| IVOD_ID |
166759 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166759 |
| 日期 |
2025-12-31 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-36-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期司法及法制委員會第16次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
16 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
36 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
司法及法制委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期司法及法制委員會第16次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-12-31T12:00:42+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-12-31T12:16:39+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:15:57 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/c2638f9bef880eb14c0bb6bae0f62298b1ecef7239bdfb16d53fbbf289ff3135ddaafb66827a691f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
王鴻薇 |
| 委員發言時間 |
12:00:42 - 12:16:39 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-12-31T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期司法及法制委員會第16次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請法務部部長率所屬相關單位、司法院副秘書長、內政部警政署、行政院國土安全辦公室就「無差別攻擊犯罪事件之防治與量刑檢討」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
二、併案審查
(一)委員翁曉玲等18人擬具「政務人員法草案」案。
(二)委員羅智強等19人擬具「政務人員行為基準法草案」案。
【第（二）案各黨團若未提出不復議同意書，則不予審查】
【僅進行詢答】） |
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好謝謝主席我先請法務部長還有我們警政署今天有保安組副組長以及我們國土安全辦公室代表請警衛官員到備詢台 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
20.227 |
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我先請教部長就是有關於這次北捷殺人事件現在檢調在偵辦中那麼在電腦硬碟現在要把它解密的部分現在是不是碰到非常大的一個困難 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
38.504 |
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61.112 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
好像這個根據媒體報導到目前為止這個嫌犯張文他的電腦硬碟到現在都解不開是不是碰到這樣的一個瓶頸警方在在做一個處理那這邊我想這個是技術性的問題那技術性是不是可以請警政署來那要不要請警政署來說明一下那個報告委員這個部分我們允許還在做努力 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
66.773 |
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93.68 |
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還在做努力因為根據媒體的報導說這個這個硬碟因為他的這個而且連微軟都好像幫不上忙所以如果要解開甚至有說要到100年所以我想請教的是如果他到現在為止電腦硬碟都一直解不開的話會不會針對我們接下來整個的這個偵辦造成了什麼樣的困難部長還是我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
95.441 |
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107.396 |
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那我想這個是一個當然我們希望能夠解開但是因為屬於這個數位的一個設備這部分的確有它的相當高的一個技術的一個門檻那這邊我想在整個一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
108.944 |
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127.49 |
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把它解開這部分當然可以充實一些的比如說購買一些軟體設備那這部分屬於技術性基本上我們都是由警方 刑事局在做一個不過這個部分我想可能未來它甚至未來我們包含打架還有一些那種重大犯罪恐怕也會碰到 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
128.11 |
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148.841 |
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那另外我請教一下警政署因為有張文他跳下來他死亡大家一直在猜測他到底是失足還是跳樓到目前為止我們可以確定嗎他到底是失足還是跳樓因為嫌犯已經死亡所以這個動機的部分還要做一個查證還是沒有辦法確定 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
150.245 |
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164.818 |
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所以也是不排除如果他今天其實他並不是要這個自殺的行為而是屍主死亡的話那如果他人還活著也不排除有更進一步的這些恐怖的攻擊對不對這個部分我們沒辦法做臆測 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
168.934 |
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187.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
這個你們都其實到底他的動機我覺得應該還是要把它搞清楚那另外我請教一下剛剛莊瑞雄委員也特別提到因為今天就是跨年今天就跨年那我們整個的全國的警力達到這個上萬人要那個要怕 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
189.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
210.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
維持相關的治安那剛才他特別提到細胞簡訊的部分台北市已經確定今天會發出細胞簡訊當然我的意思說他不一定一定會發啦他有兩個狀況第一個狀況就是呢出現重大治安事件譬如說像北捷這個事件 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
211.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
239.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
那第二個他這次再增加了一個就是如果人潮特別擁擠也就是如果他出現止暴的現象因為在過去國外也有發生像那個前幾年韓國有離太遠的踩踏事件所以他今天呢已經確定說如果發生這兩個狀況的話他們會發出細胞簡訊那我想請問一下到目前為止我們所警政署或者我們那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
241.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
253.168 |
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那個國土安全辦公室所掌握的是只有台北市已經有這樣的準備還是說其他縣市也有跟我們做申請 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
255.595 |
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279.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
有人能回答嗎包委員 目前我們這邊了解是台北市有提出一個申請書到災防科技中心去做備查除了台北市還有沒有其他縣市目前我了解是台北市只有台北市但是今年晚上很多縣市都會有跨年活動 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
280.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
307.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
那麼我有注意到雖然我們的內政部長我們劉世芳針對細胞簡訊他有所保留可是我們的政務委員紀連成他肯定就是說他認為如果有細胞簡訊可以降低可能發生的這些傷亡這些後果那所以我想請問一下我們內政部現在態度到底是怎樣如果說 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
308.683 |
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335.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
劉世芳的意思就好像說他還擔心會造成什麼什麼的後遺症但是紀連城政務委員又肯定所以現在不是劉世芳跟蔣萬安不同調現在變成劉世芳跟紀連城也不同調那我請問一下根據你們的專業或是你們的研判這個細胞簡訊到底可不可以讓各縣市政府或中央來做一個統一性的規範呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
337.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
356.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
包委員 那個目前的規定來說的話各縣市政府它是可以提出申請書核備以後它就可以應用這個目前規定是這樣但是就是要跟災防的一個科技中心去做備查去做申請 對自己怎麼應用 應用的條件如何這個可能要再思考 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
357.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
379.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
我覺得你們要盡快啦其實最就是今天晚上如果要做的話就是今天晚上其實你們已經一直在拖一直拖可能下一次的機會可能就是在那個就是在燈會啦對不對所以我覺得我們還是有很多大型的活動我覺得這個動作要快好那接下來我想請教一下部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
381.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
400.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
因為最近呢這個行政院送出了社委法的修法這裡面特別強調了如果有仇恨性的言論這裡面甚至包含這個網路上還要求這個網站要給他下架那當然很多的這些網站的經營者會 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
402.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
405.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
很困擾什麼樣叫做仇恨性言論我現在整理出這幾個這一陣子以來譬如說昨天中國的軍演我們就看到網紅一個網紅徐碧她就發文說希望砲彈可以不小心打到桃園的中國國民黨黨部讓 解釋一下為何他們阻擋軍購案 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
429.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
449.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
像這樣子 夠不夠成仇恨式的言論跟委員報告齁 因為這個仇恨 所謂這部分的修法的這部分齁那個這個不是 這是內政部主管的話對那這我沒辦法幫 我是尊重內政部的修法的提案啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
449.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
470.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
所以在行政院的時候你們包含你們根本都完全沒有任何的沒有任何的質疑說這樣子的這樣子的這個修法他有什麼樣的問題有沒有這個限制言論自由問題或者難以執行的問題而且社會法過去本來就已經受到很多的質疑了 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
472.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
487.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
所以你們法務部完全沒有意見我這邊看到有這麼多這麼多的言論或者是這樣的貼文什麼叫做仇恨性言論好 比如說這個我們常常提到嘛那個檢察官的照片紮上絕痕你們立刻 檢察官立刻偵辦嘛好 所以認為這個是那個仇恨性的這個言論貼文訊息那同樣的把我們這個國民黨所有的立委來放一個靈堂 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
500.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
503.931 |
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這樣子一個粉專放沒事啊這樣就沒事啊所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
505.532 |
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532.73 |
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法务部不觉得这样的修法有问题这个刚才委员有提到就是仇视检察官那一部分事实上他还是用恐吓的已经达到恐吓的一个要件所以这部分就依法来处理那至于仇恨性的言论这部分那这部分因为这个是属于内政部的一个修法提案那这部分还没有相关的内政部正好保安组也在这里来来来我要讲就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
533.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
560.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
這次這個社違法的提出來有很多人是認為就是當時的這個這個就是有關於網路仲介法的一個這個借師還魂因為針對就是說只要是你們認為是有這個仇恨式的言論影響國人之團結你看到沒有這麼這麼泛泛這麼就是形而上的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
561.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
569.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
一個文字 什麼恐怖主義啦境外勢力的不當訴求對國安影響甚巨的話 什麼叭啦叭啦一大堆就可以要求在這個網路上要求他們把他這樣的言論給下架所以有很多人認為這是不是一種網路的箝制這種是一個網路言論的一個箝制什麼叫做仇恨性言論 我剛才舉了很多啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
588.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
612.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
同樣類似的事情對檢察官他認為造成恐嚇那對於這個幫這個民意代表立法委員擺靈堂這不叫恐嚇我們會不會心生恐懼對不對一般人你給他擺一個這樣子放在那邊 靈堂在那邊他會不會心生恐懼所以立法委員不應該心生恐懼這種都很多的就是這個標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
613.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
643.454 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
非常非常的我覺得非常的抽象另外我們也注意到包含了時代力量時代力量他絕對不是藍白陣營時代力量他也認為說你仇恨跟骨髓戰爭的言論是要管但是用社為法來管就是很不適當另外我們台灣警察工作潛意推動協會也認為社為法這樣子的修法事實上是很粗糙的 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
644.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
661.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
那我在這邊要特別提出來其實過去我要特別講因為社委法沒有錯 剛才那個部長講的它不經過法院我們如果羈押 現在我們來講我們其實在司法法治委員會談了很多次羈押的條件 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
663.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
676.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
可是呢 現在的社違法不需要經過法院就直接給你拘獄三天讓你關三天 或者讓你罰三萬所以 這些部分會不會 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
678.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
695.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
變成一個行政上的濫權我提出一個統計資料因為我們在涉違法其實以過去幾年來警察機關的移送警察機關認為他違反涉違法 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
696.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
712.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
然後移送到法院但是法院不罰的比例事實上是非常非常的高的我們如果根據過去幾年來這樣子包含今年不罰的比例達到八成 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
714.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
728.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
達到八成過去監察委員也特別針對那個案子就是針對當時的這個台大的教授蘇鴻達的案件就是你們去把他移送移送到這個法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
732.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
749.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
當時監察委員也提出就是有關於以所謂的散佈謠言就基於涉違法的散佈謠言去移送事實上也有違反人權以及沒有保障言論自由 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
750.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
760.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
所以社會法沒有去檢討去做修正反而繼續的擴權在這次行政院送過來的其實是繼續的擴權而這樣的擴權你們現在才惡補喔你們現在才在惡補嗎這麼重大的案子不管是保安組也不清楚嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
781.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
810.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
報告委員這個部份內政部的部份內政部講證者的部份是由刑事局主政麻煩您大聲一點這個部份是由我們刑事局來主政的所以我們請刑事局來做說明報告委員那個社會法的部份它還是要經過那個行政法院麻煩您因為您可能戴口罩請您稍微沒有關係那個社會法的部份還是要經過那個行政法院經過法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
811.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
827.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
好 經過法院 但是布法的比例很高啊 我剛剛不是講嗎是不是很高那到底是我們前端大家在在白忙一場還是法院他的那個判決有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
829.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
852.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
到底是前面的移送太腐爛還是法院的判決有問題在我前面第一個就特別講到今天早上也有討論到就是有在網路上詢問到我們的監察院長陳菊有事嗎 一樣被移送被移送之後法院認為這根本沒有違法的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
854.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
877.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
是不是那我想請問一下那你這個拘役是需要通過法院嗎才能夠拘役嗎拘留是不是需要拘留所以如果你們要處三日以下之拘留或者新台幣三萬以下的罰還 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
879.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
894.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
是不是要經過法院的判決那個拘役的需要 法管的不用對不起 大聲一點拘役的需要通通就要經過那行政法院拘役的這個部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
894.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
923.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
就是機遇的部分 那罰款呢這個不需要罰款不需要嘛 對不對所以我個人認為因為當然這個是行政院送出那其實最近已經引起非常多的質疑有很多 我要講的是在這個部分其實我看到已經不是只是你說什麼這個藍白陣營或者什麼綠的陣營其實包含綠的陣營也已經有人去提出這些種種的相關的疑慮 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
924.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
948.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
所以到時候在大人立法院的部分我們會我們會嚴格的審查所以我覺得內政部也應該採納雅言我覺得為什麼會行政院可以這樣的莫名其妙匆匆忙忙的就送出這樣的這個涉違法的修正我個人也覺得有點不可思議好不好那但是我覺得這部分既然引起大家的疑慮還有很多的討論那我們就應該去好好的去嚴格的審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
956.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
957.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
好 謝謝王宏威委員 |