| IVOD_ID |
166301 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166301 |
| 日期 |
2025-12-10 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-20-12 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期財政委員會第12次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
12 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期財政委員會第12次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-12-10T11:33:33+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-12-10T11:45:16+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:43 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/a128e1119a2c25c09328b081bd68809b9ecb9f93c172c55119f30473e88220b39958b8a00feea6e15ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
羅明才 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:33:33 - 11:45:16 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-12-10T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期財政委員會第12次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查「財政收支劃分法」7案：（僅詢答）
(一) 本院委員郭國文等17人、委員賴瑞隆等19人、委員賴瑞隆等17人分別擬具「財政收支劃分法部分條文修正草案」等3案。
(二) 本院委員陳玉珍等19人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條條文修正草案」案。
(三) 本院委員邱議瑩等26人擬具「財政收支劃分法第十六條之一條文修正草案」案。
(四) 本院委員蔡易餘等17人擬具「財政收支劃分法第十六條之一及第三十條條文修正草案」案。
(五) 本院委員陳玉珍等24人擬具「財政收支劃分法第三十條條文修正草案」案。
二、審查「國家金融安定基金設置及管理條例」2案：（僅詢答）
(一)本院委員郭國文等18人擬具「國家金融安定基金設置及管理條例第四條條文修正草案」案。
(二)本院委員李坤城等18人擬具「國家金融安定基金設置及管理條例第四條及第五條條文修正草案」案。
【12月10日及11日二天一次會】） |
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略席官員大好 主席柯博前國安基金的執行秘書 阮清華 阮市長行政院的副組長來 委員好 陳副組長先這樣子好了 來 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
25.731 |
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那個25年前本席在一樓那時候金管會跟財政部門有分家的時候在一樓我們在那邊通過了國安基金的一個設置條例成功的扮演的救火隊的角色歷年來都有很多重大的國際變動的情況你也知道什麼時候可以動用國安基金 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
56.007 |
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國安基金條例都有明確規定比如說碰到重大的事件國際的因素或者是特別政治變化等等因素然後大家信心不足然後股市就崩跌的狀況所以國安基金它扮演一個非常成功稱職的角色過去它的規模很小就大概八兆左右所以我們當初的考量 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
85.077 |
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就是大概週轉率大概算一算大概是3%到5%可以維持一定一天的那個量都還OK當然不是說讓你一次都用盡記得以前最會操盤的大概是財政部部長他是試兩波千金 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
104.755 |
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125.655 |
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他就聞風不動 早上七點半突然通知所有的媒體 記者 財經記者就是守在財政部舊的辦公室外面那個地方請大家喝豆漿 吃燒餅油條大家就想說有什麼事情要發布 有什麼發布 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
127.38 |
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151.17 |
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沒有 沒有 沒有過一陣子就說有一些委員都會到現場來所以就一場騷動所以這個鵝魚我炸就是這樣四兩撥千斤的一毛錢都沒動隔天就翻場所以國安基金的設置他必須要膽子夠大 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
152.25 |
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174.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
他必須要鎮得住整個規模他必須要讓市場有信心現在國安金的推動當初跟現在比起來是這個市況不一樣現在都快100兆了差很多了快100兆了對 現在100兆現在政府基期是不是在做多 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
176.407 |
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沒有所謂做多的問題我們基本上 國安基金基本上是維護股市的穩定維護投資人的信心沒有像剛才委員講的那種情況不過就是先穩定嘛 穩定了以後再做多 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
197.583 |
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218.943 |
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也不會做多 其實我們有 官方基金有限制因為我們買跌不買漲市長 你也客氣啦當然你的心理就是扮演好你的角色齁在全世界每一個國家當然都希望股市可以欣欣向榮蓬勃發展因為股市是經濟的櫥窗嘛你股市好 做得棒 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
219.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
238.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
你执政就不会有什么太大的一个牵连或者是负面的影响所以全民财富就增加你有没有算过从25年到现在市场规模多了快90兆平均一个股民赚了多少钱 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
239.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
252.594 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
我是沒有算 因為這個很難算為什麼 因為每一個人的投資的績效都不太一樣有些人可能是用當沖的方式那有些是長期投資 我們現在開戶的這個戶數有多少這個部分因為我沒有去計算一千兩百多戶吧一千兩百多萬戶因為有重複開戶的應該有機會啦那比較有經常在這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
268.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
286.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
買賣股市的流動性比較多的正常戶大概有多少這一部分因為都是金管會在主管大概有四五百萬戶所以其實在台灣的經濟方面股市是很熱絡的意思都是這樣子所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
287.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
313.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
分析一位 既然你剛剛講的安定很重要那凡是整個台灣之與全世界我們的確要加強一個強心劑所以過去是大概國安基金的借錢什麼規模是五千億 五千億今天有人提到大概就是債錢到一兆 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
314.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
339.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
其實如果相比過去的倍數來說的話大概是成長了快十倍左右所以十倍照理說應該要五兆但是我覺得五兆可能恐怕現在目前的財政情況還有點小困難所以本席提出的是兩兆兩兆的規模或者是三兆 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
341.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
355.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
市長你覺得兩兆好還是三兆好我感謝委員長期關注股市我現在跟委員報告一下民國89年的時候如果用5000億來算的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
357.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
370.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
那時候它跟市值的佔比大概百分之五點四三五點多五點四三那我們現在假定提高到一兆一兆的話如果跟現在的市值來比的話它佔比大概百分之1.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
372.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
390.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
其實是蠻低的但是我的意思是說有時候如果提個太高也有一些後遺症為什麼如果你提太高如果你進場如果買太多的話出場也會有退場的時候也會有一些會影響股市的這些狀況其實國安基金很多人都是覺得他很神秘 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
391.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
413.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
那從這20年來它的績效評比來說很多股民說你現在快3萬點了很多股民多數還是苦哈哈沒有賺到錢所以很多人就說那來一個傻瓜投資法就跟著國安基金走讓你想要什麼通通有市長 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
416.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
443.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
你總共操盤大概有幾次我這個超過 這個是第三次這次是第九次就是從國安卿 因為還有前任你前曾明聰 曾主委那時候當次長他有操盤超過啊我是協助 那時候是協助你有在場喔那是我獨立操作大概三次你三次 全部加起來有幾次全部加起來九次九次喔那有九次裡面喔大概獲利有沒有超過20%的 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
446.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
466.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
有好幾個都超過20%對 都超過20%所以很多人說你們很厲害啊然後你剛剛講說買了你們希望就是要退場其實你在第一次就是前八次 前九次的時候你們那時候有沒有買台積電 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
468.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
493.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
我不方便在這邊公開講那你可以不要回答那你們有買很多的台積電當初如果買台積電你買了那你不要賣放到現在那不是替國家賺更多的錢嗎而且還有一點你賺的這些錢累積了以後你不見得一定要百分之百繳國庫啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
495.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
511.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
本席認為啊你覺得這個基金規模不夠那你可以一半繳國庫一半就留著市長你有沒有算過你9次的操盤啊如果每一次都累積50%到現在大概有多少金額 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
512.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
532.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
累積到現在 對如果是說都不賣是吧就是你有賺有賠嘛那賺的比較多就如果每一次都結清累積到現在賺的部分有多少這個沒有去算過啦好 那翻譯句話說不要說50%9次算下來總共賺了多少錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
532.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
556.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
五百六十幾 五百六十四億五百多億吧對 五百多億那所以你如果說一半的話是留兩百五十億左右放在你的國安基金裡面以備不時之需啊我跟委員報告目前的國安基金的規定是說它如果經過委員會決議通過以後那我基本上是繳酷啦基本上是繳酷因為放在國安基金國安基金因為已經退場 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
557.532 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
583.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
你也不能再做任何的用途只能就存到銀行裡面生利息就等於是說浪費那個資源所以如果是說要做別的用途那可能就是大家要有共識而且可能會涉及到修法的問題資源到底要怎麼運用但是如果是從國庫的管理來看我們基本上是支持統收統資比較不希望這個為了長治久安 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
586.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
610.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
然後這個國安基金是一個非常重要的信心的指標本席建議提高到兩兆的規模兩兆那因為比率上剛剛都已經討論過往兩兆的目標來努力那國庫缺不缺錢我想因為我們是借錢嘛我們是跟金融機構來借貸嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
612.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
634.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
那如果是提高到一點 假定是兩兆兩兆 對兩兆的話那就等於是說假定那個四大基金那三千億還是維持等於換句話說 貸款就要達到1.7兆那1.7兆的話可能就是說單家的金融機構可能就吃不下來可能就是到時候可能還在安排可能就是會有一些貸款的一些問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
636.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
647.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
你氣勢如虹才可以匆匆容容你要有底氣啊你如果當個小器材神大家覺得不痛不癢信心不足啊而且 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
648.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
676.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
如果今天可以確定通過兩兆的國安基金我相信台灣的股市馬上就會飛躍三萬點有沒有信心我沒辦法表達對未來的股市的發展我不是股神但是我是覺得說如果我們國安基金如果從目前的可用兩千億如果提高比如說到七千億的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
677.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
698.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
我相信對這個股市的穩定還有這個投資信心一定有很大的幫助好 謝謝反正你現在大概起跳都一兆啦那我們希望再討論看看心有餘力就往上加好 謝謝羅委員要跟你們同黨委員溝通一下他們有不同的意見好 接下來我們請王世堅委員 |