| IVOD_ID |
167071 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/167071 |
| 日期 |
2026-01-12 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
聯席會議-11-4-15,36-1 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期內政、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
1 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[1] |
36 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[1] |
司法及法制委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期內政、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-01-12T11:06:10+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-01-12T11:15:31+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:09:21 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3ab52049cf0a1ce03048a80a8a6b02978a817aa92b948b9c603d53f4e9015297dab12b64c84673915ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
吳思瑤 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:06:10 - 11:15:31 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-01-12T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期內政、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：一、審查委員沈伯洋等20人擬具「反滲透法增訂第六條之一條文草案」案。二、審查委員陳冠廷等19人擬具「反滲透法增訂第十一條之一條文草案」案。三、審查委員林岱樺等18人擬具「反滲透法增訂第八條之一條文草案」案。四、審查委員黃捷等16人擬具「反滲透法第四條條文修正草案」案。五、審查委員沈伯洋等18人擬具「反滲透法增訂第六條之二條文草案」案。六、審查委員王美惠等18人擬具「反滲透法部分條文修正草案」案。七、審查委員李柏毅等16人擬具「反滲透法部分條文修正草案」案。八、審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「反滲透法第三條、第四條及第五條條文修正草案」案。九、審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「反滲透法第五條條文修正草案」案。十、審查委員林宜瑾等20人擬具「反滲透法第二條、第九條之一及第九條之二條文修正草案」案。【僅詢答】） |
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謝謝主席有請陸委會梁文傑副主委內政部吳長次那我也請國安局的副處長委員好 |
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50.27 |
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來辛苦大家了齁這個磨高一尺道就要高一丈反共諜反滲透呢國安法案需要修好修滿下一頁而且我們的修法呢絕對不會是先求有再求好我相信內政委員會的素質應當比我們司法法制高很多我們不應當有先求有再求好的這種心態我們所有今天反滲透法所提出來的法案我們都要嚴謹的審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
52.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
62.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
讓國安到位那這個是我整理出來我們國安局的代表在這裡國安的刑案起訴人數其實是兩年半內標了6.5倍在2024達到最高峰 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
67.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
94.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
所以說違反的法規就有國安法反滲透法路外空軍刑法國家機密保護法國家情報工作法還有刑法的內容換罪2024年是182案起訴那個別類的當然就是我們今天國安法還有反滲透法是TOP國安局的代表我的數據應當是正確的這是統計於你們的官方資料在下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
96.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
112.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
而犯國安犯罪的被告的身份從傳統我們認為現職的軍警或是退伍的軍人為大宗現在也更多元化了因為中國的滲透無所不在一般人是政黨成員的幕僚 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
113.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
138.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
台商還有幫派都已經成為國安犯罪的被告身份也代表他們的犯刑被繩之以法所以我們可以看到不管是從案類的攀升兩年內來攀升2.5倍然後到犯罪被告的身份逐步的多元都告訴我們我們需要修法來回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
140.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
168.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
那這個會期因為我在司法法治委員會我每個月都會有共諜的專報那既然在野黨的委員這麼關心共諜的案子那我們就要回應在法治作業啊立法委員不是只排專案報告然後來這裡就責為難官員然後沒有具體的作為所以反共諜滲透就要具體的行動就是國安法案下一頁這就是我們提出來的國安法治的架構下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
169.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
194.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
今天的反滲透法全部都是民進黨委員的提案1234567899個案子藍白的委員在野黨的委員0版本就回應我剛剛說的反滲透反共諜我們就要回應在立法院的立法委員的職責就是修法或是立法下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
195.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
220.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
那非常遺憾黃國昌委員呢今天人到美國去了大搞畢業旅行去了針對重要的反滲透法的修法他沒有來其實過去他在擔任時代力量政黨立法院黨團總召的時候他是率先提案反境外敵對勢力併吞滲透法副主委您應該研讀過他過去的法案嘛對不對我有看過我有看過 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
222.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
240.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
所以他過去的方向也是我們現在要補強精進的方向不是嗎基本上非常一致但是黃國昌最會雙標跑到美國去了今天沒有來審查下一頁那我問內政部的代表 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
243.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
260.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
市長 這個是這段時間我一直困擾的冒用我的信箱去威脅對於恐嚇要攻擊總統府啊 松山機場101啊我已經報案了六次 這是跨年這段時間連光國慶日那個時候還十幾次我都報案 你們也都在偵查有沒有查出來是境外嗎還在查應該 這個警察署會比較了解好 趕快辦 因為都是用簡體字的下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
272.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
299.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
這就是國慶日的那一波好我要用這個是說如果用言論只是在鼓吹暴力用暴力的威脅我們都要神之以法我都需要報案那麼危及國家安全的用言論來支持武統支持中國犯台這當然也不是言論自由所允許的嘛對不對下一頁檢察總長也已經說了立法規範 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
301.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
325.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
對於對敵效忠的還有要檢討法規的灰色地帶以及言論自由非沒有底線在台設統戰的言論都將受罰如果鼓吹犯罪都要吳斯堯要一個案一個案去提告我不縱容這些暴力那當然對於要對台灣武統的這些暴力也完全是零容忍的不要雙標所以我們的手法非常的一致喔夏業 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
326.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
347.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
我今天有機會在內政委員會就教於各位因為我們上週在司法法治委員會針對陸海控軍刑法24條修正的時候要加重降低罪責於法院那一天我沒有機會問到梁文傑副主委我基本上都支持我們要提高不盡其責降低罪的刑責這些都該做 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
348.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
362.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
那天在野黨委員有一些非常荒誕的比喻啊因為法條的內容是說以言論舉動文字圖畫電磁記錄科技方法或其他方式對敵人效忠的表示我們增加了這一項 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
364.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
391.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
在野黨委員一直說這非常抽象這樣子文字非常抽象會是文字獄但是如同我剛剛說的如果對於這種暴力言論攻擊公共設施都要嚴正以待去繩之以法那為什麼對於國安的相關的內容尤其降敵或者是拍影片替對方宣傳這些在野黨的委員認為可以放手呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
393.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
414.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
那我就教於副主委喔軍人的忠誠義務是大法官釋字430號非常清楚的闡釋而現行軍人的忠誠義務若被違反只能夠用貪污治罪條例的違背職務收賄罪來處理所以這法制要補強下一頁這就是非常有名的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
416.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
439.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
陸軍的上校向德恩遭中國吸收開始收賄2019年開始而且簽署了投降承諾書這是非常具體的一點都不抽象但是我們只能用貪污治罪條例的收賄罪去起訴他下一頁而這些搭配中國來拍攝願意投降解放軍的照片的這些人也只能夠用收賄罪來起訴 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
441.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
468.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
所以說副主委你在這裡可以清楚的告訴我們雖然這不是今天在內政委員會的主題但是陸海空軍刑法也是一整包的國安法案你可不可以說明一下陸委會的主張陸委會的主張很清楚就是這些凡是這些漏洞我們都應該補起來你特別是我講更具體的像這個向德恩的案子你看到的只是表面的一個但是你每抓到一個後面就一定有一串 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
469.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
495.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那前兩天還有南部南部也有南部軍團也有一個同樣的同樣的案例同樣也是被檢方起訴我想國安局在這邊很清楚就是說類似這種拍影片向中共宣誓效忠然後說一旦戰爭的時候我不抵抗甚至我要這個倒戈相向的類類這樣的具體的案例在軍中其實現在是一個危機 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
496.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
524.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
所以我們這個修這個刑法其實是完全是有具體對應的案件要處理的而不是隨便處理 而不是隨便修一修的這樣子好 謝謝副主委喔所以因應其實這些行為都是現在進行式就像你講 抓到一個後面都是一瓦啦一粒肉贓頭後面都是幾瓦啦我們如果不趕快補強了國安法之路漏洞陸海空軍刑法 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
524.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
538.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
具體的增加降敵的這些作為我認為我們真的很難很難向中國這些滲透的行為來宣戰所以今天在場內政委員會有非常多的部會都是國安法案的主責的部會 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
539.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
561.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
我們就是堅持為國家的國安我們拼上最後一塊的國安拼圖其實不是一塊 好多塊的國安拼圖大家一起努力我在司法法治委員會我們在相關的法案 陸海扣除刑法或是未來的軍事審判的制度我們也會全力的跟大家一起合作加油 辛苦了 謝謝欸 梁文傑沒有拿水杯上台 |