| IVOD_ID |
167954 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/167954 |
| 日期 |
2026-03-26 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-19-5 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
5 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-03-26T10:43:41+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-03-26T10:53:25+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:09:44 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/62ea4221ea272c4ea381a7d95e45f3501db4e8dc12ee02550f073324919e7b6e10ab85f957d34f9a5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
謝衣鳯 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:43:41 - 10:53:25 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-03-26T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請公平交易委員會代理主任委員列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
9.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[0].end |
13.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[0].text |
好 謝謝主席我想要請公平會的代理主委陳主委 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
22.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
32.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
陳主委早大家都問到了就是Grab的問題因為Uber有13.05還是13.05的股權當然從股權的角度來看它也沒有到整個完全擁有 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
43.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
66.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
那但是為什麼大家在討論他現在只有宣布而已我相信也還沒送你們公平會吧還沒還沒送嘛對不對可是未來會不會他未來如果真的就是說要實施併購的時候會不會送公平會需不需要根據什麼法律目前的情況看起來是一定要送 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
67.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
80.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
因為市佔率市佔率 對他們兩家加起來市佔率多少沒有 依照我們公平法的規定目前市佔率只要超過一定門檻就一定要進回來審查那目前這個foodpandafoodpanda已經超過了foodpanda超過了對對對 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
82.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
106.33 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
他已經超過四分之一了市佔率他已經超過四分之一了所以這個案子如果他們真的要進行購併的話一定要送到公平會來所以未來他一定要送公平會來審理那你公平會怎麼審查呢怎麼樣子來審查哪一條法律來確保我們消費者不會喪失選擇權嗎因為有可能如果Uber |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
107.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
124.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
你也知道嘛過去曾經Uber也想要併購Foodpanda結果沒有成功嘛那時候大家擔心的就是消費者喪失選擇權以及有可能導致的就是說聯合的這個外送的費用的問題那這要怎麼處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
126.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
138.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
這個我想跟我們上一個案子的整個的分析的架構是一樣的那剛剛委員提到的問題其實都是我們會審查的我們會去觀察結合以後那個市場結構的改變會不會導致這個結合後的事業有能力去漲價把價格抬得很高 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
140.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
164.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
那當然結合以後會不會讓兩大平台更有機會去進行聯合所以剛剛委員關切的議題其實都是我們審查時候會去注意的對我是說因為畢竟過去Uber就已經要併購Fupenda嘛那再加上現在Grab但是你也要必須要考慮喔因為現在他不是用Uber去併購Fupenda嘛他是用Grab那Grab他的 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
166.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
181.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
呃行為模式以及他的這個機制是不一樣的喔是不是他我看到他是他們呃的定價我在在新加坡的時候有用過Grab他們的定價會即便是相同的距離 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
182.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
202.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
也有可能是不同的價格他們根據的是GeoHash這樣子的系統然後把每一個地區變成一個小區塊然後按照小區塊的供需的這個模式來決定它定價的方式謝謝委員提醒像這種比較特殊的定價模式我們在分析過程裡面會納入考慮特別是在於 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
203.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
218.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
結合以後這個事業他有沒有能力任意去漲價這個地方定價的模式還有過去所在他也許他也許不是在就是說抽成上面或者是什麼可是他運用的反而是一個APP |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
219.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
243.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
他計算的方式以及他們演算時候所產生的這樣子的一個計價方式那你怎麼樣子去進行你們現在公平會裡面有沒有相關的專業可以去進行這個審查以及未來公平會怎麼樣子在審查的過程當中藉由會不會需要勞動部 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
245.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
269.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
或者是其他部會共同來聯合審查然後來確保我們外送就是外送員的相關的權利呢這個案子因為備受矚目所以我們一定會廣徵各方面的意見包含主管機關還包含業者包含消費者團體等等我們會綜合考慮那有一些技術面的東西我們可能更由不排除我們可能必須要專家學者的協調 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
270.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
297.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
這已經是更技術面了它不是從就是說契約上面來講這個外送員的就是說聯合的這個問題那它用不同的演算的方式會不會造成就是說變相的我們消費者就喪失了選擇權然後呢變相的我們的外送費用就增加了以及我們的外送員的勞動權益就受損了 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
299.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
320.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
是不是等案子送進來以後我們在分析過程當中委員所關切這個問題我們都會把它納入考慮當然剛剛如同我剛剛所講的有些技術性的問題我們是必須要依賴外面的協助所以像學者專家這個我們都會爭議所以你們要技術人員的協助嘛對不對有些比較技術性像數位演算法這些東西也許可能要一些專家學者來提供一些意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
320.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
344.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
好 還有另外一個問題就是如果Fupenda就是由我們所有消費者的這些消費行為跟金流的數據那未來GREP它不是在台灣而它是在一個就是境外在台灣是沒有實體總部的這樣子的一個情況下那我們怎麼樣進行 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
345.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
363.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
如果委員關切的是資料的隱私保護的部分這部分可能不是屬於公平會去處理的問題不是你們處理但是未來審查的時候會不會有介入共同來討論這一點我們會從競爭的觀點去看看他對隱私權保護的夠或不夠到底對市場競爭會產生什麼影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
364.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
380.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
所以你們不會直接去看說你接了以後你是不是對隱私權的保護就會比較鬆散所以這個東西可能還需要數位部或者是其他的相關部會共同來審查嘛 是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
381.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
400.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
如果未來我們所有人在福平島上面的數據而外流到因為那有可能是那個什麼GDP定位或者什麼什麼等等的相關的問題那如果未來外流到一個不是在台灣的實體公司的時候那怎麼樣處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
401.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
421.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
這個就剛剛跟委員報告隱私的保護我們大概就不會介入因為有其他的主管機關在處理那數據的部分其實跟競爭有可能會產生一些關係數據的使用數據的濫用來排斥競爭這個其實競爭法是可以來介入當然如果有這樣的事證的話我們也會介入去處理所以你們會就數據數據的濫用導致市場競爭的減損或限制我們如果有這種事證的話我們會介入調查好那 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
428.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
441.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
現在大家討論的就是行政院他宣誓下游不屯那你們說你們只是就聯合什麼樣子叫聯合因為一般的民眾認為當 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
443.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
472.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
這個塑膠袋的情況下那什麼樣子叫聯合什麼樣子只是暫時的囤積在這我相信你們參加了整個物價的這個穩定的你們都是在那個物價穩定平台裡面嘛是那怎麼樣子處理這一塊呢基本上那個平台是分工的啦我知道我們的角色主要就是聯合那當然什麼叫聯合聯合就是同業之間有某一種形式的合意集體的 譬如說集體拒絕出貨這個其實也是聯合行為 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
474.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
502.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
你覺得現在有沒有這樣的情況這個需要市政的調查那調查市政需要一點時間那需要多久因為有時候市政調查這個情況就是說消費者已經面臨到這個情況有點緩不濟急但是目前我們已經跟經濟部在密切的配合如果看他們盤查的結果那同時我們也在自己有進行市場的了解那如果初步的市政顯示似乎有聯合的情況出現的話我們就會立案調查所以現在你們還需要多少時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
503.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
510.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
因為這個事件剛我們現在目前正在了解當中你們需要多少時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
513.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
540.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
因為我們現在是調查資料中 還要等業者提供資料過來所以在目前很難給委員一個確確的對啊 因為人家美國說很快就那個中東衝突就結束了嘛你總不能在中東衝突結束前都沒有一個結果還是你們估計你們有內部的資料顯示中東的衝突是超過四到六個禮拜六到八個禮拜 是不是六個月以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
540.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
547.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
我會盡快啦所以你們可以慢慢做不會慢慢做啦我們一定積極地去調查那什麼時候給給大家一個交代盡量在四個月內可以嘛四個月內做個調查應該要早一點吧四個月內說不定戰爭都結束了因為有時候跟業者要資料他回來我們要研析而且最重要的是說我們要經過委員會還要有委員會的討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
570.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
581.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
你至少要三個月吧好不好三個月這沒有很勉強啦三個月沒有很勉強啦我們盡量朝三個月來做了好 |