| IVOD_ID |
168589 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168589 |
| 日期 |
2026-04-15 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-26-6 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第6次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
6 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第6次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-04-15T12:18:33+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-04-15T12:48:45+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:30:12 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3ec77822e2e6eae3904c893aec4c71ae8ea785098ebfecd5e6b800412f8d870b315cf85df7fa038c5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
林淑芬 |
| 委員發言時間 |
12:18:33 - 12:48:45 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-04-15T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第6次全體委員會議（事由：邀請衛生福利部部長、行政院經貿談判辦公室、經濟部、農業部、教育部就「美國貿易代表署發布《2026年各國貿易評估報告》（2026NTE）提及技術性貿易壁壘或食品安全檢驗與動植物防疫檢疫SPS）壁壘之豬肉、牛肉與牛肉產品、β促進劑的最大殘留容許量等各項食農相關產品及技術之要求，我國所承諾之措施、移除產品禁令或取消輸入口岸檢疫程序等，並特就其中開放切片馬鈴薯帶芽（或腐爛或發黴）仍能整批進口與其敦促撤銷基改食品進校園，對我國食品安全造成之衝擊與因應作為」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
邀請衛生福利部、農業部、行政院消費者保護處就「寵物用藥新制上路在即，犬貓及非經濟動物急重症醫療銜接、藥品流向管理、飼主取得可近性與消費權益保障之整體配套」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
【專題報告綜合詢答】） |
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今年以來 |
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台大醫院研究大樓在1月29號台大醫院東址大樓在2月24號三軍總醫院松山分院在4月3號這兩家醫院有三起火災事件發生火災然後松山分院還是清明節連假的第一天然後台北市消防局獲報後立即提升為B級的這個火警 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
48.493 |
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69.181 |
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出動了53名的警消前往救援16分鐘以後撲滅火勢然後大家發現醫護啦民眾受影響大家都就地避難那我現在要談這個是因為啊2026今年到現在才多久的時間就有 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
70.917 |
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90.559 |
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這個都教學型醫院大型的醫院然後火警見報那台大還兩次那我們在講說這樣的火警都不是偶發的還不是偶發的單一事件你看從台大醫院說他們是建築施工然後設備安全火災預警 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
91.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
109.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
然後這個應變管理大家都開始睜大眼睛在檢視這些事情很難以想像就是說怎麼會像台大醫院東址是外部六樓的外部施工導致煙霧煙霧會跑到醫院裡面然後造成12樓13樓觸發警報外面的煙霧跑到大道裡面觸發警報 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
120.992 |
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144.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
這個不是非同小可的事情在這種狀況裡面緊鄰大作然後他也不是一次今年就兩次雖然沒有人員傷亡但是依照醫療事故預防及爭議處理法的第35條專案主管機關應該要組成專案小組做出這個調查報告請問你們有啟動調查嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
149.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
171.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
跟委員說明因為那個應該還不能夠列入我們這個醫療事故正義處理預防跟正義處理法的這個定義啦那個他還沒有屬於叫做醫療事故第315條他是事故預防或危害公共衛生及安全或有危害之餘 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
172.987 |
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200.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
但是他前面的那個法規在前第三條他在名詞定義上他有提到那你說中央還沒有構成要件那地方的火警調查火災調查原因是什麼這應該要因為他還是可能的一個公安事件所以按照醫療法本身他還是這個地方要去介入了解我們來追蹤這個事情很嚴重今年就兩次 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
201.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
221.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
那三種的是控制的病房 控制的病房沒有人大白忙 不明原因起火這大事建築物的外部施工焊接引起火花 然後觸發警報控制的病房不明原因起火 這是正常的嗎這絕對都不正常 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
224.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
244.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那地方政府的調查你們對他的狀況怎麼樣我想聽起來好像你還是沒有去問沒有特別去沒有掌握嘛但是不是每次火警都要等到有人死亡我們才要去把它當成是重大事件去關注不是因為你必須見為知著啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
247.762 |
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263.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
所以你從這裡就看到這個醫院醫院的管理有沒有問題一次兩次 台大耶然後現在講說因為醫院跟一般建築不同裡面是臥床的病人重症的病人行動不便者一旦失火 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
263.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
278.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
他的風險不是一般的公共場所可以來相比你的所以我現在跟你講說兩次然後都是教學型醫院然後控制的病房會起火這事情很嚴重的 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
284.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
310.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
跟委員說明確實因為台灣很多醫院也相當老舊台大醫院也是他已經很久的我們聽不下去老舊老舊不要提出來談再怎麼老舊也要確定這個醫療場所裡面的安全是更勝於其他公共場所的沒有錯就如同委員所提到的因為醫院裡面的住院病人相對的避難能力是比較差的 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
311.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
323.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
所以他所需要要求的防火相當的措施要更高所以我們去年開始就有一個輔導計畫你們的輔導計畫是什麼輔導計畫我們輔導當然是先從比較小型的醫院因為他們自己的能力比較不足所以我們先去輔導 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
333.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
360.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
那這個大型醫院的話而你們輔導計畫的內容主要是什麼核心的那個點是什麼我們的輔導當然包含第一個就是它的防火設施還有它的這個那個建築安全它的設計那以及應變能力那些大概這些因為去年年底剛好監察院也通過糾正屏東縣政府衛生局東港政公所衛福部 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
362.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
386.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
他們在年底去年12月26號糾正了你們地方政府主要的疏失以安泰醫院為例他合法的面積大概一半一半47.2都是非法的違建而且在2005年就開始了在那種狀況裡面地方政府放任違建醫院在違建內從事醫療使用到連 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
390.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
407.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
到去年 監察院去年2025年10月去履刊的時候現場仍然是違建 持續在使用當中現在政府也沒有依法勒令停止使用也沒有依法採取斷水斷電的處置火災的風險不是偶發 而是結構性的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
414.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
419.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
這個問題消防署統計全國469家醫院在2005年到2024年之間一共發生過98件的火災起火的原因都以電氣因素最多佔56.1%起火的地點以機房居多佔13.3%而安泰醫院就是因為電氣因素加上機房起火 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
443.519 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
462.511 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
死了8個人 死了8個人我這個都是監察院的監察報告全國醫院評鑑的制度也出現了系統性的失靈我說的也是監察院的調查報告監察院指出 全國有81家的醫院 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
463.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
479.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
屬於你講的中小型醫院類似安泰醫院他們都涉及違法擴充樓地板面積應列管的違建醫院竟然其中有70家這些都違建要列管的然後都還在營業的81家裡面有70家通過了衛福部的醫院評鑑 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
496.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
523.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
通過了醫院評鑑你們衛福部都給他評鑑通過所以顯然可以知道你們衛福部的對醫院公共安全的評鑑存在著系統性的為師而讓所有看病的這些民眾置於風險當中所以你動搖了人家對你們監督機制這種評鑑機制的信任 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
525.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
543.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
81間有70間通過你們的醫院評鑑你怎麼做 何感想跟委員說明 當然在這個評鑑的過程當中基於這個委員的專業啦他不見得有辦法看得那麼細所以通常在評鑑的同時會會同衛生局我現在不在看你們的委員看不看得這麼細啦現在監察院說你們81間都是這個有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
553.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
568.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
連七十經理也是讓他評鑑合格這不是你們有問題嗎然後你們被點出來的四大缺失喔他們簡直就透過安泰醫院這個評鑑上的問題他點出你們四個問題第一個問題你們衛福部辦理安泰醫院的評鑑 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
577.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
592.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
這個早在2005、2007年就存在了結果你們的這種違建還在一半以上都是違建然後你們在2011年、2017年通通都繼續通過評鑑都通過第二個你們在2024年 這個在2011、2017都評鑑通過 合格喔合格喔在2024年他要辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
606.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
632.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
這個評鑑2024年8月要辦理評鑑評鑑委員在上面清楚的寫出他的意見他說公安消防有缺失2024年的8月評鑑委員說公安消防有缺失結果呢當年10月就發生火災了就8條人命了但是呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
633.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
658.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
你們安消防有缺失有同時通報縣政府去解決去改善嗎有橫向聯繫嗎答案是沒有在8月的時候就說有缺失沒有通知縣政府不要說當時沒有到現在可能也沒有啦是不是沒有沒有啦評鑑的時候都是會統衛生局你有通知縣政府說裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
667.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
692.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
委員認為上面有公安消防的缺失衛生局他們不會知道你們的委員當時審查的意見所以在這個裡面依據你們醫院評鑑基準第1.5章安全的環境和設備裡面有講所以你們應將員工工作環境病人就醫環境的安全納入考量 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
693.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
713.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
在規劃院建築和相關硬體設施時就應該把這些納入考量而且要審視是不是符合法規的要求如果發現有違反相關的法定規定應立即改善然查上開基準欠缺呼應條文和查核的方式沒有將核心的公安事項列入評鑑指標當中你們沒有把 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
716.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
730.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
公安的核心指標列入評鑑指標制度顯有缺漏這不是我講的這個是監察院講的監察院又說你們的評鑑人員雖然有醫學公共衛生和管理的專業背景但是 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
731.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
759.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
在醫療設施設備安全評鑑時考評存在建築硬體配電器消防安全等缺漏醫院的評鑑人員如不具備建築公安消防等專業也沒有看到評鑑時要求受評的醫院要提供上開的證明文件通通都沒有辦法評鑑所以你們評鑑淪於紙上作業居多就公安公共安全上真的是沒有那個作用 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
761.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
789.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
那只有台北市衛生局在要求轄區醫院在考評的時候台北市政府會要求他們要提供醫院的建築出圖證明供衛生局現場集合我的意思是說地方政府人家有人這麼做那我現在在講喔監察院不是只有糾正地方政府也糾正了衛福部要求衛福部消防署國土署要檢討強化醫院的建築安全管理等等還有 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
790.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
816.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
他們現在到現在去年12月糾正到現在然後也明確指出了你們應該要修正評鑑制度請問你們衛福部到底修正了沒有好跟委員說明喔第一個在這個評鑑的時候呢那麼多另外有消防安檢那個是由地方的主管機關要去做檢核的就是聯合的概念我現在講的是監察院要求你們 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
818.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
831.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
監察院要求你們在評鑑的時候不是什麼都是由評鑑委員來評啦我現在在鑑主法規的合法消防安檢的部分本來就有地方的補管機關人家地方政府隨時就可以檢的啦我沒錯啦我現在問你的問題不是這個問題你答非所問你不要轉移焦點我問你的問題是你的評鑑委員在評鑑的時候就發現他有公安消防的疑慮你們沒有同時通報地方政府沒有啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
847.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
852.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
第二個監察院說你們在做醫院的評鑑的時候也要把公安的這個消防的這一些確保安全的這些項目要納入評鑑的機制裡面所以評鑑的基準有沒有納入核心的公安事項評鑑的委員的組成有沒有補到建築消防配電的這些專業 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
875.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
893.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
受評的醫院 如果沒有那些委員的話受評的醫院應備的文件有沒有增加建築 公安 消防等相關證明我問你是監察院都給你們糾正了 到現在四個月過去了這些通通改進了沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
894.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
901.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
在這個剛剛委員關心的就是我們的評鑑的報告給地方政府這個我們會做啦就是把它我們過去就是有給衛生局啦就是這個評鑑的結果報告會給衛生局作為它未來督導考核的查核項目之一啦所以這個部分橫向的部分我們做了不是啦你們的委員都發現有問題了一定要通報地方政府馬上進場去檢查如果2024年的8月 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
924.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
939.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
你們這麼做的話或許那10月發生的火災就不會有這8條人命的去無辜的傷亡跟我們說明就是說那個時間的落差是不是可以縮短一點我們是前車之鑑慘痛的經驗過去是最後評定完之後再把這個評鑑的結果報告會給衛生局 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
949.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
950.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
我現在不是在談個案而已我是從這個個案要跟你講制度而監察院都糾正了你們的制度全面性的改善了沒有就這麼簡單問你們全面性的制度改變了沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
964.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
980.139 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
第一個就是我們把這個報告早一點送 早一點送給地方不要等到那個評定完之後啦那第二個就是那個評鑑的標準裡面來優化把這些納進來 這個我們會再做你們評定完要多久才會評定完 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
982.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
991.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
通常你們評鑑要評定多久才會評定完怎麼會分批啦 不過大概都是評定完那個叫實地評鑑 你實地評鑑完要多久大概都會幾個月後才會決定會議我問你最具體的 為什麼我要問這個問題是因為你們2024年的8月去評鑑東港的安泰醫院 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
1005.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
1032.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
10月3號就發生大火 死了8個人然後呢 發現一半都是偽章建築那請問這樣子事情過了多久了從你8月評鑑 2024年評鑑到現在2026年的4月了已經過了幾個月了請問你安泰醫院的評鑑到底是合格還是不合格所以他當年沒有合格 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
1033.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
1048.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
就要重評我在你們的網頁上查詢不到啊就是還沒有2024年的8月你就去評鑑啊到現在你說他不合格還是合格來他就是要重評啊 他要重新評鑑啊什麼叫重新評鑑就是2024年那一年他沒有合格 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
1060.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
1071.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
你們對於人民知的權利真的是認為都不需要給我們嗎不合格然後不用讓我們知道嗎你說他不合格他的網頁說他合格耶那是之前吧他之前的話現在還可以掛在網頁上嗎他說他們合格耶來看你們的查詢系統 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
1089.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
1102.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
你們的醫院評鑑你去查詢都查不到不合格你只公佈合格那查不到不合格那人民是要知道他是還沒評鑑還是不合格嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
1105.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
1117.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
這個跟你們狼醫查詢系統都一樣在這裡虛晃一招你只公佈合格然後呢事實上還沒評鑑的也查不出來評鑑不合格的也查不出來你們的網頁連不合格的資訊都不公告蛤 這不用改進嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
1126.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
1134.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
我們過去當然只公告合格名單啦啊不合格不用公告給我們知道嗎他自己的意願說他合格你說他不合格如果沒有立委在這裡質詢你人民怎麼會知道他合格還是不合格 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
1145.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
1162.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
就是過去我們都是公告合格現在呢過去是這樣現在呢我們來演我們來演繹你評鑑這個要幹嘛不就讓人民知道哪些是合格哪些是不合格嗎你不合格不公告我人民怎麼知道這間是不合格還是不合格 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
1165.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
1179.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
這是包庇嘛 就是包庇嘛在你們的醫院評鑑專區網頁上東泰安泰醫院沒有任何敘述這種到底是 你說不合格還是合格不要講了啦 其實你們有改嘛其實你們公告了 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
1190.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
1202.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
在2024年10月安泰醫院大火以後以後你們修改了你們的醫院評鑑及教學醫院評鑑作業程序第11點 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
1204.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
1229.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
你們改了不知道是對醫院太好還是怎樣你們說放寬評鑑結果可以限期改善其實他為什麼他也不是合格也不是不合格安泰醫院現在不是合格也不是不合格經過了快要兩年了一年八個月了評鑑完到現在一年八個月了 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
1231.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
1244.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
到現在他不是合格也不是不合格因為你為他量身訂製了放寬放寬評鑑結果可以限期改善但這個限期是要限多久保定是要限多久 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
1247.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
1267.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
你們現在開放可以限期改善是要限期多久沒有啦你們可以把重大公安 病安事件納入評鑑但沒有明定一旦發生應停止或不予通過評鑑 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
1269.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
1295.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
一旦但你沒有明定一旦發生問題應該要停止或者是不予通過你就說可以給他限期改善你就允許他改善嘛所以你不會判定他合格還是不合格表面上你們是說新增了重大公安病安事件的處理規定實際上卻是把重大事件納入先改善再決定是否不合格的框架 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
1296.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
1318.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
你不是加嚴啦你有可能是在架空和弱化你的評鑑的及時把關的功能讓發生重大公安或病安事件的醫院仍然有機會可以透過限期改善維持評鑑結果把重大事件納入可補正程序卻沒有同步建立明確的評定暫停還有資訊揭露和對外標示的規則 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
1324.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
1348.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
導致問題的醫院得以停留在通過跟未通過之間的模糊地帶他是合格不合格還沒有判定的狀況所以現在安泰醫院一年八個月不是合格也不是不合格因為他發生了公安事件還在限期改善你們制度面我就問你你的限期改善沒有讓人民知道他現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
1350.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
1370.978 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
在限期改善階段你在合格不合格之間如果允許他限期改善那你也要讓人民知道這家醫院現在正在限期改善你也要在法規上明定限期改善最長的時間是多少沒有人這樣子一年八個月了還在限期改善的吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
1374.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
1390.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
你這個有三個層次的影響第一個層次對民眾知情權的不利 評鑑本來就讓我們知道他的醫療品質跟安全標準到底合格或不合格你現行的制度只有公佈合格不公佈不合格 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
1391.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
1418.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
然後發生 還修改你們的作業程序 評鑑作業程序你們允許他限期改善可是呢 你們對於發生事情裡面進入限期改善也沒有讓人民知道也沒有清楚公告目前法律跟評鑑狀態也沒有公告限期改善期間要多久民眾無法做出正確的判斷這間便宜有安全嗎 不知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
1419.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
1443.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
第二個對主管機關責任不利因為只要不知道他是合格不合格或是陷起改善狀況主管機關就持續用 尚在處理當中尚未評定來延後表態也不必立即公告不合格也不必立刻說明該醫院是否仍得對外宣稱自己具有某種評鑑資格 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
1445.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
1461.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
都不知道都是醫院自己說我合格了你們政府都不用說明第三個對醫院形成有利的模糊空間然後醫院就利用這一種空窗期主張我沒有不合格喔因為我還在限期改善喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
1462.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
1478.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
甚至還可以說我過去的平健光環或是社會的印象它還上面寫我合格所以對這種發生重大事件的醫院來講保留了很大的操作的空間所以現在怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
1479.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
1498.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
安泰醫院我現在問你安泰醫院他可以適用你們20他2024年評鑑不合格2025年你們修改了評鑑作業程序他現在可以適用你們2025年的評鑑程序然後給他限期改善嗎舉這個醫院來講是這樣子把我們說評鑑制度當 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
1506.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
1518.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
當裝飾嗎?他用2024年的評鑑然後你2025年修改規定他又2024年評鑑沒算 要用2025年的作業程序來重評給他機會 每間便宜都這樣你們的評鑑這是裝飾用的嗎?不對 這樣對不對? |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
1526.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
1547.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
這個限期改善的部分我們會再督促主管機關啦來啦你那主管單位在哪裡限期改善限期是限多久一年八個月還要限嗎限期你們沒想過你們的限期改善是多久嗎2024年8月評鑑到現在還在限期改善連合格不合格都沒有辦法判定他對外說他合格啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
1553.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
1558.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
到底你們現在是判定他合格還不合格還是在限期改善當中醫院評鑑合格是與否合格不合格他醫院自己說我合格你們網頁找不到也沒有公佈他們沒有違反他們這樣做他們沒有違反相關規定嗎我今天不是要跟他針對 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
1584.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
1596.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
安泰醫院這個個案 而是要問你監察院已經指出全國有81家像安泰醫院一樣的列管的 違建的醫院81家70家通過評鑑而這些狀況都有可能會跟安泰一樣有公安的疑慮而你們說他們評鑑合格 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
1611.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
1617.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
你到底要不要正面的去面對你們評鑑制度失靈的責任啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
1619.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
1647.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
然後再來 當你們2024年8月在評鑑安泰的時候評鑑委員已經在公文裡面寫下他的評鑑意見 寫下公安消防缺失沒有同時通報地方政府 地方政府不知道這樣的評鑑制度有預警功能嗎 沒有所以8月之後的10月發生大火 死了8條人命 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
1649.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
1676.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
再來當醫院發生重大公安或病安事件以後你現在修改你的評鑑作業程序評鑑結果沒有判定合格也沒有判定不合格就停留在長期停留在現期改善當中民眾的風險要依據什麼沒有資訊不知道任何狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
1678.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
1684.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
然後民眾無從判斷風險所以我們用這個個案來看你的制度 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
1686.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
1708.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
你立即公佈81家 你把資料給我們 81家列管的違建的醫院到底是哪81家 給我們知道然後你的醫院評鑑合格公告出來 不合格也一樣公告出來你的限期改善也要公告出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
1709.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
1738.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
然後你的制度面限期改善是限多久最多一個月兩個月三個月已經夠多了如果不行的話就是不合格不要這樣子安泰醫院已經限期一年八個月了一年八個月了所以在這種狀況裡面如果這樣拖下去你的評鑑制度形同虛設沒好處而且治病人的安全在高風險之下 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
1740.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
1761.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
這樣補聽有辦法嗎?這方面要改跟委員說明這個有關於這個國土署所給的這個名單我們都有列管然後再進行輔導 改善我要說監察院說的80億斤啦 明年大學給我們啦 可以對不對可以可以可以 那個名單其實是國土署給我們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
1762.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
1779.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
那你再搭配你們70家評鑑合格的一併勾出來網頁公開的網頁要改進有沒有問題你們的限期改善不能限到一年八個月還在限期可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
1780.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
1797.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
限期改善最長一個月兩個月三個月已經夠長了你們想想看還要拖多久啊限期改善可以一直限下去嗎從合格六年評鑑一次你現在已經評鑑一年八個月以前的評鑑到現在還沒有公告不合格這樣六年已經有兩年 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
1802.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
1807.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
都還在限期這個評鑑制度就沒好起來了這制度面都要改進啦好 謝謝 |