| IVOD_ID |
166919 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166919 |
| 日期 |
2026-01-07 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-15-20 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期內政委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
20 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期內政委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2026-01-07T10:28:20+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2026-01-07T10:36:27+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:08:07 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/8a4de0f3676b468f3c0073b3cf818d97781827afd94ae333a2318d3e8cde50e9e2b1819fafab4f6f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
張宏陸 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:28:20 - 10:36:27 |
| 會議時間 |
2026-01-07T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期內政委員會第20次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查行政院函請審議「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。二、繼續審查委員陳冠廷等21人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。三、繼續審查委員沈伯洋等17人擬具「國家安全法第十三條及第十三條之一條文修正草案」案。四、繼續審查委員陳冠廷等23人擬具「國家安全法第四條及第八條條文修正草案」案。五、繼續審查委員邱志偉等16人擬具「國家安全法第三條條文修正草案」案。六、繼續審查委員沈伯洋等20人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。七、繼續審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。八、繼續審查委員沈伯洋等20人擬具「國家安全法第三條、第八條及第十八條條文修正草案」案。九、繼續審查委員陳冠廷等19人擬具「國家安全法增訂第十九條之一條文草案」案。十、繼續審查委員黃捷等16人擬具「國家安全法第二條、第三條及第七條條文修正草案」案。十一、審查委員陳冠廷等16人擬具「國家安全法第十三條條文修正草案」案。十二、審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。十三、審查委員賴瑞隆等17人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。十四、審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「國家安全法第七條、第八條及第八條之一條文修正草案」案。十五、審查委員邱志偉等19人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。十六、審查委員莊瑞雄等16人擬具「國家安全法增訂第十三條之一條文草案」案。十七、審查委員王定宇等16人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。十八、審查委員吳沛憶等17人擬具「國家安全法第二條及第七條條文修正草案」案。十九、審查委員郭昱晴等18人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。二十、審查委員李坤城等16人擬具「國家安全法第四條及第四條之一條文修正草案」案。二十一、審查委員徐富癸等20人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。二十二、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具「國家安全法第六條條文修正草案」案。二十三、審查委員李坤城等19人擬具「國家安全法部分條文修正草案」案。【詢答及處理；第一案、第二十一案及第二十二案如經復議則不予審查；第二十三案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書則不予審查。】） |
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請內政部馬次長還有法務部徐次長還有經濟部委員長 早其實國家安全國家安全大家嘴巴都在講言論自由大家嘴巴也都在講但這個徐次長 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
27.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
34.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
言論自由 那我如果公眾羞辱人罵人有沒有在言論自由的保障範圍內 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
36.164 |
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跟委員報告言論自由絕對是憲法保障的權利之一但是這個也是會有限制也就是說他不能去侵害到別人他不能危害到社會秩序也不能危害到國家安全如果有這些行為的話憲法也會規定有一定的限制我們先不要講到國家安全 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
57.811 |
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78.16 |
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我在公共場所有沒有公然侮辱 有嘛那有沒有受言論自由的保障就是限制了 當然限制嘛我們是追求言論自由我們一定要百分之百的支持言論自由但是我們在現行的法律我們在支持言論自由下也沒有無限擴張嘛 對不對所以勒 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
83.132 |
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97.717 |
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身為一個國家的主人 所有的人民應該也要追求國家安全吧對不對 如果國家沒有安全你有再多的什麼都沒有用那我們今天很多人在講限制言論自由或限制什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
98.197 |
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121.196 |
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我覺得這都是可以探討的一個法律要通過很多都可以探討但我認為大家都忽略了很多的事情為什麼特別請經濟部上我們這次的修法裡面這裡面國家核心關鍵技術這個跟政治有沒有關係你們都可以回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
125.146 |
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國家核心關鍵技術都有關係這跟經濟跟政治都有關係都有嘛對不對所以我們這次的修法裡面經濟部我想請問一下國家核心關鍵技術 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
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如果我們比如說我們的半導體業我們不要指名哪一間啊不然好啦 沒關係就講嘛台積電或什麼特別的關鍵技術嘛會不會有敵對勢力或是中國或是其他國家要來竊取我們這個商業機密 國家機密 會不會包圍我想國家核心關鍵技術目前來講確實有些是涉及到營業秘密的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
167.571 |
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我剛剛就講 我剛剛的問題是會不會有其他的敵對勢力或其他國家要來想辦法竊取我們這些商業秘密這些國家關鍵核心關鍵技術 會不會有我想委員 報告委員這部分或許別的國家還是敵對勢力因為記憶就是有關於不管是台積電或我們很重要的關鍵技術的時候它假設要突破這個技術它可能會造過偷竊或許 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
194.811 |
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對這些該當的不管是敵對勢力或外國任何一個團體都有可能發生的事情都有可能發生嘛 是有沒有發生過我想目前來講在報紙上有些確實有發生過好 就有發生過就好了嘛對不對 是有發生過我們不用去制止嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
216.454 |
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240.185 |
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所以鮑威我想在這部分我們在營業秘密上面假如萬一發生竊取營業秘密這部分會回歸到我們營業秘密這部分也有相關的事情什麼叫回歸到營業秘密這次的法條你都沒有看到喔修正裡面國家核心關鍵區我們也是要保障這一部分啊對啊 你剛剛想什麼回到 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
241.325 |
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264.629 |
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就是說營業秘密也有 那這次國安法裡面也有確實相關涉及到偷竊國家核心關鍵技術對啊 是嘛 對不對 你就回答我是或不是就好了嘛是嘛 對嘛 所以這個也不只是對於我們剛剛講的言論自由的限制或什麼的其實對於整個台灣未來國家的發展 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
265.256 |
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290.701 |
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我們如果這些國家核心關鍵技術被人家拿走了被人家用過不正當的手段敵對勢力或什麼的對台灣的國際競爭力對台灣的保護對台灣人民的生命財產尤其是財產可能少賺很多錢我們今天所有的修法其實不只這些嘛對不對好 那個馬次長馬次長 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
293.414 |
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319.79 |
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我剛剛所說的台積電這個或是半導體業這個國家核心關鍵技術這是一項但你們應該也介紹很多敵對勢力或外國或敵對勢力他對我們的基礎建設或有發動了很多的攻擊這是不是事實報告委員是事實比如說海蘭我們就常常被切斷 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
320.558 |
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343.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
就事實嘛 對不對 那事實我們要不要防範我們要 而且關鍵基礎設施裡面有非常多並不一定屬於所謂的政府營運的部分所以我剛剛沒有講關鍵兩字喔我剛剛特別只有講基礎設施而已喔我還沒講到關鍵喔 對不對連這個基礎設施都有 那我再請問一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
345.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
368.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
如果有人要透過不正當的手段拿到我們台灣所有人的就醫資料或是說馬市長你家住哪裡 你每天去吃什麼這個對國家安全會不會也有危害這個絕對是 因為我們可以看得到就是說各個國家對於各種不同的包括各自的保護或者是基礎設施的資訊的保護它都是一致的 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
369.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
385.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
我今天為什麼要提出不同的面向我跟你講如果從全台灣人的就醫制度裡面來看我們全台灣每年消耗最多的藥品是哪一個如果對台灣有不友善的敵對勢力或什麼我想辦法切斷你所有的用藥台灣人怎麼辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
388.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
409.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
有沒有這個可能有可能有可能而且不只是藥品我們還有一些其他的比如說能源或者是其他都是一樣的我們就講藥品就好了嘛對不對可能大家會覺得啊這個修國安法什麼跟他沒有相干但我就只舉這個我們的就醫資料健保資料有心人透過這樣拿到了主動我們拿到所有的藥品 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
410.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
436.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
這台灣人怎麼辦啊 再來每個人的住所 每個人什麼也有可能啊 對不對所以我在這邊就是說今天我們修這個國安法其實我個人認為沒有那麼多政治就是要保護台灣人保護我們的經濟 保護台灣人能夠繼續永遠走下去我剛舉的這些 那你再講一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
437.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
451.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
對不對 如果你有 你拿到你所有的手機裡面的資料你每天打給誰 你每天幹什麼 哇全台灣現在啊 打電話打到哪個國家最多的哇 可能跟那個國家啊 經貿往來密切 哇 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
454.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
483.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
阻斷台灣的經貿發展 這都是有可能的餒 對不對而且已經在發生了 根緣報已經在發生對嘛 所以舉這幾個例子要讓全台灣人民知道我們今天修這個國安法其實是為了保護台灣人民啦 對不對沒錯 這個謝謝委員因為這個都是在現在進行式所以我們修這個法基本上已經不是未來式了我們是在處理彌補過去我們安全上的漏洞好 謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
484.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
484.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
謝謝 感謝 |