| IVOD_ID |
167238 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/167238 |
| 日期 |
2026-01-26 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-35-28 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
28 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
35 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
外交及國防委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第28次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-01-26T10:44:17+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-01-26T10:54:48+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:31 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/eb9c45f2fd6188102eb0cbff62024e4c784d0199fe87f28a53e5fca86ad1f1aba5ee903531ddfe835ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
賴士葆 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:44:17 - 10:54:48 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-01-26T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第28次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國防部部長顧立雄報告「我國武器採購策略暨國防預算(公務、基金暨特別預算)編列結構之適切性」，併請經濟部、國家發展委員會、國家科學及技術委員會列席，並備質詢。） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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謝謝主席以及各位先進有請國防部的顧部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
12.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
28.797 |
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是 賴委員我請教部長 你剛才你對我已經否認了就是說台美要成立聯合火力協調中心外面感覺就是美軍要來兼軍你說絕對不是兼軍可是你們還內部高掛一個電子鐘倒數2027年的1月1日就是說老共要打台灣就掛在那裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
39.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
47.767 |
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而且美方的智庫宣稱 中共有人歷來打台灣在那個時候可是 人家知道 另外的智庫說不會打台灣2027我們現在看起來的感覺就是 都在政府說的啊現在為了一定澳洲 就說很緊張的2027要打啦所以你看啦 我要成立聯合火力協調中心啦然後另外一方面 賴清德總統會想說我選舉的時候 只有我當選 兩岸最和平 不會戰爭 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
69.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
88.226 |
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就是都知道你說的對了你要不要對這個事情這個來講一下你這個是不是準備打仗了2027年1月1日倒數你這個聯合協調中心即便美軍不是建軍好了但是是不是你掛在那裡就準備這一天要打仗是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
89.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
110.015 |
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跟委員報告我想我們要以2027作為我們有一個高戰備的能力這是我們國軍的一個目標那這個跟來研判說中共是不是一定會在2027年對我們採取前面入侵的這些軍事行動我想不必然有等號的關係但是無論如何我們都要 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
111.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
128.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
以為就是說我們透過不斷的這個實戰化的訓練所以等於戰備準備說我準備你那天來打你不打最好是這個意思我們一定要形成嚇阻我們一定要形成嚇阻嘛2027那就明年1月1日喔 剩不到一年喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
128.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
133.797 |
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時間蠻緊湊的我想2027年是一個點但是不會是2027年之後我們就不需要去籌購新式的武器也不需要去維持這個高戰備能力我們2027年我們有一個這樣子的一個要形成高戰備的能力但這樣的高戰備能力我們從這個點來看呢事實上還有待進一步提升的地方我們會持續來進進 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
157.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
159.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
你剛才提到高戰備人力高戰備人力有沒有包括類似以色列的那種所謂的鐵穹系統 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
178.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
208.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
我想我們已經在對外在說明就是說台灣之盾就是鐵球沒有我想每一個的系統不能夠做完全等號的類比但是我們要發展一個我們的台灣之盾來形成一個多層次的一個防禦在防空的部分這個是我們努力的方向防空很重要啦空戰很重要請問那個已經講很久了 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
209.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
231.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
F16V到底今年可不可以交捐F16V我想這個是不是請空軍來回答今年能不能交捐目前是正在進行非策的階段這要看整個非策的結果如果順利呢順利的話今年當然可以交捐今年什麼時候第一季 第二季 第三季 第四季還是要看它整個測試的進度 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
232.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
258.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
我看去年的報導是說今年的第三季最有可能我們叫Most likely 最有可能今年第三季如果說進度都正常的話那我們希望在今年第三季能夠交幾架這個都還沒辦法確定不是交66吧66架這個基本上是不太可能不太可能 40架咧這個我沒辦法去做一個預測交一半種可以吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
260.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
269.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
投這麼久了所以說他出來的時間跟他後續的產能這個是有直接相關所以目前所以你一估只加一價 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
271.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
295.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
我想這樣的委員就是說我們現在在進行各項的一個測試他第一架測試如果完成以後以之後的測試應該就會比較簡單那在線的組裝也有幾十架我上次已經報告有56架所以我們預期今年如果測試順利的話我們會有相應的數量來獲得交付那我們現在沒有辦法跟委員確定到底有多 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
295.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
299.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
你剛才講我就幫你解讀我聽你講你剛講的意思就是只要那第一架測試成功大概就有56架第三季膠是不是這樣子可以這樣解讀嗎我沒有辦法說最樂觀最樂觀就會有56架的一個膠糊我只能夠說我這桌球給你了你不敢接最樂觀啊也不要你 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
314.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
318.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
我們希望推估就是說如果完成首次的飛行那麼繼續按計畫來執行飛車的作業之後呢順利的這個進行的話呢會在這個115年會有這個飛機飛返那因為大家在飛機飛返之前他還會有相關的一些在美的訓練的項目這樣子所以還是要拖一陣子啦可能要到明年去啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
340.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
352.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
那個你的 再一次大家討論的1.25兆特別預算現在確定的是美國要均售我們3500億我們在國內買3000億我這種講法對吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
359.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
382.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
那個數字可能有點問題那個3千5百是含了美國啊美國 三個我們公務預算的案子也就是保修那個案子軍購五項裡面大概是2千9百億左右我們算零頭啦 零頭不要3千億 美國3千億是不是跟委員報告 因為我們在上個禮拜已經做了機密專報全部的內容都在那個機密專報裡面沒有 我現在從不機密的角度嘛我們今天公開的大家想知道啊 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
386.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
398.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
因為我為什麼提這個東西那我就問你一個很籠統的你一定這個打都不會有心理壓力的1.25兆是不是都是武器的採購是不是不是1.25兆裡面它區分成 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
405.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
422.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
那個七類然後七類裡面其中第六項的部分是提升整體軍備量能的部分它就有包含採購武器彈藥跟籌建我們的軍備產能以及提升我們的主角能量有沒有包括 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
423.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
448.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
operating under maintenance的錢 有沒有維修費用 有沒有報告委員 作業維持費的這個部分有沒有 有沒有我們有 在軍購以及商購的案子裡面我們都會納到初期備份料件跟接裝等相關的支出那後續等到案子執行之後我們會納入年度公務預算裡面來編列作業費跟訓練費 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
449.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
475.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
不要忘了 大家都知道我們最喜歡講Life Cycle叫做壽期 壽命的壽期間Life Cycle Cost那麼事實上 除了武器採購還要後續的維修費用作業維護費用都要加進來那個大概是 我查了一下大概是一到兩倍 這個錢你們沒有算進來包委員 這個應該 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
479.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
505.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
比一到兩倍這種數字要複雜得多我們舉例來說彈藥類的東西他只有在後續的時候不不不我講那大武器啦比如說F16V啦或者比如說這個海馬仕啦之類的啦大武器的部分您舉到海馬仕的部分海馬仕的部分如果是以我們目前我們的規劃十年期做一次性能提升二十年期做一次延壽的話如果是按照這個規劃基本上是處於1.25到1.33左右 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
507.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
533.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
好但是如果是像戰機這種項目他就會稍微高一點所以每個項目他都不同那這個錢也變在哪裡對這個我們在這個錢要變到哪裡我問你啊特別預算還是年度預算就是問題是個年度預算年度預算跟委員報告他剛剛站規師已經說明了軍事投資的這個部分都會有新增的就新增武器的裝備會有一個初次備份料增跟接裝訓練那在這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
536.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
546.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
武器裝備部署之後 維保跟訓練所需就會放在這個作業維持會裡面兩個會做一個無縫的接軌這樣也就是說假如我們買的跟美國買3000億跟台灣自己買3000億如果加起來6000億事實上不止啦你們講的不止啦可能其他的6000億可能是商售或什麼之類的 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
560.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
569.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
我們就用以保守六千億可能你們還是要編六千億的預算這個作為維護費用啊如果十年一年就六百億啊就加進來啦 我這樣講對不對報告委員您看到我們剛剛知會國會的裡面我們有很多是彈藥的 像托式 標槍那個金額很少啦那個金額很少啦 你不要講他老是講彈藥我要跟你講是大武器的啦 報告老新式武器有他的作為維持委的需求 那我們就 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
589.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
603.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
新式武器進來之後那些不合時宜的這個舊的武器會把它汰除因此也會減少這部分的作業維持費這個就是以新換舊的情況之下作業維持費會做一個適當的調整我就是要強調1.25兆不是1.25兆ONLY要乘以2其他的1.25兆是放在年度預算不管你分攤10年或者20年基本上是各年都要分攤的我要強調這一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
617.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
624.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
像我們海馬市的話就會提到一些舊市的這些泡的裝備那這些裝備的作業維持會因此就可以減少嗎1.3倍 1.5倍有的到2倍都有 |