| IVOD_ID |
167151 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/167151 |
| 日期 |
2026-01-19 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-26-20 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
20 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-01-19T10:48:25+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-01-19T11:14:33+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:26:08 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/4ba512932926f851ee7d710c670b7826e1f8a6d37bdd8b89247638a9beb78aabe845366a77bfd4645ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
林淑芬 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:48:25 - 11:14:33 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-01-19T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第20次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查(一) 行政院函請審議「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。(二) 委員羅廷瑋等20人擬具「藥事法第五十五條條文修正草案」案。(三) 委員羅廷瑋等17人擬具「藥事法第二十七條之二、第四十八條之二及第九十六條之一條文修正草案」案。(四) 委員徐欣瑩等20人擬具「藥事法第八十條及第九十四條條文修正草案」案。(五) 委員劉建國等16人擬具「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。(六) 委員王正旭等20人擬具「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。(七) 委員林月琴等18人擬具「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。(八) 委員郭昱晴等16人擬具「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。(九) 委員王鴻薇等18人擬具「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。(十) 委員邱鎮軍等20人擬具「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。(十一) 委員林倩綺等18人擬具「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。(十二) 委員陳菁徽等16人擬具「藥事法部分條文修正草案」案。二、審查(一) 行政院函請審議「藥害救濟法第三條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。(二) 委員羅廷瑋等16人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條條文修正草案」案。(三) 委員劉建國等16人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。(四) 委員王正旭等19人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。(五) 委員林月琴等18人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條條文修正草案」案。(六) 委員郭昱晴等16人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。(七) 委員王鴻薇等18人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。」(八) 委員邱鎮軍等19人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。(九) 委員林倩綺等18人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條及第二十八條條文修正草案」案。(十) 委員翁曉玲等17人擬具「藥害救濟法第三條條文修正草案」案。【第一（十一）及二（九）案，如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書，則不予審查；第一（十二）及二（十）案，如未經院會交付本會審查或未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書，則不予審查】【綜合詢答】） |
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好 謝謝主席我是不是好 先請我們次長有請次長委員長次長早我上個禮拜質詢就是上週五上個 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
32.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
61.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
就是上上禮拜吧上上禮拜這個中榮發生廠商進手術室帶刀事件那你們調查報告應該已經出來了你可不可以稍微簡單說一下報告委員其實台中榮總這一邊台中榮總他們在1月15給我們的調查結果就是確認醫師有違規讓廠商進入手術室的管制區域那目前中榮是給予行政懲處我現在問你是他有沒有帶刀 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
62.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
80.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
蛤有沒有帶醫師操刀操作手術我們在目前他對外的那個資訊看起來是有一些疑慮那但是莊榮給你們的報告你們就全部都沒有報告員今天我們包含醫師是已經直接要到台中榮總區一起進行調查你們醫師師師長喔呃 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
84.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
101.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
可能是有失公允他在上個禮拜五1月16他說中榮已經提出調查報告確認有三名醫師未依規定完成報備程序違規放行草上進入手術室他直接已經定義你們的司長 劉悅平 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
102.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
103.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
他直接說 OK |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
118.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
132.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
劉悅平這樣說是根據中榮報告就算了但是人家媒體接著問問你劉悅平說這個懲處是不是過輕因為只有申戒一次 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
133.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
150.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
然後你們劉悅平答覆中榮對於三名涉案醫師各寄生借一次屬人事處分醫生都是資優生對醫師來說被寄生借甚丟臉的事情尤其是科部主管影響其實不小 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
153.508 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
164.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
你那個劉悅平 劉司長沒有客觀公正沒有扮演起目的事業主管機關的職責然後說這樣的處分已經是影響很大了報告委員其實我們現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
168.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
186.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
現在最新的資訊也跟委員這邊做個報告就是說部長這邊已經先要求健保署去調查因為如果這個過程中牽涉到這個醫師這邊的健保申請那如果不是醫師自己親自做這樣的相關執行手術的動作的話那健保這邊會有一些相關的追回跟懲處 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
187.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
207.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
你知道嗎 次長你這樣子輕輕的講過去 但是我要告訴你啊你們上個禮拜五 中榮報告丟出來你們劉悅平這樣講以後 人家就有影像已經在媒體揭露了你們的影像看起來 大家都覺得說 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
209.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
236.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
沒有預期會有人敢檢舉所以你們當時就認為說大概沒有具體證據下本來是要持續否認後來人家把影像丟到媒體曝光以後然後相關說法才隨著影像逐步出現而被迫修正就像擠牙膏一般被動而且消極看起來就是這樣子 來 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
238.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
265.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
知新聞講的這些神經外科主任鄭文玉不但沒有穿著手術服沒有戴滅菌手套雙手還抱在胸前而持刀的竟然就是這個被爆料的陳姓一財商所以我就說嘛大家都知道只有衛福部不知道還有躺在那裡的病人不知道人家檢舉了 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
269.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
285.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
還繼續隱瞞如果影片沒有出來劉悅平還繼續幫中榮幫醫生袒護所以人家質疑你 劉悅平依依相護啊人家質疑你們並沒有解決問題從制度面 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
287.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
312.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
去好好這個整頓的決心啊報告委員其實部長也提到了就是說半年內我們會提出相關的這一個共同的一個指引部長因為各個除了指引以外部長還指導你們還要做什麼包含就剛剛提到的這邊第一個是健保這邊去做調查第二個部分就是說如果這邊有違反相關的法律的話那全部都要依照法律來做調查僅此於此嗎現在的法律規定足夠嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
317.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
334.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
我已經諮詢過他了醫師法第28條密醫行為是有刑責的他們都不在乎欸市長房間裡面的大象大家都看得一清二楚醫界也有人出來說護理界有人出來說 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
335.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
360.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
醫材界有人出來說 連這個醫院都有人出來說大家都知道 看得一清二楚房間裡面的大象 現在你們告訴我們說訂指引 立委給他們指引過立委跟他們說第一要件是什麼因為現場在座的參與的 每個人都是共同炸七飯共同炸七飯檢舉的人也有刑責 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
362.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
390.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
檢舉的人 具體的人 具名的人也有刑責所以我已經講了法律就不怕 你頂指引要從下 指引不夠所以要頂這個吹哨者保護的機制要讓吹哨者可以從刑事責任裡面豁免出去所以你去頂相關指引要配套配套就是要有吹哨者保護的機制而你們在這裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
393.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
420.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
聽你們一直在講 定指引 定指引這樣沒有檢舉就沒事了現在是怎樣 人力短缺所以都叫醫材上去帶刀那個不是人力短缺的問題那是長期以來那個其實這樣講就是說有一些比較特殊新的醫材我們也理解他可能在醫師這邊操作上需要一些協助但是我們還是要再一次澄清廠商不可以站到table上去在病人身上執行相關的業務 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
422.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
442.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
那你告訴我那你告訴我你覺得哪些帶刀的科別集中在哪些科別就是這些科別目前來講啦就是說這些新興的器械我們包含這一次神經外科那我們接下來可能還包含骨科等等這些我們都要進行一些調查眼科有沒有 眼科有沒有委員這邊有相關的資訊的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
448.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
475.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
怎麼會這樣子呢你去看我的youtube人家都來留言啦所以哪些醫材因為器械很新甚至醫材的業務帶刀操作的比你們的醫生還要更賢手手術做的可能也可能更好就算這樣也不行也不亞裔就算這樣也不行你知道嗎他再厲害都不行那我現在要告訴你你們的醫生不用精進嗎新的手術刀法不用精進嗎你新的醫材不用練習嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
476.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
486.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
那誰要當這個獸數的實驗的人其實相關的某些程序事實上有的是用模具可以事先做一些處理啦那當然不是全部啦你們有規範嗎有規範嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
490.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
508.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
大排的醫生 新的 小的 細節 他們也不要餓啊就在這裡 叫醫材上來做這種簡單的沒有檢舉就沒事檢舉之後 醫生都說我自己做的現場大家都共同炸七飯 不敢出來那你的吹哨子保護機制在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
510.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
529.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
我記得其實去年吹哨者相關的法規已經過了刑責他沒有包含這個啦免刑責你告訴我吹哨者保護機制去年的法律哪一條可以適用哪一條我其實現在在調查裡面我們是沒有去追究到底是誰來提供這些影片啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
531.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
545.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
你的腦袋轉不過去當事人如果知道他就馬上去提告馬上都是共同詐欺犯而且一年以上的是完全不能交保的不能緩刑的非坐牢不可的 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
547.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
573.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
這很重的罪耶但是就很多人還在做啊因為沒在怕啊大家都涉案在裡面欸 奇怪人家麻醉科醫師護理師跟他沒有相關 他也沒拿到錢但是已經被迫要參與在裡面共同詐欺我們不會認定他們有這樣的行為啦那不是你不認定 刑法的認定主責機關是你嗎你是檢察官嗎 你是法官嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
574.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
597.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
共同詐欺 這個就是共同詐欺 構成要件就是這樣子而且以中融為例 2017年他們院內第三次手術室管理會議中就已經明確的決議 開會已經決定絕對禁止廠商刷手跟刀或碰觸病人傷口及身體 而且絕對禁止手術進行 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
598.65 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
613.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
由這個業務來帶刀這種規範在中榮2017年就定了內容很明確那為什麼2023年還發生這麼離譜的事這件事情我們請中榮的院長這要趕快去查清楚所以次長 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
615.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
629.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
這個不是規定的問題嘛不是有沒有規定的問題是制度內執行還有內部管理失靈還有長期中央主管機關放任不查所以這個問題是 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
631.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
647.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
醫院本身的管理和內控機制都沒有發揮作用啊中央主管機關你未來到底要怎麼監督和介入啊難道只能停留在繼續被動的等醫院回報相信醫師自律嗎你們的劉悅平就是這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
648.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
673.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
土法不足以自行 有行者的都沒在怕所以這不是法治面而已 這有執行面困難的地方你們劉悅平講這個話 就是一一相護所以更令人憂心的是 劉悅平還可以講說醫生從小到大都是資優生 被寄生界很丟臉 當前提 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
674.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
693.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
你就形同玉色了醫生群體不會也不可能發生違法行為那麼你的主管機關都這樣講了那我們只能夠 病人只能夠選擇相信嗎那請問制度面監督病人的權益是誰要來承擔啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
694.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
701.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
這不是法治面的問題執行面你們自己部內已經這種態度了劉悅平這種態度我們可不可以信任你 要改革 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
707.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
733.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
吹哨者保護機制我們這個案子因為媒體一揭露其實我們就已經請鐘榮的院長你們就個案處理但這不是個案你去看我的youtube下面人家具體台南某個醫院某某某個醫院人家都講了都有人出來吹哨了所以歡迎來跟我們檢舉 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
736.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
757.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
檢舉的人有刑責伺候我檢舉我自己是共同詐欺犯要怎麼檢舉你有給人家吹哨子保護免刑責的機制嗎你告訴我有沒有你說歡迎大家來檢舉檢舉的人馬上共同詐欺的共犯委員您剛剛說刑責不是我說的 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
758.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
776.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
對啊 那你有免除人家的刑責嗎你有提出修法案嗎你有在醫師法裡面明文規定可以吹哨者免除刑責嗎你要修法捏 你講到事不關己你這種態度還能笑我覺得這正經事欸 很嚴肅欸 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
779.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
803.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
你還能夠覺得說不用修法不是委員剛剛是您說我不能刑責不是我講了算啊你說沒有刑責你們不會認定是刑責就不是你認定了你這憑什麼認定你有沒有責任你要修法在醫師法裡面把檢舉人免除刑責放到法律裡面來你現在推薦你的責任 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
804.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
814.322 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
你沒有權利 你說我要認定他們沒有刑責 你沒有這個權利當你有責任的時候 你要去修醫師法的時候 你就說我沒有權利 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
817.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
839.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
不是這樣子的態度啦不是這樣啦你劉月平那個態度可以嗎你說說看你說說看劉月平的態度可以嗎委員我們這個案子我們全力來調查這不是這個案子你老是說個案這個案子他是全台灣全面性的全面性的骨科神經外科眼科脊髓外科 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
844.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
856.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
全面性的每個醫院很多都被人家講出來他不是一個醫院不是只有中榮你到底要怎麼解決 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
858.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
880.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
指導原則能做什麼違反指導原則會怎麼樣你要定一個指導原則違反指導原則會怎麼樣那委員剛剛提到他這裡面有些部分他會牽涉到對於我們健保那邊事實上是有違法的那剛剛提到醫師法以及密醫法這邊目前的法律當然都可以先處理當然委員如果提到要修法我們也尊重委員的評估你不認為應該要修法你不認為應該要解決這個問題嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
883.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
890.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
這要解決這個問題你要怎麼解決定一個指導原則有法律有刑責他都不怕了那你的指導原則要做什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
895.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
923.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
我覺得很訝異啊次長你這種態度我想這個問題不會解決因為你宣示了一個跟劉月平一模一樣的態度因為我剛剛講掉了醫生絕對不會違法醫生都是自由生這裡都有相關的法律醫生被寄生件很丟臉所以醫生絕對不會違法現在醫生很多都在違法當中而且還把麻醉科醫師把無辜的護理師都牽扯拉進來 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
924.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
940.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
他們何其無辜 其實很多業代也不願意當密醫而你制度面沒有保護這群人你們更是制度面忽略了病人該享有的保護的他有 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
942.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
953.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
廠商本來就不可以在病人身上指導現在就在病人身上指導所以我們要相關 後續調查之後要相關的排查不是一件 不是只有這個個案你剛才說消尾嘛好我們請回 跟你說不好我繼續問我們是要數有請江署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
964.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
984.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
署長 上週五發生寶城興業有限公司豐原國際企業有限公司涉嫌從2024年起從國外輸入成本低廉的橄欖油破然後以日本一番頂級橄欖油的名義對外販售給下游廠商依照地檢署 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
985.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
999.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
還有你們的說法就這樣子你們主動告發然後地檢署說他們違反食安法第15條第1項第7款摻尾和假冒我請問你他們摻了什麼東西假冒了什麼東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
1002.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
1021.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
這個油品呢 他是用所謂感染破油摻了一個東西 摻了叫做同業綠素他們確定有加同業綠素嗎對 在查的過程當中我現在問你 因為你的新聞稿都沒有 你不要在這裡說謊喔新聞稿完全沒有描述他們摻了同業綠素 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
1023.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
1042.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
這邊委員特別詢問我特別因為還在偵辦當中我們自己驗的實驗室驗的我們是有驗到的同業律師所以跟你們去跟委員做進一步報告在確定之下呢感染破油是有這樣子的油品在CNS4837號的標準使用不要講CNS你的法規不應該要用經濟部的CNS標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
1048.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
1061.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
你的法律應該是你們的食品的品名標示標準要定規範我今天要講的如果他沒有加同業率數如果沒有的話請問他有違法嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
1064.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
1090.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
報告委員 他沒有加同業綠素但是假如他直接寫 他是所謂的精緻的所謂的出炸油 這個就是違法現在是在說什麼啦你們大夫職責就在這裡因為如果他沒有加同業綠素他從國外進口感染破油然後他說我這是頂級的感染油如果其他的廠商這樣做 有沒有違法 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
1091.112 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
1115.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
有 他違反什麼法他在這個過程當中呢並不是他確確的所謂的原來的所謂的頂級出炸的感染油他沒有寫出炸 他寫頂級感染油即便他寫這個頂級感染油請問他違反什麼法因為市售感染油的你不要在這裡胡說八道我現在在這裡就跟你講 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
1117.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
1140.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
你的法律不應該講國家標準CNS因為那是沒有強制性那只是參考用的沒有法律的強制性而你現在就是食品安全衛生管理法的施行細則第七條第一項第二款因為你沒有制定 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
1142.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
1163.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
橄欖油的品名標示標準你沒有所以要用你的施行記者第一條第七條第一項第二款他說經中央主管機關規定者要依中央主管機關規定的名稱但是從假油事件到現在你們通通都沒有制定 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
1164.815 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
1191.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
什麼叫做感染有這個名稱那根據你們的施行細則沒有規定者得使用中華民國國家標準鎖定的名稱或是自定其名稱自定其名稱沒有強制性喔謝謝委員 委員其實非常精準的把食安法的施行細則第七條裡面多了跟我們做一些說明上面寫得不是因 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
1192.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
1202.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
他可以自己定名稱我把感染破友定成頂級感染友請問有沒有違規違法 沒有 沒有那你們做了什麼你們應該做什麼 署長你告訴我 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
1211.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
1231.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
如果你把什麼叫做感染油你的品名標示標準的法律訂出來今天他這麼做就直接違法了從2013年的假油事件 假感染油事件到現在2026年了 14年了 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
1234.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
1262.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
我們看到2016年曾經衛福部食藥署說感染油要比照聯合國分五級你後年上路就是2018年要上路曾經到現在經過14年你們獨指你們不敢訂出什麼叫做感染油因為沒有訂出品名的標示標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
1263.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
1286.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
所以業者把感染破由如果沒有添加非法的添加物他跟他說我是頂級感染由沒有違法沒有違法因為政府沒有定出什麼定義什麼叫感染由所以就是對業者最大的縱放而今天 今天在這裡你們了解阿公是縱放 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
1291.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
1318.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
縱放的責任是誰 是你 是政府縱放廠商 這樣子亂搞的大家都很開心 我也沒什麼頂級啦每一個人的手上都像 我是優質感染油明明的破油 破油為什麼不行你知道嗎 為什麼破油不行破油有沒有違法破油沒有違法對 破油用什麼去萃取的它用感染油破 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
1320.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
1346.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
不是啦 他加化學溶劑嘛他用溶劑 蒸集完 那你想像不到欸化學溶劑 用脫膠 脫酸 脫色 脫臭的方法去把感染由人家炸完的破 拿回來再萃取合法的使用化學溶劑 合法的添加物 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
1347.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
1368.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
然後成為破油 破油的健康風險是什麼 你最知道你是腎臟科專家破油使用化學溶劑長期大家以為感染油是好油你不知道你買的感染油是破油因為政府沒有規定一定要把破油寫清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
1369.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
1390.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
政府沒有規定所以廠商可以自己訂名稱我也不用訂得太好聽我也不用講說我是VIRGIN的我也不要講出詐我只要寫優質感染油也不用優質我就寫感染油其實都是破油化學溶劑萃取 你告訴我健康風險是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
1391.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
1409.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
報告委員因為油品出廠其實有個規格如果他的破油他也是一種油可以使用的也不要完全合法的啊合法的啊對我說科技其實進步到可以把這些油能夠做再利用我們要但是他沒有直接把他接到我最後跟你說你大家你會知道破油合法的 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
1412.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
1417.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
但是我們希望消費者有知情的權利什麼叫橄欖油什麼叫出炸什麼叫混合油你把橄欖油的品名標示標準定出來可以嗎這個部分我們答應可以嗎我們進一步的去研議一定給委員進一步的說明因為這樣子其實是高風險的 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
1433.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
1457.605 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
這是高風險的品項嘛 長期吃破油長期吃化學容器萃取的破油這不會是好事所以在這裡看到假油混油藥屬在過去都是個案處理沒有上升到制度層次去回應所以這樣的管理態度太消極我們不能接受而感染油現在絕對不是只有這一家有問題所以在這種狀況裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
1462.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
1479.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
頂級橄欖油純橄欖油這是什麼油到底是不是橄欖油什麼叫做橄欖油通通都不知道所以我們在這裡希望啊你把橄欖油的品名標示標準法規定出來會很困難嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
1481.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
1492.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
我們進一步研議再跟委員報告 2013年研議到現在還需要研議嗎是因為廠商的利益被打減損了要跟廠商研議嗎2013年到現在還需要研議嗎馬上制定什麼叫做橄欖油什麼叫破油什麼叫出炸什麼叫這個精緻橄欖油 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
1514.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
1521.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
因為這整個牽涉的稍微廣 如果可以的話我們三個月內一定把牽涉的稍微廣我們等了13年了啦 2013年到現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
1523.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
1539.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
容我們可以進一步跟周延的謝謝要多久我們是可不可以用三個月的時間我們一定把三個月你是要訂什麼三個月要做什麼我們在這個過程中其實要因為在CNS底下嘛什麼CNS底下你們沒有訂CNS |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
1542.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
1548.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
不是CNS底下這些品名如何把它轉換 其實都是製程上面要確立現在COGETS是9項 如果你要分成CNS的5項勉強可以 但是已經講夠久了14年13年了 不要再讓人民繼續吃你以為花很貴的買的 其實是破油 不可以這樣啦謝謝 謝謝委員 謝謝 |