| IVOD_ID |
167869 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/167869 |
| 日期 |
2026-03-25 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-5-20-5 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第5會期財政委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
5 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
5 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第5會期財政委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-03-25T10:54:32+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-03-25T11:05:12+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:40 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/755992caaad3baae8636f76ff386d9d05b6789160e7ad0a44b8922a2b60b811d85b58d3d4fa10b1e5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
吳秉叡 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:54:32 - 11:05:12 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-03-25T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第5會期財政委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請財政部莊部長翠雲率所屬機關首長暨國營事業董事長、總經理(含各轉投資事業機構公股代表之董、監事)列席業務報告，並備質詢。
【3月25日及26日二天一次會】） |
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主席麻煩請財政部專部長好有請專部長委員好部長早今天大家關心的那個關於國票金控的問題那我看到有很多人的發言都是根據媒體的報導或是一方面的說法那我要提醒你你的實力原則是應該的 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
36.115 |
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這個在馬英九總統當政的時代就發生過這個公家去取得比較多的張萬陽的股份然後在市場上最後張萬陽歸由公家這邊來指定總經理跟董事長的這個事情這個事情有前例嘛你記得嗎你的麥克風要開啊是所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
64.99 |
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85.749 |
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同樣的狀況啦當時怎麼不講說國進民退呢當時還是立法院的財政委會一致的要求啊說你取得比較多的股份當然你要有經營權啊所以這個實例原則如果今天在國會令上面也用的話那就是一致的標準一致的標準就是我的股份比較多 |
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那當然就我來選拔這個經營者但是當然站在公股的立場選拔經營者當然是要選拔優秀專業的來去進行他的業務嘛對不對 |
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101.082 |
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125.253 |
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沒有錯 是的另外剛剛可能也有一些人有一些誤解說某一家民股9.9%另外一家民股9.9%另外一家民股9.9%如果大家都三十可是他忘記一點了並不是所有的股份都會來參與開會股東會的提名跟這個票選不是你實體的股數是要怎麼歸附這個郭票卿是 |
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是這個股票上市公司啊然後依照現在的這個證券交易還有這個相關的這個法律來辦理啊所以並不是所有的股份全部都會出席股東會嘛那當然要以出席的表決權數作為依據啦但是你想想看我現在要跟你講一個我個人關注的點跟他們不一樣就是你既然掌握大部分的股數 |
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155.222 |
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你這個改選只許成功不許失敗15個董事組成董事會公股至少要掌握巴西能不能在這邊承諾我想我們會根據這個股權的實力往這個目標前進因為你掌握巴西之後你才能夠確實的 |
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203.961 |
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掌控這個董事會你想想如果民股就算他們分了好幾個四五個三四個都不要緊他們加起來如果有八席變成公股只有七席的話有可能民股大集合之後他就可以把你公股的這個經營者這邊把你推翻掉所以我是說國庫署這些外面的業務承擔的這個責任都要勇敢承擔起來如果你確實要用實力原則 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
205.558 |
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225.492 |
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那這個其實法律有保護你 為什麼因為個別的股東要買到9.9%為什麼要只能9.9% 因為超過10%要經過金管會核准金控的股份這是一個特許行業這個不是一般的這個公司所以如果有一般的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
228.041 |
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253.871 |
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想要參與的人他買到要超過10%必須金管會核准嘛所以才會有幾家名股都是9點多的這樣的狀況嘛對不對是的所以我現在跟你講說我關注的點是既然政府真的是要去拿下來那你就必須要選上八席的董事齁這個任務如果失敗的話齁那國庫署是是沒有辦法立足的咧你了解我說的這個事情嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
257.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
279.118 |
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因為剛剛很多委員都提到說這個關於20萬以上的特殊過去有一些特別的行業攤攤水水啊 湯商啊這些如果在20萬以上也可以免開統一發票如果經過核准之後他可以省定1%的營業稅對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
281.701 |
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306.435 |
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沒有錯,就是20萬以下,而且他鼓勵我們請他導入行動支付所有的行業未滿20萬的都可以申請不用開立?是,20萬以下都是的20萬以下都可以免用統計發票?對都是用核定的嗎?用查定的消費一趴那超過20萬以前有一些會免,現在那些會免要減少,是不是這樣的關係? |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
308.113 |
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330.44 |
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超過20萬的部分我們當然原則上要開但是對於像這種大眾化的還有小規模營養它如果能夠導入行動支付跟Kiask來做的話我們是希望我們朝這個路上走所以在這個輔導期間讓他們可以一樣用1%來計算營業所以這個是一個方寬的三年所以就是說如果我舉個例子有一家 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
332.721 |
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356.361 |
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這個過去是在惠美的他是做飲食的或是做你剛剛講的湯湯水水我也不知道湯湯水水的定義是什麼啦做飲食的好那本來他是用查定稅額就算他每個月他是超過20萬的營業額但是現在問題是你給他惠美期限只有3年所以他當他導入行動支付之後他有3年期間是用1% |
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358.887 |
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364.078 |
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過了三點之後它就要變成音樂碎片5%所以這樣子的右翼你用得夠嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
365.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
393.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
我想這個部分我們會在期限屆滿之前再來做通盤的一個檢討考量因為你在說明這個政策的時候一開始沒有講得很清楚或是有人就是去做不同的解讀現在在台灣施政很困難你知道嗎因為每一個人資訊很發達他如果解讀錯誤他把你散播出去就會造成你很大的問題所以又再加上現在的傳播都是注重標題 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
395.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
418.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
所以你的實質內容講得很細的時候看的人也不多了所以常常就會以訛傳訛會引起摸到的困擾但是我是講根本的問題在這個地方你用這個電子支付做誘因但是你的後面期只有三年這些人如果考慮說我要做的生意是長長久久 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
419.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
440.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
我本來是一趴啊我就繼續一趴就好了啊我用這個行動支付之後我只有三年能一趴過了三年因為我行動支付我的營業額多少你就清清楚楚了嘛如果他全部用電子支付電子支付最大的好處就是營業額多少你財政部是很清楚的嘛啊那三年之後他就沒有辦法再 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
441.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
448.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
去走一趴這一條路啊這個問題的根源我個人認為可能是出在這地啊不知道你的看法怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
450.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
474.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
委員確實是知道說問題有在這而且用行動支付再一趴其實也是不是今年才開始之前就有那這一次也是延長而且放寬這些規定那我想整個來說未來我們還是會在期限屆滿整個來看這個導入行動支付的一個狀況實施的一個期限還有我們要考量民眾有時候在消費上他希望拿到發票他要來對講這個我們都要做整體的一個評估 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
476.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
495.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
當然這都是考慮的因素但是另外同仁們在講的那個事情也是一個問題因為你的金額是20萬已經很多年三四十年都沒有調整所以你那個基增成本如果你老實講你如果要真正對這方面認真的查核基增成本是非常的高 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
497.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
507.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
以前的做法是這樣一個算物人員在那邊算說你每天來消費的人有多少那每一個人平均消費額是多少然後用這樣子抽樣來去累計來去統計 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
513.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
530.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
這個現在的工商業這麼發達我們國家負擔不起這樣的基金成本這個成本非常的高所以我是覺得事實上應該是可以考慮說那是不是金額稍微拉高那拉高之後大家就自然知道說 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
533.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
545.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
這個生意這麼好的不可能是在這個規模之下你的基增相對你就是邊際的那邊就可以比較不用那麼的細緻這樣你的基增人們可以降低有沒有可能考慮這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
546.445 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
576.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
那建議我們可以納入因為你規定訂好了之後如果你沒有辦法執行的話反而是使得大家就有那種心理說那我不要守法啊我看到別人沒有守法我就跟著想要不要守法我可以省點錢啊會引起這樣子的誘因你知道嗎所以如果你把這個標準稍微拉高我舉個例子說你每個月是40萬30萬40萬拉高到這個標準那他的營業就已經相當高了那 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
578.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
604.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
營業的人獲利他也比較願意繳這5%的這個營業這個交易稅嘛那另外一個原因是你剛剛講的那種店小吃店賣冰的幹嘛他們的原料來源喔可能沒有辦法給他進向所以他沒有進向憑證所以他報了營業稅之後等於是他自己要吸收他沒有辦法再往下去 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
606.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
628.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
去往回推去把它這個用鏡像憑證去把它的稅額給扣抵掉所以要考慮這個東西所以我覺得同仁的建議也不是沒有道理因為你在小吃店如果我要付標五八零月稅跟現在不成比例的話它的誘因會減少而且它很多的原物料它的鏡像成本沒辦法扣抵所以這部分要重頭考慮好不好好 謝謝你 加油好 謝謝哲偉 |