| IVOD_ID |
166923 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166923 |
| 日期 |
2026-01-07 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-15-20 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期內政委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
20 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期內政委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-01-07T11:02:31+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-01-07T11:14:52+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:12:21 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/8a4de0f3676b468facd9cb08cbfbcdc4781827afd94ae333a2318d3e8cde50e92dd89391cbd2639a5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
麥玉珍 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:02:31 - 11:14:52 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-01-07T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期內政委員會第20次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查行政院函請審議「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。二、繼續審查委員陳冠廷等21人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。三、繼續審查委員沈伯洋等17人擬具「國家安全法第十三條及第十三條之一條文修正草案」案。四、繼續審查委員陳冠廷等23人擬具「國家安全法第四條及第八條條文修正草案」案。五、繼續審查委員邱志偉等16人擬具「國家安全法第三條條文修正草案」案。六、繼續審查委員沈伯洋等20人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。七、繼續審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。八、繼續審查委員沈伯洋等20人擬具「國家安全法第三條、第八條及第十八條條文修正草案」案。九、繼續審查委員陳冠廷等19人擬具「國家安全法增訂第十九條之一條文草案」案。十、繼續審查委員黃捷等16人擬具「國家安全法第二條、第三條及第七條條文修正草案」案。十一、審查委員陳冠廷等16人擬具「國家安全法第十三條條文修正草案」案。十二、審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。十三、審查委員賴瑞隆等17人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。十四、審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「國家安全法第七條、第八條及第八條之一條文修正草案」案。十五、審查委員邱志偉等19人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。十六、審查委員莊瑞雄等16人擬具「國家安全法增訂第十三條之一條文草案」案。十七、審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。十八、審查委員吳沛憶等17人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。十九、審查委員郭昱晴等18人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。二十、審查委員李坤城等16人擬具「國家安全法第四條及第四條之一條文修正草案」案。二十一、審查委員徐富癸等20人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。二十二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具「國家安全法第六條條文修正草案」案。二十三、審查委員李坤城等19人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。【詢答及處理；第一案、第二十一案及第二十二案如經復議則不予審查；第二十三案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書則不予審查。】） |
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有請行政院和內政部將內政部次長行政院張參與委員早安 |
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23.104 |
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市長好去年4月份有人在網路上發文就是詢問一句陳菊走了嗎結果警方在短短幾個小時內 |
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38.573 |
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就直接用社會秩序維護法 認定他散佈謠言就是足以影響公共安寧 火速敵送雖然是最後不起訴 但我們請教一下發文質詢 |
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請問某一位政治人物是否過世這件事到底符不符合涉違法的散佈謠言足以影響公共安寧的構成要件呢報委員如果今天是指涉五院的院長或是任何一個高階政治人物這都是構成要件不一定是指監察院長 立法院也是一樣 |
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這樣子的話如果符合你說這樣子是符合所以如果是這樣子的符合的話我要問你接下來這一段 |
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有許多委員在粉專在粉專裡面社群平台每天都能看到大量的留言所以直接叫政治人物去死還有用極端的仇恨言論攻擊特定的政黨與立場刻意煽動仇恨的對立請教這些留言有沒有 |
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可能符合社委法或你們修法草案所稱的就是仇恨性言論 自發性社會對立的構成要件我們也很害怕 我也很恐懼如果你有收到的話一定要來報案 我們一定處理全部在網路那我們一定處理 那就請警政署這邊來處理整個很多委員的都有但是要報案 要報案 |
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這委員一定要來報案所以就是講我們陳菊的是他報案嗎還是你們就馬上接所以現在就是說報案你們在處理不報案的話就是言論自由是這樣嗎報委員他不是言論自由他基本上是違法的他不是言論自由 |
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不是言論自由 當然是在我們改革的期間如果是這樣的話 有人在立法院外的大馬路設立我們國昌主席的靈堂依你們現在的社會法修法草案的理解 |
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這樣的行為符不符合公共場所不斷言論或激化社會的對立以足影響公共的秩序的構成要件如果符合為什麼直到現在今天我們都還沒有看到任何的處理 |
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215.87 |
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238.965 |
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人家只是在網路上就是問一句陳菊是不是過世四天內就被移送這種在公共場合直接放靈堂的行為為什麼可以完全沒事呢報言這是公然侮辱罪這個也是一樣要請我們黃國昌主席來提告提告的話我們一定處理 |
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240.392 |
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所以說變成是有人提告如果他今天是在立法院的外面的話要去跟中正一分局提告那台北市政府警察局會處理 |
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251.656 |
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276.597 |
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所以這個法修了就是有人告 不用修法報言這是刑法的內容這不是我們現在要修的法很多人去跟你們申訴不是提告而已 這個要提告所以在你們的眼中是哪一種比較可能影響公共安寧就是就問一屆還是說公開叫你去死如果沒有提告 沒有人檢舉的話 |
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279.813 |
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301.698 |
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比如說如果有人叫我去死的話也是我要去提告對 就是有提告才有處理如果說我覺得他叫我去死我覺得無所謂也沒關係看個人 如果有人叫我去死我覺得無所謂我就不會提告不是個人維護 社會維護這樣子言論發生這樣不是因為針對我個人而已 他不是針對大眾 |
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328.575 |
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如果他是針對比如說搭台北捷運的都去行 那就是恐嚇公眾因為我們現在要修法 還有我們要了解說每一個人這樣子的去言論 每一個人的去叫我們不怕委員剛剛提的跟我們這些修法沒有關係因為我們這個修法是國安法委員剛剛提到的一部分是社會法 一部分現在刑法有的內容我們不管是修法還是今天質詢 |
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就是我們要講的就是維安法或者國安法國安法沒有包含這一塊所以我們想要讓你們知道的是說我們修法是要保護人民不是說有人檢舉有人怎麼樣我們是要保護國家我們國安法是要保護國家跟人民我們國家國民都要保護也要保護委員都要保護 |
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354.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
373.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
所以說我們就看到這樣子這樣子你們都不處理會處理所以委員一定要提告所以等一下事後我們請警政署跟委員聯絡提告才要處理因為他法律構成的要件就是要提告因為公然侮辱罪這一些或者是恐嚇他是要提告他沒有提告的話我們沒辦法處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
374.734 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
395.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
為什麼當社委法掛在批評政論就是政治的言論上的時候就是你們就是我們也不知道說是不是告但是呢你們就是急速的去動員馬上移送立即追究但是當真正有 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
395.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
411.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
分裂性 或者是自發性的籌換你們都看到 都知道啊 新聞都看到啊但是你們有沒有對這樣的 如果是口賀公眾罪的話151條我們是不用提告 我們直接就偵辦了所以我們那個北捷事件之後我們總共辦了97 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
413.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
436.586 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
97件 那也有羈押的所以那個是主動偵辦 但是個人的話所以這些的話是不主動偵辦 就是要有自己要去個人跟公眾是分開的 對個人跟對公眾的恐嚇是不一樣的不一樣的構成要件所以說你們說要依法嘛 依法行政這樣就是選擇性的執法 不是選擇性 抱歉它是法律的設計架構就是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
439.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
444.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
對公眾的恐嚇跟對個人的恐嚇它的告訴乃論跟非告訴乃論它是不同的設計 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
446.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
471.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
所以說你們是說政治清算的工具啦 我覺得就是請問這個太超過了啦 沒有政治清算啦因為每天很多人去檢舉 不一定來去辦啦所以我說委員趕快來檢舉 如果有比如說網路上或者是說實體上對委員有任何的言語不敬或造成威脅的話委員來檢舉 因為這是屬於對委員個人的部分 我們一定會處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
473.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
476.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
所以是不是要檢舉才去做所以說滿天飛 網路或者電視所以說都有 有人跟你們去申訴或者什麼的話都不是個人的話 我們都沒有去辦 是別人說的 這樣子嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
491.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
512.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
報委員這申訴的意思是指哪一個部分很多人也去說幫我們國倉委員幫我們去跟你們申訴但是呢也不是因為那個是要黃委員來報案才可以才可以是這樣子嗎就是個人別人沒辦法幫他報案我也不能幫委員報案都不行一定要他個人很多人在去反映啊那個是反映就是我們會到現場去維持秩序可是如果說黃委員來報案的話我們就會進行偵辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
520.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
527.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
所以你們就是說這個維安法就是說我們要維安法那不是維安法 那是刑法 包委那是刑法 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
529.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
541.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
對 我是說現在我們是因為現在網路一直這樣子恐嚇我們也是那個也是刑罰我們是對我們的人身安全對我們家人也是覺得很恐慌所以在網路都不斷的就是有這些言論委員如果覺得有人身安全的疑慮的話可以跟我們申請隨乎 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
556.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
584.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
好 這個我們是沒辦法去約束啦因為這網路太多來去言論自由所以我們是沒辦法但是說我們是說就是可能就是破壞公共安寧的極端言論我們看到的是這樣子所以他根本是不是一部維護社會的秩序的法律而已而是說一部讓我們的就是執政黨用來就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
585.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
590.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
要該辦你們說辦的就辦該不辦的就說你們說的算這跟執政誰執政都沒有關係過去不同政黨執政也都是同一個標準我們就是看不到標準委員你要往前看 往前看是同一個標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
601.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
628.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
我們是往前看還是後續我們希望你未來是標準你往馬英九總統時期看到現在都是同一個標準往前還是現在未來我希望你們真的是用標準的但是我們先看就是司法迫害所以我們才要說你們不標準所以我們是要呼應我們行政院還有就是一邊推動社委法的就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
629.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
658.282 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
擴權的修法一邊無法說清楚都是說我們沒有擴權我們是界定清楚我們是界定清楚這些危害公眾的言論我們沒有擴權所以這只要是說我們社會更安定而不是說所以希望委員支持我們我們現在國安法跟社會法修正完社會會更安定 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
659.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
688.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
請委員相信我們你說百分之百都不會有任何有事情是嗎是這樣的意思嗎你保證這個沒辦法百分之百全世界沒有人百分之百但是我們會讓我們會讓整個不管是社會還是國家還是人民都是我希望是說你們是你們的責任說修法法在那邊就是大家都平安我們希望的是說涉及國家安全還有說敵對勢力的 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
690.16 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
717.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
滲透鼓吹戰爭的言論未來有國安法還有就是反滲透法可以處理不要再用色違法去補刀一般的言論所以法律如果變成誰執政誰說的算那不是叫做維護秩序那就是做製造對立我們希望真的 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
718.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
737.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
不管是過去還是現在還是未來我們希望的是修法是保護但是執政的或者是在這個工作一定要去維護我們國民的安全這就是我們要修法的目的沒有問題 我們想法是一致的 謝謝 |