境的防患的部分我们会不断的精进这个是最重要最重要最重要的一定要去落实第二个难免看起来有疏还是有疏漏嘛 对不对所以进来了嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
4360.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
4388.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
所以进来了进来了怎么办呢对不对这个部分就是说除以到底这个除以这个很多早该前面进除以养猪对不对这个就是你难以防范进来 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
4389.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
4414.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
你說你剛剛進進了很多我跟委員報告你剛才講到這個廚餘我跟委員報告一件事情就是我們現在廚餘養豬一定要經過徵主我知道你都有寫了對 這個是一個非常重要所以廚餘養豬只要他經過合格的這些徵主的部分是一個安全的飼料我覺得不要去污衊我沒有污衊廚養豬的部分第二個部分我想跟委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
4415.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
4436.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
就好像我們在路上交通事故頻繁的時候我們不能說因此而不能開車 不能騎車所以我們會精進整個廚藝的監管廚藝長的監管這個是大家的心聲那你認為說是可以防範的但是顯然沒有沒有防範好嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
4436.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
4451.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
所以那個源頭很重要不是 現在的疫調還在進行中所以它的來源到底是從哪裡來的我想我們還沒有辦法去做決定所以我們也不能說這個來源一定是從廚藝或一定是從哪邊因為在疫調沒有完成之前 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
4452.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
4478.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
對不對沒有 國外的部分一定是從國外進來的那國外進來它有非常多的管道進到我們的豬場所以我在這邊我想我們第一時間就是我們會去做疫調疫調完了以後我們會定期的跟外界說明那最後的疫調的結果我們才能夠知道可能的來源是從哪裡來的來源一定是國外嘛 對不對這個是確定的嘛 好不好 加油是 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
4485.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
4499.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
謝謝 謝謝接下來我們請張家俊委員請做巡檔主席謝謝 那我想請陳部長我們再請陳部長餵好再下一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
4509.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
4531.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
部長我想我主要還是要呼籲大家必須要冷靜理性然後中央跟地方一定要攜手合作來防範這一次的疫情爆發包括說昨天你們已經宣布說要禁止廚餘養豬想請問一下說禁止廚餘養豬大概會禁止多久呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
4531.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
4544.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
我跟委員報告我們在設計這個鏡子圖養豬是用他可能的潛伏期就是15天但是我們每5天會做一個觀察那我想請問一下現在全台灣到底有多少豬隻呢500再養頭數大概是500500 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
4550.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
4553.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
505.8萬505.8萬嘛505.8萬請問目前廚藝養豬的大概是多少戶我們這樣講就是廚藝養豬戶有5552場那其中廚藝養豬的有435場35場 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
4569.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
4573.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
本席幫你算過了就是全台灣這麼多頭豬只有將近46萬是廚餘養豬所以只佔了全國養豬戶的8%所以你現在告訴我說你不全面禁止廚餘養豬為了這46萬頭要犧牲500多萬頭為了這8%你要讓台灣成為非洲豬瘟的破口嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
4598.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
4621.728 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
不過我想我們現在目前禁止廚餘養豬或者是禁宰禁運最主要是把這個傳播鏈先做斷鏈這就是下一個問題就是下一個問題才會去做移調但是後續的廚餘養豬的政策我想我們會是希望可長可久我們台灣的養豬產業你知道這個一旦爆發之後我本席就問你假設爆發之後會影響整個產值多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
4625.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
4647.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
以純粹豬產業的話 大概800多億但是觀念產業的話 稍微1000億是吧 本席也幫你算過不只1000億 可能1500億 也有可能2000億這影響的是全國人民欸可能會打擊非常多人的生計所以在現在 你告訴我說到底要禁止廚藝養豬多久 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
4648.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
4663.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
我想我們還是以就是15天當作一個所以你覺得先禁止15天為了這8%吃廚餘的這個養豬戶你要只禁止15天因為這8%46萬頭你要影響500 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
4667.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
4673.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
50萬頭是嗎550萬頭我還是跟委員說明就是廚藝養豬他如果經過珍珠廠合格的珍珠這個等於是安全但是他畢竟是一個破口啊你同意嗎你同意他是一個破口嗎他可能是破口之一是吧他就是破口之一他就是一個破口他就是一個破口那這個影響是1000億至2000億的產業你告訴我說為了這8% |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
4696.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
4715.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
你要影響這麼多人你堅持不禁止全面禁止廚藝養豬的理由是什麼我沒有說不禁止那我剛才說的你沒有說不禁止就是你要禁止囉我們這個政策我們需要去做滾動檢討那我們現在的策略就是從108年到現在那個廚藝養豬廠從 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
4717.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
4723.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
從一千多場變成四百多場不見得去輔導他轉型那現在告訴你說已經有爆發人你必須立即全面禁止全面輔導他轉型這個才是你農業部現在手要手應該要趕快去做的呀你農業部不趕快去做你告訴我說你15天之後還要觀察 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
4741.841 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
4760.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
你為什麼不能說先進一年先進三年試試看你試試看之後其實很多我們台灣的黑豬其實吃豆料也是可以我再問你下一個問題就是染上病毒的這些豬隻到底有沒有流入市場 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
4762.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
4789.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
以我们现在的观察我们是在病死猪去检测到的但是从我们的疫调过程中它过程中所以你也不确定说染上这个非洲猪瘟的猪肢到底有没有流入市场是吗屠宰场出来都会屠宰前屠宰后都会进入位置所以有掌握最新的流向吗有掌握最新的流向说到底这个病死猪我们有掌握我们没有病死猪流到屠宰场 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
4790.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
4812.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
真正的屠宰進到那個肉餅市場都會那個圖前跟圖後都由獸醫師檢查所以這個部分都是安全的我想消費者不要疑慮所以也呼籲消費者絕對不要擔心絕對不要擔心因為他是不會傳染給人的是不是 是所以另外我也想要請問一下國內那現在目前有豬肉短缺的狀況嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
4814.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
4835.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
現在因為我們禁運了以後那短時間之內市場上的這些需求我們都是用冷凍的方式所以會啟動就是進口國外的豬肉嗎不會 我們現在冷凍我們協調冷凍工業冷凍廠來供應第一個最重要的學童午餐第二個就是我們的一些市場所以我們的庫存量大概有將近26到1個月的時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
4837.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
4856.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
本席在這裡提醒你你假設要從國外進口你也要檢查非洲豬瘟的這個病菌因為它在冷凍肉品裡面是可以生存將近一千天的所以這一個也是我們必須要防堵的可是呢再回過頭來包括邊境管制假設你全面禁止廚餘養豬 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
4858.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
4880.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
你邊境管制就可以就不用那麼緊張你知道嗎這是一個雞生蛋誕生機的問題你如果假設禁止全面廚餘養豬邊境管制大家帶進來就不會那麼緊張我跟委員報告就是非熱豬的傳播不只是廚餘可能人體人的帶動我知道所以還有很多的 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
4880.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
4892.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
我知道但是禁止廚餘養豬是已經可以降低風險很多包括我們雲林縣早在七年前張立善縣長上任的時候他就全面禁止廚餘養豬那個時候就也有呼籲當時的農委會的主委陳吉仲那時候就呼籲陳吉仲主委說應該全面禁止廚餘養豬圍堵這件事情所以現在有很多的鄉親另外還有要講的就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
4910.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
4916.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
假設真的未來爆發了就是要撲殺補助的部分我們還是希望說這個是個案但是我們必須要料敵從寬未來如果進行撲殺本席建議必須要從優從寬的原則比照當初禽流感的這個模式你一定主動通報的機制然後依據市場價格進行全場全額補助的這樣的機制 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
4936.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
4953.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
因為我們不能讓農民為了配合防疫而造成他重大的損失那這更是為了鼓勵農民主動通報的一個重大機制不要避免說他為了隱瞞然後不通報而造成的這個死角這個部長認同嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
4955.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
4977.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
我想如果不是市主刻意隱瞞我們做全場撲殺的部分一定有我們相關的撲殺經費那第二個部分就是飼料的部分我剛才講的我們會去做一個滾動的檢討因為現在目前除以養豬的大縣就包括新北 桃園 台中 新竹然後還有屏東這幾個大縣因為除以養豬可是只有46萬頭啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
4979.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
4990.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
可是他吃廚餘的也只有45萬頭啊我們會去加強這些養豬大縣裡面也只有全國加起來只有46萬頭佔全國豬隻的8%因為這8%造成了影響上千億的這個產業鏈的風險你覺得值得嗎沒有 我剛才說的 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5000.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5015.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
風險是有來自不同的我再提醒一下部長我們會逐步的去調整我再提醒一下部長說假設不幸真的爆發我們必須撲殺那後續這些株枝的處理你們怎麼處理因為目前台灣只有 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5015.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5036.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
五個化智場有五個縣市有九個化智場只有宜蘭彰化雲林台東屏東五個縣市有化智場那怎麼辦呢是不是中央要有統一協調撲殺後株枝的處理辦法否則如果假設二度污染怎麼辦我現在本席 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5037.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5045.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
不是要挑戰農業部或者是要給你們找麻煩我們現在是希望大家一起攜手把這些事情有可能會發生的我們預先把這些機制擬出來其實這也會相當程度安定我們豬農的心非常謝謝委員這樣的一個建議特別在化製廠的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5058.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5086.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
像昨天我就特別提到因為台東現在比較看起來是疫區所以台東市的豬一定不會流到其他縣市然後第二個部分就是現有的酒家的化製廠本身我們都希望說透過聯合調度的方式大家縣市彼此放掉彼此擔心的然後就是接納其他的縣市的部分那後續因為以現在的量大概一年可以處理100萬頭但是如果緊急的時候一定不夠那怎麼辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5086.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5112.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
所以我們就必須做一個當緊急有緊急方式的目前有很多豬農給本席反應就是說有沒有可能補助他們小型的焚化的器具讓他們可以就地焚化但是這個當然我覺得要專家評估這個叫做生物處理機那這個部分我們絕對會來考慮我們絕對會來考慮因為在場裡面做生物處理的方式因為它移動還是有風險的所以這一點可能請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5113.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5118.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
薛議員的建議像這個生物處理機我們會來考慮那我最後還是想跟部長說就是防疫視同作戰那中央跟地方包括我們委員會包括整個立法院我想都全力的支持你一定要用最謹慎最快的速度還有決心來守護這些豬農還有守護所有消費者的餐桌安全 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5135.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5149.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
謝謝 我想中央跟地方一定要充分合作還有包括全國的消費者或者豬農我們一起來努力我相信一起努力的話我們會把疫情降到最低的一個風險是 謝謝好 謝謝謝謝接下來我們請鄭正前委員請做詢問 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5164.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5191.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
謝謝主席 我想請一下農業部陳部長我們再請陳部長部長好我想說碰到這個非洲豬瘟的個案狀態的時候其實我們一定是非常的擔心可是防疫是同作戰那我在想說我們在經濟委員會我們都很務實我們在想怎麼樣子能夠解決問題而不是在打口水 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5192.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5211.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
所以我想說一開始我一定要特別提到說最近在網路上有很多的風向在特別在講說因為藍白三預算沒宣費的時候然後才產生非洲豬瘟我覺得這完全是莫名其妙因為你剛剛有特別提到說這個非洲豬瘟他不可能從台灣自己生起來他一定是外來的對不對所以邊境的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5213.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
5239.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
儘管檢驗一定是最重要的是不是是嘛對不對所以說我在這邊要特別提到我就說事實上我們在今年的追加預算當中的時候莊總預算追加預算當中的時候其實包括民進黨在內是三黨有共識針對於這個沒宣費的問題是三黨有共識的所以我就在這邊就不要再去考慮什麼沒宣費然後要去帶風向去什麼抹黑在野黨的狀態我覺得這真的是不需要 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
5240.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
5263.978 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
工業部並沒有這樣子的思維希望 因為我們現在看到網路上面有很多的網軍就開始在帶風向我覺得這真的是莫名其妙的事情完全沒有把真正的問題點看出來那現在我們就特別看到的狀態就是說既然部長剛剛也特別提到非洲軍一定是外來的至於說它是怎麼樣的產生你剛剛提到說也許有很多可能性包括人體可能會帶進來對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
5265.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
5292.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
它都有很多的可能性所以我們的邊境的管控絕對是最重要的那我這邊我就先問一個問題事實上在那個我們從109年的時候我們整個那個易檢的全組總共有多少109年的時候 檢疫全組 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
5297.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
5299.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
現在56組嘛對不對其實在109年的時候只有50組從109年前是50組那麼109年開始有56組我給你們看個數字109年的時候我們的一個就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
5317.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
5336.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
入境的人數大概只有398萬人因為那時候大概有疫情沒有問題到現在的時候已經有了2494萬人入境人數包括我們國人的部分因為我們入境都必須要有這樣子的一個檢疫對不對可是我們現在的那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
5337.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
5351.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
檢疫犬的部分的時候還是只有56組工作量成長了已經快要8倍左右的狀態這種狀態的時候我想請問一下我們現在檢疫犬它的一個檢疫覆蓋率大概有多高 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
5352.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
5382.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
我跟委員報告我們的所有的邊境的檢查那檢疫犬是一個輔助的作為理解他不是用這個部分最主要是用X光機那我們在X光機的判度的部分是百分之百嗎我有看到這個數字一個重要的就是X光機我們現在希望包括光務組包括中研院都有合作就是讓他用AI更精準的判試的時候那相對的那個檢出的準確率越來越高然後檢疫犬是在做這個邊境的部分的一些通道的部分有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
5382.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
5411.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
特別是要出關的時候其他的輔助嘛那因為我們現在之前沒有問題的時候我們可能也覺得這樣也許夠可是問題現在碰到的狀態我們就希望不要有百密一疏的情況所以針對檢疫犬這個部分的時候我們是不是有需要要增加已經有因為檢疫犬需要培訓然後最近我們現在也一直不斷的確認然後從美國的部分這邊然後還有其他的公務署這邊也在協助一起來協助把這個檢疫犬輔助的作為能夠增加 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
5412.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
5419.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
預計能夠增加多少組多少多快的時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
5421.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
5429.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
沒有我想這算是整個公讓權我想我們回去再做仔細的評估好那針對這個部分的時候因為我想從109年就只有56組那時候只有398萬入境人數現在到113年已經到了2494萬入境人數的時候我就還只剩下56組我就顯然不合理那之後我們檢疫權的一個人數 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
5443.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
5451.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
犬數要怎麼樣增加再給本席很清楚的一個資料我只是再補充一下我們在對非洲豬瘟的控管裡面有分國家分為 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
5452.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
5480.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
高風險跟低風險 理解這個部分我們都知道所以旅客也分流了以後 理解理解這個只要有入境的人大概都知道這題目先不用特別講因為時間有限那我要特別講到因為在這一次整個的一個非洲豬的事件當中大家對於廚餘的問題其實就非常的有感因為目前感覺上好像是廚餘這邊導致的一個問題那我這邊要特別提到就像我也不想很口水的去講說其實張立善在就是2018年當縣長 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
5482.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
5493.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
他那時候就特別提到要敬畏廚餘可是當時的一個行政院長賴清德他其實是表示反對的那我不想口水講這個事情可是我只是想要講說廚餘這個問題因為目前只有8%的 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
5498.524 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
5513.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
株枝是用廚餘的部分剛剛有特別提到46萬頭那我想請教一下針對現在我們要用廚餘的部分都必須要有高溫蒸煮的一個情況請問這個部分有沒有真正的落實 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
5514.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
5533.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
我想我們的每一個高溫蒸煮廠本身它的中心溫度90度C一個小時我們都有資料就是去看它的溫度計然後把這個影像回溯環境部的部分回溯到環境部的後面的資料那我們會去檢查 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
5533.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
5562.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
因為當時賴清德當行政院長他那時候表示說因為用廚餘養豬有時候是因為成本的一個考量所以針對這個部分的時候呢你如果說要90度要高溫蒸煮一個小時以上的部分的時候我在想說很多這樣子的養豬廠他們會不會為了要控制成本而沒有真正的去落實去達到而且你如果是高溫蒸煮一個小時通常其實廚餘會有很難聞的味道可能周邊的 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
5563.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
5575.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
那個也會有一些抱怨所以我在認為我們對於高溫真主這件事情如果沒有辦法真正有效的落實的時候是不是就全面的禁止廚餘餵養 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
5576.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
5599.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
我想要不要用廚餘我們後續會滾動檢討但是一個非常重要的就是你如果要用廚餘的話我們所使用的廚餘的相關的規範是一個安全的那現在重要的就是我們一定要去加強監管的部分是非常重要那我剛才說的廚餘養豬的這些溫度計有沒有他是有影像攝影去判試的理解所以我們一定會加強監管 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
5600.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
5619.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
有完整的規範本席認為以台灣的法律體系一定會有問題是如何去落實去這件事情我覺得是最重要的好不好那我們希望大家一起中央地方一起合力來解決這次非洲豬瘟的一個挑戰好不好是好謝謝好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
5625.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
5641.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
好 接下來我們請賴瑞榮委員請做詢答好 謝謝趙偉 請陳部長我們再請陳部長部長我先請教一下這個非洲豬瘟的部分現在看來應該是只剩程序應該99.94%非洲豬瘟應該是這樣吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
5646.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
5665.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
對 以我們現在對於核酸的片段的確認跟序列的確認它應該就是應該就是非洲豬瘟的通報的程序裡面只剩下程序把它走完而已對 還要做分類了以後的程序走完以後我們就會那個正式通報為非洲豬瘟是對 好那再來我請教一下這個非洲豬瘟的病毒株跟越南是一樣的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
5666.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
5685.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
我根據我們的檢測的結果它的序列裡面它是一個重組的序列然後比較接近於越南我請我們的獸醫所的所長來說明沒關係 就是應該是可能性很高啦對不對不是 因為我們用非核株的病毒序列非常長那我們目前只訂了其中的三段 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
5685.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
5705.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
那他要知道病毒從哪裡來或是不是蟲毒豬要其他的部分完整的分析那我們今天會有初步的結果會知道他是從所以部長跟越南的很類似嘛對不對目前沒有但其實多數還是跟第二基因型就是中國或者是在那個東南亞流行豬所以比較像越南豬而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
5707.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
5724.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
OK好所以中國跟越南是都有可能的對好那再來我請教一下部長我們現在是禁運5天啊但這個時間上面剛剛很多人也提到了會再延長嗎不是我們不是說延長我想我們的整個的一個禁運期間是根據我們的可能的潛伏期就是15天 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
5725.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
5740.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
但是我們用5天來做觀察所以禁疫15天那5天5天觀察如果狀況控制下來就可以縮短而且是可以限制在某個區域的話那我們就會開始就是做這些解禁的動作就是15天所以以15天 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
5742.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
5759.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
那再要請一下部長這個來源到底是從哪邊來的是從境外就是由那個境內還是到底這個來源是從哪裡我想我們現在看到的是一個結果那我們才會啟動疫調那我剛才說的這個來源本身因為非洲豬瘟的傳播 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
5760.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
5785.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
他有非常多的多的方向包括人員可能出國進來帶進來的也有可能廚餘那也有可能從走私有些東西其他的東西然後進到那個生物防治做得不好由其他的人員有沒有參觀的人員來污染的所以這三樣都有可能就對了所以在疫調沒有完整呈現之前我們不能揣測說他的來源一定是哪一個所以這三樣都不排除對 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
5786.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
5799.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
那最有可能是哪一個 目前不過現在因為疫調還在進行 我們沒有辦法判斷因為特別是人員的部分那我請教 因為在15天的一個狀況的話從10月10號如果發病的話那應該是最早是在9月底囉 是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
5800.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
5823.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
回推的話最快的15天前15天前的話那就9月底10月10號發生的第一個嘛所以9月底就發生了所以等於9月底後的會全面去清查對我們從10月往前回溯往前回溯15天往後控制15天這樣好那我請教一下為什麼到了10月14號才去訪視然後甚至於場主還拒絕訪視這有沒有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
5825.322 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
5844.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
不過我想我們報告所呈現的那個時序的部分都是在第一時間去問台東市的動保處的人員的一個回應那我剛才說了這個回應只是單方面的回應那到底我們要做疫調嗎部長那這個你認為初步來看有沒有檢討改進的空間 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
5845.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
5863.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
這個我想以這樣的作為來看絕對有一我們有必須有精進的部分啊有必須有更精進的一個作為就如果可以在第一時間能夠去掌握到的話甚至第一時間去做比如說10月14能夠直接做一個相關的一個檢查的話檢測的話那有可能在那個時間點就找出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
5864.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
5889.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
對當然當你發現異常越快檢測它的擴散就也不會那麼那麼容易所以無論我們應該10月14那一批應該是要來檢測才對是吧對以我們現在看到畫質上異常的現象的話它從10月1號到10月總共有5批啦有5批異常那其實我們都有監控後端的畫質的嘛畫質的數量那這5批的異常如果能夠更早的話我相信能夠更快的能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
5889.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
5902.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
所以有檢討改進的空間有精進的空間對那因為動物傳染病防治條第9條第13條其實他不得拒絕嘛這你說案主是不得拒絕的是吧那如果你拒絕依照45條你是有罰則的那為什麼這會開罰嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
5905.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
5921.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
不過我想就是因為地方政府在看的時候他會看當場的現象如果地方政府的動保人員他覺得應該要去實際的去檢查的時候那個事主就不能拒絕所以沒有要求 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
5921.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
5937.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
所以沒有這個就是要疫調我們才能夠知道所以我希望未來在這件事情上面要加強在這一塊的整個制度上的建立就是說類似像這樣狀況如果10月14有強力的要求一定要做那個的話你不做的話我依照傳染病的防治我可以開罰的 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
5938.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
5954.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
那當時如果做的話也許我們就多出更多的時間我們可能多出至少六天的時間來做一些陰影所以我希望這一些未來讓大家如果整個檢討裡面應該要去做檢討我們一定的我們在疫調的過程中一定發現說可能有很多地方必須精進啦我們一定會來做那我問了一下啦齁目前有沒有蔓延出去 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
5956.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
5980.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
有沒有蔓延出去整個病毒狀況有沒有控制住蔓延我想我們現在看到的就是觀念場附近的觀念場都沒有異常其他的周邊是沒有異常的對就是觀念場3公里之內所以都是在這個暗場內對大概暗場內暗場內的也都鋪砂了對已經鋪砂了所以我們現在先鎖定台中區是一個主要的疫調的作為因為他的觀念場都在台中跑 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
5981.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
5997.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
所以只要在這接近的這15天的時間如果周邊沒有再發生任何狀況有可能第一步就先控制一下然後我們也全國性的因為這15天我們也會做全國性的一個調查嘛那看看有沒有可能就是說其他地方如果沒有症狀的話我想那就是很明確的鎖到這個案例這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
5998.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
6025.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
那部長我請教那像這樣的事情的發生對我們的豬肉對我們整個經濟的產值會有什麼樣的影響我想喔在禁運禁載的期間一定會有一些階段性的影響那我剛才說的這些豬肉衝擊會有多大那我們盡可能的就是將我們的冷凍的冷凍的庫存釋出給薛東央我說的是整體未來我們的產業如果沒有守住這一關的話整個衝擊會有多大如果完全沒守住的話遇到前一以上的損失嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
6026.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
6053.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
我們光租的產業就800多億然後冠延產業的話超過1000億我希望政府努力啦中央地方合作最後我問一下台中農業局說該做的都已經做了部長同意這樣的說法嗎我不知道他說這句話他做了什麼東西我沒辦法評斷但是我想我們在疫調一定會呈現出完整的從現在這樣真相揭露我認為應該還有很大努力的空間對一定是有我們必須改進的空間好我希望中央地方合作來改善對我們一定這樣做 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
6055.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
6077.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
好 謝謝 謝謝接下來我們請陳婷菲委員請做巡檔謝謝主席 我們請部長我們再請陳部長委員好 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
6078.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
6098.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
部长我想要了解的是说现在为什么10月10号台中的养猪场的猪只出现死亡之后然后他们没有第一时间做相对应的处理我们的SOP到底是怎么定的 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
6099.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
6127.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
這也是我們為什麼這個會啟動疫調的非常重要的一個詢問的地方因為一般出現異常死亡的時候地方政府動保處人員要第一時間去看那有可能是一般的疾病或是管理的不當那也有可能有其他的病方但是如果有異常死亡的話應該要更敏感的去檢測啦所以依照我們一般的SOP是如果有豬場 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
6129.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
6141.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
出現了死亡而且是異常的死亡我跟委員報告 異常的死亡如果是以200頭以上到500頭以下他只要租場裡面有百分之 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
6143.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
6163.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
3%的话我们就叫异常那异常的部分我们就会地方政府就会去查都有一定的标准所以异常死亡不是随便讲的这个SOP都有定的非常清楚所以到底到了什么程度一定要去做通报这个你们也讲得非常清楚我觉得我们这一次虽然 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
6164.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
6182.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
要疫調可是我們要把重新這個SOP拿出來檢討到底是哪一個環節出了問題然後呢好10月10號台中養豬場豬隻出現死亡之後然後呢台中市政府10月14號是有去訪視的喔結果訪視沒有採樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
6187.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
6216.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
我想这个东西就是我们一定要去了解的就是当初没有采样是事主不同意采样还是当初是事主可以不同意采样吗不可以如果说动保人员觉得应该要采样的时候事主不得拒绝所以这个部分也是我们要去了解的对这就是我们要了解的事主是不能拒绝的所以这个关键点我觉得这里有两个关键点这也是这个案子发生之后我们希望在未来各县市 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
6217.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
6240.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
一定要警惕就是說10月10號出現了死亡為什麼你們沒有去做相對應的動作因為我們有說嘛 異常異常有一個標準到底他是不是有到達異常好10月14號為什麼去到現場訪視沒有採樣這很嚴重耶到底是因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
6241.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
6260.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
施主不同意可是施主是不能不同意啊因為你已經發現了要去採樣而且有問題了那就有強硬的動作嘛我們的法印都已經訂得非常清楚好之後沒有採樣一直到10月20累計死亡到117頭 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
6263.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
6288.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
那麼台中市政府才採樣送檢中央你看這當中多久10天10天這是非常嚴重所以這10天到底是哪一個環節鬆了我覺得我們要把這個案件變成是一個非常重要我們以後警惕其他縣市政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
6289.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
6304.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
一個很重要的關鍵是的 我想透過這樣的一個很清楚的釐清以後那一定有一些必須改進的然後你們就化為新的一個作為然後會通報到通應到其他的縣政府是 這才是最重要然後 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
6305.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
6333.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
到了10月21號中央收到檢體並檢驗呈陽性你們就開始動作了對不對就開始動作了好包括我們馬上召開應變的措施會議然後馬上要求要把豬隻整個移動作為管制他到底他的整個足跡到哪裡他的豬隻載運到哪裡都要整個管制好 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
6334.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
6355.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
然後也進行了撲殺那我要問部長那請問我們現在掌控因為畢竟有20天10天 有10天這樣的一個時間空窗期有10天好 這10天我們有掌控這些組織的所有軌跡嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
6358.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
6377.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
有 我們所有的因為我們是以車追廠以廠在追車那從化製車的還有運租車的這些軌跡它整個大範圍的大概關聯廠有33廠那大部分都在台東地區然後比較接近的跟這廠有直接關係的就是有去買租的這個廠 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
6379.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
6407.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
没有异常然后有载运的这个场没有异常方圆三公里的没有特别的死亡异常所以现在我们有掌控到方圆三公里的周边是没有异常的它的轨迹是没有异常的但是还有一些我们目前还在做疫调疫调在了解在追踪当中33场我们预计这33场多久可以给我们民众有一个安心我想我们预计是在 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
6408.146 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
6423.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
第一個就是五天之內我們有一個初步的一個結果但是因為有一些潛伏期啦我們也不能掉以輕心但是我們在前進的應變所裡面每一天都有工作會議看進度然後會跟外界做記者會對外說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
6424.754 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
6453.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
我們一定要讓這個訊息完整的對外說明讓民眾來非常公開透明每一次我們有什麼樣的訊息我們就對外因為這不僅是我們食的安全還有我們整個對整個豬隻產業的問題所以這牽扯到兩個層面所以我們一定要把它很公開告訴大家現在的狀況到達什麼樣的程度那麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
6454.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
6476.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
我们现在也已经拉高了是不是我们整个一个circle控制的circle是15天是不是我们也是把这样的区块定为15天但是5天5天做一个循环报告对我们15天是因为它有可能的潜伏期是所以我们定15天但是我们每5天做一个观察是那观察到 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
6477.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
6506.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
可能第二個五天的時候如果說我們的疫調有更完整的疫調它沒有對外擴散的風險的時候那我們也許有機會先做部分的解除或是全部的解除這個我們後續才能夠判斷對 因為我們必須如果當我們資訊公開的話然後我們把整個位階拉高然後不斷的一個區段一個區段跟民眾報告跟我們的租资產業報告我相信大家才會安心 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
6507.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
6524.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
尤其這一段時間我相信這樣的訊息傳出在我們的產業在我們的食的安全大家都是放大眼睛在看所以我覺得部長這個部分是我們的我們一定要給民眾安心的一個責任一定把相關的資訊一定隨時對外說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
6526.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
6556.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
所以我覺得這件事情有兩個環節一個就是為什麼在10月10號發生的時候沒有直接通報而且在10月14號沒有去採樣到了10月20才做採樣把整個檢體送中央這個一定要查而且這個絕對是未來我們給各縣市的一個非常好的一個樣板跟警惕大家不能再犯 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
6557.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
6584.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
這個一件事就已經搞得這樣子人仰馬翻大家嚇死了所以這個是絕對不能再犯這是一個問題第二個問題是我們整個資訊公開透明把我們整個足跡這個有問題的豬支廠它相關的足跡整個把它疫調的清清楚楚報告所有的人民我相信人民就會安心謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
6589.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
6594.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
谢谢接下来我们请张琪凯委员请做寻答 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
6619.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
6643.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
請博定我們請部長文豪博定先替記者朋友問你一個他們剛剛一直追著要問你的最近這幾年夾帶疫區的那個豬肉進來了大概有好幾百件對不對現在這部分的那個邊境管制會加強嗎我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
6645.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
6663.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
那個邊境的管制我們只有越來越精進越來越強度越來越強沒有從應該108年開始一直到現在7年間我們的作為沒有降低成績而且我們的精進的作為也越來越高所以我們在相關的這些裁罰的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
6665.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
6684.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
也有一定的數量但是整體來看從國外進來的違法的部分有越來越少的趨勢表示說我們的宣導特別是國人從國外帶進來的這些豬肉也越來越少的趨勢現在就是因為非洲除了這個期待嘛會不會因為這樣子更加嚴有沒有做什麼緊急的措施 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
6685.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
6713.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
對 我想我們整個的邊境的一個管制第一個就是旅客帶過來的這些手提行李 後送行李對 然後我們這個手提行李是100%然後我們特別針對高風險區像有一些有39國已經發生非洲豬瘟的國家我們就強制的100%那相對的我們做國際的郵包還有後面的走私的部分所以我們這是跨部會的一個聯防的部分是防堵我們的邊境作為 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
6714.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
6742.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
加嚴防堵對不對對 一定 我們一定會加嚴我們來談這個這次這個非洲豬瘟這個事情一方面是因為症狀非典嘛 對不對而且沒有資訊很有限所以才這個判定才會失準那專家寫者現在提的就是說就是事前提早知道這個非常重要所以他們提醒了一個點來 我們看一下就是我們台灣曾經研發非洲豬瘟的快篩 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
6743.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
6765.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
這是全世界唯二亞洲第一而且獲得國際上世界動物衛生組織OIE參考實驗室的這個認證保定 它有幾個優點它有幾個優點 現在先生就在提醒你就要提早知道它有狀況嘛 對不對它的潛伏期就可以驗了活豬的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
6767.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
6784.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
活株的時候潛伏期就可以驗了然後第二個他10分鐘就會知道就驗得出來了跟我們當初那個COVID-19那個整個那個測試非常非常的快第三個你就降低這個非洲豬瘟的傳染風險寫者專家提醒這個有可能是我們最近可以派得上用場的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
6784.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
6812.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
我跟委員報告這家試驗公司所開發的試劑這邊講到受到國際認可它是送到中國的參考實驗室認證它並沒有向台灣我們台灣有參考實驗室它並沒有來向我們台灣的參考實驗室申請認證的部分有沒有有認證還沒認證這是有啦OIE認可的一個實驗室世界動物衛生組織OIE認可的一個實驗室它的優點我跟你講先者專家提醒的優點是什麼潛伏期就可以驗出來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
6813.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
6833.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
對不對而且他很快嘛就跟十分鐘就知道你這樣就可以降低非洲豬瘟傳染這個風險你看你現在你現在不是說要希望附近的不要擴散出去對不對那你不是盡快比如說附近的幾公里內的全部趕快測有問題進一步去測嘛然後如果全國的可能有症狀的 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
6834.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
6850.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
會趕快塞啊之前我們不會採用這個因為台灣是清的嘛是乾淨的肺液區但是現在有開始有一些病例的時候我們要用更積極的方式去做這些疫調的過程中然後您剛才講這個方法我會請我們的專業團隊來評估因為某個程度也會擔心 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
6855.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
6866.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
當你測出來快篩因為快篩的準確度還是有個百分比萬一是有他自己害怕自己就把它撲殺掉了那反而會讓疫調更為不精準所以我想這個由專業團隊他們專家會議去討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
6869.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
6895.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
它這個快篩是專業的它是要抽血您可以要求那個獸醫要在現場所以你剛剛講那個是可以解決的所以我說像這個這樣子的方式我想交由我們的專家團隊去研議說是不是應該用這種方式如果他們建議我們一定會去採行好 OK 這個是很多專家寫者建議的趕快評估一下 好了解然後第二個就是除以這個風險 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
6897.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
6913.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
現在我們這個養豬除蟻使用就剛剛張家慶張委員問過了8%斜界本身10%他更精準是8%可是非洲最後那個疫情90%都來自於除蟻現在當然有人在罵說為什麼不禁那你現在就是先禁15天對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
6915.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
6936.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
對 我們的透過我們的潛伏期的15天所以我們本身是以15天為一個我們做疫調的因為現在禁止是斷點然後疫調如果完成了以後我們就會重新的去檢討我們如果要開放那要更好的一個控管的機制 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
6937.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
6964.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
對 那如果說要禁止那也要有一個大家合理的討論空間要怎麼樣的轉型所以這個部分我想我們會用一個很完整的方案如果完成以後會對外來說明也絕對不是說今天要或不要8%引起90%的這個危險確實要當然 沒有沒有 部長我跟你講就是事後你當然15天之後你要檢討要不要用嘛 對不對那如果要繼續用一定要做到兩件事情第一個 第一個他在爭主要 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
6965.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
6983.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
我們絕對強烈的控管90度C一個小時一個小時一定要落實對不對這個要檢測第二個我看了環境部的資料他說是不是應該要有個病毒的檢查你做成試藥之前要不要多一道的這個安全的可以測試嗎這很簡單對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
6985.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
7003.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
你如果要繼續用今天能不能清楚的表達說以後做好病毒檢測我想喔廚餘如果經過真正合格的蒸煮完了以後再進去飼料是安全的那如果說廚餘都要做病毒檢查那表示說我們設計的這一套蒸煮機制是不對的 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
7003.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
7018.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
現在就是因為你徵組了以後你現在出現漏洞所以90%都來自那邊我跟委員報告現在的來源到底是從哪邊來的現在還在疫調不能說是廚藝我想人員可能的國外的接觸 豬場的接觸都有可能各種可能 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
7020.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
7038.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
你剛才講嘛那是可能之一嘛除非是可能之一嘛所以你要先禁止這15天嘛對不對那我現在就跟你講除了徵阻要落實之外你要不要多一道安全的措施我想能夠更強力的監管我們一定會做好OK好來最後做幾個建議第一個這次受害的這個產業 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
7041.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
7067.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
至少有養豬的這個產業鏈對不對然後第二個豬肉的這個加工業還有我們餐飲的觀光業這個衝擊都是非常大的我們請先要趕快做評估而且要盡量去幫他們好不好會 我們會來做評估另外部長我最後要幾個東西你兩個禮拜內給我第一個就是我相信這是全民現在也急著要的就是加速完成這次疑似案件的各項問題的釐清包括是真為 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
7068.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
7096.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
非洲的這個豬瘟嗎病毒出這個來源到現在在查嘛對不對傳染的方式傳染的來源途徑這是第一點第二個要建置這個病疫病的這個資料庫老實講我們現在是缺了很多啦第三個儘速完成疫調並且要公布喔同時嚴防可能這個病毒擴散到你說髒話來混淆邊啊這些養豬的這個大線那如果不幸不幸疫情真的這個擴大了 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
7098.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
7107.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
要緊急提出來對農業跟養豬產業有具體的支持政策跟措施那之後我提兩個建議弱品市場以後如果恢復了 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
7109.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
7129.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
對於豬的這個健康的把關跟強化要有一個明確的說明另外養豬這個產業鏈也要利用這個機率好好調整跟升級好不好我要謝謝委員這五大這個部分我想我們一定也是朝這個方向在做但是我跟委員報告不可能兩個禮拜因為疫調有它的疫調的程序我沒辦法在兩個禮拜就告訴你所有的答案 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
7129.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
7157.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
所以其他四個可以所以只要疫調疫調那一塊只要疫調完成了以後因為這是全部的一個作為嘛只要疫調我們疫調每一天都會公布我們的進度然後最後有一個比較清楚的時候我們一定第一時間把相關的資料提供給委員疫調完成就要儘快給他好不好對 我們不會沒有辦法兩個但是疫調完成我們第一時間一定會讓經濟委員會還有委員所有委員知道我們共同共同努力啦是希望把這件事情了解好 謝謝謝謝委員守護我們人民的這個健康 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
7158.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
7159.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
讓這個整個養豬產業不要受到衝擊我們一起來努力謝謝好 謝謝好 請楊瓊英 楊維恩維恩好 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
7195.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
7197.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
謝謝主席我再請部長請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
7205.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
7222.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
部长 透过您早上的说明跟关务署的说明以及我们所有的委员大家的提问跟沟通跟你的回复我希望的排定今天的议程就是希望让我们的国人 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
7223.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
7243.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
能夠安心下來而且也知道政府的方向是什麼不要一直的揣測讓民眾恐慌這是本席今天之所以排定這一個國人大家非常關心的這個議題也謝謝委員讓我們農業部有這個機會透過這樣的一個場合跟外界做說明也跟委員做報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
7244.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
7259.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
非常感謝那你也辛苦了那接下來本席要說的是今年五月份我們台灣才剛獲世界動物衛生組織認定為朱溫飛一國那成為亞洲一同 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
7260.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
7284.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
這個唯一的可以同時來取得傳統豬瘟口蹄疫跟非洲豬瘟三大豬變非疫國這個是我們一直在努力的而且已經大陣但是沒有想到在這個四個月之後那10月10號發生了養豬場出現了豬隻異常死亡的這個情況 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
7285.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
7297.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
那麼到20號有發現到117隻的豬隻的這些現象所以本席首先也就是說在發生時間的時候當我們在21號確認為非洲豬瘟陽性並採取撲殺跟禁運的這個措施 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
7307.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
7321.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
那也顯示說在整個的過程當中我們到底到目前為止當然似乎是可確定是非洲竹瘟但是還是要經過科學的一個證據最後確認 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
7323.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
7339.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
在这个情况当中我们也采取了一些措施包括中央的措施地方台中市政府的措施一直大家中央地方合作来努力那目前的情况是如何呢请做说明 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
7340.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
7369.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
我想我們特別是在昨天開始成立台東前進應變所那在應變所裡面特別也邀請了台東市政府的農業局的環保局的人員就是說在這個情況的疫調的過程中一定是中央跟地方通力合作的那也感謝台東市政府的配合還有相關的單位的配合包括其他部會那我們希望說這個疫調能夠更清楚的釐清的時候找出這個來源找出這個可能的破口那這樣的話以後我們才有機會更精進 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
7371.787 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
7399.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
那这个呢就是中央地方大家一起来努力本席非常的希望当国人有所质疑隐忧的时候我们政府不管是地方政府中央政府都有义务要让民众放心也让民众可以在有的讯息当中能够让民众了解这是非常重要所以在目前为止我们看到也就是说 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
7400.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
7421.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
不管是媒體報導也就是說非典型的病徵到底是不是真的有所謂的非典型病徵我想這個用專業的角度我想請專業人員來回覆會比較恰當是來請做說明報告委員因為他所謂非典型病徵就是因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
7421.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
7445.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
他的那個不是說他從他那個外觀還有他初步的那個獸醫師的診斷他是以那個放線桿菌兇末肺炎那這個他會有一樣的症狀所以獸醫師就用這樣的方式去做治療所以在治療過程中他會觀察一個時間讓他確定說他 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
7447.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
7454.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
預後結果如何所以後續如果不好那防疫單位他們就會去進一步檢驗 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
7456.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
7477.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
這個部長我們聽到這樣子的一個說明也就是說萬一我們幾乎確認他大概是非洲豬瘟大概但是要等最後科學的證據但是一個問題也就是沉入剛剛專家所說的非典型的病態未來我們要怎麼樣防範 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
7478.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
7497.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
未来我们怎么方法是这个部分就是说如果他是有非典型的症状的时候那即使是非典型的症状不同的病所产生的病征可能还可以更细致的去做做一些病征的确认所以这个部分我想防炎署跟我们的受医院也会针对这个部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
7497.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
7521.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
有一個比較好的一個所謂的SOP讓第一線的獸醫師能夠更清楚的去做判試然後寧願料敵從寬有疑似的時候像類似這個有疑似的時候應該同時去做採檢這樣的話才能夠讓我們在第一時間更早發現我想我要謝謝部長也就是剛剛所做的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
7522.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
7544.867 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
我們要怎麼樣在這一次的這個樣態裡頭我們的精進方案就誠如剛剛部長您所說的非典型的症狀那我們的SOP流程要怎麼樣可以更精進讓第一線的人在採取的時候可以更多元而且 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
7545.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
7563.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
能夠更廣泛的這個圍堵那這個本席也希望去研擬這個方案然後告訴執行者告訴縣市政府告訴社會大眾這個你認同這樣的方向吧我非常認同而且我們覺得這些精進作為也是重要的一環 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
7564.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
7578.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
對好接下來本席也要請教關務署跟農業部那因為到底議員是從哪裡來我相信部長你也說過各種的這個方向但 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
7579.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
7608.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
這個非洲豬如果萬一真的百分之百是了現在99點多是那真的是了我們知道非洲豬瘟它不可能是在我們本土自己產生那就是境外那在這樣的情況之下剛剛關務署也特別說了不管是你這個X光機啊或者是大家說的這個警犬那這一些防疫犬都必須要加強有這個方案 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
7608.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
7634.094 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
那這樣的一個情況我們現在到底議員從哪裡來就你早上所說明的那現在有沒有更可以明確的方向因為現在還沒辦法確定因為疫調包括動物包括人特別是那個疫場的人是不是有曾經出國到其他的國家那個疫場是不是有曾經 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
7635.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
7652.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
就是私自買進一些可能被遺漏的被X光線遺漏的這些可能的肉品所以這個東西就是可能是人可能是動物然後我們還要做疫調那疫調完了以後我們才能夠確定哪個可能是POCO我們才會做更精進的作為 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
7653.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
7680.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
我想國人都希望破口到底是怎麼樣我們大家都希望知道那政府也必須要跨部會去討論去研議那我想所有的國人都希望知道破口到底是在哪裡我們才能夠好好的去防範這是很重要因為本席認為當疫這個豬瘟發生的時候我們應該要好好的全力的來這個檢疫 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
7682.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
7702.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
防疫以及接下來本席要討論的產銷的一個條件因為這不只是這一個億而是關係著我們千億以上的產業也就本席剛開始開會的時候我特別提出這是非常嚴肅的一個議題所以因此本席要強調是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
7703.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
7726.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
在整個國家的這個邊境線必須要檢討跟加強剛剛我們已經討論過你也同意我們要怎麼樣阻絕可能的疫情來擴散這是民眾需要知道的在防檢的每一個角落每一個環節要怎麼樣好好的去落實那所以包括了關務署這邊我也勿請必須要好好的 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
7729.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
7752.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
去檢討怎麼樣去加強這個SOP流程跟進進那這個是我們現在要聽的我相信所有的人都知道經濟委員會每一個成員都全力的在支持我們的農業支持農業部那尤其是我們的農民我們經濟委員會都全力的在支持所以我也希望在 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
7753.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
7780.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
一定要鞏固好守住我們的臺灣豬這個是一定非常的重要委長 部長你的方向也是如此吧對 所以我們才會斷然的就是在第一時間我就決定全國性的禁載禁運還有除以養豬停止除以養豬這個是可能傳播的熱戀所以我們把它斷掉了以後傳播電斷掉以後我們才能夠精準的找出那個案場的來源對 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
7782.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
7794.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
對 所以一定要好好的守住我們的臺灣豬這是非常重要是因此我們第二期的這個養豬計畫您現在的進度送到行政院了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
7795.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
7823.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
我们已经送到行政院了然后我们我所了解大概这一两天应该就会合了但是这一两天合不是因为非洲租金有产生这个状况才合因为大家都一直在追踪因为要守住我们台湾租的产业那你预计应该下个礼拜会出来我相信这个礼拜应该就能够因为整个预算是经过立法院同意动之的但是因为计划没合就主要是计划没合定我们在动之会比较困扰 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
7824.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
7836.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
所以一定要趕快合會 我們一定會預計下個禮拜會出來我想這個禮拜應該就有機會能夠獲得訪問一定要好好加油守住我們的台灣豬謝謝好 謝謝接下來我們請邱志維委員請做詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
7875.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
7897.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
謝謝主席 又請陳部長好 我們再請陳部長 謝謝我們到謝玉鳳委員這個詢答結束 我們休息三分鐘謝謝部長 這個非洲豬瘟防疫勢同作戰是絕對不能匆匆忙忙一定要戒慎恐懼 如臨大敵 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
7899.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
7926.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
不管是房間署或者是官務署因為這個影響到整個產業鏈影響到甚至國內生產毛耳都會受到很大的影響國際新運也受到影響那東亞國家裡面是日本跟台灣之前是唯一二的非豬瘟非豬瘟這個疫區那日本的做法你們知道日本的做法是怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
7927.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
7942.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
你說哪一方面日本有沒有出於養豬日本我所了解應該是沒有出於養豬的方式日本有沒有出於養豬有沒有為什麼日本有還是有比例是多少呢比例是多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
7943.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
7965.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
日本目前它是把那個廚餘做成飼料將飼料中跟我們廚餘養豬不一樣嘛我們廚餘加熱之後消毒之後就可以去養豬嘛它不是它把廚餘製作成飼料所以就沒有透過廚餘去病毒傳染的問題嘛對不對所以日本的做法你可以去學習了解廚餘你還可以再利用變成飼料嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
7967.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
7995.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
那我們這一次沒有用廚餘直接廚餘加熱之後但難免還是有病毒會產生嘛是所以我們為了用廚餘去養殖佔了百分之八左右對不對我們全國大概有五千多場五千五百五十二場然後四百三十五場大概百分之八那其中幾個縣市不是每個縣市都有的新北 台北 台中 台北 桃園也有台中也有 屏東屏東也有 對所以其中幾個縣市那我們當然要考慮到日本可以做到這一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
7996.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
8007.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
我們應該跟日本人學習而且他們不需要像我們比較繁瑣的邊境檢查是對不對我們只要出國回來我們要經過這個廣際再一次的這個鎖定心理你都要安檢對不對是 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
8009.813 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
8034.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
所以這個部分不確定是從國外帶回來的所提醒你帶的弄製品不能確定對但是我們還是要做為什麼要做呢因為我們還是用廚餘去養豬嘛是所以是不是考慮到未來的方向我建議是不是可以思考一下你要制定一個落日條款歸年一來我們廚餘養豬要慢慢退場怎麼樣去輔導把這個廚餘轉換成飼料你不做也夠那轉對做也夠啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
8040.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
8044.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
那麼你有做不到嗎而且我們又可以節省很多這個安檢的人力跟預算嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
8045.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
8071.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
了解 我想我認同委員的說法就是說我們的廚藝養豬一定要做一些轉型那從過去108年到現在它已經降到435 本來1000多場所以這個轉型我們希望力道更加強然後第二個部分就像您說的這些廚藝我們更強化去把它做再利用變成飼料化以後那這樣的話那個風險就更低了現在可以立即啟動嗎我覺得馬上可以立即確認我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
8075.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
8104.813 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
如果這個技術有這個技術能夠用專利的授權的方式我都願意用授權的方式直接導入日本已經行之有年了對不對所以他們為什麼能夠確保現在不是變成東亞唯一的非洲瘟疫區我想我們會後我會去成立一個團隊就是針對日本的這個技術是不是可以直接導入到國內因為處理的樣態可能不一樣這個我想我們請專家團隊你現在做的就是治標跟這個損害管控是 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
8105.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
8119.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
你要治本一定要用到廚餘變成飼料化就沒有所謂這個傳染的問題我想我們立即去啟動這樣的一個研究那你要制定一個中短中長期的情況你要有一個落日條款你要讓所有目前正在廚餘養豬的435場知道說政府的政策什麼時候要退場不能再用廚餘養豬因為廚餘要轉化成 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
8126.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
8145.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
這個飼料我了解我想我們在後續的滾動檢查一定會訂出一個比較明確的逐步的這樣子有沒有機會轉型時間表要出來時間表我想我們會時間表要出來就是你要三年之內這個除去養豬要退場我們了解你要讓這個葉子可以有時間去緩衝去因應我知道 對 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
8147.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
8174.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
另外這個整體的防疫策略當然需要地方政府跟中央政府來合作那你整個疫情的採檢這個通報這個當然有些新生物的這個相關的能力不一定完全相同那你目前對地方查驗回報的這些相關的指引相關的制度有沒有考慮到從這次事件來看有沒有檢討的必要我想每一個制度裡面我們特別是從這次疫調裡面可能有一些 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
8175.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
8194.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
需要精進的地方就包括10月10號他們看到一些非典型的症狀但是如果說類似非周溫的非典型症狀也許我們在第一時間就可以採檢是啊 你要地方採驗回報你們現在有沒有一致性的指引對有沒有一致性的指引我們有相關的指引每一個地方地方政府一定要按照你的指引來執行喔對 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
8195.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
8213.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
我們現在是針對從化資廠的監測地方跟中央同時監測化資廠如果異常的時候他就要去關心這個訓護廠我問你有沒有這個指引東西我請教你有沒有這個指引有這個指引有這個指引縣市政府如果沒有按照指引就是縣市政府的責任嘛你確定有這個指引嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
8215.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
8233.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
你們同仁不要隨便回答一定要確定有這個指引各縣市政府一定要按照這個指引來執行相關的防疫業務報告委員就是我們有對於非洲豬瘟的一些它的疾病的一個特徵有一些注意事項但是沒有那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
8234.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
8248.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
注意事項這是一個善意的提議我覺得指引有一定的要求有一定的強制性所以我建議農業部必須要去建立進出建立地方查驗回報一致性的指引這有一定的強制性那你最注意事項有時候是一些建議 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
8249.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
8278.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
好 我想我跟委員回應就是說我們現在一些注意事項是針對病症的部分然後相關的就是說如果遇到這個病症他的臨床症狀如果有類似的東西我們會變成一個很明確的指引讓這些地方政府的受益師好不好 我們迅速把這指引建立起來好 是差不多一個月之內把指引通報各縣政府他按照你這指引有相關的規範SOP去執行相關的這個包括抽葉送檢採樣送檢等等通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
8279.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
8296.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
了解我想我們會同步了不會等到疫調結束才會來做我們現在同步就來處理這個議題另外最後一個議題要請教就是防疫安全網很重要要保險的概念保險的概念所以你現在就你用這個事後的這個撲殺補償 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
8298.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
8317.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
這個救助我覺得這次都是對豬農這個沒有辦法去彌補他們損失如果一旦疫情發生的話有沒有可能建立從防疫安全網的這個計畫裡面用保險的制度來導入這個用日本用歐盟的方式來做這個部長您的看法呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
8318.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
8346.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
我們現在注視死亡保險可是很可惜的就是沒有包含疫病的部分那我覺得我們該注意的還是應該疫病所以這個部分我想我們會從不同面向來增加這個用這種保險的概念去降低農民的一個風險這盡快建立起來好不好這個防疫安全網把保險導入我們會來處理對疫情的掌控或者事後的這個相關的補償是最後半分鐘我想請教一下公務署署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
8349.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
8373.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
這個從中國來的食品裡面啊這個中國來的食品裡面有些用快遞雖然你的這個報告裡面就是這些平台啊你們對平台的管理現在目前做到怎麼樣比如說從這個平台裡面去購買中國的這些包括這個食物啦或者有可能對疫情造成影響這些他們可不可以進來那你們怎麼去查處 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
8374.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
8396.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
跟委員報告 就這個平台的管理目前我瞭解應該是那個產發署那邊在處理產發署 我來說明一下 是抒發部是抒發部 就是電商平台是抒發部來處理的你看 中國這個網路平台大量販售從寄到台灣這個食品還有一個敏感專線包清關 雙清包稅 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
8400.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
8418.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
這個變成一個變相走私啊那也變成一個防疫的一個破口這部分應該跨部來協調包括農業部包括這個關務署包括這個你說的採訪署也好或者是抒發部也好聽說這個都買得到耶您了解嗎 那個署長我了解買得到嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
8419.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
8429.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
可以透過這個平台買得到嗎這個抒發部那邊會 我查過買得到買得到那就變成一個防疫的破口因為你沒有辦法對他檢查 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
8431.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
8451.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
還是你可以全面對他這個從中國來的郵包這些都可以檢查各位演報告我承諾我在下禮拜還會再開中央應變中心會議我就會把這個議題納進去特別是我們邊境的除了人的手提行李關務組這邊負責那事實上交通部對於郵包的部分他會負責然後同樣做平台也會經過郵遞 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
8452.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
8467.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
那他有不同的部位在合作我想我會更精進的把這個合作的機制跟他檢查的那個節點我們會把它建立的變成一個就是戒慎恐懼要如臨大事了解要全力以赴謝謝好 謝謝好 謝謝接下來我們請呂玉玲委員請做詢答 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
8483.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
8484.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
謝謝主席 請陳部長我們再請陳部長喂好 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
8493.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
8514.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
部長 本期上個禮拜才誇獎說我們農業部對非洲豬瘟的努力防疫做得很好獲得世界動物組織認證成為我們亞洲的首個三大豬瘟的非疫區可以重返國際市場一個禮拜而已就破功了心情怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
8516.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
8539.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
很難過很難過好難過檢討追蹤改善立即保護我們豬農產業的未來這才是重點所以本席要請教部長的就是在去年的時候我們有特別提到那個廚餘的問題當然首要的首當其衝的還是境外因為台灣 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
8541.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
8560.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
並沒有非洲豬瘟對不對所以今天會發生了但是還沒確定喔你們還要做一個病毒的分析嘛對不對最重要就從境外進來境外進來的話就有防檢署為什麼沒有防檢成功讓這個非洲豬瘟進來這是先決的對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
8563.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
8572.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
對 杜絕境外杜絕境外是第一杜絕境外是第一那台灣沒有非洲之溫那這個就是從境外進來的是不是是先確定這個問題所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
8574.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
8601.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
我們才會訂定了很多強加強保護這個非洲豬瘟的傳染這個問題加強了7年所以我們每次從國外回來的時候就會拿個一張綠色的卡片有沒有在疫區回來的地方這個我們都做了努力的但是今天發生了發生了趕快就要解決所以在這一家 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
8603.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
8621.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
台中這一家它的廚餘的問題你們有沒有去開始也在這個疫調當中有去篩檢有去檢疫我想整個疫調裡面包括它的生產環境包括它的廚因為它是自己煮的廚餘經過合格認證的自己煮但是我們也會去調閱所以在98家當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
8624.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
8626.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
許可的我們只有98家 435場435場裡面的98家有許可證的其中之一嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
8633.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
8657.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
是不是應該每個435場應該每個都是許可的每個都許可 對可是我們可以許可處理這個廚餘的這部分的對 這是環境部要符合環境部的那個檢核再利用的部分那有一些有一些中央珍珠廠它是中央珍珠然後提供給人家所以你們也有電極去抽檢啦對 它是每天在每天在珍珠啦那你每天都 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
8658.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
8684.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
對 衛務部這邊特別是在珍珠的那個溫度有沒有溫度計都有監控器具去做monitoring以後去處理好 部長我們在2021年10月就開始針對這四養豬隻的在200頭以上的中大型的養豬場才可以用高溫珍珠90度以上才可以用這個廚餘對不對是那其他的199頭以下就沒有了是那但是 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
8685.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
8708.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
我們在這個廚餘的處理的過程他們載送是屬於自己去載送還是由清潔隊送過去它這個有不同的模式啦那基本上我們不管它的來源是什麼它只要經過90℃一個小時的蒸煮的話它的飼料它的那個廚餘就是安全的就可以餵豬啦這個是一個非常重要的好 那清潔隊載運的這個廚餘是怎麼處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
8711.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
8724.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
這個可能要問環境部會比較清楚那可能各縣市的處理方法也有不一樣的我們桃園的部分的話就會全部送去掩埋堆肥的處理不會送給養豬戶那請問你們的疫調出來這一家的廚藝是怎麼來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
8729.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
8754.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
我想我們在疫調裡面也會針對他的廚餘的來源包括這些人員的這一家 你就回答我這一家的廚餘怎麼來的他自己去載的沒有 還在疫調中我現在沒辦法給你這個答案好 本席就問你請去疫調這家的廚餘是要自己去載回來的還是清潔隊送去的我想我們在疫調的時候所以未來部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
8756.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
8777.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
我們每個縣市都有廚餘的問題都有我們回收廚餘的所以有個各縣市處理方法你都要去追蹤這也是一個破口的問題所以你要去追蹤好不好了解 我想我們針對您剛才的議題我們每天在中央前進應變所這邊如果有得到答案的話我們當天的記者會對外的說明就會說明是 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
8778.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
8804.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
所以對每個縣市的廚餘你要去追蹤這些廚餘都是到豬場還是是到掩埋場去堆肥做堆肥處理這個你都要了解我想我們會透過要追蹤去了解透過環境部這邊來了解所以你現在目前都沒辦法確定它是非洲豬瘟還是有病毒的分析我想所以盡快你大概什麼時候會公佈應該是非洲豬瘟確認但是因為在 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
8805.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
8820.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
根據WHOA的規範一定要做病毒的分類不過以現在的證據的掌握應該就是非洲豬瘟但是因為通報的關係我們現在還要做明確確定好不好應該明確確定下來好 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
8821.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
8836.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
那現在本席想請教的就是我們現在既然發生了第一個要看房檢部分如何境外的會跑進來這個一定要再做一個防堵防堵措施再來的話就出於我想請問部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
8838.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
8864.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
廚餘為什麼當時我們討論的時候你沒有全面禁用你有什麼考量是什麼問題不過我想當年其實因為不同的時代可能有不同的當初有非常多的小廠然後有非常多的這些廚餘小廠199頭都是飼料所以我們那時候的一個非常重要的策略不是說沒有禁止然後就不管它我們在沒有禁止之下但是我們強化我們的廚餘本身的徵屬的監管 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
8865.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
8889.768 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
然後小廠的因為他沒有能力做自己的徵組所以我們把200頭以下的是不准用用用廚餘飼養一定要200頭以上的部分所以這個部分就是一個比較強又有力的監管讓廚餘變成一個安全的飼料而不是像外界說的就是沒有這樣子的一個政策就不管他我們還是有做強力的監管所以你還是有在討論是 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
8890.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
8909.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
你說時代不一樣經過七年強力的加強現在七年也沒有什麼時代不一樣了可是已經發生了那你現在全面禁用廚餘是暫時性還是永久性我們現在是因為為了做疫調我們針對禁止廚餘餵養是做這個怕疫情的擴散的一個斷點 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
8913.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
8934.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
然後包括豬隻禁運也是一個斷點都是這兩個作為都是為了做疫調然後疫調告一段落以後我們就會來做後續的處理特別是這個潛伏期的15天是一定不能移動的然後不能餵養廚餘但是這個部分我們以5天為觀察的週期所以現在是暫時性的對 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
8935.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
8955.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
那一吊结束完毕之后的话你会盘整整个状况我们会盘整整个后续的还可不可以用厨余对我们一定是先去做厨余的加强监管然后就算要不要做厨余喂养我们也一定有足够的缓冲期绝对不会说 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
8956.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
8981.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
今天說了明天就停止那這次是因為疫情的關係部長廚餘的部分跟環保局比較有關但是關聯的又是我們養豬戶的所以你在橫向跟環保局這邊要做好一個溝通廚餘的所有的源頭來源的輸送到哪裡供應到哪裡處理的最終辦法這些你們要互相的來做個溝通來處理好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
8983.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
9007.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
你們都息息相關 最重要是跟我們的產業溝通像桃園 您桃園那邊也是一個非常重要的我們桃園沒有化製廠全台灣有九個化製廠桃園本身用廚藝的也不少排名在第三我知道 所以我跟部長提醒說桃園沒有化製廠沒有化製廠 你知道我們怎麼處理嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
9009.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
9028.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
去跟那個養豬協會請他們用車輛人力再去雲林處理我們每年要花多少錢你知道嗎我們全台灣有九個化智場對我知道桃園沒有啊所以不同的地方可以互相治癒這個也是部長你未來要檢討的一個最重要的因素好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
9029.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
9047.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
我們會加強單一場內用生物處理機來處理這樣的話就是也減少了所以部長 本市在這邊要求的就是立即要查明感染的源頭全面檢討邊境的檢疫跟廚餘的養豬戶的這個制度針對於受損的養豬戶我們要啟動專案補償的機制守住我們台灣的養豬產業好不好好 我們朝這個目標來努力謝謝好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
9059.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
9073.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
接下來我們請謝依鳳委員請做詢答好 謝謝主席我想要請陳部長我們再請陳部長陳部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
9082.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
9095.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
我想請問一下像這一次的這個養豬場所發生的問題那有沒有展開回溯性的調查那這份報告什麼時候可以公佈 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
9096.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
9126.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
我想我們從21號發現了以後我們第一時間就是將這個廠所有的移動管制然後全面鋪砂然後開始我們就從周圍的3公里還有它的直接的關聯廠去做調查然後接下來就是這輛車輛本身移動的關聯廠所以我們啟動正式的調查那正式的調查它需要一些時間但是我們每一天在台中前進指揮前進應變所這邊每一天會對外公開說明我們的進度 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
9127.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
9150.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
那你还是没讲啊对啊三公里啊还有未来可能对于全国各县市都要展开调查吗是不是对我们第一我们同时就是启动台东市的疫调然后台东市以外的全国的租场的第一个就是它的本身的租资的健康度的回报跟它的一个关注所以我们是同时启动 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
9151.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
9177.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
比較強度比較強的台東市的應變然後還有其他縣市的那相關的調查什麼時候可以公佈所以我剛才說的這個疫調有它的時間我現在沒辦法講說一定多久可以完成但是我們是希望在這個潛伏期的15天之內能夠完成15天那就是月底15天那5天為一個單位我希望說台東市的這個基本的疫調能夠在5天之內能夠完成 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
9178.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
9206.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
就是五天之內對 海東市這個部分是25號嗎大概我是昨天他們去前進指揮所我是希望說五天之內能夠完成因為他們不會有假日的是昨天的五天對等於下禮拜一囉大概下禮拜一禮拜二這樣子但是我們每天都會公告我們的進度因為疫調還有可能又追到其他的源頭所以你剛才說的有可能就是其他委員在質詢的你覺得有可能它的原因不是來自於廚餘是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
9207.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
9227.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
我说非洲猪瘟的传播本身当然厨余是一个原因但是人员的如果说你进到国外的这些养猪场然后可能带过来的然后也有可能你其他的食物来源不是经过厨余的来源带回来因为如果那个场有其他的这些外籍的 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
9228.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
9256.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
我不是就是外籍去国外买东西好了我们不一定是外籍就是国外买东西回来那也可能不小心吃一吃以后就丢到自己家里去都有可能啦所以这些可能在疫调没有完成之前我们不能断定说它一定是人员接触一定是厨医或一定是家里买东西自己乱丢造成的我们没有办法判断但是那个病毒的分离报告是不是已经出来了大概分离报告大概两个礼拜还没出来吗还没有出来 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
9258.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
9281.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
我怎麼那為什麼我有定序我們這樣子我們先用核酸病毒的核酸檢測是陽性然後接下來我們會做這個核酸的一個定序那定序完了以後其實應該是確認的但是因為我們台灣是首例那是首例的國家的話他還要做一個動作就是將這個病毒做分類 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
9282.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
9303.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
分離跟分類那才能夠正式的通報所以這個部分就是在分離需要兩個禮拜所以我們是用最強的用把它已經是其實就是非洲豬瘟只是在通報上還需要一些那病毒株呢是從哪裡來的這個還要再做分離以後是不是從越南還要定序現在定序還在繼續定序是越南嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
9305.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
9334.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
刚才有讲可能是中国可能是东南亚然后一部分之间所以我们现在完全定序以后才能做完整的比对定序还在执行吗所以定序也要两个礼拜不确定是来自于东南亚还是因为非洲株的病毒高达180K所以它需要很多时间去完成定序那我目前已经知道的是大部分的序列都来自第二基因型那第二基因型就是目前广为世界流传的病毒株的基因型不一定来自越南 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
9334.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
9351.65 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
不一定是來自於越南是不是好那所以定序要兩個禮拜以後才會出來好那就是下下禮拜囉下禮拜一是疫調然後下下禮拜是病毒株的定序是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
9352.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
9379.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
大概是這樣子下禮拜一是大概台中市的部分我們希望有個初步的結果大概是這樣因為疫調有它的有它的嚴謹度跟詳細度啦好那我還要再一次請教喔就是關於廚餘養豬的問題喔那廚餘養豬是為什麼當初2018年有這樣子爭議的時候不馬上的禁止是因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
9381.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
9398.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
沒有辦法處理廚餘的問題嗎是不是我想當初當初做這樣的一個政策最後政策的一個決定一定有他當時的一個考量那是不是沒有辦法處理廚餘我想可能是一個原因就是處理的量推到我們現在你有沒有辦法處理廚餘 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
9399.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
9408.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
那我想喔從108年到現在其實養廚用廚餘養豬的戶數已經降到430幾435場本來1000多場變成降到435這就是當初108年的時候雖然說我們沒有禁止但是我們積極輔導他轉型那同時我們去強化那個廚餘的徵主的條件跟他的嚴苛的一個監管那這樣子的話只要確認這個這個是 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
9428.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
9455.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
那農業部有沒有去跟環保有沒有跟環境部了解到底廚餘有沒有辦法處理我們全台灣所有的廚餘有沒有辦法處理它的廚餘本身它有不同的像它可以做一般的飼料然後進到廚餘養生處但是現在目前大概65%大概是進到廚餘的系統然後還有一些生殖的部分所以剛才因為委員提到我們如果把廚餘先做成飼料再餵豬也是一個很好的方法 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
9455.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
9468.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
所以我想除以養豬絕對不是罪魁禍首但是我們要讓除以養豬能夠安心的養豬牠的飼料是安全的這是我們的目標 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
9470.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
9496.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
好 我希望我們能夠緊述的調查做疫調的相關調查讓所有的養豬場都能夠安心到底真正的來源是什麼那以及病毒株的來源是從何而來那對於未來就是說相關的邊境的檢查也好那才有辦法進行確實我想要順便問一下我們關務署 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
9501.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
9527.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
請問一下我想請問一下現在我們的出口今年的出口的數字是怎麼樣是說我們到目前為止整年的一個出口據我瞭解應該都還維持還不錯的一個成績是不是有33%的我看有33%的成長是不是我看你們關務署的數字 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
9528.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
9545.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
抱歉委員我沒有掌握這個數字是不是容我查證之後再跟您回報那明年咧我想要知道明年的數字明年出口的一個數字會不會下降抱歉委員這可能我還是要請教專家之後我再來跟您回覆你們都沒有做預估喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
9546.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
9568.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
你們都沒做預估喔?官務署這邊我是沒有對啊 你們不都會做預估嗎?你們財政部不都會做預估嗎?財政部那邊會做預估你們都會做預估啊主總那邊會做預估啦包括經濟成長率等等好 謝謝好 謝謝那我們現在休息三分鐘 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
9929.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
9948.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
謝謝我們現在繼續開會請陳昌明委員陳昌明委員陳昌明委員不在現場我們請參議委員請做詢答謝謝主席那是不是有請部長我們再請陳部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
9958.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
9964.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
部長今天大家真的為了這個非洲豬瘟台中無期廠這件事情人心惶惶 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
9966.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
9992.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
那我想再跟部長確認因為早上很多委員在質詢的時候有講到說那現在禁運禁宅以及這個廚餘的一個管制的一個期間那我們這樣大概會用幾天的時間我跟委員報告就是我們現在所實施的比較積極的兩個做法一個是全國性的禁運禁宅及禁止廚餘養豬那這個考量都是為了做比較完整的疫調 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
9995.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
10015.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
讓這個傳播鏈不會因為其他的因素而擴散所以我們根據我們的這些潛伏期的規定是15天所以我們就是定15天但是在15天之內我們會用5天為一個週期來做觀察包括我們台東市的這些關聯性的養豬場我們希望5天之內就能夠有一些初步的結果 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
10015.982 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
10037.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
那我們在不同的五天的觀察期如果說他的情況是可被控制的那相對的我們可能對於其他縣市某個程度我們會開始逐步的去開放這個部分或者全部的開放所以原則是15天但是以五天為周期去看接下來疫調的一個狀況那所以現在已經進行全面性的疫調了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
10038.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
10067.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
對 現在已經分兩個層次一個層次是針對台東市的疫調觀念場的疫調是最嚴謹的然後另外一個是台東市以外的這些養豬場那本身我們也是透過中央應變中心各縣市的這些防疫的人員都會到豬場去不管是透過電話訪視或是現場訪視去了解豬隻的健康狀況那相對的這個部分我想我們會定期的去讓這些階段性的工作成果 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
10069.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
10078.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
這個對外的一個說明那部長我想要問一下因為現在大家國人還是對於這一次的這個台中這個無期這個案場這個養豬場 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
10081.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
10108.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
整個時序上大家還是充滿著疑惑從10月10號這個這頂開始有出現死亡然後他們當時他們是把他懷疑是感染的是叫做什麼兇魔肺炎他們把他認定是兇魔肺炎所以在10月10號的時候並沒有去做全面的一個採樣跟監控是這樣的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
10111.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
10117.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
根據我們從那個台東市的那個動保處的人員他所陳述的的確是這樣的方式 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
10118.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
10135.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
所以10月10號 照理10月10號出現死亡的時候應該應該照例有做採樣 我就比較早知道 不過看起來是沒有因為他們可能就是說 認定可能是別種的病那我想要問10月10號到後來10月21號我們採到檢體這段期間這張有出痕嗎?這張有出痕嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
10145.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
10167.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
這段時間應該有出租13號他有出租28隻到大安的肉品市場大安肉品市場對台中市的大安肉品市場喔喔台中的大安肉品市場13號還有出28隻對不過這28隻進到肉品市場以外他一定會照我們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
10169.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
10183.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
那個程序 圖前會去觀察動物的樣態圖後會做 獸醫師會解剖以後有沒有去看他的一個內臟的部分是不是有病徵他都安全了13號根本在全夫妻啊因為後來你們去檢測你們在21號檢測的時候就是你們的每一個檢體定義每一個檢體都有陽性嘛 會做主因陽性嘛 對不對21號後 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
10197.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
10199.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
21號後你們開始採樣後21號的時候我們採樣完了是兩頭豬八個檢體是陽性然後我們當天開應變會議以後馬上再去現場採三頭豬15個樣品所以這個五頭豬 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
10216.847 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
10234.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
都有驗到陽性23個樣品全部都在陽性這樣比例來講是百分百喔都是發病然後其他的全部都撲殺全部都撲殺還是要跟委員說明因為即使他有出租到大安肉品市場他的圖前跟圖後的檢查都是 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
10235.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
10251.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
就是沒有症狀的部分然後更重要的是這些豬肉它本身它就算有這些非洲豬瘟它不會人吃的是沒有問題的而且這個病毒不會人傳人柏定你是這樣說的不對啦我感覺以這個時序來講10月10號已經發現死亡縱使他們懷疑是別種的病然後他們在用藥以10月13日出20百劑 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
10263.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
10287.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
出了28隻豬到後端市場這個時候是不是潛伏期 不知道 已經很可怕了那10月14號台中市凍飽處前往訪視然後也沒有採樣10月14號發現異常的死亡到底13號跟14號就短短的一天內發生什麼事情13號還有辦法28隻豬出到市場14號去就說異常死亡 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
10294.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
10320.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
那有沒有可能異常死亡是在提早就發生了11號就發生了 12號就發生了我們在整個的處理過程中我們調了那個畫質的資料大概他總共有5天的有異常的死亡的一個現象那5天都有就對了對 透過畫質場的監控的部分但是在現場上面來講因為他有特約收益師所以我們這個部分還要做詳細的疫調 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
10322.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
10329.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
我感覺這個也是要做一個疫調的一個重點因為這28隻豬牠跑到市場如果你們以後端來看我們在21號我們農業部開始採樣檢查後總共驗了5隻豬然後你說用了差不多超過15個採樣15個採樣全部是陽性 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
10345.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
10369.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
那推論起來就是他整場感染嘛那如果整場感染的話13號處理那些地下有危險嗎這我們不知道這有可能變成一個破口部長要正視這個狀況對我們就是因為因為現在的時序大概都是由台中市動保處的人員做一個說明的部分但是說明只是只是動保處的人員說明我們還要去問事主 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
10370.282 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
10379.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
那事主是不是其實已經知道而隱匿不報那是更嚴重的事情說實在我就是要說隱匿不報啦所以這個部分我們要透過疫調我就是要感覺這樣因為10號他就開始有懷疑啊14號東寶祝去也還沒採樣不知道這中他就出事了 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
10388.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
10400.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
我覺得這樣要查好情策對 這個才是我們疫調的一個重點我們一定是完成疫調以後會如實的對外公開他出到了市場之後市場後端的一個狀況這個也應該要掌握 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
10402.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
10423.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
好 這個我們來了解因為以家裡十倍28隻你說到了台中後端的市場對 我想委員意思是說到了大安市場的後端的一個流處我想我們也可以來追蹤最可能也要追蹤因為這個事情非同小可所以說朱文他會整個把我們這幾年我們努力的這個全部打破掉 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
10423.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
10446.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
那最後我再問一下啦現在說台中是沒辦法配合火化這一些應該要火化的豬那這問題是怎樣我想我們昨天就遇到兩個問題就是有化智場的縣市他就不允許部分的縣市不允許其他縣市進到化智場那這樣的話會造成就是說一般的一般正常的病死豬 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
10446.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
10463.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
沒有進到化資廠就亂丟啦然後第二個部分就是台東市的部分因為掩埋有掩埋的規範但是掩埋也不是最好的方式所以我們昨天協調台東市政府所以保證你是注定要要火化啦要火化所以我們要火化你就接入嘛對我們協調了那個什麼協調了台東市環保局跟農業處這邊就是進到火化 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
10469.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
10470.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
我們會盡可能協助他們我們會來協助我們中央我們來協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
10495.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
10502.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
那就是火化啦 不要讓他們說就要掩埋啦現在大家聽到掩埋 新來的都開始都去啊就覺得說 喔啊這掩埋的會怎樣 會被人家看處理嗎所以我們會來處理 我們就大家一起做沒關係啦我們會來協助 就是就完成把它全部燒掉 就像你主張的這樣好不好這件事一定要貫徹 好不好 部長 這次 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
10519.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
10537.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
每一個時間都是黃金時刻 我覺得一定要該做的動作都要把它做到因為剛才講的這些東西 我們在中央應變中心都有正式的決議那因為依照相關的規定 中央應變中心的一個決議地方政府是應該要配合的啦 當然啦所以我們會來做溝通的 他們要配合 你們有時該 強制就強制啦好 了解 好 OK 好好 謝謝接下來我們請陳佩瑜委員請做詢答 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
10553.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
10559.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
好謝謝主席部長要不要先喝一口水主席給他喝一口好那有請部長我們請部長好謝謝主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
10573.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
10593.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
部長辛苦了從昨天中央成立這個前進緊急應變所到今天為止我相信你們在第一線已經處理了非常多狀況但是今天立法院立即召開這個會議討論我覺得很好但是我也想要問部長目前為止大家都在問中央必須要做的事情但部長我要問根據我們花蓮縣光復鄉救災的經驗我要問 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
10596.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
10619.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
請問地方政府該做什麼事情可不可以請部長這邊幫我們說明到底所謂中央地方分工落實是如何落實謝謝我只要聽地方的部分我想地方的部分就是相關的這些這些畜牧場的部分至於地方政府要負責去訪視如果發現到一些異常狀況的時候地方政府一定要去訪視那中央會做必要的一個協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
10620.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
10640.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
我是指現在所謂緊急應變的這個部分緊急應變的部分也是一樣就是說相關的疫調的部分其實也是地方政府要做但是因為這次緊急狀況我們是前進指揮所是來協助因為疫調可能會發生不同的狀況然後必要的時候可能是由中央去做跨部會的一個資源來協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
10641.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
10661.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
好 謝謝部長說得很清楚疫調的部分原來在相關法規裡面規定是要地方政府承擔但因為這件事情事涉緊急而且我們也不確定地方能不能做得夠好所以我們中央緊急成立應變所然後中央跨部會的積極協助地方政府以上我說的對嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
10662.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
10684.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
是這樣子的如果是這樣我們回過來看到底法規範給了中央跟地方哪些工具尤其是今天早上非常多委員在問到廚餘的部分很多區域委員可能對於相關的法規範因為事情太緊急了還沒有搞清楚部長我們辦公室整理我跟你再次確定到底廚餘養豬這件事情在台灣的法規範目前的規定其實有說得非常的清楚一 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
10685.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
10701.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
200頭以上的養豬場可以例外開放二這個開放必須建立在縣市政府核准在利用是也就是決定我的縣市政府可不可以用這件事情不是你農業部管的是地方縣市政府決定可不可以用對不對對 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
10702.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
10724.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
所以才會出現有雲林的委員說雲林沒有用廚餘養豬而其他縣市有而目前現在案發的這個廠在台中也就是我可不可以這麼說台中市政府他站在主管機關他核准當地的養豬廠符合情況的條件下可以再利用這個廚餘做養豬工作以上我的結論對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
10725.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
10749.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
是的他是根據環境部所公告的這些標準然後由地方政府核定那地方政府可核定可不核定會由地方政府來決定所以雲林之所以沒有廚餘養豬是因為雲林縣政府他們做了這個決定就是不要開放廚餘養豬所以我要請大家一起注意這件事情因為是地方政府主責所以絕對不是事情丟到中央說了才算就像我剛一開始問的為什麼事情要分中央跟地方搞清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
10750.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
10778.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
一起合作但是該誰做就要誰承擔再來當市長做了這個決定之後呢市政府就要在後續的其他有像這次的緊急事件當中市政府也是要有角色除了疫調之外我不知道後續市政府還有哪些角色這個部分我覺得要拜託農業部因為今天雖然主席只找了農業部跟財政部來但是也要報告主席喔在處於去化的部分其實需要環境部其他跨部會的事情不要只有在問責於農業部接下來我要問的是關於這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
10780.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
10803.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
相關法規範處於養豬的部分還有地方跟中央的分工接下來我要講的是時間序其實很多委員都很關心時間序的問題但我要問市主跟市政府之間這個關係明明市政府他有角色他有法規範可以讓他去對市主做出相關的動作但沒有做目前這件事情你們怎麼看就是根據地方政府回報的時候他在10號的時候因為我們後那個畫室後台發現到他異常死亡 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
10808.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
10827.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
那市政府的動保處人員去看的時候如果有異常的話他可以要求他要去做相關的採樣或檢體那市主是不得拒絕的那這個部分我們會去再釐清到底是市主拒絕還是動保處沒有要求這個部分我想我們在疫調的時候會去做釐清 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
10827.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
10851.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
對我覺得這個部分非常重要因為現在網路上非常多言論就一昧丟包給中央我覺得這非常非常的不公平中央該做緊急應變事情我們也做了可是在那之前我再次強調除於這件事情的組織機關在地方政府在飼料管理法第20條第一款還有在動物傳染病防治辦法第28條第一項第一款裡面都說得非常的清楚我也要拜託 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
10852.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
10881.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
我們在相關部會相關謠言的澄清當然現在第一階段沒有辦法澄清謠言我知道你們在地方已經很努力在工作後續這個部分我們一起加強也希望大家在這個觀念上要搞得清楚以上謝謝部長謝謝主席主席剛剛跟你報告有一件事因為你剛剛在跟網友講話沒有聽到因為今天有很多人問到除於去化的問題確實團善業者也好或是營養午餐或是很多美食街這個去化的問題是關於環境部如果主席對這個議題還有關心可以再邀請環境部 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
10882.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
10901.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
以上谢谢主席谢谢你好好接下来我们请赖会员委员请做寻讨谢谢主席请部长我们再请陈部长 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
10906.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
10928.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
部長 那個延續剛才幾位委員的一個議題我要請教10月10號到10月14號這個是一個採樣的一個關鍵期那到底就是說台中動保處有沒有要求就是事主就是要採樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
10929.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
10951.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
那有沒有事主就是這個過程裡頭是怎麼樣的一個情況我們必須要去把它釐清這個關係到後續的一些行政的一個工作那還有最重要就是說10月10號到10月14號他再出地再20倍價那個流出我想大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
10951.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
10977.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
必須要把它搞清楚是行政怠惰還是程序上的一個疏失還是制度出了一個問題這10天的空窗期絕對不是台中市副市長那個黃國榮一句說我們已經盡了最大的努力了我想這個關係到整個養豬產業非常重要的一個存亡之際我們花了20年在把台灣變成是一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
10979.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
10997.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
惠州豬瘟的一個防疫區這個你知道我們這裡的地方都可以外銷外銷新加坡 外銷菲律賓這個都得到很好的一個成績那如果只是一個地方政府的一個疏失讓我們造成一個這麼大的一個破口這個都是我們不應該去承擔的 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
11001.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
11026.981 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
所以禁印5天禁印5天這個在後續你剛才有講到了就是說你們是把它延長到15天那5天一個cycle5天一個cycle都會充分的就是反映追蹤那事實上如果以我個人在這產業界這麼多年的一個關懷的一個時間我想15天可能還不夠部長你可能還要有一個第二 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
11027.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
11054.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
第二一個那個計畫準備就是營運這個禁運的5天15天以外的第二套計畫來 部長請回答我跟委員報告就是我們現在是訂15天5天為關卡期看它的一個疫調的情況但是如果說在這15天之內大概疫情是可被控制的那接下來可能是一個類似自主管理的部分讓它更乾淨能夠更安全的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
11055.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
11079.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
那我们会考量看看到时候跟业者来讨论所以我跟你说自主管理这个讲到自主管理的话在这里我还要再提醒部长你们必须还有畜牧师还要做一个准备如果万一传染出去的时候你到时候你这一个场它临近三公里有几个场这一些地图你们都要做出来了对我们现在的畜牧场的全台湾的地图都已经Mapping在那边了好 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
11080.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
11098.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
非常好還有一段就是說全部全國的一個畜牧場其實現在面臨到的一個困難就是說消毒水消毒水不是有錢喔有錢買不到喔這個很大的一個困難到底那我們農業部有做什麼樣的一個準備 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
11098.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
11118.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
我想昨天在中央應變中心的時候我就指示各地方政府一定要去協助包括化織車基本最重要是化織車的一個消毒跟豬場的消毒那這個部分我們之前也提供了消毒水那如果說不夠的話由地方政府先來支應但是中央一定用經衛來補助來協助他們所以這個部分我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
11119.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
11142.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
我們會更用心的將這個部分來處理然後我們從環境 從運輸 從那個續舍這個等等的一個途徑你都是要那個全部全線的一個追蹤那再來還有境外的一個包裹境外的包裹你有沒有跨部會跨部會去做一個整合現在境外的包裹是不是應該要暫停呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
11144.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
11170.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
我跟我們報告就是整個邊境的防堵的部分大概從旅客的部分包括郵包的部分還有快遞的部分包括走私的部分我們是跨部會聯合稽查那這個部分我想我們從108年開始我們就非常積極的去做而且這個強度沒有降低反而是更精進的部分包括抽檢的比例更高所以這個部分我們會去持續去加強 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
11171.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
11188.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
部長 你的宣傳會就已經被刪了六成了你怎麼有辦法做這麼多的一個事情呢境外包裹 我跟你講這個違規中港澳最高嘛你這次出現的問題是噴嘛你是在那個就是用那個噴室養的這一些養豬場嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
11190.16 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
11211.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
有没有考虑到就是说在未来是不是要前面的那个停止这个也是一个很重要的一个议题这个是后续的问题那你也要考虑你知道吗其实在日本养猪他们也是有用到喷可是他们是用喷把它在那个升级做饲料它是变成饲料变成饲料以后再来喂猪这个部分我想我们会来考虑 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
11212.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
11239.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
必須要關心的對 後續的養豬的這些政策我們包括可能逐步的轉型然後也讓這個廚藝的部分有機會變成飼料以後再來餵這個部分我想我們會整體來考慮是啊 所以再一次提醒部長就是說也請你加油因為面臨到很這個是很重要很重要的一個對養豬產業很大的一個困境跟挑戰所以農業部跟其他的部會我們要一起聯合起來跨部會謝謝好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
11247.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
11265.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
謝謝 接下來我們請鍾嘉斌委員請做巡檔好 主席 在黨委員先進列席的政務及官司長 官員 會長 工作夥伴媒體 記者 女士先生有請陳部長我們再請陳部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
11274.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
11280.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
我也好部長我很迅速的延續剛剛賴慧媛委員所說的在日本的廚餘它是轉化成液態飼料來飼養豬對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
11282.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
11305.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
對 它是轉化成飼料以後再進來那為什麼要轉化成液態飼料呢 兩個原因因為每個人每天都在製造廚餘所以廚餘一定要去化 對不對但是廚餘如果直接餵養會有風險所以日本在轉化成液態飼料後才給豬隻食用 對不對好 那我請問一下我們今年是不是宣布台灣才脫離三大疫區是 今年五月豬瘟的嘛 傳統豬瘟 非洲豬瘟還有長病毒 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
11310.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
11320.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
那請問一下過去這幾年來關於管制廚餘申請資源再利用是不是有使用 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
11321.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
11345.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
我想我們從108年開始這些對廚餘的關係跟現在一樣嘛跟現在一樣沒有對所以在這樣的廚餘的再資源化利用的情況之下台灣仍然有效的達成脫離豬瘟的疫區是不是對如果說我們沒有去重視它我們不可能守住七年啊是的表示說過去這七年還是有這樣的廚餘的再資源化的利用但是 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
11346.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
11370.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
沒有影響到我們脫離疫區的努力是這都是靠著大家落實嘛是所以重點是在落實是還是禁用我覺得落實是最重要的好就像我們說的有人運動要去登山有人要去健行你會因為健行被車撞還是因為登山發生山難就全面禁止登山健行嗎你會這樣做嗎不會不會嗎好那我們接下來看一下那 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
11372.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
11397.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
請問一下什麼樣的豬種是使用廚餘資源化的我們現在了解的是大概是黑毛豬的部分黑毛豬嘛黑豬白豬各有所好那請問黑豬佔我們全體豬的量供應量大概多少有沒有8%大概大概40幾萬隻吧差不多8%8%對8%所以說絕大部分我們吃的豬肉是白肉豬白毛豬黑豬只有8%黑豬的主要消費地在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].start |
11399.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].end |
11421.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].text |
桃園在桃竹苗我檢驗你有沒有看過客家的那個神豬賽豬宮有沒有都是黑豬嘛這是一個特定族群的傳統的習俗跟他們的飲食習慣那麼黑豬的主要消費地是在桃竹苗那請問這個地區的黑豬使用的廚餘資源化來源地是哪裡是不是北部的餐廳 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].start |
11423.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].end |
11439.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].text |
是嘛北部的外食人口多所以北部的連飼料的供應也是北部市場的需求也在北部所以桃豬苗的確是台灣目前這8%黑豬的產地跟市場的主要集中區是不是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].start |
11439.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].end |
11462.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].text |
是的 我跟委員報告那為什麼這次我們在台中出現了這一場我們的廚餘的資源化再利用是誰在管 是不是環保局在管是 地方是環保局那我們是不是有兩個原則第一 兩百頭以下不得使用 對不對規模化才有效益第二 一定要集中高溫烹煮 對不對是不是還包括說我們盡量鼓勵試用團散的食魚家庭廚餘的風險是不是比較高 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].start |
11463.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].end |
11479.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].text |
相對相對的那你認為這是無期的清潔隊他收來的廚餘是家庭廚餘還是團戰廚餘我們在疫調也會了解不過你如果不管是清潔隊或是事業廚餘或是家庭廚餘你如果要落實爭主是落實爭主最主要的但是風險呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].start |
11480.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].end |
11503.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].text |
家庭廚餘有可能會是境外郵包食品的郵包比如說我不是一定但是有可能是包括境內的移工他們想念家鄉的食物進來的郵包食用後進入了家庭廚餘被清潔隊收了後送到了這個養豬場這個小規模養豬場又沒有高溫蒸煮造成了這樣的可能性這樣的可能性是不是存在 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].start |
11504.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].end |
11522.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].text |
我覺得所有的風險我們都不可以忽視好那所以我這裡要請我們農業部一定要在行政院現在行政院有沒有聯合起來對這個非洲豬瘟的事件開始做跨部會的協調我想特別是昨天院長特別召開的這些跨部會的這個非洲豬瘟的一個應變的一個會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].start |
11524.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].end |
11549.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].text |
那原來的制度裡面就有中央非洲豬的中央應變中心我們會透過這個組織來運作所以包括目前在我們本來廚餘限制廚餘管制使用必須資源化處理對不對那這個是環境部環保局在做那請問現在台中市的部分它那麼多團山那麼多營養午餐產生那麼多的廚餘這段時間不能使用那怎麼去化這是農業部管的還是環境部管的 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].start |
11549.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].end |
11564.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].text |
這個是環境部來協助來處理的地方的環保局所以地方的環保局要趕快的落實趕快的去因應在這段禁用廚餘期間團散營養午餐的這個廚餘要怎麼去化可以用燒的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].start |
11566.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].end |
11584.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].text |
不曉得我想這是環境部環保局的問題我所了解環境部跟地方環保局昨天已經有開會然後希望說有一個儲存的地方然後用委外的方式去收取所以我們在這裡希望說其實這個廚餘資源化是環境議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].start |
11585.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].end |
11612.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].text |
對於農業部門來講養豬全部的黑豬只佔8%不是我們國家主要的養豬的主要的市場但是在國內仍然有特定的消費人口在使用所以我們希望說未來農業部跟環境部要在這一次的教訓之後我們一定要落實包括邊境管制包括這些使用的資源化必須要能夠被監督有落實高溫增煮可以嗎這一定要這樣做的好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].start |
11614.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].end |
11634.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].text |
好 谢谢接下来我们请王红薇委员请做询答好 谢谢主席我请陈部长还有我们关务署关务署署长 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].start |
11638.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].end |
11659.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].text |
好部長辛苦了我想請教就是有關來源的部分那現在很多都指向廚餘但是我也有看到我們的獸醫專家有講說因為現在我們國內的豬肉價格很高所以不排除有走私豬肉進口 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].start |
11660.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].end |
11678.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].text |
那這裡面呢提到就說有可能有從中國或者是越南走私豬肉那因為呢它的地點無錫港有地緣上的關係那麼而且呢在這一次的就是有關於它的病毒豬病毒豬 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].start |
11680.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].end |
11690.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].text |
那麼也有這個專家提到說他的一個排序跟越南的非洲豬瘟類似所以我想請教部長還有我們的關務署因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].start |
11695.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].end |
11721.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].text |
我們這麼多年來我們守住了所以這一定從境外來的嗎那所以我想請問一下除了廚餘的感染之外有沒有可能在我們的現在的追查裡面來自於境外有沒有可能是來自於走私豬肉那至於他講說他的排序是跟越南的非洲豬瘟類似我想請問是不是有這樣的訊息 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].start |
11722.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].end |
11744.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].text |
我先跟委員說明就是所有的來源我們一定要經過完整的疫調才能夠確認不過非洲豬瘟的導入一定是從境外的它有可能是國外的這些含有豬肉製品進到注意系統然後有可能人員的部分也有可能走私的部分它有不同可能的原因所以我們不排除是有境外走私豬肉 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].start |
11745.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].end |
11764.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].text |
而造成的嗎我覺得都有可能所以我們疫調的時候會去了解好 那我現在提到就是有這個獸醫專家提到無錫港有沒有可能因為你們有港口的關係然後就是因為這個都是我們境外把關我們有沒有去討論或研究到可能有這樣的一個路徑 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].start |
11765.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].end |
11781.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].text |
我想我們在中央應變中心針對境外防堵的部分境外的走私就是一個非常重要的一個工作是由海委會這邊來負責的然後光務的部分是針對行李的部分所以不同部會有相關的一個部分我知道像剛才大家特別提到就廚餘的部分那麼可能它還有些後續的問題但是要提醒不要排除走私豬肉也就是我們境外管理出現了一個漏洞 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].start |
11793.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].end |
11808.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].text |
而使得這個非洲豬瘟長驅直入直接到了這個台灣讓我們出現了這樣的一個首次的案例另外呢剛才在提到說10月14號現在很多在追究10月14號為什麼沒有採檢 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].start |
11811.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].end |
11819.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].text |
但是現在我發現我們的次長杜汶珍次長也提到說這個在經過獸醫的檢查的時候也承認這是一個非典型的病態這是一個非典型病態因為它沒有出現傳統我們所知道非洲豬瘟會出現的什麼流鼻血或者耳朵瘀青等等的症狀 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].start |
11836.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].end |
11852.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].text |
所以對於這種非典型的病態是不是在這一次確實存在然後未來我們要怎麼樣的去預防因為我們接下來我們也怕再有類似這樣的狀況然後我們沒有辦法防堵到 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].start |
11853.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].end |
11872.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].text |
謝謝在我們那個主委回答之前我們今天會議中午不休息一直到我們議程結束謝謝請說回答我想第一個說明就是我們杜市長所回應的不是說我們農業部因為現在外面都說我們農業部說沒辦法去分辨這個是從台東市政府動保處那邊所說到的 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].start |
11872.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].end |
11885.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].text |
那的确非洲猪瘟跟现在的部分的这些那叫做肺腺杆菌的肺膜炎它的病征是很类似的部分确实很类似所以它是一个非典型的部分所以确实兽医没有办法没有办法分辨出它没有办法立刻诊断出这个是疑似非洲猪瘟 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].start |
11892.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].end |
11921.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].text |
但是有一個重要就是我們會去監控後面的死亡的異常如果有異常的時候其實就應該更有警惕的部分所以這也是我們在做疫調的主要的調查原因因為它後面的畫質它有連續的5天的部分都是異常死亡的部分那異常死亡就不能當作一般的非典型的部分去處理它必須去做一些比較強勢的處理那到底是事主拒絕還是動保處的人員沒有去做 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].start |
11922.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].end |
11944.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].text |
那這個東西在疫調的過程中現在市主能夠拒絕嗎市主能拒絕嗎他不能拒絕如果說動保處要強勢去採檢的話市主是不能拒絕的所以我們現在法律上是市主不能拒絕的嗎是完全是不能拒絕的嗎因為你今天受醫所他所調查出來拒絕的話他會罰款 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].start |
11948.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].end |
11964.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].text |
所以我們現在是說你的意思說地方政府是可以用罰款的方式但是我覺得像這種遇到這種類似的因為獸醫師也應該知道這些非典型的症狀非洲豬瘟跟哪一些非典型的症狀的疾病是一樣的如果他有 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].start |
11965.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].end |
11990.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].text |
但是他如果說一隻兩隻那還好他如果異常死亡而且連續的異常死亡的時候就應該那我最後問一句我不要佔用大家時間目前我們還有我們除了這個養豬場之外在其他的養豬場目前有沒有出現也有異常死亡的現象到目前為止到目前為止的關聯場他的並沒有異常死亡的現象 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].start |
11990.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].end |
12001.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].text |
到目前为止目前是锁定在就是这个养猪场没有我们锁定在这个养猪场还有它周遭三公里的还有它的化制车走经过的这些关联场 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].start |
12002.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].end |
12030.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].text |
除了這個關聯廠之外我想全台灣的豬農都非常緊張目前在通報上有沒有這個目前類似別說大量死亡的沒有但是我還是希望這個對這些非典型的病態因為我覺得這個因為第一線這是我們第一次嘛大家可能經驗不足會經驗不足的問題所以在非典型病態的部分是不是應該要有一些精進的方案的提出 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].start |
12030.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].end |
12057.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].text |
我想透過這次疫調一定有更多的可以精進的作為那所有的這些防疫人員都非常辛苦的但是它相關的有一些判斷上面來講也沒有辦法很及時但是我想我們會針對這一次的疫調過程中會設計出一個新的機制讓我們的低線的同仁一個新的SOP好不好讓所有低線的人員能夠更快的因為我們是以 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].start |
12058.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].end |
12069.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].text |
維護台灣的產業為主這個我想我們大家一起努力中央地方要一起努力好了解謝謝好謝謝謝謝那接下來我們請黃婕委員好謝謝主席我們請陳部長我們再請陳部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].start |
12095.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].end |
12114.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].text |
好部長好首先要跟你說辛苦了因為其實這個事情是10月21號也就是前天晚上你們接到這件事情通報然後短短三天內其實農業部的反應非常迅速那也馬上成立了前進的協調所那我們杜文貞次長也馬上的到台中去進行協助了 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].start |
12114.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].end |
12117.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].text |
那我覺得你們真的非常辛苦今天還臨時要被叫來這個變更議程然後突然要來這邊備詢那我覺得這當然其實我們農業部的整個流程然後對於整個危機應變的能力都是很強的那現在看起來是因為台中市府確實面臨一些困難 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].start |
12132.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].end |
12144.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].text |
那我覺得農業部必須要給予更多協助因為很顯然他們沒有能力處理這些事情包括10月10號發生第一例死亡結果到了10月20號過了10天之後他們才到現場進行採驗那這個中間整整10天 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].start |
12150.16 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].end |
12176.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].text |
沒有進行採驗的這個問題我覺得非常大這是第一個我認為你們一定要積極的督促台中市政府趕快把過去這些鬆掉的螺絲趕快補上的問題第二個這個沒有採驗的原因你們必須要跟他們了解第二個接下來焚化的問題我也認為問題很大你們已經很明確的建議他們應該要以焚化來處理結果他們堅決要用掩埋 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].start |
12177.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].end |
12200.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].text |
那這件事情我們農業部跟我們可不可以跟環境部協調一下看他們到底可不可以協助他們能用焚化就用焚化的而不是塗增多餘的風險繼續讓這件事情可能擴大我跟委員報告因為台中的豬隻我們不准他移到其他縣市然後我們在昨天中央應變中心的會議也明確的說希望是用焚化的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].start |
12201.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].end |
12221.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].text |
那焚化的部分如果租资太大的话我们也调度了一些所谓的生物处理机让他们去把这些病死猪的部分就做部分的处理再进到焚化那环境部也跟昨天也跟地方的环保局在开会那我相信这个问题最后台东市政府应该也会朝向我们的决议是往焚化的方向去处理 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].start |
12222.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].end |
12241.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].text |
好謝謝部長因為我在這邊認為很顯然他們從採驗到後來的焚化的處理都是沒有能力的所以我覺得農業部的責任就變得更重大我們只能盡力的來協助盡力的挽救那至於另外一個部分我也要提醒很顯然他們在廚餘再利用的部分是出現問題的 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].start |
12243.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].end |
12270.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].text |
所以他們很顯然可能沒有落實你們說的必須要90度以上然後一個小時的持續烹調然後持續攪拌這樣子的處理方式所以除於在利用很顯然有人沒有落實這個我們就一定要來精進一定要來更嚴格要求這個部分好嗎這是我希望農業部接下來要協助的對 這個也一定是在疫調裡面去調查的它的除於增組的一些SOP本身還有它的落實度因為這都是這一次問題的癥結點對 這次都會去做調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].start |
12271.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].end |
12283.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].text |
沒錯好謝謝部長所以我在這邊拜託幾件事情第一個他們動保處到底為什麼沒有第一時間採驗明明如果我們四組拒絕採驗你就是開罰啊這麼嚴重的事情為什麼當時不開罰或者是沒有第一時間去阻斷這個傳播鏈第二個這個焚化爐的問題焚化的問題拜託你們也進入協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].start |
12293.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].end |
12311.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].text |
第三個疫調現在看起來台中市自己有在疫調但是看起來疫調的效率也不張所以也拜託疫調部分也請你們直接協助以及這28頭豬現在已經有入市場的也請你們直接協助了我拜託農業部直接協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].start |
12312.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].end |
12336.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].text |
會 我想這也是為什麼我們在台中成立前進應變所的原因就是直接來協助地方政府補足地方政府量能不足的地方好 那這28頭豬流入市場也請你們幫他們查清楚吧那我要講一下說這件事情真的影響非常大因為到昨天看到我們台中市長都還在講說要購物節拚經濟但卻沒有提到說這整個豬肉的產業鏈造成的 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].start |
12340.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].end |
12367.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].text |
損失可能是上千億元耶不只今天看到我們隔壁的這個雙越就說滷肉飯要停賣了我們高雄南豐滷肉飯也要停賣了影響所有店家所有消費者所有豬農高達上千億的產值都是接下來都在這樣的威脅當中所以這件事情真的不可不慎然後包括說你們可能接下來淨運載可能的天數要長達15天我相信很多人都很緊張 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].start |
12369.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].end |
12388.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].text |
我想這是必要的措施這樣的話才能夠讓我們的員工更精準掌握當然我也同意必須要面對敵人面對這麼風險這麼高的病毒我們必須要料底從寬那最後我請一下關務署我在這邊想要講一下邊境管制的事情部長先請回座 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].start |
12389.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].end |
12416.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].text |
那署長我在這邊請教一下因為我認為邊境管控才是這解決這整件事情的根源必須要杜絕這一些來自疫區可能的風險可是其實一直以來我都很常接到民眾說又有人從中港澳違規攜帶疫區來的肉製品包括說在蝦皮上面販賣中國的肉粽包括說在一些地方的社團販賣一些中國的月餅 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].start |
12417.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].end |
12432.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].text |
然後甚至是來路不明的一些中港澳的豬肉的製品都流竄在網路上這個是我一直以來都有接到的那很顯然這些都是違規我也知道公務署一直都有在查所以從2018年到現在每年幾乎都1000多件 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].start |
12433.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].end |
12446.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].text |
這樣子的違規的從中港澳來的疫區的製品那當然我也希望幫你們呼籲民眾所以我每次都會一再的呼籲民眾說拜託不要再從疫區帶這一些這麼風險這麼高的肉製品進來了可是 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].start |
12451.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].end |
12476.847 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].text |
我們這邊還已經量能提的這麼高了邊境管控量能幾乎從進口的郵包進口的貨運都百分之百少X光了我們還能做什麼可不可以暫停停運從這一些來自疫區的肉製品報告委員暫停停運這些來自特定國家的這些物品這涉及很多部會還有相關法制的問題容我們再研議一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].start |
12478.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].end |
12484.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].text |
我覺得非常時期需要非常手段我在這邊提出這麼這是一個很嚴厲的一個政策沒有錯可是現在台灣豬的風險就是已經 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].start |
12490.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].end |
12508.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].text |
正在面臨非常嚴峻的考驗我們希望我們繼續成為亞洲唯一三大豬瘟的非異國這是一個得來不易的榮耀要歸於所有的農業部所有關務署的同仁這是你們辛苦多年以來的成績可是現在卻因為一個破口 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].start |
12509.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].end |
12533.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].text |
造成這麼大的危機大家的心情都非常的沉重所以這件事情到底怎麼解決我認為邊境管控就是一個關鍵啊去年沒宣費被刪了六成去年邊境管控的經費被動刪了四千萬今年我們當然一樣會全力支持你也希望所有立法院同仁支持你們可是這些非常手段該實施就實施吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].start |
12535.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].end |
12553.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].text |
是了解委員的意思那因為牽涉到問題跟法治非常的廣 廣泛還是要我們要審慎研議一下好那也拜託這些網路上來路不寧的包裹嚴加查緝那當然我們現在海關已經全力動員是好謝謝署長好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].start |
12558.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].end |
12587.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].text |
来接下来我们请赖世宝委员赖世宝赖世宝委员不在现场我们请林楚英委员林楚英林楚英委员不在现场我们请陈冠廷陈冠廷委员陈冠廷委员不在现场我们请刘书斌刘书斌委员不在现场我们最后请徐新义委员请发言谢谢好谢谢主席本席有请部长陈部长我们再请陈部长 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].start |
12594.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].end |
12599.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].text |
委員部長我想我們的邊境防疫 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].start |
12601.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].end |
12620.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].text |
出現了危機大家都覺得應該要想辦法改進但是有些委員一直覺得這跟沒宣費有關我想應該不是所以我今天要就邊境防疫的危機我們覺得防線潰堤的部分要來跟部長來討論我們這一次114年邊境查驗了 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].start |
12627.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].end |
12650.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].text |
截至114年10月21號邊境查驗了9507件其中有996件病毒查驗是陽性等於是我們的病毒陽性率高達10%那這是不是已經證明我們邊境防線出現了系統性的潰堤嚴重危險我想不能用這個數據因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].start |
12652.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].end |
12667.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].text |
我們邊境查驗是看到就是夾帶了以後我們去查驗那查驗的時候有一些不同的國家那這些是針對可能的包括你剛才說10%那這10%裡面也有80%是從氣質它放在垃圾桶裡面我們去檢查的 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].start |
12674.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].end |
12686.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].text |
對 所以它本身就是有可能是肉製品的我們又去查然後有非洲豬瘟陽性的是10%那其中大概有八成是來自中國的部分所以我們現在在機場我們現在在機場的檢驗 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].start |
12690.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].end |
12711.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].text |
一般認為是不是有需要改善比如說你高度的仰賴人力那你X光機的判讀可能有一些問題或是什麼我跟委員報告我們從開始啟動整個邊境的防疫是由跨部會不同的機關來處理分幾個層次而且我們一直在精進好 沒關係我問重點好了現在有我們這個如果被這個發現是財閥20萬對不對是20萬20萬他如果 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].start |
12721.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].end |
12739.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].text |
據入境他就可以不用罰他以後就不能再入境了以後就不能再入境大概有600多 629個人所以我們的這個檢查的制度是不是要調整我們現在對於入境的旅客你是看依據區域是不是高風險區域你才查還是都查 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].start |
12742.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].end |
12756.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].text |
都會去查但是高風險區的話我記得我們出國回來好像都是不是高風險區的部分是100%然後非高風險區的話是用抽查的方式那是在通道的時候嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].start |
12758.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].end |
12767.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].text |
那是分兩個部分如果說是在我們檢疫之前那我們有設我們的藍線跟紅線綠線跟紅線那那個部分是提醒如果在那個地方如果有檢驗這個違規的產品的話你丟棄那麼你在進來海關的時候你不會被罰我說的問題是你綠線給他自主性的走綠線但實際上他搞不好夾帶進來所以那這樣到海關的時候他一定被罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].start |
12785.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].end |
12800.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].text |
那只要租的製品被查出來跟海關我們有兩道防線啦我們的叫做預防性我們的是設在前面叫預防性那如果民眾配合在那個時候守規矩的話可能在後面被海關截下來的時候就不會被罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].start |
12802.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].end |
12819.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].text |
你海關你用什麼檢查X光對啊 所以我們就說你這X光可能人力的配置我們分兩個層次一個層次就是說我們在入關之前我們會提醒你如果主動丟棄的話我們是不罰的可是一旦入關你又被查到的時候那你就會被罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].start |
12820.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].end |
12840.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].text |
然後另外委員一直關心的就是X光機的部分的判試我們現在也盡快用AI化就是AI化的方式去處理因為我時間的關係那我想請教我們是否應該擴大WOAH國際合作共享病毒株序列可以做到超前預測變異風險讓我們的篩檢試劑跑在病毒前面這個可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].start |
12846.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].end |
12871.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].text |
我想這個部分我請我們的獸醫所來回應因為比較技術面的問題是有關那個病毒株序列的事情我們都會公佈在上面以我們也因為分享在那個網路上我們能做到超前預測嗎基本上比較不容易對 因為這個病毒它也是DNA病毒變異本身就比RNA病毒還要小變異的機率比較小而且它病毒的基因序列又比較大 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].start |
12872.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].end |
12898.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].text |
所以我们不容易做到预测病毒会往哪个方向是不是可以看看仿效其他国家有更先进的我们想办法来做那接着最后最后一个问题就是有关我们画质数据的部分画质数据这个部分部长我们应该要能够有及时的机动的监测而不是事后才发现现在像我很快举例像我们现在 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].start |
12899.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].end |
12917.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].text |
銀行他不是有很多警示帳戶嗎只要有有異常的他就會跳出來現在你們對畫質數據有沒有動態的數據只要畫質車你的數據重量你隨時你等於有一個機制那發現異常他就跳出來我們現在就有這個機制 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].start |
12920.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].end |
12934.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].text |
現在什麼時候現在就是我們畫製廠本身的這些後台的數據那我們有設定不同規模的時候它的不同百分比的異常死亡那就變成異常 異常的話它自動跳出來這一次怎麼會那麼慢 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].start |
12935.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].end |
12960.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].text |
這就是我們有 我們才一直提醒可是也是事後耶 也是事後因為當你發現那個死亡的豬隻的重量車輛的數量異常的時候你應該馬上就可以發現不是等到這個比較後面我們看到異常你們也是事後嘛 不是即時的監測算是即時的 就是即時的算是即時 然後我們也通報地方政府地方政府同步也可以看到這個數據啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].start |
12962.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].end |
12975.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].text |
好 所以我們還是希望預防勝於撲殺我們大家一起來努力包含邊境的防疫還有我們這個即時的監測數據所以我想我們會持續的精進也不會把這個強度降低好 謝謝好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].start |
12980.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].end |
13007.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].text |
好 谢谢登记发言的委员除不在场其余的都已经发言完毕询答结束我们由委员陈超明委员陈冠廷委员所提书面咨询列入公报刊登列入记录书面咨询以及未答复的部分请相关单位一周之内以书面答复并复制本会我们特别感谢媒体朋友以及机关单位我们各位同仁大家的发言让 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].start |
13008.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].end |
13023.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].text |
我們可以好好的維護臺灣的產業我相信透過這樣子的一個說明以及詢問讓大家更清楚也讓國人希望讓國人能夠安靜下來謝謝 散會 |