| IVOD_ID |
167066 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/167066 |
| 日期 |
2026-01-12 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
聯席會議-11-4-15,36-1 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期內政、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
1 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[1] |
36 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[1] |
司法及法制委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期內政、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-01-12T10:24:26+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-01-12T10:32:10+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:07:44 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3ab52049cf0a1ce065b99e35e35d5f338a817aa92b948b9c603d53f4e901529776aa520af6b9da4e5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
李柏毅 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:24:26 - 10:32:10 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-01-12T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期內政、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：一、審查委員沈伯洋等20人擬具「反滲透法增訂第六條之一條文草案」案。二、審查委員陳冠廷等19人擬具「反滲透法增訂第十一條之一條文草案」案。三、審查委員林岱樺等18人擬具「反滲透法增訂第八條之一條文草案」案。四、審查委員黃捷等16人擬具「反滲透法第四條條文修正草案」案。五、審查委員沈伯洋等18人擬具「反滲透法增訂第六條之二條文草案」案。六、審查委員王美惠等18人擬具「反滲透法部分條文修正草案」案。七、審查委員李柏毅等16人擬具「反滲透法部分條文修正草案」案。八、審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「反滲透法第三條、第四條及第五條條文修正草案」案。九、審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「反滲透法第五條條文修正草案」案。十、審查委員林宜瑾等20人擬具「反滲透法第二條、第九條之一及第九條之二條文修正草案」案。【僅詢答】） |
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博弈委員 咱家李博弈委員質詢謝謝 我有請入委會梁副主委家梁副主委 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
17.213 |
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市委好謝謝副主委我們上個禮拜一在這邊審國安法同步我們在審國安法的同步我有問你那你有掌握到相關的訊息非常及時的就是我們在審國安法那國台辦就片面宣布制裁劉世邦部長跟鄭英耀部長但是少了少講了一個檢察官 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
39.281 |
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那中國在處理包含片面的宣布直接說這是台獨頑固分子之外就會入罪於他們的反分裂法 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
51.636 |
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那再來指名我們的辦國安的檢察官這個也要直接入罪他們的懲毒還是可能也是反分裂跟懲毒嘛那再者今天我們在審的這個反滲透法其實台灣的民主就是我們是靠選舉 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
76.704 |
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那各政黨有推出候選人的政黨包含執政黨或者是大小在野黨也好或者是有其他理念的政黨也好有一個政黨在境外最關心我們的選舉的其實無非就是共產黨那共產黨的借選他其實根本就已經不是自己跳出來候選人 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
105.103 |
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沒有辦法自己跳出來當候選人而已他透過各種的方式來想要意圖影響台灣的選舉所以我們今天 包含我提出來的第四條 第五條 第六條 第十一條等等的我們都希望降低我們隔壁的惡鄰居想要介入我們選舉的各種可能性 |
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131.772 |
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那我覺得一個法條我想要放一個例子進來在馬英九時期的陸委會副主委張顯耀副主委當時在2015年的時候是被當時的政府以外患罪去辦他對不對那當然沒有辦成嘛因為他很多市政剛剛有講過那可能都在境外 |
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159.673 |
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但是他在2025年的時候被起訴用反滲透法這個法律重不重要 重要這部反滲透法他在2025年的時候把前陸委會主委但是也是現任中國國民黨智庫執行長張顯耀起訴了起訴的內容有什麼第一個他寫報告去給國台辦說他會勸郭台銘簽和平協議 |
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190.436 |
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第二個他有錄音檔為證第三個他發布了很多的假民調都是郭台銘會領先侯友宜而且他明明知道侯友宜已經被中國國民黨提名了那他還意圖用這個假民調來換掉侯友宜嘛那他背後是誰反滲透法是不是就要處理這件事情是 |
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214.105 |
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如果沒有反滲透法的話這個怎麼處理當作一個政黨在借選嗎當作一個共產黨公然的在幫郭台銘服選嗎如果沒有反滲透法的話張顯耀先生應該不會被偵辦因為他的行為就變成是說他跟國泰辦在討論哪一個人適合來選台灣的總統而已就這樣所以反滲透法的必要就是說我們對於這類企圖 |
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243.59 |
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271.616 |
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跟中共有關係的人來介入台灣選舉的時候我們至少有可以追溯的一個法律但是至於最後能不能具體的定罪能不能具體的定罪那個還是要看法院法院的怎麼怎麼判決因為我覺得這個案子這個案子我覺得有一些有一些行為是已經很清楚行為在起訴書可以看得到行為是很清楚的可以看到這一個人他到底在做什麼到底 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
272.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
295.643 |
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民眾在電視上看到誰要配誰誰要配誰的時候哇原來是背後有北京有國台辦在這邊下這些指示欸是你沒有這些偵辦你也看不到國台辦這些指示欸你以為只是臆測欸是沒錯最後齁還有一點齁其實我們在第四條裡面提出來的這個 |
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296.799 |
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304.928 |
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增加的 修正的這些條文裡面把這個 擬參選人放進來 然後另外把政黨初選 政黨提名放進來 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
306.705 |
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326.325 |
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很遺憾還沒看到國民黨的委員可以提案因為依照如果依照國民黨黨主席在選舉的時候郝龍斌跟趙少康的指控中國借選他們應該要提出來啊所以他們應該提出來他們就是被共產黨影響到的啊副主委你又沒有什麼看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
327.784 |
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關於政黨的選舉或黨主席的選舉要不要規範我們黨內是有黨內初選但是我們提的我們是沒有幫中國國民黨提說他們的黨主席選舉應該要防止中共借選應該要把它放進來才對不過以前的選罷法也沒有規範各個政黨的黨內初選後來是有擴張到規範各個政黨的黨內初選 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
353.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
380.774 |
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所以也許 也許反滲透法好不好你講的這個不對 這個跟我們今天要講反滲透法的精神不一樣在哪裡你剛講的刑法如果 選罷法 有傷害選罷法 沒有沒有沒有 我另外講我舉例刑法 你說選罷法嘛那我另外舉例 刑法如果傷人 他當然會受到刑法的制裁嘛但是他如果因為他的言論被北京指示 他被打了 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
381.786 |
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404.338 |
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我們主張這一個行為應該要加重刑責為什麼因為他被傷害不只是他的身體他還傷害到台灣的民主跟法治喔所以我覺得今天的反滲透法為什麼要把這些釐清重點就是在於他不只有傷害不只有恐嚇那甚至他有可以叫說黑幫等等的這些行為 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
405.259 |
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421.434 |
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這些一定要必須要受到反滲透法的這些約束但經過調查我們最好可以掌握具體的證據那我們才可以非常明確的告訴國人我們正處於什麼樣的環境我們要注意哪些事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
422.099 |
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446.871 |
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是委員有提案而且事實上我們現在有看到一些案子他被指示來台灣所做的事情不是什麼影響選舉或什麼他可能就是針對某一個人的言論然後他指示某一個黑幫的成員去恐嚇甚至傷人或是跟蹤他或者是潑妻或是打人類似這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
447.728 |
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463.864 |
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那這個東西到目前我們反滲透法還沒有具體規定我有看到委員還有其他委員有提案那我覺得這個都是值得討論的對 我們主張這不只傷害個人人身它還傷到台灣的民主法制我們必須要入法 謝謝 |